Heating your boat when it's actually cold - diesel heaters compared

[@AlluringArctic]

Hi everyone! This video is a little bit different compared to my previous ones, yes it's mostly just a talking head type of thing, but I think many of you will find it useful. If you're new here then please have a look at my other videos as well for more action! PS. A new "real" episode is coming up soon as well, please stay patient 😉

[@RoryL83]

This was EXACTLY what I've been researching!! Loved your content before this so we must think alike. Anyway, you answered a ton of my questions so thanks and I look forward to seeing more of your videos!

[@gerdontheboat]

Coild you also please give us a realistic idea of fuel consumption per av. day in regular use? Many people run them from the main tank, and cant rally tell because the only use them occasionally.

[@AlluringArctic]

@@gerdontheboat I use around 4-5 liters per day, running the 5,7 kW Refleks heater near minimum, I think I'm running it at around 1,5 kW most of the time. When I wake up I run it at full blast for a while. I really try to save on diesel though and I think most people would use more in these conditions. You can calculate your fuel usage approximately like this: 0,15 liters produces around 1 kWh of heat. You could also estimate your need by bringing in a electric heater (say a 2kW heater) and running it, then you'll get an idea of whether it's enough or not etc

[@gerdontheboat]

Concerning refleks heaters... In the Netherlands you the heatpol heaters are very popular, I think they are really refleks, and can often be found second hand at good prices. For example www.marktplaats.nl/q/heatpol/

[@paulmurphy8549]

Use kerosene instead of diesel for heater burns cleaner,less smoke less soot,plus it's same as airplane fuel doesn't freeze,it's also what that add to diesel to stop winter freezing at about 5% or more,depending where you are,it's airplane fuel,and used in most home heating systems as they can burn diesel or kerosene with change of nozzle,it's just cleaner,and less trouble

[@rockymnthodad3047]

so English is not likely your 'native' language, yet I've never listened to more articulate and accurate speech as this.. well done, information and all.!

[@AlluringArctic]

thanks a lot!

[@jimhilstad5227]

I live in Gibsons BC (one of the places you sailed by on your way to Alaska) I plumbed in a bus heater in my boat that used the cooling water from the engine. It worked very well. The big advantage is the while underway you get double the use from your fuel, both to run. The engine as well as heating the cabin. One side benefit is that it also aids in cooling your engine if that ever becomes an issue. By the way I really look forward to your video’s👍 you are very down to earth and practical. Thank you

[@Stephen-uz8dm]

Hey. I live on the Coast as well. Did installing the heater affect your insurance?

[@tunerrestorations]

That is a great way to do it. If your in very cold waters you don't need to worry about your heat exchanger freezing when using it that way.

[@user-sx4yu3nw4j]

This video is exactly what I was looking for. There’s more than enough videos of people showing how easy installation is, what I want to know is how the various systems stack up against each other. Thank you and well done!

[@Cudbeorht]

Thanks for this. Just purchased a Planar 2kw heater for my Moody 33. I'm not as far north as you (only at 55⁰) but also a live-aboard and need dry heat. I'm very encouraged by your experience...

[@richardsimms251]

Don’t you need a CO carbon monoxide detector too to avoid the very serious risk of Carbon Monoxide death. Great video. Thank you so much. CO carbon monoxide is different from CO2 carbon dioxide. I know that YOU know this ( but others may not ). Keep up your great presentations. RS. Canada

[@NickVass1000]

This is an excellent video explaining different types of heaters and installing heaters. Very straightforward info which is to the point without any naff music or pretty pictures. This is great because it shows heaters in use in a bloody cold sailing area. If it works in the Arctic in winter it will work fine in the Solent.

[@AlluringArctic]

Glad it was helpful!

[@edshuttleworth1549]

My Bride (married 54 years) insisted on adding heat to Dreamweaver (38') before we cruised up to Maine. I chose a Webasto forced hot water system. THE most difficult installation I have ever done! The system employs a burner, a tank for the water that will be circulated, hoses to link the various radiators and fans, each with it own switch through out the boat. Problems were limited to the hoses leaking at the radiators (anti freeze and teak do not play well together) The hoses just did not want to seal- answer permatex! Trying to get the right SS piping to expel the exhaust out the stern. Also suck up the amps. The up side was it works fabulously. I plumbed a radiator-fan into the head so showers were a delight. Our other problem was condensation on the hatches. I my humble opinion- if your vessel is not insulated- go south to warmer places

[@zerofox7347]

The Webasto heaters have been used in lorry cabs and RVs for years. I’ve been using them for 20 plus years and I can say I’ve never had any issues.

[@davidc6510]

Great summary on the various heaters and although long it was packed with a large amount of information. It is good to have two sources of heat in that extreme climate and the dry heat is really good as well. Those thermal fans are such a great idea. You must store a lot of diesel for the boat engine as well as heat. Well done again. Thanks for sharing and keep up the good work!

[@sabergolbaf1364]

You are a very practical sailer , some things I tried to become, but failed. I wish you luck .

[@EgilWar]

I had forced air diesel heaters in both my boats. They work really well and both also took advantage of the engine heat when the engine was running. The only caveat is that one fuel measuring system was based on a mechanical/electric system using a float in the tank while the other was purely electronic based upon fuel flow. With the first I would know how much fuel was in the tank while the latter it was a guessing game and when we went to refill the tank we would often see that the electronics thought there was much more fuel than actually. As such we were cautions to keep the tank full, or as much as practical, to avoid running out and having to tap into our emergency supply. Its amazing how much fuel you use on a cold night in Canada.

[@captainchristianguy3307]

Wow. What a great video! You sir have giant balls to sail that far up and I certainly respect you for that! I just bought a boat and was looking for a heater just to get to where it's warm. Either way I'm not going to put in garbage heater in my boat. And the heater has to work! Very informative!

[@man-with-handle]

Very interesting video with some very valid positives and negatives. I use a small Taylor's diesel heater which is now about 22 years old. It's very efficient, use very little fuel but a bit tricky to light and can also suffer from blow-back in a sudden gust of wind. It may well get changed for a Reflek's heater this year so as to provide additional heat to custom radiators and heating hot water. May also look at installing a Wallas system as well for backup.

[@asennaydenov6461]

Great summary, thank you! Few years back I did replace my Wallas 1700 with 5Kw Chinese air diesel heater. I’m quite impressed how stable is preforming. Never had any issues with weekend sailings around Sweden. If you think is good idea dive a try with Chinese one 8KW I mean just for fun and spare heat. Btw I absolutely love your videos combining my favourite two skiing and sailing!

[@mymobile5014]

There is no such thing as a 8Kw diesel heater, that's just typical Chinese exaggeration. The 8Kw are all 5Kw.

[@perryjones457]

We have been considering a diesel heater to extend our sailing season into colder months, but not winter. This was very good information. Thank you!

[@OmmerSyssel]

@@charonstyxferryman Insulation of traditional boats has to be considered carefully. It tends to cause condensation, with the amount of hidden corners in boats might be a precription for future desaster! Along with a correct used dehumidifier it could be a good idea...

[@marktanska6331]

I love your videos. They are good, but I'm also a Finn. I live in southern Australia. I have 52 foot Hartley with my brother. We do not have heater. Come and sail here to overcome heating problems, and also clothing. T shirt and shorts without shoes. Much better. Love you man.

[@marktanska6331]

@@danc2779 Only on Christmas eve. One day a year I can accept that. You are very brave. You eve worry about skiing all those mountains alone?

[@davidbroman8391]

Excellent presentation of how to heat a sailboat in winter. As a Finnish Canadian I had to laugh at your comment about it being hard to talk that much. Yes, that would have been 2 months worth for me. Can’t wait to see some more sailors and skiing! Cheers.

[@Karlosangeles1]

Another Finno-Canadian here out of Vancouver,BC...perkele...

[@TheFrancoisgendron]

This video is precise, clear and full of useful information. You might have forgotten to emphasize the importance of a CO detector and alarm in case of CO buildup. I live aboard my Grand Banks 42 near Vancouver and really enjoy the Espar 8 kw diesel heather. It is a bit oversized, a 5 kw would have been plenty but the previous owner had the habit of over killing everything. I am glad he had installed an impressive battery bank. I have 13 batteries on board plus a 8 kw Onan generator. Lots of power to run the Espar on cold nights at anchor.

[@Erndog67]

Great video. I drive a truck, which is where the webasto is primarily used. They are usually installed under the bunk and hot air is piped into the sleeper. Many times you will find a slot cut into the forced air tube under the bunk to heat that space also because if you don't, the air in that space is freezing and so is your bed.

[@OmmerSyssel]

Consider insulating your bed with woollen blankets, or better sheep or Rein Deerskin, and try a full size heating blanket, eventually with a timer. I always use this setup for years in the different unheated boats, cars and cabins i lived in Scandinavia. A truely pleasure with a warm and dry sleeping place :)

[@BitcoinNewsTodayLive]

Great video. Don't forget that marine air conditioners with the reverse cycle heat pump option (like the Domestic Turbo) is the one form of electric heat that is more efficient than all the others. I have two as well as a diesel and propane Dickinson and two wall mounted electric fan heaters. I still plan on installing two diesel air heaters at some point. No bus heater for me though, I have a raw water cooled engine. Fair winds!

[@makisp.1428]

Thank you for this additional information. Many heaters. May I ask how long is the boat that it requires all these different heaters?

[@BitcoinNewsTodayLive]

@@makisp.1428 37ft, Tayana Cutter

[@esquire9445]

I found this really helpful. It’s interesting how there are brands of heaters that are better than the normal stuff but they really don’t advertise.

[@AlluringArctic]

Yep not all of these are widely known at all. Thanks a lot1

[@johannesspurk9933]

Thanks for the video. I was thinking about heating on sail boats a lot recently and even though I'd only have to make it through the Australian winter, this was very helpful.

[@RoyClare]

Hi Juho, just subbed. Found your channel via your link on FB. Congratulations on some very interesting videos, beautifully produced. This one about the heating was most informative. I have used a charcoal-burning solid fuel heater in a boat in high latitudes when diesel supply was an issue. Charcoal is physically light weight and can be stored in small bags and tucked away in the corners of the boat that aren’t used for anything else. My current boat (a Fisher 25) has an Eberspacher that works very well as you describe. I like your idea of redirecting the ducting to warm up the engine space as my Yanmar Diesel engine has no glow-plug so cold starting can be an issue. Some 25 years ago I had a Wallas heater that I transferred from one boat to another and also proved very reliable. In around 15 years of ownership I only serviced the burner once! In a small camping-style day boat boat I have used a slow-burning ‘tea light’ candle under a ceramic or pottery dome ... typically an upended flower pot ... this device works surprisingly well, but as an open flame is involved it isn’t safe to leave alone and certainly not to use underway! I try to sail all through the year whenever my work permits. So it is inspiring to hear of your experiences in much higher latitudes than mine on the east coast of England. Good luck with your channel. Thanks for sharing your experiences. Roy

[@AlluringArctic]

Thanks for sharing your experiences!

[@Sunshinecoastphotography]

Fantastic! Greatly appreciate your insight and experience with heating a boat. I am interested in a type of diesel heater that also acts as a cooktop and I have only seen one or two of them in person, but it seems like the perfect thing for us. It is made by Wallas and until I learn more, I am still looking for an unobtrusive diesel heater. The smaller forced air unit looks like another excellent solution for us. Thanks for doing this!

[@makisp.1428]

"an unobtrusive diesel heater" well put!

[@woodroofguy]

Great video. Thanks! I am researching for a 1971 31’ Airstream trailer/caravan. I live only 10 kilometres from Dickinson Marine. Will be checking out their diesel heaters, for all the same reasons you pointed out. Happy sailing!

[@marccohen5579]

I have used the Espar (D5) for 25 years living aboard in New England USA year round. Keep it clean and it works great.

[@Beorninki]

Loistava video. Kiitos siitä ja lisää tällaista. Lämmittimet kiinnostavat kyllä.

[@paanikki]

In 2018 we had to replace the old Wallas 1600 heater in my friend´s yacht here in Finland. The burner itself, fuel pump, the combustion air fan and the fresh air fans still worked, but the electronics controlling the fans and pumps started to fail, and there were no spare circuit boards available for a 40 year old model. The heater was originally installed in 1983 or 84. So it "only" worked for 35 years or so, without major problems, with very little maintenance and service. I also had a warm relationship (and still have warm memories) with the Norwegian Refleks stove-type heaters from my childhood and youth. A stand-alone model, and also an insulated SV model that is used to heat the circulating water for radiators in the 11m (36ft) traditional wooden motorboat. The latter had to be ignited using a small amount of denatured ethanol. You had to drop the burning match in the burning chamber within a few seconds after the ethanol. Otherwise the ethanol evaporated and created an explosive fume in the burning chamber. I burnt my eyebrows a few times before learning the right technique. The air heaters are more convenient and better for drying up the yacht in really wet conditions, when people bring their wet gear inside the cabin all the time. The hot air heater helps to bring the humidity (and condensation) from dripping to a somewhat tolerable level pretty fast.

[@OmmerSyssel]

Refleks is still made in Denmark, not Norway ;)

[@captainheather]

Oh you gave me such a great idea hose clamping my fan to the diesel heater, I always have to choose between moving air and making tea but why didn’t I think of that before? Thank you!! Great videos, very inspiring!

[@AlluringArctic]

Yeah I especially recommend a fan at the ceiling! And you can get this hose clamp "band" which is open ended so you don't have to take apart the chimney to install it

[@anneli1735]

Love your going into this topic a lot - like others commented - and looking forward to your offering another deep dive❣️

[@UnforgettableSailing]

So nice to learn with you! Someday we will sail into the cold as well!!! Thanks for the episode

[@jamesmead7005]

Thanks so much for producing this video - it's packed with useful information!

[@jeffsteinmetz7188]

Good content and clear presentation of details. Concerning the engine heat I think an integrated hydronic system would be optimal. Hydronic systems can be heated by electric shore power, engine coolant heat exchanger, and be heated by a diesel furnace. I am happy with my Eberspacher hydronic system provided by Rixen’s Enterprises. Rixen’s is a USA company, but I am sure Eberspacher has integrators in Scandinavia. These are not cheap systems, but I think the triple option of heat/energy sources in one system is compelling. All the best!

[@jimsaranna9011]

Thank you that was really interesting and I have to tell you this I am living onboard and I find that an oil filled radiator is fine for my needs. Now the boat next to me has just finished installing the heating system that you spoke about first he has cut an exhaust only a few inches above the water line and it is just an elbow no more that 6 or 7 inches from the main heater and oppersite my hull !!! He has no silencer at all. He comes down every Sunday with his friends and they sit onboard drinking coffee and eating dougnuts luckily he only put the heater in last week and has not run it yet I have saved the video you made so that said I will give him the video to watch before I quickly untie my lines and head out Sunday. So once again thank you for the information you have probably save me and my boat from a bad day. Take care my friend and I shall look forward to hearing more about your travels. Jim

[@AlluringArctic]

hahah thanks and hope that you'll get along with your boat neighbor! :D

[@Tenright77]

SV Basic, installed two of the electric diesel, forced air, chinesium heaters in their catamaran... Thanks for your review AA...

[@davidsongraham]

right video at the right time for me as i am considering what heating to instal in my barge and whileit does not heal and i want hot water on tap it is a brilliant introduction to some of the obvious options. thank you.

[@stevesimonsgaard973]

That was terrific. I was curious about how you stay warm. We need more videos please.

[@dn52n56]

your video was really great and informative. you have answered a lot of questions on using heaters. I live on a 30ft power boat and will use the diesel heaters.

[@pottery1950]

Very well thought out and presented description of heating options. Thanks!

[@ottobhan725]

You gave us well reasoned articulate and succinct clarity in the best way. Muchas kudos señor.

[@jimmysqueezyronin5623]

Thanks very useful info and helpful to me trying to decide what heating system in my boat

[@deborahgordon8387]

Thank you for sharing the information on your different heating sources . This is very helpful for me 👍

[@AlluringArctic]

thank you deborah, glad it was helpful!

[@qt35732]

Just found your channel, and really enjoyed all so far. This part with some tech and +/- was nice too. And I’d definitely like to hear the details about how the run the burner in the best way. Keep on posting!

[@Jurflip2]

Excellent summary of heating systems. I have had experience with most of them (diesel, paraffin and gas forced air systems), a Dickinson stove on a previous boat and an engine system on my current boat, in addition to an Eberspächer forced air heater. I have not had any experience with a diesel burning central heating system though. Just a comment: a separate, forced air heating system in the bathroom is great. Even in mild temperatures, heating up the bathroom before a shower is great. It can also be used to dry wet clothing or washing. I have a Wallas 1300 for that purpose.

[@MrMemoistanbul]

Best video about heaters..i watched over 50 videos before and read million pages ..congratilation and thanks

[@AlluringArctic]

Wow, thanks!

[@JamesJackson-jv4pf]

I enjoyed this, thanks. Good to learn more about these different heating systems, and I would be interested to learn more about how the Reflex operates. Cheers

[@SpencerHammond-v1q]

Watching this long after you posted this, just hoping my feedback can be useful to you anyway. I found this 38.5minutes was packed full of more beneficial information on boat heating than I've been able to collect after about 8 hours of hunting. Brilliant that you shared this. Given your experience, I would like to hear your thoughts on small solid fuel heating. Something that could be fueled with wood or combustible waste paper, cardboard, wood. Sailing the Pacific NW, seems it might be useful if the soot and ash are manageable. The install must be challenging, and heat distribution limited.

[@simon2samuel]

I would love an indeep presemtation of the oil burner heater, thank you! Also the aspects of using it on a non-insulated boat as mine, for sailing in scandinavian waters. Thank’s for a very well performed and informative video, it was really great! Simon

[@OmmerSyssel]

Certain issues are irrelevant and can't be done much about.. Boat's are boats and made for sailing.

[@elizabethwinsor-strumpetqueen]

yes please for the in depth reflex heater video ...thank younger all the useful information in this one too

[@theislandpackrat]

Great video! just a note if you pour in about two tablespoons of Methyl hydrate too light the stove, stops all the soot buildup and makes lighting real easy! I use it on any diesel stove I've had! Iv'e had them all.

[@AlluringArctic]

I use denatured alcohol for lighting up the stove, I think it's probably pretty close to what you're using, works very well! In addition I use a "soot removing cube" every couple weeks, I don't really know what they're called in English and what would be a comparable item in the English speaking region, but in Europe we have these: www.ebay.de/itm/TILL-Russfrei-Kombi-Wuerfel-10x-8-80-Stueck-Entrusser-Russreiniger-Olofen-Kaminofen-/202540313562 They are REALLY amazing, drop one inside when the stove is hot and it gets the whole burn chamber so clean that you can see the metal.

[@geneallen5758]

I'm late to this discussion, but here's some useful info about lighting a diesel heater. Mine is a Dickinson heater. To light: 1) turn on the fuel regulator and the fan, 2) squirt about a tablespoon of barbecue charcoal lighter fluid into the burner, 3) light and insert a propane torch deep into the burner for a few seconds until the lighter fluid catches, 4) remove torch, close the window and you're done. The lighter fluid isn't so combustable that it flares up and is enough flame to get the diesel burning and vaporizing. This has been a reliable, clean and fast way of lighting the heater I've used for 25 years. One warning, no mater how you light it, if it doesn't stay lit on the first try, don't retry until the burner has cooled and vented with the fan--there could be combustable vapor accumulate that will cause a little explosion on your next relight.

[@marcwouters6059]

Very intresting heating stuff !!! Usually it's about cooling in the tropics , I don't know why ??? The same 2 diesel heating systems are used on a Garcia Exploration . At the customer's request , somtimes a Kimberly wood stove . This wood stove with secondary combustion is very eficient and smal in size . The wood stove supplies 12Kw/h and with 3 blocks of pressed saw dust you heat 24h . A nice alternative if you fall without diesel and available in every Brico (etc) for +- 4€ .

[@AlluringArctic]

Interesting, I'll have a look at that Kimberly, I've had a look at few solid fuel stoves but haven't been convinced

[@marcwouters6059]

@@AlluringArctic You will find many youtube videos about the use of the Kimberly wood stove in camping cars , boats and small houses !!!

[@JimDory]

@@AlluringArctic I'm about to launch (perhaps this summer) a 30' catamaran in NW Alaska and considering what kind of heat. Not a lot of room, no diesel engine - using gas outboards. So was looking at the Dickson solid fuel heater, but haven't heard any opinions on its practicality. Have you looked at that one, and could you enlighten as to not being convinced in general? thx!

[@OmmerSyssel]

12 kW/h is way overkill... This size of boat needs something between 2-3 max 5kW/h. Efficient = max level of burning is essential on any burner/heat source.

[@thylacine1962]

Excellent summary. You put a lot of practical thought I to this video. Well done. Yes to a video covering the refleks heater. Looking forward to that. Cheers. Safe sailing.

[@smaarch1]

Thanks for the informative video. I have finally gathered all the bits and pieces to install by Taylor diesel heater. Just have to finalize the location and find the courage to drill a big hole in the deck. It will be gravity fed

[@johnhayford5946]

Bit of an expert on the forced air versions having fitted and re-fitted one on my boat. Firstly I made all the usual mistakes, no insulation on ducting, used air from aft locker etc. Refitted it a few years later this time. Insulated all the ducting inside and out. Added more outlets to get rid of cold spots. Fitted a Y valve on the air input to allow air from outside or re-cycled from the aft cabin. I added a separate isolated air inlet to avoid the aft locker smells and the risk of exhaust gas leaks. The re-cycled air made a massive difference to the diesel consumption, and the leaky Y valve lets in enough fresh as it's poorly sealed. In the end I ended up insulating the inside of the boat with high density closed cell foam. A massive job but well worth it. The wife is now very cost, she likes it a cosy 23C, easy even with -5-10c outside. The added insulation allows us to switch the heat off overnight and not freeze. I also added a timer/remote control so I can switch it on remotely that way we do not arrive to a cold damp boat. There was one downside the 5K heater is now too powerful, and only runs at minimum most of the time resulting is it sooting up. It now needs a good blast at full power before shutting down to blow the soot out. Having said that with it running at minimum it's almost silent and very cheap to run.

[@AlluringArctic]

hey john! sounds exactly like my earlier experience :D I've now installed 2 forced air heaters. The 2kw heater is usually plenty for smaller boats!

[@johnhayford5946]

Our boat is 42ft, it did need the 5kw, but with all the mods I guess 2kw would do for northern Europe.

[@robertmcnair35]

good content i understood all, but i will say i have a Chinese diesel heater forced air type and it has run for two years with no problems. but your right make them work from time to time to keep them clean

[@deislanddave]

Pretty well done. A few comments based on my experience, including professional experience as a naval architect. Diesel fuel in the US is not as clean as that in the EU. We see more carbon build up in combustion chambers as a result. Run a gallon (4l) kerosene (K-1) as heater fuel once or twice a season to help keep the chamber clean and avoid signficant maintenance costs. In my opinion on small boats having the heater and water heater in the engine compartment is good for winter liveaboards. It means a core of warm space in the boat and reduces the chance of expensive freezing. Be very careful with exhaust routing. Dips in the exhaust lead to pooling of sulfuric acid from exhaust condensation that eats through the tubing. Read the installation manual, even if you pay for installation to be be sure it is done properly. Bringing outside air in either directly or from an external locker means drier air blown into the cabin and therefore less condensation. You should have a heat outlet in the heads and I recommend locating the outlet so you can blow warm air on the toilet seat. The video did not talk about hydronic heaters. They are an option. I don't like them as the maintenance is significantly higher and warming the boat takes longer. The pluses are keeping the engine warm and domestic water heating.

[@AlluringArctic]

Thanks a lot Dave, I agree with everything you said! I think personally I'm not at the risk of freezing the engine because my boat is always in ice-free water, so essentially the water heats the engine compartment (which is quite well soundproofed -> insulated), if you're frozen in then I'd be more worried. Hot water heater I'd definitely need to have in the engine compartment or other warm space, if it was in an outside locker it'd freeze (if I for some reason didn't have warm water in there all the time). This is something that is a problem in many boats that plan to cruise in actual winter conditions (hot water heaters are often installed in outside lockers). I have a outlet in the heads and it's very useful when we use the heads as a shower space or drying very wet clothes! Hydronic heaters are an option but I agree with you there, for me they're too complex and use too much electricity, they are also pricier etc...

[@manfredschmalbach9023]

Diesel for road use is sulfur free in Europe these days, so with pump station diesel no more acid problems of the exhausts. The red dyed extra light oil though still has some residue of sulfur content. The hydronics are, in terms of maintenance, not much worse that the aironics like You already have one, they might take even more electricity though because they need an additional waterpump to the burning-air pump (however no hot-air distribution pump ...). I once built an hydronic central heating for a circus wagon ... didn't work out well, they aren't made for longterm use, meant for a 20 to 40 minutes quick heat of a car or truck coolant system, not for burning days or weeks nonstop. (pump station car-) diesel Refleks with water sleeve is definitely the way to go should You want additional warm water with long term cabin heating "off grid". Despite the fuel-preparation and fuel-quality problems a log burner with a water sleeve could actually work out fine, as long as You are longterm alongside and not out on a roadstead. Sailing and log-fire doesn't go together I'm afraid however.

[@deislanddave]

@@manfredschmalbach9023 Hydronic heaters have greater power draw not only because of the coolant pump because of all the radiator fans. The maintenance--in addition to the combustion unit shared with air heaters--includes all the hose clamps on all coolant hoses (much more work than you'd think), tracking down leaks (more than usual due to thermal cycling), and periodically changing the coolant. It turns out to be a lot. In exchange you get domestic hot water and the main engine stays quite warm. Choices. I prefer the relative simplicity and faster warm-up time of air heat but I certainly see the appeal of hydronic heat.

[@manfredschmalbach9023]

@@deislanddave I'm at home (Northern Alps) where hydronics are used in numbers, and we upgraded quite some engine controlled hydronic support heaters (lots of TDIs and CDIs have them) into _real_ independent park heaters with timer and remote control. They are a pain in the ass as long as there's "automatic controlling" and You can't control every single function Yourself, crappydicrap to say the least, because You gotta use 'em once a fortnight no matter summer or winter, and You gotta use 'em full power before shutting down every friggin' time, otherwise the glow plugs suffer from soot, the starting gets worse and worse, and the burning process doesn't work properly the first 5 to 10 minutes anyway with all "-dronic" etsy petsy modern modern playthings: too much tryin' to regulate smoke and exhaust contents. You gotta have a less overcontrolled , "analog" burner like the Refleks for longterm use and longterm low maintenance. Cheers!

[@OmmerSyssel]

@@manfredschmalbach9023 Rumours among experienced seamen says the Refleks diesel can run out of control, therefore has to be well maintained and kept an eye on. What exactly causing this issue, no one tells ...

[@casperholst1757]

Details and experience on the Refleks would be very useful. Looking at fitting one with backboiler on a 12m aluminium boat aimed at higher latitudes and ski touring. Best Casper

[@waderogers]

A good video regarding heating methods onboard. Living in Alaska, I too have a couple of heating options. I don't live aboard but I do sail my Catalina during the early spring when night time temps are around 40F. I have a Dickinson Newport diesel heater that's connected to a 5 gallon tank and a small impulse pump that moves the diesel from the tank to the heater. I love the radiant heat and have a fan at ceiling level above the heater to blow the hot air back down. It also has a 'draft assist' fan built in so that if the wind is blowing 20 knots or more, it helps the exhaust to draft out the exhaust in the cabin roof. I use it mostly at night while sleeping so that the cabin is warm when I wake up. Usually here, once the sun comes up, temps in the spring will get close to 55-60F. I can get about 7-10 days off 5 gallons of diesel and my solar panels keep recharging the batteries so the small pump doesn't cause a problem. I'll also use it while motoring since I can't use this heater while the boat is heeled over. Also, while in the harbor here in town, all winter I run a small electric heater, to keep the interior temp around 55. This heated, moving air keeps down the moisture content and prevents any condensation and mold from forming. It also keeps the boat heated so that even in the dead of winter, which is when I do interior work, the boat is heated when I go down to the harbor to do some work. Usually in the spring/summer/fall, it only runs a bit at night until the sun comes up. I might also mention the propane Dickinson Newport heater doesn't put out the same amount of heat that the diesel model does but it is a cleaner exhaust so there's always a trade off. Thanks for the informative video and it's good to see you again!

[@AlluringArctic]

Thanks once again Wade! 😃 I should have probably talked more about condensation etc., because I feel that's actually in some ways a more important topic than heat. If you're dry then you'll never be cold.. but if the boat is wet... that sucks!

[@dnswhh7382]

Alluring Arctic Very informative video, thank you! And right, I was just about to ask you for condensation and how you deal with it. Esp. under these circumstances I would expect almost all corners and walls getting wet, and all clothes and goods close to them as well. And then the mold comes, or does it not ?

[@waderogers]

@@dnswhh7382 The diesel heater he uses, and shows in the video, does much to dry to boat out since it pulls the air out of the interior of the boat for combustion, then heats it and exhausts it outside. Plus, the fans move the air around and that reduces condensation. In my boat here in Alaska, if I don't run the heater at night when it's 50f or below, I get condensation but within a couple of hours of running the heater in the morning, the moisture is gone.

[@dnswhh7382]

Wade Rogers Thank you, I can imagine the moisture is gone concerning the air, but my point is more about condensation e.g. at the inside of the hull or within cold cupboards, where the warm air doesn‘t really get to, but the moisture from breathing etc. usually does. Or is this scenario not an issue? I heard similar complains also from motorhomes, which are by far not that much exposed to cold weather and icewater nearby than a yacht in the artic sea

[@waderogers]

@@dnswhh7382 I get a bit of condensation in my engine compartment but that runs into the bilge so that's not an issue. As for cupboards, I don't get much condensation there either in part because the diesel heater sucks the interior air into its combustion chamber and them uses it for the flame and then exhausts to the outside.

[@flippatmedbernt]

Great talk on heaters pros and cons. Would like even a more on the Dickinson Reflex diesel. Thanks a lot !

[@kevgermany]

Thanks. Really useful. Would love to see the Reflex heater follow up.

[@camielkotte]

That is some very informative and educational material. Invaluable. Thanks. I saved this one for later rewatching.

[@dustinholman9487]

Thanks for a detailed walkthrough of your heating systems. I'd love to learn more about the Refleks heater. I'm planning to do some trips in northern latitudes soon, and am trying to figure out what I should get.

[@IrregularPineapples]

In winter conditions you absolutely need a forced air heater it's the only thing that will get rid of condensation and completely dry out the boat. Refleks heater stoves and similar are unable to do that during winter conditions and you will have an awful time.

[@FloatingIdeasonanarrowboat]

As I had some plumbing leaks on my boat, I got a dehumidifier. I calculated it gives out about 150% heat for the electricity used. 50% is released by the condensing water. I also got a little halogen stove last year. It has 400W & 800W settings. Great to warm your legs in the morning. On bright days I can run either one from solar.

[@michaelwoernle378]

On my 12 m motorboat I had an Eberspächer diesel heater not for ducted air but warm water (with antifreeze). Ducting is easier, with 1/2 in copper tubing, but of course radiators must be installed. My system was connected with the engine cooling. On another boat I had a Reflex, which I liked much, first with the yacht style chimney cap. In strong winds sometimes backdraught occured, even with sort of an explosion in the oven blowing black smoke into the cabin. So I replaced it with an H type. Another "minus" of the Eberspächer with side exhaust: noise for neighbors, and melting fenders.

[@iancameron3970]

For forced air heaters, ensure that the wiring is at least 12 gauge. Otherwise the power-hungry glow plug may not ignite. Enjoy your channel. Thank you.

[@thomaspoussin8663]

Great video. The best I've seen about this subject.

[@AlluringArctic]

thanks a lot thomas! hope it was useful!

[@sharkamov]

Juho; You're definitely a _'natural born'_ KZbinr, this particular video was nothing short of _brilliant! . . . _ ⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐⭐😉👌

[@makisp.1428]

Thank you for this very informative video. I'm debating entering the sailing lifestyle. And I would want both air-conditioning and heating. I'm amazed how few KZbinrs address the air-conditioning of the boat. And even fewer address the heating. Also, I don't see much on insulating the boat.

[@Coyotehello]

Nice video well done too! I am glad you mentioned the engine heating system, we call it 'red dot' for some reasons here in Canada. Regarding the diesel drip stove, I inspected a boat that used the 'radiator' option very cleverly and simply, I thought. It ran an engine hot water hose SAE J2006 or UL 1129 in Europe inside the hanging lockers and behind the bookshelves and in storage where heat was beneficial, just enough heat provided in these closed compartments to kill humidity! No more book getting moldy, no more clothe getting smelly! This ran off a 'Y' fitting with a seacock that could be closed to allow the engine to warm up quickly. I discourage electric heaters, as dangerous. Most people do not understand or care to understand electricity. Power = Voltage x Current, or Amp = Watts/Volts. Ohm law, those electric heaters will quickly overwhelm a shore power connection and cause a fire. Cheers! And thanks for the great video.

[@euanmckenzie2029]

I have a SIG100 drip feed diesel heater. really good and simple and can be fitted on the bulkhead in the same location as yours on my HR Rasmus. Just ordered another stove fan whilst watching you. Thanks for that tip!

[@santamulligan676]

Euan McKenzie these look good

[@daleanderson1727]

Informative and straight forward as well as being pragmatic, great job. I am quite envious of your peltier fans and will now go looking to find some for myself.

[@vraymond108]

Informative, thorough and well done. Good job!

[@paulphillips82]

I installed a Dickinson Alaska heater on my 34-foot boat. The boat is well-insulated and I was able locate the heater centrally and low. I found that it was just too warm for the boat. This is in the Pacific NW where winters are not very cold, mostly not below freezing. I found that I had to leave the hatch open to keep the boat from being over-heated. So I cast about and came up with a Refleks heater, their smallest. The sizing of this is much better for a small boat. It's really good, but the smallest of them does not come with a port or window for easy lighting; that is the downside. But I have been able to get it lighted easily enough most of the time. I use a video inspection device to look down into the heater to see that oil is coming in, then I turn off the oil, drop in the alcohol, and then a match. It would be much better if I drilled a little port in the side, so I could light it directly with a lighter. Before I got this new heater, I visited the Dickenson company in BC, I spoke with a lady there and suggested they make a heater that is smaller, but she said the company would have no interest in hearing from their customers about this or anything else.

[@c.n.9074]

Thank You for taking the time to explain this. I bought a Webasto but haven't gotten to install it yet in the refit.

[@AlluringArctic]

thanks! installing a webasto is not a quick task, especially if you have to run all the ducting etc

[@c.n.9074]

I'm thinking of having the heated air enter the main cabin straight from the heater and run ducting for the heater intake air to the forward cabin. This way I wouldn't have to insulate the ducting and could use cheap clothes dryer type flexible ducting. Do you think this would work?

[@Scramasax]

We have a Wallas Spartan that I installed last summer. Compared to the Webasto we had in the past, the biggest advantage is that it is way less noisy and consumes way less electricity. I also like the fact that you can use your cell phone as a remote control for it as standard. Is it worth the money then? That can everybody decide them selves. Some have installed used EGR-coolers from cars to forced air heaters with unprotected exhaust pipes, like Webastos. In that way you can collect the otherwise lost heat from the exhaust and crank up the efficiency remarkably.

[@AlluringArctic]

That's a good idea with the car coolers! Yeah, Wallas and Safire both use less electricity than the truck heaters. One of those would probably be my choice as well.

[@jamesmason7124]

Hello from the high desert of New Mexico USA 🇺🇸. I just found your channel and I liked and subscribed. I don't have a boat anymore but I do live in my 1967 GM TDH-4519 city transit bus full-time and I was thinking about a diesel drip stove in addition to two diesel air heaters and a hydronic heating system. I would love to watch a longer more detailed video about your drip stove. Thank you for sharing your experience and your thoughts with us. Keep up the good work and stay safe

[@adam8642]

Great video and very useful. Has put me on the hunt for a small self contained system that will allow me to spend the odd night in the boat and not be foundered

[@Corsariorubio]

Thanks for a bunch of information. Guess I will try to get myself a drip feed stove in my little polca 28 soon enough. Fair winds and following seas my friend:)

[@SalingSamantas]

Most informative video I've found so far on the subject.

[@puresnowuk]

Really helped us decide on which heating to get, thank you.

[@Grandliseur]

Amazing you choose to live on the boat during winter. How you can do this is beyond my ability. Preparing food and drink must be difficult as well as keeping enough provisions on hand without all the appliances found in houses / apartments. About heating: it is claimed that kerosene is a lot less stinky than diesel when used for heating. I just checked the liter price in Norway, and Kerosene is also a lot cheaper. I know it would require an extra tank, but wouldn't it be worth it! Check the price yourself. (Your diesel heaters may even be able to convert easily, just check with the manufacturers first)

[@AlluringArctic]

thanks for the tip! the diesel stove actually does not smell at all. BUT I didn't know that about the price of kerosene, I have to look into that! I do know that kerosene burns cleaner... the Refleks stoves can burn kerosene, you just need to adjust the regulator. I'll certainly look into that!

[@staxter6]

Just joined you, very informative, thank you. Now to binge watch all your adventures....

[@ajbosin]

Hey I wanted to say thank you again for sharing your awesome adventure I saw you uploaded the vid and was actually overwhelmed with excitement which sounds kinda Corny coming from my mind haha but figured id let you know and I know this channel will explode I bet rather quickly keep them up they are quality indeed.

[@AlluringArctic]

I'm glad to hear that, thanks a lot! 😁

[@Dan_C604]

Hello, i just stumbled upon your channel, very interesting! Love your cruising areas! Cheers from Canada.

[@FredSmeaton]

Very good presentation. Look forward to a detailed video on the refleks stove😀.

[@dae8864]

Really nice walktrue with the pros and cons 👍

[@JimKJeffries]

Awesome information thank you for sharing your experiences. There is no such thing as 100% efficiency. Electric heaters can get close. When electric heaters have oil filling this is primarily to reduce the risk of fire. The oil is slow to warm, and slow to cool, so no real gain there. However because of this they do best when left on and able to run for long periods (most likely not possible on a boat). Just wanted to share the perspective of one who use to involved with the manufacturing of electric heaters. Have a beautiful week.

[@AlluringArctic]

I don't know what you mean with the efficiency, with electric resistance heaters all of the incoming electric energy gets converted into heat. If it doesn't get converted into heat then where does it go? 🤔 Only a small small fraction gets used to run the fan (if there is one).

[@JimKJeffries]

@@AlluringArctic, first, you are wonderful & I enjoy being able to see part of your adventures. Thanks for making the time to film & sharing. There are numerous resistive moments: the wire carrying the electrons in, the element, what the element is made from, circuit boards, and fans, connections (a classic choke point) between the power source, switch, wire, circuit board, etc... Each one of all these incredible small loads, just keeps adding up. So we get efficiencies: that most companies admit to as well, in the 90's. Some are in the high 90's, while other junk can be down in the 70's. The gold standard that is reached for, hopefully, is 100%. The dream (that would change our current understanding of science), is to get more than 100% out, but so far this has always been impossible.

[@AlluringArctic]

Yes but these inefficiencies in circuit boards, wiring etc create thermal energy just the same way as the resistive heating element itself. Energy doesn't disappear

[@JimKJeffries]

@@AlluringArctic true, energy is neither created or destroyed. Yes, resistance makes heat. However it is in the wrong places, behind cord insulation, etc...not enough to heat your space but enough to lower the efficiency. What about the energy that goes to create magnetic fields? What about the energy that turns into light? Lots of small moments, but they do add up. Happy Tuesday sir, fair winds.

[@Mark-jp9dz]

Diesel air heater is a good solution for monohulls, but not for a catamaran. (Unless you install one in each hull!) A better solution for a catamaran is a diesel water heater, which pumps hot water around the boat in small hose pipes (which makes running the pipes much easier). Small matrix heaters are then needed where you want the heat. These are similar to car heaters, where you need an electric fan to blow the heat from the matrix heater. My installation has separate thermostats for each matrix heater. I also have a heated towel rail. Another benefit is that you can connect an immersion heater in the circuit. One thing you do need to look out for is the estimated life. If you are living onboard you can quickly add up the hours.

[@philipdonegan9716]

Thank you for this. Very informative and well presented.

[@fransdriesen1311]

Very well narrated ... Love the content and the "hands on" experience you shared...Well done.....

[@hansramlv9779]

Very useful and interesting video. I very much like you attitude and reasoning about heaters.

[@bchdsailor]

Reflex is the number 1 choice for diesel heater aboard a vessel, either leisure or professional use

[@michaelbundy3867]

Thanks, more to think about. Your pro,s and cons very useful.

[@olavthyvold2288]

Thanks!. Very informative video from a person who's living it.

[@SailingVesselPrism]

We just did a similar talk on our podcast. Same conclusions for us as well. We never had a drip diesel heater but instead a solid fuel bulkhead heater. On the east coast USA the cold weather is generally coupled with lots of wind and making a fire was extremely difficult without having down draft issues with winds over 20knts. We did a proper install with one of the Chinese units and used all epar marine parts for the exhaust as well as armorflex for duct insulation with the idea if we liked it we could always swap the unit out with the genuine espar later and keep the cheap unit as a spare. So far we love having on demand heat, today is a perfect example of lots of wind outside, too much for our old heater but the forced air is keeping the inside toasty. Plus having heat now underway is a huge, if not one of the biggest upgrades we have ever done. Great video.

[@AlluringArctic]

Thanks , yes I've heard that some people have used the Chinese heaters very successfully. I think most problems that people have with those are because of bad installation. They are so cheap that it would also be an option to just simply carry a spare one. I didn't discuss solid fuel heaters at all, for me the main problem is the fact that you have to carry and store all that wood/coal somewhere, and the energy density of solid fuel is just not good enough. And over here it's not possible to collect wood yourself (there's no trees and in winter all the possible driftwood is of course covered by snow), so you'd have to buy it. It'd end up being more expensive than diesel...

[@AlluringArctic]

I can imagine lighting a wood stove in 20 kts plus could be a problem... the Refleks runs just fine in 40 knot gusts, but the key there is a tall enough chimney and the H cap I think.. 🤔

[@leaveonlywake]

@@AlluringArctic As a 15+ year full time liveaboard on US east coast, I have tried all manners of heaters over the years. Most recently I used a Cubic Mini wood stove for a couple of years, and had a stack that looks like it is as tall as yours, and never had problems with drawing / downdrafting / backdrafting due to wind. IIRC, the manufacturer recommended at least 4' of exhaust stack. It worked pretty well but was very frequently "hungry", needing more wood. :) It was topped with a circular Charlie Noble. I have switched to one of the cheap Chinese diesel forced-air heaters this winter and it is by far the best thing I have tried yet. As you suggest, it is cheap enough that if I was traveling (especially N!), I would just carry a spare unit. So far I have only temporarily mounted it, am trying to find the best place to have a longish run of exhaust pipe to aid in heating cabin, because it gets so hot - hate to pump that heat out of the boat without using it if possible! Yes - CO/CO2 monitors are aboard and tested regularly. I may also try to wrap the exhaust pipe with copper tubing which I could pump water thru, for use as an on-demand shower. :) My particular heater runs at full speed/high heat briefly both when starting and when shutting down. This cycling is supposed to take care of any carbon buildup that may cause problems. Enjoying your videos, "Subbed" a few weeks go. Nicely done!!! Kurt & Crewdog Barque - I36 "Melelani" sailfar.net | plasticclassicforum.com

[@theislandpackrat]

Prism whats happened with your video's been two years since any?

[@canyonhaverfield2201]

Juho...super job outlining in-out's per style of heater. I totally relate to your outcome- exhaustion! Funny..its not like 2hrs of splitting wood but yeah.tons of yak-yak & focus...you did a super job outlining & demo'n functions. My own boat is sitting over 4 tires..yes, its a '01 ford econoline camper..ive rebuilt an interior to closely resemble a sailboats. Lived in,driven, cooked daily since acquisition in 04. My heat sources...my warm personality (ha) + propane stove at meal making sessions + shore powered AC heater much like the one you held..+ a TinyTot woodstove by the Fatsco company in Michigan, US. . Again, coming to Cali..get in contact..im in Monterey..I'll serve as your tour guide 🌲

[@AlluringArctic]

thanks a lot!!

[@carlosrosa1965]

Really informative for me with my limited knowledge and experience, many thanks

[@gr8scotch]

Great video, thanks very much some great info and tips to help compare. Brought our first boat 29.5ft and with winter approaching need a heating solution don't think can fit a stove anywhere but think Planar is looking like a great possibility.