How the World's Most Complicated Language Works

Subscribe to Nebula at go.nebula.tv/hai
Get a Half as Interesting t-shirt: standard.tv/co...
Suggest a video and get a free t-shirt if we use it: halfasinteresti...
Follow Sam from Half as Interesting on Instagram: / sam.from.wendover
Follow Half as Interesting on Twitter: / halfinteresting
Discuss this video on Reddit: / halfasinteresting
Video written by Adam Chase
Check out my other channel: / wendoverproductions

[@ParametricGold]

“A voiceless non-labialized lamino-postalveolar dorso-palatal grooved sibilant fricative” He is just talking about “sh”

[@navygravy9708]

worst part: the IPA representation is right at the end of the line he read even worse part: it says how you're supposed to pronounce it at the start of said line

[@dejv0000]

š

[@jangamecuber]

@@dejv0000 ʃ

[@KatzRool]

Talking about standard linguistics like it's some quirky shit.

[@saruman947]

Ş

[@eyekandi]

For awhile I wondered why some languages were so fast and long and they couldn’t be short and precise, now I realize why. this is pain inducing

[@Ealsante]

Yep, this is why. It's because language is used by societies, and the average intelligence and understanding of any group goes down as the size of the group increases. This is also why jargon is a thing - a group of post-doc linguists have no problem deciphering what is a voiceless non-labialised etc. etc. sibilant fricative, but the general population is going to struggle. Any language is only as complex as it can be understood by the dumbest people in a large group.

[@Mercure250]

@@Ealsante So you're saying you're the reason language is getting simpler?

[@holtcompass3934]

@@Mercure250 Yeah. Just check our presidents out.

[@michaeltagor4238]

@@Mercure250 simpler AND much more practical

[@Mercure250]

@@michaeltagor4238 Yup. But the paradox of language is that things get simpler without actually getting simpler. If it simplifies in some aspect, it gets more complicated in another. For instance, English lost its morphological complexity in exchange for syntactical complexity. This paradox is the reason languages change all the time.

[@eterevsky]

"Which means I must stress the final syllable." Immediately after that the presenter pronounces the word with the stress on the initial syllable.

[@LeoStaley]

My favorite part of the video.

[@sillicon8227]

I read this while that part of the vedio was playing Oh my God

[@mcgovemj]

He mispronounces many of the terms in the video.

[@syrialak101]

I, to this day, do not know exactly how grammatical stress works so I don't blame him.

[@TonysRacing600]

My question is how does one pronounce the finally syllable while also maintain a falling tone. These kind of cancel each other out don't they?

[@iLikeCoffee777]

I think this would make a neat "spell incantation" language since part of the very idea of magic words is that they are extremely specific and information dense. Also, the idea of the language being incomprehensible to those without special training is another common trope.

[@buddermonger2000]

It also addresses the super specific pronunciations which are equally present where just even a wrong inflection can mess up a spell (take Harry Potters infamous "leviosa not leviosaaa")

[@matthewhenson4566]

The problem here is actually writing it. It would be a huge unnecessary time sink in the writing process when writing already often requires a whole lot of research to try and sound intelligent about topics the writer is personally unfamiliar with. There is a reason most writers don't try and pull a Tolkien despite how cool it might seem to make your own language for your world.

[@bjrn-oskarrnning2740]

Oh, *come on*, man, don't make me want to learn Ithkuil just to make my D&D campaign more realistic!

[@steveglover6411]

Very cool idea. It might be more fun to just pretend your D&D Sorcerer has knowledge of this kind of language.

[@DonVigaDeFierro]

From "Structure and Interpretation of Computer Programs" (The wizard's book): "A computational process is indeed much like a sorcerer's idea of a spirit. It cannot be seen or touched. It is not composed of matter at all. However, it is very real. It can perform intellectual work. It can answer questions. It can affect the world by disbursing money at a bank or by controlling a robot arm in a factory. The programs we use to conjure processes are like a sorcerer's spells. They are carefully composed in arcane and esoteric _programming languages_ that prescribe the tasks we want our processes to perform". Honestly why your idea isn't a thing in fantasy can be attributed to the fact that writers are _writers,_ not computer scientists or linguists (save for a certain guy who wrote a story about some dwarfs...) A dumb idea occurred to me: A fantasy book in which spells are cast using actual programming languages (or just a language in general) , and the book itself is structured like a language course. We follow a young wizard apprentice learning the language and eventually saving the world... WHY IS THAT NOT A THING??? IT BASICALLY WRITES ITSELF!!!

[@rokushou]

Ithkuil looks like the result of an AI developing a language for humans. Complete with lookup tables incorporating all the sounds that a human can make in an efficient grid. Ease of use and was definitely not a concern.

[@Matt-zp1jn]

I thought a similiar vein too. Kinda like a language that AI can use to cross interface with English (and all the languages on earth eventually), that will be precise, complex, and directly relatable for computer AI to eventually communicate “effectively” with humans thru reading, writing, speaking, even just thinking or on Musk’s Neurolink etc. It will allow androids, robots, AI, computers, humans, and maybe eventually animals I bet to communicate thoughts and feelings, ideas, statements, questions, answers etc in their language that the AI will decode/incode etc. Fascinating yet also unnerving like Skynet will be on its way, and could communicate thru those huge giant LCD digital tower giant screens that will broadcast any person, idol, celebrity, politician, dead or alive, onto the LCD screen as a digital giant future ruler that will simultaneously communicate with people around the globe 🌎.

[@Dracopol]

Yeah, the AI considers all the sounds a human can make, but not whether we WANT to make those sounds. (Nightmare image of human in blacklight hooked up to a blood-greasy rack with electrodes all over it, and an AI voice saying, "Come on, do the French nasal vowels, it's not so hard!")

[@Matty002]

@@Dracopol to be fair, nasal vowels are not hard

[@Dracopol]

@@Matty002 No? Nasal vowels are not that common. In European languages I think only French, Portuguese and Galician have them. Oh, wait, Polish has 2, ą and ę, but they are no longer pronounced all the time where they are spelled. They are a corruption where an "N" used to be pronounced after a vowel. They reek of decay. French has 4 kinds, but in France itself it may be retreating to only 3 types. "Un bon vin blanc!" It is a mystic art, to pronounce the N without actually pronouncing the N!

[@Matty002]

@@Dracopol i know what nasal vowels are, i speak french. what does them being common have to do with anything? your fake AI said 'hard' not common. lowering your velum while articulating a vowel is not hard. there are even english dialects with nasal vowels. a trilled uvilar R is hard

[@kaiserredgamer8943]

It is impossible to place implied or subtle meanings in this language because it's basically designed to convey messages in the most exact and comprehensive ways possible.

[@flaetsbnort]

They should've added a phoneme for 'if you catch my drift'

[@TBA95]

Ah but just because the language is precise, it doesn't mean the writer/speaker has to be. You can still be ironic or change the grammar, using formal/informal or the wrong case on purpose for effect? Also, slang would be interesting...

[@demonschnauzer1555]

Imagine the poetry in this langauge

[@joshuaoehler5796]

@@demonschnauzer1555 There isn't any. Not can there be . . . other than doggerel, limericks, and maybe haiku.

[@demonschnauzer1555]

@@joshuaoehler5796 I would agree, but I think it would probably still be possible to create poetry with hidden or multiple meanings in this language given that metaphors exist and also we will never be able to come up with a language that actually perfectly describes every single thing, so some things will be left unexplained, and you could make poetry with those things. Also, things can be said “incorrectly” for the purpose of art.

[@larsw8776]

Now imagine Aliens finding Ithkuil and trying to decipher it, thinking we were incredibly intelligent, complex beings.

[@magicmulder]

It’s certainly better for communicating with us than “give weapon”.

[@Pining_for_the_fjords]

@@magicmulder I got that reference.

[@magicmulder]

@@Pining_for_the_fjords Military dude: "They said something like itxapodúrxameeshnoput." Linguist: "Oh, 'We have come to procure you with the necessary language skills to be practically able to fully master the time dimension with the peaceful intention to enable you to help us in the far future'".

[@vikashkthakur]

@@Pining_for_the_fjords the short story was nice too.

[@magicmulder]

@@twitchygene614 Arrival. :)

[@ayrplanes]

This is the kind of language you would get if word cost $300 each.

[@CreeperGreenMC]

This language is genius, why bother with text compression when you can just compress your whole language. And People on twitter would love this language, it would give them even more characters to bully people

[@joeygenna4801]

imagine having to write a 10 page essay in this

[@wyntyrr]

I’ve also been making an information-condensing language called Qala. Here’s an example: English: The car exploded! Qala: Xaat’â!

[@zimtschnecke9284]

@@wyntyrr Can you break Xaatâ down for me?

[@ghostguy0o0]

@@wyntyrr wait so is ðe /aa/ þing supposed to be an indication of a long vowel or is ðere some rule ðat dictates ðat ðe glottal stop is automatically placed between two vowels? Edit: or maybe it's someþing i can't þink of aðm

[@wyntyrr]

@@ghostguy0o0 “Aa” is pronounced /ɑː/, yes.

[@joeym5243]

This is the language you use to write on the one note card you can use on a test

[@PotatoMan007]

It would take more effort in deciphering the language than studying for the test.

[@graciouscompetentdwarfrabbit]

ngl, just because of this comment I now kinda wanna learn this language

[@DaveTheVader]

Unironically, if you did that it would help you loads actually remembering and internalizing the material. Because the language is so dense and filled with context a lot of thought needs to be put into what the context of the words you write is. Writing in Ithkuil necessitates actually understanding what it is you want to say, so by the time you've finished writing your cheat sheet in Ithkuil you probably don't need the cheat sheet anymore.

[@breadtubediet1524]

@@DaveTheVader which is the main function of the notecard anyway. The promise of "easy/free" information available to you during the test is just a trick to get you to sit down and actually study

[@DaveTheVader]

@@breadtubediet1524 That goes without saying.

[@6z0]

Fun fact: Not one person can fluently speak Ithkuil, even the creator. So maybe you could be the first!

[@prisma.]

i dont think anyone wants to memorize hundreds of thousands of tables to make weird noises nobdy but them understand

[@Cody-Bear]

Maybe Xioma, he learns languages

[@yoyu1001]

@@prisma. yes but what if we captured a child and taught them this language from a young age. Like imagine how would a child that has only known ikthul all their life learn English?

[@6_blocks_under]

@@yoyu1001 they would be so confused as to why our language is so drawn out and imprecise

[@gordoawesome8590]

Over my dead body

[@stevenc.6502]

A similar conlang was described in the 1949 story "Gulf" by Robert Heinlein. The major problem with such a language is the lack of redundancy. Any mispronunciation, mishearing, speech impediment, tone-deafness, noisy environment or low-quality communications technology, means serious miscommunication.

[@fieryr]

which is why languages like this would be perfect if they only existed on paper rather than have people actually try and speak them.

[@condorianonegdiffsgoku]

​@@fieryr A single spelling or typing mistake will change the whole meaning completely.

[@fieryr]

@@condorianonegdiffsgoku that's a skill issue on your part though also you can just invent a language with thousands of symbols distinct enough, or composed by multiple simpler symbols. just look at chinese or hindi.

[@PrometheusUnbound-zy1nc]

Ithkuil is not designed to mimick Robert Heinlein's Speedtalk, that common misconception Quijada actually responds to in his FAQ. Whereas Heinlein's Speedtalk is focused on compression, Ithkuil instead is intended to convey as much cognitive intent and semantic nuance/exactitude per morpheme.

[@renakunisaki]

These super-information-dense languages seem great until you try to actually use them. Packing so much information into so little space with no redundancy means any minor error or damage can create a valid, but incorrect word. So you send a nice formal letter to your boss only to be fired because a smudge turned "working for you" into "screwing your mom". In English this can still happen ("car" and "can" differ by only a fraction of a letter), but usually there's enough redundancy that you can infer what the damaged/wrong worm was suposed to be, even if you omitted a letter entirely like I just did, or used the wrong word. Even if you an entire word it can still be understood.

[@GarrettBlackmon]

Yeah, it's impressive that we can make the model maximum precision languages but in practice they'd be terribly inefficient. Our brains have evolved to infer and deduce meaning from an imprecise statement. TL;DR: Subconscious mind waaaaay ahead of you.

[@HayTatsuko]

I accidentally the entire watermelon.

[@DanielTanios]

Yeah, but pretty sure Ithkuil has quite a bit of redundancy itself. It is information dense, but that doesn't necessarily make it "efficient" in the context of conversation or everyday life. The grammar requires *much* more syntactic information to express semantic ideas than natural languages. What this means is there's a large amount of redundancy baked into the grammar, which probably means it isn't any less understandable or comprehensible in the presence of signal errors than any other language.

[@thequeertelope7941]

lolll

[@zyaicob]

Who actually thinks these are good? Good for what? If they were good, human languages would resemble them. Language is literally only useful because we use it

[@vodozhaba]

HAI: complains that “voiceless non-labialized lamino-postalveolar dorso-palatal grooved sibilant fricative” tells him nothing IPA [ʃ] right there: am I a joke to you?

[@ExtantThylacine]

SSHHH! Don't tell him.

[@justin.booth.]

@@ExtantThylacine hahaha

[@DeadBread.]

.....i may be dumb, but that symbol also tells me nothing

[@ExtantThylacine]

@@DeadBread. It's the 'sh' sound as in 'shake'.

[@eritain]

My [ʃ] is labialized. Many people's is; it helps exaggerate the distinction from [s].

[@hunterg6534]

as a linguist this "phenome" thing is really driving me up the wall

[@katiekawaii]

Yeah, and making that kind of mistake in a video specifically about language is...not great for credibility.

[@Abigail-hu5wf]

It hurts my soul and makes me doubt that Sam really knows any amount about the things he's talking.

[@GiulianoScocozza]

Same

[@hititwithit]

He also mispronounced "monadic" as "mondaic". Sloppy.

[@drakemarsaly6644]

@@Abigail-hu5wf You're a fool if you thought he's been writing his own videos this whole time - at this point he's a narrator for a research team. They probably do know what they are talking about, he doesn't and that makes him mispronounce but doesn't impeach the credibility of the whole video. They do need better QC tho

[@tttITA10]

As a linguist, all the mixing up of the "morpheme" and "phoneme" concepts in this video slightly triggers me, but I love how this video actually builds a word as an example for us. It is great. (By the way, you guys showed how the word should be stressed in the last syllable, but your final pronuntiation stressed the penultime syllable. It's still great, though, I just noticed it the second time around). Also, lots of the things here are suprasegmental stuff, and I have no idea on how the morpheme concept works with supragmental stuff. I'll assume it is pretty much the same as it is for segments, but if any fellow linguist would explain this to me, I'd be thankful.

[@erynn9968]

I think it’s incorrect to say ‘as a linguist, it triggers me’. Should be ‘As a linguist, I find it annoying’. So that the subject of the 2nd part is the same thing that you refer to in the 1st part. As a linguist, I find THIS frustrating.

[@thomicrisler9855]

@@erynn9968As a linguist, you oughtn't subscribe to such prescriptive grammar rules. Dangling modifiers are dispreferred but they are hardly ever actually ambiguous; in fact, I often analyze them as being akin to a topic, like Japanese "wa" phrases.

[@glitchy9613]

@@erynn9968 Prescriptivism at its finest.

[@asheep7797]

As a not-linguist, I have no idea what this reply chain says.

[@wilhelmseleorningcniht9410]

@@asheep7797 In pop linguistic spaces such as this, prescriptivism (the idea that there are certain correct ways to do language) is still quite entrenched even though it's long obsolete in professional Linguistics (this is one of the ways where pop science lags behind actual science) This is all contrasted with descriptivism which is the idea that a language is what its speakers are speaking it as, and that a linguists job is to study and describe that, rather than impose arbitrary rules as an authority figure (which'd be prescriptivism). If you were in English speaking public schooling than most likely you've come across a few cases here and there of like 'then vs than' or 'don't use *can* use *may*' or you might have gotten it from your parents as well (prescriptivism in other languages is of course also a thing but there I lack knowledge as to specific examples)

[@f52_yeevy]

This language is the most efficient if you look at how much few words can say, but also the less efficient language if you look at how much work you have to make just one word.

[@darkpixel1128]

well, if you had to fit a full novel on a piece of paper, then it would be very efficient if you actually had to write said novel, not so efficient

[@f52_yeevy]

@@darkpixel1128 Exactly, it's a very weird concept for a language and I'd say that the motto "Virtus in medio stat" (aka the truth/virtue lies in the middle) is valid also in this case.

[@exedeath]

If you are wondering, the radix economy for a language with only sillabes (sillabary language) is 3 sillabes. Radix economy takes into account the amount of sillabes it takes to write something and the amount of sillabes you need to do it.

[@hyperspeed1313]

This would be perfect if you have supercomputers connected by cans with string that need to communicate.

[@badenfrancis2038]

It would be interesting to see if a baby could learn this as their first language. And if so, would they be able to speak ot just as easily as you and I speak English?

[@ordinary_magician]

So it’s sentences are really short? Oh man ithkuil translations of games would become dominant in speedrunning if they existed...

[@StarmuteVII]

Oh hi Marisa

[@6z0]

@@waldolemmer Autocorrect switches “its” to “it’s”

[@HyperDragon01]

Until some language like Italian is noticed to be faster because Italian has instant text and you can just hold a button down to fly through the text boxes.

[@sillicon8227]

@@waldolemmer it's is actually the right form. Now, you might think an "apostrophe symbol denotes the possession of an item or anything else by the subject" and you may be right for example the word "jack's", it can be used as "Jack's clothes"; but when used on words like "it" the apostrophe symbol changes its use case to denote plurality.

[@MatLCF]

@@sillicon8227 I don't think he used it to denote plurality, though, but rather possession. "Its" as posssessive form of "It" just like "His" is of "He".

[@Ptaku93]

the rampant mispronunciation is just a cherry on top making sure, we, the audience, never forget that this video was, in fact, narrated by a dweeb

[@polyrtm5545]

phenome

[@SnigelSnigelson]

Mondaic

[@EyeMWing]

longuistics... In the curiositystream ad.

[@DaSquyd]

Now say this in Ithkuil.

[@SM-ok3sz]

SHA POWT LAY

[@Puddlesoak]

"And now I must stress the final syllable" Immediately proceeds to stress the first syllable instead

[@Connie_cpu]

Text on the screen: "MONADIC" Sam: "Mondaic" Me: dying inside every time he says it

[@kirkkerman]

I think Ithkuil broke him; he forgot how to read

[@windestruct]

You just want to say it like you first read it

[@truebluekit]

By this point, he doesn't care

[@gnoy]

Also Sam pronouncing it “phenomes” instead of “phonemes”

[@elemenopi9239]

no way xenoblade chronicles reference

[@WhiteWulfe]

This seems like something Tom Scott would have "fun" with....

[@louiskent1724]

Would actually tell us about it instead of saying I dunno

[@michaelmoses8745]

That would be fun. I will probably send it to him. You should do so as well.

[@Jedibob5]

I wonder what xnopyt means in Ithkuil...

[@user-sc3oh1bw4z]

lol

[@zyaicob]

He's an actual linguist so he would hate it

[@nineix9438]

drinking game: drink every time sam mispronounces something

[@truebluekit]

Warning: incipient death.

[@Perririri]

ÔKSNORMIE

[@fyorr]

You'd have to have 4 shot glasses for 1:48.

[@nineix9438]

@@fyorr that one line could put someone in a coma

[@thr04w4y]

I don't want to die right now, thank you

[@peterpanda5069]

A language actually with phenomes (differentiable smells) would be amazing

[@pocarski]

*confesses feelings by gradually increasing the hydrogen sulfide concentration in my fart*

[@orngjce223]

Pheromones

[@bobbybobby325]

SHIT SHIT SHIT SHIT SHIT SHIT SHIT SHIT

[@Hallow1]

alot of insects do this, like ants, and the geks in no mans sky use it kinda

[@HeyImLauren]

HAI: “linguistics sucks and we will never make a video on it again.” also HAI:

[@GoinGreninja]

Hey, it's AxxL, an extremely famous bot known for invading in big channels, promoting his own channel while also saying some incomprehensible garbage and thinks he's gonna be a big name without putting in the effort with his videos and such. Don't you've a life that's not self promotion? With that time you waste, you'd've a decent but loyal following.

[@afdocumentaries]

@@AxxLAfriku what

[@randomtinypotatocried]

@@AxxLAfriku How's your weed smoking girlfriends?

[@Mimi.1001]

@@GoinGreninja I believe he is indeed a real person and does seem to be writing quite a lot of these texts by himself (also indicated by that typo in OPs Name he wanted to recite). He has been doing this shtick for years, firstly only under bigger German channels (I think it somehow worked out, a bigger KZbinr reacted to his channel giving a considerable boost...), but he does seem to be going international for quite some while now. It does seem to work though...

[@GoinGreninja]

@@Mimi.1001 That may be true but whether or not he's a real person, doing this much self promotion is still a very scummy move. And of course, just because he's successful with this 'tactic', that doesn't mean his audience will stay on because of his content and character.

[@godminnette2]

Now do a video on Toki Pona, the world's simplest con-lang.

[@wiktorszymczak4760]

Toki pona - created to help with depression This monstrosity - killed everyone who attempted to learn it

[@tadesubaru1383]

I studied toki pona at school!

[@kalabuk1678]

You have got to be about the most superficial commentator on con-languages since the idiotic B. Gilson. Did I miss the one where you said which conlang you’re fluent in and read at least three times a week and can read new books in every week of even one year or listen to radio shows in every week? New radio shows?

[@isaachorgan]

toki pona li pona mute

[@wlll1235]

@@kalabuk1678 who are you responding to? OP has no content on their channel, (i don't even think that what you're saying is relevant to what they said, they just said that Toki Pona is simple), and no one else said anything related to what you're saying? did the original preson that you're replying to delete their comment? if so, ok, but who are you even talking to?

[@fnorgen]

Sounds like somebody wanted revenge on their latin teacher.

[@lucasinatur2925]

Then the inventor sends his language to his teacher, that would be the greatest thing I’ve ever heard

[@PrimalBoos]

Lol

[@sillicon8227]

Is your PFP the oldest meme!?

[@sion8]

*+*

[@therealspeedwagon1451]

Why would I want to do that she’s awesome

[@R3DSHlFT]

Imagine this language inside video games or series to hide lore. The 1st text font would also work in a cyberpunk style

[@grahamnielsen6578]

Every time he says “phenomes” I feel pain

[@Edumt91]

The amount of times he said "phenome" actually made me doubt he wasn't just mispronouncing "phoneme". He was.

[@alephomega955]

Hearing "phonemes" being said as "phenomes" and š being pronounced as s instead of sh had me rolling on the floor 😂

[@ShaggyCZ]

At least my native language (Czech) has the "sh" sound as "š", which is the same as in this language lol

[@morn1415]

I will never complain about Latin again... :/ Maybe the Heptapods from Arrival will be able to speak it...

[@itismethatguy]

Ahaha

[@RaymondHng]

Ha. You should try Cantonese. It's like speaking in French and reading/writing in Latin.

[@samsunguser3148]

Heck, even aliens or not even God can read it

[@mwanikimwaniki6801]

@@RaymondHng 😂You gave me so much perspective as I can read both Latin and French.

[@Vasharan]

@@RaymondHng Right? I saw that Ithkuil had 7 tones and thought, 'Pathetic. Hokkien has 15 and Cantonese has 22.'

[@IllustriousElucidation]

Damn, where's Tom Scott when you need him...

[@Blue-Maned_Hawk]

Considering that he refused to use Linux to make the emoji keyboard when it would have taken him just a bit of faffing with Python, I wouldn't trust him to adequately explain this.

[@gogolometro235]

@@Blue-Maned_Hawk what?

[@t0x1cl]

@@Blue-Maned_Hawk can you say it in, uh, more detail

[@equinoxxed_7502]

@@t0x1cl preferably in English

[@Omikron1]

@@Blue-Maned_Hawk He is literally a linguist though. Many of his videos are chock full of linguistics.

[@zenalexander9278]

I wanted to create a conlang for Demons in my novel. And it should be full of information in every word. And this conlang is an amazing example to study.

[@wiegraf9009]

Only Mordons would speak this...

[@pawepiat6170]

4:22 When language has space time continuum diagram to explain it

[@flavioaugustojose]

I'm guessing soon Duolingo will email me with their new available language...

[@REEEPROGRAM]

It's simple everyone Spanish or *Vanish*

[@mrafishonascreen2986]

Japanese or break the knees

[@AzraelGnosis]

It's been suggested but there are a lot of other conlangs with a larger community (probably, Lojban, Ido, Quenya/Sindarin, Interlingua/Interlingue/Lingua Franca Nova/etc., Toki Pona, maybe Dothraki, Na'vi, etc.) to get through before they'd ever consider Ithkuil.

[@nerobernardino88]

@@AzraelGnosis Meanwhile there's me, an idiot who learned Esperanto just for it to practically vanish

[@flavioaugustojose]

@@AzraelGnosis it was a joke

[@tomrick5661]

Hey! Ithkuilian here (I am not fluent in it, but I am interested in the language). Nice to see that you made the video. There is a version that’s work in progress (v4) and that doesn’t have a website yet, but it is much better than v3 (the version on the website) everything is much more simple, systematic and even more expressive. The Ca chart is half a page instead of that huge chart as well as there are more words and so on. I have no idea when will it be released but great news is that it can be learnt to fluency (no one has tried it yet, but we have gotten to the conclusion that it would be harder than natural languages, but definitely doable by humans).

[@chyza2012]

i don't think anybody is fluent in ithkuil.

[@asj3419]

I find it absolutely hilarious that after decades and 4 revisions people can finally plausibly learn to use the language.

[@Blue-Maned_Hawk]

The documents are coagulated at www.reddit.com/r/Ithkuil/comments/mmkmbc/updates/. The do assume prior knowledge of Ithkuil's concepts, so quick access to ithkuil.net (yes, HTTP) may be useful.

[@gammarayneutrino8413]

@@asj3419 Ithkuil was made to be an artlang, not a language you'd actually use to communicate, but it seems what people want from this language is changing so they're making revisions

[@ok.ok.5735]

His 1 word in that language equaled 1 paragraph in English I like it cuts down on the writing and probably most mistakes. I’m interested.

[@hardlyb]

This reminds me a little of playing 20 questions with my much smarter kids. One that we had to guess was the abstract nail in the proverb (I guess) about 'for want of a nail'. So not only were there categories like Animal, Vegetable, or Mineral, but there were Figurative, Hypothetical, Fictional, and various other levels of abstraction.

[@suomeaboo]

You are the very model of a modern Major-General. You've information vegetable, animal, and mineral.

[@suomeaboo]

And also hypothetical, figurative, and fictional.

[@Kira1Lawliet]

As someone with a degree in linguistics, this made me want to paint the wall with my brains.

[@FairyCRat]

P H E N O M E S

[@bkzach]

Same just same

[@tjenadonn6158]

As a rank amateur linguistics nerd this, Lojban, and its predecessor Loglan are why we should leave languages to linguists and not computer scientists. HUMANS AND COMPUTERS COMMUNICATE IN FUNDAMENTALLY DIFFERENT WAYS.

[@himagainstill]

But the question that needs answering is this: Is it a brick wall?

[@EvlEgle]

Same but, i havent watchef the video yet

[@joshmaday1462]

As an English-speaker learning Russian, when you said there are 96 cases, I had to hold back tears. 6 is bad enough.

[@Яна-мамба]

You mean 9?)))

[@joshmaday1462]

@@Яна-мамба or 15, or whatever the true historical number is.

[@acutechicken5798]

Just use quizlet to memorize all the case endings :]

[@ezekielbrockmann114]

It's the verbs of motion that'll kill you in Russian.

[@Finch-lh6lk]

Hungarian has 26.

[@kaijoswilman]

I love how this video is out of date now that New Ithkuil just dropped

[@trevor_phillipz]

homestuck spotted

[@60secondfinance81]

Next video on Wendover Productions: The Logistics of Making Words in the World’s Most Complicated Language

[@centurion1945]

The phonemes must be shipped directly to you're brain by way of Boeing 787, but only after a stop over in Louisville KY, where it gets paired with the appropriate accent.

[@Smokecall]

@@centurion1945 always find a way to work a plane in every wendover video. Even if you have to use a Toyota Corolla reference to get there

[@thePronto]

"Why airlines are [insert GPT-3 generated phrase here]."

[@Blue-Maned_Hawk]

I do think that a more in-depth video is deserved on the topic.

[@JouvaMoufette]

*video of jets on a tarmac* Ithkuil... Has... A problem...

[@thelinuxcolonel]

Imagine spending a week doing research for this video but not bothering to check how the word "phoneme" is pronounced.

[@toadofsteel]

Kotor did that shit too

[@Myrkvi_]

..or learning basic IPA to find out that /ʃ/ is pronounced just like English . oʊksʌɹn

[@psiphiorg]

Or that "monadic" isn't pronounced "mondaic".

[@lapiscarrot3557]

PHENOMES (my linguistics hurts)

[@TommiWalle]

labialized as "labby-lised"

[@memehub.112]

my man speaking enchantment table

[@rocks7456]

My eyes twitched at every pronunciation of 'phenomes.'

[@xenon8966]

The way you pronounce 'phoneme' actually scares me, but I'm happy you covered this incredible conlang.

[@turpialito]

Sad state of affairs that your comment has gone unnoticed.

[@xgozulx]

this language reminds me so much of Basque, witch also has infinite numbers of look up tables and word constructing, so though it is like 10 times wors, I think it can really be used

[@hipsnowsis7374]

HAI: "Why sound description so long?" IPA Symbol: "sssshhhhhhh"

[@reallyreally1067]

4:00 "Mondaic" like 'mosaic" or did you mean "Monadic?" It's ok to say it, almost every male in every species only has one.

[@slyar]

1:44 Sam casually mispronouncing the English "sh" sound preceded by "k"

[@wisteria3032]

Am I the only one who wants to use this in D&D? As in: You finally managed to free the last of the Ithkuils from his seal. You ask him about the profecy. He answers. good luck guys.

[@ladyeowyn42]

You’re a mean dm

[@breadtubediet1524]

def make this language an "exotic" one.

[@wiegraf9009]

You have to permanently lose one INT to learn this language because it takes so much brain power

[@wisteria3032]

@@wiegraf9009 but if you manage to learn it you may find ancient writings now and then - if the group is keen on exploring - that may increase your wisdom?

[@wiegraf9009]

@@wisteria3032 Yeah I could definitely imagine that happening, like in Planescape: Torment!

[@MoiselleTheFae]

Wild. I do have to point out it's kinda funny you keep saying "phenome" (the set of all phenotypes in a cell, organism, etc in the field of genetics) and not "phoneme" (a unit of sound)

[@duncanhw]

And "mondaic", and "labby lised", and the hundreds of other mistakes

[@Aciel-]

As someone that got interested in linguistics through conlangs, seeing a video on one by a popular KZbinr makes me unreasonably happy.

[@carlospesqueraalonso4988]

Sendube!

[@duncanhw]

Then surely you recognise all the mistakes?

[@Aciel-]

@@duncanhw I recognize them, but that doesn't take away from the fact it serves as a good way for people who have never looked at the subject to be exposed to it.

[@duncanhw]

@@Aciel- He doesn't explain anything about conlangs though. He could have said how many people speak it (zero), what it's purpose is (not to be an actual usable language), et cetera.

[@w1ck3dz0d1ac]

Imagine writing an AI to use this as the base language to communicate with. The code could be dense and precise. It's a language that values data compression. This means entire books could have a somewhat readable compressed format. If each letter was given a number similar to Unicode you could compress the entire file even further.

[@loldragon2359]

Or maybe we could make an ai that would be the first ever thing in existence that could speak this language with proper pronunciation

[@mYnAME-ww9iv]

I just love to imagine that 1 simple syntax error would force even the most hardened supercomputer kick into overdrive mode and catch on fire! Ohh sorry, I meant: Frrœßtrã!

[@notveryartificial4486]

Fun thing with "letters" is that they are not separate symbols. They are more like hyeroglyph type of thing, that means each symbol is constructed from various parts

[@kurostyx9124]

too many features dl would work but idk 😂

[@CosmicWaltz7]

Now imagine an error.

[@xeji4348]

Knowing the IPA, seeing someone trying to figure it out ,not knowing there's a wiki for it , hurts me on an emotional level

[@YuriChan-428]

5:36 I am eastern European, I use these special symbols above letters, I would pronounce it as "uok-sh-urn".

[@DimitrijDimitrij]

You must be Slovak.

[@Okaiako]

This is basically the polar opposite of Toki Pona since it's so simplified that it requires a lot of words to express specific ideas, while Ithkuil can express them in very short sentences or even one word.

[@FrankClark]

Your [language developers] were so preoccupied with whether or not they could, they didn’t stop to think if they should.

[@prodprod]

A long time ago I read a science fiction novel (alas, I've forgotten both name and author) that contained something very much like this -- a race of beings with a very highly adapted language that allowed a speaker to do things like visit a factory, observe it, and come away with the ability to describe the entire factory using only a single word -- with the word containing all of the information necessary to completely reconstruct the factory.

[@OtakuUnitedStudio]

The fact that one of the sounds is described as being pronounced "like the 'h' in 'sh-'" just makes me so angry. This is a language made by a madman for talking computers.

[@noe2521]

Why does that make you angry?

[@horntx]

@@noe2521 because the h in sh is silent...

[@fyeahusa]

@@horntx Yes and no. You can kind of seperate the 'h' part of 'sh' because it is distinct from 's', but 'sh' tends to be considered as a single consonant in a lot of languages.

[@noe2521]

@@fyeahusa exactly

[@nuzayerov]

@@fyeahusa , exactly, like in my language, sh is a letter/consonant itself (there is actually 2-3 sh, one deeper, one lighter, and another one is, well it sometimes acts as a normal s, and sometimes as a light sh). (Bengali).

[@mrtoasteer3561]

this language feels like what runic in light novels would be; extremely compact with lots of meaning but incredibly complex as well

[@magicmulder]

At least there would be no more ambiguous prophecies.

[@descendng]

learning this language sounds really interesting but I can still barely manage to speak the one language I do know. guess that's off the table for now

[@echo5156]

its creator cant even speak it

[@itismethatguy]

Interesting?

[@aaroncohen2700]

You forgot to capitalize Guess

[@itismethatguy]

@@aaroncohen2700 uh do u rlly think he was trying to sound professional? Plz dont be a language nerd...we all know but its just to be quick. Or did i miss a joke

[@thefancysquid671]

Tolkien would have had a field day with this

[@NimhLabs]

Tolkien would assume Satan is trying to tempt his soul with this xD

[@JessHart006]

Fascinating subject, but hearing "phenome" so many times just killed my enthusiasm for it. It's as if he willed the concept of "phenome" into existence, and it was a combination of "phoneme" and "pheromone" that resulted in "a mispronunciation that produces an emotional or instinctive effect upon the listener separate from the actual vocalized statement".

[@bfish89ryuhayabusa]

Phenome-nal

[@KolMan2000]

Sounds like somebody tried making every noise they possibly could with their mouth and said “that sounds like a language to me”

[@theidioticbgilson1466]

georgian be like

[@neonvalley9613]

Don't let this distract you from the fact that Mr Krabs sold Spongebob’s soul for 62 cents.

[@Kromiball]

spngbob

[@10klikeanonimbalikwxc14]

Thanks I almost forgot

[@brandon025]

@@Kromiball spungbob

[@balkanmadnessmadeinaustria5837]

Spinigebob

[@brandon025]

Spinachbob

[@DemonicCathode]

Imagine this as an adopted language. "How're you doing with this essay? I've only 1,700 words so far." "Wrote mine in Ithkuil - finished in five."

[@renakunisaki]

Five words, but it took a week.

[@10klikeanonimbalikwxc14]

Considering two word means "on the contrary i think this rugged road gonna turn down at some point" maybe its faster to create it than write it

[@DemonicCathode]

@@10klikeanonimbalikwxc14 and one word was the bibliography

[@extrastuff9463]

Once politicians learn it maybe they can fit the things they try to pass through the legislative process on a few printed pages instead of a large bundle of paper that could probably be used to knock someone out. Oh and as a bonus many people won't be able to read it, so somewhat learning the language might get you into a media job to translate it into normal people words.

[@gorkskoal9315]

@@extrastuff9463 sooooo business as usuall. but a Bottom Line Up Front version of stuff.

[@robardin]

"Conlangs", or constructed languages, are a fascinating thing because there have been so many such languages created over time, by many different people. Yet (almost) none have ever actually gained acceptance as a universal L2 language, much less to become a living language. Constructed languages combine two basic human desires: to communicate with another human, and to engineer something for efficiency - and yet apparently these two desires are at some deep level, fundamentally incompatible! I highly recommend reading "In The Land of Invented Languages" by Arika Okrent for a history / survey / one person's foray into that world. Which includes exploring the extremely small number of people who have been raised with a constructed language from childhood as a "native" language - the two most commonly learned conlangs, Esperanto and yes, Klingon.

[@julianhayachid]

While infinitely more complex, this kind of resembles how Semitic languages, such as Arabic and Hebrew are constructed. Albeit less mind bending, these languages also feature roots, that with the help of a series of templates, pre- and suffixes can compress simple sentences into a single word. The root H.B.B / H.V.V for example constructs nouns and verbs that revolve around the general theme of love and affection (both in Hebrew and in Arabic). I can now apply a template that molds this root into a verb in first person, simple past tense: Hibavti in Hebrew, or Habet in most Arabic dialects, which means I (male) liked \ I loved respectively. Now I can add a suffix that implies an object: Hibavtia in Hebrew, Habetha in Arabic which means "I loved her" in one simple word.

[@Painocus]

It's like the roots of Semitic languages with the morphology of something like Nahuatl. To steal an example from somone else: "Nehualmoyecastemojmolunijtzinutinemisquiöni" Which means: "You, honorable people, might have come along banging your noses as to make them bleed, but you did in fact not." All built around the root "moluni", meaning bloom/boil/bleed. Honestly, if Ithkuil was less strict and less artficially economic and systemic with it's sound vocabulary it could have passed as a natural language, just one extreamly "alien" to people who are only indo-european speakers.

[@c.w.8200]

God, Hebrew is like a language from outer space to me and I'm already completely failing to learn that one. I used to think I'm good at languages but as I spent my youth learning European languages that have a lot of similarities I had no idea that my brain can't adapt to a Non-European language AT ALL.

[@mikemiddleton1240]

@@c.w.8200 Hebrew really isn't difficult. This kind of speech isn't particularly used all of the time. It's used a lot in religious texts and news articles but from what I understand, it is a formal way of talking that isn't really used conversationally very often. Hebrew is a language that tries to go out of it's way to make it easier on the speaker. Reading it is actually very simple and the root system is pretty logical. I'm a native English speaker and I haven't found Hebrew difficult at all.

[@dorol6375]

@@c.w.8200 Reading this as a native hebrew speaker is so funny

[@flyingspacebrainedidiot]

the information is so dense it might collapse into a black hole any second

[@EmmetWA]

drink every time he mispronounces a word

[@therobot1080]

id die

[@rahimeozsoy4244]

Not much

[@duncanhw]

I'd start to talk like him

[@bruhman2191]

This is the language that mumble rappers speak in when they are rapping

[@sion8]

They wish!

[@oriongurtner7293]

There is a case argument (“X” pictured at 3:19) that you said had no equivalent structure in _any_ other language That isn’t the case for algebraic/geometric languages, in which those all correlate to various qualities of geometric patterns, mathematical objects, functions, and a few other things Definitely not the same kind of language, but its definitely still a language that people speak Edit: then you go pull the list of ‘Configuration’ options and boy oh BOI is that literally ripped straight from geometric, algebraic, and general set theory language I only know because I’ve been studying and using those relations and terms

[@bluesillybeard]

"the most specific language" "...that experienced *something* " I see a slight contradiction with those two statements

[@chrisamies2141]

"Finnish has 15 cases." "Well, this one goes up to 11 ... no, it's 69."

[@deforged]

Nice.

[@MarcTelang]

Tzez has 64

[@kedarsharma487]

Feels like making the dictionary for this language would require the entire human population to work 24/7 and still take each person to be reborn 69 times.

[@frankm.2850]

I think part of the language is that there CAN'T be a dictionary for it because of the nature of the language. It doesn't have words in the way we think of them. You construct "words" on the fly, since a word is kind of this language's equivalent of a sentence/paragraph.

[@senesterium]

Funnily enough, ALL of this was made by a single guy. FOUR times.

[@breadtubediet1524]

it's kind of the opposite. There are fewer than 1000 (of the 3600 potential) roots assigned meaning right now. To construct any communication possible within the language, you only need to have those 1000 roots and the tables of phoneme afixes. You wouldn't bother making a dictionary definition for every potential combination of the 1000 roots + phoneme afixes, you'd only make a dictionary entry for every root + every phoneme afix, and you users can unify the set of definitions themselves

[@yernus]

1:13 Bro didn't even try, he just uttered some random goofy ahh sounds💀

[@TK-my7jg]

0:51 “on the contrary i think it may turn out that this rugged mountain range trails off at some point” Translate into old Chinese： “弗，吾以此岭时殁”

[@TK-my7jg]

“A crazy horse ran into the street and trampled a dog to death ” Translate into Chinese： 马逸毙犬于途

[@mattybrunolucaszeneresalas9072]

But how?

[@sterlingodeaghaidh5086]

Andy from How to Make Everything went about making a language too with his community, its pretty cool how we are able to not only dynamically communicate but have the ability to fabricate new ways to do it just for the sake of doing so.

[@robmack519]

"...you guessed it, 96." I died 😂

[@willywodka1924]

You know, German has four, Latin has five and I thought those were already high.

[@Cynd3r_]

This is probably what the dwarves from the elder scrolls speak

[@gamerpigeon4513]

Ah yes, the enchanting table language Learning it would probably be easier than this...

[@Blue-Maned_Hawk]

The enchanting table uses a cypher, not a language.

[@akl2k7]

Reminds me of RPG tables for some reason. Unfortunately, it's probably most like the d1000 tables in the legendarily bad RPG FATAL (don't look it up. NSFW. You've been warned).

[@angelodc1652]

Yes, especially considering it's a cipherlang!

[@mercurywoodrose]

this would be a great language to teach an AI, so it could translate from one language to another using this langauge as a go between. otherwise, the creator is insane to think any human would be able to use this language.

[@theidioticbgilson1466]

no because it's incredibly personal and context dependant

[@DogsRNice]

Actually machine translation systems actually have already created their own languages that they translate stuff into and then to whatever other language the user wants

[@hundvd_7]

That's basically what they do. At least for translators like DeepL. It's just not represented as a terse set of "easily" pronounceable and writable sounds/letters, but as a big string of 0s and 1s

[@xerenas1593]

Watching him call phonemes phenomes is just fucking killing me Good that he’s bringing conlangs to a wider audience though, credit where it’s due, and ithkuil was a better pick than Esperanto or a similar crappy auxlang.

[@ZMacGregor]

What's an auxiliary language and why is Esperanto crappy

[@Mercure250]

Careful, you're gonna summon Anthony McCarthy

[@Mercure250]

@@ZMacGregor Auxiliary language = language specifically created to be used by multiple linguistic communities so that they can understand each other; it can be for a local use (like Interslavic) or a global one (like Esperanto). The auxlangs going for the latter can be called "International Auxiliary Languages", or IAL. Conlangers nowadays consider Esperanto crappy for two reasons : 1. It was created over a century ago, and we can make way better auxlangs nowadays with the knowledge about languages we gained over the years (Esperanto has some weird grammatical rules, is way too eurocentric in its lexicon, and has a pretty complex phonological system for a language that's supposed to be easy for everyone to learn; though, granted, it's still a lot better than most natural languages) 2. A lot of people think auxlangs, or at the very least IAL, are pointless anyway, and we'd better just make conlangs for artistic purposes (also known as artlangs) I personally think Esperanto did quite a few things right for the time (especially compared to its competitor, Volapük), and I cannot ignore the fact there is a big community speaking it now... but as far as pure design is concerned, in the 21st century, we could do much better.

[@ZMacGregor]

@@Mercure250 I see

[@ZMacGregor]

Thanks for explaining

[@mikvan9849]

Listening to the explanation was a burden, I can't imagine how difficult it would be to understand enough to write one sentence. Much respect.

[@benrr123]

1:48 š is just ‘sh’ btw

[@athirkell]

4:15 "In this case, *we* dweebs are real." Can I really trust your command of ithkuil?!

[@Egalitariat-likesecretariat]

I'm now convinced that this thing I never heard of before this video is a particularly clever form of performance art. I imagine it was written by some polyglot teacher who got pissed at his students for not understanding Spanish, so he made up a new language for the purpose of teaching them what words mean to the point that all words become meaningless. It feels like a horrible curse bestowed by an angry god

[@ComradeDoubleM]

So basically this is an introvert's dream, just cutting the talk with a few words.

[@Imman1s]

Err.. sophisticated grunt, you mean?

[@ComradeDoubleM]

@@Imman1s yep.

[@lexnorwood6949]

Bro, there was so much wild information in this my brain went smooth

[@DrumBum561]

Says: mondaic Spells: monadic

[@jamesmorgan1142]

Hey Sam, good job on this!! Even if a few details were a bit off, you clearly put in a lot of effort to understand a complicated topic, and I appreciate you.

[@duncanhw]

He didn't do the research and writing. Also, there is a lot more off than "just a few details". Real KZbinrs have their scripts read by an expert before posting.

[@dddgaming885]

@@duncanhw Dude chill out. These are mildly informative videos that are put out 2/3 times a week. If something was critically wrong like crediting the wrong person with constructing it, okay. But pronunciations? When it's very clear what he means? Chill out. You sound like one of those weebs who get mad at people saying "Sakura."

[@michaellin4553]

@@dddgaming885 A true academic does not dwell on the mistakes of amateurs. They're more focused on improving their knowledge of the field. Those who don't are jaded, bitter, second-rates who are projecting their insecurities.

[@davidcvetko]

@@duncanhw this is his second channel he made just for fun so it doesn’t matter

[@duncanhw]

The level of parasocial relationship these commenters above have scares me

[@blue_jbots5588]

Bro is deciphering enigma

[@KindaNameless]

I can imagine this used as a way to reduce data storage space taken when sending a lot of information(on a device with not a lot of data storage space), though most likely translated to, and from by A.I.

[@corn4me994]

As a conlanger 1:13 kills my soul.

[@SpikeOfProtection]

I can relate.

[@cycrothelargeplanet]

Same

[@cycrothelargeplanet]

1:50 never let bro guess the pronunciation of words again

[@gabrielperurena6013]

"PHONEME", not "PHENOME". And you are actually describing "morphemes" not "phonemes."

[@rarebeeph1783]

While he is describing morphemes for the text on screen, I'm like maybe 70-80% sure each morpheme maps 1-1 with a distinct phoneme in Ithkuil, so the same logic would apply to adding phonemes to the spoken word.

[@AzraelGnosis]

I think the first time he's referring to certain morpho-phonemes, the second time he's referring to phonemes, and the there time either morpheme or morpho-phoneme could apply.

[@AzraelGnosis]

@@rarebeeph1783 i would say that's more characteristic of an oligo-synthetic language. Strictly speaking, there's a nearly one-to-many relationship between morphemes and phonemes, for a given slot there's a nearly one-on-one relationship but, ignoring allophones of course, several places allow one of two phonemic realizations (e.g. degree 5 type 3 suffixes allow "-üaC / -uìC / -iùC")

[@willmfrank]

So... Does that mean that he should actually be mispronouncing it "Phormemes?"

[@Lumegrin]

1:47 the s with a hat is just pronounced "sh" so yeah I figured that out from the IPA transcription

[@ACHistory]

If there is a language harder than Navajo, then hearing it may cause instantaneous human spontaneous combustion.

[@amandasunshine2]

I studied linguistics in college. Much like this language is made up of letters I recognize strung together in patterns I don't, I completely understood every single jargon term but still have no real understanding of the actual language