Herman Miller Embody vs Fractal Refine Chair

[@Ahnestly]

*SPONSOR* HelloFresh: strms.net/hellofresh_ahnestly Use my code *POGHF145244* and receive 10 free meals + free breakfast for life! *Herman Miller - SALE (Worldwide)* 🛒25% off Gaming Embody: geni.us/SHAnBy 🛒25% off NON-Gaming Embody: geni.us/VsUBT 🛒$5 off Headrest: geni.us/Atlas5Off Sale Ends 11/17/24 *Fractal Refine (Worldwide)* 🛒geni.us/pQade *My Slippers* 🛒Glerups (Amazon): geni.us/rlk7C0H *All links are affiliate links. Using them costs you nothing, but keeps this channel going!* *LED Light Boxes* 📼Tutorial: kzbin.info/www/bejne/iKm2h4V3dt2VqJo

[@Xiaowahh]

Bro, everytime I watch your video about Hermin Miller Embody/comparison videos. It makes me appreciate mine a lot more.

[@tdub77]

Thanks going to order my embody today through your link. Been waiting for the pre-black Friday sale which it looks like is this...BTW I'm 6'3" 240 I'll update you on my experience if you're interested...

[@Ahnestly]

Thank you so much! And yes let me know!!!

[@Gidrah]

I'm one of those 6'4" guys that finds the embodys back rest to dig into my shoulders. I feel like the Fractal might be the better buy over the Titan Evo XL but I wish chair manufacturers would just make flat seats so I can sit cross legged.

[@jacobb-c7946]

I got my refine 2 weeks ago, i was super hesitant but just that f it and pulled the trigger. Definitely not the MOST comfortable chair I’ve been in but for just under 500 it’s fantastic and is still very comfortable. If you don’t want to spend close to 1000+ the. The refine is great. Even for long hours.

[@br1ank7ein]

I love the detail and atmosphere in your videos, keep up the good work 👍🏼

[@Ahnestly]

Thank you!

[@sky2934]

I'm just watching this video to further justify my purchase of the Embody from a year ago which was sparked by this channel. Embody is still going strong

[@miked7344]

Sitting on the Refine right now and I'm loving it. Its supportive, but not overly firm (using the fabric version). Thanks Dan for your reviews, they helped so much in making my decision.

[@volcmargray5259]

its firm as hell !

[@miked7344]

@@volcmargray5259 I was really really really worried about it being too firm, but I just don't feel it I guess. Should soften a bit over time too.

[@Noneya5555]

@@miked7344 Can you do the leg tuck?

[@saintyoo]

Man the Refine without the bolsters on the back and seat would slay. Maybe with a softer seat cushion too. I'll hold out for a version 2.

[@X3.X3]

Just bought the gaming embody....should be here tomorrow, cant wait!

[@LilBudaa]

Watching this as I'm sitting on my Fractal Refine. I've had it for about 2 months and I absolutely love it! I have the mesh version and I'm 6'2 198lbs. The chair is very comfortable, keeps my back upright and the quality of the materials is great. I love the video, but I don't agree with your maximum weight recommendation of 170lbs for the mesh Refine. 220lbs would be just fine imo, the mesh doesn't feel that cheap. Thanks for another great video Dan :)

[@Ahnestly]

Hey! my concern with the mesh is the longevity of it. From the feel of it, it's similar mesh to what you find on $200ish chairs. But with a 3 year warranty, hoping you can get that fixed if it becomes an issue!

[@crpsg]

Strongly recommend trying and reviewing the kokuyo duora 2 chair. Its back support is truly a wonder that the big names can’t beat.

[@justinhoule5198]

i just ordered a HM embody X Logitech, will be receiving it Monday looking forward to it, and I hope ill be able to adjust to it. I've read that some people don't always like it but it seems for 6foot 220 pound guys it would be fine and I could adjust to it with time!

[@Ahnestly]

It should be solid for your height!

[@Personal_Comp]

5'11" 285lbs, I have mine for a year and a half with the headrest(got it in preorder), you are going to be just fine. Expect back pain and uncomfort in first 5-10 days and after that comes the bliss :)

[@justinhoule5198]

@@Personal_Comp Thank for your imput! looking forward to it!

[@justinhoule5198]

@@Ahnestly I just got the chair. I sat in it. It was love at first sight. I will be gaming tonight and working online tomorrow all day, so I'll see how good it is as the hours go!

[@Ballissle]

I've already just got the embody and liking it a lot. The refine seems pretty good and definitely at the top of its price range and also of the bucket seat design range. However I'm glad I didn't get that now that you mention its not good for 5'4 or below people.

[@dreamix0949]

How tall are you? I’m hesitating to get the Embody because I’m not sure if my feet will properly touch the ground and I don’t like using a footrest 😅

[@Ballissle]

5'4 My feet reach the ground at the lowest height but to reach my desk with my arms at the correct flat angle I need to raise the chair a bit and then my legs dangle so I have a footrest.

[@bonanzabrandon6877]

The Embody was definitely an investment for me, but it's a great chair, very comfy and I don't regret it one bit.

[@CleverCoz]

After we met I've been looking at a new chair again since the seatpan on my chair is literally down to one bolt (the rest sheered off 😂) the fractal chair looks soooo good and will be a huge upgrade for me.

[@Ahnestly]

hahaha new chair won't get the heart rate going as much as the old though

[@luciusesox1luckysox570]

The Herman Miller Embody is on sale in the UK and is going for £1177. I don't know what the conversion rate to the dollar is but that is no where near $2000, more like $1500. I just ordered one :)

[@Ahnestly]

My links show all the sales (including for UK!)! And this video will live longer than the sale, hence why I’m using MSRP prices!

[@luciusesox1luckysox570]

@@Ahnestly Oh no.. no criticism intended I was trying to help some people out so they don't miss the sale. I hope it doesn't take cash away from you.

[@Ahnestly]

@@luciusesox1luckysox570 dang i hate how tone is lost over the internet! I didn't think you were criticizing! I just wanted to clarify why I didn't include sale prices in the video, but also that if anyone saw your comment, please use my link when you purchase as it helps the channel a LOT!

[@aashilr]

I have an Aeron V2 & am looking to sell or trade it in for an Embody. Main reason is because I want to sit with one leg folded in, which I can’t do on Aeron due to hard plastic seat rim. Rest of the chair is 10/10

[@slothasauruslex]

Absolutely great video as always. Love your content man. But what I need is the Fractal vs the Haworth Fern Digital Knit. I'm looking closer to the $1k mark and I can't decide between those two.

[@Ahnestly]

I'm sitting in my digital knit fern right now writing this. I love this chair man...the digital knit backrest is just so soft. I know people hate on Haworth for its not as high quality feeling build quality, which I totally get, but I love mine. I think I made it clear in all of my videos, but I don't mind firm, but I prefer more cushy over firm. If I could make a suggestion, get the Haworth Fern first bc you know you'll get free returns with minimal work. If you don't like it, you can try the Fractal Refine (you have to break down the Refine if you want to return it, huge PIA). Hope this helps! And as always, please consider using my links if you pick up! And let me know what you decide!

[@kernel1809]

@@Ahnestly You prefer Fern with lumbar support or without it?

[@Ahnestly]

@@kernel1809 I love mine with. It's removable (not the easiest process, but doable!)

[@Chill_Phactor]

As a tall person who had the Embody... I returned mine due to how the edges of the top part of the backrest dug into my back.

[@arnandravichandra-yh8xb]

Love your channel ! Can you please do either the HBADA E3 pro or HINOMI H1 pro please 🙏🏾

[@smthsmth]

Bought Fractal Refine mesh version for 450 eur. Cant complain. There are a few small issues but for the price its a great deal.

[@cityfan974]

on which website did you manage to order the chair?

[@smthsmth]

@@cityfan974 Local internet store that probably ordered them from Asia in the very first days when it came out. I can confirm that now its impossible to buy the chair and it costs 600+ eur at least when available,

[@freedonx]

One of employees is 5'0" - 5'1" and she loves her Embody. She can lay her head on the upper back part

[@MbV9320]

Bro Ahnestly is such a clever name! Nice review.

[@Ahnestly]

Thank you! It's clever until you have to explain and spell it out for every single person during a networking event...LOL

[@Noneya5555]

Dammit Dan, stop reading my mind! 🤬🤣

[@Ahnestly]

My new hair is giving me superpowers

[@Noneya5555]

@@Ahnestly With great hair comes great responsibility. 🍻

[@Ahnestly]

The cost is too high. Literally. The shampoo is f$@& expensive.

[@Noneya5555]

@Ahnestly First-world problems, am I right? 🤣

[@Jayzee31519]

When you get a chance you have to check out the Hbada E3

[@QwietStorm]

Can you comment at all on how the Refine compares to the Haworth Fern?

[@Noneya5555]

BTW, the Embdy is currently 25% off; it's still expensive, though. And Secretlab just released the new Evo Titan NanoGen Edition for pre-order. Base price is $799, but it currently comes only in their new leatherette fabric. The seat and backrest are made partly of a new foam, which is supposed to be much softer than the AL Cold-cure pad they use now. I thought of buying it, but $799 is too much for a Secretlab chair. And as Dan and past buyers have pointed out, their customer service is hit or miss. Plus, they make you jump thru sort of a hoop to get an extended 5-year warranty, instead of just giving it to customers up front.

[@Ahnestly]

The sale is noted in my links, but this video will last much longer than the sale, hence I didn’t mention it in the video (could confuse people!)

[@Noneya5555]

Good point. Sorry I missed it; I hadn't gotten to the links yet. 👍🏻

[@rabidrabbittt]

still waiting on the refine i ordered over a month ago, its just impossible to get anything except an ikea chair or a standard embody where i live it seems😮‍💨 sidenote, i dont think slouching is inheritely bad as long as you move around a bit. posture is more about body language than staying healthy, probably shouldnt slouch at your job interview though xd

[@mrfumetsu]

Thanks for all your vids. Pushed me over the edge last week, gaming Embody comes on Tuesday. I'm 41 years old and been PC gaming since I was 11 years old. Should have had one of these decades ago.

[@Ahnestly]

I hope you love it!!! Let me know!

[@just4justincase]

Any plans on reviewing the upcoming secret lab Nanogen? Supposedly supposed to be much cushier than the current Evo seats.

[@Ahnestly]

For some reason, Secretlab won't email me back LOL. I'm trying to get my hands on one

[@timohoepfner3068]

@@Ahnestly😂

[@Noneya5555]

​@@AhnestlySecretlab has sent out chairs to tech and gaming media reviewers. If they're smart, they should send you one as well. 👍🏻

[@ayzenshiro1090]

Thank you!

[@Ahnestly]

Thanks for taking the time to say this. Means a lot!

[@Creeper9112000]

What do you think about the HBADA E3 Pro/Ultra? I was planning to get my Embody in the sale rn, but today I saw this "newcommer" and just wanted to ask whether you know it and what do you think about it. A reply would be really nice

[@atrium12]

I was going to get a refine fabric version didn’t realize the price is different with the mesh/fabric. At the higher price, might as well go all the way with an embody.

[@Ahnestly]

Here in the USA price is the same? Where are you at?

[@atrium12]

@@Ahnestlytypo, I meant alcantara

[@rickv5004]

With the 25% discount, are there any other discounts you can stack on top?

[@kyactus4325]

Hey man, I have a Corsair T3 Rush that I used in my studio, but now I've moved my setup to the living room and I’d like a chair with a more office-like and ergonomic look. Would you recommend the Hbada, the Sihoo, or something else? Thanks

[@S7tronic]

Thanks for your excellent content, based on your reviews I just ordered the gaming Embody and an Atlas headrest, I have a Gesture with headrest for the last 10 months, but find the seat too hard-having to use a memory foam cushion on a 1K plus chair irks me.. love how you snuck in the like & subscribe prompt, very slick 😁

[@Ahnestly]

LOL thank you! And hope you love it! (And hope you were able to use my links! Helps the channel a LOT!)

[@Mezxxii]

Love the chair review but I also love that Daytona.😍

[@joe25x]

Could you please review the autonomous ErgoChair chair ultra

[@KingJerbear]

Hey man, I just wanted to thank you for your videos, they are invaluable. Especially when it comes to direct comparison. My only question is... are there stores somewhere that you can actually sit in chairs like these to try them out before purchase? I tried googling it but like Staples shows up and that's about it. I'm also on the East coast in Connecticut so that probably doesn't help.

[@sumivescent]

I wonder if you've ever thought about trying to get your hand on Kinnarps chairs ? As I understand it, while scant, they're getteable in US. Not sure how much traffic you get from EU and if it would be worthwhile but in Europe they are one of the main alternatives to HM or Steelcase and I do wonder how they stack up since there's dearth of reviews of them on net. On paper, Plus and especially 9000 have impressive set of features and are quite cheap comparatively.

[@donalddial5786]

Interesting video! I would have expected you compare the Refine against cheaper ergonomic chairs that don't have that much-sought-after racing chair aesthetic. Like Refine vs Colamy Atlas, or Refine vs the Branch Ergonomic w/ the headrest. 🤷‍♂️ (Personally I'm trying to decide between the Refine and the Branch w/ headrest)

[@Ahnestly]

If I could offer a personal suggestion...go with the Colamy Atlas. I like that the seat cushion is thicker and has more adjustments than the Branch! Downside is warranty is ??? lol. Fractal Refine has a much straighter back compared to Colamy Atlas, which has a slight recline to it, depending on how you like to sit. Also, Atlas' back will feel super slippery bc of the mesh material they use in the backrest compared to Atlas where you feel pretty set in place. Hope this helps and as always, please consider using my link if you pick up!

[@snostorm100]

I really enjoy your videos. However I would caution the height recommendations for the Embody. I'm just under 6'2" about 230 pounds with broad shoulders. I have had the Gaming Embody for a week and the top of the back rest on the Embody makes this chair unusable to me. I have messed with the adjustments incessantly and can not eliminate this. I search on Reddit and I have come across many with the same issue. Everything is top notch the seat the build quality, the arms are ok for me. The back just ruins it. I sat my wife in it and she was really impressed however the top of her shoulders are below the top of the back and it just cups her whole back. I can appreciate that these chairs and user experiences can be subjective. I would caution potential buyers however this is a serious design flaw with this chair if you have a long torso and broad shoulders.

[@dreamix0949]

Hi Dan, I’m 167 cm 5’5 tall, and very few chairs fit me properly because I have short legs. I don’t want to use a footrest. Would the Embody work for me, or should I go for a Leap V2 or a Sayl instead ? It will mainly be for gaming. I play with a controller, so I tend to sit in a slightly reclined position. Thanks

[@Sinsanatis]

dam no lumbar support adjustment for that price is wild

[@kasunyip4676]

Is the embody worth the 400 pounds over the fern

[@Personal_Comp]

The Embody's seat has four layers, none of which are like the back of the chair. Two of the layers are the spring layers. Just Google embody chair seat and look at the images.

[@wertywerrtyson5529]

I tried the Fractal fabric that my friend bought and it felt very nice. But I’ve never spent that much on a chair. I have an IKEA Markus that I got about 5 years ago before the inflation when it was 1500SEK (about 150 bucks) now it’s 2500. Fractal is 7000 here about 700 bucks. Prices include the 25% sales taxes we have in Sweden. Herman miller is so out of my price range.

[@algotn]

I recently bough one from inet, and while yes its expensive. Its not quite as extreme as you make it sound. I bough it for 6499 SEK, which approximately equals 600 USD (Not 700. Yeah, the SEK really is that weak atm)

[@NarwhalBoop]

Which is better for a bigger (not taller) guy?

[@Ahnestly]

Embody. The turned up edges on the Refine may not make it best for wider folks!

[@janpichrt]

Refine (not mesh).... with Embody, armrests will be touching your hips :) if you are wide

[@Noneya5555]

Is the seat on the Refine as hard as the Secretlab Titan Evo? I'm still in the market for a chair, and this is one of the 2 choices I've narrowed it down to. I'm looking to replace my ancient and decrepit Titan. I considered a refurb Crandall Office Steelcase Leap V2, but I like to rock in my chair, and reline at a deeper angle. Also, is the seatpan long enough in the default position using the 2-finger rule for someone who's 5'8"? I've seen reviewers also say that the seatpan was too short. Lastly, how easy is it to move the armrests? And if I swivel them in or out, will it lock them? Do you have an affiliate link for the Refine?

[@YuokoII]

Bro just go and watch Refine review wtf

[@jackboxer7537]

Awesome review, as usual! How can I convince to encourage healthy ergonomics instead of damaging cross-legged sitting? 😂

[@varunaX]

your price comparison should have been at the start. the embody is almost 3k CAD after tax. i have no words

[@Ahnestly]

That video is next week 🙃 SORRY 2 weeks from now!

[@bcc5701]

If you sit all day for work (as I do) a few thousand is small price to pay vs having back pain and issues later in life. The generation above mine sat in crappy chairs their whole career and are now suffering the consequences long term. Was one of the first things I was told by multiple people “get a nice chair. Spend the money”

[@AlphaConde-qy7vi]

Right now the Embody is 25% off on the manufacturer's website, at around 1450€. Still roughly three times the price of the Refine, zo... I don't think this is warranted.

[@Noneya5555]

You're right, t's not warranted. Like other companies, chair manufacturers blamed price increases on covid. But after covid waned, they continued the price gouging out of pure greed. And buyers just continued to accept those price increases, while ignorantly and wrongly blaming their governments for them.

[@bruh9391]

Any opinions on the Fractal Refine versus the Leap V2?

[@Ahnestly]

2 totally different chairs, but general idea is the same. Leap = cushy and more flexible sitting. MUCH more huggy in the lower back area compared to the Embody. Lumbar is best in the Leap I think (more controls). No good headrest YET (Atlas and Crandall Office are working on one right now...will report back as soon as I get one to review!). Hope this helps! Let me know what you decide and please consider using my links if you decide to pick up!

[@bruh9391]

@@AhnestlyI think I’m going to end up going for a Crandall Leap V2. Do you know if they do any Black Friday sales?

[@Jacksonas]

Hey, man, kinda off-topic, but I am curious if you have had a chance to try the GX4 by BodyBilt or the LFG by LF Gaming?

[@Ahnestly]

Haven't tried those!

[@fiddytroisvis]

What headrests do you use for the embody? Also what is a fair resale price for my 2020 logitech embody in good condition?

[@Ahnestly]

sorry about that forgot the link! $5 off Headrest w/ my link: geni.us/Atlas5Off

[@numbone]

Its the Atlas Headrest

[@PrimusTechnology]

Would you recommend the Haworth fern because my main point of pain with my andaseat Kaiser 3 was the cusion was bad.

[@Ahnestly]

I'm personally a fan of the cushion on the Kaiser 3. What didn't you like? Too firm? The shape? The Fern's cushion will be on the firmer side, but softer than the Kaiser 3. I love the Fern (sitting in my digital knit fern right now at home writing this).

[@PrimusTechnology]

No it is just that I have had it for a while so the cushion was wearing off

[@PrimusTechnology]

Also I hated the hard edges I am more of a freedom sitter I like to sprawl out my legs

[@shoutingstone]

Been torn between the 2 for months. Plumped for the Embody when it went on sale. That price still stings but my existing chair is getting on for 20 years old and cost around £200 so i figured i was due an upgrade. Your videos have been pretty helpful with my decision making (I think anyway, its still on its way!)

[@DubElementMusic]

herman miller is just overpriced

[@Gates-Tech]

debated these 2 and ended up with an aeron.

[@snostorm100]

How do you like it?

[@Subletter]

Haha, this video drops just as I am questioning this myself. Excellent timing Ahn!

[@BLAKGRIP]

Jesus Loves Y’all. Also amazing reviews Dan. Love your work. God Bless.

[@privatesocialhandle]

I have the embody and I tried a lot of top tier chairs, I'll cut it short for ya: If you care about arm rests DON'T get the embody. Period. The adjustments on those are absolute trash. If you care seat depth adjustment, DON'T get the embody, the mechanism on it is absolute trash. If that stuff doesn't bother you and you just want a durable comfortable chair? Then it's a good option.

[@DerrickDevine]

Not sure any chair is worth 2k to be honest.

[@Dx-so7jm]

2 grand for a chair , wowzer , i know people have money but there must be more people out there driving a Porche than sitting in this chair. I would love to try one but seems like lunacy to drop 2gs on a chair without sitting in it.

[@FourFront99]

LOL, this video comes out as my Embody is out for delivery.

[@shoutingstone]

Mine too!

[@Ahnestly]

Embody still king!

[@xxstealerxx]

Its a better chair don't listen to the bot comments

[@alih611]

If i paid for shipping, would you send a subscriber a free chair you no longer use? (throwing a hail Mary...I had to ask)

[@MichaelBrierley]

for the price, Neither are worth it. I've had both. Waste of money

[@roadkill11000]

Just me or is the seat back freakishly large? If chairs were people, this would be Lurch.

[@groto27]

Oh snap

[@Smood47]

embody is not good for sitting with a foot or 2 up because of the annoying plastic side tabs

[@keblin86]

Haha loved the "like and subscribe" part! Also the fact the Embody is 3x the price of the Refine makes the value of the Refine very good and appealing.

[@Ahnestly]

ahahaha

[@valentin1166]

I really don't see how these two chairs belong in the same Category and why a comparison between the two was necessary other than a paid review to make the Refine look like good value. The Fractal Refine looks like the office version of the classic Gaming chairs that every reviewer agrees they are C-D tier and extremely overpriced for what they offer, and on top of that the Refine comes at double their price. I would much rather see a comparision between the Refine and the Ikea Markus to really judge it's value.

[@Ahnestly]

The beginning of the video explained it - a TON of people asked me to compare them or asked me how the Refine held up to the Embody. The Refine seems to have built their chair from the ground up and all the controls are much more in the realm of ergonomics, but with a slimmed down version of the racing style gaming chair.

[@valentin1166]

@@Ahnestly Yeah, I'm sorry but I'm not buying it. That's what every influencer on instagram says before pulling out a paid review out of their ass. On the video you published 2 months ago about the Refine there's barely 5-6 comments asking you how they compare, which I don't think it relly matches the definition of a TON. You could have at least compared the two chairs as a whole, like the title sugests. Instead you do a component by component review without any conclusion on what category the whole pachage falls into, how comfortable they are for long sessions, etc. The Embody is a chair made by a company that has made chairs for more than 100 years. The Refine is the first chair made by a company that builds PC cases. You're comparing Ferrari to the first car protototype of a banana company without any sort of disclaimer that they really don't have anything in common and the difference in value between the two is just ridiculous.

[@Ahnestly]

You realize people have many other means of contacting me other than YT comments (email, Reddit, Instagram)? And if this was a sponsored video, I'm legally required to disclose it. I recommend you watch the whole video before talking out of your ass. I clearly said the Embody is the better chair and the better package with a larger range of seating heights and superb warranty (backed by personal experience with HM warranty). I don't usually say things like "it's great for 8 hour sitting sessions" bc that evaluation is incredibly speculative and that's what I would say if I was trying to just get you to buy something. IMHO, breaking down the components, how things function, the shape, and the feel is more helpful to people wondering whether to buy a chair. You are entitled to your own opinion though, and look forward to your review channel.

[@valentin1166]

@@Ahnestly I'm sure as hell you got a TON of requests by all the other channels but the one you actually publish your main material on, especially by email.