Expensive vs Budget Grooveboxes - What I've learned

[@floncyb5436]

The deluge is the best groove-box in my opinion. I know that’s not the topic at hand. Your channel is nice and I appreciate the clarity in explaining things.

[@UnfinishedIdeas]

Agree with this comment, but I gotta shout out how Gabe acknowledges how he is kind of overlooking the category. Honestly, cut him some slack, he is also still discovering the wonderful world of Grooveboxes, which is why we all watch this right?

[@inf0tr8r]

polyend tracker is a better deal and covers just as much if not more ground

[@LucIndustries]

@@inf0tr8r polyend only has granular synthesis afaik. Kinda turned me off the polyend and onto the deluge. Deluge does Fm, subtractive, has a modulation matrix type keyboard and is getting wavetables and more. The polyend is probably the better sampler but as arranger synth and midi controller the deulge definitely has the upper hand. That said I own a deluge but a polyend is on my longer list. Chopping shit on the polyend is just insanely fast.

[@yakinbozek]

Agree. The Deluge may be the best groovebox. They only need to hire good graphic designers to make the brand and the design of the displays. The super ugly graphic design makes this great machine being overlooked while comparing with the beautiful hardware of Teenage Engineering, Native instruments, Novation, etc.

[@CaidicusProductions]

As someone who's used a lot of grooveboxes, my absolute favourite is the MPC Live. The batterylife is great, so it's actually portable, and even as a non-moving device (something you leave plugged in) it's great for the dawless setup as well. I use my MPC Live as the heart of all my hardware synthesizers and it really just can't be beat.

[@ildarkinildarkin]

In my turn I'm in love with my Akai Force. You get the most for your buck: 64 pad RGB pressure/velocity sensitive controller, advanced sample editing, built in synthesizers and effects (you can add more for your buck), huge amount of storage with additional SSD/HDD, Wifi, Bluetooth, Ableton like clips and Scenes launched from pads or from touchscreen, Arranger mode to finally finish your song! It has Auto Sampler to sample your or your friend's hardware syth so that you'll have multi-sampled version of it in your possession. It has lots of buttons and pots (for buttons and pots lovers). All in all it's the best groovebox on the market! Just one con: it's big. I had MPC One, Elektron Digitakt (still have), Elektron Model Samples, lots of Volcas (still have Sample2). Out of all of them Akai Force is the most advanced tool to finish your song.

[@LCondabeat]

I Don't own any but I love to see groove boxes in action!

[@sodiumsovereign]

You still need to try the MPC One!

[@GabeMillerMusic]

Agreed! It's very high on my list, although I've got a bit of a backlog of video topics I've gotta work through first.

[@BubbaSatori]

Yep. Or the MPC Live 2 that I just got. Incredible bit of kit. New drum synth. 7” touch screen. 4 driver monitors. Battery power. Lots of connectivity. 32 MIDI device potential.

[@LaymensLament]

I think the mpc one has the most features for a studio brain in the cheaper range. If you want something that fills that midi sequencing role (+sampling) the most fully featured device at the least price are a used mpc 1000 or a mpc one.

[@LaymensLament]

Wait you didn't even mention the digitakt, which is the one I decided on. I absolutely love the way their interface is laid out. Edit: sorry shoulda been a top level comment

[@hischuzzness551]

I am all a tither MPC One or Roland Verselab making a purchase next week so time to decide, may even go Circuit tracks but probably need more versatility.

[@dinogoldie9716]

Great video. I hope Novation are now hooking you up with the new models. My picks for gear would be as follows... Tier 1: Korg Volca Drum (£150) and Sonicware's Liven 8bit Warps (£200); Tier 2 Novation Circuit/Tracks (£360) or Arturia's MicroFreak (£230) plus a hardware sequencer such as Keystep Pro (£350); Tiers 3/4: Isla Instruments S2400 (approx £1000). They're not out yet but I am eager to get my hands on the forthcoming Novation Circuit Rhythm and the Sonicware Liven X FM (preordered for £200).

[@l.a.beltranmusic4554]

The fact that you continue to plug Novation products, after they snubbed you on the new circuit, makes you a better man than me. I bought a circuit because of you, and while I really want the new one, I wont buy it until Novation sends you one, along with an apology. You are the godfather of circuit as far as we are concerned. Keep Grinding brotha.

[@GabeMillerMusic]

I appreciate that. To be fair to Novation, they did tell me about the launch a long time in advance, which allowed me to be one of the first to cover it. They express shipped me a unit as soon as they had it, I've got a video ready for tomorrow.

[@hardtakeoff]

Snubbed how

[@JamesAville]

Hey Gabe! Did my homework and I think the right one (for the moment) should be the Novation Circuit Tracks. I already have 3 synths at home and I can take even more out of them with such device. (Novation Ultranova, Behringer Neutron, Uno Synth... Probably a Microfreak anytime soon!) Thanks for this sort of videos. Keep them coming.

[@DocBolus]

I kind of like the 'budget' category because it allows you to think about plugging boxes together. Half the fun is getting things to talk to each other. I also like having boxes from different manufacturers because they all have their own flavour, so at the moment I regularly pair a Circuit and a Samples and then choose another box to join them. Finally I like the 'budget' boxes because I have a mind to play live and I think all of them are small enough so you can get a 3 box live rig into a backpack.

[@troyorwin5043]

This is why I've been a staunch follower since the beginning. You are a no bullshit, cut to the chase style guy.

[@JoshIsMakingMusic]

Great video. Grooveboxes are my favorite medium for music making so I always dig hearing people discuss them.

[@geekindakitchen]

Keep up the good work mate lovin' your channel only found it a few days and I am binging a lot of your videos. Personally the OG circuit in Australia was $699.00 and Circuits Track is 699.00 so I am extremely grateful for the same price , with the MC101 costing $719.00 out here and the MV1 I recently picked up cost me $1300.00

[@_-Marcel-_]

Great! Thank you for your work and opinion!

[@parisdontlikeyou]

I have an Akai Force, and I really like it. It was a little intimidating at first, but once I started using it it became pretty intuitive. I can make full tracks on it and master them before I bounce it to my DAW.

[@ildarkinildarkin]

Advise for beginners: The best sample based groovebox to start with if you are into dance, house, techno music is Elektron Model Samples. If you are into rap, hiphop, beatmaking, fingerdrumming - your first groovebox is Akai MPC One/Plus. If you have more money get MPC Live2 as it has battery and built in speaker. Don't waste your money on Volcas, Pocket operators and other tiny devices. They will not allow you to learn a lot.

[@leewightman8619]

I'm nearly 40 and I'm still buying budget gear as I'm a big believer of its not what use it's how you use it iv heard folk making pure bangers on p.o kos and people making trash on MPC X's and iv got a weird workflow thats based around a tascam multitrack so that gives me a the layering I need

[@briantrudyleupold4937]

Dave excellent videos , I have watched a few of yours as many times as I have seen Zardoz. Anyway thanks for the input keep em coming!

[@JeffyG]

Great video! I still feel like 'Groove Box' is different than a DAW-less all-in device. MPC and Maschine are targeting an alternative to a computer and DAW. Recently, I'm using Drambo on an iPad and find it to be the most complete groove box I've used so far.... for $11.95.

[@CrescentRollCarl]

Love that you mentioned the M8. Thats the one I'm looking forward to.

[@InfotoxIn]

Would recommend, it's ridiculous.

[@CrescentRollCarl]

@@InfotoxIn I've been on the patreon hanging on every update for the link to order! Looks amazing

[@samanderson806]

I would love to see you dive into the mc 707. I was so excited when I found out about the 101, then I saw the 707. Now I'm about to get one.

[@adamshatwell]

I would like it if you could demo a deluge. I have been a happy circuit user, but can't stop thinking about the deluge, I trust your opinion on these matters

[@GabeMillerMusic]

I'd love to, it's on my very long list of gear to try. I'm very limited by time these days and I have a backlog of content to finish (including stuff with the Circuit Tracks once that arrives). I'll get there eventually!

[@mrclaytron]

I think the Deluge is a good step up from the Circuit. If you love grid based sequencing of the circuit, but crave more power and less limitations, the Deluge really takes it to a new level. It's a LOT more complex, but you've got full access to editing the synth engine on the device (supporting subtractive, FM and soon, wavetable). The sampling in Deluge is awesome. The waveform is displayed on the pads like a screen, and you can zoom right in to single cycle level - the device even supports single cycle waveforms assignment to either or both oscillators and has built in effects etc. It does auto pitch detection, and automatically sets the pitch so notes are correct. It's sequencer is probably one of the best available, comparable to dedicated sequencers - a recent update allows zooming and editing up to 6144th notes!!!! (That's not a typo...) So you can record "off the grid", and actually accurately edit it - when you see zoom editing on Deluge, it kind of blows your mind. It's also got full probability based step sequencing too (and the sequencer is only getting better - it's about to get Euclidean sequencing, and multidirectional play per track - which is truly insane). It integrates well with other gear - full DIN MIDI out/in, USB class compliant midi in/out, CV+ gate output + click out. It also runs on rechargable batteries, and is powered by USB or dedicated power supply. You can also configure tracks to work like a looper pedal (yes, you can plug a guitar and MIDI foot pedal, and layer recorded tracks in real time). Oh, and it has UNLIMITED TRACKS - the only limitation being the processor. I've had over 20 tracks of audio and synths, with effects playing without a hiccup. Even playback speeds can go to insane high and low extremes for sound design. It's sampling engine has time stretching per note (like Ableton Simpler), plus multi-sampling, and "drum kits" that offer sample and synth patches from the same "instrument". It's not perfect, but for me, a guy who just freaking loves grooveboxes - why I also love Gabe's channel! (I've had Circuit, Octatrack, Analog Four, Electribe 2, Roland MC-303, Maschine +, Roland JD-Xi and a bunch of other stuff...), the Deluge is honestly the most amazing device I've ever owned - It's expensive (but not super expensive for what it can do), but I think it punches well above its weight. I'm a fan of Maschine + as a super powerful (but overpriced - I'm NOT a fan of the NI tax!) production machine. But looking at the price and features, the Deluge smashes it IMO. Deluge feels nothing like using a computer (also what I love with Circuit) Watch some more Deluge videos (Red Means Recording, Cuckoo, Dolo Jones, Ollie Loops and of course Loopop for in depth review). If you are ok with the price, you are buying a super powerful groovebox work station, capable of full professional tracks, if you put in the time to learn it. I can't recommend this device enough - if you LOVE grooveboxes, Deluge is a dream machine! For me, it is everything I wished the Circuit was - and more.

[@adamshatwell]

@@mrclaytron thanks for your very welcome answer. It seems like an amazing machine, the looping function, wavetable, synthesis, sample to oscillator, have just sold it to me. I like to work 'outside the box' as much as possible. That's quite a statement that you say its the most amazing device you've ever owned. Thanks again, for a brilliant reply. Your getting a sub from me 👍😁🎶👌

[@mrclaytron]

@@adamshatwell thanks man - just be sure to watch some videos about the Deluge before you decide if you really want one - for me, it's brilliant - but not everyone loves the workflow, so just read and watch as much as you can on it to decide if it looks right for you (I'd hate for you to buy one and then find its not your cup of tea) - but if you do eventually get one, be sure to record some tracks to share with the other Delugers on KZbin :-)

[@mijaba]

I've had a deluge since the first "public" sales. It is beyond a groovebox, though that's what category it could fit in. It is essentially a complete DAW in a diminutive, battery powered box. I do not use it for recording onto, though that is one of it's capabilities. Unlimited tracks, unlimited steps, sample editing/playback, fm/subtractive/(soon wavetable synthesis), (soon euclidean sequencing), this is the machine for you. I have never been disappointed with my purchase. It is a sophisticated instrument with ever-expanding capabilities.

[@stevenwoodward4333]

Thank you for your in depth videos. I’m kind of new and have learned quite a bit watching your videos on music tech. Keep up the great work 👍! Many blessings.

[@MidlifeSynthesist]

Awesome video Gabe! It’s definitely a very exciting time to get into dawless✌🏻 Pd: I would recommend you trying out the digitakt, I think you might like it a lot... beware though, elektrons are highly addictive lol, cheers bro!

[@javierfernandez5275]

Great video, I was blown out when I connected them together in a midi chain. (e2+mc101+circuit)

[@hednodsflyingoscillatorcir9827]

Toy : Every synth I own. Some were very expensive, but still my toys. Toys : the funnest ones, usually cheap but have a great sound. Play to play! It’s your kit, get what you want and can afford.

[@anakamhi7097]

You are a great KZbinr and the info you give is quality! I know one day it will be harder to reply to all our questions 😳Hope your channel keeps growing more and more!

[@engx3733]

I have a Akai Force, Roland mc101 and Korg Electribe Sampler 2. Out of all them, I prefer the mc101. It feels more complete and virtually bug free unlike the Akai Force.

[@alecsbuga]

I bought a Maschine+ instantly when they launched it because I've been wanting it since I got my Maschine 1. But it is very expensive for what it is. I also retrofitted it with a battery and RipCord cable so if you ignore its size & weight, it's fairly portable. What I hate about it is the quiet inputs. You really have to drive those in order to get a proper signal. same issue as MK3. Other than that I have also an OPZ Which is amazing for what it is. I do wish it had Line In, but you can get around that by sampling via USB from the phone which is also super cool. I'm really excited about the Circuit Rhythm too. The tracks version, I preordered it , but I plan to return it. I just wanna test it.

[@jdssurf]

What do u mean quiet inputs? I’m kinda newer sorry

[@alecsbuga]

@@jdssurf the sound coming through line in is quiet

[@dreadful_name2924]

You’re only 23?! Dude you’re doing so well!

[@thethrillofnoskill4521]

Ahhhh thank you for reminding me about the chromatic and polyphonic sampling I love the synth Engine but it is a bit too clean and nice for music I want to make !!! Time to get the 101 and tr-6s out again

[@All_Together_Now]

I just chose to buy a Maschine Mikro mk3 over the new novation circuit. For me it is essentially the full Maschine of you don’t mind having it hooked up to your laptop and using that as the screen rather than having the built in ones. The limitations are almost non existent if you don’t mind clicking on your computer screen sometimes. Also it’s only $270 vs $420 for the Circuit and $650 for the full Maschine. A no-brainer if you ask me.

[@GabeMillerMusic]

That's fair, they're different devices for different use cases. The Circuit is much more performance oriented, the Maschine stuff is more beatmaking/composition oriented. I've definitely thought about getting a Mikro myself, I might pull the trigger on one when I have more time.

[@inf0tr8r]

P o l y e n d T r a c k er

[@valley_robot]

Here's what I think if you're starting out, anything is good as long as it's affordable for you, I started with a Yamaha qy70 that I paid 75.00 for and a Casio ht700 that cost me 7.00 from a charity shop. I still have it and will never sell it because it's still useful for long train rides. I sold most of my old gear to purchase an MPC one, I did my research before taking the plunge, it had to replace all my old gear and it did it with ease. it's at the higher end in price but when you compare it to the new circuit at its price new, it's not much more to save up for an MPC one, if budget is tight I can not recommend an old Yamaha QY70 enough, if it's sampling you want to do, a used PO33 is the way to go, they sell for about 50 -60 used. use what you have until you get better at it, better gear will not make you a better musician, it never has and it never will.

[@taylorfournier7943]

One of the things I love the most about music is that there’s guys out there like you. Honest, and informative reviews in every niche of music gadgetry. I’ve watched several of your videos already. Just trying to find where I really want to start before I make the financial leap.

[@milk_bath]

Hyped for the Korg Drumlogue and if they update the Electribe. They have come a long way in UI/UX and quality and quantity of synthesis since the Electribe 2.

[@Johnnyhaag79]

Elektron ! Hands down Amazing!!

[@symbiat0]

BTW, I’m in the Patreon group for that tiny tracker you mention, hoping it will be made available to patrons early... 😁

[@joshpuhl9524]

I think the thumbnail image is great! I am getting to know the Akai Force, which I picked up recently. It isn't a groovebox, but I am connecting with it. It's more of a mobile studio than a groovebox, though. I didn't like the limitations of the cheaper grooveboxes. Thanks for the video!

[@cartilagehead]

what’s your take on more “hybrid” devices like Push 2 or the cheaper, non-standalone Maschine? They’re not quite grooveboxes since they’re tied to a DAW, but let’s be honest, most people are working within arm’s length of a computer with a DAW anyway. I’d also argue that iOS has matured into a groovebox-like experience (Android is too fragmented to really compete in that regard, unfortunately, and lots of great iOS apps don’t come out on Android) at this point. You’ve got people like Hainbach replacing their OP-1s with iPads, and you can certainly make complete tracks entirely in iOS at this point depending on what your budget for software is.

[@GabeMillerMusic]

I think it's great, the more options the better. I've thought about getting a Maschine Mikro mk3, the only thing stopping me is time to actually use it, given how much of a backlog of gear I already am trying to get through. And yeah, seeing iOS music production get to this point is great, the tools have gotten really powerful. It's something I'd like to explore in the future, time permitting.

[@mikg2618]

Thanks for mid category real support ! )

[@BIG1TOWER]

Awesome channel and topic Gabe

[@jackiechan2687]

Hi Gabe, do you think it’s good time to do updated video on these 4 categories?

[@681MUSIC]

Not mentioning digitakt and digitone in the 1,000 budget ? first video of yours that I find very incomplete, still love the channel

[@nsbd90now]

You are so well spoken I subscribed.

[@batninja]

The OP-Z could perhaps be in the 2 cat at £450 odd. For those new to grooveboxes (like me) it’s really wonderful.

[@GabeMillerMusic]

Yeah it's just a bit more expensive than I arbitrarily made that category, but it looks really cool and isn't *that* much more

[@batninja]

You should try one out if you haven’t yet. As a guitarist for me, the OP-Z is more of an musical instrument with musical mode recognition and improvisational aspects, plus no screens (unless you plug one in), no loads of buttons and dials, no menus.

[@qbpie]

I know they're mostly above your spending comfort level, but you didn't mention Elektron at all! Of all the grooveboxes out there, I see Elektron gear the most. Especially at gigs. The Octatrack and/or Digitakt are the heart of many, many musicians' setups. Some folks think of them as the holy grain of grooveboxes. I wouldn't go that far, but they are pretty amazing machines. You might really like the Digitakt/Digitone or the Models units.

[@Drone453]

Didn't he mention Model Samples?

[@martinthompson2584]

Pricing is clearly pretty different here in Australia. I could get the Deluge for considerably less than any of the other grooveboxes in the "kind of expensive" category. Guess that's the "Australia tax" at play. Also kind of convenient that the Deluge comes from just over the pond and arrived very quickly.

[@natanunorthodox]

Listen to Gabe Miller here, because he knows what he is talking about on this topic. I would go right for the "kind of expensive" one's, and learn one of them inside and out. You will be way better off overtime, and it will definitely pay off. I have an MPC One on the way soon, and I cannot wait, because it's really on then, because I can do everything stand alone for real...SBN RESONATE

[@ashtomtube]

I was expecting you to mention the Octatrack MkII in the expensive category.

[@robertsyrett1992]

I think he remains unenlightened about "the Elekton workflow."

[@shaft9000]

He's overlooking pretty much everything in the upper tier...to not mention or even acknowledge the RS7000 E-mu 2500 or spectralis/Quasimidi or even the wack-ish big old Roland'MC x0x' boxes really pegs this video to novice-level. This video has no working definition of the topic: MPCs have been MIDI+sampling throughout their existence and not tied to a grid. "Sorta" grooveboxes, at best. And people mentioning things like Deluge - that are evolutions of the monome and Live: a clip launch+MIDI paradigm. Again - at best, 'sorta' grooveboxes but not the goal there, either.

[@ruairiokane3804]

Really great information. I'd like to get a synth/drum machine for my 8 year old, and having used MPCs, and old Electribe groove boxed in the past, think they might be complicate for him to use. I'd like him to have the tactile experience of creating and manipulating sounds and beats with knobs and pads on a stand alone piece of equipment. I like the look of the novation, but would be interested in your view on this, and if you think something in the 'cheap' category would be better! Cheers.

[@GabeMillerMusic]

I usually recommend a Novation Circuit to beginners looking for something budget, and yeah I'd recommend it for a kid to learn on. It's pretty straightforward to learn and has some room to grow into

[@ruairiokane3804]

@@GabeMillerMusic Thanks for the quick response. I'll check it out. Cheers.

[@LucIndustries]

You should try the Deluge some day. Its a circuit on steroids.

[@vprice509]

I expected this to be a Circuit lovefest. I was wrong. I apologize. My next music purchase will be an MPC One. Yes, it's a groovebox, but I think it's more than that. I love techno above all other beat-heavy music, so I am going to make some on the MPC. But I want to do other stuff, too, that is more ambient, experimental and not so linear. I want to use a sampler as a proper instrument; more than just beats, loops and one-shots. I am hoping I will like the interface and that the MPC will let me do what I want.

[@OldheadMike]

guitar center near me has the maschine mk3 on clearance for 499..... i'm very tempted

[@vertigev]

The Deluge ❤️❤️❤️

[@MrJackal43]

Yes.

[@bartjanc]

Yup, beat all the other ones in the list. Song/arrengement mode, looper, portable, intuitive to use, updated all the time, etc. etc.

[@GrootsieTheDog]

Anecdote: There is a famous filmmaker who makes all her films with old video cameras and very little editing. Another filmmaker known in the high art world creates with, literally, only toy cameras. Context, capability, construction, & connection, (feel, aesthetics, etc.) all have to be considered. They easily become interchangeable depending on the person when considering the word “toy” to describe a piece of gear. The word “toy” has become, unjustly, a derogatory term.

[@cheapnoiseinthehouse5578]

Really nice video as always. What is the best cheap beat making device for under 150$US in 2022? I am starting to hate working with my SK-1 from 1985. If it's better than that, it's great for me.

[@eaman11]

Dedicated Grove boxes looks fun but are unpractical, they always fail in something like sound quality, ability to arrange a whole song, display for edits, user interface. Your old laptop with a Launchkey mini is both easier, more powerful and most important a better time investment as you can start simple and then develop the idea with all bells and whistle.

[@koskey06]

Buy a 8 year old or newer laptop for at or under $100.....buy any midi controler.....boom! You have any and every sound you want and can do what everyou want

[@JM168M]

Gabe would you say, a really good midi keyboard such Komplete Kontrol can be an alternative to the upper beat station?

[@matthewwilson3673]

love these videos, helps me out in my journey to get hardware haha

[@RadekPilich]

You are missing the arguably most interesting "grooveboxes" which are the Elektron boxes, whether the Digi series or even the flagships.

[@BecomingProductions]

Agreed they deserve a mention, but I guess hes never really covered them aside from the Model Cycles so probably tricky for him to accurately classify them. They're kinda their own thing, both in workflow and capabilities. Like there is literally not one other device or even piece of software can can do what the Octatrack can do, so can understand some reluctancy to cover these without having full knowledge of them.

[@LorenzoDeprado]

Cant speak for the digitakt but the digitone is more of a ultra-powerful digital synth that happens to do groovebox type workflow fairly well. Trying to program full drum loops on one track can be tedious given the sound management and locking required. On the spectrum of grooveboxes, its definitely on the less "fun" side and more on the "sound design / powerful" side.

[@GabeMillerMusic]

Yeah that's a blind spot of mine that I've tried to remedy a bit, but I've not totally gotten there yet. Although note that I'm mainly using the lists of grooveboxes as examples to give the categories context, and it's not meant to be an exhaustive list.

[@BecomingProductions]

@@GabeMillerMusic totally understand Gabe. It actually just highlights how big this category of products has become. You cover a whole bunch but yet the grooveboxes I primarily use barely get a mention, namely Akai MPC-X, Akai MPC Live, Akai Force, Polyend Tracker, Octatrack, Digitakt and Analog Rythm (strictly speaking a drum machine but still very much has groove box functionality). Its ok man nobody could possibly know and cover every product under the sun. What you do cover, you're doing a great job of.

[@GabeMillerMusic]

Thanks! I'd definitely like to get more into Elektron stuff given more time. I'd really love to give the Polyend Tracker a go for a total switchup, that's very high on my list.

[@MistyMusicStudio]

Thumbs up number 666, huzzah! Excellent rundown ^_^

[@gagagalousch]

Did you ever talk about the electribe sampler 2 in a video ?

[@gerrylop3476]

Gracias por darte el tiempo para el vídeo. Aunque comentas que en tu amplio conocimiento y búsqueda . Pero acaso tienes más de 20 años? Conoces rave olution. O las tr o las EMU. Creo que solo hablas de las cosas que son relativamente nuevas. Y no te esta mal. Pero creo que a un Vince Clark o a un productor serio se le creería más. Y no es tanto la caja es más bien la experiencia.. en fin. Se agradece el esfuerzo... Saludos

[@DjAlkmst]

I’d say Circuit/Tracks Pro rather than a lite version would be nice. Workflow of Novation but competitive features of ie. Akai/Maschine+ (yes a small screen may be needed).

[@djdeemz7651]

Which of all has the best live looping experience, im a Turntablist and want get into live looping my cuts but with a drum machine thrown in I'm looking at getting a boss 505 and maybe thr trs 8 for the live possibilities but is there anything that does it all i was looking at the 707 but from what people have said the loop recording doesnt suit a live situation ..maybe 505 is the way

[@Kev-1k]

I would love to hear how you feel about the elektron digitak! you often leave that device out of the conversation

[@GabeMillerMusic]

Yeah I'd definitely like to give more Elektron stuff a go in the future. I'm more interested in the Digitone than the Digitakt, but I'm sure either would be dope.

[@Kev-1k]

​@@GabeMillerMusic just curious what dont you like about the digitakt? no shade or anything i have one and i have my opinions on it (some great and some annoyances). I want to get something else im considering getting digitone to finish off the combo or completely switching directions for a whole new work flow but im just curious your opinion if you have one specific reason it doesnt get mentioned much. im sure it would be redundant for you to own one with all the other boxes you do have. Thank you!

[@GabeMillerMusic]

I don't have anything against it, but yeah it would be slightly redundant in my current setup, and I just don't find the feature set as appealing as some other samplers out there. Also, I just think the Digitone seems neat and would be an interesting change from the kind of stuff I normally use.

[@Kev-1k]

@@GabeMillerMusic hey thanks for you opinion man much appreciated. i find the sample organization or lack of to be very frustrating and just the fact that you cant really store "kits" to be a little bit of a miss. i love the sequencer paramater locks though and the control all function!

[@musicwombat74]

I wonder why Elektron Digitone doesn't get mentioned. It seems to have all the features of a groovebox, a synth, a sequencer, mixer, external hardware support etc. Doesn't have a sampler, but is it a hard requirement?

[@tekrahmuzik777]

Hi Gabe, since you are working on a video for the Machine+...i was going to get one but after i have seen another video...with 4gigs of ram, it show that after your load just 2 plugins the CPU is already max out...please check that out and looking forward to that review...prob they are already working on Machine+ 2 with at least 16RAM, thanks

[@Darqion]

I'm trying to buy my first groovebox and ive been unable to decide for a while now. Part of me wants to be cautious and buy a cheaper one like the circuits or mc101, but i also fear i would miss some visual feedback. The bigger ones with a bigger screen are on my watchlist for that reason.. the 707 or mpc one.. maybe a deluge The issue with those is that they jump in price about twofold. Really not sure how i`ll ever decide on this.. but i guess that does save me some money

[@pinto_ukes8406]

Hello, if you can help, I play Bass, Acoustic and Electric guitar. To do music, with record parts from the instruments and create music, what the best choise, novation tracks, rithm, or buy a used novation circuit? Thanks

[@grouponspeam9236]

OP-Z is the king of groove box around 600 bucks. Yep, not doubt, from every aspect (excl. build quality)

[@Jarah]

This is really good thanks

[@alexshdvideo]

Good time to be learning. I wish I was 40 years younger but I think I’ll jump into this. I like the idea of several groove boxes to learn with just to a void the computer, or be working on ideas while the computer is doing something else. I see Novation line has a lot that worked with not only Ableton (that I won’t worry about because of price) but Logic Pro X (cheap $200. GarageBand Pro). What sort of budget grooveboxes to start with that won’t be superseded by new gear or say Logic Pro etc. I will be order a Native Instruments Maschine Mikro because I like working with my midi keyboard with Native INstrumetns Komplete Kontrol. I may choose to go Maschine MK3... but the Mikkro for $250 and looking at screens but not easy sampling.... (haven’t decided on that one yet.. though I hear one can use the Mikro with MK3 at the same time and not be a purchased and stuck with later... don’t know). Anyway I’ll review your recent videos with Roland and Novation grooveboxes.. every time I look there seems to be another new one. I did get a Roland VT-4 that I like a lot. (Voice changing box with live hardware effects).

[@sunahura]

I see myself in you 30 years ago, life is good. Keep growing 💗💗💗

[@diosancho3875]

Would you be able to suggest one for a blind user above the beginner level

[@techstyles758]

How about a video on how you got companies to demo gear?

[@GabeMillerMusic]

I did a video when I hit 20k subscribers about what I learned over the course of growing a channel, all that stuff still applies. Usually, reaching out to a company hasn't worked for me, they have to like the content and the audience size first. That just takes time, consistency, and constant course correction to get to. Although I'd start a channel for the love of the KZbin video as a medium FIRST... It was years before companies hit me up to send me gear. And having tried as many devices as I have isn't even close to necessary. If I was just making music and not running a gear focused channel, I'd probably own only two or three of the devices I click with the most.

[@FormatWarsBand]

A personal lesson I learned... I spent many years looking for the “all in one” groovebox/production station, beginning with an MPC. Now if the idea is to release top notch sounding music, the ‘master bus’ on these devices never seems to have the finished sound. I’ve been much happier since adding a mixer and external effects to get a finished sound. As a groovebox user, you may need to have a strategy to process the output, whether that be in a DAW or some external studio gear. On a budget you may not need to own this other processing gear. Find someone who has it or use software. What do you think Gabe?

[@bf5765]

I'm picking up one of the new Circuit Tracks and I want to be able to mess around with it while on the go, like during a lunch break or something like that. Anyone have a suggestion for a case or bag to keep it from getting banged up?

[@GabeMillerMusic]

I just got some cases from Analog Cases, I'm going to do a video on then soon and give a review.

[@jaygreer7430]

Here’s the case I use for the original circuit: Gator Cases Mixer Case (G-MIXERBAG-0909). For me, it works great and will even fit cables and some small accessories in addition to the circuit without being bulky. The dimensions of the new circuit tracks appear to be similar, so my guess is this case should work fine with it.

[@AllaMortify]

Are the lower end grooveboxes (Circuit etc) more for say jamming than actual production then? Looking at the Circuit Tracks videos seems to suggest that it's pretty intuitive to use and just pick up and run with compared to even the slightly more pricey offerings like the MPC One mentioned in the comments which for all it's added features (Sampling, the new drum synth etc) looks way more serious and complicated to operate and really only for those who know what they're doing, not casual users looking to while away some time doing some musically creative stress relieving.

[@GabeMillerMusic]

That's definitely true to a degree, although I would say don't underestimate the production capabilities of less expensive grooveboxes, and don't overestimate the difficulty of more expensive grooveboxes.

[@davidegrotto9910]

Grazie from italy !

[@strandedaliensband]

If you would like, I would be willing to let you use my Orba for a review video. Let me know what you think of the idea...

[@GabeMillerMusic]

I appreciate it, although I already have one and am slowly working on a review.

[@strandedaliensband]

@@GabeMillerMusic cool. I'm not impressed with it and plan to sell mine

[@GabeMillerMusic]

Interesting that you say that, I actually think it's really impressive on a technical level, but has a ways to go to be properly useful for everyday situations.

[@strandedaliensband]

@@GabeMillerMusic I thought about keeping it for around campfire hang outside and running it through a portable speakers, letting someone play some drums on it while I played Cigar Box Guitar. But... ehh...

[@sykromsmile6303]

Great video

[@IanTindale]

You’re getting a lot of plosives coming through on the mic. Not always, but there’s times where it increases noticeably. At those times the proximity effect increases the bass too much so I’d say it’s simply getting too close on occasion. I don’t think a pop filter would help, it’s just distance. The mic is already off-axis to your mouth so that’s good, it’s prob just a touch too close. Or something.

[@GabeMillerMusic]

Yeah I'm still testing setups as I go, I've backed off the mic in subsequent filming sessions

[@IanTindale]

@@GabeMillerMusic The rule I use personally in mic placement is stretch your thumb and your pinkie apart, that's about how far your mic should be from your mouth

[@michaely1377]

Have you ever tried elektron gear?

[@GabeMillerMusic]

The only piece of Elektron gear I've used is the Model:Cycles, which I do like a lot, I've made multiple videos with it.

[@michaely1377]

@@GabeMillerMusic id be curious how you'd like the more traditional workflow of the digitakt or analog rytm. Start a Kickstarter to fund a synth binge! 😁

[@buscandolaverdad8686]

MpcOne not recommend for ableton users. But is really amazing for ppl looking for all in one solution And in a budget. Or a laptop and maschine mk2

[@zonashi8645]

Polyend tracker

[@sawtooth808]

Nice to see The Polyend Tracker getting love, despite the latency issue, however this is getting addressed in an upgrade, Polyend does care about their customers unlike other companies (rhymes with Morg)

[@JasonHader]

I don't know that he has the depth for that.

[@rskityaev]

Good day, kind sir! I'd like to ask a question, if you don't mind. I've been using DAWs for like eternity and i wonder how do you mix songs from grooveboxes? You record stems one by one, bring them into your daw and mix? Or you use internal effects for that?

[@GabeMillerMusic]

It depends on the groovebox. The Roland MC-101, Korg Electribe 2, and a bunch of the more expensive ones have ways to export or record multiple tracks. For others, like the Circuit, you would need to mute and unmute stuff to record each track one at a time. It's totally doable, but kind of a pain, so I rarely do it myself.

[@rskityaev]

@@GabeMillerMusic thank you!

[@xn-triq7607]

Polyend Tracker has the biggest bang for your Buck! FACT!

[@jjurksztowicz]

Polyend tracker is amazing, but I can't use mine anymore, too buggy. I lost days of work twice already. I really hope they fix their code because they have a winning formula, it just needs more quality control.

[@xn-triq7607]

@@jjurksztowicz Really, I've been fine so far, fingers crossed! but I am a casual user, I'll make sure to back up often after hearing this.

[@andre.quaresma]

Hi, Gabe. What's your opinion on the Roland verselab mv-1? And where does it fit in a setup? I've checked many videos but most of them focus on hip hop and not electronic music.

[@GabeMillerMusic]

I'm hoping to give one a go very soon, but in my mind, a lot of the hip hop stuff will translate well to electronic stuff. It's definitely got the synth engine, layers, and DAWlike setup to accommodate that.

[@andre.quaresma]

@@GabeMillerMusic yes. I'm really thinking about buying one but I'm waiting for more videos mainly focused on electronic music. Or I could just load the zencore engine into the new circuit :)

[@andre.quaresma]

I will wait for your video though :)

[@natanunorthodox]

If everyone wants my honest recommendation on this topic, because I have owned many cheaper synth/drum machines before, and still own them, but if I was you, and I was serious about this thing, then I would go right for something around a 1000 dollars or a bit cheaper. I would not get something under 500 dollars if you are serious about going stand alone. I own a Roland JD-XI, and I am doing some really great music with it, but I have been using it and these other "cheaper" "budget friendly" synth/drum machines since 2000, so I know alot about them. I would not recommend anything less than, or cheaper than the Roland JD-XI, if you are being serious about making music. The Electribe 2 isn't so bad, and I own the gray version myself, but it's just not enough to get really serious with. There's only global effects, and the overall sounds are pretty mediocre, but you can make it work if you really desire to, because I do, but it's all up to you to make it something...SBN RESONATE

[@beejayOne]

Nice Video, but not a lot of "new" information to me. Totally agree with all of your points! Just one question: Do you think it's worth to get a used MPC 1000? I'm kind of curious how it's working and if you control another synth via MIDI you also also have a mighty-ish setup. That's at least how i understand it.

[@MrKadidle51]

Totally new to this stuff. So...how do I get the sound out? Do I need a computer? Or just some kind of small PA?

[@GabeMillerMusic]

Just posted a video about this today, at least for recording/exporting sound. To listen, all you need is a pair of headphones or speakers. The point of devices like this is that they're self contained, so you don't need to connect them to a computer (other than to load sounds onto them)

[@MrKadidle51]

@@GabeMillerMusic awesome. Listening now

[@keepitshortnsweet]

0:35 The only "shifting" I want to see at the moment is a shift to grooveboxes for musicians whose understanding of the breadth of available time signatures extends beyond those of the elementary school classroom Fisher-Price xylophone "jams". Rant over. Please continue.

[@roguca31]

u should check out the polyend tracker

[@GabeMillerMusic]

It's on my list of gear to try, I'd definitely like to give it a go when I have the time

[@beedok]

the click bait eyes got me.

[@futur_sunds]

Same

[@harrycallaghan22]

Do you know of a groove box that I could write and produce an entire song on from start to finish. I was interested in the Roland MC707 but someone commented that you can’t write an entire song on it but you’d have to change the pattern on the fly.

[@GabeMillerMusic]

The Roland Verselab MV-1 might be exactly what you're looking for.

[@harrycallaghan22]

@@GabeMillerMusic thats exactly what someone else has just said. Have you tried it?

[@GabeMillerMusic]

Not yet, hopefully soon!

[@ArcAudios77]

The MC-707 has Song Mode so it's easily capable of full Song Production just like the MC-505 from 1998. Pattern movement is seamless on the 707 & 505.

[@shaft9000]

You can write an entire song on any groovebox that has an 'arranger' or 'song' function. e.g. EM-1 for a couple hundred bucks. E-mu Command Station. Be aware that most of the newer units LACK this feature, though. Progress does not always mean _improvement._

[@Gesamtkunstrave]

I have one question please. How do you record both audio and video with the circuit? I struggle with it very long time, and i would be very happy if you could help me🥺🥺

[@GabeMillerMusic]

I record them separately (my camera and then I record the audio into my DAW with an audio interface). I sync then up after the fact... I'll hit a pad at the beginning of the video, then look for where that and the first audio hit of the recording line up.

[@GameBrou]

Gabe, I would love to see your take on the IOS ecosystem. It’s versatile, sounds professional and its very portable! Maybe you’re a Android guy, but... Just think about it. ;-)

[@GabeMillerMusic]

I'd definitely like to give iPad music production a go, especially to use Andrew Huang's app and maybe try iMaschine and some classic synth emulations. I should probably just try to borrow an ipad for a week and try out a bunch of this stuff at some point.

[@GameBrou]

@@GabeMillerMusic You’ll never regret. I have an Ipad pro and its a m a z i n g! It has that music concept I know you love and share. “Make music everywhere!”

[@caramel777]

Levels in a nutshell: Level 1 - "cheap" Level 2 - budget Level 3 - kind of expensive? Level 4 - HELLA SPENSIVE