Wii U's a Downgrade for Playing Wii Games

[@NoonDragoon]

I think the most important thing I learned in this video is you can boot straight into Wii mode on a WiiU. I’ve had this console since 2014 and didn’t know that.

[@LandonEmma]

same

[@kevinkite3418]

Same

[@iMatterhorn7]

Hopefully you know now that the Gamepad can act as a Wii game screen and sensor bar when the TV is in use for something else 😎

[@NoonDragoon]

@@iMatterhorn7 that I actually did know! When I first moved into a dorm for college I didn’t have a tv or monitor for the first few months, so I played primarily on my WiiU using the game pad as a screen. It’s how I beat the MP Trilogy when it was digitally released.

[@pessoaanonima6345]

I actually knew that, I think it shows it to you at some point.

[@Supersayainpikmin]

Something for everyone to keep in mind: If your display itself is Limited Range, than this isn't an issue. Using Full Range on Limited Range displays actually results in a washed out image. Same with Vice Versa.

[@StormsparkPegasus]

This. I have a feeling this setting is why some people think the Wii U looks washed out.

[@GhabulousGhoti]

Can confirm that this isn't the case, on my Limited Range monitor and Limited Range capture card the Wii U still looks washed out when compared to Wii on Component and Dolphin running on the computer (also set to Limited Range at the time).

[@FurryMcMemes]

This, though I do own a TV that supports RGB Full Range so it does look washed out but it thankfully isn't that bad because it has a pretty good Color Gamut. Still of course the Wii U remains in Limited Range.

[@jaffaman99]

Came here to say that too, you just have to match the display to the device. Limited range is not a problem at all

[@PieStudios]

@@GhabulousGhoti you have your settings wrong then.

[@ChristeriousNinja]

I did NOT know about holding B to boot straight into Wii mode, that's very useful

[@patrickmurphy9470]

I’m late to the Wii U party but this is good to know. Very handy indeed.

[@mrhelitosis7564]

I did this on accident once.

[@TonyNes64]

Now you know !

[@Snugboy]

Ok Jon I am sorry but I am watching this on the KZbin app on my Wii THROUGH my Wii U so what are you gonna do now??? Huh????? HUH??????

[@megahedgehog2039]

For 10 years. For 10 years I didn't know the gamepad was also a sensor bar.

[@mattrandall1808]

I just purchased two Wii U's and am kind of amazed I didn't buy one before

[@zed_2ed929]

I just found out you could do this because of your comment

[@ric1234510]

Whaaaaaaat?

[@mattiscool11118]

I remember having to use the game pad's sensor bar because my TV broke. Very helpful because I was really into Mario galaxy at the time

[@LeafRazorStorm]

I knew it as soon as the console asked if I wanted to play Wii Mode on “Gamepad Only” and I thought “Well, how the heck does that work?” And then I tried it and was like “Ohh…..”

[@vvizard4994]

Jon mentioned that you can use the Wii U Gamepad only as a display for GC and Wii games, however some of the Wii games that you can download on the Wii U eShop actually have support for the Wii U Gamepad, it's not that many sadly, but some of them do (Xenoblade Chronicles for example can be played in its entirety with the Wii U Gamepad itself)

[@ssj99gohanisthebest48]

Only games that support Classic Controller, the gamepad can be used

[@Puffypoo574]

A couple of days ago I bought RE4 on the eshop thinking that it had gamepad support since it was included under compatible accessories. Lmao that was such a lie. At least the motion controls are really good.

[@VictoryReviews]

I had no idea

[@LoliconSamalik]

Pandora's Tower

[@LoliconSamalik]

@@Puffypoo574 They didn't have it back then so no reason to think it did now

[@samuzamu]

HDMI limited range vs HDMI full range isn't really a question of picture quality. It's more a question of two different standards for color representation and just needs to be in sync between console/PC and monitor/TV. So the Wii U should not look worse just because it's only capable of limited HDMI, you just need to set your display to also use limited. There just seems to be some variance in colour reproduction between different consoles. Really appreciate your exploration of video options and quality otherwise!

[@NoonDragoon]

TV’s sometimes have the RGB range option labeled as “Black Level”. And if your TV gives the option for “Auto” for Black Level, this Auto doesn’t always work. Setting my Black Level to Low manually on my TV makes WiiU games look way better. Auto made my WiiU games look really washed out, probably because it was just defaulting my TV to the High option.

[@chromium5988]

Came here to say this. Set your display device and console to the the same RGB range and they will both good. The problems arise when you set one to limited and the other to full and vice versa :)

[@SianaGearz]

@@chromium5988 Many PC monitors take every source as full range, which is a bit of a problem.

[@chromium5988]

@@SianaGearz yeah that's an issue if you want to use a Wii U on a PC monitor. It's an oversight for sure and very Nintendo 😂

[@kevinfromsales9445]

The real question is, aren't all console games supposed to be played on limited range? Since TVs are mostly limited range only while monitors are full range. So for example if I'm playing a PS2, Wii or even WiiU game on my TV I should always keep it at limited range while if I'm playing WiiU on my monitor than I should switch it from full to limited.

[@Club_Weeg]

Wait I've owned a WiiU since 2014 and used Wii mode a decent amount AND DIDN'T KNOW THAT YOU COULD BOOT STRAIGHT INTO WII MODE BY HOLDING B ON THE GAMEPAD!? That's the most important lesson in this video today Jon.

[@bendovaplz5329]

No way. Awesome

[@LyokoWarrier1fan]

When you talked about the black border in Wii mode on Wii U, the Wii actually has that too it is just that some TVs by default have an overscan setting that crops the image so you don’t notice it. Turn off overscan on your TV while using the Wii and the black border is there. That said, I do think that Nintendo should have scaled the image to get rid of it like they did on the game pad. You do have the option to go in Wii U settings and shrink the display area, then turn on overscan on the TV to crop the black border Hopefully Homebrew one day can fix the issues. I only use my Wii U for Wii stuff because it is convenient for me to just have one system for everything + installed all of my Wii games as Wii U menu apps so I can boot in and out of Wii games much faster

[@skins4thewin]

Agreed, although I suppose these oversights & issues make the original systems relevant to the hardcore audience. For myself, I am not into these systems enough to really care that much. I just love having the all in one nature of the system. My retro consoles are the ones I am more hardcore about.

[@tomaspostorivo]

I fell the same

[@Piggieyt75]

I think the reason why this border exists is to improve game performance. On the GameCube, some games rendered in the full 640x480 window, like Wind Waker, but some rendered in lower resolutions, like Mario Sunshine at 640x448 or Twilight Princess at 608x448. They did this as a way to improve performance in ways that most users would not have noticed due to overscan. This was still a relevant concept with the Wii, since most TVs at the time had plenty of overscan by default.

[@skins4thewin]

@@Piggieyt75 If that was the case then the graphics would have to compensate and wouldn't simply be stretched or squeezed.

[@SirYodaJedi]

Most TVs I've seen only allow you to disable overscan on HD resolutions.

[@TheBlackKid3398]

I'll be honest...I never notice any of this stuff. And even when comparisons are shown, I have a hard time spotting any differences. I just play the game. So, videos like this just go right over my head. I did learn one thing, though. Simply holding the B button to go straight into Wii Mode is something I never knew was a thing until today.

[@godfatherpablo5569]

Absolutely based

[@MoogMuskie]

I don't own a Wii U so I didn't know this was a problem, but personally I don't know how you didn't notice the black bars on the sides of the screen. I likely wouldn't have noticed the resolution difference though.

[@TheBlackKid3398]

Well, that's what I meant. The resolution differences. My fault for not being more clear about it.

[@skins4thewin]

Most definitely isn't for you then. This stuff is for the tech nerds that care about the finer details. It's a niche topic but ya, I am most definitely one of those nerds lol. It's ok to be a casual non-nerd tho. It's also ok to be a nerd who cares bout this stuff.

[@curtispavlovec]

I agree totally. The joy is the games and nostalgia experience not sitting around nitpicking video quality or what have you. It’s good enough.

[@Snivy102]

Before watching this video: The Wii only supports analog out. The WiiU supports digital out (HDMI). Therefore, if you hook your Wii up to a flat screen TV that still has analog in, there will be input delay. Those HDMI adapters you can get for the Wii do not remove the input delay. The WiiU is better for playing Wii games on flat screen TVs for this very reason.

[@podracer35]

0:42 the timing on that cut though

[@windy4566]

0:41 green shell jumpscare

[@alexeivelasquez4770]

Thank you for the warning. I could have had a heart attack, but thanks to you, I can live another hour 😊😊😊.

[@KhaoMortadios]

I'm mixed on this. I can definitely see the differences. Especially with the deflicker. But I don't get why we're talking as if it's an objective downgrade. It's clearly different, but both methods absolutely have their pros and cons. It's always a tradeoff between blurriness and more visible artifacts, and results definitely vary on different TVs. To tell the truth, almost all my experiences connecting SD consoles to HDTVs have been atrocioust, but I've only gotten good results with Wii U's Wii mode through HDMI. Especially on a monitor, which is how I mostly use modern consoles these days. And if you ask me, the best way to play Wii games is with a crt anyway. Neither of these methods is ideal. I can definitely see why others would rather use an HD TV though.

[@mattrandall1808]

The best option is a Panasonic EDTV Plasma imo. I have one and it looks really good on it.

[@Lucrei.]

​@@mattrandall1808we've got old Pana plasma we bought back in 2009. Easily my favourite display in the house even though it's only 1080p. Supports all kinds of inputs too, so flexible.

[@bellowingsilence]

Yeah, I think Wii U outputting 720p or 1080p is the most convenient, easy, decent option for pushing Wii games on native hardware, for modern displays. I mean, if your Wii U doesn’t brick itself out of nowhere, at least.

[@BJsPool87]

I noticed the quality dip when I played Sonic Colors and while I was recording for my upcoming review of Kirby's RTD/Deluxe, something looked off when playing it on my friend's Wii U. Very informative video, Jon!

[@HistoryandReviews]

Wii U looks better

[@perpetualcollapse]

@@HistoryandReviews The 240p test suite would like to disagree. The color bleed is horrendous even on my professionally calibrated TV. Maybe it looks better than direct connection from component to a TV as TVs have terrible scalers, while the Wii U is doing everything digitally. Still bizarre that the colors are handled so poorly and bleed into each other.

[@clouds-rb9xt]

@@perpetualcollapseWould the Electron Shepherd be better than Wii U?

[@theglassarrow_]

the biggest thing to keep in mind, is that modern TV's simply loos video quality for component cables. HDMI is near lossless for video quality. Endless you have the time and money to fork out the best video quality out of a wii, wii u will most likely look better. especially after homebrew video quality.

[@el_primer_y_el_ultimo_caiman]

One advantage of HDMI is that the Wii U will output a digital audio signal. It might be slightly cleaner?

[@ChicagoBulls1984]

Also prevents the tv from having to upscale the image and possibly add input lag i would think

[@el_primer_y_el_ultimo_caiman]

@@ChicagoBulls1984 Even if you have a 1080p set, the difference is so negligible that I can't imagine any display being programmed to skip scaling under any circumstances, even for a 1:1 image that'll appear identical. More room for bugs...

[@ZipplyZane]

I suspect those saying that 480p looks better have screens with better upscaling. Because, unless you're playing on a CRT, the graphics do have to be upscaled to the native resolution of the display.

[@JoSephGD]

Fun fact: the issue you note about the aspect ratio is exclusive to 1080p. The Wii U's "vWii" mode outputs at double the native resolution of the Wii. Given that the Wii was 480p, this means that vWii maxes out at 960p. I don't know if you realized this, but 960p is less than 1080p. I guess the borders were added to maintain the integer scale, but that's difficult to answer. (Even more interesting, if you play with the Wii U's aspect ratio set to 720p, the borders are gone. At 480p, the two basically match.)

[@diabeticman2194]

I've never been one for spotting visual differences, but learning you can get straight to Wii mode by holding b when booting the Wii U? Blown my mind!

[@JazzemYT]

Great work as always Jon, I love these image quality videos 🙂 One thing though; I was under the impression that limited or full range didn't matter as both should look the same, the only caveat being your TV has to have matching settings (which is sometimes labelled as black level low or high). If a TV is set to RGB full for instance, a console giving it RGB limited will look terrible and washed out, but if the TV was also limited it should look the same as both devices at RGB full. Likewise, an RGB full console to an RGB limited TV will be overly saturated I may be wrong on this and apologies if so, it gets confusing easily 😅 maybe someone else in comments can confirm the RGB range situation

[@manuel0578]

You are correct.

[@lordeilluminati]

and you are not wrong, thing is, in theory full range allows more depth in contrast levels, in reality, since content on the living room like consoles use standards for TV broadcasting, full range is no better than limited, it just adjusts the black and white values from 16-235 in limited to 0-255 in full. The setting you are mentioning doesnt affect RGB levels per se, most TVs dont need to have matching black levels and RGB depth levels. The full and limited range recognition is mostly automatic. You can set full range RGB, low black level and have different results when you change the setting and when you RESTART the television with the settings already applied. Full and limited RGB do have greater effect in PC monitors and capture cards which tend to always expect that 0 is black no matter what, and when it receives a 16 value of a pitch black scene of movie, for example, it displays as grey.

[@armadeus8711]

Love seeing Jazzem being a tech nerd in the comments on one of my favourite channels (also you are correct on that, I think the only caveat is that it can effect Monitors and capture devices)

[@Mr.Welbig]

The Wii U is my preferred way to play Wii/GCN purely for convenience. Sure the video output looks better on native Wii and GCN, but tbh without a side by side comparison I hardly notice a difference and don't think about it when I'm actually playing. Getting Wii and GCN games installed as VC Injected titles lets them be bootable from the Wii U menu like VC games which works so well from my experience. And to have all games playable on one console is worth the trade off of higher quality video.

[@PixelShade]

One thing to note about the WiiU is that if you set your TV to limited range (all TV-brands will have different name for this, My LG TV call it "Black Levels"). Contrasts and colors will look near identical to full range if the TV is setup correctly.

[@Piggieyt75]

The only difference would be that there is more color banding with limited range, but most users don't notice the difference.

[@skins4thewin]

Hope the CFW crowd can figure out ways to fix these Wii U scaling issues one day... Would be AMAZING to have one perfect option!

[@smtek]

I just found out about the deflicker filter the other day, I am running the Wii with the Mclassic upscaler and I gotta say, it looks sooooo good on my 1080p projector.

[@Froge0]

I've been seeing Wii games exclusively on the Wii U for over a decade now so it cuts the mustard for me, but still quite an interesting video

[@kellokabana2399]

I’m confused by your comparison. You talked about using original cables straight out of the box, but that would mean using composite cable for the Wii vs HDMI cable for the Wii U. And keeping the original settings for both systems, the games should look much brighter on Wii U. This was especially noticeable on darker looking games like the Last Story. Every game I ever played looked brighter and more vibrant on Wii U.

[@milesfernando]

They're not using the stock cables They're both using the same component cable, which would still allow for an HD image in the case of the Wii U.

[@bendovaplz5329]

They def look better on the Wii U lol

[@101Leafy]

Jon, I obsess over the tiny things when it comes to "properly" experiencing games. With so many options available, why SHOULDN'T we be more purposeful in what we choose to use? Thanks for covering this important information on such a commonly used Mode.

[@soywho9837]

Hi leafy, I like your videos.

[@imaginitivity7853]

Really interesting analysis. It seems really surprising that within the WiiU/Wii homebrew there hasn't been a way to work around the RGB limited issue.

[@lordeilluminati]

limited vs full range RGB is mainly an issue with PC monitors and capture cards. Having full range RGB on any common television on your living room will not make any difference in picture quality related to this topic. Nintendo chose limited range because it is more guaranteed to work on any television (because limited is made with TV broadcasting and movies in mind, full is expected to work on PC monitors), with full range if the display doesnt adapt well over this, the black levels get extremely crushed. For those who dont know, limited range is a range from 16 to 235, meaning that a color with the 16 value means black and 235 means white. Full range RGB works from 0 to 255, meaning that 0 is black and 255 is white. Most TV of the time and even today detect if you used limited or full and adapt to accomodate any system. On any TV that I had in around 10 years if I set any console as full RGB it does get crushed black levels but if I restart the television it adapts to the image sent by the device and it looks the exact same as if it was on limited.

[@violator1017]

Sorry but from my perspective you're absolutely wrong. The Wii is clearly made to output 480i 60Hz or 480p 60Hz + 576i 50Hz Only in European version... The Wii U 1080p 60Hz, 1080i 60Hz, 720p 60Hz, 480p 60Hz, 480i 60Hz + 576i 50Hz Only in European version... Now, depends on what TV/Monitor you play AND what resolution you set your WiiU to. I can promise you that I have, here in Europe, a better image quality on my WiiU compared to my Wii but the settings needs to be in par with the type of screen that you used... On my CRTs with a SCART cable and the WiiU set with 480p, the image is amazing. On my plasma screen with a YUV or HDMI cable and the WiiU set with 720p output, the image is better thanwhat I get from my Wii plugged with YUV cable. On my OLED, I even don't have to describe how ffaaarrrrr better the image is with the WiiU compare to the Wii. The only "tiny" advantage that my Wii has compare to my WiiU is when I output 240p content with a SCART cable... in this case, my Wii can output the image slightly better than my WiiU (the WiiU double the scanlines to " transform " the 240 signal to a 480 one... kind of) Maybe it's different in the US but here in Europe, I have better results with my WiiU compare to my Wii.

[@miniconbini]

Jon!! Love the Wii content. Would you consider doing a deep dive on Wii plus something like a retrotink 5x? I've always wanted to see some in depth look into Wii output with one of those, especially when homebrew is in the equation.

[@markwebster4996]

It’s a preference but I don’t think the sharp pixels on Wii look better than a smoother edge. Sharp pixels from games on NES, SNES etc are one thing but Wii games you don’t really want a jaggy edge. The skyward sword example shown, Wii looks super jaggy edge and it’s shimmering. Both Wii and WiiU can look perfectly fine but it take some awareness and work for either. WiiU totally native with no Homebrew etc is an easier hookup for many. Not all TVs even have component connections anymore.

[@Spacething7474]

the easiest way to fix this is to just use standard definition 4:3

[@robertwahlstrom]

I actually pushing 480 p from both my Wii (Wii HDMI cable with no upscaling) and Wii U (Wii mode) and then push that signal through an HDMI merger and then from that to an mClassic that then upscales it and that looks really sharp.

[@MoonlitChris]

I have a homebrewed Wii U still hooked up to my entertainment center to this day just because of all the systems it can run, and yeah I acknowledge that the HDMI isn't the best for some of the games let alone the NES and N64 VC being absolutely horrendous but it being the all in one system is what sells it for me and why it's still being used to this very day for me

[@PikangsFutaba]

Indeed, NES and N64 are kinda the worse in that regard, but neverless is still convenient and an OK alternative to the real deals or better emulators, I still use my WiiU from time to time playing some of it's classics or as a convenient (and lazy way) retro console monster, I sometimes play (either oficial Wii releases or via Retroarch) NeoGeo games, SNES, etc, plus, the gamepad for me is a great "controller?" for most of those retro games, not to mention that RetroArch does wonders with not WiiU controllers like the Ps3 to expand your options for the most part, however with N64 is were the issues come (but if you have your WiiU with the Tiramisu soft-mod... you can use Switch Pro controllers for WiiU games and WiiU Virtual Console games... in this case for N64 games really helps), so yeah, the WiiU is a retro monster machine.

[@HistoryandReviews]

2010 Mac Mini can play more and do more

[@bendovaplz5329]

Yes same. I love Wii consoles, but the Wii U is like a 9.5 vs an 8.8 with the Wii. Being able to play Wii U games, all the rest of the consoles below it, be hdmi, have the gamepad, larger storage, more powerful graphics, etc Wii U is an easy choice for me. But when it comes to modding nothing beats the Wii. Wii U and modding SUCKS. Having to individually install each game takes forever. Maybe we will be able to use a Wii backup manager with Wii U's someday.

[@TheGameLooters]

Change your Wii U to output 480p fixes the Wii problems

[@KierenGamePlays]

Ye and have the mclassic do the upscaling instead

[@wausjackbauer128]

I haven't watched this video yet but I remember doing a side by side with Skyward Sword. On Wii U, the colours were slightly worse but the overall image was slightly cleaner. The image was slightly cleaner simply because it was running through HDMI which is a cleaner signal compared to component on Wii

[@silver1407]

3:05 "It's not anti-aliasing, it's just a blur" lmao, thx for the info

[@seanpaul3954]

Really enjoyed this video. I'm currently playing Xenoblade Chronicles on Wii U virtual Wii and have found best results in terms of looks using the 4:3 aspect ratio with an Mclassic dongle,which seems to clean up jaggies a good bit and make colours pop a bit more.

[@akirafuudou2037]

Xenoblade Chronicles has no business being displayed in 4:3.

[@IceBlueLugia]

Who the fuck tryna play Xenoblade in 4:3

[@overwatch761]

I find it amusing that GameCube looks astounding through the Wii U via Nintendont in patched 16:9 with deflicker off and is a massive upgrade over existing hardware - GCN games look pin sharp almost HD in quality on my 60", Wii looks a generation behind GCN in comparison with it's hazy blur. Aroma is already starting to fix issues with vWii through plugins - the viewport cropping is fixed and Wii games can launch in 480p. I don't think it will be long before a plugin update allows for deflicker and dithering to be turned off while launching Wii games. When that happens the Wii U will easily be the definitive option for Wii.

[@clouds-rb9xt]

Like, true 480p? Does it fix the other issues then?

[@overwatch761]

@@clouds-rb9xt yea, the only thing now to add is a disable deflicker filter which would mean the Wii U will be outputting a Wii image every bit as good as a HDMI modded Wii with deflicker disabled. Deflicker on is standard fare for Wii games, it works well on CRT as it blends seemlessly with the image on screen, not so good on LCD. Of course you can boot direct to USBGX on Wii U, which has a deflicker off option by default so you will get the best quality you can gleam from a Wii game at 480p.

[@clouds-rb9xt]

@@overwatch761 Any link to those plugins? I'm curious Because currently I don't have my Wii setup for my modern TV, due to a lack of inputs, I've been playing on my CRT

[@mega77]

Have a Wii and WiiU. The Wii is connected with a YUV cable to my TV (the best component cable available for unmodified Wii's). The WiiU is connected via HDMI. Let me tell you that the image quality is FAR better when playing on the WiiU. The analog signal of the Wii creates scan lines whennthe image is moving. Just the fact that the WiiU does not make this effect when playing on a flat screen makes it superior. Yes the Wii might be looking a bit better when HDMI modded, but if you own a WiiU I don't feel it's worth the effort.

[@clouds-rb9xt]

Could just be a weak signal on your end

[@PPHDocumentaries]

Was your WiiU connected to a 4k tv when you played original Wii games on it?

[@kamikazilucas]

full range actually makes the game look worse if you dont have the settings on your tv correctly, if you have black levels on low you should have it set to limited it its on high then full, you shouldnt have it set on high though to begin with so just have all your set set to limited and it will look the exact same anyway, saying limited looks a bit washed out is a lie or a placebo effect because they look the exact same colourwise, the reason they look more vibrant and saturated to you is because your capture card is not properly calibrated, the games are not meant to look like that SET TO LIMITED

[@WilliamMcCarthyIII]

Never use 480p for Wii Mode on Wii U. It stretches the image 1% on both axis which adds even more blur.

[@LHSMeleeClub]

At this point this channel has given enough knowledge about really cool things you can do with Nintendo's Legacy systems that I'm going to create a new KZbin playlist titled "GVG Knowledge"

[@dragonwario1123]

Perhaps one day the HB community can tackle these scaling / color distortions. There's actually a thread on GBATemp with some people trying to figure it out, but it seemed that project never got off its feet unfortunately. Still, having the option to play Wii U/Wii/GC backups with HDMI on a single box is really really nice, and I still keep my Wii U hooked up for that reason.

[@swavoxiii]

3:55 I personally see that as a pro. Something like skyward sword which has a lot of watercolor graphics, I don't want to tsee all the sharp pixels. This is why anti-aliasing exists. The visuals you've shown in this video just make me appreciate the wii u's output more. Why would I want a jaggy mess for 3D games? I'd get it for 2D, but old 3D can def. benefit from some blurred visuals.

[@mattrandall1808]

Get yourself an mCable Gaming edition. You'll be floored

[@GenghisConnThr333]

"the Wii has better image quality than the Wii U if you mod it" So the Wii U is better...

[@lakitu6422]

One thing you can do with the wii as well is use prii loader to autoboot straight to usb loader gx. Makes it a 1 click start and super fast

[@Ependyma]

Jon's voice

[@vacuumblink2300]

It makes me cream my pants

[@Latestmustace]

Probably one of the most soothing voices i have heard.

[@bregowine]

Always enjoyable. Needs more appearances in GVG

[@lukeshioshio]

This person knows what's up

[@Haymdahl]

True.

[@pokepress]

16:9 has an inherent problem with 480p, in that 480 isn’t a multiple of 9 like 720, 1080, etc. as such, digital 480p video often uses non-square pixels at a resolution of 720*480. 1080p video sometimes uses non-square pixels (1440*1080 for a 16:9 image), but 480p over HDMI pretty much always does this unless it’s a converted 640*480 VGA signal.

[@abrahamnatanahelvillegasvi5972]

I wonder if you could do a video about trying to play Wii U games on a CRT since you don't need any modding to do so. I know it sounds weird but to me Mario Kart 8 feels way better as a 4:3 game than it does widescreen. Totally underrated option.

[@kebm1388]

Does it actually play in 4:3? Every Wii u game I've tried on a crt was forced 16:9 letterbox (even virtual console games)

[@vasopel]

@@kebm1388 ??? hm...you have to change the settings on your CRT,I'm pretty sure the TV is stretching everything by it's own.

[@abrahamnatanahelvillegasvi5972]

@@kebm1388 I don't know if its something weird with my tv, but for Wii U games to display in 4:3 you actually have to have the settings in 16:9 If you put it in 4:3 it displays on widescreen with black borders up and down. And thr settings work the opposite way on any virtual console game

[@kebm1388]

Are you saying to zoom in to cut off the sides of the image? Cause that's worse. Just setting the Wii U to 4:3 results in letterboxed widescreen

[@SamuelMK_]

@@abrahamnatanahelvillegasvi5972 No, it's nothing weird with your TV. When you set your Wii U to 4:3 it letterboxes most applications to 16:9 because those applications don't support 4:3. That's why there are black bars when you set the AR to 4:3; the aspect ratio is being preserved while fitting to the screen. There are very few Wii U games that support 4:3, and the Wii Menu actually displays proper 4:3 when booted into. When you set the AR to 16:9 your Wii U thinks it's being played on a widescreen SD CRT, so it doesn't letterbox content. On a typical 4:3 TV this results in vertical stretching, which in general makes games look worse. Circles appear like ovals and squares appear like rectangles. I think I did this exact thing back when I did my first playthrough of NSMBU on a 13" CRT TV.

[@KillingBytes]

bro your voice do you say "finish him" in mortal combat ? xD

[@trickz8183]

I have not known about the deflicker and framebuffer options! I feel like it's made such a big difference in image quality, thank you!

[@grayaquatics852]

I feel like I'm listening to Benedict Cumberbatch talk about the Wii lol

[@nickk3077]

7:46 What? You can boot up the Wii menu immediately by holding down the B button!? That's kinda neat.

[@Caolan114]

Thank you very much for these videos, I love the Wii and have been modding mine since 2012 and didn't know about framebuffer or aspect ratios, nor did I know which was better graphically

[@chadwolf3840]

great stuff man! it's so hard to get good info discerning all these systems sometimes and you make it so crystal clear.

[@Yes-me4pk]

0:40 can't get over this Mario Kart Wii gameplay 😭😭

[@FurryMcMemes]

I actually found this out a couple years ago when I bought a Wii for GameCube games as I was buying the Hyperkin HDMI cable for it and a mClassic later on. I was curious because I though I was used playing Wii games on my Wii U I don't remember those same games looking so blurry and well all of the problems you mentioned in this video. So since finding all of this out I since then I do not play Wii games on Wii U anymore, only on my Wii.

[@pepsidude8919]

I always thought the Wii U was the much better choice for playing original Wii games since they just seem better on the Wii U than they did on the original Wii, especially if you're also using HDMI for the Wii U. Even though I also have a Wii U already and it is backwards compatible with original Wii games, I still have and use my old original Wii console as well since it still works and all, and it's even backwards compatible with GameCube games too which the Wii U does not support.

[@bendovaplz5329]

Yes i felt that the colors are more vibrant on the Wii U

[@pepsidude8919]

@@bendovaplz5329 I agree too.

[@ultimat3lifeform]

I agree and it’s stupid to buy a Wii to play Wii games when a Wii U can play Wii games and more

[@pepsidude8919]

@@ultimat3lifeform Exactly. I actually still have an original Wii game console for playing Wii games even though I also already have a Wii U now for playing them on, but my original Wii that I still have can even play Nintendo GameCube games which is something that the Wii U can't really do since GameCube game discs aren't natively backwards compatible on the Wii U unlike the original model of the Wii.

[@MeesterTweester]

The worst part is you can't use Gamecube controllers on Wii U (even with the adapter) for games like Brawl and Mario Kart Wii. I want an original Wii just for that feature.

[@JohnLattanzio98]

0:39 how did he even manage to hit himself 😂

[@AnonymousFreakYT]

Thanks for this video. My old Wii (bought during the initial launch scarcity scramble!) optical drive died, and I was debating just “upgrading” to a Wii-U for my Wii games. Now I think I’ll just replace the optical drive. (I use a 4x3 CRT HD TV, so component is my connection type anyway.)

[@relo999]

The black borders on the WiiU make sense, the WiiU uses integer scaled image. The Wii on a modern screen doesn't creating uneven pixels. Granted the Wii was made with CRT's in mind and doesn't render square pixels on the X-axis. The widescreen mode was in a lot of cases an afterthought sometimes stretching the image, just avoid it. 480p signals aren't build for it anyway. Also the Wii shouldn't have square pixels, it natively doesn't so you're actively messing the image up on a Wii if you'd use the framebuffer setting on USBLoader. You see this quite well in circles and squares, the moment you use the framebuffer setting they become slight ovals and rectangles. Also only use the deflicker option if you use the component cables, turning it off can cause flickering if you use other forms of video transfer on some modern displays.

[@TommyDeonauthsArchives]

I knew that the Wii U had setbacks, mostly regarding the lack of any native GC compatibility, but I didn't think that the Wii U had THAT many setbacks!

[@jagkopp]

Wait, what? I’ve used the gamepad to play Wii games plenty of times, but didn’t know the thingie at the top functions as a sensor bar!

[@DronesAreReady]

I just change the aspect ratio on my tv to 16.9 or 16.3 when I want to play a Wii or Gamecube game. Which ever looks better I stick with for that game. Its still a little blurry, but I can survive with that, and saves space without having to have a Gamecube and Wii under my tv.

[@TheShowRockstar]

And if you use the Wii U console on a CRT television, what would the Wii games look like?

[@notsoslck]

Something that should be noted is that with CFW you can have whenever you boot into Wii Mode (vWii)/Wiivc titles, for it to automatically change the resolution to 480p/480p 4:3 (I personally use it for 480p 16:9, I have no clue what’s up with Jon’s recordings. The homebrew in question is called “Wii VC Launch.” Keep in mind it is CFW only, and only compatible with Aroma.

[@FlareOfLegacy]

Man I didn't realise how slow going into Settings was on Wii U. That awkward silence waiting was rather funny.

[@mistergremm735]

been recommended this yesterday, glad something great came out of that tab Subbed

[@LOmarG]

I've been scouring the internet for years trying to find confirmation of this. I knew they looked blurrier but couldn't find anyone that would agree. Thank you!

[@vrturboprincessrescuercubed]

When I 100%ed Sukeban Shachou Rena on Wii U, I noticed this. The ironing out of the lag messed me up on several minigames because I couldn't buffer inputs anymore.

[@Silverfox365]

Something else to point out, if you own a Gamecube racing wheel (Logitech Speed Force) it does not work with the GCN Adapter, but the DK Bongos and DDR Mat do work.

[@seeKwoL]

Did not know about boot into wii mode and that the Wii U game pad has a built in sensor bar, mind blown!

[@penguinjay]

Resident Evil The Darkside Chronicles, monica?!?! Oh hell yeaa, great game, glad you showed it in this video. Apart from not being perfect for accuracy compared to scan lines and a guncon2, the wii and wii u totally picked up and carried the lightgun/rail shooter games forward when they were due to be forgotten. Darkside Chronicles is a fantastic RE game with a surprising amount of replayability, and a crazy amount of things from the RE formula that they execute very well. It's extremely surprising for them to do so in an on-rails shooter, but that was a fantastic release. Plus iirc, the models from that were used in several fan projects and artistic HD mockups of RE. Very cool game. Nice vid as well.

[@andrestapia1493]

Nah, at least my Wii U works compared to my dying Wii

[@pokepress]

480p for Wii mode on Wii U is definitely better if you’re relying on some sort of upscaling device like the mClassic since those work best when they have access to the image at or near its native resolution. Similar if your TV itself has an advanced upscale algorithm.

[@AustinTroth]

In 480p virtual Wii mode on the Wii U there is significant sharpness and detail loss versus the other scaling modes, very visible if you open the check board tool in the 240p test suite. You should not set the Wii U output to 480p even with an mClassic

[@mattrandall1808]

​@@AustinTroth I'm going to test this later with my mCable

[@AustinTroth]

@@mattrandall1808 It will look incredibly soft and lock a significant amount of detail

[@Kneevirus]

U should make a video about how playing og ds games on 3ds washes out the colors hard

[@fenix_tx_1342]

It's so interesting that it's just upscaling the games wrong, I always assumed the black bars were there because the Wii U was taking the 480p Wii games, presenting them in a 2x container (960p), and then using black bars to fill the rest of the 1080p output, ensuring the games would look better than if the TV was handling the upscaling, I even thought it was a smart solution to have that nearest neighbor upscaling as default. Now I want a Wii with an hdmi mod.

[@cheezyfriez12]

Something you guys should keep in mind is that with a modded wii, you can disable the deflicker filter at the system level now with priiloader.

[@bendovaplz5329]

Yes totally!

[@goldmemberpb]

The only big issue with playing games on my wiiU is the dark filter on some VC games. I never really had issue with the game ratio being stretched or even noticed that the game might be blurrier.

[@TheDeadjam421]

I’ve got a crappy 48 inch tv from 2011 I found at goodwill for $20 and it has serious issues, but it has an insane backlight and It kinda cancels out the dark filter

[@LyokoWarrier1fan]

That can be fixed with Homebrew but it’s time consuming and you have to read through forums to figure out how to get it working right

[@goldmemberpb]

@@LyokoWarrier1fan i can get rid of the dark filter with an injector for outside ganes but idk if it is possible for games i got on the eshop.

[@panikk2]

it's really simple. if you have component input available to you on your display, use a regular wii. if you only have hdmi available to you, you will still get a really good experience with the wii u. btw if you have a crt it's a crime to not have a modded wii, just sayin.

[@Selfinflictedhummusrocket]

I personally reccomend playing Mario galaxy 2 on the wii u gamepad with the classic controller mod so the gamepad works. It's fucking incredible.

[@Mezziah777]

I'd say the best way to play Wii is on a standard Wii console plugged into a widescreen CRT TV through RGB Scart. That said, I have a CRT but it's only 4:3 aspect ratio, so I tend to use my Wii U nowadays. It's still better than using a Scart to HDMI converter/upscaler to plug the regular Wii into a modern tv.

[@PikangsFutaba]

Yup, I noticed that picture issues with Smash, but despite that, WiiU is still great to play Wii and Game Cube games, just some GBA stuff on the GCN games cannot be pulled out without external shenanigans like the Fusion Suit and NES/Famicom Disk System Metroid in Metroid Prime 1 GCN version (however for NES Metroid there are already options to just ignore that problem on GCN Metroid Prime anyway), by the way, I had NO idea that you could boot Wii Mode from the get-go without special boot menus (original or homebrew) or entering the WiiU's proper main menu.

[@rainbowsprinklez]

Btw. My wii reads Gamecube discs. The early models do this :)

[@GalaxiaSword]

I'll take the near instant load time on the Wii's main menu over the 20 seconds of load times on Wii U any day.

[@gb1838]

the solution to this is to have an hdmi cable and monitor for wii u games and also a component cable connected to a crt , so you can switch

[@RetroGamerMike]

I’m glad I didn’t transfer all save data & everything from Wii to Wii U since it’s better with the Wii after all. Thanks for the tip on holding the B button when I turn on my Wii U!

[@natoriousthehopeful2786]

You know the weekend has started until Jon makes a video 😎

[@KDiaz-hy1xx]

Thank you! My Wii's disc drive recently died. I do have a WiiU and was considering whether to hack that, or the Wii, so I can also keep playing GCN games. And since I have an OSSC, 4:3 480p games look great on my display, anyway. This video settles it.

[@phorchybug3286]

It's just a graphical complaint. I much prefer OG Wii games on Wii U for the more improved sensor bar on the game pad.

[@parski]

Loving these technical videos recently.

[@Andy_0L]

Freaking love this dude's voice

[@fixorbricks]

Glad to know! I’ll be nodding one of my Wii’s for hdmi and setting it up alongside the WiiU. Nice work!

[@DigiPen92]

Dang, I didn’t know that actually happen for the Wii U.

[@DragonProtector]

1:05 you made my day playing super monkey ball 2 my favorite game

[@NullyBird]

Honestly, the anti-aliasing on Wiiu made Wii games look alot better for me. It's not that gimmicky Mcable stuff, either. The only problem I have is the slight green tint, limited range can always be counteracted with capture card and/or tv settings.

[@LennyQUMFIF]

The green tint? I think that's actually a graphical glitch, since Nintendo actually put 1 CPU but 2 GPUs on the Wii U (the CPU runs both Wii and Wii U games natively, but Wii U uses a different GPU from Wii games) and since maybe the more powerful Wii U GPU makes more heat (and the CPU does in fact heat a bit more during Wii U games) it maybe damaged most Wii U's wii GPUs, resulting in that green tint graphical glitch. That or Wii GPUs hate HDMI lol

[@NullyBird]

@@LennyQUMFIF it’s extremely slight, like we’re talking maybe 1% more green than there should be. It’s well-documented.

[@LennyQUMFIF]

@@NullyBird Oh. Where can we see the documentation? Im interested

[@NullyBird]

@@LennyQUMFIF would recommend watching Wobblingpixels video comparison. You can see that the greens are a bit more saturated, skin tones are a little greener. Some people aren’t as sensitive to differentiations in green hue - it’s a biology thing.

[@Piggieyt75]

@Nullyboy Are you talking about the chroma shift issue that the Wii U has with vWii mode? The easiest way to notice it is to look at icons and see if they have discolored edges. In Mario 64, there is a green border on the left side of the icons on the HUD.