Green Peter Kokanee Disaster: Killing Salmon to Save Salmon?

[@94smokercraft]

You are one of the only ones to mention the spawning native fish below the dams. Floating the river in the fall was so fun because of the hundreds of salmon on shallow gravel bars. The gravel bars got blown out this fall and probably killed off an entire year of native chinook.

[@mannymayer9250]

I’ve been fishing Green Peter for 40 years. I’m so disappointed my favorite Kokanee fishing lake is now dead. Will definitely put a lot of pressure on other Kokanee lakes here in Oregon. Wickiup reservoir in central Oregon used to have a great Kokanee, Brown Trout and Rainbow fishery but a decision to draw down that reservoir for a downstream frog has also killed off that fishery. I’m disappointed at these decisions.

[@buddymcclure6170]

I live in Sweet Home and fished Green Peter often, and I can tell you that there are a lot of residents who are pissed!

[@doamaker6674]

I agree I've lived outside of sweet home for over 20 something years it seems like the city was not really on the people's side until the county commissioners got involved. You would think because appeals happened to federal judges all the time that the city could have launched an appeal on our behalf.

[@twise95]

Thanks for your insight Tyler, been waiting to hear your thoughts on this. Really appreciate your willingness to explain the events from all sides and perspectives, which I think gets lost amongst the horrific fish kill (which by all means deserves to be in the spotlight). I have a friend who lives in the South Santiam valley who has had pollutants in their drinking water as a result of this draw down, just one of many consequences resulting from this. The irony of these high and mighty eco-extremist groups using all of their money and clout to sue for "fish saving legislation" only for it to have the exact opposite effect is just mind-numbing. God forbid they actually use their money to do something that makes a positive difference, instead of using the loophole in the system by suing for what only THEY want, not giving a damn about what the reality of their "environmentalism" translates to the real world. Pathetic, sad, tragic. And unless the state is able to enact legislation to block this from happening next year, it is only the beginning. Seeing what's happened (and continuing to happen) to some of the most historic, prolific, and iconic fisheries in the state of Oregon at the hands of these groups is truly dark.

[@mengkhang1037]

It's always clout, now they'll sue for the disaster and it becomes a never ending cycle. If it ain't broke don't fix it.

[@christiancherry1377]

Tyler, this is very troubling policy. Thanks for collectimg your ideas on this platform and putting voice to dissent. As a Springfield-based fly fisherman I have real issue with the turbidity downstream from all the dams. They should have anticipated this much better. They took the cheapest path and have jeopardized the fisheries and human health in one bad decision.

[@NorthweSteelheadJunkies]

Correction only WINTER steelhead are native to the entire Willamette Watershed.

[@tylerrandolph6193]

Albany here, i started kokanee fishing this past summer at green peter. (Guy with green/blue kayak with custom trolling motor in it) Your videos helped me learn a lot , which led me into salmon-salmon fishing and the sport of it all has given me a lot if healing from PTSD, so it mean a lot. Its a disaster, up and down stream. Yellow bottom is ruined due to the high flow through there and the whole santiam south fork is a mud pit. All the cut throat are dead as well. Willamatte is hurt well into Salem. This was a major air ball on the pesudo-biologists that did the cinsulting for the hearing committee. They were not even biologists! The phytoplankton that the kokes feed on can take a decade to reestablish as well. If there is a counter citizen suit, im more than willing to sign.

[@daviru02]

Sweet Home has started litigation from what our city leaders said. I haven't heard of any sign up/petition, yet. They just started refiling it on 12/15 and the water has gotten back to looking like the Mississippi. It was clearing up ever slightly, but maybe it takes time for that to clear up. Hopefully, it does

[@tylerrandolph6193]

@@daviru02 thanks for the heads up about the litigation. I've been following USGS for the duration and take the KLR up there to see/inspect/ go for the higher river natives to check health when the flows are lower. MP 19+, seems healthy (post rocky top) but that run normally drops like that every season. Cascadia run of the santiam is holding the left over survivors for the most part due to the high origination and the natal flow keeping the sediment out for the most part. I hope this doesn't increase the number of pike minnow in the system as they thrive in crap water and also, eat up to 1k/fry a week per fish.

[@Northwestfishingfanatics]

I agree with you 100%. Problem is, local governments, power companies that own and operate the hydroelectric dams blocking fish passage and environmental group hell bent of saving or better yet re-introducing "native" populations simply do not care about the Kokanee, fishing community or the economic impact. I see it every day and have for the past 50 years here at my house. Trucking fish upstream pass dams simply does not work. Tacoma Power has been transplanting Chinook, Coho Salmon and Steelhead to various locations upstream of the Mossyrock Dam on the Cowlitz River and its tributaries for 60 years and it hasn't done a damn thing to restore wild populations except appease people who think "Wild/Native" fish restoration is possible after 60+ years of introgression.

[@spiltmilt]

I wouldn't say trucking fish doesn't work. Look at the Baker Lake Sockeye fishery. Its doing extremely well and 100% of those fish are trucked.

[@Northwestfishingfanatics]

​@@spiltmiltBut don't Sockeyes' life cycles start and end in lakes whereas Chinook and Steelhead are rivers and streams right? I'm not trying to argue, you're the expert not me. I thought the drawdown was to protect Chinook and Steelhead. From what I have observed over 50 years of living 1/2 mile downriver from the Barrier Dam hatchery is that all the trucking of hundreds of thousand of Steelhead, Chinook and Coho has produced zero naturally spawning fish above the dams on this river. Am I wrong about that distinction between Sockeye and other species of Salmon or Steelhead?? Thanks in advance.

[@daviru02]

Thanks Tyler. You've given more information in 14 minutes than the Corp of Engineers and the city did in 3 months.

[@returnofsid]

The sediment that was washed away also contained huge amounts of ammonia! That's played immediate havoc. What a poorly planned "remedy."

[@jonlobello7151]

Thanks for covering this issue (and other such issues out there) because I wouldn't have known about them otherwise. It is clear that not much thought was put into doing this before they acted. The smolt collector would have been the best option in this case. Last spring I ran a coded tag injector at the smolt collector (fish gulper) on Baker Lake. It was one of the most interesting things I have ever done in fisheries work and I look forward to doing it again this spring if they'll have me. I worked for the WDFW, but that facility was owned and run by Puget Sound Energy. I'm in the UP of Michigan right now.

[@gomerwd]

Tyler, you are a well-read biologist... if you could forsee this disaster, why couldn’t the decision makers at the Army Corps of Engineers also see the outcome? It seems like the inmates are running the asylum in this area of government, just like most other areas of government. I nominate you for head of the Corps of Engineers.

[@rainygirl65]

Army intelligence is an oxymoron. 😅

[@OregonOutdoorsChris]

it's not the army corp, it's fake environmental groups who sued to have this done

[@PNW_Wolfpack_Adventures]

How incredibly sad. I got the family a boat for Christmas and was planning on Kokanee fishing this year at green peter. I don't understand how in 2024 we are still doing stuff like this without the proper understanding or effort to do it right. Thank you for sharing. Please do updates

[@doamaker6674]

It was because a federal judge snap decision and went with the environmentalist instead of demanding an environmental study.

[@brianjohnston4207]

Here in Washington state there's a reservoir called Alder lake on occasion they catch some Sockeye in the fish trap below the dam where there shouldn't be any Sockeye. This is due to juvenile Kokanee passing through the dam during normal annual drawdown spill and I wouldn't be surprised if the same happens here particularly if the genetics from the Kokanee plants originated from anadramous Sockeye.

[@kevinfoster4680]

Thanks for covering this topic, one comment is they are concerned with spring chinook and winter steelhead. Summer steelhead are not native to the basin as they could not navigate Willamette falls until there was a fish ladder.

[@rjduresky]

In Nebraska, the restless natives demanded Walleye in every lake. So Nebraska would dutifully stock Walleye in 200 acre mudholes. In the meantime, a world-class catfishery flowed right through Omaha that was mostly ignored by Nebraska Game and Fish and Anglers alike (key word: "mostly"). It was there that I learned, you always want what you cannot have. Here, the situation is even more ridiculous, with the lion's share of conservation dollars going to Salmon Recovery Restoration. But it is the same problem with a different shade, there used to be spectacular Salmon runs here, therefore, we should seek to restore those salmon runs. You want what you can't have. We are going to tear out clean energy producing dams on the Snake River to recover a small percentage of the run, but we won't modify the Marine Mammal Protection rules? I don't get it.

[@Askeyb2011]

The native fish people here in Oregon are fighting to restore wild salmon and Steelhead when it will never happen for most areas because of dams and other manmade issues. These wild fish groups from what I have heard lie and exaggerate. They have successfully shut down or force cut backs of hatchery fish. Then claim wild fish population increased. All lies. ODFW person on subject of helping wild Spring Chinook Salmon told us for the Willamette River all the prime spawning is behind dams east of Willamette. The streams available aren’t as good and so do not do as good. Also there is NO SUCH THING AS A NATIVE FISH. With years of hatcheries and runs almost whipped out many wild runs restored with hatchery fish. To show how ridiculous Native Fish Society is ODFW created a wild run of Spring Chinook on the Sandy River. After they successfully created this wild run NFS filed lawsuit to shut down hatchery. Wild fish groups claim hatchery fish are too stupid to survive. Also first hatcheries were created due to commercial over harvest. Lot of mistakes that cause poor genetics. Hatcheries today have corrected and make sure to use correct methods. They also have Brood stock programs which is collecting wild fish that are used in the hatcheries. Wild Steelhead are spawned and released back in the river they came from. Some have been used a number of times. So we know they survive. I was at a meeting with a number of wild fish groups and a guy from one group made a very ignorant comment that the brood stock program doesn’t work. It has been proven to work.

[@mengkhang1037]

Im really glad you gave us your insight. Thank you for the update. Hope to see more updates.

[@fastandfun20043]

Really appreciate your insight on this!

[@timschwarze4842]

Thanks Tyler for informed message! And for sharing it publicly!

[@rodgould8980]

Your spot on with everything vou said....this is sure going to add pressure to all the other lakes in the Cascade range...we have way to many over educated children trying to run an adult world....its amazing to me that a 27 year old over educated kid can out weigh 5 or 6 generations of fisherman and crabbers....these snotnosed kids should be required to spend atleast 2 years on board a fishing boat or crabbing vessel.....

[@WillyFish]

Thank you for making a video on the reservoir. Hopefully the fish come back strong.

[@spiltmilt]

From the sounds of it no adult Kokanee survived to spawn so unfortunately I believe this fishery is lost.

[@joshuadavis8230]

Great presentation on a subject that abounds in natural resources. You nailed the explanation of the circumstances. You can be assured that they won't manage for an introduced species in competition for management resources of endangered salmonids. This situation only illustrates the dichotomies of natural resource management and the laws made to uphold it. (Left hand not talking to the right) I agree there needs to be more room for listening to data tech and the boots on the ground rather than unaware bureaucrats who only look at it on papper.

[@joshuadavis8230]

....on an unrelated note, I was wondering if you'd be interested in meeting up this spring/summer for some mid columbia walleye fishing ?

[@spiltmilt]

Depends on work. I lost most of my contracting gig with USFWS due to budget cuts and have applied for work elsewhere. If I have the time I'll let you know.

[@alansisson4343]

Good evening Tyler, thanks for putting this out there. I have been fishing Green Peter for years as well as Foster. I discovered this absolute ?$&! show on October 6th on my birthday. Arrived there at first light to fish with a buddy for Kokanee and Rainbow. Once we headed out we noticed what looked like rafted up leaves, it was Kokanee belly up, many were still alive. It was shocking. We at first thought some sort of algae bloom but it was too cold. We decided to not fish. I ran in to a local at the boat ramp who has fished the area for over 40 years. He was beside himself. He didn’t have a smart phone and asked if I could call local folks to see if anything could be done. So I called Linn Co’ Parks and two local park workers came down to check it out and were also shocked but not surprised. They explained it knowing about the release and suspected it as the cause. I called the ODFW station that covers the area and explained what was going on. The biologist with whom I spoke too really didn’t seem to care at all. That in itself was a real surprise. Unhappy with that interaction I called the Eugene ABC affiliate and let their news desk know what was happening. The story made the news and has continued to be in and out with the wells drying up and how it’s impacting local residents. The three other reservoirs that have also been rapidly drained haven’t generated conversation about the fish loss. Only well issues. It is such a huge disappointment in so many ways. No accountability, just compliance. It is so sad. I hope something changes in the ongoing process, and that the fishery recovers as you mentioned. Fingers crossed and good thoughts. Thanks for your channels and wisdom and gift of information. It is greatly appreciated. All the best, AS

[@daveengstrom9250]

This is a classic example of people making decisions about things which they do not fully understand. This is the sort of thing that drove me nuts while I was still working. We were bound to follow the direction of people like that and none of our inputs were ever considered (because it required thinking). Its unlikely to change.

[@johnhobbs7697]

Kokanee fishery was absolutely lights out😊 I think what this was a bad decision if you look at the South Fork of the Santiam it's been running muddy since they started letting water out that won't really help the spawning Reds below Foster Dam

[@fishfearmetv2488]

The army core is absolutely terrible. We could have such better fisheries if they actually managed these resevoirs and hatcherys

[@NorthweSteelheadJunkies]

The are potentially huge impacts from unreal high turbidities on both wild spring chinook , cutthroat, rainbow; and winter steelhead that 99% thrive in these tailwaters.

[@F-N-C]

I went there to check it out in November and there were 1,000's of dead fish everywhere. It was sad

[@bruce8663]

Excellent summary of this fiasco Tyler. If this drawdown continues every year I don't see how this kokanee fishery ever comes back with natural production. This year you had 4 and 5 yr old adults upstream on the spawning grounds which seeded the next generation, those fish spawned and died. Their resulting fry will migrate down to the reservoir in the spring to be greeted by muddy water and very low primary productivity which creates the zooplankton kokanee feed on. Even if these young fish survive they'll be flushed out next fall during the next drawdown with little to no chance of reaching adult age capable of spawning. I don't see how the Green Peter kokanee fishery comes back given the current management scenario.

[@spiltmilt]

I agree although I'll be curious to see what the water conditions are by this spring after they spend the next several months filling the reservoir back up. Plankton communities have such short life spans they can rebound very quickly but if water quality remains poor that point is moot.

[@codygray7791]

Great teaching! With regards to stake okders getting together to solve problems, Not everyone wants to solve the problem or wants to pay for it. If so, I would have thought the issues with fish passage at dams would have been solved by now. I was wondering about the fish spawning below the dam and that doesn't sound good at all. Hopefully our fears will be not see full scale and only minor damage will occur, hopefully...

[@joepedersen8664]

Thanks Tyler.. So sad I sold my boat all ready...we have a brand new Hatchery at Foster, why not brood stock program like our coastal streams..love your channel... Merry Christmas and New Year!

[@Pfenzer]

Yeah, this is what I thought was going to happen. I remember being able to boat camp on a shore away from the world and fish all morning/evening. Some of the best times ever have been there. This is a tragedy.

[@privateuser2463]

well said my friend. Remember the old saying "the road to hell is paved with good intentions" , this is the sort of thing that applies to.

[@johncase1972]

They're doing a similar thing to Wickiup to supposedly save a species of frog downstream. Wickiup was the best Kokanee lake in oregon as well as being an awesome Brown trout fishery.

[@spiltmilt]

Its not really the same at all. Wickiup was getting drawn to historic levels in part because of a multi-decade drought and that irrigation rights allocated downstream exceed how much water is available. Its true that water is being held back at Crane Prairie to preserve spawning habitat for an endangered frog but they are not purposely draining Wickiup. Also Wickiup still, despite low waters, has managed to maintain its Kokanee population and spawners have been evident annually even during the low water years plus some fish spill over from Crane Prairie.

[@ShenpaiWasTaken]

Maybe you could do another video on the wickiup reservoir, it's really enjoyable to listen to your opinions/takes on these draw downs/conditions. Thanks!

[@Exploer8591]

That makes sense.

[@Askeyb2011]

Green Peter is really a very sad situation resulting from exaggerated ideas and information. We started fishing Green Peter in the 1980s for Kokanee which we had never heard of or fished for. That became our favorite fishing. We attended meetings with ODFW person I believe Tom Murtaugh was his name and he has retired. He explained information on wild runs of salmon and Steelhead with returns of over 500,000 each year, all wild. Due to commercial overharvest that was the first impact and hatcheries were used to restock runs with of course a lot of mistakes early on. Then came the dams with no fish passage. Tom told us all of the prime spawning is now behind dams east of the Willamette River. Tom also explained research that ODFW had done. Releasing smolts above Green Peter. What they found is that the smolts will go up every arm of the lake looking for a way out. Likely reason they drained the lake to guide the smolts to the dam. He said a system would have to be setup to collect smolts at the dam. Note not draining the lake to streams at the bottom. Another issue is people have introduced Bass to the lake illegally and they would likely impact smolts going up arms of the lake. Issues would be that returning adult salmon and Steelhead would have to be collected and trucked up to the lake and released. That would still be a problem for what they are doing now. None of the dams east of the Willamette River were built with fish passage. They do have elevators, but Tom said they are in bad shape and never really worked all that good. Also, Spring Chinook Salmon have been in Green Peter for a number of years and likely spawning in streams above the lake. These fish are illegal to keep and have to be released. So, the draw down of the lake also killed the protected Spring Chinook Salmon in Green Peter. Total screw up plan if there ever was one. My opinion and what I have seen of these wild fish groups is they collect donations by creating causes to support themselves. They also exaggerate over and over what is really going on. Another example of misleading information is the lawsuit to shut down all Summer Steelhead hatcheries east of the Willamette River. Tom Murtaugh also had information on what these groups were claiming in their lawsuit. Tom said they are well aware of what is being claimed and it is so minor isn't even worth concern. The claim was that Summer Steelhead are spawning with wild Winter Steelhead. Tom said that doesn't happen very often and not even a concern. Yet these wild groups use everything and exaggerate as they always do. A friend and I attended a meeting with NW Steelheaders and a number of wild fish groups including Native Fish Society, McKenzie Fly Casters and others. The effort was to increase the number of wild Spring Chinook to get them off the ESA list and be able to use in Brood Stock Programs for hatcheries. Native Fish Society discussed to have healthy runs we need the Army Corps to regulate dam flows for healthy fish. There were a number of issues with dam flow during summer causing fish to die. Everyone agreed that something needed to be done to get Army Corps to do a better job of regulating so the spring salmon and Steelhead would survive through summer into fall to spawn. What was clear is that these wild fish groups actually understood the real issue and it wasn't closing all the fish hatcheries as they promote. The draining of Green Peter caused killing of thousands of fish, turned Foster and South Santiam to mud. Mud flowed all the way to the Willamette River where the Main Santiam River dumps into the Willamette River. The excessive drawn down caused landslides, trees uprooted falling in the water. As said drinking water systems unable to deal with the amount of mud in the water. Someone I know was president of the NW Steelheaders for a lot of years. He said what is happening now is no one is taking blame. The wild fish groups are going after Army Corps for draining the lake. It is just a big mess stemming from the wild fish groups lawsuit to drain the lake which was stupid to begin with. The dams were never designed for this or fish passage. The dams destroyed all the wild runs that used the streams above the dams. Tom Murtaugh told us the prime spawning areas that supported the huge runs of Willamette salmon Steelhead was blocked by the dams. Another reason we have hatcheries or there would be no fish in the rivers or very few. Wild fish groups have also filed and successfully destroyed our Summer Steelhead hatchery releases. NOAA supposedly ordered ODFW to cut releases to 240,000. Sounds like a lot of smolts but with all the predation and other issues the returns have been very poor. This last year I checked repeatedly, and it was a count of roughly three Summer Steelhead a day. The final count for Summer Steelhead over a 1,000 for the whole season.

[@Richoshay1]

I am sure they have screwed up spawning grounds down stream for miles along with all the feed that was destroyed.

[@Richoshay1]

Something else that makes no sense to me about all of this is the fact that there is another dam below Green Peter. Why are they drawing down the power producing dam in the name of salmon habitat but there is another obstacle below?

[@jimmyj422]

The same thing has happened to Wikiup reservoir. It is getting drawn down to a trickle due to environmentalist lawsuits over a frog below the reservoir.

[@doamaker6674]

My understanding is the Kokanee have a bladder, the corps of engineers is saying it's because of that rapid drawdown and this need to balance themselves through that bladder that caused them to die because it was too quick to a shallower depth. What I don't hear anyone talking about and I was hoping you would is what about the other fish that live in lakes over streams such as bass, sunfish, and other such fish, what did the drawdown do to them? With the amount of Kokanee that died off what did that do to the waters downstream as well as the turbidity? It seems to me somebody who lived in the Sweet Home area it seems to me that there was no impact study done on this, for that matter where is the study shown that it's the dams actually for sure causing the reduction in salmon and steelhead. I have lived in the Sweet Home area for 22 years, all of it right next to the South santiam below Foster. I remember a lot of steelhead and salmon for several years after I moved here, then there was a sudden decline. If the dams were the cause then why the sudden declined and not a gradual one leading up to that point that you would think especially since these dams have been here for far longer than I have.

[@pepe97355]

Not only the draw down killed the Kokanee fish, but it impacted the water of the people of Sweet Home, Lebanon and Albany. Same thing for Detroit lake which impacted the Salem Oregon region.

[@spiltmilt]

They didn't do the draw down at Detroit.

[@rushintofishin81]

I can’t find you on Instagram anymore, I remember u had a link for all the conditions for ice on lakes

[@spiltmilt]

I don’t maintain that anymore

[@rushintofishin81]

@@spiltmilt where can I check ice conditions, I live very far away from the main lakes people fish in eastern Washington

[@kenlani1]

Do you think Foster lake will have any more Kokanee in it?

[@spiltmilt]

I don't think so. Water quality was below what I'd expect Kokanee to thrive in for most of the fall and winter.

[@pathill6428]

Agreed

[@jasonmcgonigal8044]

They should have known better and I believe they did, if they really are set on saving the wild spring chinook and winter steelhead, first step is tearing down green Peter dam wich will never happen, second they need to rebuild foster with an actual fish passage ladder wich will never happen.. funny how they built a really expensive hatchery across from an fully functioning hatchery that was pumping out lots of hatchery salmon and steelhead since then the fishery went to crap, I don’t think the Kokanee are going to fair well in the next 3to4 years in green Peter because drawing all the water out not only killed basically all the fish but the Kokanee’s food base , how will the fresh water shrimp make a comeback enough to feed the Kokanee that are trying to grow? army core of wtf have been out of control on this river system for a lot of years.

[@scottulbrich5376]

such a shame, beautiful place

[@derekbleiler4541]

All that drawdown water and fish went into Foster lake....hopefully we just made Foster another Kokanee lake. It already had some but not many

[@spiltmilt]

I doubt any survived in Foster. It was a mudpot for most of the fall and winter

[@dagger281]

So sad....arggg

[@gumpenater2006]

Someone needs to be Fired!!

[@tomg8673]

You should comment on the Disaster they created at Wikiup Reservoir in Oregon Unbelievable!

[@spiltmilt]

Wickiup fished pretty well this year and I think next year it will be even better

[@tomg8673]

It’s Empty right now

[@tomg8673]

Spotted Frog

[@spiltmilt]

It’s not empty it’s low.

[@colvilleoutfitters3290]

I am all for wild fish but this is just absolutely absurd. If you don't work for fisheries you need to. Are you on fb?

[@josephfolsom2030]

“I’m from the government, and I’m here to help”

[@boba-mg5md]

Tyler, way is the Corp going the cheap route ? We the taxpayers would have to foot the bill anyway

[@spiltmilt]

Yeah but corps is DOD the cost for the smolt barges is insignificant given their budget

[@roberthooton9636]

Tyler Spring Chinook and winter (not summer) steelhead were the native almonds lost w the dam. I can fill you in on more historical trivia at your convenience. Let me know how I can contract you Bob Hooton ODFW 42 years

[@spiltmilt]

You are right the winter steelhead run is the ESA listed population. Good catch.

[@roberthooton9636]

Historically summer steelhead and sockeye salmon (as well as coho and fall chinook) were not native above Willamette Falls (40’ barrier) During 1964-68 fishways were improved to allow year round passage. The Fish Commission introduced Adam’s River and Wenatchee sockeye into the MF Santiam River above Green Peter Dam. Only the Wenatchee persisted and they were the origin of original Kokanee fishery. In the 1980’s ODFW no longer passed returning Sockeye above Foster Dam to reduce possibility of IHN infection of Chinook and steelhead at South Santiam Hatchery. The Wenatchee Kokanee have been naturally reproducing ever since. And I learned today that local staff also stocked juvenile Kokanee from Wizard Falls Hatchery (likely Whatcom Lake stock) for a period of time, likely exacerbating stunting. They discontinued about 10 years ago. Local bios monitored the MF above Green Peter this fall and did not observe Kokanee spawners. It’s unknown if survivors of this year’s flush will provide much of a future Kokanee fishery because there is the potential of annual draining

[@spiltmilt]

Thanks for the input

[@jamesmilton3490]

How could there be any truly natural native runs over Willamette falls at 40 feet? @@roberthooton9636

[@swimbait1]

You did a great job of summarizing this situation. This is the first time I have heard about this reservoir. We create a lot of problems when we build dams. The best solution would be to remove the dam and let the river recover. Kokanee are not native to this system so it makes sense to recover the native fish populations. As for the silt below the dam, salmon have been dealing with sediment for centuries and they will deal with this sediment too. The area above the dam would be covered in vegetation in one year if it remained at low pool.

[@spiltmilt]

Actually the sediment loads below the dams were well above lethal levels for salmon smolts and almost certainly resulted in mortality of endangered salmon. I agree that salmon are adapted the occasional silt plume but naturally those would be short duration (e.g. days or a weeks) not months. I agree Kokanee aren't native BUT the dams aren't going away unless you want to see huge swaths of the Willamette Valley flooded. The valley is too urbanized to handle dam removal at this point unless they can find a way to displace flood waters into areas non-urbanized and away from high value agricultural lands. Having worked in the Willamette Valley on conservation issues for the past two decades I can tell you there isn't much opportunity for that. I can also say confidently as a restoration ecologist vegetation would not fully recover in one year. That's absurd.

[@HungryH1951]

Army Corps of Engineers.....hello, we're from the government and we're here to help. Watch us go!

[@jessejames1395]

This just saddens me at pisses me off

[@Exploer8591]

Do you think this might have been retaliation because of the lawsuit? The Army Corps should be facing stiff penalties for this environmental disaster.

[@spiltmilt]

Hard to say. The whole thing is so stupid its hard to wrap my mind around it.

[@eh6929]

remember how good the salmon fishing was when we barged fish on the columbia??

[@chugachocho]

Remove those dams. Contour the river to support human water supply, recreation, and fish. The fix is with small scale disruption that that cure all problems in a self sustaining way.

[@spiltmilt]

But they won’t remove those dams because those dams are built for flood control and unless you want the densest populated region of Oregon to turn into a seasonal flood land there is zero chance of that happening.

[@user-ee8uy3dd5u]

Let's quit thinking salmon on the upper rivers of Oregon are what most fishermen are after. They are hundreds of miles out of the ocean. Not that good for sport or eating. We need to get the hatcheries on the central Oregon coast running like they did in the 60s and 70s. People would come to Oregon from all over the country to fish for salmon if they can catch and take. Fish home. Not going to happen in Sweethome or Mill City or Eugene. Salmon should be caught out of the ocean where they are fresh.

[@thomassmestead9905]

Ironic. Destroy the environment in order to improve the environment.

[@colvilleoutfitters3290]

Funny the wild fish society's only care about their agenda.,,not the fishermen and businesses fishermen spend their money at

[@questioneverything6489]

People are brainless if the kokes Can’t live because water conditions the smolt cant either😂

[@getoutside4363]

Good job Oregon. Maybe they can take the dams out and then complain about why the government let floods happen and no water for crops in the summer.

[@magwamagwa45110]

To heck with Kokanee there are tons of lakes with them bring back the salmon and steelhead. I agree make the corp built a collection system.

[@TiredAmerican247]

Kings are higher priority than stocked lake salmon.

[@spiltmilt]

Yes but can be compatibly managed or at least better managed than in this scenario. The Lewis and Baker River systems in Washington are great examples of this. I also doubt that a few hundred extra Kings returning is going to do much to increase the viability of Willamette River wild spring Chinook stocks.

[@jimmychesney7162]

The survival rate of smolts is extremely low between low water levels and bird predation, I agree a few hundred extra kings wouldn’t have made much of a difference as far as the big picture goes. Definitely not worth losing all those Kokanee and creating water quality issues. Lousy resource management.

[@patsherrett312]

Russian trawlers have huge nets miles long. Those kings are electronically tracked. They know exactly where they are all the time. The U.S. has spent $16 billion on salmon recovery to no avail. Logging and dams are a small part of the problem. And sea lions and cormorants. The modern technology of the Russians, Japanese, Koreans and Chinese are a much bigger piece of the puzzle. Stocked lake salmon. 👎

[@NorthweSteelheadJunkies]

If kings were a priority Agencies would be addressing both predation and harvest.