Henry Wirz: The Only Confederate Officer to Be Executed for War Crimes After the American Civil War

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[@matthewlentz2894]

I think Wirz was at least guilty of gross negligence. There was a Confederate POW camp at Cahaba, Alabama which was even more overcrowded than Andersonville but had a death rate of only 2%, largely thanks to an exceptionally humane commandant.

[@ZeoViolet]

How rotten was his chain of command above him directly? Don't get me wrong; I think the same; he was negligent. But it IS recorded that he at least tried to get more rations and we know how _that_ turned out. His superiors were probably at best, apathetic to the whole situation and worse, probably enjoyed a "hunting trip" or two. >:(

[@matthewlentz2894]

@@ZeoViolet I know that his top superior, General Winder, was a fairly scummy character. If he hadn't died before the war ended, I have a hunch he would have gotten some of the blame.

[@ZeoViolet]

@@matthewlentz2894 Thanks; you gave me a new name to look up. :) (Probably would have been a General Windbag or something...)

[@matthewlentz2894]

@@ZeoViolet General Windbag would be General John Pope.

[@somethinglikethat2176]

A 2% mortality rate probably wasn't that much higher than the background rate.

[@michaelstoughii1920]

I was just at Andersonville at the end of October, so this is fresh in my memory. Finally made the trip to visit my great, great, great uncle's grave. He died at Andersonville on April 2, 1864. I would say there are a lot of factors involved regarding the state of things there, making it a challenge to point fingers at any one person for the conditions which existed. All I can say, is a lot is owed to Dorence Atwater, the Union soldier who kept a secret record of almost all those who died there, so that when he and Clara Barton returned after the war, people like my uncle were able to be properly identified. Thank you Simon & Co. for telling the story.

[@rileyfair5]

You should visit Camp Douglas

[@ericwilliams8475]

It was hellish there I remember it well

[@UIgnorantprick]

Every war that was fought during the civil war was within 20 miles of the railroad tracks where union soldier's could gain their edge! The Union was championed by the northern railroad!

[@Concussed1.]

I’m u up

[@lizc6393]

As someone who's actual father figure was her uncle, I'm very glad your (great, etc...) uncle's memory and dignity in death were preserved via efforts of great heroism. Asian cultures would see you as an excellent descendant.

[@danwoods5105]

My Great Great Grandfather Newell Burch was a POW captured at Gettysburg, and was the longest held POW on either side during that war. He was employed as a POW nurse. He kept a detailed diary (now published) that listed each person who died, how they died, and where they were buried. At that time, any POW with paper was an instant death sentence. His diary helped convict Wirz, and led to the repatriation of the POWs bodies back to their homes after the War ended.

[@David-wk6md]

Thank Dan.

[@johnpenn8444]

Here is the key difference between Andersonville and northern camps like the one near Chicago: southern commissaries had nothing to give their prisoners, due to the constraints placed upon them by the strangulating tactics employed by the north. The north refused to care for the prisoners it took simply out of malice. There is nothing you can say to change this simple fact.

[@craven5328]

Fascinating! I hope your great great grandfather had a much easier life after the war.

[@RunnWScissors]

@@johnpenn8444didn’t the video literally just say that they COULD have made food but the Confederates were nervous about it? Also food wasn’t the sole issue you Dixie-lover

[@johnpenn8444]

@@RunnWScissors the video is WRONG. Plain fact: south didn’t have food for its own soldiers or women and children at home, let alone prisoners. North had more than enough food for its populace, army, and any captured prisoners. So, logically, starving Union soldiers is the result of lack of resources, and starving confederate prisoners are the result of MALICE AND NEGLECT. Get bent, Yankee-boy. Hopefully one of my 8 grandads got one of yours…

[@2010rls]

There is a mistake regarding the Battle of Antietam. The casualties were 23,000 killed, wounded, missing, and prisoners for the battle, not 23,000 deaths. People keep confusing the word casualty for killed/death. The total number of deaths for the battle was about 3,800.

[@brianfrederico6245]

As soon as I heard that figure I scrolled down to find a comment correcting it. Glad someone also caught that error. 23,000 dead is Battle of the Somme Day 1 figures. Civil War was bad, but not that bad.

[@jeffreymcneal1507]

Thank you for the clarification. I have been frequently confused by the use of the word "casualty." This helps to make sense of what happened.

[@Ryanbmc4]

A casualty is an injury that takes someone out of the fight, but isn't necessarily a fatality. A fatality is a death. You're right about the common misunderstanding of the term, but it was still one of the most most fatal battles. Technically, you're both right on the casualty arguement haha. The meaning of words matters and I respect your comment.

[@seanmccarty1176]

Modern estimates put the eventual death toll of Antietam at 8 to 9 thousand. Most of those that eventually died succumbed to infections or disease caused by poor medical knowledge of the time. Keep in mind these would happen over months and so cannot reasonably be counted as battlefield deaths, but they are casualties. Aging historians think the 750,000 count is too low considering the whole of the civil war and how destructive the "new" weapons were at the time.

[@2010rls]

@@seanmccarty1176 The 3,800 killed I mentioned is "killed in action", so it doesn't include the wounded soldiers that died later. I don't doubt that the total number of deaths is two or three times that number, especially from infections to wounds.

[@sethwoll6240]

I remember reading a personal memoir of a Confederate officer who visited the prison for a day and wrote of how he had never seen or imagined a more deplorable example of mistreatment upon other humans. So much so he felt sick every time he ever thought about it and never wanted to even be within the area of the camp again in his lifetime, even after the war had ended.

[@wildestcowboy2668]

Name and dates are good. Or are you a carpetbagger?

[@jessefisher1809]

I wonder if he owned slaves

[@PhilMasters]

@@jessefisher1809 If he wasn’t a slave-owner, well, good for him; if he was, that makes his disgust at the camp conditions slightly more significant.

[@katieholland4244]

I hope he wasnt. 🤞🤞

[@ifv2089]

_Slavery still an issue today_ ©️✔

[@CrisMind]

Simon didn't mention that some prisoners went past the dead line in order to be killed. Not wanting to live as they were. Truly a sad story all around

[@hanisk2]

The whole Civil War to me feels a lot more depressive.. it wasn't two countries fighting. It was the same.. most soldiers now say its real easy to kill someone who doesn't speak your language.. who can't plead with you.. it would've been terrible..

[@micnorton9487]

"Dead at the hands of the guards would be merciful compared to this studied cruelty and calculated diabolical murder by slow death." Union prisoner at Andersonville...

[@hedruum]

I grew up right next to Andersonville and we used to go camping there when I was in the Boy Scouts every fall when they did Civil War reenactments. There’s a national cemetery and museum there now and it was pretty horrific learning about it when I was a kid. It seemed like ancient history back then but I didn’t realize at the time that we weren’t that far removed from that era.

[@westrim]

Consider that there were Civil War soldiers alive as WW2 started. (76 years from the end of one to the beginning of the other for the US) and a Civil War widow survived until 2020 (granted, that was exceptional circumstances that saw a 17 year old marry a 93 year old so he'd have someone to bury him when he'd die in a few months, and she'd get his pension (though she never collected).

[@MsPuffykinz]

All American countries are so young. Our stories have barely begun. Both good and bad will be apart of it. We can only hope, in our time, we do the most good.

[@westrim]

@John Arsebuckle Reread

[@westrim]

@John Arsebuckle By Civil War widow I just meant the widow of a Civil War veteran.

[@shepberryhill4912]

Those of us who grew up in families where stories of our ancestors in the war are still told feel how recent it was. About five generations. It was quite common in the late nineteenth century here for old vets to marry young girls. Not so much because they were pedophiles, many were beyond consummation, but because they needed a nurse for a few years and wanted to pass on the pension. That pension meant a secure life, and was a good tradeoff for many young women.

[@dougearnest7590]

The night before his execution, Louis F. Schade, an attorney working on behalf of Wirz, was told by an emissary from a high Cabinet official that if Wirz would implicate Jefferson Davis in the atrocities committed at Andersonville, his sentence would be commuted. Allegedly, Schade repeated the offer to Wirz who replied, "Mr. Schade, you know that I have always told you that I do not know anything about Jefferson Davis. He had no connection with me as to what was done at Andersonville. If I knew anything of him I would not become a traitor against him, or anybody else, even to save my life."

[@RamblinPhoenix]

Schade was my Great Great Grandfather. He also would later buy the house Lincoln Died in, in order to make sure it was preserved proceed and live there for 30 years because of how much he respected Lincoln. A really intresting guy. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_F._Schade

[@JL_Lux]

He should of done it. Just add on to him being a terrible person

[@dougearnest7590]

@@JL_Lux -- I'm not quite sure what you mean by this, but it seems like you're just not getting it. (also, "should have" - not "should of")

[@JL_Lux]

@@dougearnest7590 no i mean for someone who done some heinous war crimes - he should of followed his villain arch and tied in the confederate. Also if he asked for more rations - they have a piece of this war crime. He isn’t the only one that Should have been hung

[@ethanweeter2732]

That is rich considering men like Davis fled the country or tried to say they should not be in trouble even though they were directly responsible.

[@drudgenemo7030]

The water situation would be enough. The importance of water cleanliness was understood by the Romans, and was part of military instruction for officers and most enlisted in virtually every nation. The results were well understood. That alone would be evidence of systematic cruelty and death by his orders. Anyone who has suffered dysentery could attest to the torture of that.

[@neuralnetwork17]

Yes, it would be enough. The same can be said about the starvation and exposure to the elements. These things are so fundamental that it is difficult to imagine an officer so incompetent that he would not understand the consequences of neglecting them. Why anyone would argue that this cruelty was anything but systematic and deliberate is beyond me.

[@RyanT301]

@@neuralnetwork17because not everything is that black and white big guy. The union cut the south off from everything that even the confederates were starving..

[@neuralnetwork17]

@@RyanT301 I'm pretty sure that's not accurate, "big guy." But even if I'd grant you that, it would do nothing to justify the lack of shelter, or shitting in the only source of fresh water.

[@AiluridaeAureus]

See, I went into this thinking "What could possibly have happened to get this guy axed when nobody else was?" When I heard the word "prison camp" I pretty much instantly understood why...

[@krisaaron8180]

The novel Andersonville by MacKinlay Kantor won the Pulitzer prize. It took 25 years to write and is a completely immersive description not only of the camp itself but of Southerners living nearby, and soldiers on both sides.

[@smooshiebear80]

Thanks for the recommendation! I’m going to listen to it.

[@krisaaron8180]

Hope you enjoy it as much as I did.@@smooshiebear80

[@hungrysoles]

My great great grandfather was a Union soldier that was a prisoner at Andersonville. It was a miracle that he survived to return to his family. I'm sure his life was not the same and he had serious emotional scars he had to live with.

[@michaelstoughii1920]

Interesting to find someone else who had a relative in this wretched place. My great, great, great uncle was there, but didn't survive. Sad thing is, the place is actually quite beautiful and serene today.

[@karlgharst5420]

Many prisoners offered to testify on Wirz' behalf... Military tribunals are no longer a force of law once a nation surrenders.

[@amped333]

I really appreciate the effort you put into being thorough and attempting to cover stories from all angles.

[@robertortiz-wilson1588]

Agreed.

[@ChessJourneyman]

So thorough that he said 23k died and made a series of other mistakes. Whoever does his research did a poor job.

[@georgewilkey5283]

The real crime is that the average mortality rate for southern POW camps was15.5% and northern camps was 12%. That's only 3.5% difference between the CSA which literally had nothing to give and the USA which had all the resources of the union army and federal government. There are several accounts from guards at Andersonville and visitors to the prison that state the staff and guards fared little better than the prisoners themselves. The south was an agrarian society with very little industry. You can't raise crops with all your men in the military so by the third year of the war the South frequently could not feed it's own army. The north did not have this excuse and there is absolutely no reason for their mortality rates to be almost as high as the south, except for gross negligence and indifference. Let's also not forget that Wirz tried on more than one occasion to parole all the prisoners, all the north had to do was send a train to pick them up. However, they refused to do so, not because the couldn't but because they knew that all those prisoners were a serious drain on southern supplies. So, even though the union was completely aware of the conditions their own soldiers were living in at Andersonville they refused to accept their parole. With a mortality rate of 3000 a month by the end of the war, how many people would have been spared if the union had just come and got there own soldiers? The people responsible for the decision to leave them at Andersonville are the ones that should have been hung.

[@bigfoot3866]

Again. The south should have been much more ruthless against the imperialistic north. Like Vlad Tepes ruthless.

[@bigfoot3866]

Something Europeans SHOULD be smart enough to understand is that the average southerner HATED slavery because, just like today with third world immigration, they were not only taking jobs from southerners, but also drastically lowering wages for manual labor jobs. I understand how big 👃 are able to so easily trick Africans into believing europeans are a monolith even though it was specifically anglos, and them (70% of slave owners were 👃) and they ran the slave trade even introduced the practice. Despite this they convince POCs that all 🇪🇺 were in on this plot to oppress them and its all our faults, but how are we falling for this? Even if it were true, we shouldn't care. The fact they were able to turn us against our own people and actively seek our own replacement and eventaul eradication is sooo insane...

[@dperry19661]

@@bigfoot3866 And the US government should never have let the confederate states govern themselves ever again. The whole area should still be a military district. Plus the entire CSA military should have been hung for treason.

[@bigfoot3866]

@@dperry19661 this happened. The south hasn't been allowed to govern itself since.

[@i-am-evil-morty6710]

Simon is going to be the best story-telling grandpa ever

[@jackson1arm]

Let’s also look at Elmira, to just name one Northern POW camp where supplies were abundant , medicine available, blankets against the cold in warehouses by the thousands and Confederates were denied basic items. Several Union soldiers at Andersonville convinced Wirtz they would swear an oath to return if he give them a pass to travel to Union authorities and try to convince them to stop the embargo on medicine etc. that they needed in Andersonville . They failed to convince Union Headquarters and returned to Andersonville-now those were honorable Yankees!

[@beckyblack2333]

My 2xgreat grandfather made it home but suffered from what we now know as PTSD. He died after a buggy accident on a dark night after a time spent with his army buddies in heavy drinking.

[@Kenneth-ts7bp]

Sorry for your loss.

[@mitchellpatterson1829]

Southerner here. I am willing to accept the Wirz scapegoat theory IF somebody can produce letters, or other correspondence where he requested additional supplies for the camp. Until then, I believe it was what Simon described as "Shocking indifference." I realize that the number of prisoners sent to the camp in the first place was excessive, and almost certainly out of his control, but I have not seen much about what he did about it. I know Simon does not believe in ghosts, or any kind of echo/latent memory, but I have been to the grounds of Andersonville. It is deeply unpleasant to walk the grounds.

[@michaelfried3123]

you southerners show us time and time again you hate the truth...especially when you vote for your lying politicians who claim to be (laughing intensely) Christian.

[@mitchellpatterson1829]

@@michaelfried3123 Kind of a blanket statement there, and since you decided to focus on elected officials it really applies to any group with an electoral track record on either side. Since you choose to stereotype me I'll take a guess you are a liberal keyboard warrior who only accepts a truth that supports your prior position? Going back to the topic, I accept Wirz as a war criminal based on evidence, my opinion of the defunct CSA has no bearing on it. It looks like you are just seeking confirmation bias.

[@phildicks4721]

I also believe it was gross negligence and indifference on the part of Wirz, and his direct supperiors, especially General Winder. Some of my friends who have been to Andersonville have said the same thing about it...the place feels wrong, even on a nice day.

[@erraticonteuse]

I have not been to Andersonville, but I have been to Dachau and I can tell you that the atmosphere is about the same. Like the literal atmosphere feels thicker somehow, and sound doesn't seem to travel the same way. Anyway, speaking as a damn Yankee, while I am disinclined to let Wirz off the hook entirely, I AM willing to believe the possibility that he just was resigned to the war basically being lost and thinking there was no point in asking for supplies he knew wouldn't come. But that's the sort of thing people tend not to put into writing, so there's no way to know for sure.

[@vic5015]

I don't believe in ghost and spirits either, but I would be *deeply* unsettled to walk the grounds of the former Andersonville, knowing what had happened there.

[@dominicguttridge7560]

First here for a change. Just wanted to say I love all your channels. Honestly by far my favourite person to watch. Actually i have no time to watch anyone else due to your seemingly endless amount of content. Thanks for everything simon.

[@kathyjaneburke2798]

Ahhh, Simon, I always look forward to seeing you pop up. I am truly enjoying this channel and I love how you end them. Thank you & your team for all the great content.

[@mikesully110]

I keep seeing Simon everywhere, be honest with us Simon, are you real or are you some new advanced Google AI?

[@alexander-mauricemillamlae4567]

you mean by walking... into the shadows?

[@YoutubeBorkedMyOldHandle_why]

Truly shocking. Simon, you should talk about the concentration camps in South Africa which the British set up during the Boer war. Not to be mistaken for the POW camps (as these were mostly outside the country and were horrific in their own right), rather the concentration camps used to confine civilians, including tens of thousands of women and Children, in appalling conditions, not unlike those of the american civil war POW camps.

[@HarryFlashmanVC]

@Fred brandon no... the were not. A Concentration Camp is not an 'extermination camp'. Extermination camps were the brainchild of the Nazi party. Concentration Camps were exactly that, camps to house the civilian population. As is always the case and especially before antibiotics and modern logistics, such policies were bound to fail as bureaucracy, incompetence and overcrowding resulted in tragedy. The camps were not, as you seem to be implying, designed for the extermination of the civilian population.

[@HarryFlashmanVC]

And indeed, such internment camps have never, ever been humanitarian success stories, even today. All.sides used them.in WW1 and WW2. The WW1 ones were particularly awful. The Japanese, of course, ran the verybwprst civilian internment camps.

[@Clem_Fandango11]

@Fred brandona story made up by the morning star newspaper which is a renowned communist supporting rag. That has been one of the oldest fake news bullshit stories for decades and a lie pedaled by the left. If you can explain how a war correspondent could wave so much power over the person who set them up.....IE Lord Kitchener, I'd be eased to hear it.

[@karlgharst5420]

@@HarryFlashmanVC Besides the Japanese the US took more than 200,000 Italian and 300,000 German civilians into captivity on our soil. Some were sent to Germany as slave labor after the war (Fritz Kuhn for one).

[@Stewart1953]

or what the english did to villagers if they didn't pay enough taxes in Africa

[@comettamer]

As a student of Civil War history, I can say for sure that hearing the tale of Andersonville will always send a chill down my spine. At most, Wirz was guilty of gross negligence, and even that is questionable as he did try to get more support from the Confederate government to improve conditions at the camp and even tried to reduce the number of prisoners being held at Andersonville by sending five prisoners to the Union with a plea written by the inmates begging them to negotiate their release.

[@nvr2late666]

He couldn't be bothered to get his men to stop shitting in their prisoners drinking water. He got off easy, as did every other traitor to the Union at that camp.

[@SkarKingg]

True but unfortunately when it comes to military the "scape goat" is normal as the top chiefs never get the blame

[@davidmarks5400]

@@SkarKingg Correct. Wirz wasn't acting alone.

[@LeoDomitrix]

We have letters from those of my ancestors who survived that shithole. Wirz was the boss. He's the boss, he's the responsible one in the end. That's how we treated everyone else, and how we should. Wirz didn't do anything to *stop* his own underlings from promoting the violence (they'd bet on the gangs "who'd win", and take the prisoners' food, giving bonuses to prisoners who threw someone close enough to the deadline to give them someone to shoot...) I've read the original letters. So either my ancestors lied ---- and one died in there, btw ----- or Wirz earned his fate. BTW, the UDC erected a statue to Wirz. Don't see any Germans erecting statues to the guys in charge of Dachau/etc. (UDC: United Daughters of the Confederacy) Wirz didn't directly kill, but so what? Many camp leaders didn't *directly* kill anyone in a Nazi camp, either!

[@squeaky206]

​@@LeoDomitrix You see, Wirz killed 13,000 Union Prisoners of War in his time as Commandant of Andersonville. The Nazis that ran those camps killed 6 million and counting Jews, Roma, mentally and physically ill, Slavs, and Socialists/Communists, political enemies. Wirz wasn't benevolent or kind by any notice, but to compare tens of millions of lives snubbed by an egotistical failed painters ego to 13,000 prisoners of war is a mocking, though good intentioned comparison.

[@itsapittie]

I think the story of the Galvanized Yankees would make a good fit for one of your channels. The Galvanized Yankees were Confederate prisoners who were recruited from Union POW camps and sent to the western frontier to fight Native Americans who had become more of a threat as Union troops were sent east to fight the Civil War. As far as I know, it was the only time something like this was done officially.

[@jamesmaclennan4525]

And then the US Government forbade Ex Confederate Soldiers from enlisting in the Army...go figure

[@itsapittie]

@@jamesmaclennan4525 Ironic, no? Although in practice, the Army didn't make any real effort to check out a recruit's background in the mid-late 19th century. Quite a few ex-Confederates enlisted by the simple expedient of changing their names. It's a technical point, but the Galvanized Yankees weren't actually enlisted into the Union army. Officially they were civilian contractors even though they wore blue uniforms and used military ranks.

[@ianalexander7267]

That would make for a great movie

[@itsapittie]

@@ianalexander7267 there was one made in the 1950s or 1960s but it wasn't very good or historically accurate.

[@deweysturgill6220]

@@itsapittie Read about Bad John Wright. He done exactly that as a member of the KY Calvary. Was captured, escaped a Yank camp enlisted in the Union army got paid enlistment money, took a horse and went back to the CSA.

[@stevendaniel8126]

I have been to Andersonville. Mostly a grassy field now, but the site and it's history remains very creepy. Visitors rarely speak.

[@jodilewis5593]

Part of me wants to go, but given how badly I reacted to Kennesaw Mountain Battlefield, I probably shouldn't.

[@MrJdebest]

I know that feeling. Very creepy.

[@RCAvhstape]

I was at Antietam last year and went to the sunken lane, where a photo had been taken of dead bodies stacked up right where I stood. It's just a dirt road again, manicured by the NPS and marked with little signs. But that photo...

[@roguedalek900]

@@jodilewis5593 I've been to Kennesaw , Stones River and Andersonville about 1975 when I was 14. It's sobering . All that suffering.

[@johnhazlett3711]

Truly a bitterly sad aspect of American history. More Americans died in the Civil war than WWI and WWII combined.

[@mennograafmans1595]

And yet, at the time it didn't even make it in the top 30 bloodiest wars (according to wikipedia list of bloodiest conflicts) in total numbers. Pretty sure it has fallen out of the top50 by now with the world wars and all the cold war conflicts. Not to downplay how bad it was. But it shows so well how new the US was. Long established nations in Asia and Europe had so much more time to grow. And wars with over twice the numbers of death, like the Jewish-Roman wars are forgotten by now as "one of many". The US still has such an innocence in how they view wars, since so few have been fought on their own soil. A very interesting difference in mindset to see on videos like this.

[@victoriateague9012]

Well of course, since Americans were fighting well, other Americans.

[@micnorton9487]

​@@victoriateague9012 .. that's true,, and 620-700K lost from wounds/disease is probably a little more than the number of kia/other fatalities of Napoleons 1812 war with Russia... nothing compared to the 2,000,000 of the Vietnam war on both sides,, the 36-52 million of all sides of WWII,, but yeah,, the American Civil War was a lot more compact than either of those wars...

[@Mazz3D]

Into the Shadows is a great channel SW. Thanks for all the content you have provided, it actually helps my mental health no matter how awful. I love how you don't do an outro for this channel and just walk off the set like you feel dirty for the information you just provided.

[@WhiteCamry]

Supposedly, two escaped Union prisoners reached Sherman's army during his March, delivering the first news about Andersonville.

[@seed_drill7135]

When I was growing up we had a family friend who's father was a POW at Elmira. She lived well into the 21st century, living to age 98.

[@waltergolston6187]

my Great Great Grand Father was a Prisoner. He lived and only mention to my Grand Mom that he and his fellows had dug a "cave to live in " He was said to have been proud of being a Lincoln Republican and helped preserve the Union.

[@user-dg9pu4pe9d]

This was interesting. It just sounded odd. I had never before heard the prison reffered to as Sumter even though it is the official name. It is always Andersonville. Sumter has always reffered to the fort where shots first fired. I do not mean that as a criticism. Maybe it regional like Manassas or Bull Run.

[@absollum]

I've heard of it as Andersonville, probably to not get it mixed up with the Fort Sumter that signaled the start of the war.

[@jimaanders7527]

During the Revolutionary War, more American (Colonial) soldiers died as British POW's than died on the battle field.

[@lizc6393]

One's neck not breaking during hanging is something I actively have vivid nightmares about. Perhaps I listen to too much stuff like this, perhaps it's a past life.

[@vainoleppanen8971]

This story raises a question that's probably not a good fit for this channel: what was the best prison for average soldiers on either side of the conflict? Were there commanders who truly went above and beyond for the POWs?

[@erraticonteuse]

Bear with me, this is going to ramble a bit: I don't know the actual objective answer to the question, but I do remember when there was some debate about taking down the only Confederate monument in my native Boston, it was one of the few I considered possibly worth keeping up because it commemorated some Confederates who died in a POW camp on an island in Boston Harbor. My thinking was that if they had died as a result of neglect or abuse, then that's something that should be remembered regardless of what side of the war anyone was on. But then I looked into it and found out that it was actually one of the better POW camps of the Civil War, and the deaths were just the sort of thing that happened before medicine was good. So yeah I don't remember the name, and I don't know if it was in any way "the best", but that's something you can try and look up. (The monument has, of course, been taken down.)

[@regan3873]

If you don’t care about it being a video, r/AskHistorians (on Reddit in case you’re not familiar) could be a good place to ask.

[@vainoleppanen8971]

@@erraticonteuse not much of a ramble :) Thanks.

[@3ducksinamansuit]

Hard to tell, north and south they were all bad. Lack of supplies near wars end made southern camps really bad.

[@Archerfish1977]

Probably the best POW camp during the war was Fort Delaware. It housed a total of 33,000 prisoners over the course of the war, with about 2,500 of them dying (7.6%). Almost half of these deaths occurred during a smallpox outbreak in the summer of 1863 that also claimed the lives of a number of the Union guards. The fort's commander, General Albin Schoepf, was a professional soldier from Austria who did his best to maintain high standards in the camp.

[@glengearhart5298]

Being born a Yankee, raised below the Mason-Dixon (Massaponax, Virginia), and returned back to Yankee lands, I must admit I have a love for American Civil War history. Also bein a Veteran of the U.S. Army, I have a complete understanding of the Responsibilities of Leadership. A Leader is responsible for ALL the actions of the troops under him/her. Atrocities happened on both sides of that war, and unfortunately "justice" is meted out by the victor. I cannot remember if legal action was taken against the commanders of Camp Douglas. So in the finality of it all, Wirz was culpable for the actions and the situation at Andersonville.

[@MatthewChenault]

Nope. No legal actions were taken against the commanders at camp Douglas. In fact, some were later _promoted_ to higher ranking positions.

[@tjchesney4997]

This and the other channels out by Simon, are by far, the best on KZbin. Just, endlessly compelling...

[@robertortiz-wilson1588]

I appreciate your balanced telling and explanations. I think it was negligence combined with the feeling that his requests for improvements we're (correctly) not going to be answered despite his requests anyway, along with severe apathy from superiors. Lack of supplies and resources might have also played some role though as well, but that can't excuse the way the camp was consistently ran and managed.

[@johncox2865]

Do you think Wirtz had any real options? Thank God, I’ve never faced the situation or choices he had to deal with. I place at least 90% of the blame in his superiors, who forced this situation upon him. Simon clearly states that the captain sought repeatedly to improve the situation.

[@westzed23]

My great uncle was held prisoner there. He became blind because of his stay there. He believed that it was the smoke from the wood that was used to create fires that caused his lose of sight. They needed fire to cook and for warmth during winter. I think that the diet also contributed to his blindness. He received a pension after being rescued. He had some little sight, but he lost that over time. He married and had a small farm near family in Kansas. His wife and brothers ran the farm.

[@powwowken2760]

Was he scapegoated? I mean... kind of? More appropriately it could be said he was the only one held accountable for what happened. Rather than him being innocent the question is, was he 'more guilty' than others, and that question is likely lost to time.

[@bushranger51]

Wirz wasn't a scapegoat as you put it, he was a cold blooded killer, even if he never used a weapon. To let men starve and die of thirst and to deny them reasonable shelter in all kinds of weather must be the most inhumane treatment ever imaginable, and to make his subordinates do it against their own judgement shows an insight into the man's character. Andersonville was the worst POW camp in the Confederacy because of his disdain for human life. A despicable man deserves a despicable end.

[@TheQuickSilver101]

I remember reading about this years ago. These kinds of stories really make you wonder how people can treat others so poorly. Thanks telling this story!

[@donaldwert7137]

Considering slavery, I can't say I'm too surprised. Nauseated by both, but not surprised.

[@maxpayne2574]

Look at what slave owners did whipping people taking babies from mothers and giving them to brokers raping the young girls.

[@scottessery100]

@@maxpayne2574 no compassion kindness or empathy It was a concentration camp I think hell on wheels featured the condition sadly accurately To be fair It wasn’t far off ww2 pows in Burma conditions

[@Verdunveteran]

Civil Wars tend to always be more brutal. Usually because such wars are conducted with more, or a different kind of, hate towards the opponants. It's like a realy bad family strife were sentements and feelings get overly heated. The Confederates saw the Union side as oppressors. The Union side saw the Confederetes as treacherous rebels. Traitors and rebels usualy always gets treated with brutality in war. More so in a civil war. Ad to this that during the time of the American Civil War there were no international laws to dictate the terms of how prisoners of war were to be treated. Yet, such only applies to legal combatants anyway. And CSA was never recognized as an independant nation. So they were in fact rebels and traitors from a legal standpoint. At that time there weren't much president for what to do with huge number of prisoners of war either. How to treat them and how to accomadate them. In prior centuries, atleast in the Europe, prisoners taken in battle were usually recruited into ones own army or simply sent to a prison to languish in some fortress dungeon or to be used as forced labor, or surrender was simply not accepted. In the latter the surrendering party was simply killed right there and then on the battlefield. An example of the first is that the Swedish army, after the Battle of Breitenfeld in 1631, was larger after the battle than it had been before, because the defeated enemies taken prisoners were simply recruited into the Swedish army. This is off course something that can't be done in a civil war due to the nature of such a war. This had also gone out of fasion in general as mercenary armies had given way to national armies during the time of the French Revolution and the following Revolutionary and Napoleonic Wars. This was also the era when really huge armies, numbering hundreds of thousands of men, were used. Prioners were usually sent to some sort of prison were they might or might not be used as forced labor. And death rates could off course be high due to malnutrition and dicease. But the USA had not had this experience of such large scale wars, with such large scale armies nor such large numbers of prisoners of war to deal with. So when the American Civil War broke out there were little to no experience at all about how to deal with prisoners of war on the scale they faced. That and the given sentements between the to sides aswell as the difficulties large numbers om prisoners imposed on the supply chain and the logistics of war it's no wonder that the conditions for prisoners on both sides were bad. One also have to account for the fact that supply issues were more frequent on the Confederate side. The Confederate armies themselfs suffered from starvation on many occasions. So it's obvious why many in leadership positions within the Confederacy would want to "waste" resources on large numbers of Union prisoners, when resources were in short supply within their own armies. Though much of this lack of resources was the limitations of the southern infrastructure and the logistical difficulty to get food stuffs especillay from the source to were it was needed before it spoiled. So considering this the supply of food to prison camps would most likely have been easier logisticaly speaking than to get it to the armies in the field. But to boil it down to three main reasons why conditions were so bad in prisoner of war camps on both sides: 1. A lack of experience in dealing with large numbers of prisoners and how to build the proper facilities to house them. 2. Supply and logistical issues. 3. A certain aversion towards the enemies held as prisoners due to the nature of it beeing a civil war.

[@ProjecthuntanFish]

When you wage an illegal TOTAL war upon a people don't cry when they don't have enough food or medical supplies to keep your POWs alive!!!! BTW Union POW camps in the north were just as bad if not worse than Andersonville was reported to have been. Deo Vindice!

[@jodilewis5593]

Sadly, there are far too many here in Georgia who havve the same complete disregard for the humanity of those with whom they disagree. It's heartbreaking how little we have progressed.

[@nzkshatriya6298]

Well, the Arbery (sp) verdict was a breath of fresh air You could tell the defense atty's were relying on the belief that a 99.9% white jury would not find the defendants guilty.

[@lisapop5219]

Just curious, what part of the state are you saying this is the norm?

[@robertortiz-wilson1588]

That's a pretty insulting generalization you're insinuating about most people that live in Georgia.

[@Thestargazer56]

@@robertortiz-wilson1588 Nah, I'm pretty sure that she knows that wars are started largely on misinformation.

[@CETGale]

yea I hear its dangerous just walking to the store in downtown Atlanta ...........

[@Itchyknee88]

There’s a memorial to him…what in the world is wrong with people?!? 😂

[@davebrunero5529]

A direct ancestor of mine was impression in Andersonville. He had gone AWOL and got married. But soon they were separated as he was sent back to the war. One day him and some other men were surrounded at a train station by the Confederate troops... and after a long night of fighting with no ammunition left, he and the other Union troops surrendered. They were sent to Andersonville. While he was there he became ill and tried to climb over the "Dead Line". However he had a cousin also there who pulled him back. When they were finally freed he started back home. Finally he returned home and walked up to the white picket fence around his house. There was a little girl playing in the yard and his wife sitting on the front porch. As he approached, his wife grabbed a shotgun and leveled it at him. She said "I don't want any trouble mister, keep on walking"... He responded "Becky, don't you recognize me? It's me, your husband, H.L." I'm descended from the little girl, but they did have a few more children. He passed in the 1870's, a little over 10 years after the war ended. The damage and toll on his body from being imprisoned in Andersonville limited his life, as was true with most who were sent there. During WWII, my grandfather was involved in liberating US soldiers in a POW camp. He was taken over to a man from the same town. They talked until the other man passed. There is little consideration, thought, or memory given to POWs... But their suffering has often showed the limits of what anyone can take.

[@joelex7966]

Thank you Simon for doing your usual thorough job covering this overlooked trajedy. There is a movie about this made on the "90s called Andersonville. Worth watching for anyone with an interest in that subject.

[@HarryFlashmanVC]

Wirz was a scapegoat. An opinion loundly proclaimed by Father Whelan.. Wirz was a monster but the systematic incompetence and indifference of the Confederacy Army was at the heart of this and the Union Army had their own hells. One of the reasons we have the Geneva Convention is due to the state of POW camps in the 19th C.

[@JL_Lux]

He didn’t even try

[@nancydrew5606]

In 1857 my great-grandfather immigrated from Sweden to the US with his parents and siblings. He was 12 and his older brother was 18. On the ship, his mother gave birth and named the baby Ida Atlanta. On their journey west, the father contracted cholera, died, and was buried somewhere in Pennsylvania. In 1861, A mere 4 years after their arrival in America my great-grandfather at just 16 and my great-uncle (21y) signed up to fight in the Civil War. My great-uncle first served with the Minnesota First and survived First Bull Run, Antietam, and Gettysburg. He re-enlisted in the 1st Minnesota Volunteer Infantry Battalion and was first captured at Petersburg, and sent to Andersonville. He escaped and was re-captured and sent to Libby Prison and was exchanged just before the end of the war. I think that experience took its toll as he only lived to be 36 years old. In 1862 my great-grandfather enlisted with the Minnesota 7th and was sent to fight the Sioux and the Dakota in the Indian Wars. The men signed up to fight in the Civil War and were not pleased to be fighting Indians. In 1863 the 7th finally went on to fight in the Western theater of the American Civil War. It is a miracle that my great-grandfather and his brother survived, they are Nils Johan Ernst Törnberg aka Nels Berg, and Peter (Per) Axel Wilhelm (Vilhelm) Törnberg aka Peter Bergh.

[@ignitionfrn2223]

1:10 - Chapter 1 - Civil war 2:05 - Chapter 2 - Prisonners 3:45 - Chapter 3 - Building Andersonville prison 5:05 - Chapter 4 - Captain Henry Wirz 7:20 - Chapter 5 - Prison expansion 8:05 - Chapter 6 - Condition deteriorates 10:35 - Chapter 7 - The raiders 12:10 - Chapter 8 - The beginning of the end 14:35 - Chapter 9 - Liberation & execution

[@shadymcnasty5920]

Ahhh I see how u do it now

[@mikesharkey2010]

Belated addition. There is one particularly awful postscrpt that should be added to this story. The steamship Sultana left Vicksburg on April 24, 1865. Late that evining or very early in the morning, while making its way up the Mississippi, at least one of its boilers exploded. The Sultana was vastly overloaded, carrying over 2400 passengers, when she was designed to carry 365. The explosion threw some passengers into the near-freezing river, others were blown up, still others were burnt as the boat burned, collapsong in upon itself and numerous passengers trapped inside. Many of those hurled into the water were too dazed or injured to swim or even stay afloat. Survivors recounted screams and pleas for help in the darkness lit by flames from the ship. Actual casualties are uncertain but are commonly agreed to be in excess of 1,100 souls. This is the single worst maritime loss of life in American history - even in excess of the much more well known Titanic disaster nearly 50 years later. How is this a post script to Andersonville? The vast majority of the passengers on this ill-fated trip (approximately 2,000 of them) were recently released prisoners from Southern POW camps, including a large contingent from Andersonville.

[@blakecampbell6549]

As brutal as the 1st civil war was, it is suprising only one person got tried for war crimes.

[@russellfitzpatrick503]

Suppose it's that the winners determine who gets tried ..., and who gets found guilty

[@pyromania1018]

Because Lincoln was too magnanimous for his own good, and Johnson was a Southern former slave-owner

[@MatthewChenault]

@@pyromania1018, this is why the south was right to secede.

[@bc2578]

Technically, that wasn't a civil war. We weren't attempting to take over Washington, DC, and control the USA, we just exercised the right to leave a voluntary union. A civil war is two sides fighting to control the nation. It's like the Yankees couldn't take the fact that the relationship was over, and we needed a restraining order or something....fn weirdos.

[@bc2578]

@Cancer McAids Apparently not........

[@mrman487]

The POW camp in Chicago could be argued as worse than Andersonville.

[@frankheaps9022]

Wirtz could have used the prisoners to farm the land around the fort for food. What a nut.

[@michaelstoughii1920]

Some prisoners did indeed get paroled and assisted in the local community, but with so many prisoners and so few soldiers to guard, a complaint of Wirz, it just wasn't practical. Also, a lot of the prisoners came from other camps and/or were in ill health when they arrived at the camps, making work details difficult on that side too.

[@Tuberuser187]

To think that some of the Men who survived that camp ended up on Steamboat Sultana with other released PoWs and drowned/burned in that disaster.

[@RamblinPhoenix]

To highlight how polarizing and confusing this whole time was: my Great Great Grandfather was Wirz's Lawyer, and felt Wirz was being unfairly singled out. He then would later buy the house Lincoln Died in and lived in that house for 30 years, in part to make sure the house was preserved for history, as his respect for Lincoln was imesurable.

[@jeffreymcneal1507]

Wow, that's an amazing lineage. Had two relatives, one died at the Second Battle of Bull Run, the other in Libby Prison. RIP.

[@RamblinPhoenix]

@@jeffreymcneal1507 if intrested here is some information on my Great Great Grandfather, Louis Schade: en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Louis_F._Schade

[@awfan221]

That's a pretty high-end lineage. Mine is ok - my great great grandfather and grandfather fought against Italy in 1896 and 1941, respectively (1st and end of 2nd Italo-Ethiopian wars). We won the first one decisively, and lost the second one but staved off colonization long enough until we received help from the Allies to drive out Italy in 1941.

[@mattiemathis9549]

I figured out why I watch Simon! Today I found out that the horrible prison camp I knew as Andersonville was Fort Sumpter.

[@VosperCDN]

I thought it was about Andersonville prison even before Simon mentioned the name - it was the only place/event that same to mind.

[@adrianred236]

Snap

[@birdwatcher101gbh]

The monument in Andersonville states that Wirz was arrested in violation of his parole and tried in a court which had no legal jurisdiction. He remained at the camp after the surrender of the forces in his department, a surrender which provided for paroles of the surrendering soldiers. There were a few prisoners still there, too sick to move, and they remained in his charge. When federal officers appeared they dined together. It was after the officers communicated with their superiors that they were ordered to arrest him. The fact that he remained is strong evidence of his belief he would not be arrested, a belief based on his clear conscience, a sincere belief that he had committed no crimes. Surely a guilty man would have fled. The trial was highly suspect. There is no doubt that much of the testimony was perjured. There is a strong argument to be made that he was a scapegoat and the victim of judicial murder. The Federals refused to exchange prisoners and the authorities preferred to call the deaths a crime than to admit to the nation that they died because the Lincoln gov't refused to exchange prisoners.

[@wordsmithgmxch]

My great granduncle, John Wilson Anderson, died in the Federal POW camp: in Elmira, New York. While it was probably a "nicer" camp than Andersonville, "Hellmira" was almost as deadly: 24.5% mortality as compared with 28.7%. Of course, no one even thought of hanging the commandant. Why mention the? Well, war is hell and while history may have its "good guys" and "bad guys", there's always been enough rottenness to go around. So study history! Know that you are the descendent of some pretty awful people ... and try to do better.

[@MatthewChenault]

Well, it’s simply a matter of “history is written by the victors.” Northern atrocities are conveniently forgotten while southern atrocities are propagated endlessly.

[@bc2578]

Same reason no Communist war criminals are still being hounded in their 90's like Germans, even though the Commies actually did 100X worse than the Germans are even "accused" of. Like, not just hysterical war propaganda, actual atrocities, 100 million dead, etc...

[@jamo491]

Civil war is the worst kind, those scars end up being carried for generations.

[@nothanks9503]

I’m not my mother was Cherokee my father was polish

[@professionalbeanie8342]

Well I suppose you get that sorta treatment when you fight for slavery 🤷‍♂️

[@rydplrs71]

The thing about military responsibilities is the commander of x is responsible for everything that happens there. It does not matter if the results are because of them actively doing their job, or equally if what happens is because they failed to do their job.

[@douglasturner6153]

Aside from any personal failings Wirz was a victim of a larger national drama. At that time Gen Grant was the top Union General and pushed for total war. "No exchange of prisoners" being part of that. With food shortages and overcrowding from new captives Wirz tried to get rid of many by exchange. Or just paroling prisoners and leaving them at Union outposts. But Union commanders refused to take them by orders from above. Sherman even refused to advance and take Andersonville when he could after Atlanta's capture because he thought all those weak unarmed soldier's would hinder his plans to advance to the sea. It's part of a story with many bad sides.

[@marcmelvin3010]

Thank you for bringing that up. What happened at Andersonville was horrific, but the cause, and the blame as well was far more complicated than simply that Wirz was some sort of brute. By the time the war ended, the North had become adept at propaganda, having had plenty of practice with the supposed massacre at Ft. Pillow (where my family were deeply involved) and other events, so that hanging Wirz, and subjecting the Lincoln assassins to a military tribunal fit nicely into making sure that the northern public had someone specific to hate, and hanging a few people here and there appeased a lot of that hate.

[@pamelamays4186]

Suggestion: The persecution and treatment of Japanese Americans, German Americans and Italian Americans during WW II. Also, the ill treatment of African American servicemen and women when they return home after the end of WW II, facing racism and prejudice after having fought for their country.

[@brianmichaelseymour6913]

Gives me a related idea. Thank you. Treatment of servicemembers upon return from Vietnam. =/ Though, maybe that's still too contentious.

[@shanewoody4232]

Interesting ww2 was very important for the civil rights movement and the southern Democrats also controlled the southern and the federal government with FDR and Wilson. Truman and Eizenhowers adminstration did help with civil rights

[@jaredevildog6343]

@@brianmichaelseymour6913 shouldn't be contentious. I feel bed for how Vietnam vets were treated. They went through hell and came home to ungrateful people spitting on them ?! Alot of them didn't understand why they were there but they still did their job. Just like I did recently. Every one of our military members deserves so much more . I do believe , the media then ,and social media now, is ruining everything.

[@noth606]

@@jaredevildog6343 well, getting involved in foreign wars that no one sees the point of isn't going to win popularity contests... I feel bad for them too, but I'm not surprised.

[@robertortiz-wilson1588]

@@noth606 there's a difference between not supporting a war and actively throwing things and spitting on scarred soldiers and cussing them out when they're just walking by on the street with short hair and civilian clothes.

[@ericoberlies7537]

Watch “The Andersonville Trial” (1970) starring Richard Basehart, Martin Sheen, William Shatner, Cameron Mitchell, Buddy Ebsen, and, directed by George C. Scott. It was a TV movie.

[@snakejones9965]

I think this is Simmons best channel.

[@Qba86]

He certainly wasn't innocent, but people far more guilty than him (like basically the entire political leadership of the Confederacy) got away with not as much as a slap on the wrist...

[@parkerwilliams7652]

The same could be said about the union

[@Qba86]

@@parkerwilliams7652 Not really. The Union leadership didn't issue an order to kill Confederate POWs based on skin color. Also, it's the southern planter class that started the entire bloody affair to begin with.

[@PrezVeto]

@@Qba86 The who started it argument is pretty weak. The south attacked Fort Sumpter, but it didn't invade the North and the Union knew their war goal was defensive. They chose to wage a war to force them back into the Union. That was _their_ choice.

[@Qba86]

@@PrezVeto Well, seceding to preserve and expand slavery, and then murdering POW's based on their race is still enough to earn a noose IMO.

[@MatthewChenault]

@@Qba86, nah. They just left them in horrific conditions and excused starving them with the line “we don’t want them to get fat in captivity.” They were deliberately cruel, which is what set them apart from the southern POW camps.

[@us89na]

The town of Parole Maryland, a bit west of Annapolis, is named after the 'parole' given by the prisoners at the POW camp there.

[@ChrisSeaB]

I have spent the last 15 years living in Elmira, NY. I had heard people refer to it as Helmira for a few years. However it wasn't until about 7 years ago that I learned that, that name wasn't just because it sucked to live there. It was the name the POW gave it during the Civil War. However it wasn't until the last year or so that I learned just how bad it was.

[@antkoz6370]

NY prisons have an insanely dark history in general. I've been in Elmira and it is one of the better prisons today.

[@ChrisSeaB]

@@antkoz6370 Umm I was referring to the Civil War prison camps. Not the current prisons in Elmira.

[@antkoz6370]

@@ChrisSeaB many facilities state wide have functioned as both. The human suffering inside hasn't changed much

[@brianedwards7142]

All the time I was listening to this I had in my head the song they made the prisoners sing while they beat Eli Wallach in The Good, The Bad and The Ugly.

[@MrGrombie]

I wish more Americans would be more considerate when calling out other nations on their deplorable actions. We try to say how we are so civilized, and yet we still have people choosing rent or medications, or losing their job due to some random reason and finding themselves homeless because they don’t have the support they need. These lessons like told in the video are reminders of my humanity. And how far we have yet to go.

[@silverstar4289]

“Highly charged” reaction to Wirtz. Yes, a work buddy had an ancestral there. He said when his family visited the site, his cousin screamed at some poor confederate re enactor. “You killed my uncle!

[@canadianbacon9819]

Great video I have a suggestion maybe look at some World war II Soviet prisoner of war camps they were exceptionally harsh as over 3 million died in German captivity during forced labor or executions could make a good video

[@Mrgunsngear]

Thanks

[@rayraudebaugh5395]

My great - great uncle was an inmate at Andersonville and was lucky enough to survive. I have read what he wrote about the experience and I am sure that, had he been in the crowd, he would have cheered at Wirz's execution.

[@Jtworthy1]

Imagine thinking "eh, why not pick a side" then realizing you chose the wrong side. I think he was shoved into a role he wasn't prepared for, then realized how much his fellow confederates didn't care for their prisoners

[@celter.45acp98]

and lincoln had the audacity to not only pardon but promote union officers accused of war crimes

[@Markus_Andrew]

For any who haven't seen it, there was a telemovie made in 1996 called simply "Andersonville". For a small-screen movie it's very well made, and by all accounts it seems quite historically accurate. If you're interested in this subject this movie is worth a watch, if you can find it.

[@devintorbert8876]

I lived in Birmingham Alabama, I am so shocked you did this one

[@KevinM491]

one of the few time where "they dont teach this in history class" is valid. had never heard about this.

[@eifelitorn]

18:25 lol at the dudes climbing a tree to see the execution

[@malarucoon]

There is a little known movie about Wirz's trial that was directed by George C Scott and stared William Shatner as the prosecution- I highly recommend this movie. "The Andersonville Trial"

[@barackobama9343]

there is little known because Wirz and his wife Oschwald are BOTH JEWISH NAMES!!! Simon just "forgot" to mention the facts that don't support HIS narrative... as usual

[@AS088]

You should do a MegaProject on the whole US Civil War from start to finish

[@theg.c.142]

Would wake a lot of folks up I bet. Good idea.

[@InstantAce]

Additional fact the leaders of the raiders are buried separately from the rest of the POWs in the associated cemetery

[@firefighter919]

Love all your content. I hope you continue to do this for a very long time.

[@j.p.obregon1415]

I've been to Andersonville before. It's a really great Civil War site to visit. Very humbling.

[@yosheymc8193]

Comparing the situation in this POW Camp with the holocaust is gross and shows that either you understand or care not for the nature of either of these camps, the Holocaust and inherently the camps aswell were designed to KILL not to hold prisoners but to utterly destroy groups of people for their cultural or ethnic heritages whereas this Camp Sumter appears to be but a mismanaged and overcrowded prison not unlike the Rheinwiesenlager, still horrible of course, but in no way whatsoever even remotely compareable to the industrial scale of murder that KZ Auschwitz-Birkenau for example provided. Also must I say that I am unsure whether or not the math actually works out, as you mentioned (or as I understood it?) the prisoners were also moved from one Camp to another, do correct me if I am mistaken, please. As such the 31695 prisoners on August 31st would not neccesarily be composed ogf the same people that were present in April, for if say 20% of the occupants were moved to other camps we would not be looking at 13000 out of 31700 but at 13000 out of roughly 38000, horrible numbers nontheless ofc and still and closer to an actual third but a lower relative total. I see why you'd make the comparison especially after seeing the picture of that union Soldier but in the end, the means and reasons how and why they were kept there is uncompareable to the Holocaust. This is of course but my own Opinion which no-one is forced to share.

[@MrBoybergs]

Beautifully presented piece of history.

[@tedebear108]

Good day to you sir. This is Ted from Texas. I am a civil war living historian. I reenact General Joseph E Johnston. We must keep the history of the Civil War alive. Knowing what Americans can do to other Americans and knowing that it's wrong is very important for history. When I visit the Alamo here in Texas I feel for the soldiers of the Alamo in the outnumbering cause they had to fight for the independence of Texas. I hope one day to go to Andersonville to visit and experience the feeling. It is very important to understand history. God Bless America may we survive the new troubles were in

[@antkoz6370]

Thank you for doing your part! I have fond memories of reenactments as a young kid.

[@icemancometh1621]

Not a good example. Texas was a part of Mexico. Mexico invited Americans to settle on plots of land in hopes of subduing the Apache people with whom they had been fighting for years. The Texans didn't like following Mexican laws, which led to the uprising and demands for American military relief at the Alamo. Granted, conquest by war has long been held as a legal means of aquiring land, but the actions of the Texans leading up to the war were just wrong from the outset. 'When in Rome...'

[@wptaimuty]

I love the civil war, and the topic of Andersonville prison is definitely a heated debate. I appreciate the balanced view on this issue.

[@BaronVonQuiply]

Congratulations, Simon, on your 8,675,309th channel, mysteriously named "Jenny".

[@nancypine9952]

There was a prisoner of war camp in Boston Harbor called Fort Warren. It was a small one; just 1,000 prisoners, of whom a total of 13 died. It was also a prison that held some high ranking Confederate politicians, including Stephens, who was the vice president. So, despite Stephens writing about how horrible it was, I suspect that conditions there were carefully monitored, and everything that was needed was supplied. There are even stories about how, during the winter, when the prisoners were freezing, some of the ladies of Boston knitted blankets for them. It's part of a large park that includes several other islands, and you can walk through parts of the prison and the battlements. But that one was an exception, and the majority of the camps were horrible.

[@robertfolkner9253]

There was nothing senseless about prisoner exchanges- they made perfect sense in a conflict where the issue of manpower was very important.

[@Verdunveteran]

True, and it greatly bennefitted the south as they had the largest issues with manpower. And the north knew that. And hence Grant wanted it stopped as it gave the south a chance to continue the fight for longer.

[@waynecampbell9107]

What's even more unimaginable is that the federal government did not address the rotten conditions that plagued the different states approaches to the Civilian prison system which was run by the county Sheriff's departments all over the nation, until they split things up into county, state, and federal prisons during the 1950s, 60s and 70s. Because it was considered that upon being assigned a ward of the county, state, or federal government, all incarcerated individuals lost ALL of their rights for the duration of their term of incarceration! Originally, those who had no family members in the area where they were incarcerated, prisoners were barely maintained by meager sustenance that was basically surplus foodstuffs gifted to the prisons by local farmers, and things that nearby farmers were unable to sell at the markets during harvest time! The United States has become the largest incarceration country in the world, and boasts about the treatment of the incarcerated, however, States like New Hampshire, STILL using the same main building built in 1871, for the state prison, DESPITE having only 2 inmates on death row, (BOTH will require the reopening of the States Electric Chair after all their appeals are exhausted, or be transported to a facility that has a lethal injection type of execution, and THAT will have to be added as a means of execution by the state legislature, and approved by the Governor, - provided the condemned don't insist on the current state law which states that the condemned must die either by hanging, (the last inmate hanged in New Hampshire was in 1947), or by electrocution, (for which, the state's Electric chair was refurbished, and then sealed inside a room in the main jail, decades ago!) Both the death row inmates in New Hampshire are convicted cop killers, and are near the end of their appeals process, and none of the Governor's from either party have expressed any interest in commuting either of these justified death sentences! We'll see what they come up with when their executions come up! In any case, the United States had many German pows during WWII, who were subsequently released after the war ended, one or two, escaped, and later became US citizens after a long period of time on the run from the FBI. Prisoners of war are the only prisoners who benefited from the horrific conditions at this prison, because over a century later, inmates are still finding themselves lawsuits for being mistreated at every level of prison in New Hampshire, and many other places across the country! Prisons are the biggest industry and the largest unions in these states that maintain ridiculous 90+ % incarceration rates for things most states wouldn't even consider to be crimes! Prison country, USA

[@JozefLucifugeKorzeniowski]

All you had to say was, there was almost no shelter and it was in Georgia and I would've been like "oh yeah, that's a SUPER war crime" If there were attempts by wirz to better the situation and avert those conditions then the correspondence indicating so needed to be supplied as evidence. Although it may seem logical he had little ability to goad his superiors into sending supplies, evidence of attempts or remorse over the conditions would've really gone a long way. Chances are he might've been scapegoated because he had no or little family there to mourn him being an immigrant. and who would make that decision is debatable as at the end of the war both sides were exhausted with murder, revenge, and adding more bad blood to the matter. But the situation was obviously appalling enough that there would be unrest unless punishment was doled out to someone.

[@MatthewChenault]

He was a scapegoat for northern crimes as well. After all, he was a good distraction from the abysmal conditions at camps like Camp Douglas, which had poor shelter for conditions in Chicago.

[@demiller74]

Had a relative there, visited Memorial Day in 2011. I recommend everyone visit Andersonville.

[@N33k5]

Simon looks like Mister Rogers with how he is posed in this video.

[@kingjellybean9795]

Idk how many civil war docs I've seen and not a single one mentions the battle of schrute farms

[@demonprinces17]

For all you making excuses for him as the commander he could have set up proper waste disposal, ensured clean water, built shelters, ensure proper disabution of food and stop the killing and torture of prisoners by the guards

[@davidbowie50yearsofbowiean23]

Yeah, everybody knows this, so what are you talking about? That's called negligence. The argument is both A) is Negligence worthy of the death penalty? B) How much authority did he have over anyone at any given time? All you've done is reiterate what the video said.

[@pompelmostique]

@@davidbowie50yearsofbowiean23 Hmm... Negligence leading to 13,000 deaths? Dude. Get a better argument. That's shit's deliberate. Hence... his hanging... and hence how he was only thought of as a martyr/hero in the south 30+ years later by the United Daughters of the Confederacy, hardly a reliable or unbiased group as far as historical accuracy is concerned.

[@davewagner5408]

How much better would anyone else have done? Not defending him,but you can't make a silk purse out of a sows ear.

[@2639theboss]

​@@davidbowie50yearsofbowiean23 Yeah but how am i supposed to feel a false sense of superiority and intelligence if i dont restate the whole premise of the video, and argue against an argument that doesnt exist?

[@ihateyankees3655]

He could only do so much with confederate logistics as stretched as they were and the camp so severely overcrowded.

[@Sinn0100]

"A third of the entire Britain population..." that can't be right. So you're telling me Britain only had roughly 39,000 citizens during the American Civil War period?

[@HaysiKing]

There was a battle for the town of saltvile that did result in a guerilla leader of the south being hanged named Champ Ferguson. This battle also basically ended the war for the south because it ended the south's salt supplies. But I never hear much about the battle. the native people there was kicked out to go deeper in the mountains and the first union army there was a black army brigade. It would make a awesome video but it will take some digging to get all the details.

[@PhilMasters]

Ferguson was a guerrilla leader, not part of the regular army, and hence wasn’t an officer. So Simon’s headline is at least technically correct.

[@erisgh0sted961]

One day Simon is gonna own YT.

[@annipsen4104]

To hold the person at the top responsible that would be a general... unless I don't know my rank structure, but I do.

[@raagtop363]

Too late for that now!

[@Verdunveteran]

Well, General John H. Winder who was in in charge of the Confederate prisoner of war camp system died on 7 February 1865. The war was still going on at that stage. So once the war was over Winder couldn't, for obvoius reasons, be put on trial and held accountable. He seems to have been a shady character, not just when it came to the running of the prison camps, but also when it came to some of his other duties aswell. According to the witness testmony of John McElroy, one of the Union prisoners in Camp Sumpter/Andersonville prison, Winder was said to have boasted that "he was killing off more Yankees than twenty regiments in Lee's Army". McElroy also claimed that Winder had given the order, on July 27 1864, to open fire with the artillery batteries surrounding the camp upon the prisoners within the stockade, with grapeshot, if Union forces were to come within seven miles of Andersonville. Don't know how reliable McElroy's wittness account is, but considering the shadiness of Winders other affaires I would not be surprised of McElroy spoke the truth. Winder would have deserved to be put on trial and to be held accountable. Sadly he managed to avoid justice by dying from a heart attack. well before that could happen.

[@bc2578]

Actually, since they weren't allowed to exercise their legal right to secede, the Confederates were still Americans, which made the top of their command structure.....Abraham Lincoln.

[@kerrynball2734]

The problem with POW camps generally is at some point when food is low. Someone has to choose between feeding your own soldiers who are out at Battle or feeding the prisoners. We got used to the idea that food is readily available.

[@MatthewChenault]

People tend to forget that the south had bread riots during the war due to the scarcity of food.

[@seanmcmullen4274]

2:45 weird camera zoom.

[@shadymcnasty5920]

I digged it. Startled me slightly

[@canadiandee6342]

It threw me off at first not seeing a script. Been watching a lot of BB and Casual Criminalist