Good Omens, Queerbaiting, and Religion

Hi everyone! For this video I talk about Good Omens and whether or not I think the central relationship between Crowley and Aziraphale is queerbaiting, and then talk about religion and how the queer elements relate to that. Subscribe for more content like this coming soon!

[@elliart7432]

Good Omens is so INSANELY interesting and complex to me in the conversation of queer rep, because this is one of the first times we've seen an author not only reinvent his own work that he was already satisfied with and wanted to adapt faithfully, but also actively draws a distinction between the two versions. I've seen Gaiman on several occasions state in some manner that Book Good Omens and Show Good Omens are different canons, and one of those differences is whether or not the characters are in love. So if the show reads like a love story when the book doesn't, that's because _it literally is._ That was an intentional choice on Gaiman's part, hell not even necessarily thematically, but for PRACTICAL reasons. He's mentioned before that the book has much more of an ensemble structure, so in order to properly distinguish Aziraphale and Crowley as the main characters, the central plot had to heavily focus on their relationship. I CANNOT stress this to people who don't bother to do any background checking enough, _Neil Gaiman is NOT afraid to write queer characters._ He's done so multiple times, and at this point there's zero reason to believe he didn't do it again just because he chose to be a little pedantic about the labels.

[@JohnnytheYouKnowWhat]

"Nothing gets undercut, nobody dies, and they just get to live happily ever after." Cue the second season.....😭 But in all seriousness, season two was *gorgeously well done* , I am very satisfied by the whole six episodes, especially the ending. I await the third season with baited breath, I cannot LIVE without knowing what will happen in the end of the last season.

[@user-mt3ge3xh6l]

man, ep 6 made me feel things and it's sadness :/

[@xioxialt]

oh, i'd love if you made another part for season 2! if not, i definitely recommend at least watching it. you'd love it.

[@Alucard45000]

In my opinion, Good Omens is Not queer baiting, the main characters are an Angel and a Demon(which are both sexless) that love each other. They aren't exclusively male or female, they are just two beings that are in love and that is it. Nothing else have been promised, and Neil himself see the show as a love story, so that is what it is!

[@manicmath3557]

Gaiman said theyre not gay but didnt say theyre not queer. And i think i like that, my friend saw it as gaiman wanting to make it a queer love story and made it open to whatever the reader wants. Whether romantic, platonic or other queer attraction in between like Queerplatonic relationships that asexuals have. He believes in death of the author too I dont think Neil is too scared to show gay ppl. Hes a very good ally in rep, ofher books like American Gods and Sandman EXPLICITLY show gayness and its wonderful. Even before Good Omens. Especially his trans, twospirit, nonbinary, lesbian, gay, bisexual, and so much other explocit rep, its reasonable they can have a queer platonic ship like how asexuals do. He wrote it in the time of the aids crisis so its explicitly brave to make a queer story

[@elliart7432]

man we *desperately* need more queer stories who's themes center heavily around spirituality and religion in a way that is more nuanced than gayness and faith in a Venn diagram that looks like two non-overlapping circles. I think the point of both Bare and Good Omens (tv) is that there is no greater act of holiness than the love you hold for others. Essentially, if I can borrow from a completely different property, "to love another person is to see the face of God."

[@sheilagarrick]

YES!!!

[@letolethe3344]

Boy if you thought S1 was gay, watch season 2! I hope you'll make another interesting video--would love to hear your thoughts.

[@elliart7432]

this essay needs more views, I've spent FOREVER trying to find good omens video essays talking specifically about the queer themes and this was apparently just right here this whole time

[@HuntingViolets]

I just posted on Tumblr--not that I have much link, but maybe it'll get shared a bit from the tags.

[@ineffable_ezra]

So... Good Omens fandom... how we feeling now?

[@queerculturetheory7224]

Hi all! Wow this blew up! I really appreciate all the comments and likes. I am going to work on a Season 2 video to come out soon so keep an eye out for that!

[@bluelemoon]

ok this video is two years old but whatever I dont think Neil Gaiman, when referring to them sexless, equated sexuality to having sex. What I believe he was trying to say (which I acc love about the show), was that they were sexless as in genderless, they aren't human so you can't full label them with human sexualities, you can't call them straight up gay because well that would imply that theyre both men which theyre not, however he himself says they are however male presenting (mostly), so I'm fairly certain you can call them gay presenting in a way. But since you explicetly even see Crowley being female in the show twice which would again make them straight and what not, you just can't fully call them gay. In short, they aren't human which means you can't label them with human constructs of gender roles, however you can definitely call it a queer presenting relationship

[@caneleskitty356]

Yep! couldn't agree more this is what it's actually about

[@birdiejett3163]

I love this analysis! I just watched the show and was trying to organize my thoughts on the queer overtones of it. And yeah, I think it does a lot better than other shows that have that ambiguous element, mainly because the show doesn’t ever try to undercut or insult the idea of a relationship between the two. When one of the angels snidely refers to Crowley as Azi’s “boyfriend” he doesn’t deny it or even flinch. Compare that to shows like Sherlock where the idea of the two male leads being lovers is mocked constantly, or just . . . EVERYTHING in Supernatural. Yeah.

[@Natala00]

We need more videos from you. Including your take on season 2. This is so well written.

[@sosha20]

aza and crowley are like heavily coded male-presenting nonbinary (crowley is at least in show i've never read the book genderfluid coded) demiromantic asexuals in a queerplatonic relationship which is a commited exclusive loving relationship between a-spec folk that isn't necassarily romantic or sexual but it depends on the indivisuals involved tl:dr they're queer and in an a-spec relationship

[@letolethe3344]

I understood about 5 words of your comment. These are all new terms for lots of people. Maybe adding some definitions would make it clearer. And, yes, your reader could go look up 7 or 8 new words, but since presumably you're hoping people read and understand your comment, it seems logical that you'd help folks understand.

[@Temptation666]

@@letolethe3344 hmm i had no problem understanding it. Maybe you should go look it up. There is nothing strange or new in Sosha20 words

[@PatriseHenkel]

Welll, HEA until season 2.😢 wonderful essay, thank you. I hadn’t put my finger on why their connection makes me feel SO happy. It really is a love-conquers-all-obstacles tale. I survived Sherlock fandom, but the last season or two of that once brilliant show were awful- because they didn’t take their love seriously

[@chickwithbricks]

I finished the whole show so far ASAP when the season 2 ending was ruined for me. Been a book fan for years but thought the TV would be disappointing despite the cast. How wrong I was, and I'm now scanning around the internet for solace and support. This is one of the better videos I've seen on the topic. I'm subscribed and waiting for the update on season 2.

[@sheilagarrick]

I appreciate your thoughtful analysis. So much of what you shared about religious trauma and the types of "people" they are 13:00 onward really resonated with me. I also listened deeply to your explanation for the need for representation and positive outcomes. I want us, as a society, to get past the old binary of gay or straight, and move through fluidity to a place where people can love without labels. I want to see love in all its forms and a collective turning away from hate and hurtfulness (one can dream). I appreciate the main characters as sexless Angel and Demon who love each other. They are just two beings that are in love, doing their best. We try to box them into our individual understanding of love. I see Good Omens as an invitation to expand our thinking on multiple subjects. I look forward to your analysis of season 2.

[@IneffableHusbands-1990]

"they get their happy ending" *sobs in season 2*

[@ostsarahb7466]

I feel like people engaging in this debate are not using the same definition of gay. Gaiman is using the word in the sense of “exclusively homoromantic and homosexual man” whereas it sounds like others are using gay as an umbrella term. Neil Gaiman never denied that Crowley and Aziraphale are queer, in fact he said that he sees them as ace/aro and trans.

[@raindrops0905]

he never said he sees them as ace/aro either though. he said it was up to people to make their own headcanons but that they’re not technically gay males since they’re not humans. in any case it’s a love story, a romantic one.

[@letolethe3344]

Very insightful essay. Thanks for sharing your experience. It takes courage.

[@MarieNuchols]

This is such a helpful take on the book and Season 1 and I am so happy to have found your analysis. So much so, I immediately checked out your channel in hopes that you had followed up with your thoughts on Season 2. Any chance you will post something on that? Either way, thanks for throwing some light on the relationship and representation in Good Omens!

[@allchanges]

Really interesting video, thanks I'd love to hear what you thought about season 2, if you ever find the time.

[@Inspirit-gp4dp]

I agree with everything you said in this video. I think that this is the best video about this on KZbin, I wish it had more views.

[@frankiestein1713]

Omg please make a video for season 2 (only if you’d like. But definitely watch it pleaseee)

[@wormbag80]

Also stan Crowley with long hair

[@Kleineganz]

I loved this analysis and wish you had kept making videos like this (at least do a follow-up for Good Omens season 2?). I think I recognize your voice, so I know you haven't been as active on KZbin as you used to be (assuming you are who I think, in which case you have another channel).

[@Temptation666]

You should make more videos. You are great

[@m.c.a.2699]

Is it bait anymore???? Is it bait anymore, Sir Videographer, is it bait anymore??!?!?!!!?!!??-#+'(#( Edit: JUST finished your video! It never was, of course it never was..hahahahahhahahahahahahahhahahahahhhhhhhhhhhhhh

[@dianneschuman6328]

Read the book.

[@HuntingViolets]

I'm curious whether you've seen season two and what your thoughts are on that?

[@hustler212]

Deep analysis btw. 😊

[@crolmac]

Hi, thank you for this enlightening video. I love this show, and there a re a few reasons. One is the fun pocking of christian lore and habits, point of views. The other is the fact that we have a male friendship without the associated proper socially driven male type of friendship expession (you know, the bro codes and the testosterone driven behavior, the fear and shame etc..they are shameless!). Of course i got a lot of the cues, they were fun actually. And they managed this without the nail driving soft...or hard...porn scenes usually associated with gay love that the media uses, just to make sure that you got the message. I find that those scenes are usually useless, be them straight or gay, and oh so boring, and add nothing to the plot. Here it is pure joy. Plus all the other bonuses of the series, i am binge remembering scenes in my head during the boting moments in my job😂. Take care

[@wormbag80]

So underated

[@MikaTank-uk5nz]

They get to live happyly ever after. Two years later when the new season was published... 😢

[@millicent9235]

love the vid ❤❤

[@wormbag80]

😊😊😊