Games As Art (and thoughts on the Fallout TV Show)

[@SadderCatLin]

I hope Tim is like some random bartender in a fallout episode as a cameo

[@GRNKRBY]

They didn't even consult him. 😢 But yeah, that would have been great.

[@ojthesimpson35]

2nd-ed

[@ZiddersRooFurry]

I'm sorry about your friends. Thanks for creating a game series that has been helping me get through losing one of mine.

[@TKsMantis]

Whoever did the props for the show certainly seems to care about making it as close to the newer games as possible. I would love to listen to Leonard chat about it, we likely share some similar views on it by how you are speaking about his reaction haha

[@JoshuaKevinPerry]

Writers make the show. And for the most part writers have destroyed IPs. I hope it's good.

[@jacksonm4792]

@@JoshuaKevinPerry So far they're saying it's not going to be tied to any of the games stories, its apparently going to be set in the West based on an NCR flag shown in a leak, and with the showrunner I'd say the outcome of this show is looking fairly positive for a change

[@AmbrosiusIII]

@@JoshuaKevinPerry tell me you don't know anything about anything without telling me you don't know anything about anything

[@jess648]

@@jacksonm4792recent tweet from the prime video account says it’s set in Los Angeles. first piece of Fallout media set in California in nearly two decades

[@AshKhenir]

I feel the same. Though it's possible that as I've aged, I've become less flexible to uprooting my notion of how things are so ... retcons bother me more than they likely would have in the past. I see, for example, the constant addition of power armor models in different time periods, the same as going to bed owning a Honda and then waking up to get into a Ford to commute. The concept is the same, a combustion vehicle to get places, but I don't understand where the Ford came from, but I gotta get to work anyway (immerse in the gameworld).

[@TheFrogEnjoyer]

My new favourite channel on KZbin

[@Ablimify]

It can be painful to talk about those who we have lost that we held so dear. Thank you for pushing through and sharing about your friend who has passed.

[@UrlagEntertainments]

I'm looking forward to see the TV Show, but it has big potential to fail hard. But at least they made the effort to make costumes, Props and sets look good.

[@randomnerd3402]

About the cast, and as a huge Twin Peaks fan, I was giddy to see that Kyle McLachlan will be in the show. I could definitely see him being in an antagonist in the show, somehow Kyle is equally good as an antagonist and protagonist (as he did both in Twin Peaks) so he'll definitely be a valuable addition to the show.

[@kaptenteo]

I had totally missed there was a Fallout TV show underway.

[@BilboBaggyPantz]

Thanks for sharing Tim, I know this audience all agrees bc we've all been moved by games in our life. Thanks for creating some of the ones that have moved me 💜

[@cloudtx]

RIP to your friends Mr. Cain. I know it's too much to ask for the people making the TV show to stick to a story that's close to the games so all I'm gonna hope for is that whatever they make ends up being a good, solid story set within the rich Fallout world.

[@chapman3713]

"There never was much hope. Just a fool's hope."

[@GioGioPietromica425]

I think the first time I ever realized that games are art was when I was playing Red Dead Redemption on the PS3, I was crossing over from New Austin into Mexico, and Far Away by Josè Gonzalez came on. I had to stop in my tracks and just let the emotion watch over me. One of the most amazing feelings I’ve ever had in my entire life

[@lrinfi]

Exceptional series. I've no idea if it was intentional or a happy accident, but all the elements of RDR2 came together in a beautiful way. I never finished playing it myself due to the fact that the main quest system is on rails, but watched the rest in a Let's Play. The fact that it's set in the liminal time between two worlds and eras was a stroke of genius. (We just so happen to be living through such a liminal time ourselves.) "May [we] stand unshaken amidst the crash of worlds." -- kzbin.info/www/bejne/gmGkqp5-Z5WLabM :)

[@JoshuaKevinPerry]

Walter Goggins is an amazing actor. I love him in Justified, Django, and The Shield.

[@TihetrisWeathersby]

I appreciate these talks Tim, These are so refreshing

[@rodrigoaraujopereira4724]

I know, right? It's like you are right there with him, sitting on the other side of the desk, just chatting. Great content all around.

[@VolumeCheese]

Everywhere i go i see your face...

[@NubileReptile]

1:10 I can't remember the last time I did a 'bad' karma playthrough of Fallout or Fallout 2. And it's because it mostly just makes you feel gross. That might actually make an interesting topic to discuss. The difficulty of making a compelling 'evil' path in a game, one that's more interesting than just being a deranged psychopath who wanders around ruining everyone's life for no good reason. Supposedly, despite all the effort Bioware put into making a Paragon and a Renegade path (in practice, 'idealist hero' vs. 'ruthless jerk') for the Mass Effect series, some absolutely infinitesimal portion of their players ever did a Renegade playthrough. 8% of players is the percentage I heard. That's an _enormous_ amount of content that almost no one saw. They expended a whole lot of effort making material for someone who wanted to play as a 'bad guy' (or at least a ruthless guy), and just about no one did. And my guess is it's because (and I speak from experience as someone who did the playthrough) playing Renegade makes you feel bad, and the game goes out of its way to make it clear you're being a petty, cruel jerk for no good reason. There are some saving grace moments where being a Renegade makes you feel like an '80s action hero, but they're outweighed by being anything from a bully to a genocidal maniac.

[@lrinfi]

New Vegas did this so very well. There is no "good" or perfect path laid out in the game. After the destruction of the old world, the survivors didn't deign to try anything new. Obviously, Caesar's Legion was based on the Roman Empire and the NCR on the Greek ideal of democracy as actually practiced in the old world. Both the Roman and Greek were considered "successful" civilizations by history's standards. Both had their merits and pitfalls. Mr. House was a corporate power player. In other words, "the game was rigged from the start.." :) Even with Caesar, the writers tried to provide reasons for him to be doing what he was doing whether or not we thought what he was doing was "good" or "evil". Mr. House represented the 'Brave New World' kind of mentality in which man becomes servant to his technologies and not the other way around. None of the factions could admit to themselves that there was something fundamentally wrong with the way they were going about things and the player is essentially left to choose from among the lessor of four "evils." I'd love to see a follow-up in which the survivors do try something entirely new, but don't expect that will ever happen.

[@zurcus7224]

Renegade suffered a lot from writing inconsistency and blatant paragon favouring. Inconsistency - one scene renegade will be a total badass, that does something cool. Another you're a mean jerk for no reason. Another you're a straight up monster. Another you're a ruthless, but somewhat understandable "ends justify the means" kind of person. While paragon is pretty much the same for 90% of the time, idealistic, heroic, nice, etc. etc. It feels like paragon they had clear mind and vision from the start, while renegade they kept changing over and over again As for favoring, 9/10 times paragon is the objectively correct option. Objectively, cause you'll both act nice and good, AND gain the most practical benefit from it. There is very few moments where the ruthlessness pays off more, which is a huge missed opportunity. But unsurprisingly, if you have character that keeps shooting people indiscriminately at slightest offenses instead, you lose out from that more than you gain

[@slynt_]

Video games need to abandon the childish good/evil dichotomy already. That's not how the world works. Focus should be more opn how much you are willing to trade off "moral" choices for other benefits.

[@sergrojGrayFace]

People assigning their own meaning and artists sometimes saying "it means whatever you think it means" is a thing with paintings and songs too.

[@lonneansekishoku8288]

1:10 I do that too. In the 3d fallouts, I would also reload if I got hit once (no mods on console back in the days.), never use a stim or chems, complete the game 100%. Thanks for creating one of my favorite game franchises.

[@martinpavelka3546]

Oh Tim, you described Stephen in a nutshell. He ‘d have loved this!

[@vagabundorkchaosmagick-use2898]

That closing words for your friend made me shed a tear, to the point I decides I won't say anything about the "games are art" topic. Respect!

[@AlphaGator9]

Well said. I have been really enjoying all of your insight to Fallout and its history. Especially from one of the original creators. Thank you for bringing this to all of us. I was first introduced to Fallout 1, a while after it was released, when i was on active duty. I was hooked immediately, and have been a fan ever since.

[@sandwich2473]

This was a really nice episode, thank you for sharing it

[@Pyromancer_]

Despite how the Show will turn out, it will never change the feeling I get from the originals and that will stay immortal in my mind.

[@ChA0s_AgeNt]

You'll be strong.

[@jonahulichny9874]

Why do you think it will be bad?

[@ExVersion83]

I think Tim's channel is very welcome in this day and age specially, it gives me hope that his videos inspire the new devs to make good and meaningful games.

[@ApologyforPepology]

It seems like there are competent people involved and money be spend on the show. Part of the core team behind the Fallout TV show comes over from Westworld. Jonathan Nolan (younger brother of Christopher) is writing, directing and producing. Jonathan mentioned on the 25th anniversary video that his first Fallout was Fallout 3, so I have a feeling the themes and designs will follow more the Bethesda ones.

[@jadendesilva7203]

I’ve just found your channel…can not express what the fallout games and just the world just built means to me

[@drzero8222]

That is precisely the point of games - to be interactive. It is what makes it different from other forms of entertainment that involve storytelling.

[@LonelyKnightess]

"Courier, stop! That Psycho is for the Raider Orphanage!" "[Day Tripper] I'LL BE A LIVING GOD"

[@spudd86]

I always like hearing the intended meanings of art, all kinds of art, games, books, movies, TV shows. Even if it's very different from what I took from a piece. I especially like hearing about how elements were intended to combine to create meanings.

[@cykeok3525]

Tim, I don't know where else to put this question/request where you'll see it, but I just watched the Fallout series and I'm dying to know your opinion of it. I'm also willing to bet I'm not the only one :p I'm a die-hard canon purist to ridiculous levels, with the first game as sacrosanct, and easily accepting most aspects of Fallout 2 and FO:NV in my head-canon, while disregarding most of Bethesda's additions. As one would imagine, then, I was actually shocked to discover that I found the events introduced in the TV show to be... all right! Was hoping you can do a video on this as soon as you've watched it, would really like to hear your thoughts. Edit: I do understand that contemporary reaction isn't the purpose of your channel, and after thinking about it, I also realize that your words on the matter would hold a lot of weight and probably need to be carefully considered, so maybe you can take your time on this one actually :D Still looking forward to it, regardless. Much love from the opposite side of the planet!

[@marcovirtual]

I just watched the first two episodes and I'm also really looking forward to seeing Tim 's comments about the show. Also, Did you guys notice a subtle homage to the original ambient music of the first game in the first episode?

[@TrickyCletus]

Thanks for sharing your insights, Tim. I appreciate the way you evoke ideas just from talking about your experiences from your past and your daily observations. It a pleasure to watch 'Tim's Storytime' almost daily. Hope you don't get tired of making these.

[@mateuszt6498]

This was a point I made while studying journalism and games. Games to me are the ultimate art form, they combine every other type of art medium into one piece which is experienced in a different way by each individual. There’s everything in there - a story, music, visuals and modeling combined into one beautiful crafted experience from the developer’s mind. I think games in a way are the peak of human creativity, adding to that the fact that we’re playing them on wonders of technology no matter which platform we choose. Games ARE art.

[@bluemooninthedaylight8073]

I think games as art is a bit gray in that it all depends on the game itself. Not all games are deep pieces of art, being more akin to a billboard ad or other pieces of corporate made products. They are cynical, without much purpose outside of being a piece of entertainment, or in the worst case scenarios, gambling devices or war propaganda. However, when Devs are allowed to make a game with little to no restraints, we do see some meaning, some drive to create genuine art. The original three Silent Hill games are what they are, mainly because Konami at the time didn't care about that "B project" all that much. So, the creator, and then later Team Silent were able to draw on higher brow elements to make some of the very best horror games ever made. But when Silent Hill went through the milking phase, it was passed from one team to another with little care other than to make more money. Shadow of the Colossus opened my eyes to visual art in video games, as much as Silent Hill did for the horror genre. And then I saw the indie explosion, and all of these unique, fever dreams come to life. As times passes on, we will still have games as mere product, but more and more, we're also seeing games expand, and in some cases, rival film, television, paintings, and even novels.

[@plaidchuck]

That seems to happen a lot with the japanese game industry. A project was basically left for dead and a designer was able to create something unique because of less expectations or oversight. That’s what happened with the original final fantasy and recently with Demons Souls

[@bluemooninthedaylight8073]

@@plaidchuck Yeah, funny how that happens, and depending on the company's attention when they become a success, how well or mediocre later additions become. I'd say the Souls games for the most part have been solid, but have had their share of stagnation due to essentially making the same game again and again. Not saying that the later Souls games do not have merit or anything new to offer, just that they follow the same structure and themes. The new Armored Core seems very interesting in that they are blending earlier and newer aspects of their game design.

[@gamedev_zombie]

Walton Goggins is supposed to play a ghoul in the show. I wish they did the story from Fallout 1 with some of Master's backstory, with Goggins playing Harold.

[@JoeFF85]

Tim, thank you so much for bringing an idea and game that brings so many of us so much joy to life. My own relationship with Fallout is also intrinsicly tied to emotion. When I was in high-school a friend of mine who is no longer with us GA me his copy of Fallout 2. I lived it and spent two years tracking down the copy of Fallout 1 (at the time I could only find double jewel case sets of 1 and 2 together in stores) and was blown away when I finally got to full copy at a flea market and had the wire bound manual. Ive been a fan of this franchise you fathered for more than half of my life, now. Ive been running my own tabletop campaign set in the world of Fallout for the past two years and I thank you for creating this world with your friends.

[@souluss]

There is a beautiful conversation about "serious games"/games as art hosted by Polish game personality Rysław. He and his guest brought 10 examples to showcase different qualities in games that make them worth of being called art, with graphics being brought just once. The discussion is in Polish, but I made a short summary of the games and qualities they were praised for, because I found them fascinating enough. I will make a response comment with the link, but I don't think yt will let it through.

[@wisdomcoffee]

Losing friends is hard, they sound like they were nice people and how happy it must have made him to get to know a creator of one of his favorite games. And how special it is to have a friend who enjoyed the world you created and felt compelled to be a hero in it.

[@Undeadpool2099]

Hi Tim, I wanted to ask, if you were to make your own Fallout TV show free from any pressures or restrictions, what would that look like. Would you like a show about your original game maybe going more in depth about what you couldn't finish or put in? Would you make a new adventure not related to any of the games? New locals or old?

[@jesuschrist194]

Man Its SO interesting to hear you speak about all of these topics. You're like a father talking about his now 20-30 year old grown up kid, this is just amazing man, are you going to GDC this year by the way? Keep it up Tim and thanks for so many hours of AMAZING games!!!

[@robertbcardoza]

You are an icon. Thank you for sharing your experience with us. Your perspective is foundational to the modern games industry, and to the future of games humanity will play for as long as we can manage to keep playing them.

[@PullingTheBasement]

Meaning in games may be influenced by what the player brings to the experience, but isn't that in itself shaped by the developers? Developers control the context; they define the parameters which the gamer has to abide by. I love it when developers subvert this relationship, which probably explains my affection for the work of Christine Love, Davey Wreden, Bennett Foddy, Toby Fox et al. As far as the Fallout TV show goes, it's like anything else; in fact, I imagine some of the people who created the 1950's sci-fi inspirations for the original Fallout may not have enjoyed or even understood that game. Rather than holding any specific expectations, I'm curious to see how a videogame that was partially inspired by old TV shows gets remade into a new one.

[@cloudzack1090]

Rip to the homies, my dude

[@michaelbolland9212]

The path thing he was saying sounded like the quote from halt and catch fire about computers not being the thing, they are the thing that gets you to the thing

[@Cyrribrae]

What a cool video. Not much more to add to the conversation on my end, but really appreciated hearing some thoughts, some stories, and since memories. Hope the show is good too! But I really don't think I'll be too bothered if it's not terribly faithful. Fallout kinda got reimagined once it twice already. It'll kinda be a tradition :p

[@mitya_music]

we hope the show is respectful too. Amen

[@Hamza-qs7ez]

This is a vulnerable moment, art is a piecewise function

[@gpcube]

It's criminal that you, Leonard and Jason aren't even consulting or involved on the show. Imagine if they made The Last of Us show without consulting with Neil Druckmann, it would turn out like the Halo show did. I would find it bizarre if Jonathan Nolan never even reached out to you guys, all the iconic stuff that defines the franchise all traces back to the original Fallout team. Some amazing cast on the show, but still there's no way I will be able to bring myself to watch it, especially as any of the Bethesdaverse lore changes and additions really annoy me.

[@lrinfi]

"there's no way I will be able to bring myself to watch it" -- Same here. I didn't think I'd ever touch Fallout 76 with a ten foot pole, either, but did for a variety of reasons. I've rarely regretted anything so much in my life. Bethesda's artists and developers did a wonderful job with the original setting and environment, then the industry came along and completely ruined it. I can barely contain my sorrow over the lost potential regardless how much or often others ridicule it. I'll be treating it the same as the Witcher series: wait for it to be out for a good, long while and get a sense of how closely (or not) it cleaves to the original source material. My guess is that it won't any more than Bethesda's Fallout titles have.

[@propergander8374]

I'm really surprised that the showrunners haven't reached out to you and to all of the original creators of fallout to try to bring you on board as consultants. If I was making a show or film based on an existing IP that would be the 1st thing I would do. Could this be the reason that most of the films based on video games are terrible?

[@Mirokuofnite]

The fans of the series would. But this doesn't happen. A company buys the movie/tv rights, and if the stars align, it gets attached to a team to make it. The director, writer, and art direction are rarely ever interested in the source material. Bethesda maybe put out a few guide lines so it doesn't go completely off the rails, and modern familiarity with Fallout helps. But if anything it will draw from FO4 and 76.

[@slynt_]

@@Mirokuofnite Quite sad because in my opinion those games are completely missing the signature Fallout flair. Fallout 1, 2, 3, and NV are the only ones they should be looking at for inspiration

[@TravisLee33]

Your video was strangely enlightening in a way. Thank you for sharing!

[@GypsumGeneration]

my favorite walter goggins quote is "SHOTS!"

[@ScientiaFilms]

Art in general is something you should seek in yourself, and not in others. That's something I've learned, at least.

[@gamesareartGA]

An important message from an important messenger! Thanks for being such a great advocate :)

[@Max-rn3eb]

wake up babe new tim cain video dropped

[@TheFreshestPineapple]

Tim, I recently found your channel and have binged all of it within a week. The insight you give on game development, and just working in the game industry as a whole, has been some of the most interesting content I've watched in years. Keep up the great work!

[@NikolaBulj]

I've been thought that the sublime lies inside the triangle author-text-reader. There are other schools (only the text matters, only the reader, ...) but I believe this one best applies to the video games. And I'll use an example from one of your games to try to prove it. In Arcanum, when you end up in Shrouded Hills, a doctor asks you to help prevent a bank heist. As I always play good characters, I was on board and... still new at the game, we all died. Okay, re-load... Saved the bank, got the title of Hero of Shrouded Hills which will follow me throughout the continent... On another playthrough, I knew there's going to be a bank heist, so I went there directly for that sweet XP, but no one was there, they were locking for the night, I took some time to look around and constables weren't happy. Okay, re-load. To make the story short, I ended up accidentally robbing the bank before the robbers arrived, then fought them and the doctor with constables. Re-load. Then I pulled a perfect heist, got away clear, then fought the wannabe-robbers alongside constables... And was pretending to be stumped like them about where the money went. Doctor had suspicions but I came out clean hands with money to play the game on easy mode basically. But couldn't. So I re-loaded and played it as I did the very first time. Now, I thought of all of those ways to enjoy the game, try different things, that's one point. The game not only allowed me to do it without putting up invisible walls, but gave different +/- for every variant, that's a second point. And some genius had to think of all of that upfront and code it in for all the various playstyles. That's the third. The player-game-author triangle is full. If I was not interested in exploring all the options, there would be no feelings born it would be just another quest. If the game didn't allow me to do half of those paths, no joy there. And if the authors didn't imagine the game working so naturally, allowing different approaches, again no joy, no deep feelings, no opportunity for wonder. No sublime. Ofc, almost any quest in Arcanum is like this, I just took an early one to avoid spoilers (as if anyone here didn't play it multiple times).

[@baxterbragi]

Hey Tim! I was wondering about the specifics of how games are sort of structured from like an architecture/code wise. Obviously depends on the game, engine, dev, etc and I know there's plenty of videos on the subject out there but I would just love to hear your views on that.

[@fredrik3880]

Dont know if we would like to hear about the same thing but maybe as this sounds interesting. Id like to hear about a game being made (prefer Fallout or Arcanum) like in what order and how it looks in those stages. Like on Fallout i understand Tim made an engine without a setting. Then what happens? After that etc. Just like the basics. Compare it to building a house. First you pour a foundation then pipes. After that the building blocks that form walls etc etc

[@kevinlearner40]

I watched your video on why you left fallout 2, i'm so sorry that happened. I feel kind of bad cause fallout 2 was my favorite in the series, but I don't think its right the way you were treated.

[@NotRandomHero222]

I look forward to every new video you put out. It's like visiting with a friend. Hope you're well and having a nice day Tim!

[@fixpontt]

never heard about Fallout show until now, but what Netflix did with The Witcher (they murdered it) should be a huge exclamation mark when we talk about TV shows inspired by games... however i checked on the Wiki page and Christopher Nolan's brother Jonathan is the writer (or one of them) and he created many quality movies and tv series (The Prestige, Dark Knight, Interstellar, Westworld) so i think it will be good

[@Vaultboy-13]

I am disappointed to hear the show producers didn't get in touch with you or the others, Tim! I think you and Leonard could have provided important insights into the bedrock of what this retro future world is about in terms of art style, tech and dark humor. I think just slapping the 50's style sensibilities on everything and calling it good is not quite "getting it". I did read that the show runners were more inspired by the 97' Fallout, but I don't know what that means for them exactly. And since there are so many interviews and documents out there about the games, I'm sure we can be hopeful that they at least read the Fallout Bible for this tv show. Now if they can just walk that razor thin line of dark comedy and goofy technology with the writing.

[@lrinfi]

The Fallout franchise already has fallen off that razor thin line and into the abyss. It'd be nice if it could be rescued, but we're way past the point that it could be at this stage. Better to stick with the originals. I'm not going to make any preconceived predictions about how the TV show will turn out, but considering who the writers and producers are consulting, I think we can have a pretty good idea.

[@v4v777]

@@lrinfi Probably Todd will be the main consultant.. cause he has a lot to will teach them about the Art of: " It Just Works!"

[@lrinfi]

@@v4v777 No offense, but that meme is totally unfair to Todd Howard. It's taken out of context and applied to issues such as unresolved bugs, rushed launches and the like. He was actually talking about all the elements of a project coming together and "clicking", i.e. connecting, with people. Some projects do; some project don't. Depends on the project and its aims.

[@v4v777]

@@lrinfi Maybe for you its out of context.. but not for me... this phrase sums up his whole Philosophy/Mindset on gaming..... and those with eyes to see, know whats Todd's "Just Works" is all about in the games hes involved in.

[@Vaultboy-13]

@@lrinfi I think FO3 and so on did a fairly good job translating the overall look and mood of the originals into immersive first person. But the characters and writing just fell flat and were largely uninteresting to me. Fallout 1 had a lot of originality and character where FO3 was just kinda soulless. So I hope the writers for the show get more inspiration from the first game than anywhere else. Maybe it is just nostalgia goggles on my part, but I do recognize how limited Fallout 1 is in characters and storyline complexity when compared to anything today. Much of the charm from Fallout 1 was in text based world descriptions for items or events. The writing had to be good enough to convey much of what FO3 just does visually in storytelling.

[@fenbyrat]

YESS!!!! considering the impact fallout and new vegas had on me and the emotions they evoked, it would be crazy to say games cant be art. So much of what we create is art because of the passion we put behind it, and what we say with it either intentionally or unintentionally!!!! as for the TV show, I'm cautiously optimistic. Sadly video game TV shows have a bad rep (think resident evil, halo, witcher etc) BUT I'm really hoping they pull through and make a show as good as The Last Of Us!!!!! And if not, at least the props and sets look pretty cool lol

[@VK-sz4it]

Episode with Pierce's will is hillarious. Great talk, thank you for sharing!

[@Will_OT]

I fear the fallout show will be "Bethesdas fallout show"

[@Jfbmu]

How do u feel about it now

[@sylvilaguscunicularius3155]

@@Jfbmuit is definitely Bethesda’s fallout show… as Todd Howard is being consulted, lol; but the Bethesda team has never worked on the west coast directly other than giving input in FONV, so a lot of the lore is being gathered from the originals and new Vegas.

[@kevinlearner40]

Have you heard of a game called Underrail? It is very similar to fallout in design principles but has a very different progression and theme. Also there is another game called Age of Decadence which is also similar, both place you in a very ammoral world where it is difficult to survive, and doing the right thing just isn't really always possible.

[@packrunnernes]

2:23 this is extremely sad

[@pixelfairy]

You bring up a good point. Playing god of war felt more like watching a movie than playing a game.

[@pitchforker3304]

Sorry to hear about your friends :-\ It's what makes life worth living but it makes life hard.

[@tobinmonroe3045]

I love hearing you talk tim! I’m a fan of the entire fallout series including the original it’s been such a treat to hear the stories you tell. Can I ask who came up with the idea of being able to convince the master to kill himself in the first fallout? To me that is the single best ending to a video game ever. It’s pure genius. I know you may not see this and that’s fine but I can’t help but ask.

[@rusty_from_earth9577]

Question: You have mentioned researching viruses to make the FEV backstory more accurate. Have you spent time researching other things, specifically history or people to translate them into games. This is beyond absorbing things passively from movies/tv/books, but actively looking for things and taking notes specifically to try and work them in. I know I asked before regarding 1880-1890s history in the Outer Worlds, so I don’t mean to be demanding. Just curious. Also, that was the most polite critique of the Foundation show possible.

[@ThaetusZain]

It's like a movie or a book could be a conversation.

[@iamthewalrus.]

Art can mean so many different things to people, it’s not an exact science, and I think the reason why games aren’t viewed as art in the contemporary sense is because currently the art world is fixated on finding this definition, either by being extremely attentive or self aware in a sense that questions the boundaries of what art could, can or can’t be. In short, the art scene globally has its own foot up its ass, chasing a carrot of definition when its meaning could very possibly be something that will never be answered. It just is, it’s beautiful, it’s fun, games are fun, sooner or later the public will catch on.

[@dizzee2100]

I usually don't bother with live action adaptations but since Walton Goggins is in it I'm gonna have to check it out

[@TihetrisWeathersby]

I'm looking forward to the show, I just hope they focus on the source material and not turn it into something it isn't

[@cloudzack1090]

Im not holding my breath or having high hopes, ill watch it atleast and see what it will offer

[@drithius4801]

I'm hoping it's more Boy and his Dog, less CW series. I figure there must be roughly a 0.1% chance of that.

[@martinatzejensen6787]

A bit late for that, I think.

[@littleponygirl666]

Call me cynical but I'm pretty sure it's gonna be utter shit because Bethesda.

[@stuartmorley6894]

​@@littleponygirl666it won't be crap because of Bethseda. It will be crap because unless it hits a million unknown audience targets it will be canned by Amazon before the first series ends. Unless those making it are brave it will fall on its face, but if they are it could get cancelled before it even starts.

[@yarr_bro]

Thank you for sharing these videos with us!

[@hayro252]

Whats your take on Fallout London?

[@jirikrajnak9047]

there's nothing more artful than dropping a landmine on a guy's head while he's forced to dig his own grave. i mean - have there been any quests like that ever since? not that i know of.

[@GlassesAndCoffeeMugs]

I feel pretty confident about the show being good, it's got Jon Nolan who did the first season of Westworld, it's produced by the studio behind The Boys who did a phenomenal TV adaption of the source material and of course Walton Goggins who is an amazing actor. But I think we need to prepare ourselves to consume the show "as is" and the story "as is", as opposed to watching it and every minute wracking our brains to recall if it's lore accurate. My worry is that they might lean too far into Fallout's quirky elements (which I don't think should be ignored) and not enough into the dismal reality of post-apocalyptic wastelands, which is that they are brutal and sad. But that's why I think Nolan is a good choice because he seems like he would understand that.

[@lrinfi]

Considering the show is set in LA only 14 years after the events of New Vegas and the NCR is nowhere in sight while the BOS is apparently a major force despite their defeat at the hands of the NCR, I wouldn't think any brain wracking would be required to know that it won't have much of anything to do with "Fallout canon". It'd be hard for Lucy and her fellow vault dwellers to "rebuild civilization" when the NCR already has established a republic on the west coast, which is portrayed as complete desolation and utter chaos by the trailers. The wild west/country theme BGS tacked onto both Fallout 76 and Starfield, otoh, appears to be highly prominent as well, but I don't suppose it matters to many that the Free States and the Freestar Collective, respectively, paint a rather stereotypical view of rural America.

[@GlassesAndCoffeeMugs]

@@lrinfi NCR is clearly depicted in the trailer, plus the Brotherhood were only defeated at Hoover Dam in Nevada, it's never implied they were totally wiped out, stands to reason they'd have a stronger presence elsewhere. New Vegas wasn't their home territory. I can definitely see that 14 years later, conflict between the NCR and the Brotherhood could spread to other regions, like LA. If anything some scenes in the trailer reminded me of the Mohave desert in NV. Personally the thought they were stereotyping rural Americans never crossed my mind, also "space cowboys" has been a trope in sci fi for decades

[@lrinfi]

@@GlassesAndCoffeeMugsI didn't say they might never make an appearance in the show even if it's just a cameo. I've seen the NCR flag, at least, in supposedly authentic set photos myself, but the West Coast Wasteland is nonetheless being depicted in Amazon's trailers as though they never existed or, perhaps, are just another small-time, ragtag group as opposed to the New California Republic, which would naturally be far more prominent in California than the BOS with flaws of its own. "Fan service?" A "nod" to the originals and New Vegas? Maybe. But "canon?" Fallout's canon is as jumbled a series of disjointed images at this point as the show's teaser trailers, imo. Bethesda excels at creating interesting, virtual worlds to explore and has commercialized Fallout for a mainstream audience. It's the commercial aspects most everyone is looking at. I feel for those who are hoping it "sticks to the lore" considering that everyone both inside the project and out are talking almost exclusively about visuals: how "cool" it looks and how it "nails the look"...of a Bethesda Fallout game. I'm glad you feel confidant enough about the show to tell us "we need to prepare ourselves to consume the show 'as is' and the story 'as is'", but you see, passive consumption never has been a thing when it comes to the interactive Fallout universe or, indeed, any RPG universe. Why should it be for a TV series set in that universe? Word is the production team has been given a green light to tell an original story with original characters in the Fallout setting. Nolin has been quoted in Vanity Fair as saying, “The games are about the culture of division and haves and have-nots that, unfortunately, have only gotten more and more acute in this country and around the world over the last decades." (Okay. So, that's not "canon," but very much in the spirit of Fallout.) Nolin adds, "We get to talk about that in a wonderful, speculative fiction way. I think we’re all looking at the world and going, ‘God, things seem to be heading in a very, very frightening direction.” It's also been posited (in a separate forum) that "specifically, the series will provide commentary on people’s morals and will do so through the character of Lucy, a vault dweller played by Ella Purnell." Uh-oh. The "woke" vs. "antiwoke" crowds are already all over it when it has yet even to air. It seems some would rather perpetuate the divisions among us in reality than explore them more deeply. Nolin himself has said (again, in the Vanity Fair interview), "One of the things we're trying to gently sidestep here is that kind of binary thinking, like, ‘They’re the good guys, or the bad guys.... Whoever the good guys and the bad guys were, they destroyed the whole world. So now we’re in a much more gray area.” I'd say 'liminal time' myself because that's how I understand our "times" to be. It's possible Wolin "gets" Fallout even if many of us feel Bethesda doesn't. If there's any hope for the TV show it lies right there as I see it. Here's hoping its potential as an agent of healing as opposed to further divisiveness is realized.

[@asdfjkl227]

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder

[@antijulius]

I know you don't own the IP or anything but it's still crazy to me that neither you nor Leonard did consulting on the show.

[@avery_IO]

you think the geniuses at modern television companies know anything about art? crazy, disappointing, but not surprising 😢

[@SoldierofJeb]

Hey Tim, how did you go about researching Southern California for the Fallout setting? I'm California born-and-raised, and I've always been amazed at how true-to-life a lot of the locations in Fallout are. I remember when I was in college I was driving through the outskirts of Lancaster, California, on my way to visit family, and noticed the absurd number of fortified compounds with walls made of scrapped cars. Was Junktown based on these compounds in the California high desert?

[@Tremirenes]

Tbh a lot of arguments on game not being art I heard stem from Robert Egger's theory, which is surprising since I even hear this [relatively low worth argument] even in Poland

[@ErgonomicChair]

Foundation was... so upsetting :/. I think Fallout as long as its a story set in the world, it shooooould be okay? Or is it a remaster of Fallout 1 or 2's story? It should be hard to mess up a story in just a post apocalyptic world.

[@___.51]

Foundation was such a disappointment to me… My expectations are low for tv these days

[@GRNKRBY]

Officially announced now for Amazon Prime.

[@orockwell]

Tim, can you (or someone you hire) please collate these videos into an audiobook so I can pay you for them? They're brilliant, I adore each one.

[@misterxar]

As long as someone loads their quicksave out of frustration and kills every person in the room before reloading.

[@Pangloss6413]

Roger Ebert created this idea that games can’t be art and I will never ever forgive him for that

[@rabbitcreative]

5:58 You're stating, in your own way, a basic premise of general-semantics. Words-don't-mean, only a person means. Kudos.

[@Hwood88]

Since Fallout 4, Bethesda seems to have focused on turning Fallout into an overall brand with a very specific art style and aesthetic and this show seems to follow that exactly unfortunately.

[@CalobAdamsInfamous913]

???

[@emanuel81111]

True about fallout 4, but im gonna keep my opinion about tv show until i see it.

[@SwagDuhBuh]

This aged well

[@nicholaswerner8170]

Will you talk about your experiences with the new Fallouts? 4, 76, Shelter?

[@CheeseWorks-vj4yi]

Hey Tim! Was “Red Rocket” intended to be an innuendo? Thanks!

[@jabberw0k812]

Knowing absolutely nothing about the TV show, my uneducated prediction is that it will be Westworld + The Walking Dead

[@notimportant8643]

I didnt know you were a community fan. That episode with Pearces will was funny as hell

[@CainOnGames]

I love Community. I try not to talk about the show too much because I don’t want to Britta the plot for anyone.

[@ExVersion83]

About game being art, I wonder if we can say that what a developer ships is always an unfinished thing, a half product, which is only complete once the gamer plays it.

[@jaws8621]

I'm sorry about your friends, Tim. Cancer is such a bastard : (

[@alexfrank5331]

Also wondering about your take on Larian being able to build expertise and retain talent for 20 years.

[@plaidchuck]

Larian still has released some dogs. Dont like this new narrative where they’ve been a flawless developer since day one.

[@rrrrthats4rs]

@@plaidchuck Larian is a *Great* developer and I was enthusiastic about Divinity Original Sin 2 as a game that seemed more ambitious than what other CRPGs were trying-- but I don't see how people are just ignoring that COVID completely wiped the board of expectations for BG3-- they were given a blank check as far as how much time they needed to finish the game and presumably didn't struggle to get investment dollars to radically expand the size of their studio *in the middle of a pandemic* Imagine if some crazy world event had given New Vegas another year? Let alone the 3 that Baldurs Gate 3 had in early access. I love them, but people are acting like other games *aren't* like this because the developers either aren't "passionate" enough or somehow Larian has become the ubermensch developer. Yeah, it's an obnoxious narrative for sure

[@jmlaw8888]

​​​@@plaidchuckExactly. I like my RPGs well written. They dont all have to be Planescape: Torment or Disco Elysium or Red Dead Redemption 2 level of writing but at least good, solid writing. Larian isnt where I go looking for that. They have a solid and loyal fanbase who love their work and Im not for a second suggesting they dont deserve that. But this overhype is getting ridiculous now.

[@jkvltra804]

@@rrrrthats4rs So many studios used covid as an excuse as to why their games were buggy, not recieving updates, or just being incomplete but when we want to cope about why BG3 is better than what others are producing we're going to say it's because of covid? "Our game is a mess bc of covid, larians game is good bc of covid" my god I can't wait until we're far enough passed this that studios will have to find a different excuse as to why their product is a rushed heap.

[@rrrrthats4rs]

@jkvltra804 right because they had publishers breathing down their necks about deadlines and quarterly returns. BG3 is a situation where Larian is their own publisher, and they had the backing of a gargantuan, functionally free marketing campaign by way of it being a Dungeons and Dragons product released at the height of popularity for the game. Most videos games have to be their own thing. Most video games are not told "just get it done right and we'll publish it when it's ready" because of factors that go way beyond passion. Larian seems to have done a pretty good job with that opportunity. Good for them. Good for us. Josh Sawyers not making excuses though when he says this isn't a new standard, he's just realistically assessing how rare a game has this much leeway in production

[@ChronoTango]

I think I’d enjoy a Fallout show as an anthology series rather than following a specific character through every episode. Fallout is about change happening throughout an entire world. While a single character serves as the catalyst for much of that change, I think I’d like a full season, at least, dedicated to the way the world works before we see individual perspectives of this one savior character that comes and changes the wastes.

[@orlovskyconsulting]

I think everything about the story and the impression which leave at player , viewer.

[@hawkbirdtree3660]

Does the Fallout TV show have anything to do with Nuka Break by Wayside?

[@THEEJONESY]

Love this guy

[@GRNKRBY]

Curious what you'll think of the latest trailer.

[@ojthesimpson35]

When are you gonna get a cameo in the show?