Game Dev on the "Cheapest" Mac Studio. UE5, Unity, Xcode.

[@kurtnelle]

Dude, you're making videos like you've got a million subscribers. Nice presentation.

[@medboys3516]

u ugh dr y

[@josephkelly4893]

Backhander

[@pirojfmifhghek566]

Wow, that's the bitchiest way I've ever heard someone say "You've done a professional job of shooting and editing your videos."

[@kurtnelle]

@@pirojfmifhghek566 😆I wasn't intending to sound bitchy; I was just blown away by the production value.

[@gajananddave3385]

He really deserve it 🙂

[@DirkTeucher]

The thing about PC/Windows/Linux VS Apple is that game engines like Unreal Engine and Unity makes a considerable effort to enable cross platform development on Windows Linux and Apple. However Apple refuses to allow you to make games for Apple or iOS without buying an Apple mac to compile the code with Xcode. I own an iPhone and I cannot install games onto it using my windows/linux machines. You just cannot test your game or VR project on an Apple device if you do not compile the game on Apple hardware. There is no good reason at all for me to buy into this closed garden business model. None. The only reason Apple does this is to make more money for themselves and to control developers, it does not help me as a developer. It does not help the 3d ecosystem and it pushes me away from any desire to support that business model because it does not help improve the 3d industry at all. Apple needs to learn to cooperate. Apple does not want to play nicely with the other kids. So as a game dev I avoid Apple for anything related to 3d work or app development unless I absolutely have to for things like porting over from Android or for client work. Even then the 3d performance on Mac is abysmal even on the M1 for things like path tracing so you end up having to cut things out and reduce the fidelity to get 30fps. No thanks Apple, keep your studio.

[@3dduff]

I am a 3d/ motion graphics artist. Back in November, i got a new M1MAX Macbook Pro. Since then I have been trying to figure out how it was going to fit into my PC workflow. Then I had a hard deadline coming up that required me to switch my simulation work over to my MacBook, while my PC was busy with another task. I have been working on this simulation scene that has a few dozen objects bouncing around a room. I had been working on this job for about a week, so I knew what to expect for my simulation times. By the way, I was using C4D. My Macbook pro DISTROID my PC in sim times. I was used to setting up the scene and it takes 20-30 minutes to cache for real-time playback....my MacBook was 7-10 minutes! it was SO FAST that I found myself watching the non-cached playback and was able to identify issues I was having. My PC is running a 10-core i9 that's 3-4 years old. it's not a THreadripper, but it's no slouch. Now I find myself thinking about how to divide up my jobs to take advantage of the M1s power. And don't even get me started about aftereffects. my 45-minute render on the PC was closer to 15 minutes on my Macbook. Not only render times but the Interface and feedback is WAY better. I have been building HUGE animations for LED walls and for delivery I need to chop them up in pixel-accurate 'slices' for the playback on these specialized playback systems. My master QuickTime file for one animation was 8k and come in at 35 gigs. My PC struggles when I start masking it and moving my 'slices' around in a new comp. My M1 Macbook pro feels like I'm working in HD! But not everything is all roses. Redshift GPU rendering is a joke. One frame of one of my projects took 3 minutes on my PC with a 3090 & 3080...My MacBook pro took 35 minutes. That is so far from acceptable it's not even within consideration. But I am interested to see what the new Redshift 3.5 CPU looks like. In conclusion, being an old school Mac Guy that was forced to make the switch to PCs about 8 years ago, I am happy to see Apple come back with such strong machines. But I realize My work is in the top 3-5% of all users that will push their hardware this hard. The fact that Apple has delivered this much power....IN A LAPTOP FOR ME...is a real accomplishment. The only thing needed for Apple to be really taken seriously as a production machine again is to mend the broken bridges with NVIDIA. But from what I hear neither side is willing to work together. So if I had to buy a new system today....it would still be a PC, But in a year? That may change.

[@solidgalaxy3339]

So, a year has passed since your comment. What have you decided to buy?

[@3dduff]

@@solidgalaxy3339 Thanks for asking. Surprisingly, this was only 1 year ago. When I wrote this, I was waiting on the MacPro and expecting exponential scale in performance. Apple did NOT deliver with the MacPro I was hoping for. From everything I hear, the M-ULTRA chips have a few serious bottlenecks. Some blame that bus throughput between the chip dies, while others (including Apple) blame developers for "quick compality re-compiles" that do not take advantage of the hardware as much as a proper ground up re-write would. There is still a big future for the Apple M chip...but I am still waiting....and that's disappointing. But back to your question "WHAT did I buy." Well, the week before the Ryzan 7000s came out, the Ryzon 5000s were getting blown out. I have a PC parts list for a new "dream machine" that I continually update every 2-3 months. Well, the parts on that list ranged from almost $5000 to around $3500. So I pulled the trigger on a new AMD 5950x system with 128 GB of RAM and 8 TB of internal M.2 storage...AND a new 4090 to go into it. Look at those parts and that price. Apple was NEVER a contender. As soon as the new System was built, I must have spent a week doing nothing but bench tests. Across the board, it beat my Mac by 20-30%. And the more I look around at other people's Apple to PC comparison, newer PCs were definitely faster. The Redshift benchmarks demonstrated this the best. A 4090 in a Newish PC gets about 1:18 in the Redshift benchmark...the BEST Mac score I have seen is around 4 minutes. This is a Win for apple that its even COMPEATING in this test that had NO Apple support for the last 4-5 years...but 75% slower?!?!? SO the Mac is NOT for rendering, you COULD, but your better off sending the job to a cheap $1500 Pc render node you can build. But there is one area that the I feel the Mac still excells at, and that is running anything ADOBE. Maybe its my Mac-guy bies but AE and photoshop feel super responsive on the Mac. My new works station IS faster at rendering/computing...but my MacBook pro fells like I am able to work faster. I REALY wanted to see a beast of a MacPro, but what we got was a top of the line Macbook pro, in a fancy case that costs $4000 more. My final take way, Apple is in the running, but still not giving the PC a real challenge.

[@Weird_Quests]

I'd love to see more VFX and 3D rendering projects on the new systems - such as Blender, After Effects, CInema4D etc...

[@ArthurFurtadod2r]

And some Houdini please!🙂

[@Weird_Quests]

@@ArthurFurtadod2r definitely!! This!

[@godemperordoctordoom6904]

I ❤️ Cinema4D

[@pirojfmifhghek566]

There are other reviews out there and the end result is pretty similar. Buggy, slower, lack of compatibility. The general consensus is if you buy a Mac Studio for simple applications that simply need speedy RAM throughput, you'll be fine. If you bought a Mac Studio specifically for massive computations in projects like 3d rendering and CAD, my condolences.

[@Weird_Quests]

@@pirojfmifhghek566 Thanks, Pirojf :D I'm just gonna get a good gaming laptop (probably a 2021 model as they have great prices atm) and then just build a workstation later when I can.

[@ReavenZero]

Man, you Videos are always a joy to watch. Entertaining, Informative and very well produced.

[@Andrew-tl9gk]

Unreal not running native on Apple Silicon is a SHAME. It doesnt support Lumen and Nanite aswell thats awful. I am working with Unity for a while now and wanted to check out Unreal and seriously cant believe it.

[@gregjoblove672]

Running a 16" MBP from 2019 with an intel chip, and ran into many of the same problems with UE5. I think it may be more of a Mac issue rather than an Apple Silicon issue, but who's to say.

[@AWSVids]

16" MBP with M1 Pro chip, 16GB ram... UE5 doesn't crash for me, but it does run pretty slow to the point that I wasn't comfortable using it. Blender runs fine for the most part, with a few crashes here and there. I figured maybe UE5 is just too much for a laptop, but if it is a problem with Macs or Apple Silicon, then that's frustrating. I hope they fix it, because I'd love to dabble in Unreal some day. Blender will have to do until then.

[@pirojfmifhghek566]

The OS certainly isn't doing the software any favors. The Pre-ARM OS is still "supported" by Apple but... not really. You can tell that they've kinda stopped caring about making good drivers. They've put all of their effort into developing M1 stuff, but that has the issue of being bleeding edge. Most of the software out there isn't well-supported simply because the OS is new. Another problem you've no-doubt experienced is that Intel chips RUN HOT and the MBP is designed to run all the way up into the 90-100C range. Apple cares a lot more about making their computers look sleek than putting decent cooling in them. Plus their fan curves suck butt (this is why I have to install SMC fan control and crank it). So you've got a chip that can boost to 5ghz, but once it hits the limit it has to drop down to like.... 2.3ghz. The longer you use it, the more it thermal throttles, causing unpredictable, stuttery behavior and crashing. With better cooling it could theoretically boost for much longer, or even keep the chip from throttling altogether.

[@clagccs]

Its good to know this... I'm thinking about develop some VR apps...many people told me that m1 was a good option but I think that I'll go for a Asus zephyrus after check the video and read the comments...

[@NUCLEARARMAMENT]

@@clagccs You'll be better off anyway with ASUS. I have a Razer Blade 15 with the 4K OLED screen, i9 8-core with 64 GiB DDR4 RAM, and the RTX Mobile 3080 with 16 GiB GDDR5 VRAM.

[@yuryzhuravlev2312]

The main issue in - Metal, Apple forces a very strange GPU API that has no sense outside the Apple ecosystem. Such API also has some strange behaviors, it's not a full replacement for Vulkan or DX12.

[@johntnguyen1976]

This was exactly the video I was looking for. I'm just starting out learning game dev and virtual vfx production with unreal (I'm a motion designer/vfx artist)...and was about to either build or buy a new computer. This really answers pretty much all the questions I had about which kind of computer to go with for the immediate future! Thanks so much! As for future tests with software...even though I've pretty much decided to go with a Puget Systems PC, would still love to see more vfx and motion graphics pipelines tested out on the new macs (blender, maya, c4d. after effects, nuke, etc).

[@GetSwifty]

Just on the last point about the price comparison. It would only make sense to get the Mac studio or better if you're 100% targeting iOS/macOS (no other platforms at all). Anything other than that, your money is better spent on a PC and using a cloud Mac to compile for Apple platforms. The development process will be far smoother in both Unity and Unreal on a PC. Plus, you'll have access to more games in your down time and save a lot of money. If you have the cash - do both by maxing out a PC, and then going for the cheapest m1 Mac you can find. The top end Macs are just not worth it for development. If you're working with proprietary software like Final Cut Pro, Logic, etc, or your company is making the purchase, that's a different story. I'm speaking as sole Mac user and full time iOS/Mac developer. When I've worked on game projects, it's been painful.

[@johnpekkala6941]

Apple is a closed ecosystem indeed incompatible with almost everything outside of it but working perfect as long u stay in their ecosystem and use their products only together with other Apple producst and software made specific for these. Now the M1 is indeed a quite new chip and so things might need to adapt a while for sure to get more compatible in general but the question then is, will Apple let that happen?

[@ThyTrueNightmare]

These applications would run fine on Mac but Apple refuse to support Vulken... long story

[@TheOfficalAndI]

Thank you for the video. It makes it more clear that M1 isn't ready to be used as a productivity allrounder. I am not sure yet if i am gonna stick with one engine, or which one that would be, so staying in the windows ecosystem makes more sense for me.

[@Andrew-tl9gk]

Thats not true. Unreal is not ready instead. Apple Silicon has been shown to the public 2 years ago and its a SHAME from Epic Games they still dont support it native. For example Blender is freaking crazy how good it runs and also Unity is doing a great job.

[@BaseRadian]

UE5 does work, for the most part, there are still tools within UE5 that will not work but it seems support IS coming slowly. I've watched more support come over the last couple of months. The Lyra project itself is particularly problematic though. Unity works much better, even the versions without native silicon support.

[@davidpurple3698]

Do Epic work on solving the issues for Mac Studio / Apple Silicon ?

[@BaseRadian]

@@davidpurple3698 Most updates do seem to improve stability and add features that were missing on silicon. but I don't think it's a big priority for epic. I wouldn't purchase an Apple machine if your intention is to purely use it for game dev in UE5/4. It doesn't make sense from that standpoint. High fidelity gaming will always be the PC master race and I don't think that will change.

[@Zoophilla]

Which version would you say is less taxing? 4.0 or 5.0?

[@TheKevphil]

So, if the stars align and the software gods smile _just so,_ the Mac probably won't suck too bad-- eventually. Gotcha.

[@vishnushankarsajan1308]

Actually i am using a Mac Mini M1 with 8GB and i use blender and unreal engine works super great...

[@audguy]

Still watching, but the first launch of UE5 is brutal on any system . My I9 9900k 64 gig of ram and 3080ti still took north of 45m to finish starting up.

[@jadz_yt]

My iMac 3.6Ghz Intel i9 with AMD Radeon Pro 5700 XT loaded UE5 in 20-30mins and runs fine with no crashing....

[@skjoldgames]

I'm surprised you have friends with major problems running UE4 on Apple Silicon. I have an M1 Max MacBook that I've been developing our latest game on and I don't have any more crashes than I did on Windows. I think the total number of crashes I've had in the past three months have been maybe 4 or 5. My partner runs the project on his PC with an RTX 2080 and i9 9900K, so obviously he sees higher framerates, but developing with git between the two architectures and operating systems has been pretty smooth for us. Granted, we haven't packaged and deployed anything yet, but we are pretty close to a demo, so we'll see what happens I guess.

[@robrobusa]

Okay, I'll stick with my windows pc thanks.

[@medialcore]

My thumbrule for UE5 development and in general development is : Never use apple and mac. Around 70% of the market use normal PC and Apple is only 15% or so. Which means development towards normal PC has all time priority. So buy a normal PC which is most time double powerful as the mac with the same money spend and you can test it directly for the target market. After that you can make it available for mac pcs too.

[@Weird_Quests]

So general idea at the moment is that Apple Silicon is not ready for game development pretty much?

[@Weird_Quests]

I am mostly doing productivity work (narrative design for games and light game dev), video editing (for clients too) and some gaming (although I don't have much time for it atm) - would you recommend a high-end windows laptop for that or a MacBook? And why (most important as I love hearing what other creators think :D )

[@cbuatal]

the software for game development is not ready for Apple silicon?

[@Luxalpa]

@@Weird_Quests As many others have said, don't use a laptop for rendering, video editing or game dev. Use a desktop PC or a server. There are lots of streaming solutions for the case that you need to be mobile. You can do some very light work on laptops (like for example some coding) but you should expect everything taking at least twice as long while being less enjoyable.

[@Weird_Quests]

@@Luxalpa so if you needed something mobile - what would you currently recommend on that market? I want to build a new desktop at some point for those purposes - just not economical atm due to scalpers.

[@TheAndrejP]

@@cbuatal well, no, while their graphics are much better than Intel's built in graphics it's still not a dedicated nVidia in there.

[@austonlopez4270]

I can get Unreal to run on my 16" MacBook Pro M1 Pro. It is not super smooth but it never crashed. I used the MetaHuman and the Lyra sample projects and it was ok. Like 60-70% performance. Some glitches with hair in MetaHuman, and it was 20-30 FPS in Lyra. When you first load the project it takes 9-12 minutes to load but after that it took 2-5 minutes.

[@MadBunnyRabbit]

Not gonna lie, was a bit surprised how bat UE works on macs, but then I remembered the state of gaming on non windows platforms XD

[@BookmansBlues]

Seeing that Unity's bread and butter has long been iOS apps, it is not shock that it runs well on a Mac. It's kinds their thing. UE has traditionally been about high end AAA games (not saying Unity can't do it, but they have a history of being the go-to mobile dev platform), and historically Apple has not really been friendly to the high end gaming market. Given that the future of high end gaming and content creation will really be about things like Ray Tracing, Path Tracing etc, Apple really isn't setup to really take advantage of this on the high end yet. We'll see what the next mac pros bring to the table, but if it is more M1 Ultra stuff, rather than AMD bringing rattracing support to the forefront, then I do not have high hopes. However, that being said, I do love that Apple is shaking up the market, and doing new and interesting things. It only helps us all when there is serious competition in the market.

[@brezza6892]

There's just not a big enough market for using the studio for any serious game developers, compatibility is improving and Apple silicon is very efficient but it's compatibility is mostly emulation or non-existent, the extremely niche hardware setup you are forced into doesn't help either. Apple's market is also very hard to get into and is very discriminatory. I would love to see Apple change this as M1 has proven to be a very powerful and efficient platform, but they just have no interest in entertaining anything outside of their own internal system where everything Apple is better.

[@CasualViewer-t4f]

I really hope Apple takes notice of what you highlighted here. Apple needs to realize that gaming is a significant pillar in the entertainment industry. I mean they probably do when looking at how much money the App Store makes for them. However, if they could apply more resources and focus in gaming it could launch their Mac sales to considerable heights. Like others have pointed out if gaming could efficiently scale from phone to tablet to Mac, Apple could have a massive gaming platform over night.

[@androidfarmer8863]

Simply: if you need or want to run Unreal Engine or VR, or many of the apps that take advantage of Nvidia cards, get a pc. I have both Mac and PC, including a 16” M1 laptop. I do all my Adobe stuff on Mac; for 3D, it’s pc.

[@ChiltonWebb]

Ue5 still has Mac bugs from 5 years ago. They’re design flaws, not new bugs. And Epic is well aware of them. It’s just not a priority for them.

[@thealexanderflorea]

April 2023 (from my experience) - Mac Studio just isn't made for Unreal Engine... as a filmmaker trying to build virtual sets/enviroments, having a program that crashes 15-20x a day isn't FUN. 8/10 projects I had to give up because I couldn't get them finished. It s still an amazing machine for editing videos. It outperforms every windows machine in the price range.

[@kloakovalimonada]

Very well done. Actual real world usage. Subbed!

[@gladiussrinath2855]

Yo man I’m using m3 max MacBook Pro unreal engine for film making . . Initially it has 120 fps after a week it’s performing like 20 to 40 fps in an empty scene. . . Dou have any solution for it ?

[@gajananddave3385]

Why we need build game on Mac just we can make xcode project on Mac and we are done. When I going on intern as in game development studio they keep Mac for only for iOS project and Mac environment.definaty new Mac's are Optimised but software support will take time.

[@myaccount__7269]

You should apply at “midnight society” game studio. They could use your unreal experience!!

[@mattieisonline143]

Please share your experience with Maya.

[@captainofthewhitetower]

I am new to Unity. I use Macos MBP m1 16 ram. Idk why but something is killing my fps in editor and in game. How can I fix itv

[@GardensoftheAncientsHerbal]

Funny how Mac’s are still good for creating assets whilst PC is best for running them

[@JasonTCampbell]

This is weird, I’m running UE5 on my M1 mini and I haven’t crashed once. I’ve just been going through the Unreal Sensei coursework so I’m likely not taxing it nearly as much as you were and I know not to expect much success with the GPU rates on my mini, was actually considering an upgrade to the Studio now that they’re out, but I’m surprised I haven’t seen more trouble than I have now.

[@TheNuclearGeek]

Why do you have an external SSD? It's like you can't upgrade the internal storage on your own for a reasonable amount of money or something.

[@ElevatedSystems]

I have 32TB of storage in my Workstation. I still edit from the external SSD's I film on. They're fast enough and no need to wate time with footage ingestion.

[@vaporjoes]

The moment you put mac and gaming in the same sentence its ALWAYS a fail. ;)

[@StormagedonBOD]

UE5 loading the project for 90 minutes is a problem on Windows too. My 1500x loads UE4 HD projects in 5-6 minutes while it takes 20ish minutes to load UE5 but with 0 crashes.

[@r4dius]

Who develops games on mac ? It's like developing windows stuff on linux

[@thomaspipermusic]

Could you show cinema 4d and octane x. Thanks love the video. Hey also does UE5 lumen work on Mac m1 I can't seem to find out a definitive answer any where

[@frede1k]

In my research i found that Mac Studio gets destroyed in any 3d pipeline compared to a Pc with a dedicated graphic card..

[@jazzifized]

Any updates on UE5 performance on Apple Silicon since the video created 10 months ago?

[@Joachim.Jacobs]

Are you happy now that Unreal Engine 5.2 now supports Apple Silicon natively????

[@AlfredBaudischCreations]

Yeah for US$ 1999 you can get a PC with 64GB Ram, 4TB SSD NVMe.2, RTX 3080 Ti, Ryzen 8 5900X, that will be light years ahead of the Mac Studio, while performing all of the intended tasks much better, and much much much faster. HUGE CON: energy consumption goes through the roof. M1 barely consumes energy. So there's this tradeoff. I wanted a Macstudio for the size and energy, but it's not for me.

[@yoRRnl]

Keep in mind.. This little powerfull box only sips 110 watt from the wall max. ;)

[@ElevatedSystems]

Keep in mind a Watt is a measure of energy used per second so therfore is completely useless without a measure of time. In reality the Mac used consumed more power (kWh) than the workstation because of the huge measure of time it took to complete the same task.

[@yoRRnl]

@@ElevatedSystems eh..The M1 CPU' base model use 30 watt top. Nothing more and only when u step on his feet. These Studio's are top 110 watt when it needs to work hard. The Ultra with 64gb and a shitload of horsepower takes 215watt max. A heavy workstation will grab 500+ wat easy when it needs to work. Those heavy intels and nvidia's are watt monsters. U can check it yourself since you have a Studio yourself. Not that u need to. There are many video's and blogs about it.

[@ElevatedSystems]

@@yoRRnl Again Watts is meaningless without time. The Mac took 14.5 hours to render the animation at 110 Watts which equals 1.595 KWh. The workstation did it in 2.5 hours at 600 Watts equaling 1.5 kWh. The Mac used more power to do the same task as the big workstation. E(kWh) = P(W) × t(hr) / 1000 is how you calculate energy use. Watts is only one of the variables.

[@yoRRnl]

@@ElevatedSystems Good point. In that case, the worstation wins.

[@fearmear]

Just get a cheap mac for iOS builds and stick to PC for general development.

[@jakejoyride]

seems mac is horrible for unreal engine

[@remilang9683]

heh apl stu what? cmon... i kno u have to try it but do u get at last refund from sopl?

[@beoxsgaming9388]

Your UE5 performance is interesting. In this video, kzbin.info/www/bejne/bJqUkqx-Z6uaaqM (around 2:42) he double clicks on a sample project and it loads within a couple of seconds. He does do cuts occasionally, but I watched it closely several times and didn't notice any cuts during the loading process. Granted he is using Early Access 2 and Preview and not the released version, but release should be more stable and optimized. I have to take both videos with a grain of salt on this. You're getting crashes whereas he's getting 140-ish frames with Ray Tracing turned off and around 60 frames with RT turned on. There could be any number of reasons for this, such as maybe he's downloading some optimization packages through Homebrew? As for x86 performance on M1: I'm not sure what's going on there. My wife is an accountant and she's still running x86 software on her regular ole' M1 and she's never had an issue. She's running fairly "sophisticated" software (i.e., much higher-end than Turbo Tax and Quicken / Quickbooks). I actually get the best performance of UE5 on the Linux (Ubuntu 21.10) side of my dual-boot system, using Lutris (Wine) - 120 frames on both Viewport and Gameplay vs. Windows' 70s frames Viewport and 90s frames during Gameplay. You got C# code to compile on Xcode!..... How?! You flew past that point so maybe I missed something. That being said, It's really nice to see someone actually using Unity on the Mac Studio, as opposed to "here's Unity loading on the this Mac...." Thank you for that.

[@ElevatedSystems]

That simple hallway asset he's using is almost a decade old. It was built on the launch release of UE4 I think. There is no backend, menus, AI, rigged characters, physics. It's just a scene, not a full game project. It also has none of the new UE5 features like Lumen.You can definetly run individual or groups of assets in UE5 on the Mac, it's when you scale up to full game development that problems develop.

[@beoxsgaming9388]

@@ElevatedSystems Ah, that makes sense. I didn't use UE4 at launch (I came in around 4.17-4.19), so I missed that asset pack. If I remember correctly, both Lumen and Nanite are unusable on Mac because of Apple deprecating OpenGL and forcing the use of the Metal framework. Metal... OpenGL... Apple being Apple. 🤷‍♂

[@theweirdsquid]

I would love to see this video again once Unreal supports M1!

[@ariffurqon3490]

probably never gonna happen

[@AaronAsherRandall]

Hey guys, I am thinking about getting the max upgraded Mac Studio. I am a professional game and app developer, specifically I use Unity 2D and 3D. Most of my Unity 3D projects are low poly. I spend more time on the backend and networking side of game dev. I also want something that is great for music production. Would you recommend this machine?

[@wikbooth5156]

I dont understand why unreal doesn't release an apple compatible version....

[@johnw3194]

CPU tasks do great on the Mac, graphics though? terrible

[@thomasdoll7446]

What are your thoughts on 3d asset creation itself - ie how does it handle high poly assets while creating said assets as well as rendering? I should note this isnt just for these tools but for Blender, Cinema4d, etc etc.

[@MiguePizar]

I prefer mac than windows, but because of the limitations of software with the macs, I will have to sell my macbook pro and get a windows pc, if at least M-Mac could have egpu support, that would be fine by me having a egpu, but not. anyway, thanks for the video, now I now for sure that I will have to buy a pc for my purpose on UE5 and filmmaking.

[@madedigital]

it runs now on my mac mini m1 with xcode installed, i have the base unit 8gb but i would not depend on it I use Twinmotion and too much stuff and it will crash. So i use my ZBox PC with a 2070 and ssd and NVE and 32gb it runs smooth on epic

[@lazyman2451]

It better not be 8gb ram or that thing ain’t lasting you 10 months 😂

[@tonybarnes2920]

Unity started on the Mac. As a matter of fact, it was Mac-only, when I started using it back in 2006. Unreal has always been a pig. I've shipped Star Trek DS9 and Medal of Honor on it and it's pretty and has a lot of pretty-pretty as its default state, but it's just a resource hog.

[@tylerdean3489]

Nice presentation. I have a 12400 and 3050 build as well and I must say that I love it. Got the 3050 from EVGA so I paid more than msrp but got it from them instead. Its a cheaper computer that performs soo well. I can play forza horizon 5 at high settings, 1440p at 90-100 fps. Kind of sad that the Mac Studio can't match that performance considering the price difference. You really do pay a premium for MacOS and support from Apple.

[@hunterjay8331]

The problem is UE5, not the Mac studio. The Mac studio is emulating the program in real time, and it seems UE is one of very few programs that don’t seem to work properly under Rosetta 2. The is something Epic could fix, and it seems like they’re working on that.

[@scrumartist]

software support is still bad till this day since m1 release (nov 2022), even with rosetta 2 emulation, honestly building with anything with il2cpp backend on Unity is a headache on m1 don't get me started on unreal when building with native code/non blueprint projects (total shitshow).. I had to always fallback to my old intel based macs for building just to avoid the headaches. I hope they sort it out cause the m1 GPU benchmarks means crap if its not utilized or supported by the tool that game devs use.. meanwhile jumping back to my windows laptop is just a breeze for game dev work, or anything that needs proper GPU tasks.

[@eh_channel3]

All you need to do to work with UE5 is just upgrade to normal PC with normal GPU. As a 3D c++ developer (not just UE5) I won't develop 3D program on mac. too much headache to make it work right.. Apple doesn't use any standard 3D library like Vulkan or DirectX, so right now you can only develop on mac with MoltenVK or Metal. I don't know how Metal or MoltenVK works compare to regular Vulkan or DirectX (I don't have mac and won't buy one), maybe Metal/MoltenVK doesn't have all the features its need to work right.. same is with OpenGL, as a programmer I love OpenGL but UE4 and 5 doesn't work so well with it (OpenGL doesn't have all the features needed). All mac users need to complain to Apple for not supporting Vulkan or other standard library.. BTW I think ue5 editor not ready for production. some tasks take ages even for strong PC. One of the area I want to see improvement is virtual shadow map, this feature drop the FPS so much.. sometimes I prefer to switch back to old shadow map.

[@morkaili]

Just design agencies who still believe the old myth that Adobe tools run better on Mac than Windows or are Apple fanboys, still use Macs. In every other Studio, especially when it comes to sound, video and 3D, they use PCs. There are 3 main reasons for that: 1. They simply do not cost more than your company is worth (exagerrated) and can easily upgraded. 2. Barely any tools are released for Mac and if they run (very) poorly, not to speak of addons, plugins, custom build tools etc. 3. A PC is simply way more performant in nearly every scenario that matters and therefore it logically has a insanely better price/performance rating. 4. Windows (or in rare cases Linux) are fairly open and highly customizable operation systems. Mac OS on the other hand is the absolute opposite. A no-go for any bigger studio. 5. Mac OS updates are mandatory and cost a fortune, Windows updates are partly mandatory (if connected with the internet) and cost nothing! 6. Mac OS collects all kinds of data, telemetry, etc. in a insanely larger scale than Windows and you can't turn it off at all. Until changes, we simply wont see Macs actually used in Studios, but some Design Agencies.

[@jayforcinema]

Hi, I would love a follow up video on the experience, since Unreal has had a couple of firmware updates in the past year and apparently has some level of native Mac support! Do you think the Apple M3 Max Mac Studio would be the turning point for game development on Apple?

[@diconicabastion5790]

Lets see the price of it vs my PC. The gain in profit making a game compatible with mac doesn't justify that cost. Sure here in the US a lot of people us iphone. But given we are now in a global market more people use android outside the US. 13% isn't worth the extra work or the over inflated cost of a mac anything. I'd support linux before supporting mac when it comes to desktops its less work and I don't have to by a over price desktop just to make use of the compilers.

[@zzz565]

Great video. I create games from ground up and also do animation work so it was interesting to see how you got on with the studio. I have the max with 32 cores. Unity is flawless and fast - even on M1 MBA, so on any studio performance is great. Build times will differ, first build will always be longer than the second as it will cache a lot of stuff. Unity was originally Mac only so has alway been great for Mac. UI is 100% Mac unlike UE5 which does its own thing. Unreal though is very clunky compared to Unity. Everything is cached and rendered as you work with it, it's a chore compared to Unity. Being rosseta emulation and with all the background share compiles going on it's not no where near Unity performance. Initial startup took a while but no where near 90 minute but I guess that depends on what your system is doing at the same time. The demo game crashed for me too. I agree that Unreal is best let alone till it's Apple Silicon and working better. It's new and buggy. At the end of the day for anybody wanting to use a free game development system on Mac - it's Unity all the way. There's a lot of hype on UE 5 atm and rightly so, it's amazing, but even the smallest M1 Mac will handle Unity really well and Unity is a lot more flexible and works on more platforms. Go for Unity - for now

[@alejmc]

Mac user here, working with Unity every single day. It’s both my daily job but my daily hobby joy. Agreed on this, everybody else on my team is on Windows and if they like take too hard of a breath or happen to stare at Unity too long it will put a pop-up windows progress bar. Everything, moving a file, switching windows, etc feels clunky at times. Not gonna lie though, there are some Unity versions that get released sometimes that it’s crazy how bad they are, it’s like they don’t test it properly, EditorLoop’s eating away at CPU cycles doing nothing, input not really detected until a mouse pixel move triggers a UI refresh event, etc etc. And the usual, the bigger and farther the project gets it accumulates that critical mass where changing a single string of a C# file makes it recompile for several seconds. That said, of all the options I wouldn’t have it any other way. And to those saying that “windows because doings Indie Games and UE5”, those endeavors will never be finished, what could UE5 could possibly offer for ease use, programming and tooling that would actually benefit Indie style game development… I go the opposite, if I try doing an Unity-dev’ed game I strip as much of the ‘realistic’ stuff possible and keep it to the bare simplest minimum, C# is a breeze (I wish I could even try things like Python for on the fly development), etc

[@TheAndrejP]

@@alejmc well, according to Tim Sweeney, 40% of the AAA titles currently in development are being developed on Unity. And what does Unreal offer to indies? A developed and battle-tested engine that isn't stuck half way between MonoBehaviours and ECS.

[@guoqiangwen1550]

你好，想问问Mac studio对呀UE5有什么不支持的吗

[@nursultannazarov8379]

1. Unity’s UI looks soo cheap and ugly 2. Stuck between Monobehaviours and ECS 3. Nightmare to make multiplayer game 3. Uses C#. 10 times slower then C++. Unreal uses C++ 😎 4. Company itself couldn’t make a single game. (Remember the only one they cancelled😂😂😂) 5. Unity CEO called game devs idiots. So Unity game devs idiots?😂😂😂 6. Unity merged with Malware company 7. Unity has stereotype that only bad games are made with Unity. Unreal has cool games stereotype🎉🎉🎉 8. Unreal developers made Fortnite, Gears of War the most popular games in the world. Moral of the story: Unity is shit, so does it’s CEO and top management

[@rayamc8663]

@@nursultannazarov8379 Unreal is not good on Mac studio as it is not Apple silicon - if you prefer Unreal over Unity great, but the video is about Unreal on Apple silicon and it is clonky and slow compared to Unity which works great on Apple hardware because it has been optimised for it. UI looks are down to preference. Personally, I don't like Unreal's as it is non-standard which makes it hard to learn and also makes it harder to port to new hardware as it is all custom..

[@Yuri-art90]

What is the recommended hardware configuration in PC for Game Development? Particularly using Unreal Engine 3.27.2 or Unreal 5. and blender and After effects. Pls advise.

[@samuelpengelly1641]

hey, are you apple todo another review of game dev on the mac studio as in November unreal announced that they had been doing work for ue 5.1 on apple silicon hardware, and was wondering what if that would work any Beter to help me decide on what next computer to get to better work on game development, rendering, music production, video editing just all round stuff but the stuff that takes a high amount of performance and power, but also to be somewhat portable

[@caresvlbdjz]

I tried UE 5 in may MacBook M1 pro and it works and didn’t crash and I could play different examples, anyway I feel it’s not optimise as unity , and the moment I’ll keep using unity.

[@zoltanerdei1317]

i would love to see Cinema4D with Redshift or Octane, or simulations in Houdini.

[@frede1k]

With a dedicated graphics card.. bye bye mac

[@johola]

What do you expect? Nvida OptiX wipes the floor with Metal. Mac is still barely viable in GPU-rendering workflows with Redshift etc.

[@zoltanerdei1317]

@@johola Apple advertised Redshift an Houdini in their commercial. I am sure Nvidia is light years ahead when it comes to GPU-Rendering but Apple is slowly catching up.

[@AntonSavoderov]

game ready pipeline, pls. Hp sculpting Zbrush, Blender modelling and eevee/cycles renders, Substance painter 2K-4K texturing, than Marmoset presentation. That's will be cool to see

[@solonyetski]

How did you become a freelance asset creator and how long did it take you, if I may ask.

[@ElevatedSystems]

Honestly I lucked into it. I had a friend who worked for a Game Development studio and they needed help meeting a deadline. From there I got random jobs.

[@solonyetski]

@@ElevatedSystems awesome, good for you!

[@DanielNistrean]

You can buy a better PC at the same price as Mac Studio. If you work in gaming, use Windows.

[@eckee]

It's a shame tho. I'm still excited about gaming on Apple's chip. It's so efficient yet powerful and it could provide seamless integration between desktop and mobile gaming.

[@hpbecraft]

don't use a mac for game dev, so dumb.

[@pirateskeleton7828]

This is exactly the info I needed. I know I’ll have to bite the bullet and get a Mac to develop for iOS, so I’m glad this is a decent option for Unity

[@Kaboomnz]

Why would you bother developing for iOS?

[@pirateskeleton7828]

@@Kaboomnz it’s a huge market.

[@Kaboomnz]

@@pirateskeleton7828 nope it has 27.22% market share.

[@crashdude7589]

​@Kaboomnz ios users actually pay for apps, check the revenue for the 27% compared to android

[@pirateskeleton7828]

@@crashdude7589 I’d like to develop for both android and iOS, but I hear you. It sucks

[@TheJoseUrena]

DDR4 en the PC? Dude you need a new build

[@phreakii]

UE5 native for Mac 2024

In short: "we try to run something not compatible on a Mac, and it's not compatible." Overall Epic aim at the Xbox serie X/s and the ps5 for unreal 5, so the results you got on an ARM CPU is completely expected. I actually find more concerning than Unity that is supposed to be compatible has so much not compatible stuffs on the Mac :(

[@50shadesofskittles9]

Yep

[@TheAndrejP]

UE5 has been out for like a week now, 5.0.1 has just been released today, so there's bound to be bugs. As for the aim - yes, you can develop for XBox, PS5 with Unreal, but those aren't development platforms and not where you'd run the Unreal editor.

@@TheAndrejP don't shoot the messenger, the platforms they aim is clearly stated in their documentation.

@@TheAndrejP part of the documentation: Lumen's Global Illumination and Reflections primary shipping target is to support large, open worlds running at 60 frames per second (FPS) on next-generation consoles. The engine's High scalability level contains settings for Lumen targeting 60 FPS. Lumen's secondary focus is on clean indoor lighting at 30 FPS on next-generation consoles. The engine's Epic scalability level produces around 8 milliseconds (ms) on next-generation consoles for global illumination and reflections at 1080p internal resolution, relying on Temporal Super Resolution to output at quality approaching native 4K.

[@igormarcos687]

I am so glad I have abandoned Apple, the 3070 laptop was cheaper than the macs and beats the shit out of those macs

[@ALXXR63AMG]

High glossy visual fluid design renderings of new Cars…can you game them in unity ?

[@overmtts]

All you had to do was follow the damn train CJ and instead youre making informative videos online thats ice cold

[@charlesalexanderable]

3:20 You have to finish compiling shaders before comparing performance and graphical glitches.

[@ElevatedSystems]

How long should I wait? Because like I said they never loaded. After an hour and a half it was just stuck at 24 textures still to load. The point was shaders wouldn't compile.

[@benjaminemde1259]

Normally one would probably say: "Why even bother comparing a tiny integrated SoC with a beefy desktop processor and a dedicated GPU?" And you would be right. I am really surprised how well everything runs on the new m1 Macs and that it is almost fair, comparing a ginormous beast of a gaming PC with a Mac mini on steroids. Great video! Btw. I am really surprised by the quality of your videos! Your videos are made really awesomely and one could almost think you have like a million subscribers!

[@Wertyhappy27]

I mean, if you were to remove most pc part from a "ginormous" beast, you would see they are quite small, just needs some passive cooling, and all is good

[@szymonronowicz9019]

Yeah but no one really gets into Mac because of size of the system;) in case of game dev and 3d it’s just waaaay less efficient than a PC. Simply because the latter has really GPU :p no matter how much I love apple ecosystem the ugly PC (like gaming laptop) is the way to go if one wishes to get into UE5

[@cloudzusvi]

Great presentation quality 👌🏽👍🏾👏🏽

[@penisdubs]

i really wish apple would just make a single computer with raw gpu compute performance comparable to a pc, they've really nailed the cpu with the m1 chips but the gpus leave so much to be desired and its sad too because i really enjoy using macos over windows

[@spacegoat_3d801]

If they do it’ll most likely be really expensive.

[@sultankosmitov6293]

It's a great and informative video, but I don't think anyone takes developing games on a Mac seriously... For testing your assets, yeah, it's enough if it runs, at least. But that would be it.

[@vectorhacker-r2]

Epic doesn't like Apple, so...

[@LucasDev]

Hi! have you tried unreal again now with v5.3?

[@Helios.vfx.]

I'd love to see houduni software tested too. There's a apprentice license you could use. It's free

[@kickinit333]

What can get lost is that having a PC for dev and production is "safer" than having a Mac for compatibility and performance reasons. I use both but for different purposes, as noted. My Intel mac crashes UE5 all the time, it's unusable. Do I want to buy a new expensive Mac just to be able to run UE5? Nope.

[@v.0]

The reason Unity runs so much better on Apple products is possibly due to Mono... But then again, as mentioned, the Epic VS Apple lawsuits might have played a role in all the issues with UE5

[@scoty_does]

UE5 not working on mac, hmmm maybe this has something to do with the parent company epic not liking Apple anymore?

[@fayyazb]

Thank you for sharing! Would love to see C4D workflow on this!

[@AtomLabX]

The thing with unreal engine, since it is not optimized it is hit or miss. Example: on my m1 MacBook Air (it doesn't work at all) I have to install it on an external hard drive for it to work. On my 16" m1 max MacBook Pro (works like a dream, no issues, internal hard drive). On my Mac Studio m1 max (works, but I have crushes from time to time). However, none of the projects I loaded, or opened, took 90 mins to open, or compile shaders, as a matter of fact, it is really fast. I think there is something missing (I'm half way through the video, so maybe you found a fix), but again all those issues because it is not optimized for the m1 just yet. But 90 mins, I'm sure something is wrong. By the way, all the results are on my channel, if you want to take a look at them as well.

[@AlekMadeDis]

Thanks for vid, finally some honest and practical opinion and not from apple fanboi perspective . On paper everything looks awesome with this mac studio, but in reality not so much.

[@esnskndmsm3509]

really enjoyed watching you learn a game engine? you showed nothing new or interesting

[@iohellemans3280]

Maybe you should try to build UE5 from the source code. Maybe then it will run nativly with the m1.

[@50shadesofskittles9]

Issue is apple not epic.

[@dievas_]

Dont gamedev on macs...

[@puertadlm163]

hey any update on the thread ripper enermax cooler. i have the 2950x and have a custom loop but am getting tired of keeping the loop. would like an aio/ but if theres any issues ill go with an air cooler