Furina GOOD or BAD? | TC Roundtable Podcast #21

[@destanl9320]

I watched the Jstern and Zajeff podcast a couple of days ago, and I have to say that having Artisans as a 'host' is so much better for the flow of the podcast. There is so much less empty space in the episode. I know that this podcast had nothing to do with that one, but the TC community is so starved for this kind of content, so that's why I'm just putting this opinion out there

[@princemannic]

yea hopefully with time he'll get better at podcasts

[@Alex-kv5je]

He's the CEO of Theorycrafting™ for a reason

[@floofflez1134]

​@@Alex-kv5je The Trademark LMAAOO

[@junyaiwase]

Why don’t u make it then

[@GlacierRain]

i agreeee

[@finebook281]

This may be controversial, but in my opinion, Furina good

[@yourally2664]

D:

[@asorix_iq3870]

WADAFQQ#@#!!!! 😡😡🤬🤬🤬

[@sentryion3106]

She’s strong but not broken. Definitely not the level of broken that every other KZbinr is touting to be.

[@No-cc1fq]

How dare you.. She's the best unit in the game she deal 10 furinillion damage per rotation

[@kingdoom5022]

@@sentryion3106 She's 100% broken unit , she's the best unit in the game maybe after kazuha

[@Zer0Hour17]

My favorite part about Furina is how she brought up mid and bad units. I played her with Diluc on the second side of the current abyss and it didn't feel like complete dogshit. Did the same with on field Ning. She has enough personal damage on top of her buff that she can make just about anything feel good to use even if it's not up to the meta standards.

[@Elrog3]

She specifically brings up some of my favorites which just pisses me off because I don't like Furina herself. Agh. Being basically forced to play a specific character to have a good team is as bad as having characters that just suck.

[@Force-Multiplier]

How to be an Amber main on Abyss 12 (no Artifacts farming) you start the game you farm for 6+ months (possibly 9+ or even 12) you get C2 Furina congratulations you're an Amber an everyone main so long as you got a recommended Furina healer like Jean or Baizou

[@marcusaurelius4777]

...You don't HAVE to have her to play those "mid/bad" units though? Like, you can play Noelle and Ning and other units just fine without her lol. She just enables you to go higher with them if you so choose. You aren't forced to do anything. Please grow up. @@Elrog3

[@Elrog3]

@@marcusaurelius4777 You go out of your way to tell someone their frustration isn't valid and then tell them they need to grow up. Sheesh.

[@marcusaurelius4777]

True, your frustration is NOT valid, ty for realizing brother :). @@Elrog3

[@Njox]

Furina is meta changing, despite not being overpowered, which is why she's awesome. She enables a lot of characters who weren't as viable before, enables new builds, and allows for more diverse artifacts.

[@kingdoom5022]

She is overpowered , she's pretty much increase the overall DPS of so many meta teams by around 15-25% , that's broken , its literally like giving evrey character in the team 5 star weapon

[@Elrog3]

She buffed Hu Tao with Bennett while having some anti-synergy with both of them. She's overpowered.

[@Linh_Tran-49]

I prefer saying she creates new meta teams, rather than meta changing There are still teams than can do better without her One example is that, having her and a healer in the team, you can hardly fit in a shielder, which might hurt someone like Wanderer

[@italomorais9424]

@@Linh_Tran-49 If there are new teams in the meta, the meta has changed.

[@jcceno4273]

@@italomorais9424wait is noelle meta now

[@SeraphisQ]

Finally a new TC roundtable episode after 8 months LOL

[@meisbigfan]

I don't think anyone's gonna say Furina is bad lmao. How good is the question. I like playing Keqing quickbloom (Keqing, Nahida, Furina, Baizhu), this abyss rotation also works in her favor as well but Furina has to be built for a lot of ER.

[@jonnevitu4979]

Bad? Nah but I think her c0 is a little bit weaker than it should; stacks take too much to get when you have anything besides Jean and maybe Charlotte c1, both good aoe healers but that dont do much else with ofc Jean at least having vv, which means that instead of the "team profit" being like, "get less defense with Furina instead of Xingqiu but here is a 75% dmg buff" is more like "get a 75% dmg buff but now you have to slot a whole ass slot for a strong aoe healer to actually get said buff... and you have to wait for it to stack" which isnt exactly that much better than just keep using Xingqiu and being able to slot Kazuha without that many issues for example. Also her not being able to benefit from her own healing passive when she can heal about 7k with a lot of stacks is just sooo cringe.

[@luminous3558]

@@jonnevitu4979 That seems like a lot of feelscrafting. In practice the number from furina is simply better than using a non healer subdps or buffer in that 2nd slot. She also isn't really competing with Xingqiu for his slot as he is mainly a hydro applier for reactions while Furina is focused on talent dmg. I agree that she should be able to proc her passive but that shouldnt really matter pre c6 as you should never be in pneuma stance.

[@xv6016]

@@luminous3558 you lose survive ability and mybe grouping to get 10 20 more dmg? Ignore the survive thing losing kazuha cc is just make you lose a lot of dmg so furina make lose survive ability and dmg in aoe cuz you might lose cc characters

[@legendnbg97]

@@xv6016 Hardest abyss floors are most often floors where CC isn't very relevant. Those are usually floors with 1-2 enemies that aren't CCable. CC is only really a huge loss with something like ayaka. That's after all the reason why venti died, because his CC stopped being relevant after hardest floors started having non CCable enemies. The only reason kazuha survived was because of his damage bonus. And survivability is really a non issue if you build your healer properly.

[@Edrigangr]

@@legendnbg97 If the hardest floors are the ones with very aggressive non-CC'ed enemies , then survivability DOES become an issue to all teams that relied on IR and now need a healer on top of it as well.

[@energyj]

Nice! We miss you guys

[@FliponYT]

Ready to count how many xq better in this video

[@Elrog3]

1 is too many

[@SLH44-44]

Would be funny since xq is now totally washed

[@deltaspecies1697]

Nah, c6 xq is better than even c6 yelan. So obviously xq is better than furina :thosewhoknow:

[@FliponYT]

@@SLH44-44 LET BRO COOK

[@m.ridzwan-26]

Xq is literally god of Teyvat

[@fishven8783]

Let's go!! Ya'll gotta have more of these!! Artesians is such a good host.

[@Kasraken]

I love playing (on field driver) Barbra with Furina. She heals the hole team when attacking while her E is active and makes it easy to keep the team at max health while the salon drains HP. Add Furina's team healing ticks when the active character is overhealing and you are always at max HP.

[@1Henrink]

Very happy with this return. This is a very calming, funny and informative podcast

[@bulldogbites1517]

Love hearing Zajef mention the quickbloom Raiden team! It’s been one of my favorite Furina teams so far. I have my Raiden built a bit different than Zajef 4pc emblem ER/Atk/CD with the new BP polearm that gives 120EM with three elements in team. 71/180, 1.8k Atk, 272EM. With Nahida buffs she gets up over 500EM. I feel like it is likely one of C0 on field Raiden’s better teams, especially in single target.

[@kailebdv]

With refines that weapon is sooo good for EM Raiden!

[@bulldogbites1517]

@@kailebdv yes! I plan to R5 it eventually, R3 at least. Honestly believe it’s one of the best polearms in the game currently, depending on the character ofc

[@kailebdv]

@bulldogbites1517 Its very team dependent, but when it works its like havng 2 main stats on your weapon

[@bulldogbites1517]

@@kailebdv for sure. That said, most weapons are team/character dependent.

[@minatoarisato7652]

It's a very interesting team honestly. It also scales well with vertical investment, C2 nahida really buffs the team output for obvious reasons, and furina cons are a no brainer. Honestly combines every aspect of raiden (personal damage esp at c2/3, hyperblooms, and agg). At least for single target, I notice it can do far more than my hyper raiden team (which is good since bennett needs to get benched more in these abysses)

[@StanTheWoz]

One thing that I think is easy to forget about Furina is how much she depends on not just having good healers available, but having the right healer for the team you're trying to play her in. Like if you want to play her with Cyno but don't have Baizhu your options are pretty limited. Same thing for Raiden hyper if you don't have Jean. Eula if you don't have Mika. Etc. Still a great unit for sure but I think she scales with "account investment" in terms of having more different healers that work with her, more than most units depend on anything like that.

[@ooochoa]

Furina is good because she brought back genshin content on this channel. (?

[@71775926]

I set up my party loadouts such that each Archon and each element gets a party dedicated to them, sometimes they overlap. I tested Furina in every single one of them and can confidently say the only builds that she doesn't fit that well in are those that require interrupt resistance like Yoimiya. I guess that's why her C6 was designed the way it is, to compress the party healer role into Furina so parties that need interrupt resistance can still fit her in.

[@JJennerUK]

Y'all are crazy if you think XQ is better than Yelan or Furina. Maybe if you need hydro app that bad, but does the interrupt resist really equal 75% bonus damage to everyone including Furina herself (So insane sub-dps im addition to the buff)

[@becauseofcourseitis]

Xingqiu is already better than both Yelan and Furina regarding defensive capability because Yelan and Furina have none. And you forget that to have good uptime on that huge damage bonus on Furina, you have to run Furina with a healer, and most healers are non-damaging units, so you're not just replacing Xingqiu directly with Furina, but you're also replacing another, potentially more offensive unit with a healer. Now the question is is Furina + a non-damaging healer really that much stronger than Xingqiu + an offensive support? The only correct answer is, as always, it depends.

[@luminous3558]

@@becauseofcourseitis That comes under the assumption that XQ is your sole defensive unit on your team which is just not grounded in reality. The answer to your question is do the math. This whole framing of Yelan/Furina vs Xingqiu is just hydro app and defensive utility vs more damage without actually going into what that means is so pointless. There are points where "more damage" is just impossible to ignore vs defensive utility(that might be unneeded) and hydro app(again some teams dont get more benefit). Its disingenuous to frame this argument in the dmg vs defense sense when in actuality its solely a "I dont want people to spend money on 5* characters" angle getting worked back from. Zajef will always talk up the 4* and talk down the 5*.

[@becauseofcourseitis]

@@luminous3558 There are many teams, where Xingqiu *is* the sole unit with defensive utility and/or hydro application source, or where having multiple of these utilities together-sans shields-is still relatively valuable, so that point is already moot. While the need for good defensive utility in this game gets largely more trivial the higher investment you put into your account, that simply isn't reason enough to discount Xingqiu's defensive utility because his kit is balanced around it. You're obviously not picking Xingqiu just for the damage. You're picking Xingqiu because of all the Xingqiu things combined. If you don't need those things, don't pick him. It is not disingenuous to frame this as a damage vs defense argument because, as you may have (not) noticed, that's exactly the question the comment I'm replying to is asking. And yes, there are definitely many situations where defensive utility is completely useless. And in those cases, Xingqiu definitely loses value. That's specifically the reason for me saying that it depends. All I'm saying in response to the comment is that there is no clear-cut solution that covers every situation for every account. Answers will vary on a multitude of factors and searching for an all-encompassing answer will prove to be futile. Also, you can speak of the relative pull values of any unit, as Zajef himself does. Them being 5-stars and four-stars will fall into that subject but there should be no assumptions made about the account owners' preferred styles of playing (whether they are F2P, dolphin, whale) when comparing units, especially at C0. Getting 5* characters does not automatically mean "spending money". You can (and should) only lay out all the facts about the units being compared, and leave the decision whether or not to spend on the game to the players, again, as Zajef himself does.

[@poushin356]

We need a TC Roundtable on Neuvillette !

[@zanzatbc]

I’ve missed this podcast so much! Thank you for bringing it back!!!

[@Forakus]

Klee is amazing again thanks to Furina so I'll go with 'good'

[@faerieinwonderland]

I agree!! It’s sooo much fun

[@raycigar6356]

So she wasn't as amazing before furina?

[@nezolar]

​@@raycigar6356klee has gone from bad to usable because of furina

[@Kellexyz]

​@@raycigar6356she alright one of the main selling point of Klee is her crazy Pyro app and no character can make use of it other than running mono pyro

[@raycigar6356]

@@nezolar she never was bad, just clunky play style with limited high damage teams....I don't see where furina helps her, maybe adding a couple more viable teams but she still is clunky to play

[@subtle-light]

Hope there is a way to learn when this podcasts could start. There is something about listening to kqm podcasts that makes me love playing genshin even more.

[@geraldolamego1745]

Loving this new format! Videos below one hour are way better

[@Senki99]

About the question on Furina's team building: I have changed the logic direction and asked which full team healer I would bring and what else that healer I can add and what the healer would bring enhance the team. Like: Baizhu -> brings slow dendro application, so the next is EM-Raiden / Kuki /Dehya / Thoma and add a carry to synergize with the team. if Charlotte is the healer than would have cryo application -> add Kazuha for VV shred & grouping and a cryo carry (not Eula oc) e.g.: Ayaka or Wriothesley.

[@distritochristianangeloa.157]

Good to see this back. Furina is still game changer depsite not being so OP that dumpster other units.

[@Elrog3]

When there's not a direct competitor, dumpstering other units happens incrementally. But it is still happening when you introduce a new, shiny, strong unit.

[@deltaspecies1697]

Aight time to see the xq glazing

[@syarifht5929]

My man finally bring back the podcast, bring more people to talk about teams this is what we need achtually

[@a-passerby]

What is that wallpaper in the beginning?? Wow!

[@larrymauri8855]

I can say that Furina C3 with neuvilette C0 is a really good team comp that can reach easy 100 k dmg with a poorly build neuvi don’t know if she’s C0 though…

[@juggernaut6666]

My favorite team is furina, jean, yelan then whatever the hell you want in the 4th slot. the 4th slot can literally be anything. I've used xiangling, wriothesley, raiden, heizou. and a bunch of others but nothing has felt bad even if it's not super optimized.

[@SLH44-44]

Tbh jean now have more value than a lot of limited 5 stars

[@luminous3558]

Xiangling in that team needs like 500 ER om.

[@juggernaut6666]

@luminous3558 think mines 239 using skyward spine. And it's usually fine. Although single target, it can be a little lacking, for that I'll put her on fav.

[@phuongtruongtran6219]

​​@@luminous3558 Er, Yelan with Fav Warbow do generate enough energy for Xl isn't it?

[@brokenprodigy8002]

Artesians and Zajef in one podcast is an early Christmas gift

[@jhl6849]

31:00 Her C6 actually allows you to forgo the healing slot. I don't know how to feel about that.

[@NahualUlloa]

Letsgoooo I love the TC roundtable

[@alvmemo]

Furina is a great character to have on an advanced account, but for a new player or more casual people I would say she is not a good option. I wouldn't classify Furina as a must have for a new player, there are better options.

[@sentryion3106]

I definitely agree. Unless you have baizhu, Jean, charlotte, or kokomi (special case to neuvillete), playing furina would be extremely wonky. I am very thankful for getting baizhu, otherwise furina would feel absolutely horrible to play

[@Forakus]

Lol what

[@tonydai782]

@@Forakus Yea, I mean it's kinda obvious. She doesn't work that well without a healer and a new player doesn't exactly have many good healer options. Unless you're trying to claim that Barbara + Furina is this amazing thing.

[@legendnbg97]

@@tonydai782 It's not amazing, but it works well enough

[@tonydai782]

@@legendnbg97 Well enough isn't what is being argued here. Sure, she'll still be ok, but you'd rather have almost any other 5 star support than her in that scenario.

[@therasitismall920]

people seem forget that Nahida need to reapply her E every time new enemy wave come and a lot of carry don't like you to switch character Furina is broken because you just E and Q last long until end of you rotation in quickbloom team she cleary better then both yelen and xingqiu

[@luminous3558]

Yeah its so bad for QoL. I'd take a raiden/furina type E over Nahidas any day just because "click and forget" is so comfy.

[@nousagi5837]

my jean heals 18k without furina's buff, i have 0 problems keeping my team healthy (240 er favge)

[@Rafael57YT]

Honestly my most regretted pull is Shenhe, she never felt that good with Ayaka and Ganyu to me. I even have mistsplitter and calamity. With Ayaka I preferred running Ganyu and with Ganyu I preferred Rosaria Now that Furina is out, I REALLY don't see any use for my Shenhe anymore. Am I missing something? I don't have Kazuha, I always use Venti. Could that be a part of it?

[@OktavianusCelestialine]

at the low-medium investment level, it will always be better if we bring an additional damage dealer rather than bringing an additional buffer, especially if the buffer is only intended for one character, to make Shenhe worth it, we have to make Ayaka as strong as possible by making her have the highest possible Crit and Dmg%, why? because the way the Shenhe buff works is "entrusts her attacks to her party members", she entrusts her very high Atk% to be multiplied by Ayaka's Crit & Dmg%, ayaka's talent level here has no effect at all. Kazuha also plays a big role in providing additional dmg% for Ayaka, so that the Shenhe buff can be multiplied even higher. so in this case it would be better for you to bring Ganyu/Furina as an additional damage dealer rather than bringing an additional buffer just for Ayaka.

[@banjoowo4001]

you can hope that the Cryo archon will synergize with Shenhe lol, but yeah Shenhe should've been a 4 star similar to faruzan and sara

[@SauravKumar-ki4bn]

I lowkey miss tenten, even though there's not much to theorycraft these days.

[@I.M.T.S]

Two teams I am really into with Furina are Neuvillette, Yae, Baizhu and Alhaitham, Kuki, Baizhu. Kuki, Baizhu together because on the other side I am using spin2win Neuvillette with Zhongli, Raiden, Nahida 😂. But my favorite is the Yae team. I am even considering C1 Neuvillette on his rerun. Another team I am liking a lot in current floor 12 as Eula main is Furina, Eula, Raiden, Baizhu. Mika would be ideal for Eula but he does almost nothing for Raiden and Coppelia hits lika a um.. Truck.

[@HowardAltEisen]

It's been a while! Welcome back, guys!

[@DJPonko]

doesnt furina massively boost freeze teams? shes a substantial dps boost and her hydro application is amazing

[@anemosupremacy9386]

Yes but no. She's just worse than mona with ayaka (omen is already 60% frontloaded like ayaka's own damage and the teamwide buff doesn't matter cuz ayaka's doing majority of the damage already) but for mid-tier "copium" freeze comps she's a HUGE buff due to being a team-wide buffer and great dps on her own. cryo cryo furina jean or cryo furina charlotte kazuha should be pretty good

[@DJPonko]

i think u guys are coping hard , i got c1 furina so she starts with extra fanfare as far as i get it thats up to +100% dmg on top of having 100% hydro uptime(which mona does not) and also nothings stopping u from running mona+furina + she can farm rocks in outerworld, can work on water, can heal, shes overloaded and strong af + she enables all sorts of teams

[@aaronyogurt3544]

@@DJPonko If anything I think you're the one who's coping. You're assuming that everyone would have constellations on Furina which majority of the player base wouldn't have. It's recommended to go for newer characters instead of a constellation so your baseline assumption is just so wrong.

[@DJPonko]

why would i be coping? i also have mona c1 and shes my most used hydro unit up to date im just not delusional to say 75-100% dmg boost on top of perma hydro app off-field is "bad"

[@Elrog3]

@@aaronyogurt3544 No, horizontal investment is not what you should be doing if you are trying to play efficiently. If you are trying to play efficiently, get enough character to clear elemental checks and then stop getting more and get constellations.

[@BrianCarreraShaw]

Yes, i agree with rhe XQ vs Furina sentiment, XQ is simply broken because he was given everything and super stacked as a character. But you pretty much swap him and seap him out and he's done. Furinas playstyle feels more challenging and dynamic, making the overall gameplay more fun in my opinion

[@SoarThroat-z6n]

45 mins is kinda too condensed, i believe an hour flat would sound better imo, especially for an informative type of podcast. This feels too fast paced and condensed for my taste.

[@lqfr8813]

she is best friend for hutao and anyone using xiao's artifacts 4 set

[@Kaiserker]

Lol I was trying quickbloom raiden too, but emblem w EM sands. Using it as a variation of all archon team bc I don't have baizhu, so ZL instead. C2 Furina lets me have enough stacks from the start for it to still be decent.

[@amorimjt]

I missed this so much

[@nineflames2863]

Regarding Noelle, I'm really enjoying my Noelle/Fischl/Yun Jin/Furina comp. Yun Jin is there to battery Noelle and boost her personal damage, Fischl for DPS and more energy, and Furina buffs the entire team (very good use case for ToTM btw) while also dishing out nicely. Rotation is Furina EQ -> Fischl E -> Yun Jin EQ -> Noelle EQ then go to town. Occasionally switch back to Yun Jin for more energy depending on Noelle's ER. Fischl's Burst can be used to reposition or to simply refresh Oz's duration. Nice and easy team to play, more than enough DPS to 9-Star every Abyss Floor, very good AoE thanks to Noelle, and of course you're just face-tanking everything without a care in the world. Bonus points for not even needing stamina lol.

[@Krmiby]

She really made many mid healers & mid characters worth investing.

[@larungbatojutsu2427]

Try hu tao, bennet, furina, and yelan/xq. Put MH artifact set on hu tao, if you're lucky to get some ER on hu tao so she can burst off cooldown per rotations, her dmg quite insane.

[@quint2568]

dude still cant get over fav i swear.

[@thornszk]

I really didn't feel a stepup on my account. Now I just use her for commissions needing to kill hilichurl archer on top

[@PhoezraeLX]

Maybe i need much more testing but from my experience, i still prefer Neuvilette-Kazuha-Zhongli-Mona Vs Neuvilette-Jean-Zhongli-Furina The Mona-Kazuha variant feels smoother to run and yeilds me the same result.. Starting with Neuv E-Q, Zhongli E, Mona Q-E, to Kazuha E, then Neuv 2 Beams.. then the rotations starts once again.. For the Furina variant Furina E-Q, Zhongli E, Jean E, then Neuv E-Q Beams.. then the next rotation now includes Jeans burst.. Furina E-Q, Zhongli E, Jean E-Q, then Neuv E-Q Beams.. Maybe i'm doing the Furina variant wrong or using the wrong charas, but yeah.. the Kazu-Mona variant feels smoother overall and the cooldowns line up very well..

[@phuongtruongtran6219]

Well, if your Neuv have Prototype Amber, you can replace Mona with Furina and don't really need to slot Jean in as Prototype Amber will heal the whole party anyway.

[@deRykcihC]

Nice to see arte after so long

[@crashbug4343]

Great stuff

[@l3gacysama]

Link for furina wallpaper

[@adourr]

Bro can’t admit that there are better hydro units in the game. (120 cd nuevi)

[@baguette_connoisseur]

What?...

[@ayzeee9855]

45:39 i feel like she's still good with xiao because he doesn't have good offensive characters for his last team slot anyway

[@MarionFR]

Noelle - Furina without Gorou is just a downgrade to versions with anemo instead?? NO sense at all, Mr Zajef. Those are two very different things with their own advantages. Firstly, as you said once yourself - when you have enough DPS, you can go for comfort, like for some more energy, for fav. So you stand by it, or not? Same with survivability and shields. Noelle can be a very nice upgrade when survivability is a bigger issue, or a comfort pick and it's not a small value. Secondly, geo is not anemo. It has it's own advantages. Like - Noelle can be helpful in breaking frozen shields. You can add electro unit and rely on it and Noelle to break cryo shields. It's again a clear upgrade over anemo. And we really see enough challenges with shields and specific shield combinations. Consider consolidations of: healing, shielding, and... great AoE that is - mobile, 100% uptime and switchable. If you don't understand how massive value it is, try Noelle in events with waves of enemies. But it can be also helpful with some bosses, like those moving around or Coppelia - better to stay at some distance because of crazy attack combos. If you have some smaller mobs around, Noelle on fav can be enough to deal with them just on the fly and save your time. Something like Furina team with Jean for example, can be nothing like Noelle driver team. And don't forget some enemies can't be grouped with pulling anemo powers. Besides, eh, and why only Gorou?? What about c6 Yunjin for example? Personally I tried only Gorou, but I'm sure even when going more for Noelle's DPS, it's not like Gorou is the only viable option. Especially since his buff is significantly lower in double geo team. Truth is - Noelle driver was always viable, just much situational. I can go with a whole list when such teams were helpful in Abyss or events, how some players that were struggling could clear content when I recommended Noelle driver to them. Especially burgeon, where Noelle is ideal and geo helps with reactions, what almost no one knows about. Besides burgeon it just never looked good in theory, cause too large downgrade in DPS. And burgeon is also not that great, so yeah. Now with Furina Noelle driver is more than just very situational option. It's just normal, good, viable option with their own advantages.

[@ayzeee9855]

Next podcast talk about all the new fontaine dps: Neuvilette Rizzley Lyney

[@m.a.r.s5789]

Can i have that furina wallpaper?

[@MrGshinobi]

On the question of which teams don't like furina that much, i find that furina is awkward to use in ayaka freeze teams, you really want to have kazuha on the team to group everything so ayaka's burst hits all at once, but with furina you're more incentivized to bring someone like jean instead of kazuha for the fanfare stacks so it's just awkward, and charlotte feels like shit to play i refuse to build her just for cryo furina teams.

[@-miromax-5349]

4:40 yo I also tried raiden quickbloom but put charloote as i don't have baizhu and it felt pretty strong, like you have a lot of stats and em

[@euclidedecastro7534]

idk if she's good but that wallpaper Def is, where I get that at? 🤔

[@kumpadri]

It's good to be back Genshin TCR

[@StrafingHunter]

My Abyss team with Furina, works pretty well: C2 R0 Furina C1 R0 Raiden C0 Nahida C4 Charlotte

[@dexydraws9272]

speaking of noelle, is there any resource or calcs regarding noelle furina team's performance vs itto teams? =p=

[@LeFrenchyestFry]

Furina is excellent for players that dont have perfectly built units. She powers up teams with weaker units but might not be an amazing slot if your current team already deletes any abyss floor

[@joshiii0816]

I love the background! Any links as to where I can get it? Thanks

[@rendyau]

Furina & artifact Marechausse Hunter make me really really really want QoL swap slot Artifact! Please hoyoverse! Don't u think 3 year already long enough to give us this very important QoL?!

[@Marz333]

Having c2 Furina, Xinqiu is no longer even a consideration in most of my teams(personally) but sure if y’all really need that much hydro application and interupt res he’s “better”

[@--6560]

So a 5-star limited character with constellations is better than a 4-star? Who would’ve thought

[@vi_llart]

My thoughts exactly. Obviously for dolphins and whales, if you have cons on either Furina or Yelan, you'd naturally forget XQ during long term.

[@princessochka3690]

Just wait for beasts to come back in abyss, thats when Furinas comps will become very uncomfortable to play.

[@Yanaro-pi8pt]

​@@princessochka3690imagine being scared of random beasts when you have cons on strong 5 stars though.

[@princessochka3690]

@@Yanaro-pi8pt how would dmg constelations help you to avoid being oneshotted from a million hp enemy you can't instantly kill?

[@keruvin_KA]

If somehow my artifact stats have more ER using Key instead of Festering Desire does the HP stats from Key offer more dmg than the Elemental Skill DMG from Festering ?

[@Puppetmaster2005]

Hey Guys............ can I know where u guy got those amazing Genshin animated backgrounds? I'd kill to get those on my desktop.

[@bestinthagame]

Furina team isn’t hard to build it’s just not the team we like to use especially if you don’t have Baizhu or Jean e.g hu tao team could easily switch furina for yelan or xingqiu and switch a shielder for jean or baizhu and can still work like the usual hu tao team but if you have kokomi or qiqi instead it means hu tao can’t be on field every rotation, which isn’t fun tbh

[@jaxyjax4033]

Does C1 Furina make buffing easier or free up a slot for team building? Tyvmia!!!

[@biggestouf]

C1 Furina makes buffing easier, but you will still need a healer. You might be able to get away with shittier healers like prototype amber healers. The healer requirement only goes away at C6.

[@aaronyogurt3544]

@@biggestouf C1 doesn't make buffing easier, that's C2. C1 raises the floor and ceiling of her buffs.

[@LittleTilde]

C1 makes stacking your buff slightly easier, but mostly just stronger. C2 makes stacking your buff basically free. To free up a team slot (by replacing your healer) you will need to go to C6.

[@jaxyjax4033]

@LittleTilde yikes C6. Welp I guess I will go for C2 on her next rerun. Thank you!

[@biggestouf]

​@@aaronyogurt3544I would call raising the floor making the buff easier, but we're splitting hairs at that point.

[@kookio4284]

Idc how good Furina is. I finally have a permanent 4th unit for my Noelle team so I'm happy.

[@dnyaneshkale9540]

I want that desktop setup background image and transparant taskbar that stuff can you help me get same on my machine?

[@HeshO-yi3hh]

Xingqiu c6 its still better than C2 Furina? I really want to know that

[@lordprawn8216]

He ain't better than c0 furina Edit: honestly they aren't really comparable, a furina + healer duo is more akin to kazuha + Bennett duo. They do Different things.

[@Sinisha82]

Me too,have him at c6 but never play him,so really dont know is he good and never wanna find out.Furina is better for me(currently c5) but on rerun will be c6 for sure

[@Yanaro-pi8pt]

There's a case for c0 Furina vs C6 Xingqiu. But for c2 it's not really a constest. There's still teams you would use Xingqiu over Furina though

[@zaphyrae]

Furina is broken because infinite water walking. You never have to worry about drowning again! Also, it's hilarious running around and seeing random stuff flying at me because my summons keep killing stuff. xD

[@yuugael4010]

I find it weird that people need to max stack furina when a team of neuvi furina without jean or bennet with furina already got enough dmg buff to just breeze the abyss

[@visnok67]

Let's be real. Zajef and others still BatChest Xingqiu because he's an accessable four star. Obviously he's been powercrept team dps wise with the Furina release. His defensive utility doesn't make up for losing a ton of team dps. We even got the new double hydro core which is Yelan and Furina. The only thing going for him is his hydro application which doesn't matter unless you play Zajef's meme dendro teams where the transformative reactions are the only source of team dps and people rarely play those teams. He will always be a dmg downgrade to Yelan and Furina in the teams where two or more characters do talent dmg.

[@xanthee_imr]

Some Hu Tao, Cyno, Alhaitham mains and others actively prefer using Xingqiu over Yelan, even though Yelan deals more damage. I myself, in one of my first Abyss clears, preferred my C2 Xingqiu to my C0 Yelan because I was playing hyperbloom and the XQ team was clearing faster thanks to the extra hydro application, even though Yelan was dealing literally twice as much personal damage compared to him (my investment was low and transformative reaction was scaling better). Good damage, amazing application and crazy defensive utility: he's just that good, whether people like it or not.

[@visnok67]

​@@xanthee_imr you're confusing between personal preference and team dps. Some people prefer playing Noelle even though they have Itto. It's personal preference so i don't have to say anything about that. You prefer XQ over Yelan and Furina, cool good for you. In terms of team dps tho, example, Yelan Hu Tao VV vape will always be higher dps than Xingqiu VV vape. Same goes for double hydro teams, Yelan+Furina will always be higher dps than XQ+Yelan or XQ+Furina, no matter you like it or not If you team is doing talent dmg of course

[@xanthee_imr]

@@visnok67 No I’m not confusing personal preference and team dps. Literally no one argues that Xingqiu deals more damage than Yelan, absolutely no one. Both Furina and Yelan are better offensive assets (unless you are playing some transformative reaction teams). This doesn’t make Xingqiu powercrept, unless you are talking about speedrun meta with no gold limits.

[@visnok67]

@@xanthee_imr that's why i said it's personal preference. Objectively, Yelan and Furina will always buff Hu Tao to deal more dmg than Xingqiu. No matter what he does, if you put him in, your Hu Tao will deal less dmg. Whether if you want the dmg increase or not is personal preference. You want more dmg or less dmg with better comfort? That depends on you. So Team dps wise, he has been powercrept since Yelan released, it was just really subtle but now with Furina, it becomes really obvious. And Hoyo has been doing since 4.0. Klee with Lyney, Ayato with Neuvilette, Xingqiu and to some extent Yelan as well with Furina.

[@shazaki1134]

finally someone said it, the xinqiu glazing unironically is funny

[@kingdoom5022]

The question should be is if furina the best unit in the game or the second best after kazuha

[@biggestouf]

Devil's in the details. If it's a boss enemy, I'm inclined to say Furina because Kazuha's grouping and circle impact don't matter or make it difficult. If there are groupable enemies then Kazuha.

[@baguette_connoisseur]

4th best

[@deltaspecies1697]

Nahida > Furina > Kazuha/ Yelan

[@Yanaro-pi8pt]

Nahida is the best unfortunately

[@baguette_connoisseur]

@@deltaspecies1697 Nah. More like Nahida > Kazuha/Xingqiu > Furina/Yelan

[@ethereallight7168]

C2 or C3 Furina over C2 Nahida?

[@SLH44-44]

Both super id go with furina, pretty sure its more broken plus enables a lot of characters

[@Yanaro-pi8pt]

C2 Furina. I have both at c2 and c2 Nahida is kind nice but forgettable. The average team damage from both Nahida and Furina c2 are probably around 20% or slightly more with Furina depends on your investment but Furina bring new things thanks to the massive stack buff

[@Zulyaki]

As someone who has both at C2 , furina C2 is much more broken.

[@thebrigade7684]

Both have the same percentage of team damage increase so choose what suits you best

[@banjoowo4001]

Fuina c2 is broken af

[@garrazm2827]

you know i have been thinking about the national team, if bennet, xq, and xl is at c0 are they actually still better than limited unit?

[@kailebdv]

Most likely yes, because even if you get the 5* all your supports are c0. I would argue maybe Nahida being an exception since she opens up dendro team comps which dont require as much investment

[@Yanaro-pi8pt]

Nope, especially Xiangling c0

[@luminous3558]

No they are terrible. C4 is mandatory for XL, C1 is mandatory for bennett though you can cope, XQ basically has most of his power in his cons but his application is fine c0. They are as constellation locked as new 4*s which is why its hard to recommend national these days when we have so many good teams that can perform similar. Compare that to Nilou handing you a whole team with 0 need for investment on her talents, Neuvillete basically being able to be run on his own, Furina just making use of f2p characters etc. Getting a functioning National team from scratch is a couple 5*s worth of pulls across multiple banners. They were so dominant from 1.0 till now because people got them early and then didn't need to reinvest when they could already clear and early 5* being notoriously weak compared to current ones. Long term players have infinite amounts of resin invested in their artifacts compared to a new player and they also enjoyed the benefit of pulling 4* when the pool was smaller so they got all the cons mostly maxed out.

[@luminous3558]

@@eyemard Fischl also really wants her c6 though she is more usable at c0 than the others. Fontaine finally gave her a decent f2p bow with the craftable that can even be triggered via her c4 healing.

[@princessochka3690]

I dont like that in community Furina is pictured as a "mustpull", and gets literally zero critique (she has a multitude of issues which are never mentioned).All her "pros" have another side of medal. I think that there is quite a huge demographic of players that doesn't need Furina at all on their account, as her teams would be just a sidegrade of what they already have.

[@marcusaurelius4777]

That's what balance is called? She's amazing. Her "cons" are just balance for the huge "pros" that she offers.

[@banir3736]

not to mention those “cons” are pretty much negligible. Unlike Kazuha’s “cons” you literally can’t do anything about him unable to buff Geo nor Physical.

[@Kindi001]

​​@@banir3736Trueee~ Kazuha Capability as support is really strong in swirlable element and Grouping. while Furina make your healer slot more valuable, straight buff all element with that universal dmg bonus, also Hydro app that not tied to normal attack is quite nice, we dont have that beside Kokomi Jellyfish. I play Kokomi Hyperblom with Furina C1 and its really funny Blue Number of Kokomi

[@impostorsyndrome1350]

if she didn't, she would be too broken lol

[@marcusaurelius4777]

He can only buff swirlable elements so Dendro, Geo, and ...well physical lol are just SOL along with Anemo itself. Furina buffs EVERYTHING all the time on and off field. Her constellations are actually mega busted and WORTH the pull. So few characters have truly amazing constellations. Wanderer is one of them, but so many characters' C4 is mid just to get to the C6 bait. Furina's constellations either greatly strengthen her, open up team slots since she won't need double hydro after C4 for certain teams...or she literally just becomes godmode at C6, which I have. You can literally run ZERO healers with her C6...her healing is that strong and it's always up. She's disgustingly powerful and truly, truly worth every pull at every investment level. Free to play, low spending, dolphin, whale...everyone gets use out of her. @@banir3736

[@xSeira-]

Is there a static version of the wallpaper used in the vid

[@thegamewoods8473]

Furina is effortlessly a top 10 unit in Genshin, the question is actually where in that top 10 she falls? Is she the new best in the game? Easy top 5? Just slipping into the top 10? Imo at C0 shes below units like Kazuha and Nahida solely because she asks you to work around her. But even then shes undeniably powerful, but also balanced. She feels like a C0 Raiden, clearly strong but not overpowered, and then you get C2 and all hell breaks loose.

[@yayayay1488]

having to build a team around a char isnt rlly a downside. Its what every char wants. Furina wants a healer. nahida wants reactionbased chars. and kazuha wants dmg dealers. The dmg furina provides is more than enough for a requirment of a healer.

[@SLH44-44]

​@@yayayay1488not only, she also fits with bennet and even shinobu unlike common sense says. Her dmg is equal or even superior to Yelan, mine isnt even properly build and that crab did 44k 😮, how couldnt furina at least wash XQ out? She can fit every team on xq place

[@princessochka3690]

Raiden has no downsides you need to work around, and is generally better with how well she fits in both crit and transformative reaction acrhetypes.

[@thegamewoods8473]

@princessochka3690 I compare her to Raiden not in caveats, but in the fact that at C0 both units are good but not amazing, but each at C2 are incredible

[@e554]

@@princessochka3690 except for when she does field time requirement + burst dmg buff isn't always useful etc etc

[@JaykeoSaurus]

What I would say as a person who tested all her Constellations and is a C6 Owner C0-5 is good and can be a meta but C6 is Broken and a game changer. C6 Furina is defiantly one of those characters that's worth the C6. Never have I wanted to C6 a character. C6 makes her become a full on Healer, Dmg with Hydro infusion in her normals, and Support all at the same time. Her Ousia stance at C6 heals the whole party up to max hp consistently after you normal attack once and it only takes 1 or 2 normal attacks from her to max her fan fare so your hp is consistently going up and down in Ousia cause of C6 but the healing is more than the hp drain. Ousia Minions are doing so much damage and healing too?????? With C6 Furina 6 fixes the issue with needing a healer. Furina is the healer now so add another slot to make the team more broken or you can go into Pneuma mode with Furina to boost her personal damage in auto attacks by 25% with Hydro Infusion and it slaps. Using her Burst with Pnuema mode is just ridiculous in her personal damage. It's impossible to die in her Pneuma mode because it's a healer mode and she does damage in that mode????? C6 Furina makes so many benched characters viable again since she doesent take up 2 slots. I'm currently leveling a lot of benched characters and having more play styles has made the game more fun to me and I have 36 Star the Abyss with troll teams that shouldnt work as long as my C6 Furina is in it, healing, buffing, and doing damage all at the same time in Ousia Stance. C6 Furina literally changes and breaks the game but in my opinion I hope MiHoyo don't make C6 being the change to characters a trend. Hu Tao needing to be C1 was already the what the heck moment but C1 and 2 is more achievable compared to C6. Her C2 was her 6 which was the current trend of most characters needing to be C1 or 2 so Hoyo knew what they were doing with this change to make money and fomo some people. I make good money but no way would I part with that kind of money, I literally Door Dashed for 2 days to get $700 and I used $400 of the Door Dash Funds to C6. The RNG Gods were nice to me a week ago

[@e554]

people like you don't know how to manage your money then wonder why you're living paycheck to paycheck? lmao c2 already makes her broken, c3 makes her even more so. c4 is a luxury for less ER, and so is everything beyond. you should have stopped or saved.

[@BLacQk]

whete can i get the wallpaper like that?

[@Ottobon]

Oh nice i forgot about these

[@Truunami]

IMO, Furina's "Meta Strength" is very high. Her, Xingqiu, and Yelan are side-grades to each other and they exist at the peak of the genshin meta. They have nuanced differences but they essentially play the same role in the party. That said, Furina's "Meta Value for your Primogems" is not as high as her strength. This is because of Xinqiu's existence. He alone devalues all 5star hydro units because he's such an easily accessible 4 star unit who performs well even at c0. It's not a Nahida situation - where Nahida has no real 4 star equivalent. Traveler (while good) isn't good enough to compete with Nahida.

[@luminous3558]

Kirara and Yaoyao both make very good cases for themselves over C0 Nahida in many dendro comps. Furina also stacks very well with yelan and xingqiu and hydro is way more in demand than dendro.

[@hubertbong2747]

Not really, reason is that Furina can work in a number of teams that xingqiu cannot work, namely teams that does not utilise normal attacks. A lot of CA based teams or teams where fitting in NA feels clunky due to long skill cast time would always prefer Furina. This is a side that Xingqiu just cannot encroach. The era of NA dominance is now passing away with the arrival of Neuv and Furina. You can now do CAs more often.

[@harryfox3681]

they are not side grades furina teams are significantly better*

[@Truunami]

@@hubertbong2747 that's really just part of the "nuanced differences" that I mentioned. Yes, XQ doesn't work in charge attack based teams but Furina also can't provide enough hydro to be the solo hydro in certain team comps. Some teams don't run that great of a healer either. XQ or Yelan just work in those teams with no questions asked. Furina forces you to change the structure of the team entirely to accommodate her. It CAN be better for certain teams but it also can be worse.

[@hubertbong2747]

@@Truunami the age of solo hydro is gone. Most solo hydro in vape teams currently does not have the dps that can match double hydro teams. Why must you be good in a team that is inferior to the double hydro variation? In fact even in solo hydro, Furina is actually better than Xingqiu in quickbloom teams because she steal less aggravates. All the solo hydro teams with just Xingqiu so far has more or less being powercrept by the double hydro teams already. Its pointless to be superior over xingqiu in them.

[@paperworkp]

I NEED THAT WALLPAPER !!!!!!!!!!

[@LandryArri]

Im a vertical investment type of player so my opinion might not be for everyone. I always think twice when it comes to pull and decided to pull better char at reruns and getting their cons, but usually I try to pull all archon because they are usually generalist, meaning there will be situation where using them makes things easier, always. She is the first archon I dont pull, because in the end of the day all she does is giving bigger multiplier for your damage dealer, unlike other archon that always gives more comfort play. And I prefer consistency to clear abyss in 1-2 tries rather than having faster clearing times in good day but need to reset multiple times against something like coppelia or whatever their names are.

[@e554]

im a vertical investment player and furina is debatably the single best character to invest heavily into. c0 she's already arguably the strongest buffer in the game, c1 it's no longer a competition and c2 makes her damage higher/comparable to xingqiu/yelan. c3 makes the buff even more broken c4 basically solves your energy issues c6 lets you run Furina solo without a healer while dishing out hits substantially stronger than even yelan's c6. your loss LMAO

[@blastimbre]

​​@@e554Her damage is comparable to Yelan at c0. She just starts doing absurd numbers at c2.

[@JJennerUK]

Just a buff to your dps? Her crab does like 50-60k damage by itself, she gives 100% damage buff to all characters including off-field E.G. Albedo, Nahida etc... while someone like Yelan only gives it to the active character. Plus if you use Jean or Baizhu, you can max her buff instantly. Her Hydro app is a bit lacking but with 100% uptime it works well enough. She's 100% an upgrade to any account

[@sergito_45]

"the Eula mains can finally C6 their bennets" best quote lol

[@HerMajestyTsaritsaIsDope]

She's so-so for me, even after getting her, I still prefer Yelan most of the time, It's just bc she doesn't bring much to the teams I prefer to play and she demands too much to teams to revolve around her which I don't like... I don't like any or have Fontaine characters to fully get the best of her, Only character she buffed for me is my Raiden but that to bc I don't have C6 Sara.. Furina Gameplay with my Ayaka feels so chunky, while she is good with Hu tao but Yelan/XQ double hydro feels way better bc of how easy it is and Yelan dash can save my Hu tao stamina.. And for Nilou... not worth the pain.

[@tristanmanalo6252]

Try Ayaka, Charlotte, Kazuha and Furina.. so good

[@SLH44-44]

​@@tristanmanalo6252not only XQ but kokomi is washed also lol

[@princessochka3690]

@@tristanmanalo6252 It is a downgrade in comparisson to old comps with Shenhe

[@BellBOYd128]

In abyss I’ve been the biggest fan of Furina overhauling Eula and Noelle for sure. But in overworld, Yae/Fischl/Furina/Baizhu has been my favorite, especially for farming. No running after dumb monsters, just drop my pets and wait.

[@MuhaamadAreeb]

33:07 i swear man this zajeff guy. Its because of this guy that im literally gonna get yelan ( i have furina) and never play him again Like this guy managed to OVERRATE SUCH A GOOD UNIT. It's so enraging

[@TheGwilwileth]

Neuvillette and Funrina, excellent 😊

[@GlacierRain]

We need a 5 star version of Kuki to do Hyperbloom and be a decent healer who replaces Baizhu!

[@Elrog3]

Baizhu is a good healer and decent character overall.

[@GlacierRain]

@@Elrog3 indeed he is. But the Furina Spread/Quickbloom teams require a healer and no electro healer is able to max out the fanfare stacks and also reliablely trigger blooms. Such a character would they exist will allow Nahida/Furina/Spread DPS/ Electro healer to reach higher hights of damage than with Baizhu as the second dendro.

[@Elrog3]

@@GlacierRain Woops I glanced over the 'be' in your first post. I thought you were asking for two different characters. One to replace Kuki and one to replace Biazhu.

[@GlacierRain]

@@Elrog3 all good dw 😄

[@nightmarerex2035]

the nate wants to battle song about the judgemental archons that was rebraded for hellavaboss would also fit furina. as its a gnostic game celestia is probbaly ruled by the enity "yaldabaoth" which is the god of the old testimate. note the bible says the true God is UNCHANGING so how can there be a "new and old" testiment. its more like the corrupted and the uncorrupted testiment.

[@MrGshinobi]

Sadly i have to agree, Furina makes Noelle much better than Itto, she does more damage now with the versatility of being able to slot in elements to deal with elemental shields, i wish they fixed geo somehow but at this point i don't think they'll bother.

[@Axterix13]

They won't fix geo, but it is worth noting the issue for Itto here isn't Itto himself, but instead, the other geos. One of those is Noelle herself, who is not a great healer, all things considered, because she needs so much field time to heal. And the other is Gorou. He's not a geo support, but rather, a def+geo support, and one who needs three geos on the team to even include that geo part. So, basically, Itto needs Hoyoverse to add some more geo support characters... either a healer or a proper niche buffer. If he gets either, he'll come out ahead of Noelle again. And, well, no matter what, Noelle will still feel meh to play for many players, due to her slow attack speed. There's a reason most newer claymore characters, especially five stars, don't attack as slow as the older ones.

[@GVS2001]

I WANT YOUR BACKGROUND PLEASE SEND LINK

[@alexschmidt3034]

She goes from skippable at C0 to restrictive but very good at C1 to BROKEN GODESS at C2-C3+.

[@tristanmanalo6252]

If she is already broken at c3 then what is she in c6 💀💀💀

[@alexschmidt3034]

@@tristanmanalo6252Then just Yelan she goes from being not just the best most broken support to a broken DPS too were we see abyss showcases of her deleting bosses with 700-900k vapes

[@mordakie3805]

C0 works just not consistent

[@blastimbre]

​@@mordakie3805Its consistent, if you have a team with a burst healer. C1 just ups your numbers and C2 just makes her OP