Headless Multiscale Bridge/Tuners from China. Are they any good?

[@akira6996]

Thanks for the information

[@RickMorris-zw6we]

Try putting string locks at the nut and running strings from opposite direction. Then put spacers on string lock screws that are on bridge that are just wide enough to fit in slots so the tuners can't move from side to side.

[@cheapskate8656]

I did end up fixing the tuners. Video is here kzbin.info/www/bejne/a2a8lmyciq-fsNksi=cOb0l1ebXJmGzerp Your idea with the spacers is similar to what I did (bigger screw). So, clever you :)

[@yikelu]

It's interesting that you thought to lock the strings "Floyd Rose style", and have the ball ends at the head. I own 2 strandbergs and it seemed obvious that you feed the ball end through the back of the bridge. In fact, with the strandberg hardware, that's the only way to do it. Would that fix the grub screw lock slippage problem? Anyways, watching your fix video now. Edit: oh btw, I love the design you have here of adding a hole to the body for the tuners. Really cool.

[@cheapskate8656]

Yep, with these tuners putting the ball at the bridge end would have been better. Before they arrived I assumed (since they had grub screws) that they have no allowance for ball ends, so, I put keys at the head end. Thanks for the kind comments :)

[@Ivvyhc]

Great video, really helped me make up my mind. Regarding the grab screw problem, have you thought about grinding the tip of the threaded part so it’s round and that way it would have a better grip on the string against the round barrel?? Maybe?? Might be worth trying. Cheers

[@cheapskate8656]

Thats a good idea. I ended up fixing the tuners and I made a video here kzbin.info/www/bejne/a2a8lmyciq-fsNksi=1QI3-dIizWfPbk6x

[@Ivvyhc]

@@cheapskate8656 I actually noticed the second video right after posting this comment and kindly kicked myself for that since I never noticed the date of the video or anything else🤣 I'm glad you sorted out and it actually helped me in my search for a bridge for my project. Thanks again

[@marsrideroneofficial]

I love the look of that guitar. incredible the grab screws that holds the sting inside the barrel doesn't let go of the strings and hit the vocalist.

[@cheapskate8656]

Haha. Thanks, I have a video series of me building this guitar. It didnt go exactly as planned :)

[@chrisliddiard725]

Thanks for showing the details of the grub screw. I have where the ball end goes into the tuning machine, so its interesting to see that the string can be locked by the grub screw 'in theory', with the ball end left at the headstock. BTW I think they are made in Japan.

[@cheapskate8656]

Thank you for the feedback :) I purchased these tuners from alibaba and the seller was Chinese. Its possible they were made in Japan but unlikely IMO.

[@lesliejohn9061]

Thank you for making this video.

[@cheapskate8656]

my pleasure :) I ended up fixing them. If you are interested the video is here kzbin.info/www/bejne/a2a8lmyciq-fsNksi=woXVxuNwfBgWrV0P

[@Utaheyelid]

I have built two guitars with the stainless steel version and they seem much better. I have not had these issues. I put the ball in in the chair and use a locking nut at the headstock. I tried several from Amazon and there is an angled version with dual grub screws that works very well. You can also use a locking nut similar to what is used on the Floyd Rose set up.

[@cheapskate8656]

Thank you for taking the time to share that information. I ended up modifying then. If you are interested kzbin.info/www/bejne/a2a8lmyciq-fsNksi=MpoXF7Gkyq1dc1Oe

[@redwildgeeza]

Great in depth comprehensive review thanks. Very helpful! Been sitting on the fence with the AliExpress version of these for some time for a 7 string project, as I notice they range from £40+ UK. I notice you went into a lot of depth on the shape and compression of the string in the barrel, all could have been negated if you use the ball of the string, as you mention at the beginning of the video, but obviously you'd need a locking system on the 'headstock'. That then comes down to a design/look preference. It's goot to know that now though, as I'll probably look to get a 7 string Floyd-rose head-grip to anchor the top. The only issue I can see though, is if you get a string-ball stuck in the barrel of the bridge. This happens a lot to me on a few Strat trems, and I'm there for 1/2hour prodding with a thin allen key, trying to get old strings out... all food for thought. Again - thanks for highlighting your experience. It helps a great deal!

[@cheapskate8656]

Thank you. I ended up fixing them. The video is here if your interested. kzbin.info/www/bejne/a2a8lmyciq-fsNk

[@redwildgeeza]

@@cheapskate8656 Awesome, thank you! And oh wow! I didn't realise you were also a fellow GBBO22 contestant (just seen your other videos)! I use that term loosely - as unfortunately I'm only a Community builder and alas, life got in the way - so never actually finished. I'm still (obviously) planning on getting my builds sorted at some point though! I'm currently mid-hand-cutting a slab of oak length-ways to use as a top on a beech, Boden style body!

[@cheapskate8656]

@@redwildgeeza Excellent, I will look for you in this years GGBO

[@pablovilan]

👏👏👏

[@qainalo]

How about just putting in little bit larger screw for the string attachment? Drill new hole, that has flat bottom. That would solve the barrels moving out of tune, and also that string attachment problems.

[@cheapskate8656]

The solution ended up being a little more involved but you are definitely on the right track. kzbin.info/www/bejne/a2a8lmyciq-fsNk

[@elliotmlehman]

Thanks for making this. It's a little hard to find info about these. Do you think anything can be done about the problem of the play in the assembly when resting on the bridge that causes the strings to go out of tune?

[@cheapskate8656]

My pleasure. I think they can be fixed. A threaded washer at the back end of the tube (glued in place) should hold the tuner adjuster stable. I intend to fix them and make a video. Currently I am building an nylon string, electro, acoustic for the GGBO22 competition. Once thats finished I will fix the tuners.

[@elliotmlehman]

@@cheapskate8656 Great, I look forward to seeing it. I'm working on a headless multiscale design right now and I'm trying to figure out what direction to go with the tuning system... It's a tough decision.

[@cheapskate8656]

@@elliotmlehman Have you had a look at the tuners from MERA. Made in Ukraine so they might take a while to be delivered but the price seems fair and the quality seems pretty good as far as I can tell from pics.

[@yellowcat1310]

@@cheapskate8656 and that nylon string electric is a build i'll be watching. i just saw a vid yesterday by you about that. but i think i fell asleep and it played and went away. i'm glad you reminded me. funny thing is that i was just telling my grandson a couple days ago that i wanted to make an electric with nylon strings. (i love my classical guitar) hopefully you get things figured out on it so i can just copy yours. lol.

[@cheapskate8656]

@@yellowcat1310 LOL. The Electric nylon is progressing well. Will probably put the top on tomorrow and the neck is ready to go on, Mostly just a lot of little things and finishing.

[@RetroPlus]

They were so close to making this good, that's such a shame since these are very attractive at the price. But i suppose you get what you pay for. Lovely guitar by the way!

[@cheapskate8656]

Yes a shame and thank you. I did end up fixing them. If you are interested the video is here kzbin.info/www/bejne/a2a8lmyciq-fsNk

[@robinleebraun7739]

Too bad you couldn’t find a way to put a ball end on both ends of the string. Probably have to remove the nut end to do that every time you restring.

[@cheapskate8656]

Ended up fixing the tuners and I made a video of it. Sorry I took so long to reply. KZbin put your comment in quarantine.

[@hussainnaeem207]

great well explained

[@cheapskate8656]

Thank you Hussain

[@yellowcat1310]

maybe an eart bridge?

[@cheapskate8656]

Hi Yellow Cat. As far as I know eart bridges are fixed. The scale lengths I have used are not standard. They are cool bridges though.

[@yellowcat1310]

@@cheapskate8656 i think you're right.

[@Jaloja]

Headless hardware needs some time to sort out the wanna be just looks like what works to fail. A split collet would work but would be a pain to re sting.

[@cheapskate8656]

Yeah, I guess you get what you pay for. If your interested, I made another video where I fixed the tuners. kzbin.info/www/bejne/a2a8lmyciq-fsNk

[@Jaloja]

Thanks this is a continuing story of evolution. It will take a while for headless hardware to improve and become more mainstream.

[@cheapskate8656]

@@Jaloja Yes. Headless guitars make sense but people who buy guitars mostly just want to look like the bands/players they like. So, currently thats limited to heavy metal. Any way, I'm currently building a headless with a moveable pick up. After that I plan to make a headless acoustic, which will probably be fibreglass.

[@Jaloja]

I have a couple of really nice neck through's that are great to look at but weight a TON... Just as some can't get used to the idea of a headless for what ever reason I am getting to other side of mind set. Why put up with all the weight and length when its not a better sound and punishes you to play it? I am sure you get it and one day more will. You might want to look at carbon for that guitar. I spent many years of my life as a Aviation Composite Tech before retiring. Vacuum bagged and properly cured Carbon will be stiffer and more stable with less material. You may want to consider some Carbon Rods like EVH uses in the necks if you don't want to go full carbon. Read up on ply bias and layup layers to insure a stable part,

[@cheapskate8656]

@@Jaloja Thank you for the tips. I was a little concerned with the health risks of working with carbon and I have a heap of high quality fibre glass in the shed :) I will read up on the topics. Thank you