Headcanon is Better Than LORE in Wargaming

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Tabletop Minions

Tabletop Minions

Күн бұрын

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@leadpaintchips9461
@leadpaintchips9461 Жыл бұрын
Honestly it's why I loved early to mid 40K. There was just enough lore to be a springboard for _all_ the headcanon to flourish.
@DiscoDigi786
@DiscoDigi786 Жыл бұрын
There is still plenty of room for headcanon in 40k. Don’t let neckbeards ruin your fun.
@leadpaintchips9461
@leadpaintchips9461 Жыл бұрын
@@DiscoDigi786 Just not as much since they answered so many questions 'recently'.
@DiscoDigi786
@DiscoDigi786 Жыл бұрын
@@leadpaintchips9461 you are literally looking for things to be upset about. GW has not personally nullified any head canon you have. Enough with the victim complex. Play war dollies the way you want to and stop acting like an abused spouse.
@leadpaintchips9461
@leadpaintchips9461 Жыл бұрын
@@DiscoDigi786 Good example is Sisters of Battle of lore that gutted headcanon. Before it wasn't clear at all what the miracles the normal sisters were doing. It was believable that it was just willpower just allowing them to do that little bit extra that seems to be a miracle but was just determination. Now it's clear, with the fluff that they've released, that _something_ supernatural is happening with the regular sisters. I'm not talking about the living saints, that was always something supernatural. But the normal sisters doing their miracles are cutting through supernatural shenanigans affecting other humans. Same with 30K. Before that was all muddled in unreliable narrator but now we have like 30+ books exactly describing what happened during that time and what was happening in people's heads. You probably should stop acting like nothing has changed negatively throughout the timespan of 40K. _Lots_ has changed and not everyone will like every change, and that's ok. It's also ok to _like_ the changes, I'm not begrudging anyone who prefers to have clear cut answers to the questions presented in lore, but I'm not one of them.
@DagsTheBarbarian
@DagsTheBarbarian Жыл бұрын
​@leadpaintchips9461 if, as you seem to believe/claim, that your head cannon is "better than the lore", then what do you care if GW "nullifies" your head cannon???? You aren't paying any attention to GW's lore anyway, that's WHY you're making up your head cannon, GW didn't nullify anything, it just gave an answer to questions, which could be from an unreliable narrator, just like your sensibilities demand....
@mycatistypingthis5450
@mycatistypingthis5450 Жыл бұрын
There is an infinite amount of headcanon. When I build a team, I make a small story about them to make decisions about their gear and the way I paint them. I'll never be limited to what is in a book, I don't need to stop what I'm doing to look up details etc.
@tomblack2064
@tomblack2064 Жыл бұрын
That's a cool idea😊
@ivoalexander4201
@ivoalexander4201 Жыл бұрын
Same. I always ask, what's the logic behind this selection of kit? What have they been through to arrive at that point? And very occasionally, a few of them get a name painted on the back of the base ;)
@edwardclay7551
@edwardclay7551 Жыл бұрын
Back in 1993 when I was 12 and starting wargaming... all of the known texts etc describing the armies or forces always promoted the use of headcanon to create my own heroes or army commanders.
@lordhelwintr283
@lordhelwintr283 Жыл бұрын
That was before they probably even had named characters
@Cosmoproto
@Cosmoproto Жыл бұрын
@@lordhelwintr283 Even when there were named characters, they started as kit bashed minis in a studio army like Ghazghkull
@Guru_Swami
@Guru_Swami Жыл бұрын
Ah the good old days. We had home brew Epic Space Marine campaigns with our own grand storyline and Battletech mercenary companies with intricate backstories. All brought to life over weekends and summer breaks on top of basement ping pong tables repurposed to create the visual representations of the stories going through our heads. Miss those simpler times…
@Pino.1
@Pino.1 Жыл бұрын
Yeah, big time fan of headcanon; a sub-chapter of space wolves who were stuck in time or tyrannids from a water world, or volcanoes or ice. They were always the most fun.
@teamevil43
@teamevil43 Жыл бұрын
The hobby is yours. Never let anyone tell you what you can or can't do from a creative standpoint concerning your army. Literally Anything. Go forth and create my children! And when you are done, I wish to hear about every last one of your chapters, warbands, crews or mobs.
@HeretixAevum
@HeretixAevum Жыл бұрын
Perfect timing on this video, I was just thinking today about how much I do or don't care about lore. As a 40K player, I like knowing the basic 'what are these guys about' for each faction as well as a surface level understanding of the timeline between now and the 41st millennium to understand why the major factions exist, and what the warp & chaos is. I also like little tidbits about random things, like the flavour text for units and weapons, as I find that kind of stuff can really animate the imagination and helps to bring the theatre of the mind to life. Outside of that surface level 'lore', I don't care enough to read any of the novels or to listen to somebody talking about the nuanced motivations of the various legions during the horace heresy, etc. 'Rivet counter' is such a funny term. I've been fortunate enough not to run into someone like that yet, but if I do, I will definitely proceed to not play a game with them. I also wanted to say how much I appreciate your intros, I think you do them better than almost any other channel I watch on YT. So many channels just stick their video intro sequence right at the front, often being a good 10+ seconds or so too long, so I find myself always immediately skipping ahead at the start of every video. Thank you for respecting the viewer's time!
@Pikilloification
@Pikilloification Жыл бұрын
They're pieces in a game. Couldn't care less about their story as long as the mechanics are fun.
@tabletopminions
@tabletopminions Жыл бұрын
I’ve always felt that if I waste the viewer’s time in the beginning of the video, then they’re likely to go watch something else. Thanks for watching!
@ryza7760
@ryza7760 Жыл бұрын
it's honestly so much more fun to create your own chapters, tombworlds, hivefleets, craft worlds etc and imagine them all fighting in their own little sector of space is so much more fun then just playing ultra marines, black legion, biel-tan and such
@robertchmielecki2580
@robertchmielecki2580 Жыл бұрын
I don't know, the historical wargamers would disagree with you on making up stuff. For these players (not me, I actually find it offputting for the reasons you mention) accuracy is part of the appeal.
@darthkai3621
@darthkai3621 Жыл бұрын
Dark Imperium actually provides an opportunity. Everyone in it is cut off from the rest more stable part of the galaxy, meaning you can do whatever you want in your little sector😁
@badgerwijohnson4081
@badgerwijohnson4081 Жыл бұрын
The good thing about 40K lore is they leave vast amounts of room for Headcanon. 10000 years, a Galaxy with billions of planets, ever present warp shenanigans. There is virtually nothing that headcanon can come up with that doesn't fit the setting.
@Axiom125
@Axiom125 Жыл бұрын
When I painted my first minis I just picked the colors I liked. I didn't bother to look to see if it matched a specific group in the faction. We're playing a narrative campaign and am so happy with my custom dudes
@DrVesuvius70
@DrVesuvius70 Жыл бұрын
I've always been a headcanon driven gamer. I've always been turned off by lore-heavy games. But here's the funny thing - very lore heavy games can reach a point where you can throw away the game and just enjoy the lore and even wargame it as if it was a historical period using whatever mini or setting agnostic rules you like and ignoring the original game. One of my current projects is Horus Heresy, but using OPR rules and based entirely on the videos of lore KZbinrs and reading the Black Library novels. With 3d printed space marines I can tailor the minis to my own tastes and mental image of the "period" and I can explore implied aspects of the story that aren't covered by the official tabletop games. it's a much more creative exercise than just buying and painting a big GW box.
@TimBergen
@TimBergen Жыл бұрын
I like using the framework of canonical lore as a starting point from which to create big explorable bubbles of previously unknown territory. My Necrons? Never went to sleep, intentionally cut themselves off from the greater command structure in order to pursue specific goals re: the C'tan shards. The little stories about each of the characters reflect their personal connections to that goal, and influence how I build/paint them, and how I field them, and consequently how they play with their various compatriots. It lets me keep them tied to the existing universe, if loosely at times, while giving me space to spin my own narrative about why this army is together, and why all its parts are the way they are. And the rest of your comments are better than half exactly this kind of anecdote, so I think you've really hit the nail on the head for a particular archetype of lore interaction. Good video!
@thedourkin
@thedourkin Жыл бұрын
The high point of this video comes at around 9 minutes in when our masterful host turns his headcanon on the canon heads. Great video Uncle A!
@FyrenTiger
@FyrenTiger Жыл бұрын
I'll bet you we nearly all have that One Friend who really needs to hear this.
@Rhowin1
@Rhowin1 Жыл бұрын
Creativity is among the biggest appeals of the hobby and as such I'm all for "headcanon". However there is one thing I'd like to add to that - gaming is usually a social activity and can be very awarding. If you enjoy the narrative part - the appeal of a lore / a canon heavy world is that it provides a setting where all the individual stories come together. In short if you have your own canon it's important communicate really well or it can easily break the immersion. It's like painting a mini - contrast is what makes the model interesting.. same applies to any good story and the characters. However there need to be parts that bind it together and the more divergent the head canon is the more effort it'll take to glue (communication) everything together. A certain flexibility helps too on everyone's part. And I don't think that creating an individual story / canon within a more confined setting has to reduce the creative part - it can be rewarding challenge as well.
@michamalinowski8015
@michamalinowski8015 Жыл бұрын
History, folklore and myths are the best lore, because it encourages You to educate yourself. Also in my opinion those settings make a game way more immersive. I don't feel engaged by space bodybuilders. But immersimg myself in a dark age warlord raiding cattle, looting villages shows what kind of sittuations real people faced. Or to see what consideration Wellington had at Waterloo.
@HNXMedia
@HNXMedia Жыл бұрын
LOL. I still have "head cannon" floating around in my brain from when I played with my GI Joe figures back in the early 80s and how they interacted with these other beings from a galaxy far far away. No different in wargaming with miniatures as a grey beard adult.
@mathieu4204
@mathieu4204 Жыл бұрын
As a kid, I played with GIJoes all the time, but I used the figures as new "original" characters. I didn't follow the stories from the cartoon nor the comic books, but created my own adventures. This followed me on the tabletop.
@DamienWise
@DamienWise Жыл бұрын
Well said, thankyou! I like it when people customise their paint-schemes, modify their miniatures, and invent house-rules for better gameplay. It makes it more fun for everyone, and it's fabulous to see how creative you can get.
@RedC0met3
@RedC0met3 Жыл бұрын
I actually have a huge issue with canon vs non-canon myself with regards to Battletech. The entire universe is catalogued so well that the only way to really make your own unit is to be mercenaries. Or if you like certain units then you get games that can break immersion because battling some opponents make no canonical sense. That said, all my guys are just green.
@axolotlaristotle
@axolotlaristotle Жыл бұрын
This is true. I play Salamanders and everyone always makes lava bases and focuses on the environment of their homeworld. So I decided to deviate while also sticking to something I can easily conceive as canon. As they are the chapter that lives with and spends time with their human families, to me it is conceivable that they would at one point have a beach party with them. So I am making beach bash salamanders and am currently working on turning my dreadnought into a lifeguard, without oversized water wings and all
@DuoXCity
@DuoXCity Жыл бұрын
As a Legion player, this video speaks to my soul. I watch so many people try to match up what characters and troops look like in the movies and shows, but it just makes everything seem so boring. I decided to paint my CIS in a dirty chrome and give them all a Skynet Terminator theme. I absolutely love it. A chrome Grievous with red lightsabers is so cool!
@daorkdork9490
@daorkdork9490 Жыл бұрын
This video hit at exactly the right time for me. Iam in the midst of putting together my Imperial Guard and thinking of the paint scheme. I picked up the Minka Lesk mini on pre-order and Boss Snikrot for my Orcs. But my Orc paint scheme isn't "lore accurate" and I don't really want to paint my troopers as Cadians. Even though I know in my head that I don't have to follow the "rules", hearing someone else voice it helps to make it stick. Thank you Uncle Atomsmasher!
@Spark_Chaser
@Spark_Chaser Жыл бұрын
40K Loreboy: It must be like the books, or it's wrong! Dornian Heresy Chad: The Black Templars are a Legion formed by Horus, Loyal to the Emperor, and seek to smash Rogal Dorn's for his Heretical Black Legion. Space Wolves Serve Khorne. Roboute Guilliman, The Master of Ultramar, told both sides to kick rocks.
@Nightmare-cr3iw
@Nightmare-cr3iw Жыл бұрын
I agree wholeheartedly. I still consider all this new garbage about the Primarchs coming back to be silly. However, I am intrigued by the concept of Bolter P0rn....Please elaborate. Whats the best book that illustrates this concept?
@AlexArgrok
@AlexArgrok Жыл бұрын
Uhh I remember when on christmass I showed my older brother my Word Bearers he just looked at them and said "Thats... wrong red tone color, right??" ughhhhhhhh. On the bright side, I loved painting my first minis because of my headcannon and little stories I made with them, now painting a bigger army, uniformity kills a bit that feeling but i feel good whenever i see my dudes recruiting more people and my warband getting bigger
@vedrengrabelox3231
@vedrengrabelox3231 Жыл бұрын
It is all about finding the right people to play with, I can see both ways of approaching the hobby and feel that each side unfairly demonizes the other.
@DRAYN0
@DRAYN0 Жыл бұрын
Really needed to hear this, thanks! just got back into the hobby for the first time since the Battle for McCrage box in 4th and boy have I had option and lore paralysis
@gabdewulf
@gabdewulf Жыл бұрын
Gather around children and learn a forbidden story that's too true for the emperor's lie spitters. When Caliban was shattered, there was a company that survived. That company survived an exploding planet, fae pirates, and a thousand year fighting the traitors. Which was fine and within the rules, but to work with a craft world that also fought with them for a thousand years which housed and fed them, which found other exiles of Caliban to replenish and maintain the fight. And when an Imperium lackey tells you the lost company is beyond redemption for working with Xenos, know in your bones the Silver Winged Dark Angels fight the Chaos while the priests only want to fight you. That's my lost company from 2nd edition in the wilder fun days.
@evileyeball
@evileyeball Жыл бұрын
It's totally true, I have written a complete Index document for each of my 7 kill teams with a full page description of the team on the whole and on each index card for each model It has a little bit of fluff about that operative alongside his custom name and custom named weapons. I even make sure that when I get a new team that team somehow links to my other teams or my wifes teams like for example my Currently I have The Illuminated and the Cult of the Ancient Muse Loyalist Alpha Legion, with Escher cultists that took the names of ancient Terran female rock stars who strive to wipe out Eclesiarchy because Sisters follow Leticio Divinitatus which was written by Lorgar Aurellian the first heretic. an use Cultist to Lure out sisters. The Shrouded Word Bearers who strive to bring the light of chaos to the galaxy and are an adversary for the Illuminated in addition to that of my wife's sisters. Memoirs of Isstvan: Deathwatch, Loyalist Terran Legionaries that survived Isstvan III and got flung via the warp to M41 and are Hunting their former brothrers The Rusted Host: Death Guard, Rusted Guys who are an adversary for Memoirs of Isstvan and are being hunted by them Cadre D'Yanoi Ta'ro'cha Ko'vash Tau'va and Kauyon Yash Savon: Tau and Pathfinders trying to convert the Twilight world of Torax IV to Tau'Va and have encounterd Y'he Mokushi (Tyranids) Splinter Tendril Marianis: Bioluminecent Tyranids stalking the shadows of Torax IV
@malakimphoros2164
@malakimphoros2164 Жыл бұрын
Did you brew rules to better represent these in teh gaem?
@evileyeball
@evileyeball Жыл бұрын
@@malakimphoros2164 No I play them with the existing rules
@DavePottsAmI
@DavePottsAmI Жыл бұрын
Being newer to 40k, this is how I feel. I prefer the magic and mystery of my head canon to the more detailed writing of specific and granular stories. This is truer the older I get. Sometimes, I think it's comes down to having more life experiences than the writers of the lore stories. Good video premise.
@radmain
@radmain Жыл бұрын
In warhammer 40k, GW officially said about the 2 lost primarchs to encourage customisation on chapters, my mate made an entire space bears faction based on the space wolves, i've created a Red Cadian guard from a planet that is in a civil war between chaos vs imperium so i can have red traitor guardsman that work 100% agree, headcanon is better than lore
@michaeltribou4261
@michaeltribou4261 Жыл бұрын
I have over 50 years of historical gaming under my belt. In that time, and with all those games, I do not recall much headcanon. I think the closest was when a group of us did a long campaign using Squad Leader (SL, CoI, CoD, GI:AoV). Lately, I am heavily into sci-if and building forces and terrain as fast as I can. I look forward to trying out and developing some headcanon with Space Station Zero and Stargrave.
@josiaht9227
@josiaht9227 Жыл бұрын
With enough head cannoning I can make any faction I play be actually the alpha legion. Any sm faction? Disguise Guard? Hydra cultists Votan? Hydra cultist dwarves Tau? stolen armor and blue prostetics Eldar? Slimfast and meth Nids? Meatsuits
@heresyforheretics
@heresyforheretics Жыл бұрын
Absolutely spot on and fantastically delivered. Lore does not dictate creativity
@tanen7264
@tanen7264 Жыл бұрын
I’ve always loved the imperial guard and I’ve always liked kitbashing and converting the troops. I always come up with head canon, it’s part of what drives me on to complete anything.
@ochoaE3
@ochoaE3 Жыл бұрын
As someone who only paints (mainly 40K stuff) but doesn't play, part of what makes the hobby fun is exactly what you talked about. I always try and come up with my own color schemes for factions and then form some story for that. I've done so for Ironhead Prospectors (kind of) Tempestus Scions And Catachans
@GusOfTheDorks
@GusOfTheDorks Жыл бұрын
I get the feeling that he only makes this argument for head cannon he considers non problematic. But for people like me, and my head cannon, I get the feeling he would tell me it's not ok
@grendelb3298
@grendelb3298 Жыл бұрын
Love this video! It took me years to realize this. It’s the reason I don’t use purity seals on any models. Never understood why Space Marines would have wax seals and parchment. I’m the same way with Harlequin diamonds. Instead, I paint them in chaos colors to “mock” chaos factions.
@lewisj555
@lewisj555 Жыл бұрын
Nice video, very well articulated points. As a counter point, being someone who leans more into the 'rivet counter' way of thinking, I have no issue with people creating their own head-canon and basing their army around ideas that diverge wildly from established lore. In fact, I encourage it. I do take issue with those that proclaim they want these fan creations as genuine canon however, as pushing for that would affect what I and many others enjoy about the hobby: lore and storytelling. As someone who takes enjoyment from taking the time to make sure armour, weapons and decals are period correct for the setting I base my army in - How would I do that if canon constantly shifts events and facts previously set in stone from a lore perspective, just to accommodate fan theory? It waters down the setting to the point where none of my effort matters, because anything now goes. I don't want to stop people being creative, I just want them to be content with what they create being fan-canon only - it's not a bad thing! Be happy thinking outside the box, just as I am thinking inside it.
@ONIMOT100
@ONIMOT100 Жыл бұрын
"How would I do that if canon constantly shifts events and facts previously set in stone from a lore perspective, just to accommodate fan theory?" 40K already does this, so you are very late to the party there. Plus, unless a person actively works for GW as a setting writer, people cannot just make headcanons official. Thats not a thing that happens.
@cianmcswiney2505
@cianmcswiney2505 Жыл бұрын
I can see both sides of the aisle on this tbh. I'm a massive deep lore nerd and love knowing why Legions chose what side and who fought who where, etc etc. Horus Heresy has been great for that for me as I can jump really deep into rivet counter mode on my models which I enjoy. On the other side, it's fun to make custom Kill Teams and come up with a story on the fly to base a campaign around. I have found on places like Reddit etc "rivet counting" is quite frowned upon. Live and let live applies a lot to the hobby
@lincolnwillis3345
@lincolnwillis3345 Жыл бұрын
Great video as always. I believe this was the main issue with the primaris debacle. If you and a friend each bought a box of first born marines, your squads would look different. Even it was just a different helmet or a different mark of armor. They were yours. You made them how you wanted. Primaris feel like finely detailed plastic chess pawns. They get the job done but yours will essentially look just like mine.
@jakec5550
@jakec5550 Жыл бұрын
Great video! I like the idea of being able to set a squad's history together while painting. This can be done if you're using the "standard" paint scheme or not in any army. But, maybe "Sgt. Yablinkowitz" has a lucky red sock that sticks out of his left boot, not because you dipped your paint brush into the wrong paint dot and couldn't find the original trouser paint, but because the sergeant is crazy and talks to his socks. Maybe the heavy gunner counts his big vehicle kills somehow on his weapon, or head. It's all toy soldiers on a table with doll houses (or doll house remnants) on the table and some model train vegetation for luck. It shouldn't matter what they look like. Stories are fun. Games should be too. Thanks for the new term "Rivet Counter". I've known a few in my time in wargaming, but always called them gate keepers. Rivet counter is a bit more positive in my view.
@kimmipops5143
@kimmipops5143 Жыл бұрын
Last week I painted my first three Space Marines ever, obviously following the box art/instructions. For my next batch I think I will try to make some of my own small variations to the color scheme just to see what effect it has. After all I am only painting them and not playing anyways ☺
@leesweeney8879
@leesweeney8879 Жыл бұрын
A thing I dislike in most war games is keeping your force as intact as possible is rarely part of the win condition. Yes, having to risk troops and at times is needed, but being able to still fight after the battle is as well. I think some VPs for having certain units survive mostly intact would add a bit to the game, your foe may not know which units you need to complete efforts later. That Tech Priest is needed to reroute power to a shield system, if he dies in the battle that is also lost, that sort of thing. I like narrative games these days much more than two forces stumbled across each other. Main issue with 40k is the Lore and the Game never mesh really. Thanks again for a good talk video.
@malakimphoros2164
@malakimphoros2164 Жыл бұрын
This is what the Jervis Johnson has warned us about!
@SpooKimi
@SpooKimi Жыл бұрын
I love headcannon, most of all my warhammer stuff has headcannon My marines are tyranids ^^ My admech, based of my dnd character they wanna mix psychic powers with technology and necrons My kruleboyz are beach orks Idk I love being creative and ya not gonna stop me
@danielhenderson8000
@danielhenderson8000 Жыл бұрын
Completely agree! Like, I love canon and lore, it is fun to see how a world has been setup, what big events and things have crafted it. Well written settings, that is ones that understand the tone they want and the ideas they want to convey, are delightful and having that foundation to look at and read is great. But I am with you, the "BEST" part of the hobby of wargaming is that it is your experience is key. What YOU want and what YOU create is why we do this, whether it's a fun little head swap or an entire custom faction. I think the biggest thing is "Did they ask". Because, sure, if someone is LOOKING for help with canon, great. But anyone who feels they HAVE to is probably with an annoying playgroup. I adore headcannon and I think it doesn't have to conflict with lore. The appeal of 40k and AoS, IMO, is to fill in the many blanks with whatever I want, find some unique ideas and characters and push them forward. Make my mark on the hobby and enjoy what I can share with others.
@shawnwootan232
@shawnwootan232 Жыл бұрын
Aight, you got me with the Head canon joke. But definitely agree. Both for my custom stuff like my Space Opossum space marines. And also for my Angels of Defiance, which are technically a canon chapter but that certainly wont stop me from naming them what I want and saying they get up to whatever I want! Kill teams and Warbands are where its at for me cos I can get so much more into who each person is and why they have the weapons they do, Like my blind Silver Templar with duel lightning claws and a ripped off world eater head on one of the claws
@garretth.251
@garretth.251 Жыл бұрын
Yeah, I needed to hear this. When I first started collecting Space Marines (a very minor army of which I don't plan to have more than 2,000 points), I thought Red Scorpions were really cool, but then I fell in love with the Phobos marines and found out Red Scorpions think stealth is dishonorable. I've been going back and forth for years now on how to reconcile {hobos Red Scorpions to the point that I've almost abandoned Red Scorpions in favor of Raven Guard just so I can embrace stealth, but this video helped me see the big picture of mini wargaming - it's all make believe so just do what I want. It's perfectly fine for me to head canon that Guilliman told the Red Scorpions they could only have Primaris gene seed if they embraced the stealth part of the Codex Astartes, so here we have these new supersoldiers using new tactics that don't sit well with the old guard. I guess it makes a compelling story.
@kristophermelin7160
@kristophermelin7160 Жыл бұрын
Could not agree more. In fact, that's the beauty of my aspect of "the hobby." I like building and painting miniatures. I use whatever minis I want, freely kitbash from other companies, and paint them how I like. I don't play the games. All of my joy comes from creating and completing my own lore. I like the cool pictures from the books, and often make mine look like that. Could not care less if the weapons, colors, decals, and organization of units complies with the established rules. I'm not playing the game. I'm making up my own storyline. Thanks for the video!
@BB-pn2qv
@BB-pn2qv Жыл бұрын
Lore PLUS head canon for me. Channels like Luetin, etc are just so well done and interesting that I want to enjoy that sort of lore
@asfm2
@asfm2 Жыл бұрын
There have been more than a few times I hit a snag working on this or that bit of back story and I found a solution or workaround via deeper official lore, so I second this.
@SitoPon
@SitoPon Жыл бұрын
"Rivet counters" oh my god this is so beautiful, my new favourite hobby words😂 I'm all into head canon, not only Wargames but boardgames like Marvel Champions, Arkham files games. While I'm playing I'm watching a movie in my head. It happens a lot with tactical games like Infinity or kill team
@jake53105
@jake53105 Жыл бұрын
I like to come up with my own stories within the existing lore. For instance, my Federated Suns BattleTech stuff is painted with lore accurate schemes, proper decal placement, era accurate mech designs, etc. BUT, all the battles me and my friend play out are homebrewed conflicts. The accurate unit colors and insignia is for the more detail obsessed players I come across in the wild.
@dadofwar292
@dadofwar292 Жыл бұрын
I like tattoo on the Barbarian from Diablo 2, Kratos from God of war and other tattoos that are colorful and cover the face. My favorite Ultramarine units get a marking on their head in similar fashion if they do something spectacular like slay a warlord or survive an unlikely encounter
@Basil_Ghothickovitch
@Basil_Ghothickovitch Жыл бұрын
I believe that the best time for Warhammer was in 2015-2019. So many new and fresh! Then GW began to deal exclusively with fan service. I don't like a lot. So for a long time I've been building my own vision of Warhammer. First, I combined 40,000 and Age of Sigmar into one setting. This must be done. Second, my headcanon never had the old fentasy world and the Horus Heresy. It's all a forgotten and forbidden myth. So are the primarchs. They may be, but not on every battlefield. And most importantly: all my miniatures exist in my headcanon setting - and not as the Games Workshop throw it into Legend rules grave, which means this no longer exists!
@adamtomlinson918
@adamtomlinson918 Жыл бұрын
this video is so reminiscent of my foray into the hobby 20 years ago. I got the 40k starter set (marines and D. Eldar) and wanted to paint them as Space Wolves. But I was so worried I'd do it wrong that i went into the shop and was like "i dont know how to paint these. can you show me how??" Now, to that man's credit--I've long wished I knew his name--he took 2 hours to walk me through painting 2 space wolves. But I remember being so worried I would do it "wrong." Also, related to GW Lore, I remember that as a newbie, I got the full rulebook in the starter set, and I did not realize that the lore section wasn't rules to the game. On the one hand, that meant I was a bit of a rivet counter as a newbie, but it also got me very invested in the Lore, and those old pictures of space marines and such are some of my happy places in nostalgia. That said, I love my headcannon!
@billdefranza4927
@billdefranza4927 Жыл бұрын
Great video and great points, as always! Oooh, fireworks! 🎉
@Salvation1326
@Salvation1326 Жыл бұрын
Where did you get that shirt? It's really cool, the art is so unique and eye catching!
@tabletopminions
@tabletopminions Жыл бұрын
It’s a Space Station Zero shirt, and it’s available at the snarlingbadger.com website. Thanks for watching!
@charbroilbeefcake6095
@charbroilbeefcake6095 Жыл бұрын
I agree wholeheartedly with your position. I think this is one of the two "evils" that drive folks out or miniature gaming. You spend a month painting you first miniature unit and bring them in to show them off and play with them. You are excited and proud of what you have accomplished. Then someone tells you that your unit, a fictional unit, is painted the wrong color, "They never wore black pauldrons." And of course, there is a dig about the paint quality. Or, "In 1809, French infantry wore the water bottle on the left side, not the right, and it was buff colored, not brown." I have seen the light go out of a new gamer's eyes when this happens, and soon, the gamer boxes up the units and sticks them in the basement, opened by their kids 25 years later, "Hey Dad, what are these?" The other "evil" that drives folks out of miniature wargaming is the obsession with winning, especially at conventions. Obviously, tournaments are a different matter. New gamer signs up to play in a big sprawling battle, with 6 players per side and an overall commander. Overall commander assigns new gamer four units to command, sticks them out of harm's way, and three hours later they haven't moved or engaged the enemy. New gamer decides there are better, cheaper ways to spend their Saturday afternoons and never gives miniature gaming a second thought. We drive away way too many folks that want to give this fun, great looking hobby a shot. Stepping off my soapbox now.
@eric_intotheunknown
@eric_intotheunknown Жыл бұрын
Thanks for this - I completely agree with you. I love watching head cannon emerge as I work on my miniatures. The irony is I just decided to do a bunch of Raven Guard Phobos marines since I love their tactical stealth vibe, and I keep coming back to "canon" black is the stealthy colour. :)
@nestadious
@nestadious Жыл бұрын
Personally, the only thing I care about is that my opponent has there minis painted. But even having the minis painted I dont care that much about, like I'm not going to complain about how my opponents army isnt painted. In a perfect world we would have all the time in the world to paint our minis, and some people just dont have that time and want to play some wargames. The only thing I really care about when it comes to playing wargames is dont be a cheater and have fun.
@patstevens9405
@patstevens9405 Жыл бұрын
Thanks for the video. The lore in the novels is what brought me into the Battletech universe all those years (decades) ago. Even now when when paintiong units that have a canonical paint scheme I'll try to match it to the best of my limited abilities. However with head canon merc units anything goes and if someone brings a lance of the 1st Sword of Light to the table painted in yellows and purples instead fo red who an I to judge, I'm just happy to have someone new to play this silly game with.
@lordmalachi6
@lordmalachi6 Жыл бұрын
Ah rivet counters, my age old model railroading nemesis.
@komsomoletz828
@komsomoletz828 Жыл бұрын
My goblins lose much more often than they otherwise would, partly because I can't bring myself to make a "smart" move, when a "goblin" move makes more thematic sense. Absolutely worth it!
@Charistoph
@Charistoph Жыл бұрын
When I got in to 40K, I was mostly doing Tau. Then someone asked how a Chaos Warband could ever ally with Tau, that got me thinking. I then created a Chaos Marine Warband who were somewhat "allergic" to the general frequency of the Warp. Even a base human even being near them could start giving them a headache. Active Psyker use caused them to go in a berzerk frenzy. Since Tau were very low on the Psychic presence, they could handle being around them without issue. This was the first army I started to paint. After a while, I got bored, and started doing their opposite, the Space Marine Chapter that they came from. For them, only half were converted through the connivances of a few of their Librarians and Apothecaries who had been getting whispers from a Tzeentchian Daemon sealed away on their homeworld. I did the Chapter after all this happened, and they operated under the Black Templar rules (4th Edition when I started). I had most of them painted when I was done. It was fun telling people about them at that time. Since then, I've gotten out of 40K, went to Warmachine for a while (which is less good for head cannon), but now in Battletech where head cannon tends to rule more with one's paint schemes.
@mdbboyd
@mdbboyd Жыл бұрын
I absolutely love this week's video. It reminds me of a memory in the reprinted version of Operation Warboard, a set of WW2 rules originally from the 1970s. Bernard was the Allies and his father Gavin the opposition. He was of a certain age and couldn't bring himself to be the Germans, so in his personal headcanon he was a fictional east European country.
@hogger95905
@hogger95905 Жыл бұрын
Books I’m reading inspire me to paint certain models. Stormcast Eternal models with capes I think of them as the Gray Cloaks from Harry Dresden models. Necromancers from Gideon the 9th books. The big ogre looking things that goblins have I paint blue like the ogre looking things from the Mistborn books.
@fredclasson7865
@fredclasson7865 Жыл бұрын
I agree to a certain degree, the benefit of a shared lore is that I can arrive to a game and spout my headcannon and it will be relevant to my opponent because of the touch points. Necrons are all about looking for immortality and royally screwing that up, my Necron Dynasty is based on the Trisolarian race in Three Body Problem. So frequent solar storms would lay waste to all life on the planet and the only way to survive for them was to build and hide in huge monoliths to wait the storms out, for a generation or so before returning to the surface in order to try to collect all the resources and develop society again for some generations until the next solar storm would hit. Eventually they were offered the deal by the Silent King and went with it and became Necrons, but the old way of life has affected how the royals treat their subjects etc. It would be immersion breaking for me if I showed up to a game and a player is playing Eldar but his Eldar are timetraveling elves from the LotR universe who were banished by Legolas and are now looking for the Other Ring in order to return to Middle Earth and defeat Legolas and lay waste to the kingdom of man. Like, it wouldn't fit. Now, this have never happened, but just saying that the lore exists for a reason.
@heresyforheretics
@heresyforheretics Жыл бұрын
The thing I find weird is for games like Marvel Crisis Protocol where one could argue has the most canon given the IP its based on has such a great open community where they're more likely to encourage the change of colours compared to something like 40k who have some of the worst gatekeepers of an IP. The inflexibility of some of these people is astounding considering its a fictional satire setting
@tommylud4324
@tommylud4324 Жыл бұрын
Headcanon...when i lived in long island i ran Barcrafts (go to the bar..eat and drink with other nerds..watch and commentate on the videogame tournament on the tv). Headcanon is the first step to what i wanted to call a "TheoryCraft" type barcraft. It's difficult to get nerds together and create a community. Miniature table top gamers need this.
@Vexariongaming
@Vexariongaming Жыл бұрын
So when I started my Space Wolves army, I did the typical baby blue armour that is typical for them, but I quickly realised I didnt actually enjoy painting them, so I wanted to move to more like 30k style wolves with the grey armour. Rather than repaint the ones I already had done (including Ragnar and a Predator) I made my own head cannon that my version of wolves are super self sufficient to the extent that rather than rely on resupply of gear they make use of all the own, including old armour, and they dont repaint itt because of the respect of those that wore it before. Its all just to justify my laziness haha
@CesarIsaacPerez
@CesarIsaacPerez Жыл бұрын
I like both. I love reading the books and following the lore but my 40k army is my own chapter and has its own story. Can't wait to see a big budget Warhammer movie! Which will probably start its own separate universe.
@AVS_uk
@AVS_uk Жыл бұрын
Tiny fireworks on my phone version, too. Awesomeness made my day
@HacksawsHobbyBunker
@HacksawsHobbyBunker Жыл бұрын
Yes! Do not allow yourself to be bound unyieldingly to lore, but it is better to have headcanon that is not completely out of sync, in the sense of everyone partaking in the narrative aspect. Unless your group wants to in which case nobody will stop you. As far as historicals go I am something of a rivet counter though I do not give unsolicited advice to others so at least I try not to be "that guy". And if someone goes off the rails and paints their WWII soldiers pink or whatever, I'm free to decline to participate. I freely admit that I can be a bit obsessive....don't get me started on the topic of British and French trade shirts in 1750s North America, for example...and I get most gamers aren't like that, so I only give a critique when requested. Cheers!
@metajock
@metajock Жыл бұрын
Very well said. Haters are gonna be haters. Fanboys are the worst at it. If they aren't there to have fun, they can use the same door they came in. We do VERY open game worlds and we love it that way.
@PatGilliland
@PatGilliland Жыл бұрын
I think you do a slight disservice to historicals. While there are broad strokes of history that should be adhered to, individual units and characters can be given or develop their own stories. One unit of Voltigeurs may consistently fend off cavalry attacks, while Sgt Jones always survives hand to hand combat. There is an old but still popular set of colonial rules called The Sword and The Flame which lays out the circumstances where a figure can win a VC - which you then paint on that figure for a small bonus in every subsequent battle. For me at least the story that develops on the table is far more important for enjoyment than winning the game. But that's just me. ;)
@nathanseward8274
@nathanseward8274 Жыл бұрын
The thing that I really like about warhammer 40k is there really isn't a "period correct" pattern or color for armor. Like yeah ultramarines are blue and the primaris have their fancy new armor but everything is so chaotic that a lot of the legions will take what they can get, they're hardly ever at "parade ready" levels of cleanliness. The legions steal armor and weapons from their foes because resources are tight. I've been thinking about painting some of my ravenguard to have mismatched armor panels as an homage to the istvaan dropsite massacre where the soldiers would take armor pieces from dead soldiers because that aesthetic is really cool to me
@kikolokopo_toys
@kikolokopo_toys Жыл бұрын
My canon for female space marines and primarchs. They're the 2 legions erradicated from records, one of the primarchs found a xenos world, she was found of the simplicity of their lives and their ambition to find new worlds and explore them, she kept them a secret and told her trusty sister. One of the other primarchs or the emperor found out about it and confronted her. She and her sister fought her dad (and the other primarch if it was a brother) and clearly lost the battle, one of the primarchs died and the other ran away with what was left of both legions. Those legions are now a secret because the emperor used his extreme psychic abilities to erase them from anyone that remembers except himself and the female Space Marines for them to remember who truly rules the galaxy. They weren't a part of the horus heresy and they still exist. They've always been around living on the most out parts of the galaxy (or other galaxies) maybe infiltrated already on the imperium or something. Because of this, the emperor justified female space marines not being possible because of genetics, he feared that without female primarchs and space marines and the possibility of them existing would bring questions not only to other primarchs and space marines but to high figures of the imperium. I play black templars, I dont have any reason to have created this head canon other than it being fun and people seem to think female space marines are impossible to incorporate in canon without altering it completely. I'm merely adding a paragraph of lore, don't get all sweaty and aCtUaLlY my head canon that makes sense
@ChopsTV
@ChopsTV Жыл бұрын
Im a big head cannon type of guy but I find it fun to find reasons to justify that stuff in the lore too. I play space wolves. not a fan of the baby blue armor, I went with a really dark blue/grey. Hey, the lore says they paint their armor the "color of the stormy skies of fenris". There's a lot of colors in a stormy sky. etc. That said, I do think there's something of a limit, at least if you're gonna play strangers in an organized or even competitive setting. "These guys are blood angels but I really like that dark green so yea, they all look like dark angels" is just one more small bit of mental load you place on your opponent. Sure, theres nothing wrong with it and I think its hella cool to have armies with (essentially) limited run jerseys. I love it when sports teams do it, I love it when war gamers do it. But I do also think you gotta tighten it up if you're planning on playing that army competitively.
@Hedonite
@Hedonite Жыл бұрын
Yea i really love the warhammer lore as sort of a guideline fr my headcanon to fit in
@HugeGeronimo
@HugeGeronimo Жыл бұрын
I put Primaris arms and weapons on MK6 HH2, and they look great!
@cdh7453
@cdh7453 Жыл бұрын
Yeah I have Primaris Luna Wolves and soon enough Emperor's Children in 30k colours. So much gatekeeping out there but I don't care and love the larger scale models
@thomaswilliams5005
@thomaswilliams5005 Жыл бұрын
I was so hung up on more and color schemes. Then you and the Joy of Wargaming channel opened my eyes to the realms of possibility
@haligaz9119
@haligaz9119 Жыл бұрын
Did Adam just mention Battletech? YEEEAAAAHH!!!
@YeeKongChan
@YeeKongChan Жыл бұрын
Totally agree. I don't like heavy lore but story and narrative is really important, otherewise the best game mechanics will get bored easily. I hope this is a beginning. I'd love to learn from you more about how to be more creative and how to facilitate "headcanon". Some people can do well but can't teach well, but I think you are good in both.
@monkeybuizznes1
@monkeybuizznes1 Жыл бұрын
It’s why I love the guard so much, I can be WHATEVER I want
@johnbruce4004
@johnbruce4004 Жыл бұрын
A thought on your lore and colour schemes. Over time this has developed but if you review early Badab War books there are a vast array of SM in camouflage. Very vivid camo too. Worth a look at for 'legit' alternatives.
@03dashk64
@03dashk64 Жыл бұрын
Where are the models at 4:25 from? They look awesome
@mutualaidminiatures6070
@mutualaidminiatures6070 Жыл бұрын
The entirety of the 40k setting is established to give you a base for your headcanon.
@Ironfrenzy217
@Ironfrenzy217 Жыл бұрын
I recently decided to strip the paint off my Dark Angels. I made them red and I wanted to do a custom paint job and what not. As it turns out, me making my custom paint job is a hastle. So I'm making them Guardians of the Covenant. They have silver black and red, I can dig that scheme. I didn't need to I just couldn't settle on what I wanted to do
@Ghislain82
@Ghislain82 Жыл бұрын
Making my own homebrew chapter was the best decision I ever made for my Space Marines. People will ask me why I model so many thunderhammer's on every model that has the option and then I explain how this is my homebrew chapter and their weapon of choice is the thunderhammer. People tend to react very well to homebrew chapters for which you've made your own lore.
@mistformsquirrel
@mistformsquirrel Жыл бұрын
*I regret that I have but one upvote to give*
@jonesfigures
@jonesfigures Жыл бұрын
Outstanding vidya as usual! I'm always shocked on forums/reddit/pages etc (especially in the 40k ecosystem) where people ask "can I use this as this" (usually some specific chapter SM dude) and I CAN NOT fathom how their inner voice doesn't go "do it..." I've made like 5 2k forces over the past 2 years and they are all kitbash/ counts as and I can't be happier explaining to people MY head canon as to what I've done (I made a Custode army out of Necrons, with OLD chaos warriors arms, called them Men of Iron, and love how they turned out. As you keep saying, it's your imagination that makes it fun (not sure if you actually said that, but pretty sure that's the gist 😅) Anyways, keep on! Cheers 🤘🤠
@SirMorNo
@SirMorNo Жыл бұрын
You're custodes army sounds really cool. Are there pictures of it anywhere
@davydatwood3158
@davydatwood3158 Жыл бұрын
Rivet-counters pop up in lots of other areas, too. The Transformers collecting world has a surprisingly large number of people who will criticise the way someone chooses to build a display or slightly modify something's transformation or even just the decision to take a toy out of the package! It's referred to there as "playing with your toys wrong." Fortunately most of the hobby pushes back against that. And perhaps the ultimate expression of rivet-counting is the 501st Stormtrooper Legion and the Rebel Legion, where one will be sharply criticised and even prevented from participating if your props and costumes don't *exactly* match what was seen on-screen. And look, if you enjoy counting rivets and trying to perfectly match your replica to a particular shot on screen, go for it, just stop trying to count *my* rivets. I suppose that's part of why I prefer the Astromech replica community instead - there are so many different R2-D2 costumes and props that were used on screen and they're all *different* so it's basically impossible to get a truly screen-accurate replica. At some point, you just have go with what you like. Which is, essentially, headcanon.
@JadedJackalope
@JadedJackalope Жыл бұрын
There's a concept in my corner of tabletop RPGs called "anti-canon." Basically, a philosophy of running and/or designing games that defers some worldbuilding to individual groups, leaving blank spaces for players to improvise on the spot or fill in during team-brewing activities.
@alceuvitorpx
@alceuvitorpx Жыл бұрын
I like to create a headcannon as a concept to build my army list. As the majority of my game pals arent wargamers and I lend a spare army to play, is easy to understand how the army works
@MentoliptusBanko
@MentoliptusBanko Жыл бұрын
That's why I paint my minis in my own color schemes. I invent stories for each army and warband I painted. I can play them however I want and change the chapter/warband/legion if I want it. And that's they reason I don't play space marines :D Chaos FTW :)
@porter-831
@porter-831 Жыл бұрын
One thing that is often not considered with lore or canon is that even if something is considered "official canon", it can be an unreliable source. Now 40k can be somewhat overt there with warp communications and reports getting lost in vast Imperial bureaucracy but even with other franchises it's an interesting thing to consider. For example as a thought experiment, you could argue that the whole original trilogy of Star Wars is told from the perspective of Luke or the rebels, meaning it's not showing what actually truthfully happened, but the rebels' point of view of events, perhaps even propaganda. It can be fun to treat fictional stories like real-world accounts of historical events in that way, where probably no single source tells the exact truth. It also makes retcons and changes in canon less of an issue, even making them something you would expect as new versions of events come to light. Even with historical settings our understanding of certain details can change as new research becomes available or new discoveries are made. So headcanon and official lore are by no means mutually exclusive. Maybe you are just interpreting the source material differently than someone else. ;)
@malakimphoros2164
@malakimphoros2164 Жыл бұрын
This is made even sillier when translations set in.
@Jamesotronart
@Jamesotronart Жыл бұрын
Great video, I think people forget that this is all supposed to be fun, and it's less fun with the lore accuracy police running around.
@JoshyXD
@JoshyXD Жыл бұрын
I am currently building an Imperial Fists army, and I chose 6th company, but they only have battleline units. Which means 'technically' I have to paint all my specialist units with different company colours. One side of me wants to be lore specific, but the other side or me loved this video and just wants to paint them all the same company regardless of unit type.
@adams5613
@adams5613 Жыл бұрын
I have always kept the lore and head(table) cannon separate. They over lap a bit though are never completely the same. At game nights people have their own armies built their own way and that is to be appreciated. The campaign we're playing is unique and silly things happen with table talk and become table cannon for years.😊 lore is the overall point from the writers that spark ideas and are greatly enjoyed by itself. Let them hold hands but never force them to become one. Your army may be , hello kitty space maids as an example, love the creativity and enjoy the game and create stories. Don't then demand they can't play that army because its not a chapter and/or they shoulder demand that their army should be Lore. Let each grow as there own selves but let them hold hands as we walk down the gamer road together! ❤
@BlakesPipes
@BlakesPipes Жыл бұрын
This should not just be for war gaming, this should be for any hobby. We'll said.
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