Wah before Tube Screamer compared to Tube Screamer before Wah - Pedal Order Test

#TubeScreamer #Wah #Pedalorder
I decided to sort of document my exploration of pedal order. We are always told that certain pedals should go before others although it is up to the player ultimately what they prefer. So in this quick video I am comparing Wah before TS and then TS before Wah.
By the way, after experimenting with this I still prefer my Wah before the Tube Screamer but there wasn't a whole lot of difference in the environment I tested in. Keep in mind that at louder volumes or different amps and amp settings things could be completely different. Also, a different Wah and Tube Screamer type pedal might react differently together as well.

[@ariangatollari3423]

Tone is in the Puma socks

[@sheikurbooti7432]

@@ariangatollari3423 well that must be why I’m so awesome too

[@Corpsecrank]

I would sooner believe that his sock DOES contain more tone than tone wood does LOL.

[@DMSProduktions]

Cheese!

[@chainsawteddybear]

VERY TRUE

[@LoudSodaCaleb]

No. TOAN is obviously in the balls

[@kylegordon3675]

wah before sounds more legit and better to my ears. the distortion can add back in harmonics, where when the wah comes last, it filters off everything.

[@DieKottis]

good explanation, thanks a lot!

[@gardendado1999]

exactly, the bode diagram of a wah is essentially a peak filter with variable Q on different frequency positions, you can find images on google "wah pedal bode diagram", this means that the distortion will accentuate the exact tone exalted by the filter instead of equally distorting all the guitar spectrum

[@aslin81]

Yes, but the grit is more controlled... Trade offs I guess.

[@cliffords2315]

Yea me to

[@tonwilson657]

10 on 10, mate. ALSO: Props on clean socks, pedals AND carpet. Some KZbin folks go at it like they play guitar in a dairy barn.

[@jimtess2744]

my cows love it when i practice in the barn.

[@gryphon37]

Seriously....I thought the exact same thing 😏

[@romromk3995]

yall are talking about the sound difference but not appreciating how good his improv is?? its absolutely satisfying

[@KeithB2Thee]

Wah after sounded surprisingly good! Not better or worse, just a slightly different response.

[@Louzahsol]

I always run my wah after my drive/fuzz/distortion pedal because, at least for me, it gives a much gnarlier sound. Like you are making the wah scream

[@KeithB2Thee]

@@Louzahsol Wah after fuzz sounds intriguing. That’s a great idea I’ll have to try!

[@Louzahsol]

@@KeithB2Thee it sounds like the amp is melting and it’s great. Think electric wizard’s guitar solos

[@namebrandmason]

@@KeithB2Theeyou really should. Many old fuzz circuits sound way better when you plug a guitar straight into them.

[@KeithB2Thee]

@@namebrandmason I’ve heard the same regarding some vintage fuzz pedals. If and when I’m fortunate enough to have a vintage fuzz pedal, that’ll be a must.

[@jimmyelectric]

Wah after sounds more vintage! It's like you got the Voodoo Child tone down in spades 😎

[@JDAfrica]

I think the frequency sweep hit the drive harder and pushes that sound better when the wah is before drive. It gasps and had breath - and I like that!

[@freemanmt1]

Agreed

[@ijobrien3]

Before, every time. That's also just a really nice sounding wah!

[@Finn.Diesel]

It´s a great sounding wah! So clean and accurate. Happy the algo showed me your video. 🙂

[@TheOfficialCaseMade]

Wah after just sounds RIGHT. The attack and sweep are so much more aggressive, you get the classic SRV "inhaling" sound. It's what my mind thinks of when I think of a wah.

[@danielbrown2612]

Wah after sounds cleaner but wah before sounds fuller and more in your face. Both sound good. Just depends on what tone you want.

[@Twobarpsi]

Exactly 🤘

[@soundbites1152]

I could hear a notable difference between the 2 setups and I preferred the Wah before the Tube Screamer. I think the tonality shifts of the Wah were accentuated more pleasingly with the Tube Screamer after the Wah. it makes sense that it would work that way and I think it would be the most intuitive way to set up the signal chain. If you have no Tube Screamer, the amp's distortion is going to affect the tonality of the Wah in much the same way, so there you go. My .02 Good playing, by the way.

[@notnoaintno5134]

Killer playing man, i gotta see how youre playin some of those licks

[@user-yv3xr1qc6t]

Distorting the filter or filtering the distortion. Both sound legit! Nice video!

[@mirllewist3086]

more similar thank I expected. thanks!

[@skyemoz6559]

Sounded great before. Nice playing

[@leftyzappa]

I like it after. Meaner! Vicious licks dude 😸

[@markusaurelius777]

Killer chops bro !!! :O

[@GuitarMallen]

@@markusaurelius777 wow, thank you!

[@vudunof]

Wah before TS🤘

[@musoseven8218]

Nice playing, nice comparison too, I think I prefer the first 🤔🤔

[@williamdevlin366]

Thank you!!! Great stuff!!!

[@GuitarMallen]

@@williamdevlin366 thank you!

[@tgchan]

god bless 1min or less videos/ Thank you.

[@markwiegard8384]

It makes sense the before has the best sound really. The wah was coloring the tube scream after. It’s the same thing with pedal order and a volume pedal. Placing the volume pedal after the distortion then you phaser, reverb, delay allows the effects pedals to continue the input sound if you closed the volume pedal. Distortion, then wah, then volume pedal then effects.

[@Gutch220]

Wah before is much better. This is due to the low input impedance of the wah pedal when matched with a direct high impedance guitar signal. You can hear a significant volume loss with the wah afterwards due to this. The initial wah first set-up has a much better/clearer/stronger signal.

[@vhateg]

I was going to argue with your opinion, then I remembered pedals go from right to left. 🤦‍♂️ It sounds so much better in the first configuration.

[@tigermosquitorecords]

To play that kind of the same scales and the same blues since the 60s, YES, it is better in front of the drive. But there are hundreds of different ways to use a guitar. After a fuzz, for example, it works like a killer filter... just before a short delay. I would never use a wah before the drive... but I would never play blues or metal either..

[@james-sf5yc]

If you listen to Hendrix you can tell he did both.

[@tigermosquitorecords]

@@james-sf5yc I don't like Hendrix. I don't like blues.

[@james-sf5yc]

@@tigermosquitorecords your taste in music doesn't affect the sound of your wah. I was actually agreeing with you.✌

[@norahmotekar]

Nice video

[@JacobMedrea]

Wah after sounds just badass

[@garyclarke9557]

I always put the way after. But after seeing this I might try it the other way. Might switch but I doubt it

[@jimjim7008]

I have these exact same socks from Marshalls

[@james-sf5yc]

I think when I listen to Hendrix's stuff, he does both. There's a few songs where the volume fade on the "wahs gate" is really audible. (not sure my use of "Wahs gate" is correct)

[@thedazedbandman]

Despite playing guitar for a long time, I only recently got into guitar pedals, so oddly enough this is a new concept. I can’t really hear much difference, but it’s interesting to know that’s possible. One of the pedals I got recently was seemingly giving me problems when it was turned off, and I was using a different one. Is there a recommended way to line up stuff like phasers, chorus, and etc. ? Also, thanks for reminding me why a wah pedal is cool. I got too lazy when I first got mine, but now I’m thinking about trying it out again.

[@CosmicWaltz7]

It's best to look into videos on pedal order for this - sometimes called a signal chain or effect chain - because there's a generally accepted order of effects types, but there's also no real rules about it if it gets you a cool sound. Generally, though, you have to think of how the sound is being changed by each effect, and how that works into the next one. Early in your effect chain, you usually want stuff like your tuner, noise gate, compressor, or filter pedals like your wah, followed by your drive pedals, then modulation pedals like chorus, flanger, phaser, then end off on delay and reverb. Now, it gets a little different based on your amp. Some amps, you can run this all in the front line, but if you use your amp for overdrive tone, then it can make those later effect types sound wrong. In that case, you'd want to see if you have an effect loop on your amp, so you can run the first two "sections" of your signal chain - before the modulation - into the front of the amp, and have the mod, delay, and reverb sections in the effect loop of the amp. This basically takes the amp tone and places it between the drive and mod sections of your signal, then it hits the speaker at the end, so you're not distorting anything at the end. All that said, I sometimes run a reverb into my drive section, so, it comes down to experimentation. Hell, sometimes mistakes even pay off, like how David Gilmour's crazy seagull screech sound was him accidentally hooking in a wah backwards. I started pretty similar. Thought going in that I'd need a wah, and, that'd probably be it. Think that was 17 years ago. Now I have about 25 pedals in my board, and a closet full of extras in case I get an interesting idea for a sound. Good luck. And as for that pedal making noise when off, do a search on it. There's a lot of reasons for noise, from improper powering, to lines crossing, to sometimes just being too close to a florescent light or conduit in the wall.

[@HBercut]

I swear to God, dude changed his socks right before doing the video.

[@supramanx1997]

Bro are those socks still comfy or what? Mine have held up since this video went up at least...

[@bulkvanderhuge9006]

I always used my Wah AFTER the Distortion, it always sounded so much better to me. The Wah would mess with the new tones coming from the Distortion and accent them

[@Jake-rv8td]

Wah, after sounds more vintage to me. Like hendrix tone almost. Neither order is right or wrong, though. It's what you want your sound to be that is important.

[@MrUmandMrEr]

Wah after TS sounds more Jimi

[@djboost2981]

On bass I've found using the Screamer (or any overdrive) before wah is a good bet. Gets you that killer Cliff Burton sound if you use the Morley wahs.

[@GuitarMallen]

Wow, I didn't know that. I am going to try that with my bass and my Morley Wah, thank you!

[@micksterminator3]

I have that Morley power fuzz wah from the 60s or 70s that he used. Got it for like 40usd in real good shape locally. Sounds heavy as hell! Gotta cut the guitar volume quite a bit to get something kinda usable, more transparent. You can also use the pedal for wet dry when in fuzz mode. Works as a volume pedal with wah and fuzz off. Way cool!

[@GuitarMallen]

@@micksterminator3 oh sweet, so that's what he used. Is that how he got that sound on "(Anesthesia) - Pulling Teeth"?

[@micksterminator3]

@@GuitarMallen I believe so. That's what I've read in forums at least. Who knows lol. I'd only use these as separate effects. They kinda sound bad together but it has its charm

[@havable]

What if there's a screamer on each side?

[@michael_caz_nyc]

Wah > T.S. - the Vox Wah Sounded Killer.

[@NoPlaceForTheDead]

I always route mine with the wah between two dirt pedals.

[@JONNIE_ROCKER]

👍👍

[@UR2Compliant]

You are damn good son! But I'd like to hear what it sounds like with Adidas socks!

[@purplemonkeyelephant]

Wah after for the first solo, wah before for the big finale

[@AvengeXKing]

Some ppl really make penetonic sing. Some people put me to sleep with it. This one made Jimi perk his ears up from the grave. Solid.

[@user-xs6ux4dk9y]

Puma pouncing on that pedal!

[@jiminnorthdallas1227]

It just depends what sound you’re looking for. Each has its merits and debits.😉

[@michaelkiese7794]

There’s a difference, but for me it’s not significant enough for me to hyperfocus on it. I like to have my wah on the far right of my pedal board, so for me, wah first. Also consider using buffered vs true bypass pedals. If you use a lot of true bypass pedals, that will muddy up your bypassed clean tone, so wah first would be preferential for that as well.

[@jacobwaters9675]

Everyone should have a tube screamer in their pedal arsenal 😅

[@kicikocani1]

before was better after somekind lost volume

[@ImYourOverlord]

Each has its merit. I prefer wah before OD.

[@godsmacking99]

Wah and other expression pedals don't like anything in front of them. They always sound the best being the first in line and having the unaffected guitar signal hitting it first. You can hear a distinct loss in volume with it coming after the boost pedal. Whereas boost pedals are the opposite and they react best being last in line before going to the front of the amp. At the end of the day, it's whatever you think sounds best, there is no right or wrong. Just a preferred method for pedal order and for most professional pedalboard builders, wah is almost always first in line and it's that way for a reason.

[@LMacNeill]

I like the Wah *after* the Tube Screamer -- but that's probably because I'm not a big fan of the Tube Screamer anyway, and the Wah filters out the harshness I dislike from the Tube Screamer. I'm not a big fan of distortion pedals in general -- better to get the distortion "naturally" from a tube amp being overdriven. That's where the sound originated, and that's still the best way to reproduce it. A nice Marshall amp with separate gain and volume controls, a great pair of P90 pickups, and you can dial in the best-sounding distortion ever with no need of a distortion pedal.

[@IbonIturrate]

So with the wah before tubescreamer, the wah pedal is connected directly to the guitar and the tubescreamer directly to the amp??

[@GuitarMallen]

Yeah for the wah first, the signal chain I used in this video is guitar to wah then out of wah into tube screamer and out to the amp. I hope that answers your question.

[@robertmac71]

Seems like the wah is more responsive and more effective before the TS to me.

[@e-henne]

Wah after the OD sounds muffled in comparison. A lot of people complain about the extreme ends of the wah sounding bad, so I can see why people would like the wah second.. Personally, I'd rather not have my sound be blanketed and just buy a wah like the Dime wah that can be set to sound like either of these settings.

[@pandorski35000]

nice wha tone, what model is it ?

[@GuitarMallen]

@@pandorski35000 thank you, it's the Vox V847-A

[@Shell_Beach]

Dammit now I have to rearrange my board.

[@Mrmustard1380]

Guitar>wah>OD>amp. Always

[@shader26]

Which wah are you using here? Sounds good both ways but agree, slightly like the sweep of wah into TS.

[@GuitarMallen]

@@shader26 thanks for asking, this is the Vox V847a.

[@shader26]

@@GuitarMallen thanks. I have one I think. Have been using Dunlop 535Q and sometimes a Budda Bud-wah. But I tried same as yours a few years ago and didn’t hear that great vocal and sweep qualities, so thanks, I’m gonna dig it out and give it another shot. One thing I do like in a wah though, an LED. So many times at gigs I think I’ve turned it off but it isn’t and I sit and wonder why my tone is so trebly, or bassy and the realize it’s still on.

[@GuitarMallen]

@@shader26 honestly when I used to gig I used the Morley Bad Horsie because it only turned on when I stepped on it. I didn't like its sound as much but it had the led as well and I needed that live.

[@GuitarMallen]

I should also add that I use reverb on my amp and in my opinion it makes the wah sound better (to me at least).

[@dennissprague2572]

Wah before sounds fuller. Nice tone

[@jackhaugh]

Dude, I’m a pedal board geek. I’m constantly tearing them down and setting them up again. I don’t mix analog and digital. I have the Wah pedal first on every single board I’ve ever put together. I’ve even got a Nirvana board set up now with a wah pedal on it first for no good reason. I’ve just always done it that way. I guess when I rebuild it, the wah will just be there. I don’t hear much of a difference between the 2. Sounds good, though!

[@gardendado1999]

but what if you want to filter a reverb or delay, what if you want to filter a feedbacking signal

[@Rhythmicons]

The wah is a filter. One wants to generate the harmonics first (distortion) and then filter them out. But there isn't a wrong way to mangle the sounds as this video shows.

[@james-sf5yc]

I've been saying this for yrs, When people speak of "correct" wah placement. You can tell when you listen to Jimi, he placed his wah both before and after distortion, it's very obvious on certain songs.

[@kylegordon3675]

if your goal is perfect filtering, then what you say makes sense, but if the goal is a great sound, it doesnt hurt at all that the distortion is adding in some frequencies that the wah already cut out. sounds better to me with the wah first.

[@Rhythmicons]

@@kylegordon3675 What makes filters musically desirable isn't the perfect subtraction of all of the third-order harmonics, but the emphasis of the frequencies around the cutoff point. The more harmonics available to filter out, the better the sweep sounds. What makes modular style subtractive synthesis like this so worthwhile is that there is no wrong way for the signal to flow. I agree with you completely about putting more harmonics after the wah. My 535q has a boost just for that. However, it is also true that if you put a filter after a sine wave, which has only the fundamental, the only thing that is going to happen is that it will flatten out and become inaudible. Creative patching FTW!

[@kylegordon3675]

​@@Rhythmicons I can tell that you know what youre talking about, and me too, so cool. :) You're talking about the resonance of the filter, a bump at the cutoff frequency, usually found in 2 and 4 pole low pass filters. And that, plus the phase issues that the filter causes around the cutoff frequency both work to draw the ear to that frequency, and give that chewy wah sound (and the wah is also a bandpass so there are some low cuts too) And I hear your point about there being more energy for the filter to play with if the distortion is first. Im just saying that I like the wah going into the distortion, because the distortion adds some sparkle above the cutoff frequency in terms of harmonic distortion. So I hear the wah, and then it's a little brighter and hairier than if the filter comes last and more perfectly conforms the sound just to the bands its passing. And if the source lacks harmonics, then your point is well taken too, but a strat has enough for the wah to grab on to, and the distortion after is a classic sound. Of course its a matter of taste, and context, but generally I like the wah first for that reason. But what youve said about the resonance is certainly a big part of why the wah sounds the way it does. I just dig it dirtied up after, instead of the distortion being more tamed or conformed by the filter.

[@Rhythmicons]

@@kylegordon3675 Most of my experience is with Moog modulars and monosynths. When I'm playing a clavinet, which I'm sure you know has guitar and bass strings running through a humbucker, it usually goes to a Crybaby 535q (stack of dimes inductor) and then to a 6G6B Bassman. The crybaby has a boost and that's usually sufficient for me, cause I can't just crank the Bassman without the cops getting called. My default presumption would be that post-wah distortion is going to be coming from the amp. It sounded great both ways, and maybe even a little better with the wah after the tube screamer in the video. My amp is in the shop, but just yesterday I was thinking about throwing the guitar on the scope.

[@djtomoy]

Those nice socks must be adding a little to the tone 🤔

[@alexandretiberiuskirk3392]

Almost imperceptible difference, I had to watch couple of time for notice it but it finally hit me: The first one sounded more dirty. The second one a little cleaner. Both played an except from Hendrix, which demands a dirtier sound, but I can see the second one in a more modern sound because it sounds a lot smoother.

[@furthur96]

Your sound is nice, have you tried stacking two tubescreamers?

[@GuitarMallen]

@@furthur96 thank you! I haven't tried that. I do however have a pedal called the Kollmanation pedal which is almost like two tube screamers in one pedal but I don't use it with both on.

[@strikeouttwo7295]

1 Wah 2 Tubescreamer 3 Puma

[@3chordsnmore]

What was the rest of your signal chain?

[@GuitarMallen]

@@3chordsnmore for this video it was guitar into the wah and tube screamer and then to my DSL 40c amp. There is reverb but it is the reverb from the amp itself. Oh and I was using a Fender Strat (made in Mexico).

[@trevorgwelch7412]

Same Difference

[@janreeh]

PUMA!

[@KenSlager]

My preference is, Turn It Down!!! 😂😂

[@Mikishots]

In any chain, the wah comes first. Guitar, tuner, wah, then everything else.

[@andrewclemons8619]

What if theres a germanium diode fuzz in the mix?

[@madslagsallupinthisgaff]

that's the point of this video - it sounds good both ways, don't just do what you're told

[@MrMojabo]

Tuner wah, then everything else. Fuzz last. It's simple distortion before wah more distorted wah, distortion after wah less distorted wah.

[@madslagsallupinthisgaff]

@@MrMojabo Actually, do whatever you like.

[@nath1606]

I put my phaser before my overdrive :)

[@stratcat3216]

Wah before dist.. always

[@creamwobbly]

I found a mutieffects patch with chorus before distortion and I was so confused but it sounds wild. The only right way is what sounds right.

[@TheTraubenstein]

I see you shop at Costco

[@stoneyboyd]

I prefer the Wah after the Tube screamer

[@dananthony6258]

I like it before . It has more of a nasally grow and like the amps being pushed more. KZbin is hard to listen to because of its compression.

[@lazarusshrr4487]

what wah is that

[@GuitarMallen]

It's the Vox V847A wah.

[@kougan_music]

Wah before for rock Wah after for funk sounds funkier idk

[@coreyroberts47]

I think the same

[@witchfindergeneral13]

My ears like the wah before the dirt box.

[@deepfake1998]

wah goes BEFORE as it filters out frequencies

[@SilverSkyline92]

What wah pedal is that?

[@GuitarMallen]

@@SilverSkyline92 the one I am using in this video is the Vox V847-A.

[@SilverSkyline92]

@@GuitarMallen thank you

[@nomadwolfox2140]

sounds like its more compressed to me, i dunno?

[@gardendado1999]

distortion gives the illusion of compression because you're cutting the waveform above certain amplitude, this on a very basic level, each distortion pedal has it's own quirks of course, the wah after sounds less dynamic in volume because the entire signal is being fairly distorted so the volume is more or less "equal" while moving the wah because of that

[@dwreal]

Costco Puma!

[@alessiovitali315]

I prefer wah after drives

[@ModernMaleSolutions]

Was after is too clean for my tastes. I like the nastiness of the wah before distortion.

[@newage5d831]

How much did Puma pay for this? How much?

[@GuitarMallen]

Hahaha, I wish!

[@butterblood]

Listen to Pets by Porno For Pyros to really hear the difference.

[@tommj4365]

Wah before is better. I like my wah more subtle.

[@roycorroy]

Why not both? Yeah, put two tube screamers with a Wah in the middle!!

[@lordofashes8262]

I always put mine after. But im crazy so dont listen to me😊

[@tonychavez1733]

Wha first

[@mattfischer3853]

Can’t tell the difference…great playing though, digging the overall sound

[@AudioStorm1980]

You must not play.

[@yaboidustin2447]

​@AudioStorm1980 I do, and I can't tell the difference, because it's all in yalls heads.

[@AudioStorm1980]

@@yaboidustin2447 I meant no disrespect. Look into voicing. Sometimes the treble bleeds through more. Sometimes the other way around. That's the big difference I heard in this vid. Maybe listen to it over with some good headphones and not a phone speaker. where this matters to me is playing at louder volumes in person....I mean like when I'm right next to my amp.

[@moroboshidan7960]

Man, wah after sounds clearly more smooth and kinds muffled compared to before. I kinda both, but there's a clear difference.

[@suffersystemstudios]

lol at people thinking there is some huge difference between the two sounds.

[@mspeedm5849]

aby switch in order here. Both sound good and both sound bad

[@johnrivera1533]

Sounds the same to my ears.

[@joesmith8398]

Nice socks...

[@shure81]

Wah after the OD just has no life at all. It's amazing how much order of pedals can destroy a tone

[@horsewithahat012]

puma socks sponser

[@pmay222]

yah never noticing in a live setting...no way

[@Sputnick60]

needs more cowbell

[@eti313]

In this case, wah before is better.

[@BlackDogOriginal]

No wrong way, but the wah belongs in front.

[@Microtonal_Cats]

first one is better.