Gibson GOT SUED by PRS Guitars & Ted McCarty’s Estate

Breaking down Gibson Guitars’ latest legal trouble with Paul Reed Smith Guitars and the Ted McCarty Estate.
“The estate of Ted McCarty and PRS are seeking to cancel Gibson’s trademark for “Theodore.” The case, set to resume in 2024, has also spawned a new dispute - one over PRS’ Silver Sky Nebula mark, which Gibson alleges conflicts with its Silverburst mark.”
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[@TomButwin]

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[@skeymoson]

I have a pre-factory CE 24 (1990). A couple of years after I bought it the knobs became stripped… I was playing near Stevensville Md.. where PRS had by then opened the new factory.. I stopped in with my guitar and the guy laughed and told me that they had used Gibson knobs on the early models.. anyway he took the guitar back to the shop and replaced the knobs and I’ve never had any problems since .. it’s still a great guitar 🎸

[@TomButwin]

Makes sense to me! Great people at that company and I'm not surprised they treated you (and your guitar) so well.

[@Nightsat44]

Maybe this is Paul's chace to get back at Gibson for their law suit of PRS's single cut. Paul said if he lost that suit it would of taken down his company. Go get em Paul! And watch out Mark Agnesi, PRS is watching you fool.

[@toddknight6855]

Speculative guess.....PRS also has some old McCarty sketches from his time as consultant they are toying with producing and wanted to fire a shot to 'clear the water' so to speak of anything Gibson might be moving on (or maybe it is just as simple as them wanting to keep the name McCarty out of Gibson's mouth). Hoping their backing of the McCarty estate would give them leverage and allow them to further use his name. Gibson, in turn, counterfiles in a move to get PRS to back off. Oddly enough though, many guitar makers use Silverburst in their terminology, so the fact Gibson has not moved against say, Fender, gives them little ground to claim real harm from the Silver Sky. If anything, filing a counter claim against Paul's Guitar would make more sense since there could be customer confusion of it relating to Les Paul and the Les Paul model. They could even have taken the petty shot at Paul Reed Smith, saying his name doesn't carry enough recognition to be tied to PRS, which is commonly know by its acronym, whereas the Les Paul does carry enough recognition.

[@TomButwin]

This is why I love the comment section. I have no idea if any of this is plausible, but it's incredibly well thought out and creative. Are you a lawyer? If not, you should be...or at least you should work for one of these companies to dream up the legal battles for the legal team.

[@clinthinkle237]

Today I met another person that shares the same birth date as I do. How do I go about litigation to keep this other individual from capitalizing on that specific date.

[@TomButwin]

lololol I legit laughed at this.

[@AndrewSchwartzenberger]

Loved when Ted McCarty played for the Wings. Real gritty player.

[@TomButwin]

The layers to this comment are endless.

[@davidallen346]

PRS claimed their original guitar design was based off Gibson JR Doublecut guitar

[@grandudetonesnob7107]

You would've thought Gibson would've sued PRS over their worn denim color back when they had Levi's former CEO at the helm.. lost opportunities..😢

[@TomButwin]

Wait, did that color really exist? How did I block that out of my memory? lol

[@grandudetonesnob7107]

@@TomButwin my friend has a modern eagle in that color. I think it was made back in 08-09.

[@Antoine_Lamarque]

I thought I was watching a Gibson documentary but it turns out it was just an episode of 'Suits'

[@letsgooo1637]

why are they even fighting? That's one of the worst designs ever... Sometimes I drop a turd that looks like a Nike logo, you don't see them throw me a lawsuit, they just wait for it to go away.

[@Sams911]

PRS is what Gibson would be if Ted McCarty stayed alive and kept running it..

[@gunnarmarks5754]

So when Gibson is marketing for the guitar they use the Ted connection and show his old sketches But when it’s lawsuit time Teds not we’ll known enough Seems like a bit of “whatever for best for me in this situation” approach

[@TomButwin]

That was the sticking point for me. Gibson, to this day, references Ted with regard to the Theodore. Without that connection to his drawings, that guitar doesn’t have much going for it, in my opinion.

[@gunnarmarks5754]

@@TomButwin fully agree. I think it’s a very beautiful design, it reminds me of a tulip, but the lore sends it, a lot of my school notebooks are filled with non existing guitar shapes, it’s very inspiring to see the “pinnacle” in guitar brands highlighting a historic designers sketch … but if your not paying its effectively explotation imo

[@adamswanson8216]

If he made that design while he was still at Gibson and it’s in their files while he worked for them anything I’m sure he designed belongs to them otherwise they would not have rights to the Gibson unless Paul or the ES 335 anything he designed after he left them certainly is a different story. I think the states out of line and PRS Cannot come up with enough signature models or new designs to compete honestly, their backbone I think is certainly there foreign guitars wouldn’t play one myself but that doesn’t mean I don’t think they’re great. I’m a guitar teacher and I’ve been playing for 40 years I would certainly not think That either of these companies are the future of music at this point anybody that is in touch with the world of vintage guitars should realize if you want to buy one now Eastman certainly has the best pricing and probably best quality out there for the money, PRS, nor Gibson can touch their prices, northern quality. You may have to upgrade the pick ups, but you have to in a Gibson or a PRS most of the time too, it’s a bunch of crap 4:19

[@BarDog57]

What's wrong with Gibson paying homage to the designer who designed so many great guitars for them? I hate lawyers. I'd like to see them settle with the McCarty estate, for using Ted's name and drawing, but I don't think PRS has a dog in this hunt. It's not their design or name.

[@96driver]

Did Ted work for Gibson when that design was made? Seems like if he did, that design belongs to Gibson. Seems like they can call it what they want. But to deny “Theodore” isn’t related is weird and flimsy. Just my opinion, based on any job I’ve ever had where if I came up with ideas, they belong to the company. Haha

[@jetteroheller]

Raise your hand if you were ever confused by any of this and whose product was whose.

[@jonthehermit8082]

I kinda Ike it just because of Gibson has been suing a lot against smaller companies. They really can’t break out of their legacy, every time they try something new they get compared to other guitars, hell ,they can’t even change their headstock angle or it”just won’t be same” to the people that still subscribe to the myth.

[@darnright]

Well at least the lawyers will still make money...Stupid!

[@ywtcc]

We really need to have a conversation as a society about patent trolling. Personally, I think the very idea of inherited artistic license is absurd. I just think there's more productive jobs than IP enforcement, and in general, IP should be shortlived and limited to the actual people doing the actual innovation.

[@kylemoran4343]

That "Theodore" guitar looks like something The kiddy guitar maker "First Act" would produce! I'm a huge fan of Ted McCarty, and how he saved Gibson guitars. If anyone knows a little guitar history, they will know that back in the day, Epiphone was thee big manufacturing giant at the time. Then comes Mr. McCarty to Gibson, and boom, Gibson becomes the giant that swallows Epi, and a few more. These people are acting like children on the playground, not getting their way ! Babies both sides

[@kirbyjakescarborough4515]

HAHAHAHA! It do....😆

[@TomButwin]

I will say, the "Theodore" shape did remind me a little of the car Homer Simpson drew and his rich brother ended up actually making.

[@kirbyjakescarborough4515]

All seems like a stretch and extremely petty... Shame on these guys. Were they all musicians once? LOL! Most folks I know playing live music are somewhat of a Brotherhood; a few exceptions (a few snobs) LOL, The minute they start making them, they become honey badgers. LOL! Call it Richard Petty, Tom Petty, Ted Petty... its petty as hell. Shame on them, man. Its greedy crap. LOL I doubt Ted would subscribe to any of this fodder. Great topic and video as always Tom. Well presented and tactfully done, mate. Hope you guys are staying warm wherever you are man. Cheers!

[@stevejewett3650]

Did Gibson really do damage to PRS & McCarty's estate? I've always known about Ted but never thought of him as Theodore until I discovered the guitar in question. It's all about money. Ok Gibson, change the name of the guitar to the Paul Leo Jetstar Dumptruck.

[@calebengland77]

this actually makes me upset. even though prs isn't necessarily in the right because they waited so long to actually go head with the lawsuit, gibson is stretching so much it's not even funny. literally anyone with eyes will tell you they are completely different finishes, guitar player or not. the only thing similar between the two is the metallic flake they both use, but gibson definitely doesn't own metallic finishes as a whole. and like prs's original lawsuit, why did they not do this sooner if they really had these feelings? this counter claim from gibson is absolutely petty, and they'll absolutely lose no matter what court they end up going about this in. and for them to say that ted mccarty isn't well known enough to be associated with the theodore, after he quite literally was the reason behind the companies fame, is incredibly shallow. as always, gibson chose to continue digging their grave.

[@charleswickline3865]

Sounds like an estate trying to get money they dont deserve.

[@TomButwin]

I’m no legal expert, but Gibson was definitely using his likeness and name to sell guitars…again, I’m not a doctor or lawyer or astronaut, so I don’t really know what that means.

[@garycoates4987]

Blues lawyer guitars vs rocker dentist guitars,,, it's funny that the two most expensive mainstream brands sue each other over trivial details that nobody who buys guitars notices or worries about, to be fair the "Theodore" was probably actually a rejected design because it looks horrible.

[@jonthehermit8082]

That’s exactly what it was , looks like a sixties Japanese guitar, which wasn’t cool back in those days, new ones made by Gibson don’t seem that cool either.

[@ace9566061]

When I think of Ted McCarty I think of the name "Ted" not "Theodore". I thought the Theodore Gibson made, was ugly so I never paid attention to it. I had no clue this was named after Ted McCarty. But since Gibson said the guitar was linked to Ted, PRS has a leg to stand on, but if Gibson had just shut up about that I don't think PRS would have won. Maybe I'm wrong. Who knows.

[@gunnarmarks5754]

Ted is a casual shortening of Theodore (or Edward) Like Bill is a casual shortening of William

[@TomButwin]

Well, to be fair, it’s still ongoing! We’ll see who prevails and wins out.

[@vadenk4433]

PRS didn’t win. It hasn’t gone to court yet

[@hammill444]

Geez, why fight legal battles over an absolutely hideous guitar like this? Just let it go.

[@richardsmith5362]

I hope the judge(s) throw out both cases...

[@RobSmith-rn3ie]

Sounds like a BS suit to me. They have the right to make a design inspired by this guy as much as PRS does. They didn't use his full name without his permission. Incidentally I'm saying this as someone who would *never* buy a Gibson and *does* like PRS guitars. Also, I've been playing guitar for 20 years and I hadn't heard of Ted McCarty until now.

[@TomButwin]

...but, I mean, they even say they are referencing THE Ted McCarty...so Gibson kind of did use his name with that intention. It would be another thing if they just happen to name a guitar the "Theodore," with no context, and then said "what? what? What'd we do?" They didn't though. They were pretty intentional and obvious lol

[@charlesbolton8471]

@@TomButwin They definitely made a big deal about it. I’ll never forget how they claimed to have “found” his drawings for the Theodore in his old office. Never mind the fact that the Theodore came out about 40 years after Gibson sold the building where Ted had an office. Rickenbacker might as well sue them too since they had model very similar already in production around the time Ted supposedly came up with design.

[@panoscyrannos6222]

oh stfu and play yer guitar.... jeez. companies. but in a way their right, people are so easilly confused, specially guitarists, me at least. "dude, wanted to buy a prs silversky the other day and came home with a silver burst gibbo...so confusing. same with that ugly p90 axe and the wonderful DC with pafs from prs...." dude so good lawyers are there to protect me.

[@bennettmusiclabs9382]

no such thing as a Good Lawyer. doesn't matter anyway the Chinese are already copying it anyway.

[@KidOnTheMoon88]

Paul Reed Smith should just shut and make PRS guitars... PRS is not original guitar maker like Fender or Gibson... PRS copied Fender Strat, Tele but also McCarthy Single cut is copied of Les Paul...

[@milenakorovljev4209]

Kid on the moon.....it's time to get back on Earth and get some oxygen in your lungs....It will do good to your brain and enable you to think clearly. "PRS is not original guitar maker like Fender or Gibson..." ? Really ? How did you come to that conclusion? Breed in deeply, get off the moon, and come back to Earth. I own all three (LP, Stratocaster and PRS) and they are all totally different and original. Stop the b.s. and enjoy them all .

[@milenakorovljev4209]

That is the most ridiculous comment. Do you think only Fender and Gibson can make guitars ?

[@stink-a-lynx6571]

​@@milenakorovljev4209I think he meant they never had an original design themselves and shouldn't be suing companies that created all their designs. Not that only fender and Gibson can make guitars. Like it or not fender and Gibson created most of the guitar shapes everything else is a derivative.

[@milenakorovljev4209]

@@stink-a-lynx6571 Fender, Gibson and Martin created most iconic guitar shapes and functions . Credit to those people and companies. Does that means that no one else cannot come up with something else and maybe, improve on those designes ? If it was so , we would still drive Ford model T. I see no logic in it. Monopoly stops progress and it is a form of tyranny. Guitar wars is what is all about : fight against monopoly and monotony. Try as you might, it cannot be stoped.

[@milenakorovljev4209]

@@stink-a-lynx6571 Gibsons "Play original" is a fighting moniker , and there is no other way to decipher it. And noone appreciates arrogance. It creates spiteful atmosphere . Gipson is fighting a losing battle.