Use G187 for Better Surface Finish and Faster Cycle Times - Haas Automation Tip of the Day

If you have never heard about G187, or you've heard of it but never used it, this video is a must-watch. G187 is a standard feature on all Haas mills, knowing how to properly use it can make a huge difference in both cycle time and surface finish. As always, Mark takes a potentially confusing subject and breaks it down so that even a beginner machinist can understand it and make use of it.
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[@markholzbach5577]

Haas tip of the day is great for us small production shop owners. Time saving in research! Time saving in implementation! Time saving in production! Thanks Mark and Haas for great support!

[@haasautomation]

Thanks Mark. If there is a topic that you think one of us should cover in a video, send it through to [e-mail]. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@romanscharnofske4773]

I am just impressed by Mark, he explains those thing that even an everyday machinist like me understands.

[@livefire81]

I've been a machinist/programmer for over 15 years and it never ceases to amaze me the little tips and tricks I pick up from these Vids. Excellent content. We only have 1 Haas in our shop, the rest of our mills are German DMG's, our company bought bc "we want the best". Our DMG's are constantly down, and our Haas has only been down twice, ever. Once when it was knocked off its moorings by a careless forklift operator and once when I busted off our tool touch off probe arm, while cleaning the bed, both times self inflicted. damage.

[@Metalbass10000]

I always taught my programmers to examine the prints, all inside radii, all size and finish tolerances, and only THEN start selecting tooling for any pocketing or contouring with inside corners/radii. I was always amazed by machinists with 20, 25 years experience that used, "on size," cutters as a preference, then called out for help because they have chatter and a shit finish. What amazed me more was when my boss, with 35 or more years experience would insist that was proper and correct for smart efficient machining. Some days...

[@holdilocks]

I worked at a place that only had 6 Cat 32 holders for their Vetical Mill, I was forced to use at size tooling in order to do all the other features - drilling, facing and tapping. It was like pulling teeth to get worn out tooling replaced, had to sharpen drills until they were too short to work.

[@AlbertScoot]

This is one of the first things I learned when doing g-code on a Haas. This explanation was much better and concise than whatever my instructor made up to explain why it works.

[@jackroman8821]

I've played with the G187 before but wasn't sure I understood it well enough to know when to apply it. This video really did a great job explaining the concepts at work and how / when to apply them. Good stuff, keep up the great vids!

[@automan1223]

Thank you Mark ! ... as usual you teach me 10 new things in a 12 min video !

[@drthslyr]

Thanks for going through the basics like this. Our shop has been dealing with surface marks for a week and not a single soul considered checking the coolant concentration. BAM! %3!! Thank you for clearly explaning every details in your videos. You are the best!! Cheers mate

[@peterbowman1783]

This totally works and was explained really well here. We used this just the other day and it saved our mold. Thanks Mark!

[@bazookamoose7224]

I just coughed up a lung from this. I carried around the Tron LASER DISC like it was a life support unit when I was a kid. Dang it Haas, you get me right in the feels.

[@xmaswitguns]

These videos are exceedingly helpful! Keep them coming please!

[@EABayuaji]

Lagi ngerti saiki lik mesinku iso koyo ngene, wis sesuk langsung tak praktekno, keep it up the good work Mark!

[@MakeItWithCalvin]

Really well put together video and that is a really useful tool for preventing gouging. I do agree though try and design to avoid it all together in the first place.

[@agie170hss2]

Another great one -- thanks Mark!

[@PorchPotatoMike]

I am not a machinist and probably will never even see a Haas machine, but I love these videos.

[@haasautomation]

You never know. If you ever find yourself here in Southern California, stop by the Haas Factory and I’ll give you the $2 tour. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@demandred1957]

It can be a fun and challenging job, and I run a Haas vf3 all day long I love it.

[@Austinfamily1]

Mark is back!!

[@brentlupardus3056]

I really enjoy all of your videos

[@neetones]

You are an excellent teacher!

[@D001lz]

Excellent. Realistic modern machining tutorial video's is exactly what the engineering world needs! Keep it up.

[@D001lz]

Pipe down Jed. I've forgot more than you know!

[@ryanb1874]

Love this channel, makes me more confidant.

[@senorimotor]

Excellent videos like this is why I decided to go HAAS!

[@James-fs4rn]

More good stuff! Thanks!

[@nyccnc]

Best HTOD yet!

[@pbrenneman5]

Seriously been waiting for this one!!

[@haasautomation]

Thanks! Makes a big difference when finishing 3d surfaces (P3) or speeding things up (P1) for roughing. I remember watching one of your videos, slotting a channel with an Adaptive Toolpath, great vid, those types of paths benefit the most from a G187 P1, you can cut the cycle time in half on some of those “peel” type slotting cuts. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@abengineering9954]

Very good explanation

[@user-jx3kq7vc8e]

wow, that's a great video!

[@antoniocampos2009]

I'm a Haas cnc machine operator, and now I'm going to programmer and this videos helped me alot. Thank you

[@haasautomation]

Antonio - programming parts is a lot of fun. It can be stressful, but still fun! Learn some hand programming, then jump right into a CAM system. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@steventhedog94]

You still programming

[@antoniocampos2009]

@@steventhedog94 yes I am

[@Questchaun]

AvE has got my recommend feed full of Hass videos!

[@farroohuhmuhamedow6199]

Thank you very much. It is that it is necessary. I ask to continue. I ask that you showed how to use your machine and the AutoCAD program, step by step with theoretical explanation to learn to use it.

[@CQEflash]

I have to agree this is an actual useful TOTD, most are pretty useless but this was informative. What would have been nice was to include the E parameter as an override outside of default P1,2,3 settings.

[@neetapatel2751]

Good Explaination

[@thomasdeponte8585]

Helpfull!!!

[@123kkambiz]

This man is awesome charming and funny and very good lecturer.

[@adrianovidiu539]

I am machinist, and i work like cnc operator on hass vf3ss, it is a badass machine

[@CQEflash]

Further to this it would be nice to see an advanced user TOTD series.

[@danielflonta877]

Hello Sir Can you give me some information about parameterized programming; You make some video about this subject but I want to learne more about this. thank you, you make a very nice work,

[@marc-antoinethebeautiful7714]

Does the smooth command bug if you put a g42 or g41 with a dia comp greater then the tool path in a 5 axis mode in the retract motion before the cancelation of the smooth command? You may ask why do you do that. On the first article an operator may want to test cut his way into tolerance where he may try to cheat by putting a dia-comp of let' say .040 of an inch on a 1/2 endmill to measure then compensate. Luckily it was showing on the tool path . But my programmer didn't believe that it would LOL. So the question is will it do that too on a haas control? It's a bug that I've discover but never got answer from the other controller manufacturer. Thank you in advance for taking time to answer the question.

[@dstryr932k]

Great video Mark, thanks! I've got a couple of questions, within the control parameters there are some parameters that seem to define acceleration for each level of smoothness, for high speed machining option enabled machines, that is, How does these parameters affect the acuracy and acceleration? And why some machines with no HSM option enabled seem to move faster that tose that have it enabled? Again, thank you for your videos.

[@CADCAMTECH360]

It's useful really

[@NectoTwo]

Очень интересная функция, надо будет попробовать. Спасибо!

[@haasautomation]

Thanks. For Roughing, try a G187 P1, we save time but pay for it with a rougher Surface Finish in some cases. For finishing, try a G187 P3, we will get a better Surface Finish, but pay for it with slightly longer cycle times. Thanks for commenting. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@bwilliams1815]

This is good to know that the Haas controller can do this. However, my CAM software has been doing this for the past 3 to 4 years. The new software slows down at square end and tight corners. Onecnc XR7

[@haasautomation]

Lots of the CAM systems today are able to do some pretty amazing things, filtering the code before it ever makes it to the machine. It is just getting better and better. Thanks for the post. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@jaymachines7587]

G187 is our best friend we use cutters below 1mm all the time and cut extremely small parts that require 3D machining and superb surface finish. I use the P1 with a big rad for my adaptive roughing and then P3 E.005 for finishing it works great!

[@akronimm862]

Just updated our post in mastercam to be able to program G187 commands right into the program. Using a G187 P1 on roughing cycles is like giving the machine an energy drink, makes a huge difference!

[@marioeduardomacielmartinez739]

Your the man MARK,I love your videos please don't stop making them, where are you located in CA. so i can have the 2$ tour ;)

[@haasautomation]

Mario - The Haas factory is at 2800 Sturgis Road, Oxnard, California 93030, USA. I’ll leave the light on for you. We give tours all the time, and would love to show you around. We schedule tours through the local dealers. Call them up and let them know you want a tour and they can make it happen, www.haascnc.com/about/contact.html - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@farshid.vahidpour]

thanks

[@mes007]

thank you! Can you please explore us Settings 45, 46, 47, 48, 80, and 250 for mirror imaging.? Is it possible to mirror a cam generated programm?

[@93Abydos]

This is similar to my methood: Before and after (on lathe) a chamfer putting a small radius. Won't leave sharp edge also.

[@tomaszochedzan1703]

Thx.

[@CapeCodCNC]

Ya those old Tron bikes could never make those turns but my new Tron 2.0 made from unobtainium does it easy! :-)

[@KozelCraft]

Hello, I have a question. I tried to use The “rough” and “finish” setting on our old Haas VF1 machine and every time I ran a program with either rough or finish setting The machine ended up with an alarm 178 ( divide by zero) It happens every time The tool is in its Position to start milling Could you help me with this one? P.S. Love your channel, thanks for providing such a info

[@inhnguyenba5347]

Did you using solidcam to make cnc program for that part?

[@jaym395]

Is it similar to the cimatron's "high speed machining" strategy where you can define toolpath corner radius?

[@raunaqahuja6047]

Just leave a bit of extra leftover stock or finish margin (say 0.5 to 1mm ) in case you're using G187P1 coz the tool tends to overcut . You can save about 30% cycle time for sure.

[@welterdavin5486]

considerate

[@MaquinerosCNC]

brutal!

[@adrianvaldez5272]

another great video! just for this, im planning to purchase a haas machine again!

[@harikrishnan718]

Whether This g187 code will work only in hass machine or it will work in other make machine. Because i had faced that this code is invalid. Why that issue is there what reason?

[@mohamadsweed4987]

Hej! Har ni program som man kan lära sig själv. Eftersom haas bra maskin. Program som man studerar på datoren .Tack så mycket.

[@farroohuhmuhamedow6199]

how to use AutoCAD instead of SolidWorks for this purpose what you show?

[@diegomora1294]

Is G187 available in a HAAS VF3 produced in 1999?

[@bajasoobnut]

In a Haas as old as the one I am using all the time I can only use the e value with the g187 code as the p value is useless and ignored due to the software onboard. So when I use dynamic milling I set the e to E0.025 and makes a big difference for sure and then with finishing I leave it at E0.0002

[@joshuaboulee8190]

I have a 2014 and the g187 P values seem to make no difference. Identical features in 2 different work offsets, one will make a seamlessly smooth circular path and the other will pause at 180° around the circle, like exact stop is on. I'll try the E values now though, I didn't know they existed!

[@gatisst5317]

Does there is something similar to fanuc?

[@JosephHHHo]

I'm a design engineer and I am constantly thinking about fabrication while I work with part geometry. I've been watching a couple of these every week to build on my knowledge of machining to smooth out cradle to grave lifecycles in the future. Thank you for the contribution!

[@shawn01707]

Number one issue I have with engineering models is they don’t account for the radius of the cutter. They have cool features in the model that are not necessarily needed in the part that take much longer to machine. Mostly though is sharp corners that are not necessary

[@joshuaboulee8190]

I agree with Shawn. My second most common issue I see with designs is specifying threads unnecessarily close to the bottom of a blind hole, with no consideration given for any chips that may pile up in there or the thread lead on a tap.

[@akil2512]

How to manufacture 0 tolerance product please upload a video on this

[@klazzera]

i didnt know that this was a problem since i started cnc machining with HSMWorks. HSMWorks generates the tool path that way on default lol.

[@Mm-ik9uq]

I would love to see a demo of g150

[@pjhvilla19]

Might be a silly question, how do you work out the E value? Im looking forward to trying this. Hopefully it will save me hours of blending in with sandpaper 😂. We do a lot of vacuum forming tools from aluminium. Would appreciate it if you could get back to me or if anyone else can help that would be great. Cheers

[@haasautomation]

Phil - If doing mold work, I’d do some test cuts. You can use a G187 P3 E0.01 (if you work in inches), and see how things look on a small mold. You can reduce the E value, to something like E.005, cut again and compare. If you see a noticeable difference, you can go with the E.005 instead of the E.010. In general, the lower the E value, the longer your part takes to run. On some types of molds though, I’ve seen no cycle time difference by going with the E.005 instead of the E.010 -but my finish was also just fine with an E.01 on those molds. If you’re using a G187 P3 E.01, you can’t go wrong. Thanks for the question. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@omlambate552]

Sir how work doller code hass control Please tell

[@mehkayla6685]

Good video! I need to remember to use G187, I always forget, SolidCam will add it in for me if I select the option. And sorry Mark, it's a pet peeve of mine, it's radii, not radius's :)

[@haasautomation]

I was surprised that so many CAM systems had options for G187 built right in. It makes sense though. Radiussesses. If deer is the plural of deer, why isn’t beer the plural of beer - English makes no sense :). Thanks for the comment Chad. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@mehkayla6685]

@@haasautomation I think fusion 360 does as well, within Haas specific posts.

[@Thefreakyfreek]

@@haasautomation try Dutch for a change English is very logical in Dutch most rules have more exceptions that words that apply to this rule

[@Vitalya313]

Неу guys what the song on 0:35

[@manikandan-cy2dk]

How to set tool path simulation in vmc

[@creativetechnologies5394]

WHAT IS VPS ....? HOW TO USE IN NEXT GENERATION CONTROL ...? MARK WILL YOU PLEASE GIVE ME THE SOME VIDEO TIPS...!

[@ipanzerschrecku4732]

Why isn't the conflict between too large end mill and the G85 max corner rounding flagged as a possible error already in the CAD software when specifying machine type and end mill?

[@joshuaboulee8190]

Probably because the CAM system had no idea what the default corner rounding was set to in the machine

[@villavan]

Sir how can we add g187 in a CAM generated NC ? Will a CAM software automatically add g187 for the toolpath ?

[@haasautomation]

Villavan - Most users will add the G187 codes, as shown in the video, by hand. Some software companies have the codes built right in. Check out this video from Autodesk for information on how they address this kzbin.info/www/bejne/rKWao4mMh86cgc0 . For most CAM systems, you will need to call them, and ask about adding G187 functionality to your Post Processor - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@omkardandwate8922]

Wow....

[@jaroslawkalota9118]

Hello Mark, Could You give a tutorial about NET sharing in Classic Control and in NGC? Best Regards Jarek

[@haasautomation]

Jaroslaw - that’s a great topic. We’ll put it on the list. Thanks. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@GreyFox560]

Will this work on an old haas vf4 from 2000ish? I’m just starting to use them at work and I’d love to learn as many tips and tricks as I can to help out my programming

[@haasautomation]

Jared - G187 should work on your machine, its been around in its current form since around 1997 with Mill software version M9.38. It’s been refined and updated constantly since then. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@GreyFox560]

@@haasautomation Mark, thank you very much. I'm not on the mills very often but the next time I'm on them I'll be sure to try it out!

[@ExMachinaEngineering]

OK, by this point, I think that Tip of the Day videos are there just to give me a chance to say "I told you so" to people... Yes, yes... I am that guy...

[@imaamericangirl1406]

Hahaha, I know right?!

[@ryanb1874]

OK, so how do you, (am very new to all this ) load a smaller ball nose endmill and get to that part of the program without bastardizing the original, when you edit the line screen, do you have to select a word and delete, or can you just type over it , ENTER, cycle start, after first 're probing new tool inserted 😎

[@markterryberry4477]

Hi Ryan. We call this Program Restart. Check out this video for more information on it: kzbin.info/www/bejne/m4HPqoubjb6NeKc

[@leonidaratovski1403]

Can it used on older haas machine?

[@haasautomation]

Leonid - This feature has been around for a very long time. In its current form, G187 has worked since around 1997 with Mill software version M9.38. It’s been refined and updated constantly since then. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@fernandoruiz9881]

what it is the price the machine

[@haasautomation]

Fernando - I think we are the only machine tool builder that puts our machine prices on our website, www.HaasCNC.com. For more information on machines, and any current promotions, your local Haas Dealer’s contact information is here: www.haascnc.com/about/contact.html - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@veerabhadraraos4513]

It shows in any place of window

[@weldmachine]

The only thing i Hate about these video,s is it makes me hungry for a New HAAS Machine.

[@imaamericangirl1406]

Right?!

[@Thefreakyfreek]

And than you have a heidenheim 530 and the presicion setting probably wont make it les precise at thus faster

[@Blobby_Hill]

Note to self: G187 is the answer to my problems

[@thundercuck1779]

OMFG ITS TERRBEERRY TOP FAN

[@robn2497]

Would you not just take the precision of the machine.... double it for "safety factor" call that P... Take the radius of the tool call that R. Then cut the corner by R subtract P.... Max corner cut! given current tool radius? Why would you not do this?

[@daxshell242]

Yo! Great info. But I think if you are going to post videos on behalf of Haas, you just have to put in a clip of machining, even if its not related to what you are talking about or necessary for your explanation. its just... a rule.

[@haasautomation]

Max - It should be a rule. There, the post-it note just went up on my desk! We’ll sneak it in next time. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day

[@jaimecruz7275]

Nice trash talk on kitamura 😂

[@gekigasky]

Great advice. Weird name.

[@DavidePetrini]

Bel video ! ti aspetto sul mio canale👍

[@ttiization]

@AvE check this one out

[@brucebrucestofiston5554]

Mark is a hack... He doesn’t even use a safety 🐐

[@MM-wp5sp]

This is a problem with HAAS control. Every other control on the market including Fanuc, Siemens, and Heidenhain, has no problems with HSM. No special code or whatever needed. It just runs, smoothly and efficiently. This is an old oroblem with HAAS controls. As we can see from the video, they still havent resolved it. Really, HAAS?

[@markterryberry4477]

M M, check for "smoothing" on your control. Chances are they will have similar options to control smoothness. The physics we adjust for with a G187 would apply to every CNC machine - or Tron bike :)

[@danielmachado6750]

🇧🇷Daniel Machado - Brazil🌎🇺🇸

[@michaeljohnson-li5nn]

Very interesting video, only one criticism - the plural of radius is radii.

[@imaamericangirl1406]

According to the dictionary it is either radiuses or radii. I just double checked. So Mark is correct.

[@sweet_as_honey]

@@imaamericangirl1406 Ain't it funny how some people think they are so damn correct, lol. Thank you for correcting this know it all, much appreciated.

[@Nikomahonen]

if you use mastercam you dont have to think those things

[@haasautomation]

Niko - Mastercam has some very cool filters, and their own corner-rounding function. Lots of ways to create shiny parts. Thanks for the comment. - Mark, Haas Tip-of-the-day.

[@sergegostoli9524]

cat videos on youTube... LOL

[@Thefreakyfreek]

You talk mm : better

[@AnnetteStoopswilson]

gay

[@AnnetteStoopswilson]

i hate school

[@RaptorJesus316]

Talking about machine accuracy while standing beside a Haas......