Legacy of Kain: Defiance - 40 - Epilogue

[@MrOrcshaman]

Remember, this was the first time in his life that kain was able to think without madness tainting his every thought

[@alexanderkapsiotis8050]

The scion of balance was healed at the time.

[@Graeystone]

And he found no comfort because he saw hope as an illusion.

[@Brucifer2]

Holy sh*t i never realized that. He mustve seemed relatively normal since hes only known it since birth.

[@MrOrcshaman]

@@Graeystone he said that when he was cursed, but this was his revival to being the scion of balance with a clear mind

[@TheKain202]

Pretty sure he wasn't ever mad. Tainted by the corruption, yes - but I don't think he had enough marbles as a fetus to be able to go insane. He was always well adjusted if arrogant, while by comparison - his fellow guardians became a pack of rabid, raving lunatics.

[@KalvinEllis]

I like how right after Kain is purified, he starts sounding like an actual hero. Shows that he would've truly been a heroic character if he wasn't corrupted ever since his birth. His corruption was "expertly calculated" indeed.

[@GrandmasterBeef]

The first, bitter taste of that terrible illusion: hope.

[@theheavy4813]

Pov: you came to a comment you forgot until it got a reply nine years later

[@Thepiller]

Chills every time

[@BryonYoungblood]

Which is really interesting for sure, since Kain had been a fatalist for SO long that finding hope after what Raziel did, it is why he had said that, since he hadn't felt hope in *AGES*.

[@Lemuel928]

Thus we move on to God of War 3..

[@tremendousyeet3467]

@@theheavy4813 Can you stop being such an example of your modern memes? why do you people have to deconstruct everything.

[@Suika_Ibuki_The_Drunk_Oni]

Yes, Hope. It's bitter taste is like poison, giving you thoughts of a brighter tomorow. But in the end, it is all we have. For perhaps, just perhaps the bitter taste is in reality, medicine.

[@wandiferous2903]

0:30 don't mind me, coming back here after the recent survey announcements of 100k responses to remember the last thing Kain speaks of is 'hope'

[@Simgor2]

18 years later and we're still waiting for another game in this series. Damn you to hell Square Enix for treating this franchise so poorly.

[@born2biscuit]

the series is free from square enix now and is owned by crystal dynamics again if you havent heard yet, they have done a survey to see if theres interest in the series still

[@thegamingprozone1941]

@@born2biscuit yesss let's hope they finally do something!!

[@RealDemonS]

@@born2biscuit the first bitter taste of that terrible illusion: Hope

[@vamperic]

Sadly Tony Jay is gone and it would feel really weird with someone else voicing the Elder God

[@Mrlevarxl]

It's time for a rebirth and continuation of, The Legacy Of Kain". I belive it will happen, I hope that they get it right. This games graphics were decent for the time, but it was the writing, the story telling, the passion the voice actors put into it. It can literally be felt with every line of dialog spoken. The series was literal magic manifested in the form of a game. This series literally touched my soul and years later, every time I revisit a cutscene, I still feel it, it's still there. We can't have the original voice of the Elder God (False God) unfortunately, but there's definitely a voice actor that could pull it off. Maybe ai. With all the lines of spoken dialog, cloning said voice should be entirely possible. These are the uses of artificial intelligence that should be taken into consideration and used.

[@davidthompson184]

And to think this would have continued with The Dark Prophecy. From what I read, Kain would have encountered The Seer when he traveled to the Pillars. He would have entered the demon dementia and met the Hylden King & Queen. I read somewhere that the unfinished plot was that the Hylden Lord was just one of a few high ranking generals in the Hylden army, but not the actual big boss. You would have played both young and old Kain. I believe the younger Kain would have gone back to the Eternal Prison for some reason. Man, what a story that could have been. If only.

[@TheRatzor]

Yes, Hope, I Hope this story concludes someday

[@alfonsovallejo2665]

Idk, modern game developers might totally tarnish the LoK franchise with a shitty sequeal.

[@ArbiterDan]

A showdown with the hylden is in order.

[@kecu0]

It's funny, because chronologically the last game drops you off, essentially, near to where the first game begins. But with whole new events, such as Janos now being possessed by the Hylden instead of reportedly dead, and with Kain possessing the opportunity to mess with any of the LoK timeline to his will. I truly wish they'd make a sequel worthy enough to be the final LoK, but in all fairness, I'd rather they left it be if they were to continue down the route they've taken with the game 'Nosgoth'.

[@therealwilliamholdin]

Nosgoth is set before ANY of the Paradoxes, So after Raziel was Cast into the abyss, but before Raziel's return. Treat it like a seperate timeline

[@Bitterman5868]

William Holdin nope, far as the devs says and how the community took it, its probably set during this new timeline after raziel was cast in to the abyss and while kain was messing up with the chronoplast the vampires in nosgoth timeline(the Terrible Illusion of Hope as Kain stated at the end of defience) didn't delvolved fast after kain dissapeared, also most of their abilities weren't devolved yet like melchiahim becoming mindless zombies and losing their necromantic and shifting powers, or turelim stil learning how to improve their TK powers, like TK shouting projectiles, and Zephonim starting to become spiders like zephon himself the only ones who evolved and Devolved due to their reclusion trying to escape from their doom were the Razielim, who became sociopaths and deranged vampires as you see them in nosgoth, and the ones who will be backstabbed later by Dumah and Rahab

[@Bitterman5868]

William Holdin nope the timeline was changed enough to make nosgoth happen(The Illusion of Hope) The game is set during the new timeline, but as always the events must run on on its own course witha few modifications, in this case the vampire conquest set after kain started to mess with the chronoplast was delayed due to the War for Nosgoth(which never happened in the original timeline that almost made the humans extinct because thet wasnt no resistance), this new timeline made the humans start arming themselves more than the easy victory of the original timeline of BO and Soul Reaver, mainly because of BO2 events where kain's conquest was delayed for centuries and when the Hylden Sarafan was destroyed, the resistance against kain's conquest started to show up. also the vampire clans didn't devolved fast like before -The Razielim Survived the Purge, but now they are serving Dumah, they now show the 1st symptoms of devolved due to their more beastial forms and chitin like skins, with a few Evolved, but with most of them being deranged monsters -Turelims didn't became blind yet, and didn't developed their feared TK abilities that they possess in the original timeline -Dumahim didn't devolved into troll looking beasts -Rahabim are are probably the Middle term of it, still sensible to sunlight but still less vulnerable to water -Zephonim and Melchiahim are showing the 1st Evolved to devolved symptoms

[@jefthereaper]

I just see this as the final game, to hell with Nosgoth, its a abomination. my own fan theory is simple. He's back in the past now, and takes on the role as Ballance guardian, unlike the first game, he no longer needs to kill himself to restore the pillars, as the soul reaver just restored him, and cleaned his corruption. He brings new member's to the circle and leads Nosgoth into a tranquil world like seen in the "good" ending of the first game. Ending the LOK series here, one of the best vampire game series ever, and may no company ever tamper with the series by creating rubbish sequels that try to change so many things for the sake of "what the fans want", disregarding the series got popular by ignoring what the fans "want" while staying true to their own design.

[@CloudHiro]

you wanna know something terrible? look up legacy of kain : Dead sun. it honestly looked like it would have been fantastic. but from what I hear? the publisher canned the game because "no one plays single player narative games anymore. make a multiplayer game instead" and we all know how THAT ended up. UGH!

[@crowfather3838]

Kain's first moment of being purified of his corruption, and he feels hope. He thinks it an illusion, due to the millennia of maddeningly doomed conquest of a sick land, but still, he feels it. Now he knows the truth, and he has the means to change things, for he technically does have two Reavers in his hand, and the Time Streamer is dead for good. He can change what needs to be changed. He HAS to. It's his job. His destiny. His friend sacrificed himself for it. His friend, who once told him when asked what he would do if faced with the decisions Kain had been faced with. "I would choose Integrity." And so he did. He made the sacrifice, and Kain owes it to him to follow through. No more games, no more squabbles. Kain, as a man, always knew he was meant for more, and was dissatisfied with his life, even being born to a rich and powerful family. His ambitions to be greater can now be realized, for that's what he chose, and his friend, the champion of free will, allowed him to do so.

[@alexsmith6914]

Sad that all these years later, we still don't know what became of Kain. We will never know if the weary traveler finally got his mug of ale from the tavern. 😕

[@jamiearnold1161]

Let's hope so. He can reward him well, for he is of noble blood!

[@Weyk47]

Nah that dude got stabbed up by assassins like a couple days prior to all that xD lolol

[@alexsmith6914]

@@jamiearnold1161 There are things that come with the night that no sane man would welcome.

[@jamiearnold1161]

@@alexsmith6914 And so I left, cold of heart and... (I've completely forgotten the line lol).

[@alexsmith6914]

@@jamiearnold1161 Lol! Forced to the road and the long, bitter night

[@KatherinaBathory]

The terrible illusion that we would ever get LoK: Dark Prophecy made :'(

[@Yo-yo-ma150]

What a way to describe hope

[@filipvadas7602]

The saddest part is that this genuinely felt like the prelude, the setup for one last game to cap it all off. The Elder God is the only threat that hadn't been dealt with yet, but with how intrinsically tied he is to the history of Nozgoth, its debatable if he even CAN be truly erased without literally tearing the timeline to shreds. An exciting, unfathomable puzzle for the newly restored Kain to solve and we just might never see it concluded

[@igorvalar9059]

such a pity this is final game for legazy of kain...

[@Smutnomir]

already something exists in Nosgoth realms but nopthing combined with this series

[@tomtinakiyama9949]

It's sad we will never get one last game. :(

[@Cangaca777]

"The bitter taste of that terrible illusion: hope." maybe Kain was talking to us rsrs

[@TheKain202]

The story is finished, for all intents and purposes. Kain was healed and is now fit to properly assume his duty as Balance Guardian. The timeline has locked in his true destiny in stone, HARD - going as far as making him undying to prevent any shenanigans - essentially giving him free will. He can return to his own era and and assume his duties, his pillar will regenerate, because for all the damage, the things are still operational in some capacity, since the Hylden can't exactly come and go as they please. Elder God is a nuisance, but weak due to starvation and powerless to intervene in Soul Reaver era without anyone to do his biding. He doesn't need to be killed, the fact that he's exposed now is damning enough for him.

[@MatiNuva1724]

If there is hope, it's in Soul Reaver remasters.

[@FreudMessenger]

This is my favorite tale about vampires. I would like a remake of the first "BloodOmen", the first game of this saga.

[@Jarock316]

You do know they'll have to recast Mortanius because Tony Jay is dead.

[@stinkfinga4918]

​@Jarock316 they can use his voice again yknow.

[@Kyjohnson1500]

God im dying for someone to make a sequel.

[@ranzigerkaefer]

The final one is BO2. This leads to BO2.

[@Lunarice98]

​@@ranzigerkaeferI thought blood omen 2 was the new memories that kain got from their changing of history at the end of soul reaver 2?

[@ranzigerkaefer]

​@@Lunarice98 Kain gained new memories because he "remembered" Raziel would save Janos Audron. Thats why he said "Janos must stay dead!" And only because Janos is alive in the events of BO2 (and past BO1), the Hylden (Lord) could invade Nosgoth. If Janos would have stayed dead, BO2 wouldnt happen, but SR1 would anyways. SR1 is the outcome of both ORIGINAL BO2 AND BO1. But with the outcome of Defiance, Kain is now the purified Guardian of Balance, through Raziels Sacrifice which Kain wasnt before. So in the new timeline at the end of BO1 (resulting of Defiance) there is now a evil younger Kain, corrupted Guardian of Balance AND a purified elder Kain, saviour of Nosgoth in the same area at the same time. BO2 will not happen, if the elder Kain stops the possessed Janos Audron and somehow restore the pillars before they finally broke down. Also, SR1 will not happen if Elder Kain succeeds . SR1 is the "bad ending" if you will, and with Defiance there is the possibility of a "good Ending" - as elder Kain himself said: "Hope". Thats what I puzzled after multiple playthroughs of all games.

[@CloudHiro]

you know I didnt notice before but the hole in his chest wasnt the only thing that healed. the scar that was visible on his model since soul reaver from his human death is gone as well.

[@anthonycarlisle6184]

This is really the 2nd to last imo, bloodomen2 concludes with janos' & hylden lords final death & defeat. I find his use of 'hope' poignant because now he's able to monitor nosgoth's development from a vantage point of awareness to the eldergod [& now armed with tools to fight back] plus being technically stuck in the timeline we last see him, I feel as if he took the position to shape reality, in a sense "fulfilling" his role as scion of balance, but doing it his way.

[@StygianWolf]

He's not stuck. Kain knows how to use the Chronoplast; it's how he was able to follow Raziel around at different times during Soul Reaver 2.

[@anthonycarlisle6184]

Pretty sure mobius was key to the chronoplast chambers being "powered" [even at the end of sr1] & through sr1,2,defiance, the chambers to travel as they had prior were destroyed, essentially tethering kain to the state of nosgoth as we last see it. Please clarify if my memory is misleading! I want to keep it accurate :]

[@ryansmith4494]

Blood Omen 2 can’t be the last in the series. Vorador is still alive in Blood Omen 2. Also Kain’s look is entirely different and canonically we both know that can’t happen.

[@SorqO]

Blood Omen 2 is a prequel to Soul Reaver chronologically. After it’s ending Kain creates his kingdom of vampires and we get to the point where he drops Rhaziel into the pit.

[@robainsworth2014]

It would of been cool if he changed back to looking more human when he was purified

[@ryansmith4494]

Not really. How Kain looks is due to his age. Raziel didn’t change obtaining the spirit reaver.

[@buckshotransom9869]

One of the greatest conclusions to a great franchise that was my childhood.

[@filipvadas7602]

What makes Defiance's ending even more poignant is the fact it takes place chronologically at the same time as Kain's selfish refusal of the sacrifice. Meaning that while his young self is basking in his power, preparing for his ambitions of conquering Nozgoth & turning humanity into cattle; Elder Kain is finally freed of the corruption which has inflicted him since birth, having finally changed his destiny thanks to the sacrifice of his own vampiric son, he sets out on a quest to free Nozgoth from the crux of its corruption. Long story short, Kain's beginnings as a villain, literally starts at the same time as his redemption as a hero, as The Scion of Balance.

[@Jayoflaw]

After SDCC 2024 be like:

[@CloudHiro]

With Square Enix selling off the rights we finally have our own hope for a new game in the series. lets hope they bring back Amy Hennig to do the writing!

[@ericocccams5865]

20 years later Legacy of Defiance 11/11/2003 11/11/2023

[@gnarlyastronaut]

Well now life itself has to pave a new road for it to live since fate itself has been killed and the pillars that made the world balanced are destroyed. So kain himself probably will want to make sure the world doesn't fall under the influence of the hylden

[@mscj4710]

I’d even take an ending in the form of a novel, I just want some fucking closure.

[@nx4621]

Now i understand this final IS the bigening of the first soul reaver so kain Will creat again the Clans ...

[@ranzigerkaefer]

The final one is BO2. This leads to BO2.

[@ryansmith4494]

@@ranzigerkaeferno it isn’t. Kain is still a fledgling vampire (you can easily tell by his appearance), Kain hasn't used the Chronoplast other than the time Mobius tricked him, Vorador is still alive, and Kain would only has the blood reaver at the end of Bloom Omen 2. Defiance if the end of the story canonically.

[@johntreherne4611]

even if dead sun went ahead it was based on events long the events of his game so you are still left without a resolution for kain and to a degree nosgoth.

[@SkellyBeardMan]

And then they never released another legacy of kain game ever again....FUCK

[@gundam7401]

I've read the blood omen 2 was the true end game of the series. Yanos was a monster attached to a machine. Then Kain kills the hylden king. I always felt like the defiance left so many unanswered questions. Kain has the power to kill the elder God. He finally has the true form of the soulreaver. This is the best game ever on storyline, presentation, voice acting. There has not been any other game like it ever since. They should made a remaster from scratch from all 5 games pit into one. Like res 2.

[@Weyk47]

Nah dude blood omen 2 was a while after blood omen 1. When Raziel stabs himself in Soul Reaver 2 Kain saves him thus creating a paradox and he remembers all of blood omen 2 in that instant. Pretty wild actually.

[@gundam7401]

@@Weyk47 oh really. Omg. The lore is all over the place. They should completely remaster all the games into one but from the ground up. Tell the same story and improve on it. I would but that in a heart beat.

[@sor90]

​@@gundam7401 funny thing the lore isn't actually all over the place it's just extremely difficult to follow. Because the phrase Wibbly Wobbly Timey Wimey was never more fitting than In this series....God I love it though

[@sor90]

My favourite series of games. I love them all (even Blood Omen 2) I would love to see them finished....but if it comes back it will probably beca reboot.

[@13thGeek]

A remake of Blood Omen in the style of God of War (2018), Horizon: Zero Dawn, or Elden Ring to explore Nosgoth and its history through its geographic landmarks would be great. Imagine how awesome it would be to see every location and know what will eventually transpire there.

[@hungkc007]

The speeches sounds so Shakespeare

[@Karcarius]

And yet the pillars have yet to be restored.Apparently the madness is still there.

[@jumnei5159]

The pillars are destroyed now not only corrupted. I don't know if they can still be restored

[@ranzigerkaefer]

@@jumnei5159 Time Travel again. Kill Mortanius and kill Moebius in the distant past and nothing bad will happen. But also Vampire Kain will cease to exist and the Vampire race will dominate under Janos Audron and Vorador. The Soul Reaver will never be a soul eating weapon, if its even made (no prophecy any more). But there is one constant: The Elder god. If there is no Moebius, he will influence the "new" Time Guardian instead. So the EG must be killed also. At least three Boss fights so to speak. Alternative: We will go back even further and make sure, the pillars are never build. In that case, the war between the Hylden and the ancient Vampires must be stopped before it even begins. Again, the root of this problem is the EG, who must be killed. There is a high possibility we have to deal with some Hylden Lords and Ancient Vampire Lords to stop a war in the making.

[@Teixas666]

@@ranzigerkaefer its not that simple. if Ariel doesnt get murdered by Mortanius Kain will not be born in time t otake part of the events and eventually bem urdered and turned into a vampire by Mortanius. and if this Kain didnt come to be, then he cannot travel bakc in time ot do any of this. also killing the EG might not be possible, he is Atemporal(exists at all point of history at once), the hope may lie instead in banishing him from the material realm by severing his connection ot the wheel.

[@sor90]

​@@jumnei5159no the pillars are still corrupted and so is the Kain of that time period. the only one who was actually purified is the future Kain.

[@PerceptionVsReality333]

I can't believe they never made another LOK game after all these years.

[@Ouromia]

And some people say the series ended in a cliffhanger? This is clearly an ending.

[@ryansmith4494]

Not really. The pillars are still in ruin. Need new guardians that need to become vampires. ...they also have to find someway to make humans into vampires The Elder God is still around. There are so many other problems, but those are the main problems that slap you in the face.

[@Cypherus21]

@@ryansmith4494 How is the Elder God still around? Even in the new timeline with a young Kain in Blood Omen 2, the Elder God is non-existent and the Hylden Lord was defeated by Young Kain. Nosgoth can regain its true self under Young Kain's new empire and the Pillars assigning guardianship to young Kain's new vampires.

[@ryansmith4494]

​@@Cypherus21in the fourth timeline Kain injured the Elder God, but he didn't kill him. Kain told the Elder God to bury deep. None of what you're saying can be possible the timelines don't work like that. Everything that happened still happened.

[@Cypherus21]

@@ryansmith4494 I do not follow you and you are lacking explanation about the 4th timeline. I never said the Elder God was killed, only that he was made powerless or non-existent now that he had no stranglehold over the souls of Nosgoth or Old and Young Kain's vampire destiny. There simply is no evidence as per Blood Omen 2 that the Elder God has any influence over events especially as he relied on Moebius to be his mover and shaker (who is now also dead). I suppose the only thing fans do not know is: the events after Defiance and before Blood Omen 2 (like how was Vorador resurrected?), and if the Old or Young Kain was able to follow their destiny in tandem after the events of Blood Omen 2. Not sure if that is fair to say the series ended in a cliffhanger - just a conclusion that allows fan theory.

[@ryansmith4494]

@@Cypherus21The Elder God is tied to Raziel’s story not Kain’s story. There’s no reason for him to be included in Blood Omen 2. Moebius isn’t dead until the ending of Defiance he’s still pissing about. Vorador is a weird ass plot hole they couldn’t fit in due to time constraints. Everything that happened still happened. There’s no new destiny for the Blood Omen 2 Kain.

[@barbedwire1987]

@Shetyre The company of Crystal Dynamics and Eidos that made the game were going through an acquisition by Square Enix while CD and Eidos were in development of the 6th game. In development the script of the game had been changed a few times and by then CD and Eidos had cancelled the project due to time constraints. combined with the exit of two key CD staff members director/writer Amy Hennig and game designer Richard Lemarchand The deaths of voice actor Tony Jay and CD employee Kyle Mannerberg

[@georgewashington4866]

You gotta figure that the 4th game would have Kain searching for a way to free Raziel from the Reaver and in the end Kain faces the possessed Janos and at the end, Janos reveals that you can stab a dead body and force any soul within the Reaver into it permanently, so Kain stabs Janos' dead body and calls for Raziel's soul to enter Janos' dead body.

[@Radat45]

Ah,when i remember my self playing this game for a hours per day on my old ps1

[@PhantomBoy7]

Filip Radat this is a PS2 Game

[@Somegoy]

I honestly think kain removed the sword and set it like he did it hopes that raziel could see from the eyes in the cross guard at the new kingdom and future they just made.

[@BoyKagome]

I bet Amy actually wrote that one.

[@jimhuffman9434]

Hope is indeed an illusion

[@naragrace3870]

Zero dislikes!!! Let’s goooooo

[@ryansmith4494]

There's five now. Damn Sarafan.

[@maxenite]

@@ryansmith4494 ahaha "Damn Sarafan" lol

[@rikybj0276]

Why they don't made the final game???

[@Galois-88]

Amy Henning was dismiss of square enix

[@rikybj0276]

@@Galois-88 why?

[@Galois-88]

@@rikybj0276 good quest hahaha

[@Galois-88]

@@rikybj0276 but bluepoint buy the director's of legacy of kain serie and is probably they will be a remake

[@Shetyre]

ther eis one thing that doenst make any sense at all, kains starts this war and so follows Blood Omen 2 in which he wins agaist the saraphan lord and follows the Era of Soul reaver to kill Raziel and start the prophecy, so whats the outcome of nosgoth ??? kain still didnt rendered its history at all...

[@Krooksbane]

Alex The outcome is that now future Kain is uncorrupted, and can now attack the elder God directly. Therefore he can alter the ENTIRE history if he wants to, he could basically re-write his own destiny as balance guardian, free of corruption. Which is what he’s been seeking all along. It was Moebius, and behind the scenes, the elder God who used him to try and finish off the Vampires. They tried to kill him at every turn, using Raziel to assassinate him. What ended up happening is Raziel was the key to purging Kain of his corruption, as vision Kain witnessed back in the Soul Reaver 1 timeline.

[@usamazahid3882]

That's entirely true. I'm willing to bet that if he REALLY wants to alter the ENTIRE history, he could've gone waaayyyyy back, like 1500 years back to the time when the Humans rebelled against the vampires long before the Sarafan crusade, and along with the Soul Reaver blade (Imbued with Raziel's soul, the pure spirit form (with which lifted the veil from their sight), and Hope) itself, been able to convince the humans and Vampires alike, to see the error of their ways that Mobieus, the Elder God, and the Hylden were the ones responsible for these chains of events happening in the future. So that the Humans would eventually volunteer to remain turned by the Ancient Vampire ancestors in order to preserve their bloodline and sustain the Binding to keep the Hylden away from the Pillars of Nosgoth as it remained as intended under Vampire Guardianship, then that would be the end result that Nosgoth would become restored along with Balance itself.

[@wuffy8006]

kain doesn't have free will. not even now. so he can't change history without a paradox.

[@alonso1288]

Alex the Kain in BO2 is not this Kain but the younger Kain that just destroyed the Pilars. There is no official version of what happened to this future Kain free or corruption. I want to believe that he came back to his own timeline in the future and restored Nosgoth.

[@Weyk47]

The Kain in Defiance already did all of that m8. When kain saves raziel from killing himself in soulreaver 2 it creates a paradox/changes history and Kain remembers all of blood omen 2 in an instant.

[@brianwalters7855]

"Vae Victis!" Kain. Blood Omen: Legacy of Kain. November 1st, 1996. 🩸🧛🩸

[@vyacheslavgrinko9993]

*Vae Victis