Should we be playing “theater of the mind” D&D?

[@FeldorS]

When we were in college, we couldn't really afford minis. So PC characters had a mini, but monsters were often pennies with a number in sharpy on them and/or candies. (You can write numbers on hershey's kisses.) Getting to eat the monster you just killed was a reward...

[@LeChaunce]

To this day I use minis for PCs and printed tokens with the Monster Manual image for the rest of the monsters -- except my boss monsters. I use minis for those. Particularly dragons.

[@JamesMillsNeutralBase]

Gummy candy monsters were the best. Nothing quite like watching a bunch of hungry university students fight to get the last hit because the BBEG is a donut.

[@Agel1ic]

Sometimes, I can be a bit dyslexic and I have to read the same sentence more than once. the first time I read penises instead of pennies.😂😂

[@jothrax4673]

We had a dry erase grid and just wrote the first 1-2 letters of the monster's title & characters' name.

[@ej_knox]

Eating your enemies is genius!

[@faemerothgoblinbane]

Love seeing all my aphantasia siblings in the comments! I also physically cannot picture spaces with any degree of detail, so maps and tokens are a necessity. Portraits for NPCs are valuable too; I can have a concept of what a monster or an enemy looks like on description, but it will just be a feeling until I can actually see an artist's rendition.

[@TheOnlyToblin]

I have aphantasia as well, but for some reason, totm seems to get around that. It's really weird. Utterly strange. On the other side, using minis/tokens etc completely ruins my immersion, because they don't look like I expect. It's a plague living in my brain, I tell you!

[@SortKaffe]

12:50 I'm glad that I stayed to the end where you finally resolved why you opened the fridge earlier ❄️🐥

[@smlowe5637]

When she said that she’d remember 20 minutes from now, my first action was to click back outside the video to see if the video was just over 20 minutes long. 😂

[@Leshantra]

@@smlowe5637 Same xD

[@juliegolick]

I've played both, and I tend to prefer somewhere in between the two: an "abstract map" if you would. Like, the GM would draw *something* just so we got the sense of the space, but we wouldn't bother with exact grid-map layouts except where that sort of thing was really important for a particular encounter. In general "they're on the left side of the room near the door" or "they're at the street corner" was good enough. And, yes, we trusted our GM to say "you catch 6 of them in the fireball" without taking out the rulers and protractors.

[@dukejaywalker5858]

same!

[@EStramel09]

So, our table had this conversation not too long ago. I have legitimate, diagnosed aphantasia. I legitimately can’t “visualize” things(my whole life I thought “mind’s eye” was just a phrase, not something real). Like I struggle to even picture dungeon layouts, let alone full combat maps. So, after the discussion with my DM, he bought a cheap, handheld whiteboard and now does a quick, 30 sec sketch of things, even outside of combat. It’s been insanely helpful to me. But he has also said it’s helped him be more descriptive and detailed to help me and makes him think about things differently when planning. I didn’t initially talk about it because I’ve learned to work around it, but it came to a head when the DM was describing a ledge overlooking an arena(he wasn’t explaining it clearly enough for me and my brain couldn’t place it together right). It’s worked out amazingly and our table has never been more fun, but it took having that conversation and coming to a good compromise for everything to work out.

[@GinnyDi]

Sounds like you and your DM have great communication!! Kudos to you both 😊

[@safebox36]

I'm curious how you got diagnosed, I only found out I have it around 7 or 8 years ago when friends were discussing their dreams and I got so confused how everyone was seeing hearing stuff, and all I had in my dreams was the sensation of touch and just "knowing" where objects were in relation to myself.

[@wolfsign9168]

I have aphantasia but i didnt know it was a diagnosis too i thought it was just a label! Is there a reason to get it diagnosed? (like medical support or smth?? it doesnt really affect me negatively so im asking for my own benefit if ive missed something!) I also used to think minds eye was just a metaphor! My dad also has it so when i first asked him he was like 'yeah its totally normal to see nothing' So it took me doing my own research afterwards to realise that no... its not normal and people can actually see the pink elephant when they make the 'dont think of a pink elephant' joke ;-;

[@57thorns]

Not every good solution is a compromise. To me it sounds like you came to a mutually beneficial solution. Just knitpicking words here, but I think this story has a much better ending than "compromise".

[@jothrax4673]

​@@wolfsign9168Is this seriously a thing? I've literally never been able to see things when I close my eyes. I've tried describing this to my wife and it's always confused her because I guess she really does see images? For me it's more like spacial awareness, or coming up with descriptive words. I'm not actually seeing anything. It's made life hell being since I write books. . .when I was learning to describe scenes I would have to draw them out. I've practiced enough to where I can kinda visualize. . .but it's more like my mind has a highly detailed description of something I can't actually see. If I really focus I can conjure a very shadowy form of something in my head.

[@angelawesneski5029]

I run monthly one shots for my book club. We use a dry erase board, animal erasers for characters, and dessert erasers for enemies. "I'd like to attack the pink cupcake wolf.... yeah, I'm the green hamster." It sounds silly, but it is super fun for us and ensures that everyone is on the same page.

[@BobWorldBuilder]

Love this topic. For me, the “abstract map” does it pretty well for most games. Theater of mind plus a sketch or tokens. Things are typically either “in melee” (one move or less), or a number of “moves” away. It does change depending on what system we’re playing of course.

[@tomleonard830]

It helps me to have a general layout on a physical map, so you know if you can reach certain areas with ranged attacks, spells, AOE effects, dashing, etc. Details on the map (other than things like doors and walls are not necessary. And poker chips or those smooshed marble looking things in different colors are sufficient to indicate the enemies.

[@amaryllisrelic9097]

100% my group can get by with a simple gird or adapted map. We've used dice in place of minis for a long time until we got some minis.

[@andrewmiddleton3487]

seems like all the tedium of building and configuring a map without any of the benefit of the information a map provides. and it also seems a lot like playing with only half the rules? i'm not sure i get it. i guess if the idea of grids and lines breaks immersion, but a third of the spellcasting rules and two thirds of the feats don't, then more power to you.

[@GinnyDi]

That sounds like it make setup a lot easier! And I suppose once you have a clearer idea of how spell and ability ranges convert into "moves", it's super simple. I might consider using this for some more casual encounters.

[@foldionepapyrus3441]

I agree it is somewhat system dependent, but its also fair to say even in the same system there are classes and playstyles that demand more tabletop wargame style precision than theatre of the mind. For instance the 2014 Monk is in some ways the most powerful class option if you are playing strictly to the rules with all the distances and line of sight being important. As terrain matters almost zip to to a 2014 Monk (in comparison anyway) and they have more movement than almost any opponent so they can always put themselves in a good position. But that same superpower for those monks really doesn't work theatre of the mind at all - the natural handwavy nature of distances just destroys that one real superpower they poses.

[@xanathar8659]

My very first dnd game, all of us were new, and we used pencils, erasers, and anything else we could find. Our player minis were standing 2d images from a lotr boardgame the dm owned, and monsters were binder clips with a small sheet of paper containing the monster name and a bunch of circles for hit points which we filled in as we did damage. We just moved them on the bare table and went "yeah that's probably like 30 feet there." We'd grab pencils and erasers to place on the table to represent things like barricades, hills, walls, etc, and it was genuinely really fun. Nowadays I use a grid which is usually a printout of a custom battlemap I make in Inkarnate printed on 11x17 sheets of paper which I tape together for full grids. We have custom 3d printed and painted minis for players and enemies, and it's sort of become a tradition to build custom terrain for final boss encounters. But even still, I sometimes find myself missing "the old days" (like 7 years ago lol) with those pencils, erasers, boardgame tokens, and binder clips. I have a lot of nostalgia for that game in general, makes me want to run my own phandelver game and play in the same style.

[@smallbluesphere]

I have at least one player who can’t visualise combat in TotM, so using maps and minis or the online equivalent is a must with them. I do enjoy TotM, but seeing players faces when you place a huge monster mini on the table is really fun…

[@Zarsla]

This. I play online and while I run TotM games, I simplifiy and remove a lot of stuff that I love combat & magic wise. When I play, as a player my games are online, so for combat I need something especially for larger combats. Plus it's still partial theater cuz we arent always on the map of the store or whatever and rping

[@HonduranHoneymoonhon]

Ah yes, the Rotating Apple Problem.

[@MetalGamely]

I have aphantasia so i need to have visual aids when playing or it is very difficult to visualize anything that is happening

[@noelleholiday61]

​@@MetalGamelySame Theater Of The Mind is cool and all until you realize somebody forgot to start your theater's projectors

[@kumonoameai]

I MISSED EDITH! Our group started as theater of the mind but then we realized having something physical would help us with combat. I have a bag of dice that I figure can be used as game pieces, with different colors to represent players vs enemies, and the sizes can represent different types of enemies (ex. D4 is a small minion, D6 is a bigger guy, D20 is a giant/dragon/BBEG, etc). Or you can use mancala stones.

[@TreeGallaher]

As a player with aphantsia, having actual maps or other visuals is so imperative for me to really get into the game and follow along. With no ability to visualise there is no TotM for me.

[@MetalGamely]

Yup, same!

[@JoULove]

Oh yes I was wondering if anyone else had this! I don't have complete aphantasia but yeah trying to envision a battlefield is like looking through dense fog for me, not very helpful 😂

[@PhotonBeast]

I was gonna comment about this! There are a variety of reasons why visual aids can help beyond style and preference. Sometimes it can even just boil down to helping break that initial inhibition of the role playing or otherwise provide an added aid in the immersion. For myself, I actually have the opposite problem - my brain is very capable of internal visualization, especially of 3D spaces. Having bits and bobs and maps to move around though ensures that everything in my head is shared with everyone else.

[@lacey_moon]

Was looking for this comment! Not bc I also have aphantasia, I was just curious what people who have it prefer!

[@MrAzhrarn]

Agreed. My aphantasia is slightly less total, but visualizing spaces is incredibly difficult with any level of accuracy.

[@tehfelf]

A great compromise is the way used in ICRPG!! They use index cards and a movement based on the length of a banana! Close is the length of the stem, near is half a banana and far is longer than a banana. You can melee someone close, you can move and melee someone near, you need to dash to get to someone far! You play with pictures on index cards of important points in the battle, arrange them those set distances away and put your minis on the cards! You can use your imagination for random bits, but the cards do the heavy lifting of the important things to keep in mind in a battle/scene. I used that movement on a map with a grid too with family who never played and theyoved it. Close was 1-2 squares, near was 3-6 squares, and far was past 6 squares. I feel theater of the mind is one end, maps and minis is the other, and the ICRPG style is the combination in the middle!

[@emilymiller7827]

i like using a map and wet erase markers, but i like making it mostly symbolic-- using those glass crafting beads that are flat on the bottom for monsters rather than more detailed minis, etc.

[@GinnyDi]

Honestly, glass beads are a secret weapon!! I used them for so long and still reach for them in a quick combat 😊

[@Wee_Catalyst]

This is kind of why I don’t like painting my minis and always 3D print them in shiny sparkly multicolor filament-my personal imagination wants more of a blank palette than a not-vivid-enough tiny painted person 😊

[@robertdean52]

I agree. I love miniatures (playing wargames with them is actually my maingaming hobby activity) but what I really need in an rpg is an idea where everyone in a fight is so that we don’t spend a lot of time discussing it.

[@juliahenriques210]

@@GinnyDi This. So much this. Or just dice. vov

[@emilymiller7827]

@@GinnyDi chess kid growing up-- we imagined those battles but it was still great to have them on squares

[@Kowa9516]

"Why are there so many trolls?" Oh, you silly goose. It's the internet. And on the topic of TotM vs Minis etc: As a DM, I'm trying a middle path: For simple, small or unexpected encounters, it's TotM (if it shows to be too complicated I still whip out paper and draw it down), and Minis are coming out for the planned big encounters that I want to feel big. I think it's best of both worlds.

[@beladan]

I have aphantasia, and TotM is reduced for me to letting the DM have me wherever he wants me and all I do is roll a number against a different number. There is zero concept of the space and everyone's position in it. Back in the grognard days, that made me need to map the dungeon on grid paper as we explored. But a few swooshes on a battlemap and a mini or three brings things much more alive for me.

[@spacemanx9595]

Same I also have Aphantasia.

[@annaclark5196]

Aphanatasia gang 🤘

[@64bitrobot]

Aphantasia gang

[@GinnyDi]

That combat sound paaaaiinful. Hope you're able to use maps and minis more regularly now 😊

[@clay4603]

*cracks fingers* Alright Google, I'm back. Yes, I know it's the fifth time today.

[@Cirrec]

When people talk about Theater of the Mind, I feel they sometimes talk past each other. Yes, Theater of the Mind has many advantages... if you either use D&D's rules completely differently from the majority or if you're playing a much simpler game. When we played Vampire the Masquerade, we never needed to pull out maps and minis, because combat is basically choosing someone you wanna have a roll off against and choosing if you add powers to that. Even in a very crunchy old-school game that we played, Cyberpunk 2020, we didn't always need to pull out the battle map because every shot could end the firefight, so combats were quick enough that we didn't get confused. I mean, best example: Dimension 20 never pulls out battle maps during their Kids on Bikes+ seasons, even when there's a fight.

[@sienna7241]

Even back when my group was new to DND and definitely not interested in spending money on minis and maps, we just used a sheet of printer paper with some general features drawn in pencil and used extra dice to represent our players. In a way you could say it was kinda theater of the mind because nothing except physical space was represented on the table, but we still wanted to be able to see where people were supposed to be. But with a bare bones representation your mind had free reign to imagine everything else :)

[@tntori5079]

For my in-person games I 100% this. It's a good comprimise between still using your imagination and yet having that all on the same page factor. We do this alot. Also becuase we can have any monster andy terrain anytime. Nothing specific.

[@GinnyDi]

Love this!! It's a great answer to a map when you don't have the money or time to invest in fancy maps or minis. Plus it gives all the players a chance to imagine it a bit differently 😊

[@barneyatkinson-saul9881]

My first games were on a giant whiteboard, and I loved it. There’s something neat about crowding over a terrain piece imo though.

[@ogrejehosephatt37]

This is a large part of the reason why I prefer barebones maps. I really only want he maps to communicate position, and maybe a feature that makes the room identifiable among all the other white rectangles. I feel like high-detail maps are too distracting, and I personally find it frustrating when they add details that I don't want to exist in my game, which causes players to make incorrect assumptions. Dungeon Scrawl got a mention in this video and it's great.

[@maddinar6727]

And! Maps can also be free. When we started 7 years ago we literally just used gridded sheets of paper and small pieces of paper with our characters' initials on it. Worked like a charm. 😊

[@mikececconi2677]

I enjoy playing in groups where the little "random encounters" or "crap the party started that the DM didn't think was going to be combat" are theater of the mind and the big "planned" combats the DM is gonna get us to one way or the other are minis on maps. Huge battles with lots of moving parts suuuuuuck in theater of the mind, but little close-quarter skirmishes can work in our little monkey brains. At least this is how it has worked most of the time with the tables I've played at.

[@knightoflodain3013]

That's how we do it as well. Sometimes you need a fork and sometimes you need a spoon.

[@jako_ronin]

I play a hybrid. I use miniatures and maps to hint at positions, but they're all abstract and not absolute. This has been working wonderfully.

[@EriRosi]

How has it been working? Do players like it?

[@jako_ronin]

@EriRosi yeah, actually everyone prefers it like that. Removes annoying limitations that like one space apart can create. I just keep things reasonable. Combat also speeds up, and all works super well.

[@goodeveningtalos]

I appreciate the simplicity and versatility of theatre of the mind, but asking your DM "How many of the bad guys are in a 20 ft radius sphere" and them deciding it's only fair that you can't fireball more than half the enemies is far less enjoyable than your DM realizing as they see the glint in your eyes that they have messed up and put 100% of the enemies in a straight line the first fight after you picked up Lightning Bolt 😈

[@GinnyDi]

ex 👏 act 👏 ly 👏

[@Zarsla]

This too

[@Slanse]

Agreed, it feels to me like DnD as way to many Aoe or distance specifique thing for TOM to realy feel "fair". But in basicaly any other system where AOE are not as prevalent i'm TOM all the way. Unless it's absolutly critical, i'm not spending time and money when "they are sparcely grouped, 10 meter from you" will do perfectly fine for our purpose

[@robertnixon1557]

wait are you telling me that sometimes people make mistakes and group up for a nuke? nooooooo... surely not.... why woudl they ever do that?

[@jgostling]

If your DM puts a bunch of enemies in a line just after you pick up lightning bolt, they haven't messed up. They are a DM to be cherished!

[@benjamindebo9283]

Depends on the campaign, I'm the DM of a campaign where I upload Inkarnate maps to Magma. I'm also a player in a campaign that uses a lot of minis, and a player in a text campaign entirely on discord.

[@ConflictedSwitch]

I don't mind TotM when it's just RPing with NPCs and the party. But when it comes to battle, I'm a strategist, and I need to see the layout.

[@GinnyDi]

The strategy is a HUGE part of combat for me. And there's nothing more frustrating than having to ask the DM a million questions at the start of my turn before I can make any strategy decisions 😅

[@samuelniesen8929]

For me, take the strategist feeling, then add in the inability to actually visualize things with the mind's eye. I can only do Theater of the mind for encounters where there are no real decisions to be made, just bonk.

[@wrongeden3420]

​@@samuelniesen8929 yea small fights, bar brawl, or the like. Instead of pulling out a map for a 5 minute cat fight, theater of the mind does well enough. But for half session skirmishes I like maps, rather I like to craft terrain for thematic events.

[@intergalactic92]

Who doesn’t use theatre of the mind for random roleplay in a town with NPCs?

[@joshualocke2821]

100% this! My group has done a few TotM fights- smaller skirmishes and all- but the thing I enjoy the most is the tactical combat aspect of the game, and though I can visualize well enough, I still prefer maps and tokens. I dunno, something about it makes it more physical, tactile, more engaging for me.

[@rashkavar]

I play exclusively online (it's what I get for being inducted into the hobby by a bunch of Brits while being in British Columbia, 8 hours away by time zone), and one of my favourite setups I've seen for mixing the immersion of vivid imagination with the practicality of maps and minis (err, tokens) is a literal grassy field. Any unplanned fight was just on this one scene the DM had prepared that was just open terrain with nice, pale green, unbusy grass texture on it. If we were in a forest or cave or whatever, he'd just draw boxes and circles on the map, showing where the obstacles were. He'd put whatever we were fighting on one side of the map, us on the other, decide if we were starting at 60 feet, 30 feet or up close and personal based on the situation leading up to the fight, and we'd have at it. These fights were rarely in a bland grassy field, but...we got all the positioning options and the 3 ADHD players present could, y'know, see where things were, and yet we could still imagine this epic and dramatic cavern or whatever it was we were in.

[@RobertPatrician]

I had a game go from tabletop to "theater of the mind" when the DM's best friend joined the game and insisted we get rid of the combat grid. Where was his character always incombat? "Just close enough to attack, too far be reached by the enemies in one turn."

[@GinnyDi]

Ugh! That sounds super frustrating. You're right, having the tabletop map really helps avoid things like this.

[@McAllisterSellsFlorida]

Loved the reference to Alice’s restaurant. I play it every year. I’ve actually seen Arlo Guthrie several times.

[@VinceValentine]

"Oops, every enemy now has a longbow or the Spell Sniper feat. They can reach you, no worries."

[@kennethmackay3269]

I've played with people like that - they're out of sight at the far end of the corridor when whoever's scouting ahead has to open a door into a room that might contain enemies, but somehow close enough to barge the scout out of the way and grab the best of whatever treasure they find...!

[@Richinnameonly]

I don't see how maps are any better. If you can see the exact terrain you can game it too.

[@sanmerci]

I play both ToTM and M&M (Maps and Minis-also good for Eat What You Kill), but the whole discussion of playing with maps reminded me of one of my favorite quotes about military conflicts: "Never mistake the map for the territory." Maps are, necessarily (and as you pointed out,) imperfect, and players can exercise their imaginations in exploring the imperfections of the mapped terrain just as they can in exploring the ToTM.

[@kaseyw13]

Still have my copy of that DMG! 😆 We played a sort of hybrid version of both sides back in '82: encounters were drawn on square / hex paper, depending if we were inside or out, and we - as players - took turns to draw the maps as described. No fudging of distances or results by the DM (we all took turns) and we trusted each other as we were all mates, sharing a love of a game few people in the UK even knew existed. And minis were damned expensive!

[@birbsdigital]

Im using screenshots of a digital map that I made. This is for 2 reasons. 1: I love mapping. That map was the main reason I had the motivation to actually finish making the module. 2: There is 7 people that want to be in my game. My ADHD brain is not going to remember the positions of more than 3 characters, so there is no way I'm going to remember like 10.

[@birbsdigital]

I also have partial aphantasia. Like if u ask me to imagine an apple its just a red circle with some green. If I have to imagine anything else at the same time as the apple its just a vague location of red.

[@kathk]

The best part about minis is using candy for the bad guys/monsters - we use either Starburst or mini Reese's cups, since they fit perfectly on the grid. Whoever gets the kill gets the candy.

[@tntori5079]

Oh I'm stealing that! That sounds awesome!

[@seanthebean99]

We use M&Ms, it works well for hoard encounters

[@tntori5079]

@seanthebean99 and differently colored for HP tracking.. . . Brilliant! Why have I never heard of this 😅

[@GinnyDi]

Great idea!! Plus if your table is anything like mine, there are always plenty of snacks lying around 😂

[@peek_yew9369]

If I ever do irl games I'm doing this LOL

[@konradwright7725]

Take a creative approach to maps. A circle with bigger circle encapsulating it then the outer circle is in 4 quadrants. Inner circle is “in the thick of it” everyone is within melee range in the circle. Outer quadrants are just different areas of the map and are considered out of melee range. Unless you’re in the same quadrant. Let’s use this example for castle battlegrounds. • Center: Courtyard, plenty of open space. • Q1: The castle wall, great for shoving people off of. Has some armorments. • Q2: The castle’s entrance, has a draw bridge and a moat. Entrance can be opened or closed from Q1 • Q3: The garden, a lot of half cover and great hiding bushes for rogues • Q4: Main Entrance to Castle, great for if you’re charging into the castle. Quick and dirty rule for Q’s, have an entrance/exit and 2 side details. Players can make up whatever would make sense to find in the area they inhabit. Don’t have to find out pesky tiles for ranges and movement, if it’s a range attack it can target an adjacent section. You can move to an additional section with the dash action. Throw in some random effects on a section like the castle courtyard is muddy so dashing may cause you to lose your footing and fall prone. EDIT: I’m not chronically online or have played anything but 5E, I thought I was original 🥲

[@RollForTuraco]

That's what I use, zoned circular terrain or Ultimate Dungeon Terrain as coined by PDM. I mix and match with board maps , UDT , and make shift tile boards.

[@trise2033]

So Edge of the Empire combat.

[@RollForTuraco]

@@trise2033 more like Deathbringer

[@erina_lessthan3]

After one important TotM combat where distances mattered a lot, and me and other players were constantly confused how far away we actually were from the enemy, I just decided to draw maps for the future encounters that happen in the wilderness. They are not the greatest, but they help with actually seeing the distances, and I try my best to include some neat features that maybe will play a role, or at least make the place look more alive. It also helps that our group just so happens to be ambushed right as the session ends ^^. I love our DM

[@EzaleaGraves]

A while ago my table fought a flock of griffens TotM, and half of us could fly as well. It went about as slow as you would imagine.

[@Klyxtor97]

Even with Hyperphantasia, I need visual aids. They're like book marks in RP settings. Then battle maps just so I can make sure my players can't fireball the whole enemy group...

[@seanthebean99]

As a DM my preference for map+minis is less about clarity (although that is nice), it's more about the fact that I love presentation! I love painting minis, making scenery, sometimes between sessions I just stage combat encounters with minis and scenery because it's fun. I'm terrified that one day this will metastasize into becoming a model railroad guy....

[@GinnyDi]

I totally get that!! The crafting bug gets me super often too 😂

[@Endienindo]

@seanthebean99 Haha, that sounds awesome - do not resist, but embrace the railroad! 😅 And then run an amazing campaign centered only on that specific area to properly utilize it, of course! 😂

[@Laserwulf]

I think the next step is becoming a Warhammer guy. A full battlefield covered with fully painted armies and terrain is a thing of beauty!

[@seanthebean99]

Oh, the omnisaiah and I have met, I'm very familiar with the feeling

[@johnny88j9]

A flat monitor with the back taken off, a perspex overlay screen in a custom box connected to a laptop is the most amazing combo we used ever. We had dry marker and minis as well for more putting on top of the display.

[@annaclark5196]

As a D&D player with aphantasia, theater of the mind is my worst enemy. It is impossible for me to picture anything in my mind, let alone a complex battle.

[@TheBeardedDoom]

Ditto! Sadly in the theatre of my mind the lights aren't working.

[@gethriel]

​@@TheBeardedDoom at least that's great for your stealth rolls...

[@TheBeardedDoom]

@@gethriel Ha! I'm using that. There is always an upside somewhere.

[@Illjustbefamous]

Came to say this! So important!

[@fishnutter5219]

I'm a DM with Aphantasia, and my players love that there's a map for everything. Sure, things like campsite maps tend to look the same (the character rolling Survival is just really picky about where they camp). But one thing it means is they can never be sure if they're about to have an encounter or not based on whether there was a map prepared ahead of time. I also used to be a builder/coder for a MUD (text-based Multi User Dungeon) that required every noun in a room description have a matching 'ed' that a player could 'look' at ('look table' if the description mentioned a table), which has carried on into my map building for my games. Disclaimer - I work a night shift security job staring at a gate for ten hours, so I have a lot of free time to greeble up my maps and prepare notes ahead of the weekly session. I've never been in a theatre of the mind situation where it's felt like my DM is working with me, rather than just throwing roadblocks in the way of what I want to do. My turns usually devolve from describing what I want to do, to checking if what I want to do is possible before saying I'll do it, to running through a long checklist of questions to ensure what I need is available before I then ask if what I want to do is possible. I spent FORTY YEARS not knowing Aphantasia was a thing. I'd been assuming everyone was just wildly exaggerating when they talked about seeing things in their minds, and taking everything else they said with a grain of salt as a result. From my point of view I had constant proof that people were just making shit up.

[@chrisray7728]

I’ve had 5 parties disband because of this argument, people just want to use their minis, and as a DM, that puts making the maps my responsibility. But I’m awful at it and can not make one on the fly I save my life. I’ve tried, took me 3 days to finish it. Then it got tossed when I realized it wasn’t to scale. I can’t even use premades because I am a perfectionist and someone else’s vision will never be what I want.

[@barneyatkinson-saul9881]

Was that for a VTT? I tried a VTT once and I hated it. In person is infinitely better.

[@peterw2880]

Minis are rad as hell. And it’s so dope to actually see the map and brainstorm ways to use the environment

[@laughingpanda4395]

Yaaaaasssss! This is the way!

[@trident042]

My group is so weird, we always use minis, we often use battlemaps and/or Roll20 for digital stuff, but my peeps never want to use the environment unless I'm super explicit about what advantages or disadvantages it gives. Like, if I were my player I'd see trees and be like "high ground, better archery go!"

[@Sourinksoda]

Our party often uses paper minis! Little folded pieces of paper with art on one or two sides with some tape at the bottom to secure them Some of us spend along time on them, others its just a 10 minute job They really are great for getting a general idea of characters and positioning on maps Plus the quality is scaleable but all you need is a sheet of paper, sissors and something to fasten them together with

[@hqueso]

For the Savage Worlds- Super Heroes campaign I'm in, one of the players prints out 3d renders he makes of everyone's characters and key NPCs onto strips of stiff paper that fold into triangle cross section paper stands; he even rotates each image so that they face appropriately (back view, left-front and right front). In the games he runs, he takes great joy in making and printing massive maps with huge detail. Our current game takes place in the ruins under Hellgate Keep in the Realms, and he has multiple levels mapped out, mounted on boards and able to be laid out on the floor all at once to show the scope of the dungeon that is almost the entire campaign's setting (for all I know so far, the campaign will take place entirely in Hellgate Keep- the end game may be just getting out). We also enjoy (some of the group more than others) tactical play alongside the RP, so we love having a good map and minis/paper stand-ups to make it easier to play the board game part. That said, I've played at and enjoyed TotM games too. Visual aids are an extra, a tool to be used if it is useful and set aside if not. "It depends on your group" seems a bit of an overused copout, but it's true. FRPGs are more a set of tools for building the game you want than a hard-and-fast rules set.

[@AmishDemonHunter]

I absolutely hate commercials, but I truly enjoy watching your skits. For the record, I prefer maps and minis. I use minimalist game pieces because I don't want to get too wrapped up in the figures. I have attention issues.

[@strattonmeyer2870]

As a dungeon master who makes his own terrain, I'm acutely aware of what a task it can be to bring that experience to the table. It's not for everyone, and it takes up a lot of space! I'm a big fan of drawing out battle maps too, but sometimes you want something that looks a little more polished. I highly recommend Geek Tank Games' Tabletop Tokens for that reason. They're packs of plastic flat terrain that is easy to transport to game night and looks great on a grid! For miniatures on the go, I use either cardboard pawns (from Pathfinder or Kobold Press) or coloured d6s from a liar's dice set to easily identify enemies. They're a breeze to pack, and help keep things obvious for my players at the table. Thanks for the great video, Ginny!

[@fluffixation]

One of the best combat sessions I've ever been part of was a combination of both styles. We were in a cave with several branching tunnels coming off of it. One of the DMs thought he'd forgotten the battle grid, so the other DM held up his hand like, "Okay, so the main cave is my palm, that's where you are, that's where the mindflayer is. Each of my fingers are a tunnel where a minion is hiding. Roll initiative." When we figured out we had the grid after all, the DMs sketched it out for us. Kind of genius!

[@sawyerk641]

I used to always love really detailed maps, but lately I just got into OSE, and so far my girlfriend and I have been having a lot of fun with the old school style "the players draw the map as they go" type of play. I think it's been good for a few reasons; one, I think a simple grid display is the perfect middle ground between theatre of the mind and no theatre of the mind. One thing that surprised me is how much more I engaged with things when I couldn't see tables, chairs, if there were bookshelves in the room, etc. The players got more creative thinking about what to look for when there wasn't a visual representation of every little thing, and it let me as the GM have "you know what? yes, there is a painting on the wall" type moments that I think made things feel more immersive and tailored to their imagination and interests. The other thing that I really liked about the "the players draw the map as they go" is that it improved their comprehension tenfold, as it essentially forced them to take notes. I was shocked with how much less "what was that NPCs name again? where did we get that item?" type clarifications there were with just having them do the grid. I'm sure it depends on the table, but I'd recommend it! Especially if you have a group that really likes to engage; if you have one person who loves it, they can do it themselves, or you can assign roles (one person who does the outline, one person who writes down items, etc.), or you can switch off and take turns every session. All sorts of options! Oh, right--and the last reason I liked it too. Needless to say, much easier on the GM prep side of things too, which is always a plus :)

[@lightningvolt3150]

These sponsor segments are always really cool, they must require a lot of effort

[@MainlyHuman]

I've had a lot of success with dry-erase boards. It makes setup a lot quicker, sometimes I even just tell my players to draw the setting as we roleplay or while I'm figuring out the initiative order. It definitely doesn't look as pretty as a purpose-made map but it's good enough to make sure everyone's on the same page about the fight.

[@wolfsign9168]

I cant do ToTM I have no visual memory (aphantasia). I also dont think dnd combat is really made for ToTM it seems like homebrew - which ofc is fine but yeah i just cant imagine it working without a lot of rule changing/ignoring. As you said - there are loads of features that are specific and would just not really work in ToTM - Even an a4 paper and some random trash would enable them to use their skills.

[@nicolalanti449]

Hi Ginny :) As a fellow neurodivergent being (in my case autism, tho) playing without a visual aid would be impossible: too many distractions (I can't avoid listening to every sound and/or conversation in the same room i am in); getting easily bored, etc... That IF i would play a table top campaign, thing i don't do because requires... socialization, my oldest enemy o.o Btw I watched and really enjoyed the Mimic video (as i do with every "creation" video you post): I think your creativity is amazing

[@LadyVineXIII]

Hear me out, why not both? Map tiles, dry erase grids and generic buildings work great for combat and other more specific encounters. Especially when you can draw them out or arrange them quickly if needed. Large scale maps and theatre of the mind for less tactical moments and non-combat encounters. Such as wandering along a path or travelling through a small village. Even a large city. Map tiles are great for their versatility. Need a lake, toss down a lake tile or water tile. There will always be an element of imagining no matter what so why not incorporate both methods and give the DM the freedom to move fluidly while also creating visuals for those who need them.

[@tsstahl]

The 'all forms of play are on the table' approach is definitely my DMing preference (see what I did there, nyuck, nyuck). I'm even practicing with a drawing tablet for off the cuff encounters for my online sessions. I'm not quite ready for use in game play, but it has been a great help to loosely map soft encounters ahead of time.

[@Zalinth]

Lancer does this, and it's by far my favorite system.

[@ronin1837]

I, for once; totally agree with you! We use minis for player characters, and different coloured and sized soda caps for monsters, with arrows on it, so we can now where are they facing at the moment. The maps are usually hand drawn, on gridded paper. But still; if i get a chance for a big bossfight, i like to be creative. Last time, i made the white dragon's lair out of white polystyrene. The whole lair was on a floating iceberg, so i put a blue paper under the whole structure, so when the ice was broken by lair action, or so, i just teared chunks out of the polystyrene, and i've got icy blue water under it instantly... it was a blast! I loved my players reactions to it.

[@John-Dennehy]

Rise up fellow Aphants! As many people are starting to learn, not everyone has a minds eyes. For those of us with aphantasia, theatre of the mind is like watching a foreign film, but the screen is black, the sound is muted and the while you can see the subtitles, they are in the wrong language so you can only understand the numbers/maths parts. Using even a simple battle map gives us at least a slide show to help us contextualise what the subtitles are saying. While using a decent battle map and tokens, with audio etc is like a VHS version of the movie, while you guys are watching the blu ray. This may seem like hyperbole to many, but when a GM insists on TotM it feel a little like telling a wheelchair user that steps are clearly better than ramps...

[@iananelson8256]

I was literally coming to post that I have Aphantasia, so the theater in my mind is just a black room. When i was young and discovered AD&D, half of the fun for me was making dungeon maps since I didn't really have a group to play with. I still have some of the minis I bought in the 80s.

[@kotzpenner]

Legitimate question, not trying to sound hostile: Why do you, or other people with aphantasia, play DnD? I mean, imagination is a huge part of the game, battle or not. Wouldn't a traditional boardgame be better? Where everything is already printed etc? Doesn't even have to be a normal boring tabletop game, can also be something more complicated, like Gloomhaven.

[@Chameleonred5]

​@@kotzpennerBecause Aphantasia isn't a lack of imagination. It's an inability to visualize.

[@iananelson8256]

@@kotzpenner for the same reason I still enjoy reading books and listen to people tell stories. I don't need to see a picture in my head to still enjoy that. This is one of those things where people who don't have aphantasia seem to think our brains are somehow crippled. They just take different paths toward representing ideas. More abstract than concrete images. When it comes to combat a map is helpful to me because I enjoy playing tactically. Probably my one real handicap that I believe stems from my aphantasia is being directionally challenged since I can't visualize where I am. But I also know for a fact that not all aphants have that problem.

[@kotzpenner]

@@iananelson8256 Thanks for the reply!

[@tearsofthekingdom9062]

I usually use a grid, with each square being 5 feet. We use drawings with labels. The cardboard would just be squares, numbered one to the amount of PCs, and the monsters would be G1 for goblin one, or BBEG for the big bad, and we would have a picture for it, so people would know where it was, and what it looked like 10:16

[@gangrel7674]

I think it largely depends on the type of RPG you're playing as well. To use the glass cannon podcast as a good example. Shows like get in the trunk which are recent past or modern-day Cthulhu adventures (Delta Green), They used theater of the mine almost exclusively. However in their Pathfinder games, they're using maps and miniatures often on foundry VTT. Both are used to great effect in the RPG that they are being played in but perhaps wouldn't work well if flipped. As an old RPG DM I typically use both depending on the scenario.

[@OriginalityIsnt]

In my first campaign, my DM had a medium-sized whiteboard and a few dry-erase markers. For every combat scene, he'd do a (very) rough sketch of the area - normally only doors, walls, and major obstacles like pillars - and he'd include a basic scale. He'd then describe everything as if it were theatre of the mind All characters, PCs and NPCs both, would be represented by initials, and as combat progressed he'd erase and redraw the initials as characters moved and died. This split the difference: we all had a spatial reference for everything, but he didn't have to spend hours preparing maps. This was the technique I adopted when I started DMing for people as well, and it's served me pretty well, I think.

[@hankdriskill6153]

D&D coming from war-games is part of why I always use mats with it, the points in this are very valid regarding the rules' desire for precision. That said, I love theater of the mind for OTHER games that weren't made by a company called "Tactical Studies Rules". :)

[@egilbugge6797]

Exactly this. I burnt out on D&D because of the combat. It is such a huge part of it, but encounter design is a total crapshot. I find battlemaps to be the best alternative, but it required me to draw sketches and keeping tabs on so much. We switched to Blades in the Dark a few months ago, and my God, what a relief it has been to play a system where theatre of the mind works. And if something is unclear we don’t need to draw any exact map. Just a few lines and dots and the confusion is gone

[@comyuse9103]

oh yeah, DnD is a straight up war game with some skills tacked on. i don't get how people play it to begin with, let alone play it like a TTRPG.

[@HLR4th]

Thank you for showing the DMG I grew up with - it warmed my heart! I agree with all the map/mini points; they provide a shared frame of reference. They help mitigate potential unconscious bias by a DM. My challenge is to remember not every place needs a map. Theater of the mind is fine for shopping, most taverns, etc…I tend to get carried away with mapping. And yes… pick up your Oscar, you rolled a 20 on either deception or performance when making the Theater of the Mind argument, well done!

[@TalesWithHaggis]

I've always relied on TotM, but that's been more because of the game systems I run or play. As much as I would love miniatures and such, I prefer to only carry books and dice to a session. A tote bag can only hold so much. 😂

[@GinnyDi]

Yeah, I definitely restricted my discussion here JUST to D&D, since every system's needs are so different on this front!

[@TalesWithHaggis]

​@GinnyDi Very true. What I DO think is a big plus for any game is some sort of map. Not necessarily battle map, but one of the town, region, or even country your game is set in. That goes for any setting I've played.

[@robertkegler5688]

As a DM I’ve spiced it up and always allowed players to add environmental downed trees to an outdoor fight if narratively it fits. 9/10 it will anyway because it shows a connection to the moment and excitement. That battlemat flexibility is welcoming to those not hoping for final fantasy tactics before the preplanned snack break. Drawing out the skyline in front of the players is a shocking introduction if done with some preplanning, and often unlocks the theater of the mind folk at the table.

[@hypotheticalaxolotl]

I have a business selling minis, models, terrain, etc. (No I won't link it here. Obviously.) So maybe I'm a bit biased. But this feels an odd question. It's a game, there's no "should." I'd like to think we've collectively figured that out by now (I know, I know, we haven't - lookin' at you, Dark Souls players). Some people prefer physical models in physical space, others prefer digital, still others prefer entirely mental. Me, I like painting and making, so I'm entirely on the physical side (to the point I made it my literal business, after all). So any group I'm in, I'm usually bringing my own stuff and painting models for other players and the DM, or if I'm the DM. But that just means if a group wants to do it another way, that's alright - we're just not a great fit. We still CAN fit - I'm okay with digital, have issues with mental. But not meshing perfectly is also fine, it's not the end of the world.

[@AuthoritativeNewsNetwork]

As an aside, I would like to recommend the Dunder Moose Method for reading/learning AD&D. It is as flows: [The Dunder Moose Recommended Reading Order for AD&D] 1. Read the following from the Monster Manual. a. The opening Text b. A few entries c. The tables at the end (treasure and encounter) 2. Players Handbook Cover to cover, skipping the spell section for now. 3. Read the DMG with the PHB side by side (they line up nearly section for section). Making sure to read it with a notebook, jotting down the rules that surprise you surprise, initiative, cmbat, etc), or that you feel go against the way you think things should be played.

[@PunkJr]

As a player, I'm happy with D - All of the Above. However, as a 'forever DM,' I readily admit that I lean heavily on VTT since most of my games are played via the internet.

[@joeTheN]

Back in 1981 we started out with minis, a plexiglass sheet with a sheet of paper with a 1-inch grid under it, grease pencils and so on for combat. And graph paper to map out the dungeon at smaller scales. Maps added great fun. But, description was an absolute most for fun, too.

[@ultimatewager]

"What works for your players" took me about ten years to get, sadly. One of my players repeatedly asked for miniatures, so we let him do his thing. I'd describe the scene, he'd graph it out on paper, and we didn't step on each other. Fast forward several years and merging two groups, and the new group all struggled with my descriptions ... until that player translated it onto paper for them. Even then it took me a while to realise that different brains work differently.

[@Vercanya]

I have Aphantasia so even if my DM was describing an area with good detail, I'd still need it to be drawn on a battlemat for me to actually get what the area is like or where the enemies are.

[@ka5141]

As someone who started playing in '81, we didnt have anything like mnis, it all took place on maps we tried to draw to follow the DM and in our heads and, yes, I have a huge soft spot for that style. But I also paint minis for a living and love seeing minis representing everything!

[@emilymiller7827]

THANK YOU FOR THE ALICE'S RESTAURANT REFERENCE

[@GinnyDi]

A fellow Arlo Guthrie fan 🙌

[@emilymiller7827]

@GinnyDi my grandma lives in Stockbridge and a family tradition is going out to the town dump to confirm it is indeed closed

[@twwombat]

Also, RIP Alice on 21Nov2024.

[@garrickstangle5996]

You can get any mini you want, at Alice's Restaurant.

[@barneyatkinson-saul9881]

As a DM, one of the highlights of gameplay is plopping down some awesome centrepiece and hearing the squeals of delight at what they see. I’m currently working on a ship for session 1. For more impromptu gameplay, paizo made double sided dry erase mats with grass, dirt, stone tiles, and water. These work perfectly fine for anything I don’t have terrain for, and have served me well for years.

[@DellikkilleD]

ToM is fine for small encounters that resolve quickly. Other then that, if you care about consistency and keeping things balanced at all, you need a representation of locations.

[@ragnkja]

Especially if you have someone with ADHD and/or aphantasia at the table. Not everyone can hold a picture of the whole situation in their head and keep it updated and consistent.

[@genevalawrence801]

Something fun that my DM does - he puts maps and images on a monitor to aid with RP and introductions of NPCs and travel portions of the game, for those in the party who need concrete visuals in order to immerse in the story.

[@Madison1676]

I always wondered how the DM sees the map over the screen without standing up 😭

[@GinnyDi]

We need a line of DM screens for shorter people!

[@DellikkilleD]

how big is your screen?!?!?!

[@Madison1676]

@@DellikkilleD I don't have one but like I've seen ones that are like 11 inches tall 😭

[@DellikkilleD]

@@Madison1676 .. seeing over a 1 foot screen wouldnt be a problem.. unless you are under 5ft I guess....

[@RussellDuffer]

If you need to stand, you stand. (Besides, the DM is usually furthest from the map anyway.)

[@Johan-on-Youtube]

We used theater of the mind. We usually played while we were out on walks in the park/forest/etc. If things got confusing, the GM could stage the scene out. "You're here. The troll is where that tree is. Jane is over there where that rock is." The times we did find ourselves inside, we would make a quick model by using dice as minis on the nearest flat surface.

[@TheElectricCaveman]

My primary reason for changing to TotM years ago was how I hated stopping play for me to draw and assemble the entire encounter right when we hit the excitement of a fight starting; I only bother when I can prepare the map in advance for climactic fights I know will have a lot of moving parts. But my players still keep minis and tokens to track enemy numbers and the approximate position of everything themselves in the blank space in the center of the table. We've stumbled naturally into a mix of both that works really well for us, maybe this would be a good combination for others, too

[@daikatarokamegawa542]

Firmly in minis + map camp. As you correctly stated, you don't need to break the bank for this. A simple dry-erase plus some markers is typically enough; you can ask players to draw some terrain features and add the ones they ask if they're relevant. As for minis, I've seen people who etch MDF minis with whatever lineart you provide for a dollar or two. Those are actually pretty to the eye and more than enough for combat; you can also request 2D tokens for monsters.

[@thod-thod]

From the title I thought “Is there something wrong with it?!” It’s only from the video I realised that most people actually don’t use it and that kinda blew me away. It’s so easy, and WAY less prep to set up, and means that interacting with the environment is wayy more easy and fun to do!

[@theangrypacifist1568]

I think the game you're playing is the most important factor. I can't play D&D or Pathfinder without a map because the rules basically require a tactical map, but in almost every other TTRPG I run with no maps exclusively.

[@GinnyDi]

Yes! This is a great point. As a big D&D fan, I will always love maps but I can totally see why they're not necessary (or straight up immersion breaking) for other systems.

[@hatempire]

As a player, maps are very useful. As a soon-to-be DM (and AuDHD as well), I'll make a mix that doesn't feel overwhelming, but still needs time and strategy: theater of the mind for the average session and using grids and maps for huge moments and (mini) boss battles. It feels like "OMG he got the grid, sh*t will be serious now aaaaaaaaaaaa" to enhance the seriousness of certain events.

[@amandadeoliveira333]

at my table we use a mixture of both. most of the game is theatre of the mind but once we're in combat or solving a puzzle we bring out the grid and mini's so that we can place ourselves in a good position for what we're doing. we also use spell markers so we don't have to calculate aoe's or range. it's great

[@katherined]

I like doing Theater of the mind for RP settings, like going across a town, meeting important people and relaxing, and using maps for Dungeon Delving and Battles.

[@aggonzalezdc]

I do both. I mostly describe and run things as theatre of the mind, but I still use a map and minis (digitally atm) for everyone to be on the same page, and to still make good strategic choices. Those maps are usually just simple outlines to show where objects and buildings are, with no detail, I create the detail through theatre of the mind, but still give people the chance to play combat strategically.

[@TheShadowKarl]

I am for the hybrid system Professor DM uses with the circular ultimate dungeon terrain system and the three areas shown in the various rings and movement defined within those categories. It gives players something to work with but allows for a fair amount of theater of the mind defining a good portion of what is in the room beyond the few props placed on the terrain.

[@jkhazraji5638]

Hey! This is what I do too. Zone combat solved a lot of problems for my players who struggled with TotM because I find that combat moves 10000x faster when people aren't counting out squares like they're playing chess. Also it helps to use a rules-light system instead of whatever 5E has become.

[@mateungar3893]

Absolutely love the topic. At the table I play at, uses both, TotM is mostly used for roleplay or small unplaned encounters. When something goes according to plan (or plan B) than there will be maps and miniatures. Also, preptime is a factor, sometimes instead of maps, in the lack of that oddly specific location, we use some roundstones to mark the borders or obstacles on the battlemat.

[@tsifirakiehl4250]

I use theater of the mind solely because I run hybrid sessions with some players in person and some on webcam, and having to wrangle a battlemap and minis on top of that feels like a bit much for me.

[@mikewalsh875]

Ginny, your posts and ads lighten my heart. Thanks. A surface I can sketch on with my dry erase pens work great for my grandkids and me- with just a touch of the mind theatre to speed things up when needed.

[@MarcGacy]

Once during a convention game, I had the BBEG monologuing the heroes who were in a gladiatorial arena. I put his mini on the edge of the balcony for maximum taunting. Someone accidentally bumped the table and the mini fell in the arena. After a brief pause, “Well, I guess he lost his footing and fell in”. It was a great moment and made the fight more memorable as they had to take him on with no armor and gladiator weapons as opposed to their own gear, but it turned out to be epic!

[@haravikk]

I'm very much in the "usually uses maps" camp - the game was originally designed around battlemaps and it shows, plus visual aids are usually so much easier than (re-)explaining everything. I only use theatre of mind for very simply things. I used to use detailed maps, but now I prefer them basic - just enough to give layout, imagination for the rest.

[@lucideandre]

One thing I bough as minis that I think was a great investment is meeples. They’re the right size, they stand well, and I can paint details on them to indicate different characters. When we move to another campaign I can buy more if I wanna keep those as they are now, or let players have them as a memento. But if not I can clean them off, and paint something new on them

[@alitain8135]

When I use to play we did more of a hybrid, or both really. We used a grid map with miniatures but it was mainly for just the general room layout, maybe blocking off certain features like if the room had big stone pillars or something. But for the minute details it was mainly just left up to 'theater of the mind'. If someone had a clever idea that might rely on the environment that wasn't already mentioned but plausible, came down to asking the DM and may or may not be a roll. On the other side, we would sometimes use theater mode if it was a minor encounter and such. I like having the maps and minatures for the base layout and knowledge of locations because sometimes distance and such can make or break a plan or fun idea. Or cause arguments, so having the general layout solves enough of those problems. I definitely don't think I could do purely theater mode for an entire campaign.

[@paulfelix5849]

As a very 'old school' player (nearly 48 years), I've played lots of variants between pure theatre of the mind and hard core minis, maps, and math. The key is in mixing them up until you find your group's 'sweet spot'. Not quick nor easy but always worth the effort in the end.

[@MarvelOfRain]

Here is why I’ll never abandon battlemaps and miniatures. A few weeks ago, I rolled an encounter from a random table. After DMing weekly for over four years, I’ve handled countless encounters, but this one was designed to be brutally tough. I expected my players to run, sneak, or find a clever way to outwit a small swarm of gnolls. However, bad rolls and a refusal to retreat set the stage for something entirely unexpected. I grabbed a random battlemap of an abandoned city and a few miniatures to represent the gnolls. Had we been using theater of the mind, I suspect my players might have chosen to flee, especially with the way I’d described the situation. But as soon as they looked at the map, one of them spotted something crucial-a collapsed building that could be used as a chokepoint. What followed was one of the most intense battles we’ve ever had. From the first turn, the party was overwhelmed. I rolled multiple crits, and they missed attack after attack. Despite the odds, they held their ground in true "Battle of Thermopylae" fashion, using that random collapsed house to funnel the swarm and stave off annihilation. It was breathtaking to watch. A terrain feature I’d barely considered turned the tide of the battle. The map and minis brought the encounter to life in a way that theater of the mind simply couldn’t have replicated. Moments like this are why I stick with battlemaps and miniatures. Small details-a terrain feature, 5 feet of missing movement, or a caster stranded just 65 feet away-can profoundly shape a battle. For large-scale army conflicts or quick guard skirmishes, theater of the mind works well enough. But for everything else, there’s no substitute for the depth and creativity that a physical representation brings to the table.

[@thod-thod]

We used to play on maps but using rulers and trigonometry in the middle of the wizard's turn to determine how far their lightning bolt goes just to find out "Oh it wouldn't get all of them, should I cast... uhh.... ....." didn't do it for us

[@prplzbr]

I'm with Ginny on this. To use Brennan's example of the 5 guards, maybe you don't need a map for that. And if your players start an unexpected fight, then that fight probably doesn't matter too much to the over all story, so theatre of the mind to help things along is fine. But for you actual planned encounters, maps are needed in my opinion. Also, from a DM's perspective, I'm not always the best at giving colourful, detailed, immersive descriptions of environments. But i'm pretty good at using Inkarnate to make a nice looking detailed environment that players can see. Plus, as a player, I also have ADHD, and whilst i do ok at paying attention during combat, sometimes i do get distracted, and being able to look at a map to see where everything is really helps.

[@JohnR31415]

You can “mini” with paper and dice. Current table uses offcuts of wallpaper liner (no grids) and minis, but a previous table used dice as minis (particularly for “enemy” with 6 goblins they’d be D6 (1-6), and the few single other items will be d4s. Sometimes different colours of d6 for big battles.

[@Nariasan]

8:25 Marco Polo... those were villains who tried to kidnap my character last week! 😂 We killed Marco. Polo was arrested and is now alone in the world. 😅

[@Konstrukto_spons]

Alright, so a few thoughts: - what works for me is using theater of the mind when applicable, usually this is not in a combat situation - it is in a combat situation when I roll a random encounter, especially in online play it's harder to have a map at the ready in such situations - wargaming wasn't done on a grid, grids are also an optional rule

[@gergsmail01]

The first encounter i ever ran at my groups table was intended to be a simple totm encounter. But as I described the scene, I looked over my dm screen and saw that one of my players was actively sketching out a little battle map on graph paper... It was surprisingly accurate to what I'd pictured in my head too.... Ever since I've just planned on being able to provide at least a simple map whenever there's open spaces or more than a couple moving parts

[@zelenoye]

Pro-maps: 1) I often space out during descriptions, so have to always ask again and again, it's awkward 2) I love AOE spells and I can't plan for them when I don't see anything 3) I can prepare my moves in avance and be sure it will work, instead of waiting for my turn for clarification 4) I love crafting, maps and minis are pretty

[@Rayowag]

I (fellow ADHDer) personally love theater of the mind but that doesn't work well when there is a bigger battle of a lot of physical ground to be covered. Theater of the mind works best with smaller encounters and 180° type reveals where people already know the enemy is in range. I'd never want to play small encounters with a physical representation unless it's a detailed, revisited area of the campaign. But I'd also never want to enter a battle with more than 4 enemies in different places on an open field without a visual for it, any visual really, I'm fine if the enemies are represented by a chess figurine as long as I don't have to ask if I'm in range lmao

[@ACatwithNoHat]

I concluded long time ago me and Ginny share a brain when it comes to what we find funny on what not in DND ahah I think i never disagreed with her in the videos i saw... which i'm not saying for flattery: i say it cause this is often helpful to me. When advices about things i never tried come... im inevitabley more keen to follow hers, rather than other DMs that have a vision that differs from mine. It's full of DMs talking about how to challenge players, how to make it harder, how to make it stressing. It's a relief this channel. I have a wacky, free, creative but grounded approach to the game: prioritize enjoyment over challenge And here i often find cool ideas i like to try

[@Lemurion287]

While I will occasionally use ToM for very small combats, I use minis and a map for everything else. I have a ton of Pathfinder Pawns, which are great but hard to manage (I have over 3000), so most games I rely on colored discs with numbers on them. Now personally, I have no problem with visualizing combats after doing it for decades, but my daughter has aphantasia and I'm pretty sure a couple of the players in my other group do too. Insisting on ToM is gatekeeping, pure and simple.

[@KiithnarasAshaa]

I have this propensity to visualize stuff as I am experiencing it. When I am reading a book or having someone describe scenery or events to me, I reflexively start visualizing the scene in my mind without even thinking about doing so. It's to the point that I sometimes don't remember the words on the page or the spoken words of the person, but I do remember the visualized scenes and imagined dialogue. For me, therefore, Theatre of the Mind is perfectly acceptable. However, having visual references helps reduce some of that imagination load and enhances its output, providing a sort of imagination substrate to build off of, and it helps unify the experience for everyone. And there are certainly situations where RPG game abilities that specify areas and shapes and proximity will certainly be hindered by that lack of explicit visual reference.

[@yukaslash355]

I am a DM with ADHD and have been running a theater of the mind game over discord for years. It allows for player creativity but also allows me to improvise. A simple map in Paint is all we need to add visual details for combat.

[@wolfwood770]

So when I was dm'ing an online group of friends, I couldn't for the life of me learn how to use Roll20. I spent hours upon hours trying to figure out how it works, only to just draw a sketch of a map on a piece of paper, sent it to the group in fragments, and saying that it was theater of the mind with these sketches. It worked. All that being said, all the rest of the times when I'm not dming or playing in person, we have used maps and minis because they are just so much more convenient, especially for our group of 7

[@Malicious_Hero]

My party rotates between theater of the mind for small sudden combats. We will use a grid and dry erase for bigger combats. One of my friends has a bag of a ton of meeples for enemies, I have tons of monster minis we can use too. There have also been some combats in specific rooms in dungeons that we just draw the room for a reference, not to scale, since the combat likely wouldn't be long enough to do a full grid for it.