Guitars That Go Out Of Tune

[@HAMMERHEAD-g3h]

I used to be in some guitar Facebook groups but you hear so many stupid myths that I had to leave them. There's no point in having 30 years of guitar knowledge if the people you're trying to spread it to, believes these myths. I've bought many different stratocasters from all country of origin from America to China. I was on a fender group and I would try to tell people how good some of these Indonesian guitars were and they would basically laugh. I got on Facebook one day and posted a video of me using a classic vibe to play Hot for teacher. Everybody thought it was some high-end strat and they were commenting on my playing. When I told them it was a classic vibe, the comments stopped lol.

[@two50ne77]

sounds like boomers being boomers

[@JohnnyBgood548]

The Classic Vibe is an excellent guitar.

[@HAMMERHEAD-g3h]

@@two50ne77 No, it's usually the younger generation from my experience. Boomers grew up during some great times and they typically know their stuff. The guy that works on my guitars is a boomer and he is outstanding. No BS.

[@two50ne77]

@@HAMMERHEAD-g3h the younguns are not on facebook anymore

[@mrbigg7255]

@@two50ne77no, brand name matters. Every generation judges everyone from the brand of clothes to shoes and their guitars.

[@wilddoug]

Locking nut isn’t zero friction, but 100% friction. 😀

[@_NoDrinkTheBleach]

I remember when I bought a Carvin DC127C in the late 90s, a lot of people looked at it and said I was crazy because I had a graph tech nut and a Floyd bridge. But I have never had any issues with the guitar coming back to pitch in the 25+ years I've had it.

[@Mpcoluv]

I think Phil and Andre underestimate just how many guitars are sold today with poorly cut nuts that bind. Especially in the midrange price point.

[@I.am_Groot]

That is something I miss about hands on shopping. If there are a few models in stock play them and see which has level frets, correct slotted nut, etc. Even if it happen by accident lol when you find one that is RIGHT take it home. About 10 years ago I worked on setup skills including fret work nut slotting etc. Made all the difference. Now even a cheap guitar is going to play right once I get it home so its more picking what I like

[@anttihuovilainen1653]

And overestimate how many guitars ever see a competent tech. I’d be surprised if even 10% of buyers ever take their guitar to a decent tech for a full checkup.

[@RICO_SUAVE21]

I replaced all my guitar nuts with graphtec tusqxl and also added locking tuners… no issues with my tuning stabling since 😊

[@I.am_Groot]

My ride or die is a 96 MIM strat its a relic (played and played and played...not faked) and one of the reasons I bought it was after playing it for half an hour trying to get over the paint cracks, cig burns on the headstock and overall beat up look of it the thing stays in tune better than any non locking trem I ever tried I added some 'nut sauce' to the bridge and nut after getting it home and even better. A few dives and whammy moves its in tune. A well cut nut and balanced setup is all you need

[@lavaughnjames3424]

I have a 98 mim that I put a suhr pickguard in. 85% as good as a real 60s Strat, love it

[@mikekozi-lester3887]

Nice video 📹 and workmanship Phil and Andrew Fludd

[@SH-pq5zq]

I installed a Hipshot tremesetter on my partscaster (as well as making sure the bone nut is smooth)… it’s an old device, but it seems to really help my guitar stay in tune…and u can bend a string and still keep open strings in tune….

[@The-11]

This was a good podcast and clip. We do hold on to old info like it's law. Time to grow as a community. Now, about Tone Wood.........

[@I.am_Groot]

I am still not sure why some people get so worked up about wood tone. Everything affects tone. Yet very little destroys tone if you are using good materials. If a guitar does not stay in tune and isn't intonated properly the 'tone' will be off no matter what wood is used

[@The-11]

@I.am_Groot Yeah, I don't understand why, either. I put that to give Phil and everyone a laugh. Everything makes a bit of difference, but what percentage, who really knows. 🤔 I think neck material is more important than the body. I prefer maple with a maple or ebony board. ✌️

[@HAMMERHEAD-g3h]

​​@@I.am_Grootwell, I personally think it's because they will charge you a crazy amount of money for certain woods and tell you that it gives you better tone when you can't really hear the difference. I've probably owned 50 or 60 guitars in my lifetime and I don't even care what kind of wood they're made of as long as it's not super heavy. Having said that, all I heard for years growing up in the '90s was how mahogany sounds like this and alder sounds like this and then you go out and play the guitars and they sound so close that it didn't even seem to matter. You know what I'm saying?

[@scottoleson1997]

@@The-11I agree you can definitely hear the resonance of a maple neck vs alternatives

[@TVsBen]

Really glad to see Dr. Fludd on your channel. I love the content that both of you produce, and I'm really glad to see you feature him on your channel.

[@hoangnguyennguyen1032]

Here's a crazy idea (emphasis on crazy). Use vespel for the nut. It's extremely durable, and it glides off of the strings very smoothly. In fact, Blue Chip picks are made out of those. If you have a properly cut vespel nut, then you pretty much don't have to worry about strings binding. If there's anyone crazy enough to spend on that experiment, that'll be fun lol. A sheet of that costs more than a thousand bucks though.....😢

[@donald-parker]

I find the whole trem discussion fascinating. For good trem systems there are two diametrically opposed schools of thought (both of which can be quite functional) - prevent all movement and make all movement as frictionless as possible. And then there is Gibson and Bigsby who just kind of missed the boat entirely - let's design trems that maximize both movement and friction.

[@thegolfingmusician6345]

I’ve owned about 15 PRS guitars, both core and se’s. The trem doesn’t knock them out of tune but if you bend a note it definetely goes out of tune. You then have to wiggle the trem to get it back in tune. VERY annoying!

[@brandonjackson5865]

Time look at those nut slots you’re binding in the nut still , to prove this bend a string and release it, now it’s sharp, pull straight out away from the fretboard on the string, is it back in tune ? Or you can take your finger and push down on the string behind the nut and you’re basically resetting the string. If you’re diving only with your trem you aren’t pulling the string the same direction as bending sharp, if that makes any sense ?

[@ErikCIng]

I’ve tried to avoid locking nuts, and Floyd-type systems because of the overhead involved in their setup and maintenance. Cutting the ball ends off the strings, making sure the string is properly seated and clamped into the saddle. Then trying to get as much travel out of the fine tuners to allow for tuning adjustments after it’s all locked down… Ugh. With non-locking systems, I’ve been able to keep my guitars pretty much in tune… aside from the damn G string. Always goes sharp after a dive, and then flat after a bend. Only the G string. I also keep my trems dive-only so I can drop tune and not throw the other strings out of tune. Finally I narrowed the G string issues down to the saddle. The nut was fine. It was the saddle where the string would not seat exactly where it had been before diving or bending. Cue a set of Wilkinson locking saddles (saw them on a Suhr and bought a set). G string now completely behaving, and I maintain the freedom to drop tune, and string changes are still easy and low maintenance. You know, if you think about a Floyd, the cumbersome saddles they use are unnecessary. Plus the tone block is really only holding the springs. The strings don’t even run through it. Floyd could have stayed closer to the traditional saddle concept while still being lockable, if he designed it more like these Wilk saddles. Would also be better for action and intonation adjustments.

[@r3d5ive87]

I string them backwards. No cutting off the ball ends.

[@Case_]

If only the thing about learning something that was once true 30 years ago and rolling with it for all history applied to just guitars... it's literally everywhere, in any field and regarding any topic. And the worst thing about it is the absolute futility in trying to stop these. You explain the myth to one person and even if they somehow happen to be the kind of person that admits they were wrong instead of just repeating their misconception/myth (which is a lot more common to see), three more pop up. It never ends. The only way it ends is that one day, you finally go "you know what, f it, I give up".

[@RayC234]

Where can I find these $5.00 Nut Files? lol

[@RyRyTheBassGuy]

Seriously! I was hoping the Music Nomad ones were going to be priced lower than the Hosco files. NOPE!

[@I.am_Groot]

@@RyRyTheBassGuy If you are slotting a nut from scratch good files are needed. But if you are just needing to cut the slots better one trick I use is take fine (up to 2000 grit) paper and wrap it around the string rough side down towards the nut. Works best with the string slack or off the guitar that lets you move the sandpaper whatever direction you need and literally slots the nut to the spec of your string gauge

[@RyRyTheBassGuy]

@@I.am_Groot I own plenty of nut files.

[@karldettling5981]

The nut slot has to be rounded like the string just bigger then the strings diamater with a smooth ramp up from the tuners. With a flat section as wide as about 3 or 4 wraps of the strings windings. And the bridge edge of the nut should have a "very small" rollover on it's edge so the windings on your string don't catch that sharp edge. The flat section should be a very light angle to the bridge side so the string starts to viberate right at the edge of the nut on the bridge side.

[@edwinstovall3334]

Gentlemen, I am the exception that proves the rule. While I, in my mid 60s, am no one's idea of a shredder, I have always gotten along very well with shredder's features. I imagine that many non-shredders enjoy the playability of large frets, flat fretboards and thin necks. I don't drop tune (since I'm mostly a funk and blues player with no need for drop tunings), so I favor vibratos, Floyds and 2-points in particular. I am NOT a fancier of round radius fretboards, thick necks, narrow frets, 6 screw vintage vibratos, 21 fret necks or buried truss rod adjustment access. Those things are all vintage spec, and they ALL SUCK DEEP! There's a reason why Fender can't sell me anything new, while just 3 years ago I bought a Jackson JS22 Dinky brand new out of Guitar Center. Yes, I know Fender owns Jackson, but Fender is mired in that vintage/barely modern set. Jackson already has a metal reputation, so it makes sense that even their budget stuff is fairly well metalled out. The main feature that Jackson has that plays into your main subject matter is that damn hockey stick headstock. The person who designed it must have thought straight string pull was a term used in skeet shooting! The gross misalignment of the tuner posts with the nut's string slots is particularly troublesome on this Floyd-less guitar; I installed a GraphTech Black TusQ nut to alleviate the tuning problems. That plus copious lubrication in several areas gets the stability decent. I often wish I could see Jimi Hendrix with a Floyd Rose equipped guitar. He was said to have often bemoaned the tuning instability of his Strats!

[@marcioastorpooter9156]

There's nothing that can beat a double locking floyd rose trem.

[@edwinstovall3334]

@@marcioastorpooter9156 No, there isn't!

[@deludedreality89]

@@edwinstovall3334 After playing a Kahler cam bridge I really can't go back to the Floyd.

[@edwinstovall3334]

@@deludedreality89 Part of me wants to argue, but I really can't -- because I've never had occasion to deal with a Kahler. I've had a Kahler SPYDER, but that's really just a Floyd Rose licensed. I've heard that the Kahlers are very different animals; the construction would seem to bear that out. After that, I'll take your word for it.

[@ESP77769]

I have a guitar with an old Floyd Rose locking nut, with the locking tops off. Unlocked, that nut stays in tune better than any other guitar I've played. Makes me wonder...

[@two50ne77]

commenting bc i love your channel

[@PhillipMcKnight]

thank you

[@84kjk]

Why does my guitar go out of tune so much then. So much that took off the vib arm? Hard to keep a Jaguar in tune.

[@darrylhubbard931]

Hey Brother Hello from Canada

[@riggitywrckd4325]

I'm personally a bone nut guy. I don't like getting ptfe on my hands whenever I play so I have to switch those plastic based nuts out every time.

[@Chalepastel]

makes you wonder how many guitar myths and sayings are actually true... like, maybe graphite on a plastic nut was bullshit vs graphite on a bone or a bronze nut... or the quality of the machining on the tremolo that can make a 20 bucks floyd rose clone stays in tune "better" than a 100 bucks of boutique tremolos

[@danmar007]

Imagine you're playing a song and all of a sudden your guitar starts playing a different song. This could very well be an alleged A.I. enhanced guitar.😅

[@HunnysPlaylists]

Nearly all tremolo systems go out of tune.

[@zThisPlay]

"Certain gibsons" 😅😅

[@ytube777]

Research Gore-Tex. Same thing.

[@_metal_militia773]

so....its not gremlins?! mind blown! :P

[@Aaron-zh4kj]

It's annoying to me the constant polarization between the old school guitarists playing classic beautiful, classy guitars but with inferior, worse designs from the past that don't perform as well for nostalgia and at the same time, the modern metalheads adopting all the good new technology but often putting them in some of the ugliest guitars you've ever seen. Make me guitar with all the classy colors and aesthetics of a '66 Fender Jazzmaster (block inlays, shell pink or sonic blue, white pickguard), but give me super modern, indestructible specs (high end stainless steel frets, roasted maple neck, a two point dive only tremolo bridge, a graphtech nut, and a classic/alnico-voiced fishman fluence set of pickups). Reverend is maybe the closest company to doing this.

[@wardharrison]

Y’all clearly don’t play a lot of acoustic guitar

[@marcioastorpooter9156]

You're oversimplifying the issue by saying the nut is the only thing that causes strings to go out of tune in guitars with tremolos. There's tremolo springs tension, the strings can be wound loose around the tuners, the ball-ends also can be in a bad position inside the trem, the balls of the ball-ends themselves move in relation to the string etc. Double-locking Floyd roses are still the best way to prevent the strings from going out of tune, if you want to have a trem bar. Their feeling is also superior. The reason why they are losing market share is that people nowadays like to change the tuning of their guitars a lot, when they play metal, or they don't use the tremolo so radically and so often, when they play other styles. It's still the best technology, almost everything else is more primitive.

[@mykneeshurt8393]

Ad blockers violate KZbin's Terms of Service

[@two50ne77]

so what, youtube police is going to get me?

[@DoctorBiobrain]

Ad blockers steal from creators. I’m happy watching a few dumb ads knowing that the KZbinrs I watch are getting some pennies from it.

[@two50ne77]

@@DoctorBiobrain nah, just buy a superchat or some merch now and then. directly support them rather than giving corporations your attention, unless you actually like to watch ads.

[@MHChang2014]

​​@@two50ne77 Totally true, plenty of ways to support creators directly than use ad blockers. Buy a shirt, donate in their live streams, but otherwise, KZbin is borderline unusable without an adblocker

[@two50ne77]

@@DoctorBiobrain ad blockers steal from youtube which im ok with. if you like the creator buy their stuff, if you like the artist support them. rather buy a t-shirt from Phil then watch 20 ads and he gets $0.50 from that

[@SeriouslySarius]

Totally disagree. Do some Vai style tremolo use on that PRS etc and it will not go back to tune without a locking nut, at least not straight away.

[@PhillipMcKnight]

like Petrucci on his music man?

[@Bigboybooya666]

You don't need a locking nut. You need a well lubricated nut and the strings stretched

[@stevemc75]

⁠@@Bigboybooya666you don’t need to lubricant a quality nut material.

[@ThePedroDB]

@@Bigboybooya666 for ease of use, locking tuners are a desirable component too. Eliminating string wraps on the tuning pegs removes the potential for the string to move and not return to it's original position.

[@kjsdestin]

@@PhillipMcKnightI love your work. But, show us. I’ve never seen a non-locking trem work as well as a Floyd. Never. Please show us. My guess is you can only come close. Like you said. 2:10