Why Bad Zazen is the Best Zazen

[@deanmccrorie3461]

A monk once asked his master how long it would take him to reach enlightenment through zazen Master says ‘oh...about ten years’ The monk then said ‘Ok master. But what about if I try really really hard? How long then?’ The master then told the eager young monk. ‘Oh yes. If you try really hard...yes yes. I see. About 20 years’

[@blorkpovud1576]

Ha! Good one!

[@osip7315]

a monk asked the zen master how long would it take to get enlightened, the master replied, when the temple no longer needs maintenance years later as he was dying and worrying about the state of the roof he recalled the master's words (long since dead) and had a sudden insight

[@marknoble2030]

This is a very helpful video. Thanks, Brad. I was also helped by what Gil Fronsdal said about "bad" sitting. He likened it to poking a stick in a clear stream. Before you do that, you may not notice what is going on in your mind. When you do jab the stick into the sand under the water, you feel the vibrations, see the ripples. You become aware that your mind, like the stream, is racing. There is great value in bad sitting. I should know.

[@HardcoreZen]

Interesting points. Thank you!

[@JasonSmith-ot2dh]

I just finished your book "Don't be a Jerk....". I want to thank you for re-engaging me in Zen and in particular, inspiring me to get back on the mat. I really appreciate your approach to teaching and speaking about Zen. For a while there I was listen to the SF Zen centers Dharma's talks and I think that did the exact opposite of what your book did for me. Anyway I just wanted to thank you and tell you how much I appreciate your way. Now I just need to figure out which one of your books to read next. Hopeful you will visit NYC soon so I can see you speak in person. All the best!

[@HardcoreZen]

Thanks. Maybe someday someone will invite me to NYC.

[@blorkpovud1576]

Probably the best video I've watched on zazen. I actually look forward to staring at a wall and being bored. I find it quite fascinating that we're trying to come to terms with the mundane "here and now" which is allegedly supposed to be anything but mundane or boring at all.

[@EvanBerry.]

You can call yourself "kind of a dumbass" all you want, but I find your talks incisive, insightful, and inspiring. I will continue to watch as long as you post them!

[@ErinWi]

Thanks Brad. That was really needed. Interestingly, I've been refocusing on my zazen practice lately--increasing duration, not skipping days, etc.--and it's been a little frustrating because it's noticeably worsened my mood. Everything seems to get on my nerves, and everything is a drag. I've been through this before. When I first started doing zazen the same thing happened. It's like I'm signalling to the universe to start dumping all my karma on my head (or just recognizing how irritable and easily annoyed I've always been). Anyway, this testy mood of mine has obscured that I'm pretty much living a life I never imagined would be possible for myself and, well, it's worth recognizing how much of a gift that is.

[@christopheschmit8671]

Maybe it is an opportunity to become familiar with this irritation. Maybe it also shows up during your zazen? If so, how do you deal with it?

[@gra6649]

I once told my teacher that zazen can make me aggressive. His response was," yea, you got to watch out for that",

[@ErinWi]

@@gra6649 haha yeah!

[@ErinWi]

@@christopheschmit8671 I'm sure that you're right. I tend to think that something is a little off in my life and I've been ignoring it but zazen is making it unavoidable.

[@alexandrosfwt]

I have had the exactly same realisation. How have you managed to cope with that the last 2 years since your comment? Best wishes from Greece 🙂

[@hoogreg]

Great explanation of how gassho arose! Also, I love the Nishijima video because it's so simple & direct. I think I saw it 10 years ago, & it changed the way I thought about zazen.

[@jacobl7451]

“Zazen is not about progress” - Shohaku Okumura

[@grayhalf1854]

Meditation should be blissful. It said so in a magazine... 🤔

[@sebybell8462]

hahahahah

[@anoridinaryhumanbeing70]

Meditation ... The practice itself , is not at all "blissful"( mostly )... But , practicing it sincerely and correctly makes your life blissful though , under difficult external circumstances.

[@matthiasrohkostkanal6406]

Excatly. My life now is the life I wanted. Nothing to complain about. But this insight is often very hard to accept. Its a bitter truth sometimes. But only then can one change something for the better. 🙏

[@andywatson-j3u]

Well put. A lot of people quit zazen because it doesn't fit their idea of what they think it should be.

[@banoffibear]

I always find myself wondering what's behind that bookshelf

[@HardcoreZen]

A wall. And behind that wall my bedroom, which has two more bookshelves.

[@banoffibear]

@@HardcoreZen I don't know if I'm relieved or disappointed, but thanks. Awesome video by the way!

[@anoridinaryhumanbeing70]

I don't know what's the motive behind your this comment!!

[@croftperkins]

I'm looking for Frank Miller stuff. 😅

[@MakeDemocracyMagnificientAgain]

@@anoridinaryhumanbeing70 it's called "fantasy" or "imagination" ;)

[@Octoberfurst]

Excellent video Brad! I always worried that I wasn't doing Zazen right. Now I see that my worrying about it means I am doing it right. :-)

[@alexlawrence5141]

Keeping it 💯 with these 👍

[@herbaldharma4203]

Very well put. Thanks

[@Tsotha]

great video Brad, it actually touched on some of the same thoughts that crossed my mind when meditating earlier this very day!

[@lorenacharlotte8383]

Fantastic explanation and insight. Very cheerful too. You’ve got it. Thank you Brad!

[@Mikedun1]

Completely un-zen related (or is it?): as child of the 80s growing up in Massillon, Ohio, I have such strange, but fond, memories of ths Son of Ghoul and the Cool Ghoul ('hippy ghoul') who hosted b-movie horror on Saturday nights for WOAC tv out of Canton. What a zany and nostalgic cultural/media phenomenon. Other cities had similar characters and local tv formats (e.g. Svengooli in Chicago). Thanks for the talk on zazen...and the trip down memory lane!

[@HardcoreZen]

I've also seen both of those guys. It seems like NE Ohio may have had more horror hosts than anywhere else in the country. But other regions also had them. There are a couple of books about the phenomenon. And, of course, I have them. They're on the shelf behind me to the right side of the screen next to the books about the Three Stooges.

[@Mikedun1]

@@HardcoreZen Heheh...not at all surprised you have such books among that eclectic collection of texts. So it's what thought: you have those organized by theme? You can tell a lot about someone by their bookshelf--not just what's on the shelves, but how they're organized. I'm weird about alphabetization, but that's just me. I'll keep my eye out for for the ghouls stuff near the Three Stoogology section on the lower right. Thanks!

[@sebybell8462]

Excellent video. Thank you for your practice.

[@budgreen100]

That was a good one Brad... really spoke to me...🤘🏽

[@harrytrafalgar6483]

It’s not my mind that I have a problem with during zazen, it’s my legs. They can’t go ten minutes without complaining and wanting to move.

[@christopheschmit8671]

And how would you know that without a mind?

[@TheTarutau]

I did horse stance meditation. Ya it sucks. The body hurts the legs get weak but still I pushed through it much like Brad is suggesting in this video. Much like the smell of shit fades over time because the mind gets used to it so did the discomfort fade as I continued my stance. Eventually it was no longer uncomfortable. Funny thing is whenever it got more comfortable I increased how long I spent in horse stance because the growth occurs in not minding discomfort. Kensho was not far away after I turned towards discomfort.

[@harrytrafalgar6483]

Christophe Schmit they seem to have a mind of their own 😃

[@sebybell8462]

Are your legs feeling 'restless' or are they in pain? If you are having pain in your legs, explore different ways to sit. Discomfort is ok. Persistent pain which tends to get worse as you sit, is NOT ok.

[@harrytrafalgar6483]

Seby Bell it’s a pain in the tendons usually, so yes I need to explore my posture more. Last night I watched a good video by some French zen teacher who went into great depth about establishing good zazen posture. So I have my homework 😃

[@thomasbarchen]

Well said!

[@WoodsyLadyM]

Excellent!

[@HandsomeNature]

Hey Brad, what are your thoughts on the wim hof method? Thanks,

[@HardcoreZen]

What is the wim hof method?

[@HandsomeNature]

@@HardcoreZen in short, The Wim Hof Method is a combination of meditation, breathing exercises, and exposure to cold that can help you regulate your stress levels. A BBC documentary on the man. Yoga studios are now widely offering his method and hes gotten a lot of attention. kzbin.info/www/bejne/jJKwm5ute6pkkNk

[@HandsomeNature]

@@HardcoreZen this is a very simple explanation kzbin.info/www/bejne/nXzKhnhta9qXgZY

[@HardcoreZen]

It sounds like a bit more than I need. Zazen has worked out pretty well.

[@chkzulu3955]

Thanks, man! Brad zazen is the best zazen!

[@christopheschmit8671]

Question for Brad: in certain buddhist texts, the qualities of an enlightened mind, or meditative mind are described. Do you have an opinion on that? For example, certain meditators supposedly remain in a state of dullness during meditation, which may feel like experiencing emptiness, but it is in reality just a mind that s not very awake or clear, creating a false sense of a "deep meditative state".

[@HardcoreZen]

I don't see any value at all to descriptions like that. How can anyone know the state of anyone else's mind and judge it?

[@christopheschmit8671]

@@HardcoreZen I think the question wether one can know someone else's state of mind is a whole other question in itself. I found the idea of dullness mentioned in Dogen’s Universally Recommended Instructions for Zazen when it says "For you must know that the true dharma appears of itself, so that from the start dullness and distraction are struck aside." I haven t found a video from you discussing it, but maybe you have your own experience of it?

[@HardcoreZen]

@@christopheschmit8671 I've felt dull and distracted sometimes. Then I adjust my posture and it usually goes away.

[@starlawhitson627]

This is true for Zazen, but for Mahamudra meditation, you need to strive for perfection.

[@Jack-il3qv]

Akron. Home of the Twelve Steps..

[@MakeDemocracyMagnificientAgain]

OK, next time I'll try to do it extra bad xD

[@brookestabler3477]

This is the truth. How do we deal with it? That' s all that matters much innit?

[@bobg.7976]

Is the “how to” link with the roshi meant to teach zazen? If so, a person new to the practice would last about 3 minutes. The vast majority of us can’t assume a full lotus or even half lotus for long. Also, you need something to focus your attention on. The Buddha gave us The Four Foundations of Mindfulness for guidance. I assume there is a Part 2 link where the roshi does just that. At SFZC they teach newbies breath counting, or they used to.

[@HardcoreZen]

Just imagine me making a very loud and prolonged sigh sigh about here.

[@edgepixel8467]

Q: What is the Way?

[@BigBunnyLove]

Zazen smazen

[@mmungara]

Brad, Nothing happens in zazen for a long time till one sudden day you wake up. You mentioned your bridge experience. I assume you had some minor experiences too in the years leading up to that. How many years you had to sit before you had any such minor experiences? Thank you

[@HardcoreZen]

I had a few weird experiences right at the beginning. But those went away pretty quickly. This was followed by about ten years of nothing particularly notable happening during zazen or even associated with zazen. After about ten years a different sort of set of odd experiences began to occur. This was when I was glad to have a teacher to basically tell me, "Don't worry about those weird experiences." Of course, anyone could have said that. But it had more meaning coming from a teacher that I trusted.

[@blorkpovud1576]

@@HardcoreZen you say "nothing of note" during 10 years of zazen. Is this to say there was nothing of value during that time? Or just nothing "out of the ordinary"? I know zazen is "good for nothing" but I'm assuming it has some noticeable benefit in order to persevere for a decade?

[@poikkiki]

Blork Povud I think that when people say zazen is good for nothing, they mean that zazen is being, fully, with whatever is already present. That does not mean that the experience itself does not change us on a more relative level, of course it does, if not, probably nobody would do it. But during the practice itself, there is no striving at all, just sitting, leaving all of the 'fancy experiences' behind.

[@will_110]

👍👍👍

[@berrycrawford5579]

triceratops didnt live the same time humans did. And you call yourself a roshi zen master....

[@HardcoreZen]

Triceratops may have been one of the last of the dinosaurs. It died out around 65-70 million years ago. But before it died out, it seems like vast herds of triceratops roamed the North American continent. This has caused some to speculate that triceratops may have overwhelmed its own ecosystem. Humans didn't appear until about one million years ago. Meaning that no human ever interacted with a living triceratops. But the movie One Million Years BC was a hoot!