Hardest to adapt scenes, spoiler free, misc: WHEEL OF TIME TALK - Ep 11

Episode 11 of Wheel of Time Talk, or WoTTalk. In this episode we talk about what scenes from the Wheel of Time would be hardest to bring to the screen.
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[@redapple6044]

It was my dads favourite series and he discussed certain aspects like grey men and mat with his luck. When I was twelve he gave me the first book

[@DanielGreeneReviews]

Whats your Wheel of Time Story? 🤔

[@morintedronai8433]

I first encountered the WoT in a fantasy group on facebook and i really didn't care about it, then i heard the song Wheel of Time from Blind Guardian and damn i felt a great need to atleast do some research about the series because lyrics felt so epic. Then i found you! With the hype of your view on it and some other things i picked EOTW and i just finished the 6th book at this point, you proablaly can guess my feelings about the ending of the 6th book... And here i am with Wheel of Time being my favourite book series :) Very eager to finish it, and not.

[@MrT115]

I jumped into the series in the mid 90s. I picked up the Eye of the world in the library when we for once could do a book report for school on a book of our own choice. I loved it and plowed through the series up to Lord of Chaos. Then I had to wait for each new installment, each release was preceeded by a re-read of the whole series. When I had finished aMoL I took a two year break from the series and have re-read it 2 times since then. The last time through it I listened to it during my commute to work. I think that I have it set deep in my bones by now and still discover some new things each time. (BTW I've read the Dresden Files books a lot as well and look forward to your videos on that series)

[@hitmup13]

I was going through a bunch of old books my dad had looking for a copy of a different book. Found a beat up copy of Eye of The World my dad had never even read and had picked up at a garage sale. I was in the middle of finals in college and picked it up and read the first few chapters and just got hooked. Finished the whole thing before studying and had to go buy The Great Hunt immediately. I have now re-read the series about 7 times and am starting over. This series is always on my mind. Thanks for the great content Daniel.

[@Sara866873]

I started the series because of a song xD Blind Guardian - Wheel of Time is the main reason I began reading the Eye of the World but I had also heard the series mentioned in one of my favourite booktube channels in my native language (Bulgarian). It took me about 11 months to finish it (October 2017-August 2018) and I have to admit I wanted to start rereading it immediately but I decided against it. I still haven't picked up any new series though, and I'm already thinking of doing a WoT reread next year xD But for now your channel (I discovered it whie reading book 2 or 3) is doing a good job providing WoT stuff for me to live off haha

[@conorreilly517]

Re-read each book as soon as I finished them one by one.

[@ordowaid.2665]

I think it's wonderful you're doing this show. I've not started The Wheel of Time yet, but when I do, I'll definitely come back to watch these videos!

[@rossj4755]

I hope you do another WoTTalk about changes from book to show, because I think there's so much discussion potential there. Spoilers ahead. To me, Padan Fain could be an essential element in turning the show into something similar to Game of Thrones. He is like a Wormtongue on steroids, travelling to multiple super powerful people and completely messing with their minds, influencing policy, and the best part is, he doesn't really do it in service of the dark one, but in service of Mordeth. This adds a different element to the story and can also be used by the show to help explain why character actions don't fit their earlier motivations. He's a low level villain who becomes a high level one, and is a very unique character. I hope they do him justice in the show. The thing that I think might be the most difficult to transition is the vast amount of internal monologue Jordan's characters always do. They are so unique to each character, with Rand having Lews Therin, Mat having the dice, and Perrin having the wolves. Additionally, Nynaeve also has a vast amount of important internal monologue, as does Egwene. A lot of this will have to be spoken by other characters to bring in the weight of it, but unfortunately a lot will probably be cut out. I hope they find a way to keep those unique elements of Rand, Mat, and Perrin though. Top 5 scenes off the top of my head... Mat fighting Gawyn and Galad (obviously). Rand fighting without Saidin in Far Madding. The entire Cleaning the Source event (this should be a season ending entire episode imo). Tuon realizing Mat is a badass general. Egwene breaking Mesaana's mind. I commented 4 times on this video, which are the 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and 4th comments I've ever posted on KZbin. Thanks for making a great video series and channel!

[@ladybugbookkeeper]

I know I'm nearly two years late, but after pirating thousands of books without looking at what they were, and loading them onto my ereader, I found WoT and fell in love. After the third book I decided to do some research and found you, continued reading and haven't looked back. It is now in my top 3 fav book series.

[@TheLordofMetroids]

I think what they should do for the Tv show opening is the "The wind was A beginning," sequence of the book the season is based on.

[@captainwilhelm9657]

To me Mat getting raped wasn't played for laughs, while Elayne and Nynaeve did initially think it was funny they later apologized and Tylin said at one point that they were putting pressure on her to stop. As for the reaction the Ebou Dari have I blame it on their female leaning culture and in real life there was a notion that women secretly liked getting raped with the novel and film Gone with the Wind according to some being an example of this. So to me this was RJ trying to make a statement that men do get raped and the only change I would make in the tv show would be to clarify this.

[@Siansonea]

I think in a lot of ways, RJ set out to show a role reversal where women in the Westlands and in other cultures have what we experience in our world as 'male privilege'. Cadsuane is the poster child for this, but a lot of women are shown to have unexamined attitudes toward men, and Aes Sedai are especially prone to this. When we are in the point-of-view chapters of powerful women like Aes Sedai, we see attitudes that depict men as overly emotional, easily distracted, easily manipulated, and unable to make decisions for themselves. Men are seen as gossipy and unreliable and they really just a need a woman to make decisions for them and keep them in line. Siuan Sanche even praises Gareth Bryne in conversation with Egwene by telling her that he 'thinks like a woman' sometimes. Sound familiar? It's a parallel to the 1950s ideas about women in our world. Aes Sedai, by nature of their advanced age, are a crystallization of the ideas and values of generations prior to the time of the Dragon Reborn. Younger Aes Sedai like Moiraine are less prone to this problem, but even Nynaeve and Elayne are not unaffected by RJ's version of 'toxic femininity'. I think the culture of Ebou Dar is supposed to be an extreme version of this theme, and Mat's plight, whether intended by the author or not, demonstrates the degree to which even a man's close female associates can downplay and outright dismiss his experiences because of their cultural blind spot. I hope the show doesn't shy away from this polarizing event too much. I think it's important to show Elayne and Nynaeve having their consciousness raised about the plight of men, and how men actually aren't these inferior creatures they've always been raised to believe they are. It's good to illustrate that female supremacy is not an improvement, that equality should be the end goal. Cadsuane, unfortunately, never has an epiphany, she is overconfident and unquestioning of her own assumptions to the very end of the last chapter, to her detriment in many ways. Cadsuane and Elaida have a LOT in common, and I wonder how much of that was intentional on RJ's part. I also wonder how much of the casual sexism we see from women toward men was absolutely premeditated by the author. To me it stands out like a bright beacon, and it explains a lot why so many female characters are always at the top of the lists of 'most hated'. From the perspective of a male reader, it is incredibly galling for a male character to be treated the way a woman in the 50s was treated by a man. Dismissed, patronized, ignored and indulged. It's not a good look on anyone.

[@meprivate6923]

First time I had a connection to it, I got a copy of Winter's Heart from a grocery store bin. It sat around for a while and I didn't really look for it and start reading it until a buddy of mine told me about it. Overall, it took me about a year to catch up. Afterwards, it would take me about a half a month to finish all the books as I got them. #WoTTalk

[@revan0890]

#WoTTALK My brother bought me the first three books in a bundle for Christmas. It took me awhile to finally pick them up and read them as I had never seen such a large book before that wasn't non-fiction. I was about thirteen at the time. Since then I have re-read the series each time a new book came out and now I listen to the whole story at least once a year since its completion.

[@BedtimeBookworm]

I’m super late watching this but have a couple things to say! As far as that historical fiction book I read of his, it was a long time ago so I don’t remember too much about the writing style but I think it was pretty similar. What I remember being different was that there were more explicit scenes than I’ve encountered in WoT so far lol. And I know the person who asked for a pronunciation guide will never see this comment but I totally plan to do that! I’m waiting until I finish the series though so it’s going to be awhile lol 😆

[@TheLordofMetroids]

(Spoilers for The Great Hunt) Yeah the.. uh the Portal Stone scene there is a moment when Rand looks into the sky and sees an aircraft contrail... Yeah, I have no idea what that means, but the implications are mind boggling.

[@justinjones7506]

I first got into Wheel of Time in a rather haphazard way. I do not remember if it was a birthday gift or a Christmas gift, but my mother picked up A Crown of Swords on audio for me. Only problem was that I had not read any of the other books before it... Oops... Needless to say, I was rather lost. Even worse, it was an abridged version of the novel... A few years later, a friend of mine found several digital versions of the series from book one up to either Lord of Chaos or A Crown of Swords. This was before publishers started to offer their products in a digital form which was bad for someone such as myself who cannot read print (blindness) and I don't even want to think about a Braille version of those books (it's four to five Braille pages per print page, in case you were curious) The only difficulty with the digitized versions that my friend found was that there were plenty of translation errors, and in one instance, over half of the fourth novel was simply not there (maybe the person scanning in the damn thing got tired?). Spoilers below Well anyway, I had to live with that version of the series, but you can imagine when I picked up Fires in Heaven how confused I was when the narration followed a stilled and deposed Siuan Sanche, among other things. I came out right in the end as I found better versions of the novels (still before publishers started to do this en masse), and got to finish the series. I found unabridged audio versions of the series and I plan on reading back through them. Actually, I am glad they are in audio form as I can learn how to pronounce the names of these people/places. My screen reading technology (the software I am using to write out this comment) butchers anything that is the slightest bit exotic sounding. So you can imagine how badly names are destroyed in a fantasy series.

[@Siansonea]

You should probably copy and paste this into a new comment in response to the pinned comment. I made the mistake of not doing that last time.

[@tylorfox783]

I would say on the topic of opening title, I would say do the Aiel war and when you’re dealing with certain nations, use their soldiers in the fighting. Like if we’re seeing early in The Great Hunt, it’s Borderlanders and maybe like Tower Guards, telling us who we’re seeing.

[@benbutler9282]

Daniel, love your stuff. Started reading 1992 and sweated on each new book.have reread books multiple times. Quick point re future. Adams prevent linking. Combined black/white tower wins

[@levisimpson516]

I really want to delve into these videos with all the spoilers. Unfortunately I just started this series. First book, only a few hundred pages in, long long way to go. Started this series after coming across your channel. I really enjoy your content and you make it exciting to want to read this and other series. I've had an old used copy of Eye of the World on my book shelf for years and now is the time. Picked up a copy of The Great Hunt waiting in the wings. If I could ask one question it would be, what is the best map of this world that you've come across. I see a bunch on google image search but none that I really like. I want to delve into this series and I think it would be fun to have a nice large map printed out. I've toyed with the idea of making one myself since my main hobby / passion is art.

[@chasetonashton8887]

Oh man!!!?!!!? That is a great question and it's so inclusive, I'm reading every comment because I love how and why people pick up any book. Growing up and still today, I have always been an A-typical Introvert, I preferred to be alone in my boy-cave where I could eat chips and salsa while either reading, watching movies or playing pc/console games. Not bragging but I was an above average student and reader. I always thought I was up on everything Fantasy/Scifi mind you I was born 1990, basically I was raised by a mother who loved Starwars, a father who loved Dune and a grandma and grandpa who loved reading of all genres. So pretty young, 2nd or 3rd grade, I stumbled across The Hobbit, loved it and began my epic journey through REAL Fantasy. Of course then came LOTR and somewhere along the same period in my life Harry Potter had come out so obviously like everyone else I gave into it all. My cousin, who was also an avid young reader had told me around 5th grade, "Chase you have to read WOT, you just have to." At the time I believe there were already 8 or 9 books out and being completely honest I told my cousin that I don't have time to begin a huge book series because of all the stupid pointless things that keep us busy when we're growing up like school, sports and extracurriculars. Fast forward I continued reading other greats and classics of the genre but for some reason, even with constant reminding from my reader peers I put off WoT year after year clear until I was 23. Long story short and no sob story, but I was without a doubt, clinically Depressed, which is no joke but at one of the worst or lowest times in my short life I remember telling myself that while I actually had quite a lot to live for, I felt like not being here (not being alive anymore) was a better option than enduring life. I remember at the time I had just finished A dance with dragons a year earlier and I recall literally saying out loud half joking and half not so much at all joking to my friends and family even my wife that "If I didn't have to wait to read the end of A song of Ice and Fire I would happily (Literally Unhappily really) go to my grave now without complaint. At the end of a pessimistically hard day at work I ran into my cousin, I still remember him asking me "If I now dared to take on Wot?" the now wrapped up 15 book series. Thankfully for some reason I finally gave in to his book snobbish taunting and borrowed his trashed up greasy copy of Eye of the World. I fell in love with the words of Robert Jordan immediately after reading the prologue, even though just after I thought I might be reading a LOTR rip-off with the first couple of chapters of EotW. I read the series cover to cover straight through with no gaps or breaks and then I read it all again back to back. In total that took me exactly 9 1/2 months, 9 1/2 months that I hardly even have another memory of events throughout the year besides reading and processing WoT. (I said earlier that I'm an above average reader which I am but I am a very slow and meticulous reader.) Without getting too sappy or extreme, The Wheel of Time along with a few other adjustments undoubtedly in my mind saved my life. Oddly enough a lot of WoT is about the WHY of life and provides many examples and ideas about why life is ultimately worth living so I was always be extremely attached to wheel of time and in a way owe Robert Jordan an unpayable debt. I know this was another long post by me and I thank those that got through it all I'll try to keep my next few comments short unless Dan decides to rile us up. ha ha.

[@mdneal79]

#WoTTalk How about the opening sequence of the WoT TV series being Rand's biological mother having Rand on Dragonmount, and then the scene switches to Amyrlin Tamra, Moiraine, and Siuan as Gitara foretells the birth of the Dragon Reborn.

[@indranigomes9874]

Rafe Judkins should hire you to be a part of his creative team.

[@DanielGreeneReviews]

Tweet that at him. Lol

[@indranigomes9874]

Haha I would do if I had an account. Maybe someone else who sees this can.

[@dediguise0018]

To your question about anime monologues it’s a common tactic. They just change the audio slightly and use it so the character in question can reveal their inner thoughts to the audience. Typically it’s used during action sequences kzbin.info/www/bejne/p2ioZJynZsyWb5o that’s a scene from death note where it’s used very liberally. kzbin.info/www/bejne/g37UoZeumbB7Zsk this is a fight scene from Berserk which is an extremely dark manga manga that I highly recommend but which is also EXTREMELY disturbing at points. The show is just ok. It’s extremely useful for animation for a number of reasons, but transitions into film very poorly. Eragons live action adaption proved that with Saphira and Eragons interactions. I distinctly remember one of the last scenes where Eragon let out a war cry in his head and his lips didn’t move. It was extremely jarring and frankly just made me want to laugh. Which is about the only positive thing I have to say about that movie with the exception of Jeremy Irons performance. Anyway Lewis Therin could be portrayed as a voice that slowly gains a physical form after the scene in fires of heaven where he tries to overwhelm rands identity with his own in the dreamworld. I would even be interested in seeing him actually take over for a short time in that scene if handled correctly. Maybe have his face start talking to him out of mirrors or overlaying Taims during their initial meeting. Subtle beginnings with slowly more and more blatant forms of madness.

[@prod805212]

Robert Jordan - Next Level: he wrote Mat that way to draw attention to the fact that people do react that way when rape of a male is brought up. Put himself on the block to draw attn to something important = D

[@safinan8008]

Hi from uk!!

[@phlatbrim2732]

the names I read in my head are so different then what I hear other people say. I read a lot and have my pronounceation,

[@KeeliaSilvis]

[WoT spoilers + a CW for sexual assault] . . . . . The way Jordan handled Tylin's rapes of Mat makes me nauseous. I understand what he was trying to do, trying to use humor to address a topic that is even more taboo than sexual assault with female victims. But goddamn did he bungle it. For male victims of sexual assault and rape, using humor to minimize/hypersexuality to fetishize the experience is a necessary coping tool. I have a number of male friends who have survived sexual assault, and it took *years* for each of them to even admit what happened was assault/abuse. For most of those friends, when they first started talking about it they obfuscated the reality of what they had gone through with jokes, raunchy story-telling, etc until they could finally admit to themselves that what had happened was Not Ok. Especially at the time, using at least some humor might have been the only way to put that section in at all--the only way it could be even remotely palatable. But Jordan never balanced the humor with real character growth, accountability, even plot importance. So what could have been a meaningful tool for destigmatizing male survivors of sexual assault turned into a vile, meanspirited joke. Maybe the show could correct some of that? Idk. My feelings are so twisted on that whole section of the book that I can't form a solid opinion on it.

[@neilbornstein5940]

Re: Hard to depict Book 1 spoilers With Perrin's wolf-speak, I agree that will be hard. I think flashes of images is good. What about the smells though? Both when wolves communicate smells to him, and when Perrin smells feelings. Are there going to be a lot of shots of Perrin sniffing and saying "Smells like fear" (or anger, or whatever)? How do you Show Don't Tell that?

[@revpembroke3082]

There are very few spoilers I care about. I typically find that journey is just as important as the destination. So what if I know that Vader is Luke's father, I want to see how that plays out. It only makes me MORE interested on the story (I used that as a safe example of something spoiler-y from 30 years ago. Hell, even when I'm spoiled on something like a character death, I don't mind, as now I know not to get attached to that character. Or, in Game of Thrones's case, that everyone dies, so why should I bother reading further?

[@rossj4755]

Spoiler comment I suppose. I don't believe Tylin raped Mat, and I never have. In fact I really don't understand why that's such a widely held theory/belief. To me, it was always a consensual relationship, and let me explain why. Mat complains about everything, all the time. That's a part of his character and a large part of his dialogue; he's a complainer. He complains about having to save people, about fighting battles, about women, about Rand, about his serving men, about nearly everything he comes across, including his relationship with Tylin. Mat also likes independence and being in charge, especially in relationships. He always likes imaging himself to be a lady's man with serving women because that lets him be totally in charge. With Tylin, she is 100% in charge, and that's totally new to Mat. He complains about the way she treats him because that is what Mat does. I never got the impression that he actually disliked it. He could easily make her stop if he wanted I believe; we've seen him do much more impossible things. However, he never does. Why? Because he enjoys it, but also enjoys complaining to himself about it. Over time, Mat grows to really care for Tylin and probably even love her; not Stockholm Syndrome; actual legitimate feelings. He is devastated when she is killed and carries that pain with him "forever." Mat complains about having to save the Super Girls; does that mean he doesn't want to do it? Of course not, he'd do anything for them. To me, it's the same with Tylin. He complains about it, but he secretly really likes he and enjoys their relationship. Maybe I'm wrong, but that's how I've always felt about it and I believe that my explanation is very much in line with Mat's character throughout the series.

[@captainwilhelm9657]

I totally understand why people think the relationship was consensual it's not like Mat ever used Oliver as a shield to try to keep Tylin from sleeping with him nor did Tylin order her servants to not give him food if he didn't sleep with her, order the guards and dockworkers to not let him out of the city and she certainly never literally held a knife to his throat. oh wait

[@rossj4755]

To me, it all came across as a game that both Mat and Tylin wanted to be playing. I don't know, without context it certainly comes across as rapey, but in context of the character of Mat and how he does/views things, I don't think it came across that way. Just like when he's going to save the super girls from the Stone, he's complaining the whole way; out of context, it seems like he hates them and doesn't want to be doing it. In context, we know that there's nothing he would rather be doing, and that Mat cares about them a great deal; he just likes pretending like he doesn't enjoy things.

[@KeeliaSilvis]

I think you should reread the section. You're correct about Mat's general character re complaining and his eventual affection towards Tylin. But at the beginning it isn't as benign as Mat not knowing how to deal with a woman in charge. :( Tylin ignores his clearly stated "no"s to the point that she eventually threatens him with violence until he succumbs to her sexual desires. Mat comes away from the first encounter wanting to cry, but he is so ashamed and humiliated that he won't let himself cry in her presence. As the relationship progress, Tylin demeans him, ignores his feelings, treats him as an object. It's all classic sexual & emotional abuse. And throughout it all, Jordan treats it as a joke. :( :C The relationship does evolve, but it wasn't just playful at first. Mat was miserable. Tylin took advantage of him because she was the queen and could do so without repercussions, so she raped him repeatedly. And when he tried to get help from his female friends (Nynaeve and Elayne), they laughed in his face and victim shamed him. It's an incredibly twisted situation, and one that Jordan mishandled. Harriet has said that he was trying to use humor to explain sexual assault/aggression to men and boys who might not otherwise understand or empathize with it, but instead it comes across as some weird funny game. Idk. Maybe the show could fix some of that.

[@dediguise0018]

This is very hard to talk about nowadays for the very opposite reasons it used to be taboo. The fact that he came to have feelings for her does not change the fact that he was in a physical relationship regardless of what he wanted. However I do not believe it had the lasting psychological damage that sexual assault truly has. And this is where we truly begin to wonder how consensual the relationship actually was.

[@rossj4755]

Thanks for the replies. I will definitely reread it Keelia. Maybe you are right. I hadn't heard that from Harriet; obviously if RJ did do that on purpose, you are right, but I just never saw it that way. Maybe I would with another read. Thanks for your reply; even if I still don't quite agree, I thought it was really insightful. Dedisguise, I feel the same way. Mat doesn't really have amy sort of lingering issue at all, and at least to me, really enjoyed it after his initial shock at the role reversal. I think the show will just take it out though, and I wouldn't complain. No reason for them to intentionally step into a known minefield, even if it is with good intentions like RJ might have had.

[@wesleymons]

I need to thank you for introducing me to The Wheel of Time, i have started the series and i am OBSESSED!!!! I am only on book 2 but i can not put it down!!! in your opinion..what is your favorite book in the whole series?

[@mathewstormblessed4706]

Wesley Mons I am glad you started it! It was an amazing series. I personally loved the last book the most just because it was the climax of a very long series.

[@benbutler9282]

Book 3, then book 4, followed book 6 ( brilliant) and so on. enjoy.

[@georgeeast5502]

Shadow Rising is the best, followed by The Great Hunt! actually lemme just rank all of them for you: 1) The Shadow Rising 2) The Great Hunt 3) The Eye of The World 4) A Memory of Light 5) The Dragon Reborn 6) Towers of Midnight 7) The Fires of Heaven 8) The Gathering Storm 9) Lord of Chaos 10) A Crown of Swords 11) Winter's Heart 12) Knife of Dreams 13) The Path of Daggers 14) Crossroads of Twilight 15) New Spring

[@raylee5461]

I remember when the Aiel started dominating one of the books I totally stopped reading for like a year. I think it was book 5, but just a heads up.

[@cameronbradley8390]

probably book 6 is my favourite, then book 2 and then some of the later books

[@captainwilhelm9657]

For anyone interested they also made a graphic novel of The Eye of the World.

[@coyote271280]

I had finished reading the fifth book of Night Watch series by Sergei Lukyanenko, and was craving for more fantasy, so I went online and did a search for Best Fantasy books not Tolkien, or something like that, previewed The Eye of The World on my kindle and haven't stop reading WoT since then, I am always reading it. On a side note, that search also brought me to The Kingkiller Chronicles....utter waste of money and time, it had a lot of hype and great reviews so I started it before WoT, what a terrible mistake.

[@filipegaahl]

Hey man, off topic question: Are u planning on reviewing the others lightbringer and malazan books?

[@captainwilhelm9657]

For Perrin communicating with the wolves I would do images with voiceovers from various voice actors and actresses depending whether Perrin or one of the wolves is communicating.

[@Siansonea]

I don't know how they're going to depict all the wolf stuff. I found it cringey in the books, and I just have a feeling it's going to be a series of images, and then Perrin either monologues about it or dialogues with someone else about it.

[@phlatbrim2732]

#wottalk #spoilerfree #1stspoilerfree! Great question. so I run several Fantasy sports leagues. it was 2008 or 2009 and one of the guys in my league was reading along with GOT books. And at the time we were waiting for next book(2011) so recommended WOT. so I dug in.HARD! So I got WOT done read the new release of dance with dragon and was pissed didn't have anything to read. so reread WOT. finished just in time to get memory of light on 1st day book was released. loved it. Loved the whole series!

[@KeeliaSilvis]

"Me and names are not friends man."-->But you got my name right! Both of my names! They're both weird and rare, so you get double points for reading it correctly. 😊

[@Siansonea]

That makes one of us.

[@john_frankford7450]

Does anybody else picture the Ogier as the creatures from Where the Wild things Are with less hair😂😂😂

[@Siansonea]

I don't know what they're going to do about the Ogier. I find every description of Ogier in the books to be rather silly looking as I imagine it. I think they'll have to use some kind of practical effect, hiring very tall actors and using prosthetic makeup effects to create the Ogier race. They're not going to leave them out, I think they're pretty important in a lot of ways. But I do worry that they'll be ridiculous looking if they follow the book descriptions too closely.

[@LightHalcyon]

No but now I can't unsee it. Especially because I have a toddler who is a big fan 😂

[@KeeliaSilvis]

[SPOILERS] I think the best example of how I would like to see the Rand/Lews Therin relationship play out on screen is the way Gaius's hallucinations/visions are treated in Battlestar Galactica. You said you didn't like that kind of thing, but when handled well (just like as BSG handles it well) it can be a fascinating and powerful tool for progressing the plot + character development.

[@zachgranat5518]

Are you sure $1 million dollars will be enough for our own Wheel of Time show? I think that would only last us a few episodes at most if we plan on casting A-List actors and cameos, shooting at locations all over the world, and having state-of-the-art special effects. You should have requested at least $150 million for Season 1.

[@mdneal79]

#WoTTalk What do you think the chances are that people who have not read the books love the TV series and people like us hate the TV series? I think the chances are fairly good if they don't hire a competent loremaster to check the scripts against the books.

[@cameronbradley8390]

Spoilers A topic inspired by the worst storyline in wot video, this might be interesting to discuss. I really liked Moiraine's return and how she was used to defuse the tense situation before the last battle, but this mean that no central characters had actually died during the course of the series (last battle excluded). I really liked her death in the first half of the series as it showed that characters could die, and raised the tension a bit. Now I’m not a huge fan of stories where main characters drop left, right and centre, until there is no-one left to root for(*cough, Game of Thrones, cough*), but the wheel of time does occasionally feel like there is plot armour, and this removes the tension to some extent. Any thoughts upon this topic in Wot and in Fantasy in general?

[@Siansonea]

Moiraine has to be there at the Last Battle though. We can't lose that.

[@cameronbradley8390]

i know, and i really liked the way she came back, which is why i have such mixed feelings about her return.

[@ricardorigual8482]

Have you been listening to the bill burr podcast?

[@KeeliaSilvis]

Daniel: There's a lot of spanking in Wheel of Time... #WotSpanks. Me: OMG IS THAT A REAL HASHTAG?? [quick Google later] Awwwww.

[@prod805212]

Wrt to David's comment: was it almost a rite of passage for anyone growing up with this series to pronounce a million things 'wrong'? Anytime I'd run into a new WoT fan growing up, we would totally deep dive (loved high school...), and hearing how they pronounced names and places informed my (possibly/likely incorrect) current pronunciation of WoT people and places. Even listening to Daniel on the reg has made me stop and say 'oh... what language was RJ intending to derive that from...?' Or 'holy crap, it makes sense that culture would pronounce their vowels like that!'

[@craftybookdragon684]

SPOILER! I'm curious to see how they do the scene where Rand cleanses saidin and all of the chaos going on around him without taking away from the importance of that event. There was fighting going on between some of the Aes Sedai while Rand and Nynaeve we're working together to cleanse the male half, but I feel like that should be focused on less than the actual cleansing.

[@Siansonea]

Some of those fights are important though. Elza Penfell accidentally killing a Forsaken, and Demandred facing Rand for the first and only time are both rather important, for instance. The cleansing itself might be hard to depict visually, but it will be epic to see the Choeden Kal used for the first time.

[@craftybookdragon684]

@@Siansonea I'm not saying leave them out completely. Plus it's been almost a year since I've read that scene so my memory of it isn't what is like it to be. Definitely keep the important ones in.

[@Siansonea]

The cleansing of saidin is definitely going to be tricky to get right, that's for sure.

[@Siansonea]

As I'm watching THIS video, I don't see a pinned comment to respond to.

[@DanielGreeneReviews]

Idk what to tell you it’s up there. KZbin is just amazing!

[@craftybookdragon684]

I just replied to Daniel's comment. It was the very first comment I saw in the line so I think that is the pinned comment.

[@Siansonea]

Jessica Haley, when I wrote the comment, it was before there were any comments on the video. I got an email notification that the video was up, so I guess I started watching it before the pinned comment was added. Once I finished watching, I was able to refresh the page and see the comments that were added thereafter.

[@rossj4755]

Daniel, I like your channel and I love talking about/listening to discussion about WoT, but Please read the comments before you start recording, so 1/4 of your video content isn't you starting to read a comment and then saying "this should've been a reply to the pinned comment" and then not finishing it or being confused about what it is saying. That is the only problem I have with your videos. Thanks for offering WoT discussion!

[@meprivate6923]

I can helps you!

[@Ipavaiva]

Dont murder me now, but honestly Padan Fain is probably the easiest character to drop completely from the show. There is very few scenes where he actually does anything important, and those can be written some other way

[@Siansonea]

I agree that Padan Fain could either be dropped completely or defeated sooner. He just isn't that interesting. A cartoon villain even compared to the Forsaken, who have mustache-twirling tendencies themselves.

[@Ipavaiva]

@@Siansonea I think he has a lot of potential... if only he had had a satisfying ending, but we didn't even get that

[@Siansonea]

Not sure what else they could do with him. Once Mat's dagger storyline is resolved, I don't even remember what happens with Padan Fain after that. ::shrug::

[@Ipavaiva]

@@Siansonea he attacks two rivers, then hangs out with white cloaks, then he travels to cairhien to stab Rand... and then the ending, can't remember anything else

[@Siansonea]

Oh yeah, it's all coming back to me now. For what it's worth, I was always bored during the chapters involving Whitecloaks, (though I always liked Galad as a character for some reason). But yeah, I completely forgot all that other Padan Fain stuff. Just wasn't very compelling for me. He was always just a pathetic Gollum-like character to me, dangerous but not insidious or terrifying in the same way as the few competent Forsaken.

[@mathewstormblessed4706]

Yes Costalk is awesome. I dare say it might be better than WoTTalk. On the subject of Mat's "rape" I have weird feelings about this. I never watch anything that makes me feel uncomfortable so I would end up skipping scenes like this. We shouldn't cut it just because of the rape, but, I feel like we are going to be pressed for time as it is. You will most likely disagree, but if we have to choose scenes to cut I would choose scenes like this. I might also leave out the weird spanking that Aes Sedai like to do...

[@Siansonea]

I think the Aes Sedai discipline needs to not be 'turning over the knee' spanking, and more like the type of corporal punishment that is seen in military organizations, etc. It's just so weird and fetishistic to depict one woman spanking another woman over her knee, not to mention that it's rather impractical. You can't get much force behind a strike from that angle, if the goal is to cause pain to the recipient. Having the woman stand still while the Mistress of Novices, also standing, strikes her with a wide strap seems more workable. And because Aes Sedai have Healing, and because they're not using the Power to harm the unfortunate woman, they can inflict a LOT of pain. I definitely don't think they should sugarcoat or dispense with the practice of corporal punishment among the Aes Sedai, since they are essentially the elite military organization in the Westlands. And especially Egwene's punishment at Elaida's hands. It's crucial for Egwene's development, for Elaida's depiction, and for Silviana's arc. So it has to stay in some form.

[@mathewstormblessed4706]

Siasonea Orande I agree to some extent. However, I feel like the show might be able to come up with an even more painful and degrading punishment that wouldn't feel quite so weird.

[@Siansonea]

It's not weird if it's depicted as a standard military practice. They can't use saidar, and they can't just make them scrub floors.I'm less worried about them showing Aes Sedai beating each other, and more worried that they'll be depicted as silly and weak.

[@mathewstormblessed4706]

Siansonea Orande I am sorry but it is still weird to me. I honestly do not see Aes Sedai as military and just feel like the viewer would sit there feeling awkward. I guess this ends up being different opinions though :D

[@Siansonea]

The Aes Sedai are the preeminent faction in the Westlands at the beginning of the story, the very top of the food chain. And their structure is very much like a military organization, as is their mandate. Their one real goal is to protect and preserve the Westlands, especially from the threat of rogue channelers and the Shadow. One could argue about how well they have fulfilled that mandate over the years, but that is neither here nor there for the purposes of this discussion. In a lot of ways, the Aes Sedai are like a religion, a government, and a military order all rolled into one. They are a city state of wizards, who go out in the world with a range of purposes that very much includes military action front and center. The Red Ajah and the Green Ajah are essentially wholly military in their efforts. The Red Ajah are like marines who go after the most dangerous rogue channelers and neutralize them. The Green Ajah are a force dedicated to fighting Shadowspawn and preparing for the Last Battle, but it could be argued that they are not nearly as effective in their stated goal as the Red have been in theirs. The Yellow Ajah are the medical corps, though of course they serve ordinary citizens as well. The Gray Ajah is the diplomatic corps, and the Blue Ajah no doubt assist them in their efforts from time to time. The Brown Ajah is dedicated to research and chronicling events, as well as training and maintaining traditions. The White Ajah is dedicated to the big picture, and making certain that the efforts of the White Tower as a whole make sense from a logical perspective, they are the philosophers and sages of the Aes Sedai. So it makes sense that the traditions of the Aes Sedai be depicted in ways that aren't silly and played for laughs, because to do so undermines their place in this fictional world. We are supposed to see the Aes Sedai as the apex predator at the beginning of the story, so that the splitting of the White Tower storyline has real stakes and real impact. If they're just a bunch of silly women running around spanking each other, then who cares?

[@mackenziesmith7047]

*Constructive criticism* If the majority of your WOT Talk content is going to be you reading comments from your subscribers, you should pre-read and organize the comments you use before you start recording. Having already read and organized the comments, you could spend less time half-reading irrelevant or "spoiler" comments in the wrong section and would have the opportunity discuss and respond to the things you want to talk about. Also, it may be beneficial for your youtube analytics if, instead of making one long spoiler-free then spoiler filled video, you made two separate videos where one was entirely spoiler free and the other was a SPOILER FILLED-DO NOT WATCH IF YOU HAVEN'T FINISHED THE SERIES deep dive on the series' themes, characters, TV adaption, etc. Those of us who have read all of the books could watch both videos and the people who haven't finished could watch the spoiler free discussion until the end... Plus, if the TV adaption becomes popular, you will already have spoiler free content for the TV viewers to click on and you'd get less complaints from people who don't want to be spoiled.

[@finghinmccarthy5021]

Just saying, please mis pronounce my name if you read my comment. I guarantee ive already heard it.

[@Uhlbelk]

Look, people want to know what others think of THEIR comment, they don't want to scroll through dozens of random comment to see someone respond to them. Also on the issue with Matt's "rape". Why the F does the story have to be sensitive to the current moral landscape of the US? EVERY culture in Wheel of Time is full of strong sexism and hard gender roles, so why would they treat Matt's situation with sensitivity?