Gretsch Guitars: Treble Bleed Mod

[@Flatheadmedia1]

Treble bleed cap is a must. Especially if you want to crank your amp and use the guitar volume to go from clean to dirt and everything in between. Allows you to keep that top end clarity in overdrive.

[@JoePerkinsMusic]

Yep totally - a volume control that takes off everything above about 1k by only turning it down to 9 isn't exactly useable!! :P

[@JohnShalamskas]

Yep. I was surprised how much more useful my 5420 became with a treble bleed on the master volume pot. Now it is one of my favorite guitars. Eventually I'll swap out the 3-way switch for a new Switchcraft one, and try a 1M pot (already acquired) instead of 500k, but I really like it in its current state.

[@Wolf_K]

It really boggles the mind why guitar manufacturers don’t include this as stock it’s literally less than a dollar more in parts. It’s like half the circuit is missing. Haha I’m considering getting that model Gretsch, too. So nice, man!

[@JoePerkinsMusic]

In the end, I settled on having a treble bleed cap on the master volume but not the two individual ones...gives me the option of retaining the highs or not! :-) It's a lovely guitar!!

[@ltvddvtl]

Great video! I know this is an old video. But hopefully you are still watching your comments. :) I'm looking into this myself. So all you did is add a 1nF cap to the master volume? Only the cap? You used no resistor either in series or in parallel? And your pot is 1 meg? My guitar has 500k pot for master volume. Makes sense to change MV to 1 meg if the other pots are also 500k? Thanks,

[@boogierandy7547]

Thanks! Ill be doing this to my Gretsch 7670.

[@JoePerkinsMusic]

Enjoy! Let us know how it goes :-)

[@JohnShalamskas]

Thanks to your demo (and a few others), today I went to the local electronic parts store (which I never knew existed before today) and bought five .001 uF 5% tolerance 100V silver mica capacitors for 50 cents each, and 100 resistors (150k, metal film, 5% tolerance, 1/8 watt) for 3 dollars. Also picked up some .001 uF ceramic capacitors for 15 cents each, which ought to work fine in a pinch. I am thinking that some of my colleagues are going to want to do this mod. Man, those guys selling a capacitor and a resistor on eBay for 8 dollars are making a lot of profit! I also stopped by the local pet store for some air tubing, about $5. I ended up using string too, for the pickup selector switch, which had to be removed in order to pull out the main volume pot. The installation process went smoothly and now I finally have the treble bleed mod installed on my pre-2016 Gretsch G520T. I've ordered a CTS 1M pot too, but I might not bother installing it, now that I can roll off the master volume without massive darkening of the tone. The 1M pot might even make the guitar too bright! I would also have to increase the hole size in the guitar body, and drill out the knob to accommodate the larger shaft. Maybe when the pickup selector switch requires replacement, I'll also give the 1M pot a try, first without the treble bleed, and then with it.

[@JoePerkinsMusic]

Great to hear John - good luck experimenting!! P.S. Watch out...it's a slippery slope once you start! :P

[@JohnShalamskas]

The treble bleed mod makes a HUGE difference in usability, especially when doing the rolled off volume with a Germanium FuzzFace to get bell-like clean tone, or the Jimi Hendrix "clean" with the fuzz being driven on the edge of fuzziness for that touch sensitive breakup.

[@sean.eidemiller]

Very illustrative video, thanks! FYI, in terms of units, 1000pF is 1nF is .001uF (pico, nano, micro, respectively). :-) For me, the sweet spot for a treble bleed cap on a humbucker volume control is ~560-680pF. I find that 1000pf (1nF) allows a bit too much treble through when the volume knob is more drastically rolled back. Certainly that has a lot to do with pickups and whatnot as well! Anyway, I'm enjoying the videos, thanks!

[@JoePerkinsMusic]

Was never any good at maths! ;-) Managed to be 1000 out! Thanks for putting my ignorant brain right! :P Haha

[@JoePerkinsMusic]

P.S. Have updated my video description to include your knowledge at the top...thanks again for the info! :-) My maths was rubbish! heh

[@sean.eidemiller]

My pleasure. And thanks again for all the hard work on the great videos!

[@JohnShalamskas]

That could also be dependent on your speakers, amp, or amp settings. Tonight I am trying out 150k ohms in parallel with1 nF. So far it is like lifting a blanket off the speaker when volume is rolled back. Will play a bunch tonight and see if there is fatigue from excessive treble. Edit: sounds great to me! I might want to add back a little more bass at low volume, which can be done by adding a 300k resistor in parallel with the 150k, to get effective 100k. Reducing the cap value would reduce the amount of bass and mids getting through (higher cutoff frequency.)

[@Gerhard468]

Is it possible to do 50's wiring on a gretsch? Always thought it just makes so much sense for a dual humbucker guitar.

[@rhiwderinraytube]

Do you put the treble bleed on all pots or just the Master Volume ? (Mine has neck, bridge and master volume pots)

[@JoePerkinsMusic]

Entirely up to you! Can do all/some/none - splitting one way between the individuals & master can give you the best of both worlds 👍

[@jtomrx]

Hi, your Illustration is tremendous, especially when you compare "UnMod's(standard wiring) vs Mod (treble bleed). you did a very good job. HOWEVER, this has not been my personal experience with Treble Bleed, Stock from the factory. I have always wanted a Gretsch, initially a few years ago I thought I wanted a Panther (standard stock wiring) after hearing my friend's. It truly was Gretsch's answer to compete w. the ES-335 market, but finding a good Used Panther is difficult, because it was discontinued 2-3y ago. However the New Nashville G6620T is quite similar to the Panther, even has the "Treble Bleed" as stock from the factory, with Filtertrons. Hmmmm, well this is where I am NOT COMPLETELY CONVINCED that "Treble Bleed" is really what it is suppose to be. I have played FOUR (4) of the newer Nashville's (G6620T's) either at local dealer or have traveled to play 2-Used, and another 1-New at another dealer. ALL FOUR (4) sound ok, but they do not have nearly the same Attack, Clarity, Dynamic Range as The Panther or even stock "Electromatic" Models at GC . . . yes I said Electromatic. Umm that's a $400 -800.00 guitar sounding better than a $3200.00 , WHAT?? and seeing that all 4- that I played were played thru my Rig of HotRod Deville 2-12", Fulltone OD, little Chorus and some Delay to fatten up the sound was not convincing that the Treble Bleed may actually hav an opposite effect ??. I asked both Dealer's WHY the tonal difference in sound QUALITY and they concurred that the "Treble Bleed" may actually be FILTERING OUT the highs ?? Huh ?? 1-sales person actually went on to further explain that The Nashville (G6620T) is called that for a reason. the guitar name "Nashville", Implies "Country tones", NOT "Bad Co, Led Z, AC/DC" etc etc . WHO KNOWS what was done, added at the factory that you won't discover till you pull things apart. Ugh !!! It's an Unanswered question and calling Fender (Gretsch) doesnt resolve this question, because they simply don't understand Treble Bleed per se. Unless the K-value in the stock Nashville "Bridge" Filtertron is dramatically different (lower). What do you think ?

[@JohnShalamskas]

With the volume at 10, the treble bleed circuit does nothing, it's shorted out. Treble bleed allows some of the treble to bypass the volume control when the volume is turned down. If you use a parallel resistor across the capacitor, then some of the bass and mids will also bypass the volume control, as well as modify the taper of the volume pot. Perhaps the differences you observed were caused by different pickups or old strings?

[@jtomrx]

I Def appreciate your knowledge and explanation. You are very knowledgable . However, I believe for Bedroom/ Basement /Studio at lower volumes all of what you described is accurate. However,I still play LIVE, busy bars, heavy people traffic, people talking/yelling etc etc and typically my Volumes are ON and or NEAR "10" (ten), I let my ATTACK dictate my volume. I know what my ears hear and all of my Bandmates agree esp guys I occasionally jam with learning new songs etc . .I'm convinced that most people posting here and giving opinions do not Play LIVE and really don't understand that dynamic. I'm serious, the Treble-Bleed just seems to Filter-Out Highs when the Volume is Dimed, Maxed . . . its a fact. So I stand by original Comment 11mos ago. Stock Electro-matic Gretsch's were literally kicking the pants of $3200.00 Pro Series instruments. I don't know what else to say. I can def appreciate Crispness at Lower Volumes . . yes very true!

[@davidallen346]

But having the same brightness as you roll down the volume setting is a good thing ? Think about that... Recently added treble bleed to my Gibson les paul and Fender strat and getting too much treble really is piercing to my ears tbh and I went thru quite few experimental value caps and different resistors solder in parallel and kinman style. Now I've decided to remove them all and just go old fashion volume controls is the best way.

[@JoePerkinsMusic]

I've taken them off the individual volume controls & left one on the master - so I've got the best of both worlds :-) I also run much much lower value caps in the tone switch, so can smooth out the high end using those if needed.

[@papahjoshscene4234]

Size potensio volume? Size potensio tone?

[@JoePerkinsMusic]

All 1Meg :-)

[@carlosg4537]

You said 1 microfarad cap, but it's not 1000pF (2:52 the numbers are wrong). You mean 1nF(and it's1000pF) yea? :)

[@JoePerkinsMusic]

Already corrected at the top of the description box - but thanks for double checking :-)

[@carlosg4537]

​@@JoePerkinsMusic Thans, it's not criticism, I wanted to make sure :)

[@JoePerkinsMusic]

@@carlosg4537 Was never any good at maths! 😂