Gold vs Steel Nibs: The Same Price? - Q&A Slices

[@gutfinski]

The original point of a gold nib was corrosion resistance. Early steels were not stainless and would rust. Since only the tipping material (iridium, etc.) is in contact with the paper, the nib is basically a device to feed ink to the tip.

[@Gouletpens]

Yes, indeed! Steel is much more resilient these days. - Drew

[@ichirofakename]

However gold is MUCH cooler.

[@ichirofakename]

I find all nice pens reasonably comfortable, and I'm indifferent to filling mechanism. Assuming I prefer gold nibs, here's what it boils down to for me: is the steel-nibbed pen $100+ prettier than the gold-nibbed pen?

[@budthecyborg4575]

Most of the difference comes down to "Marketing". In Japan they still sell Gold Nib pens for about $80, the material costs have gone up in recent times but the raw material in a Gold nib is so little that it's still only worth a few dollars. New companies probably just don't want to bother with the hassle of adding Gold to the supply chain when there is almost no practical value.

[@tedscheckler1]

My first thought was scale. There are probably multiple times the number of popular Japanese gold nibbed pens (Pilot 74, Platinum 3776, etc) produced vs some of these smaller manufacturers. The larger pen producers at making them at scale. Also Pilot can sell 74’s at lower margins because they sell millions of G2’s.

[@vincentlake]

This is an excellent question that I’ve wondered myself. It’s hard for me to justify a $160+ steel nib pen when I could get a Vanishing Point at that price point. That all being said, I do love my Aero. Thanks for the insight Brian!

[@ericarevalo5005]

The simple fact is that the Japanese “Big 3” offer exceptional value for the money, moreso than the vast majority of German/Western brands. Especially when the vast majority of western “pen” makers just use branded off the shelf Jowo nibs.

[@brettsmith1655]

It depends on what you mean by value for your money. Japanese pens are usually cheap, injected moulded plastic that are bereft of any sense of style or fashion. They are simply a boring tool. I would rather spend up and get something that is more attractive and made of better materials.

[@NatiiixLP]

​@@brettsmith1655, You know that each of the major Japanese pen companies has a division for outrageously luxurious pens made out of, perhaps, the most premium materials imaginable? Montblanc's "precious resin" is a complete joke next to the materials and finishes utilized by the likes of Namiki, Nakaya, and even Wancher if we wander back into the territory of more affordable Japanese pens. Mind you, Wancher uses Jowo steel nibs, and so does TWSBI, and their steel nibs write better than the majority of German gold nibs that add upwards of $100 to a pen's price. No idea what you're talking about here because the build quality of Japanese pens is virtually always superior to any western pen in its respective price category.

[@ericarevalo5005]

@@brettsmith1655 “Cheap injection molded plastic”, you mean like Montblanc pens? Which are literally made of injection molded PMMA marketed as “precious resin”? Besides perhaps the Lamy2000, there doesn’t even exist a western made pen in the sub $200 category which offers a gold nib, much less in the large array of in house unique point sizes the Japanese pens offer (zoom, soft, music, FA, etc.).

[@mehmethac7168]

@ none of those limited edition montblanc pens are actually meant to be used often, unless you are happy with an overdecorated pen and a metal grip that makes the writing experience miserable, whereas urushi lacquer pens of Nakaya and Namiki are not only better built because of the material but can also be used on a daily basis by an entire generation. So if you want to spend thousands of dollars on a limited edition MB or a pen from an italian company that buys its nibs from some other manufacturer do it and you will have a nice decoration in your home, but dont ever expect them to compete with a Maki-e Nakaya. That pen is just a piece of art.

[@CatnamedMittens]

@@brettsmith1655 utter nonsense.

[@rygregory]

As a calligrapher and someone who primarily cares more about the nib and how it feels to write with and only marginally care about how the pen body looks, I will say that aside from cost of materials and certain properties of each material, there isn’t much of a difference with how “good” each type is. A well made nib is a well made nib. There are certain companies though where a gold nib is the only way to go because it’s clear that they produce those ones with more attention to detail probably because it’s more profitable. However, if you buy a Japanese pen at any price point and with any nib, you’re gonna get an excellent pen.

[@davidmolloy126]

My Edison Menlo's nib is a medium italic in steel and the fit and finish of the pen and nib are exquisite. The nib is the smoothest that I have ever used, including gold nibs from Pelikan. An Pelikan M 400 with a gold nib in England at the moment is £192.00 AVG, with the Edison Menlo with a steel nib running at £185.00. It's much more than the nib as the Menlo is a superbly built pen as is the Pelikan, with both pens having their merits and I love them both! It's really all down to what you want it for and what you like. Thanks for a great video.

[@45scienceproject]

Oh! You Q&A sliced my question. Like a month ago! Loved the new information offered up here. I learned a lot from the response here.

[@Gouletpens]

Thanks again! This is always a popular topic, so we thought it'd be good to make the discussion more accessible. We appreciate the prompt! - Drew

[@robaphone251]

I struggled with purchasing a diplomat aero for the same reason the original question. I've had mine now for a little over a year and it's always inked. Even unseating my Lamy 2k for a few months as my favorite pen. The Aero is a seriously amazing pen.

[@Jmm9910]

I find the L2K to be seriously overrated, in my own experience

[@S.A.S.H.]

I have a Lamy All Star with an extra fine that was smoothed/tuned for me by a local brick and mortar pen shop. It is without question the smoothest writing fountain pen, and one of the smoothest writing pens of any kind, I have ever used. On the Black n' Red a4 poly double ring bound note books I used for journals it has almost no drag and you feel no paper texture while writing. When he handed it back to me and I test scribbled, I was astonished. I was so impressed I ordered an LX from Goulet and a tuning kit. And the Black Cherry ink to go with it. Speaking of Goulet, my second best writing nib is a #5 Goulet EF installed on a Faber Castell Loom. It's bone stock and has no tuning at all...yet. Superb writing nib, smooth and fast with only the tiniest amount of texture feedback while writing in my Black n' Reds. Thanks to your whole crew for making my return to fountain pens such a wonderful adventure, and to you two for these videos that have been instrumental in my new found understanding of how these marvelous inventions work, and how to tune them to your needs and desires.

[@joelstatosky1817]

This also brings something else up, there have been several times where I prefer a steel nib pen over a gold nib.

[@MrJungleman1]

A great moot point. Glad you brought it up. It depends on what buttons a pen pushes for you. For instance, pens on my radar right now are Platinum Century 3776 Chartres Blue (gold nib) and Pelikan Brown Marbled M200 (steel nib). While I feel drawn to the beautiful blue gold nib Platinum, Pelikan brown marbled has its allure with nice brown and caramel tones. Both are great pens, but for some, Pelikan stands out more in terms of mere design alone. However, Platinum 3776 does have the design that doesn’t go out of style and is great for almost every setting. At the end of the day, it’s a tough choice and a personal one. Cheers!

[@52536626]

Dang! Now I’m gonna have to check out that Diplomat. I have a range of gold, steel, and palladium nib pens. So many factors affect the writing experience, such as ink and paper, that I find it enjoyable to write with each of them at any given time.

[@sistergoldenhair0727]

You must! The diplomat aero is the best writing steel nib out there!

[@jamessalvatore7054]

Good explanation. I bought a parker 51 deluxe. fountain pen with an 18k gold nib in Fine size a month ago due to having a repair made to my fathers old parker 61. Upon attempting to find a store carrying such old repair parts I was given a 50 % discount by Parker due to being a customer for so long. Wonderful to use. Currently awaiting a Caran D´ache Ecridor Chevron gold plated fountain pen with a steel nib that has a beautififully & uniquely designed body alongside a free engraving. Probably my favorite part of it is the lovely metallic click it makes upon sliding the cap on. Minus a lucky discount, the prices were around the same, approximately 300 USD, in my country anyway, but each pen has their own unique features, fun tiny gimics and overall caterings to the individual preference. Plus, got a free engraving on the Caran D´ache pen which is always nice. I was leaning towards getting my second higher priced pen with a 14-18 karat nib as I did my first, but seeing how the writing experience remains largely the same ( to my knowledge) having invested in a steel nib alongside all these wonderful details coming with it I feel quite excited to try it. Thank you for the video :)

[@AdamGoodson]

Good Answer. I have a gold nib Visconti and have a smoother writing experience with my TWSBI 580. Go figure. Sometimes life is like that. Smooth is smooth and shiny is shiny. Love all of my Goulet Pens!

[@gutfinski]

Just did a little math...a 14K medium nib from my Sailor 1911S weighs 0.3 gram. 14K is 58.3% gold giving gold content of 0.17 gram which is 0.0056 of a Troy ounce. Spot price of gold this morning Is $1,768 per fine Troy ounce. The value of gold in the nib is $9.83.

[@robertoh.20]

When you buy a car, do you just pay the price of the metal and plastics a and oils used in the car?

[@bennygn9642]

@@robertoh.20 yes plus the leather seat. just kidding

[@cmac1100]

More than in a steel nib!

[@stevenconnolly7907]

Thanks for posting this. I was thinking of using these pens as an inflation hedge. Not enough gold. 🖍️

[@ichirofakename]

Interesting. Can you find a price for 14k gold? I doubt pen makers smelt their own alloys. But assuming it isn't astronomically higher, the question remains what are you buying with the remaining $90 premium for a gold nib. Possibilities: 1. Maybe it's more expensive to work the gold. 2. Maybe gold nibs are worked to a higher standard for some reason. 3. Maybe more QA is performed on gold. 4. Maybe economies of scale are lower on gold. 5. Maybe the cachet of gold allows for a greater profit margin. What else?

[@karidru5272]

I suspect too what might have happened is there are hundred dollar gold nib Sailors floating around the internet at times. I have questions and haven't dared buy one. Sailor's pricing is interesting to me in the first place because it seems like they tend higher than other things that are comparable at absolutely every level. But then I bought one, a steel nib procolor because the finish was pretty, and I stopped questioning. The thing is just made so freaking well. Add to that the fact that they are just nice looking and I get it now.

[@DeanStubbs14]

They may only be steel for the most part but the Diplomat nibs are by far the best off the shelf nibs money can buy without question

[@Gouletpens]

I've always had great experiences with them as well! - Drew

[@sistergoldenhair0727]

Truth!

[@krishnadasnair8765]

This was a question in my mind too thanks for answering! :-D

[@littletweeter1327]

I’ve wondered why some pelikan steel nibs are so expensive

[@houghwhite411]

IMO the price you pay on "expensive steel nib pen" most of the time is the price of QC, craftmanship, history and prestige. Material is just one of the puzzle piece. Though nobody forces anyone to buy the "expensive steel nib pen"

[@martinfox2244]

Totally agree. If a certain brand strikes your fancy for whatever reason, get it. Price is not the only criteria.

[@ichirofakename]

@@martinfox2244 Yes. However it still is useful to ask yourself: what am I getting for the extra $100?

[@theKashConnoisseur]

I'll pay for QC and craftsmanship but prestige and history aren't worth the ink used to write the words. Doesn't make sense to charge the end user for the sake of "the prestige of owning our pen". If Noodler's can make me a 1950s vintage inspired design that's easy to maintain and repair, with a handmade ebonite feed, durable resin body, vintage flex nib, and wide compatibility with hundreds of other vintage and modern nibs, ranging in price from FREE to $50..... no excuses.

[@ichirofakename]

@@theKashConnoisseur Noodler's is the perfect example. Nathan can put an ebonite feed on a $16 pen, whereas Visconti can't be bothered to on a $700 pen. On the other hand, if you can look in the mirror and say to yourself "this lava pen gives me $700 worth of happiness", then be my guest. Everybody should be happy.

[@theKashConnoisseur]

@@ichirofakename Indeed! Joy and satisfaction are worth it every time.

[@laoc5270]

I have hundreds of gold nib pens and a few dozen steel nib pens, of which two are the Diplomat Aero. I have a broad nib Blue Aero and a medium nib Orange one. They are my absolute favorite steel nib pens and in my top 20 overall from my entire collection. I am looking to purchase a 3rd Aero in steel nib Fine today and searched out KZbin reviews since it has been about 4 years since I’ve purchased those two Aero pens. I need a new Some-Lines-A-Day journal and it’s a great excuse for me to pick up another Aero! I’m going to get the Green one tonight with a Fine nib that has a slightly different outside design element. More vertical modern green stripes on a black barrel. Oh … and a new journal 😁

[@agnesrambling]

This is like a battle of Visconti van Gogh vs pro gear 21k gold. At the retailer where I often get my pen, both are offered about the same price. Both are considered luxury model, but 1 have nib qc issue. Dilemma isn't it? Sometimes it comes down to material of the pen or the material of the nib.

[@am_ma]

How much does the golden nib wt in grams ? May be that what it make it more valuable the amount of gold in it . Does anybody try to weight those nibs to reference them against the gold value in the market? By the way are they all gold single sheet (leave the tip aside because it is mostly Iredium)?

[@agnesrambling]

This is like a battle of Visconti van Gogh vs pro gear 21k gold. At the retailer where I often get my pen, both are offered about the same price. Both are considered luxury model, but 1 have nib qc issue. Dilemma isn't it?

[@mrk131324]

Why are there no more titanium nib pens? Whenever I write with a titanium nib (e.g. from Omas) it‘s perfect.

[@justsomesaltyboi8716]

the nice pen on my radar is the pilot custom 823 with it's resin body, but i would not mind a durable travel gold nib pen. it seeems that the custom 74 is just cheaply made body, whereas the 823 is made out of resin. i still get a little paranoid about the durability of certain pens that have large capacity. im still meandering about and browsing my options online but so far for the money, im looking at durability with the gold nib. i want to go out of the house with it and have it be looking nice and able to hold it's own.

[@ericarevalo5005]

What do you think “resin” is? They’re both literally just injection molded PMMA plastic. Same as Sailor, Montblanc, etc. Resin is just a marketing term companies use so you don’t feel so bad about buying what amounts to plastic.

[@justsomesaltyboi8716]

@@ericarevalo5005 thought it came from trees pardon me...

[@theKashConnoisseur]

It seems like for pens, resin typically refers to organically derived compounds that are generally softer, more chemically soluble, and less durable than the polycarbonate or acrylic plastics we often see in pens. Resins tend to be more expensive due to their being naturally derived, whereas plastics can be created entirely from petrochemical feedstocks.

[@hetul784]

Another thing that often goes unnoticed is that modern day gold nibs and quality steel nibs dont really have that huge of a disparity. Often it is a pretty similar experince if you took a standard sailor 14k gold nib and a diplomat aero and didnt know the nib material, the writing experince will be faitly similar because modern gold nibs are stiffer for good reason and I have steel nibs that has springiness. Of course the Gold has a different texture whili writing but its not a different world and its more about tuning. I have some steel nibs that write better than some of my Gold nibs, and not even more expensive steel nibs or an entry level gold nib

[@wompus_king]

I’m deciding among a Lamy 2k, Pilot N95, and Kaweco Supra. Halp.

[@Gouletpens]

2000 for sure! Easy pick. - Drew

[@cmac1100]

@@Gouletpens I concur

[@ichirofakename]

Well the Pilot has a plastic grip while the other two have metal. The Supra has a steel nib. The 2k has the best reputation. They are wildly different looking, presumably you prefer one.

[@nicojar]

Do you mean "Pilot e95S" ? if so, E95S > Lamy 2k, by far. Better sensation, better "cushioning", and way classier :) Lamy 2k = nice design, but you simply can't compare a Japanese gold nib with a German gold nib. Pilot really polish and shape their nibs better than any other company. They cut costs on the tube material (plastic) but the writing pleasure is way above their competitors. Kaweco Supra = I've got the kaweco liliput in brass, it's pretty much the same pen in shorter. Same nib. Stiff. Amazing as a pocket pen. A bit more "feminine", some would say, but I don't necessarily agree, though I see what they mean (it's thinner) and can imagine it matters to some. Pilot e95S writes better, by quite a good margin. Kaweco are good and fancy and reliable, for sure. I've had a few Parker, Waterman, Lamy, Kaweco & Pilot. My favourites are the Pilot e95S and the Pilot Falcon (fantastic). Discrete and amazing sensations. I love my two Kaweco liliput too, but for other reasons. One is a gift. It has a sheathe, "tailor made" by my neighborhood's tanner. It's just my pocket pen. It's practical, it's beautiful, it goes with my small notebook, it's my "adventure pen" ^^ The Pilot Falcon is my everyday writing pen, my marathon runner. Sometimes the e95S. Lamy... they're reliable, they look sharp, but the nib just isn't the same level than the Pilot at a comparable price. For me, a lamy is a good cheap pen, and looks good with a suit. But I prefer writing than looking sharp in a suit. ^^

[@ichirofakename]

@@nicojar Perhaps when Steven states "Pilot N95" the pen he is referring to is the PILOT N95.

[@tmendoza6]

so difficult I still like the way my 20.00 Pilot writes I am learning that more money does not mean more enjoyable

[@mindpoacher3180]

Mr. Bumsfelt here...I find this video so fascinating and baffling!!! What got me into fountain pens is when I taught myself to write in spencerian script.( Thats for another post) But that's when I went bat shit crazy for the vintage flex pens. For me it's all about what the pen has left on the paper. When I hear you guys talking about new nibs for 2 to 3 hundred dollars..I'm sorry what!!??! I realize I'm probably in a handful of people who are all about the performance of the flex of the nib. But I personally can't justify buying a pen for 60 dollars or more that when you see its results left on the pages you're unable to tell if it is 60 dollar pen or a 300dollar pen. But I do enjoy listening to you guys. Please keep up the good work .....that is all....signing for Mr. Bumsfelt.

[@sistergoldenhair0727]

Where are you getting a genuine flex pen for $60???

[@mindpoacher3180]

@@sistergoldenhair0727 I shop around on EBay . I just recently picked up a no name vintage eyedropper that is absolutely gorgeous and has an amazing flex to it. I got it for $42.00

[@theKashConnoisseur]

@@sistergoldenhair0727 Pick any Noodler's flex pen. Nib creaper, Ahab, Konrad, hell even the Neponset or Triple Tail. Note, the last two technically have a 3 tined music nib but its really an amazing flexer. Can do from a fine line to a 2 mm river of ink with just a bit of pressure. And generally all for $50 or less.

[@sistergoldenhair0727]

@@theKashConnoisseur I have all those pens and none of them flex.

[@theKashConnoisseur]

@@sistergoldenhair0727 I have all of them too and they all flex.... As we speak I am creating 1 mm width lines of Black Swan Aus. Roses using a Nib Creaper Flex....

[@channelsixtynine069]

I only like demonstrator versions of fountain pens, they look odd with gold nibs. Since I'm left handed, a gold nib is not durable. I will end up destroying the nib, so gold is a waste of money from my perspective. A Lamy Safari will be the most expensive pen I'll ever use.

[@randomstuff625]

I bought 2 gold nib pen Pens with gold nib overrated pilor metro and e95s writes same smoothness

[@raghus8746]

2:17 - The actual answer starts from here. Please thank me and like this for saving 2 minutes in your life

[@kellysteele8339]

I bought the Sailor PG Slim Nebula as it looked lovely in pictures and had a gold nib. When it arrived I was really disappointed. It was a £40 pen body with £100 worth of gold nib. I ended up sending it back as I just couldn’t rationalise £140 on a cheap looking plasticky pen. I have a Jinhao that cost £15 and looked better than the Sailor. I know the Sailor was superior materials but it just looked cheap 🤷‍♀️

[@MrGyges]

Rip-off ! Brian wearing plain shirt without comical figures on it, that is !

[@scriptkeeper8243]

Because they're greedy lol....there is no other answer....

[@eminienina3256]

I dont agree, some pens are just grossly overpriced. My criteria for a pen choice starts with, Nib (material and writing quality), filling mechanism, uniqueness and reputation. I will never pay a high price for a steel nib pen. Never!!