Hand Saw Showdown - America Vs. Japan

[@swedesamurai3331]

You need to use a Japanese Timber saw, (MAEBIKI NOKOGIRI) for a fair comparison. Using a bucking saw and a triming saw is like a comparison between a cross cut saw and a keyhole saw.

[@kidthorazine]

That's be cool if he could find one, but they tend to be rare and extremely expensive. With new Japanese made ones going for around $500 and antiques in serviceable condition starting at around $750.

[@MultiHash420]

Maebiki nokogiri

[@Wolfmasterpixel]

Deadman I don't know why they wouldn't know. Doesn't the US and Canada have large timber industries?

[@JAS0N_M00RE]

Because i think most people use Chainsaws or maybe the 2 man saw to cut trees down then they use a log cutting machine that cuts the logs into smaller parts

[@dundonrl]

Evan Andrews large timber industry, and trees that are upwards of 25 ft in diameter...

[@reezethevampire]

Can I just say I REALLY appreciate all the extra effort you go through to make the cinematic quality in your videos decent. I'm not sure how much you hear it, but I always notice when you take the time to set up the camera in a nice spot for the viewers. I'm sure it's tempting to just leave it in one spot for a whole video or carry it around with you like a vlogger and give us all a headache, but you don't. You've always taken great care to make sure your videos are really high quality and fun to watch.

[@frankwise1936]

Cody, don't stop doing what you have been doing. You have helped me become a better man.. if I could shake your hand I would, a man's word and a handshake goes a long way. Thank you and God bless.......

[@DropForgedSurvival]

Still.... I feel the Katanaboy 650 would be the best test comparsion

[@EliotChildress]

Very glad you made a more even competition. I would still love to see this again with Japanese saws actually made for lumber rather than limbing. They have massive blades with much larger teeth more similar to the American saw.

[@DanYHKim2]

Sharpening those Japanese saws is an absolute chore, requiring many more strokes and more precise angles of filing. When you buy Japanese woodworking saws, they usually come 'impulse hardened', with very sharp and hard teeth. But the teeth are also rather brittle, and really are not meant to be sharpened. Instead, the blades are disposable. His comment about large muscle groups is absolutely spot-on, too.

[@craighellberg4366]

There are so many different factors such as tooth size etc. Disappointed that wrangler star would do such a lopsided comparison. Each saw has their place.

[@DaroffApFire]

Great video, but a Japanese Timber saw would still be a more fair comparison. Nice work! =)

[@thedanishvapingviking8473]

Nice one.. looking forward to see the test with the "big" Japanese saw

[@SuperFlatrock]

If that relatively tiny Silky saw does that well, I will buy it over that huge American saw any day! Try the contest using a Katana Boy 550! There will be no contest..

[@wagsmoto147]

24 minutes; earliest I've ever found one of your videos (1:58am in Australia)

[@TRwalks]

Really goes to show how versatile the smaller pruning saw is. I'm sure it would win in a long distance hike and a over the head pruning competition. But, the fact that it can keep up in log bucking. If I was going to only take one to the cabin to do multiple tasks... It would be the pruning one. Great video!

[@triadack4750]

Wranglerstar looks like a giant throughout the entire video

[@ZGuy32]

A good thing to think about is the japanese saw use can be used for more than just logs unlike the other saw. One tool serving multiple uses tends to benefit when in the wilderness.

[@Crustyislooking]

The silky boy is meant for small trees or limbs not logs. I was taking down small trees on a path with my boys our troop and we all had normal saws, but the one kid who brought one of those Japanese ones literally doubled everyone else’s pace

[@theyoungbutcher5628]

awesome job cody. cant wait for the next woodworking project. god bless you and your family from the uk

[@WalterRiggs]

Brian with the comeback of the year right there: Chainsaw!

[@geetar82]

One of the more informative videos on KZbin. Good data here.

[@aktrapper6126]

Make it a fair contest, Katana boy 650. You will be amazed.

[@MasterSergeF18]

This.

[@CityPrepping]

yup

[@DannyHensloweGooglePlus]

Another biased review from Cody, Katanaboy would slay this hands down.

[@brandsmablacksmith7059]

Yeah make it a fair contest, sharpen the crosscut saw!

[@TKTyrant]

Silky KatanaBoy 1000 would be more interesting.

[@ArkansasPilgrim]

Brian is a wise man. "A chainsaw." I love it.

[@paulknox999]

Hi Cody Just got off a flight from UK to Washington was watching Only the Brave a movie based on Granite Mountain Hotshots, I know its just a movie and they would embellish some of the facts but you guys that put yourself out there to fight these fires, nothing but respect. I think Brian would have just had you there if he hadn't messed up his start, I don't think Brian would have been able to keep going much longer looked like hard work

[@raymondwhite11]

Wranglerstar, I think you have a misconception about the size of the trees in the east. We have common 2-5 foot base on our pine trees and certainly on over mature maples like I have in my maple forest for Maple Syrup the trees can be a hundred feet high and 4-5 feet at the base. To clarify, We have large trees in the east and we use the same equipment.

[@squidinkRC]

Where are you on the east coast? I havent seen anything with a diameter over 2ft

[@wyrdean_9649]

As an example, +Squidlink R/C when I lived In California there was a 3 foot thick Oak just down the block. (Minimum)

[@Adierit]

Here in Florida my property has quite a few giant Water Oak's.

[@UnknownSquid]

For example... i.imgur.com/7cixGU0.jpg I find it incredibly frustrating how they're using a tiny limbing saw for something it's blatantly not designed for, and trying to make it a nation vs nation thing. The phrase "pick on something your own size" comes to mind. i.imgur.com/mUBwFZ0.jpg

[@chrismanuel9768]

I'm in Pennsylvania. We're literally named for the forests. We have a lot of really big trees. They just plant little frufru ones around town for aesthetics.

[@StepOneSurvival]

Most people buy new blades.

[@brucerobert227]

Hello, I just found this channel...neat stuff! So neat to see a man that is willing to share his faith and a lifestyle that is something alot of people can only dream of!

[@MatthewM8]

Loved the video and without being overly scientific I thought you did a good job of making it a fair contest and enjoyable to watch. I really appreciate the work you put into your videos. Thanks!

[@grantottaviano7445]

Cody you and Brian should enter in a Stihl Timbersports competition! I think it would be a challenging and rewarding experience. I love watching that stuff on ESPN!!!

[@HeinzTheMan]

I think there should be another comparison, but def. use the katana boy 500 - 650

[@maehay4065]

You guys picked a great day for this saw contest on which one would be more practical to use on this application for building something using making something you might need! 👍👍👍👍

[@Gunth0r]

It got noticeably easier for the japanese saw when he passed the center of the log (the curvature is best suited for the second half of the sawing?)

[@jaredboyd4578]

Thank you, Cody, for being you. I love your videos!

[@kdawg3484]

Silly, fun little test but it confirms the adage: Use the right tool for the job. Cody's made a good case for having a Silky or Ichiban saw about that size on you all the time. But start getting up to more than a few cuts through even just an 8" log, and it may be worth considering augmenting your timber arsenal with a proper crosscut saw. Two saws where you know their exact uses would be better than one in-between saw when there's a lot of work to be done.

[@Zaire82]

Japan usually turns to sharpness when blades don't work fast enough. Western countries turn to size and barb length efficiency. This is probably biased, but western technology usually trumps eastern.

[@bocroka]

The pull saw had so many disadvantages doing it this way but still matched up with the push saw

[@sjbolton72]

Just wondering, as a non-logger type guy, how the wood finish compared between the two. seems the bigger saw would leave a more rough cut where the smaller one maybe a surface acceptible for use without further working. for living alone in alaska the smaller one seems more practical for board/beam/block making?

[@Dimomult]

I'm so happy half the video wasn't chipping the bark off.

[@homesteading]

My father told me he always used a crosscut with a 'rubber man' when working alone...

[@JohnPaulo0927]

Homesteading DownUnder Luffy

[@BigT.Larrity]

xJohnPaulo09x Gum Gum Bandsaw

[@a56b2]

Question what does the finish on the ends look like i know it does not matter im just curious. im thinking of buying the siky still for making chairs and stuff @Wranglerstar

[@the.original.throwback]

Simple choice on saws to take to Alaska: Both. Different tools for different jobs. Great video. Thanks.

[@fahermsen]

It looks like working i'm getting warm just by watching you guys haha

[@jeffffro7674]

Yes, the buck saw is able to be sharpened! There is something to be said about that, of course, but the Japanese pull saws don't need to be sharpened, ever! As long as you pay attention to what you're cutting, don't hit steel or rocks or anything else that doesn't CUT, those blades do not dull!!! I'm a furniture maker, I've used the same pull saw for around 11 or 12 years and it's still RAZOR frickin sharp!!! No exaggeration! One pull will take off a finger! Great vids though guys, I curious enough to watch both and wasn't let down. Thanks

[@bryantfloyd7471]

Trying the Japanese Whaleback Saw and compare it to that American saw.

[@johnlord8337]

Yeah, for both of you. Good time for both pull-draw and push-draw saws. Now if you had a 2-man buck saw, there would be a good challenge with the 1-man Katanaboy of any size.

[@CaseyHarrisSr]

Thank you for another great memory. Hi to Mrs. W and Jack.

[@Electrodewelder]

Mr. Wranglerstar i really enjoy your videos and i was wondering if you could do another drill review deathmatch

[@Electrodewelder]

i really enjoyed the dewalt and milwaukee deathmatch i was wondering if i could recomend a brand that i've been useing for over a year and it has performed flawlessly and has lots of power.

[@JasonSmith-xo9qr]

Normally I would pass on a comment, but I can't walk away on this one. For one the common man can't sharpen a buck saw, most folks wouldn't know the difference between a buck saw, cross cut saw or rip saw anyway. To my point as a KZbin create you must know how to use the search engines. In using the search you'd have found silkyAustralia or the ArboristBlairGlenn they both are great examples of how to sharpen a tri-edged blade. I have been a subscriber of yours for many years and have found your channel to be a lovely place for the most part. Oh by the why can sharpen tri-edged blades. Not that much different from anything else. The best practice, is always practice.

[@turnersparadise8368]

I find it ironic that you start your post by stating that most folks wouldn't know how to sharpen a bucking saw, which I agree. But then you proceed to talk about sharpening the Japanese saws, which the average person would have just as much, if not more trouble with.

[@JasonSmith-xo9qr]

Tenspeed TheBikeHanger The common guy can't do anything that the common guy has yet to try to do. The irony in my statement was typed on purpose for a purpose. I don't have the time or technology to do what Cody does, and for the most part he has my utmost respect for his content. His comments on the tri-edged sharpening was way out of line for him. Even to go as far as saying nobody on KZbin has a how too video is just out of touch. Was he too lazy to look, or making a swaying statement hoping no one would notice? I love my grandfather's two man saw for its own purpose, I also love my silky's for thiers. To sharpen either takes a great deal of practice and patience as well as the right tools and mindset.

[@HomesteadJay]

Question: What would you bring? Answer: A chainsaw.... Great answer!! I died laughing as well!

[@bodiestevens9845]

I bought a silky pole saw it is the best one I have ever used. I have tried at least 3 others. Well worth the money.

[@samsworldofrations6996]

That was so enjoyable, sawing in the sun ☀️👍

[@claudearmstrong9232]

One very crucial factor separating performance between these saws is the far heavier weight of the buck. Also vital is the fewer cutting points, each having several times the weight compared to the Japanese design. As notified, the full body energy input with the bucksaw gives it less tiresome performance. Another major mark against the Japanese saw is its grip. Not only is the forward-backstroke resistance a factor of major resistance, one must expend far more energy gripping the handle to maintain solid, none-slip grip. The Japanese steel lamination construction is superior in limited degree to the single ply steel of the buck, but that construction is at best maybe double the edge-wear resistance. As an example of cutting edge wear resistance, the Stanley Fat Max panel saw employs tooth-tempering that gives it roughly ten X the sharpness-duration compared to the same panel saw design but with standard tooth tempering. Great job, you two!!

[@nfp212]

I thought Brian had you this go around. Enjoyed the video!

[@HilltownCT]

How about a torture test between the two saws? 😆 Great comparo and much closer than I expected!

[@Syntax58]

I really enjoy your content my friend :) Useful information and I am learning new things about timber and the how to use tools correctly! Keep it up!

[@TXSuburbanHomestead]

I've got one of the BigBoys and there's no freakin' way I could ever hope to sharpen it. Thanks for the test, it was a fun one to watch.

[@chazwick89]

Need an American pruning saw vs Japanese Zubat silky! Now that would be fair not a saw with 4x’s the length of the other with a support handle. What’s next chain saw vs paper cutting scissors lol but love the tool comparison and reviews buddy 👍🏻

[@lukeknezevic7267]

The western saw looks so much cooler! Which one would you want hanging on the wall...no contest!

[@turnersparadise8368]

Next time you go try the Reuben, they are out of this world! If you eat it under the bucking saw hanging on the wall you will feel like a real lumberjack!

[@lukeknezevic7267]

Easy Dean. While I would gladly use the cheapo Amazon Japanese saw, I would get a greater sense of accomplishment maintaining, using, and admiring a buck saw at the end of the day. I'm not in the game for production, rather an escape from the Amazon one size fits all use and replace society we live in!

[@HocchanFan]

You should have a video yourself to see if you can eat the ruben faster under the bucking saw or under a Japanese saw!

[@DK-jd8bj]

I'm building a log cabin this summer just so I have a place to hang my Crosscut saws. ;-) Ok not the only reason but I'm definitely saving a wall for them. And of course I will use them from time to time.

[@changgames4637]

Dean Dean nobody in their right mind uses these anymore, Japanese or American. If you do you're wasting your time.

[@general5104]

Speaking of sharpening your own saw...you need a "3 point file" (triangle), large enough that at least a third of it's height be sticking up above the saw while sitting in the bite of the saw blade. You need a piece of white chalk. You need a 7/8 oz piece of leather 12" square, and wet and folded in half and allowed to dry. Cut an inch deep (from the folded edge) and 6 " long window from the center along the fold. This is your safety canopy, that keeps you from getting cut to shreads while sharpening the saw. Also a piece of emory cloth, to remove any rust from the blade. ((if you're on site and away from a workbench and vice, you can saw, straight down, into a stump, about as deep a groove as 1/2 the saw's width. By sitting the back edge into this slot, it will afford enough stability to sharpen the blade. Hand carve a couple of 1" sticks to a sharp flat wedge to stick into the slot next to the blade, to afford a clamping action. Otherwise, utilize a bench vice.)) Look at the blade. You'll notice that every other tooth is sharp on the opposite side. Mark the side, with your chalk, of the teeth that are sharpened left. Then on the opposite side, mark those. Be sure they're staggered. Starting at the end, with your leather in place, place the file in the groove, on about a 60 degree angle (the same direction that's there) and bear down and push the file forward about 3". (not back and forth). Do that, the same amount in every-other tooth. You have them marked. Then, start at the tip, again, on the other side and your angle will be about a 60 degree angle, like the other side was but opposite...Moving your leather when your window runs out. Do that all the way to the handle. Then you need to SET the teeth, that is, every other tooth needs to be bumped out, to give relief to the blade. This cuts wider than the blade, so it doesnt get hung in the wood. Do this with a nail set, if you dont have the regular tool. (on one side while holding an ax hammer head slightly below the tooth on the other side to back it up)... I'm sure there are multiple videos on saw sharpening on KZbin. I've been sharpening since my Dad taught me, around 8 years old. JUST FOLLOW THE PATTERN THATS ALREADY THERE. Oh...and thanks for your video, fellows!

[@2862Gunny]

I have a vintage saw similar to your buck saw that has one broken tooth. How much will that effect its performance?

[@DaskaiserreichNet78]

Japanese saws cut on the pull stroke so the blade can be made thinner without having it buckle. The thinner blade requires less pressure to cut trough. Because the saw can't buckle on the pull stroke the metal can be made of harder more brittle material which does not dull requiring far less sharpening.

[@bigal6667]

Both of you were completely out of breath! That looked exhausting!

[@markattardo]

Slow and steady wins the race over the long haul. Impressed with Brian's speed though.

[@erickarlsson1361]

do a katanaboy vs harvester!

[@downerwork5669]

In new Zealand we call it a pruning saw and they're amazing at height. Great post guys..

[@tommyschauer3093]

THE TIMEING WAS ABOUT THE SAME, BUT THE ENERGY SPENT WAS WAY HIGHER WITH THE SMALL SAW THAN WITH THE BIG ONE. GOOD TEST . KEEP UP THE VIDS.

[@NigelTolley]

A video where you two cut the same log but with the full size crosscut being used by both of you as a pair would likely be illuminating.

[@chrisbulldog1353]

You both sound like you went for a run. Got to love that frost bite attachment

[@ekul7894]

wtf am i doing with my life... its 4am and i'm watching the most random videos

[@LordFantasthick]

Survivalrussia did a good video on the silky saw. You can also use your body by leaning on the saw while pulling it and leting it lose while pushing, just the opposite motion of your big saw.

[@bvcxz47]

definitely need to do it again with a katana boy

[@voigtscott]

If you were in the Alaskan wilderness which saw? Does your answer change if you're in the Japanese mountains with mostly bamboo trees? Good comparison video, but I think the lesson learned is to use the tool that fits your location.

[@rnbspowa7of69]

I wounder what the energy expenditure is? What is the quality of cut? Big saw is more durable.

[@rhart367]

That little saw was pretty good but you work harder, more strokes and your arms will get tired. Cool video.

[@BobHurt]

Plus, the buck saw cuts in both push stroke and pull stroke, whereas the Silky saw cuts very little if at all on the pull stroke.

[@NathanStorer-RC]

Which one would he better for trimming branches ;)

[@twentyonetwelve2179]

Silky

[@bpark10001]

The pull saw I use has more curve to the blade, and has a hook on the outer end, and a "bark cutter" knife on the handle end. The curve on the pull saw permits generation of down-force on the teeth with only a direct pull force, no "down-force" needed at the handle. The hook and knife allows slamming into the end on each stroke. Where this saw really shines when the cut is 20' up, and you are sawing with the saw on the end of a 18' pole. (Saw and pole brand is ARS). The saw is so good I use it for hand sawing logs on the ground. The secret to sharpening a pull saw is the tiny facets on the tips of the teeth (the cutting direction is set by the slant of those facets). Only the tiniest bit of metal need be removed. I do it by touching every other tooth to a grinding wheel, then flip over, and do the in between ones. You can't even hear the sound of the wheel sharpening the tooth if you do it right. I have sharpened my saw twice, and both times, cuts like new.

[@michaelthomas788]

I'm wondering if it can't be done how did they sharpen it in the first place

[@thumper11954]

Wow love that large saw..great video

[@RoboFuryMan]

That was smart breaking it into 2 parts so we have to open 2 of your videos lol

[@charly345mstl]

if you compare a saw for cutting down timber, you should compare with "Madonoko", that is designed for cutting down trees.

[@BeeBait]

Seeing old people use the wrong tools for a job always makes me chuckle. You can teach an old dog new tricks, but it seems that most don't use the brain enough to learn 😂

[@jimmyreece5781]

How are they the wrong tools?

[@TheJumpinJesus]

Every now and again I do some work in my parents' garden and the japanese style saw is perfect for when I have to climb up, hold onto the tree with one hand and cut with the other. One handed pull is much easier than push=]

[@manusamoaus]

I agree with Brian, the bigger saw for overall cutting. Might be heavier and bigger, but to build a log cabin it is the one.

[@337923chris]

You should do the original test with the silky katanaboy and the American buck saw

[@YasaiDayo]

Not to be immature but this really made me laugh way too hard because it was “small Asian saw” vs “BIG AMERICAN SAW”

[@tylerdoerscher3345]

Way better then the other video with these guys. Of course the Japanese saw lost he was cutting off the other cut. He had to deal with resistance from vibration as well as the angle of the saw changing do to separation at the western saws point. This video the have there own ends with what appears to me a way more sturdy stand to hold the log compared to the other video.

[@mishawakapost2681]

I wonder if Rossini was inspired to write the William Tell Overture (aka The Lone Ranger theme) while listening to the sawing of logs.

[@dankollars4501]

experience makes a huge difference, find someone with as much experience as you with the buck saw on the Japanese saw.

[@nikolajhansen7120]

Try to pack both in a backpack and see which one you'd like to bring to a remote location in alaska. I'm buying a silky before my next trip

[@sadclown1225]

That tiny stop at 1:52 is what caused the japanese saw to lose, I think. Had that not happened, it would had been at least even.

[@brw3079]

Curiouser and curiouser! Which one can you use all day long?(When not in a race with a guy half your age and size!)

[@willamer]

Love your videos. Keep up the good work

[@DarthSagius]

The japanese saw also looks like it's a finer cut overall, compared to the buck saw's more rough and chipped end cut. I'd say if you want a more finished cut to go for the japanese pullsaw, but you'll go through just about the same amount of work with a buck saw and sander to take down the chips on your cut piece.

[@nomusician4737]

You miss the big advantage of the Japanese saw. You can use it both for this AND for whatever the 2/4's in the wall is called and probably do a bit of carpentry as well. In general usability the Japanese one is superior by far.

[@dabj9546]

It looks like Brian was pushing that saw but maybe it's just because he was sawing so fast

[@Z1pZ1p3r]

Rule of Thumb. European saws for volume/speed. Asian saws for precision.

[@ashnielzradio7926]

Think you might need someone from Japan to show you how to use their equipment.. probably would run circles around that American saw...

[@lefthandyogi]

Why do you coat your saw with a water displacement compound before cutting?

[@alistairwalsh1022]

Very close! but who had to do more work?

[@88spd]

Are there any companies that make those Buck Saws new that are as good as the old ones?

[@whitacrebespoke]

Flinn and Garlick in England make them they are good saws once you fine fettle then I have a 3ft and some very nice old ones I use the new one more than any of the others.

[@jorgemt62]

There are two things to consider, apart from the size of the log. One is the size of the blade. The American plade is longer and allows a longer run, which in turn means more velocity in both directions - and saws are all about the speed of the thrust. And the other is the wielder. We are used to Western saws and our technique is based on them. It's like two Westernes compariing forks and chopsticks. The really fair comparison would be with blades the same size and, more important, with a Japanese logger using the Silky saw.

[@miketolpa4449]

LOL.... Chainsaw FTW Brian! Thanks for the vid.