HIDDEN Tank Research - Hoi4 No Step Back Tank Designer Guide

HIDDEN Tank Research - Hoi4 No Step Back Tank Designer Guide
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Feedbacker dumping is where feedback procrastinates with his hobbies and other interests. Warning REALLY BORING or REALLY INTERESTING

[@FeedbackIRL]

We're very close to 10k subs! What kind of content do you want to see more of on the second channel?

[@anxiouspaw]

updated country tutorials (or just normal tutorials), those would be fun

[@VonPlanter]

Extra things like this video

[@WensBlog]

We prefer contents of just Hoi4 only

[@miel307]

Just normal HOi4 playthroughs like you did in the good old days. With some EEEEEEP noises aswell

[@syco3428]

Please do monarchists russia

[@Boronak759]

It does not show, but each new researched chassis has a higher reliability. The stats just cap out at 100% for some reason. Check it out in the tank designer

[@Boronak759]

So the jist of it is that later tank chassis will be able to have more modules, engine and armor without shredding your reliability

[@MinecraftMasterNo1]

How can something be more reliable than 100%? That's an obvious one

[@moeite7756]

@feedbackdumping give this man a pin, this is 100% correct but not displayed properly in the research tab. Medium tanks seem to have 30% increased reliability every new version while Heavies only have 15% (however, their armor scaling is more drastic). Also I'd like to mention adding an amphibious drive also decreased Hardness by 15% which is not mentioned in the research tab.

[@alfienorris188]

@@MinecraftMasterNo1 they are above 100% reliability because that is preparing the chassis for all the upgrades the player will put on lowering the reliability bit by bit, so the higher tier chassis do give more reliability im assuming t1 is 100 t2 120 t3 140 or something like that, game just bugged until a patch to show that in the research screen

[@anonydun82fgoog35]

@@MinecraftMasterNo1 Say you have a weapon (like say aircraft) which you need 4 to have 2 aircraft in the air all the time, 1 being serviced and 1 whose pilot is resting: that is perfect (100%) reliability. Then you get an aircraft that say never needs to be serviced, meaning you can have 3 in the air and 1 resting... so > 100% reliability.... It's easy to justify as a number assuming you accept that 100% is "industry standard" because "perfect" doesn't exist, can only be approximated. Then >100% becomes "better than normal", not "better than perfect".

[@KAPTAINmORGANnWo4eva]

The current "meta" of real life is attributing the Fall of France to German radios and Guderian/Rommel's initiative and mobility so it's cool the tank tech in the game reflects that

[@adrielcamilo2564]

Correct but debatable, Charles Huntzieger being a total useless leader in the Ardennes area, for real, the dude literally did everything to make HIS work harder. Allies completely disregard for air common sense, like, why use planes in reconnaissance and spot the biggest traffic jam in history of warfare? Why use planes as a ground support? Beyond me! The fact that the British thought that more delays in deliver of the first tank division to the front would made her more "practical", they literally "modernized" the matildas II with a higher suspension, even when they PERFECTLY know the problem with the matilda II was the tracks (early tracks are troublesome in matildas). And even earlier problems like the fact that De Gaulle shot himself in the foot by publishing a book that thought a professional army was the correct way (with was, but not for the leftist paranoiac government), literally people didn't know how to maintain the B1s tanks, how to proper fuel the Somuas and some "common tanks" like the H35 or R35 were crewed by my who trained in FTs, with is fine if you got time to prepare yourself for the new tank... (guess what? They don't). And for the British tank situation I think Lidel Hart with his megalomaniac out of the realm of reality ideas speak for himself...

[@jimkirk9890]

It'll be interesting to see if people will actually spam Radar as well now, since the research is really crucial to get anyway, where previously it was mostly a niche thing. Which is also where I kinda disagree with the design of the radio module: The later radios should not be that much more powerful than the early ones. I know there is a difference IRL between multi-channel 2 way encrypted radios and the very early stuff, but still the gap is just too big right now

[@ertrick3693]

I mean, as with all things there's more than one reason why France fell so easily (outdated/unadaptable war doctrine, unreliable military leadership for the most part, and France itself being a political mess of infighting and steep division, among other reasons), but yeah, lmao, I've seen an uptick of a lot of people pointing to the fact that the French still used flag and hand signals to communicate on the battlefield while Germany was using radios. They aren't entirely wrong, though - radios are leaps and bounds better than flags. And in-game, radio has always been valuable (at least the first level of radio), but now it's even more valuable 'cuz it makes your tanks ridiculously strong.

[@XMysticHerox]

I mean radios were very important not just during the Fall of France. There is a reason all nations adopted them for tanks pretty quickly.

[@jidk6565]

But isn't that like still incredibly important? Individual engagements where won by the germans entirely off of there coordination (especially when any French heavies where involved) And said initiative and mobility kinda did cause an entire army to collapse and massive routes across France I'd argue air power played way more into it, and the competence and incompetence of both sides that where most important But those 2 things where literally some of the most notable and important moments and innovations I'm history

[@annilator3000]

Gonna feel funny when you make the most expensive most armored tank and your ennemy slaps an high velocity anti-tank gun, squeeze bored gun, with 200+ penetration on an inter-war chassis, very cheaply

[@xModerax]

Which is basically just a stationary anti tank gun which also happens to move sometimes 😂

[@uncletimo6059]

@@xModerax so... a tank destroyer then. like they existed in ww2

[@TheMelnTeam]

@@uncletimo6059 It will be felt in HOI 4 though. Prior to now, it was not possible to pierce heavy tanks with armor upgrades gouged with anything other than heavies or modern TD. We'll see how players adjust, but it wouldn't shock me to see meta shift away from pushing armor + heavy tank.

[@uncletimo6059]

@@TheMelnTeam ohai ye olde civ4 creator. help me win on prince (i suck)

[@gkagara]

With speed of 4.0 km/h you can have 225+ armor with 102% reliability. Good luck pen that. With good tank manufacturer Idea slapped it's easy 230+. Hard attack is trash though it's probably the most useless stats in the game.

[@linusorm]

Being a tank buff: Cast armour isn't actually stronger than welded armour. In actuality it's ~15-20% worse than welded armour (although far superior in protection compared to riveted armour). However: The advantages of cast armour is evident. It permits the production of designs that are effectively impossible to achieve through welded armour. The curved turret of the Sherman or the T-72 are clear examples of this. It's more expensive and difficult to achieve due to the need to actually design and build casts. But the entire tank isn't cast. It's mostly just the turret, sometimes the front hull (as with the early Shermans, but that were dropped for welded hulls).

[@konstantinriumin2657]

Also, welds can be fault lines, while cast armor doesn't have such weakness. And welding thick plates wasn't always easy. So, while it's not as effective on per-millimeter-of thickness basis, cast armor can be what you are looking for when protection matters

[@penzorphallos3199]

@@konstantinriumin2657 true but if a welded plate cracks or is found deficient, it can be replaced technically. But if there's a crack on your cast Hull or turret well gotta throw the whole thing away

[@hedgeearthridge6807]

@@penzorphallos3199 I work in a factory that casts Aluminum. Casting is a nightmare to do properly. I sometimes have to send back cylinder heads to be melted down 200 at a time, because of casting defects. Same goes for Steel, but you don't even have the advantage Aluminum does of using tool steel molds, you have to use sand and such instead which can be damaged while pouring in the molten steel.

[@circleofsorrow4583]

@@penzorphallos3199 Nah, you would just weld the fault in most cases 😜

[@boxcarz]

@@konstantinriumin2657 If your weld lines are weaker than the rest of the armor, you need to hire a new welder.

[@Enchie]

I have to say, this is much better then Man the Guns. By having it so connected, it doesn't feet like you have to sacrifice half the tech tree, just to keep up with tanks, like you have to do with ships. But I still wish they added one extra slot for every nation. Maybe when they do planes.

[@bramvanderwoerdt7186]

they effectively added a slot for every nation by removing the research of doctrines.

[@Enchie]

@@bramvanderwoerdt7186 True. And those were the most time consuming outside of nuclear. But if they do the same with planes in the future, they would still need to add another one.

[@madensmith7014]

MtG had some techs already using that, like AA and radar, and the first fire control system. I guess not a lot of tech translates to Navy tech.

[@Enchie]

@@madensmith7014 I wouldn't say that. Get rid of those two radar tech navy has for some reason, and that improved guns could be split between artillery and antitank.

[@voltairethegoldflame9280]

@@Enchie Are you referring to Fire Control systems? I thought Navy Radar is handled by the engineering radar systems now. I'd just ask them to make a few of the Naval techs a little cheaper - which they kinda did.

[@montenegro3773]

About the chasis, on the reseacrh tree isnt shown but researching the next hull gives extra reliability. Im not sure why u say price doesnt matter ( 7:23 ), when u could do a mass army of efficient tanks instead of just a handful Im not sure of what is the "meta", but things i have noticed: 1 -Flametrhowers support companies, adds good attack buffs. So since a tank wont do much just as a support, why not mass producing the cheapest light tank, and even adding a dozer blade for extra entrenchment. (you can have this support flame battalion for almost the same production of a engineer support batallion, the drwback is how late u reseacrh flametanks) 2 - I love the maus with a panzer 1 turret (light single man turret), and of course, a maus cannon. (if u go for cheap, the price is just the hull 38 ) 3 -ALWAYS make ur tanks, if u can, tank destroyers, by researching anti-tank tree u get free +20% piercing and +10% hard atatck for each passive reseacrh, up to total of +60% piercing (im not secure but i think its even more) if ur tank is a tank destroyer. (3,2)- Mixing this u can have cheap maus antitanks with up to 400 piercing, which are cheaper to produce than adding anti-tank cannon to a batallion, and the best part is that they have more piercing. (im not secure this of using super-heavies as anti-tank guns work in means of the tank survival, and also mixing tanks with infantry dont work much along, but hey its cheaper than at guns, so...) 4 - Dont know if no one noticed but u can make defensive tanks (with high defense), not much of a deal. I hope i gave u some ideas :D

[@montenegro3773]

@?????? the maus thing is a bug, u caan try it, it let u have both cannon and panzer 1 turret. (also with maus i mean the super heavy tank)

[@madensmith7014]

From my few games as the UK and Japan, I find having fast tanks being way more useful. You want to be able to move quickly to make encirclements while your units still have supply.

[@gildedphoenix]

Which is the intended reason for tank divisions. They're not to snake around but create pockets, "schwerpunkt" of whole mobile warfare is about.

[@mikkel066h]

Yea and if you smack some logi companies in with them speed is one of the greatest things you can have on your tanks.

@@gildedphoenix Yes. Having speed and cutting the enemy off of their supply hubs is the goal.

[@gildedphoenix]

@ HOLY SHIT I DIDN'T EVEN THINK OF THAT!!

@@gildedphoenix Having played a Japan game, pushing China is easy once you go from one supply hub to another. Marching into enemy territory by focusing on the supply hubs is the best way to win a war. Without supply they can't do anything.

[@ertrick3693]

I've taken to basing my tank designs on a reliability threshold. I tend to go for 80%, because that seems like the point where your tanks won't break down *too* much. The primary heavy tank build I used was the '39 Heavy Chassis, Torsion Bar (gives you hella leeway), gas engine, welded armor (was able to pump out, like, probably 20 a day), simple Heavy Cannon 1, Three Man Turret, Sloped Armor, Armor Skirts, Radio 1 (only because I didn't have access to higher level radios at the time of creation), and Additional Machine Guns, with Engine and Armor both at 7 (may be forgetting details here and there). It could 100% be better, but it's done well enough against enemy AI divisions that my infantry and light tanks have difficulty pushing against.

[@FeedbackIRL]

Expensive

[@hedgeearthridge6807]

In my own games, ive found that a medium tank with a medium howitzer, decent armor, 9kmh speed (to keep up with Mechanized), radio, and near 100% reliability, absolutely crush every division it meets. Divisions have like 600 soft attack, 1000+ breakthrough, etc. Dont fight enemy tanks, just encircle them. Problem is these tanks are EXPENSIVE. As Germany I was only able to maintain 2 divisions 75% comprised of them to act as an armored spearhead, with some cheap divisions of 50/50 Panzer II's and Motorized/Mechanized to follow up and be the "shaft" of the spear.

[@hedgeearthridge6807]

And it goes without saying, that you need air superiority. But it seems like Air was seriously buffed! It used to be that 500 CAS barely did anything and was basically pointless. Now even 100 CAS do some huge damage, like 38 to Org and things like that. Also Air Supply actually works properly! It can seriously help out bad areas where trains just can't do all the work

[@xenosfur]

@@hedgeearthridge6807 From what I know CAS is just as effective as before. AA reduces dmg done by CAS by 75%, so its likely the enemy you were fighting did not have AA in their divisions. The only time I see 30+ CAS dmg is when the AI refuses to use AA (especially on minor nations), altho most of the time its just 6~ dmg as the AI templates have AA inside.

[@CerisVG]

The Dozer Blade looks bad on paper, however each of the entrenchment stacks with each unit in the division, then with Field marshes/general bonus’, 4000 combat defence is easily achieved…

[@favorius]

I went GBP doctrine with USSR and added dozer blades to tanks. With proper general traits my infantry had 100 entrenchment. In 2 years Germany lost 6 million to my 200k man when trying to breach my Baltic to Black Sea line.

[@uF1G]

new meta, paratrooper drops on the railways cuts the supply

[@alifio2183]

Guys believe me reliability is crazy important. Even in 100% reliability the terrain (or weather?) Can break them down. My tank loss rate higher due to attrition than in combat :/ Also, the wheel suspension actually useful early game to spam AT light tonks. Imagine its an oversized armored cars. But you really need to use diesel and lost some armor/speed to up the reliability or if you're fighting just in europe (excluding russian shitty terrain, infras and wether) you can sacrifice some reliability for speed and armor. Also lastly, for some reason dev put so little pros to sloped armor addon. Sloped armor can add up to 50% effective armor thickness irl and not very hard to make (in game it crazily increase production cost). But you do have harder time to design such tank. Thus the cons should be higher "army experience" cost to design rather than production cost percentage!!

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

Sloped armour does increase costs, that's why the sherman has a reduction in its frontal armour slopes in later models and the panther had reduced slopeing in its side armour in later models.

[@MundaneThingsBackwards]

6:14 For Med. and Heavy tanks armor is literally everything because you get a bonus to damage negated for every point of armor below the enemy's piercing but above 75% of it so even "close enough" armor compared to the enemy's piercing is still amazing. On top of that better tanks give you better reliability which not only lets you mount the better, heavier, but reliability reducing guns, but lets you upgrade armor and / or speed even more than before. Whatever you want. So, yes, the upgrades to better chassis are *definitely* necessary. Light tanks, not so much but still worth. BTW You can make some crazy light tank builds that can stack a TON of soft attack. They're paper because you completely ignore armor and go for 12 mph speed (any more is wasted because trucks can't go faster...), maximum soft attack through your main, secondary and addon machine guns (no radio or HORRIBLE secondary cannons, too expensive) and 90-100% reliability depending on if you take maintenence companies but they can pack a punch PIERCE EVERYTHING (slap a single light tank destroyer in there or two, you won't be disappointed) and take less damage despite getting pierced by a single infantryman's loud fart, because they are still a lot harder than plain infantry or motorized.

[@thememehead]

Love how he just made a tiger tank in the middle there

[@freyawion5337]

my "meta", worked in SP very very well, not sure about MP: 8/8/2/1 for Medium Tanks/Mot or Mech/LSPG/SPAA. Mediums: 1940 chassis, medium improved HV cannon, 3-man turret, wet ammo storage, armor skirts, radio, defensive MG, welded armor, christie suspension, gasoline engine. Engine and armor give you ~98% reliability, 12km/h and ~90 armor with a speed+reliability tank designer (I used Henschel because Germany). LSPG: 38 (?, the one given to Germany at the start as the Pz2) chassis, fixed superstructure, medium improved howitzer, same modules as medium. Armor is around 26, but soft attack is 40 compared to the medium's 20-25. LSAA: same as LSPG but 2-man turret and improved AA gun. Gives ~20 AA attack.

[@Buzzdog1971]

You forgot the stabilizer in the first section, you unlock it with the counting machines. It gives a boost to breakthrough.

[@kozaklm94]

I love how the new "meta" after the update is, play the game like your fighting in World War 2

[@vicentea.3692]

Yes, the use of hotwizers and multi-purpose Cannons(High Explosive ammo for infantery fighting and Armor Penetration for bukers and other tanks) for a basic tank in the war are Mandatory in simple desing, when the tanks have more Armor, desings change in High Velocity Cannons like 88mm Tiger 1 and/or High Explosive Rounds Shields with medium Velocity like the 120mm of the IS-2

[@jaysvideos9107]

Me editing tanks be like... BIGGER GUN MOAR ARMOUR SCREW THE ENGINES SUSPENSION? PFT THAT'S SUS That's probably why my tanks were so slow lol

[@muhammadahmadi8652]

The Meta would be designing a tank to be counted as S.heavy or heavy , so less tanks needed per devision.

[@biriking4553]

i think flamethrower on tanks are pretty much useless. its like 5 soft attack and yeah okay you get 50%?? on cities? but then you can also just use the howitzer gun which does like 50 soft attack and maybe lose some of it in the towns. but it is still better in soft attack after all isnt it?

[@gildedphoenix]

Flame tank with dozer is like a armored engineer company.

[@brycep6988]

The real advantage of flame tanks are the support companies they make that give attack bonuses to jungle and urban provinces (up to 35% on one I made last night). If you want to make a unit specialized for jungle warfare, flame tank support companies give a massive bonus that shouldn't be overlooked.

[@biriking4553]

Ah never thought about that. Maybe i should give them another Chance. Thx

[@12gark]

@@brycep6988 so basically they are the best support company for marines... Interesting, never thought about that.

[@pavelslama5543]

Before the logistics rework, I used the RT56 mod, updated the truck engine to go 16kph average, and updated the medium tank speed to go almost as fast, and update a light tank engine and armor. The result was that I could chew through enemy lines faster than he could transport divisions there to stop me. However with this logistics system, I think that any fast movement kind of warfare is essentially dead, and you have to use the American/soviet style of warfare.

[@RedSander_BR]

Pdx should give tanks with high speed a breakthrough bonus as to make players also care about speed and maybe make that if a enemy tank has twice your div speed they lose half org like armor.

[@Phoenix-ik7bm]

As someone who has already done some testing around with tanks; you want some speed to allow yourself to more easily encircle enemy troops, but obviously not put too much into speed as you'll be wasting reliability that could have gone into getting beater armor or breakthrough. (also you forgot about the gun stabilizer that you get when you research computer tech 3 which gives 2 breakthrough.)

[@JacobKelly2]

This was useful, thanks so much Dave!

[@MrHodoAstartes]

I think reliability will in the end be decisive because it means you keep more tanks while the enemy needs to produce more, giving you overwhelming numbers before long. My guess for meta is T-34s (medium 2 with cast armor and easy maintenance) with suped-up radios and howitzers.

[@jeffl0385]

The problem with rivets is less about creating gaps and holes and more about shooting those rivets inside the tank, basically like firing bullets inside a steel can with fleshy people inside

[@johncochrane1301]

Another GREAT video!! Question, with all of these Armoured options - how will division stats work now with the ability to have three/four different Armoured models in the same division? Secondly, what would "new," Armoured division look like?

[@PikaPilot]

Wheeled/Half-Track suspensions seem like good options for cheaper SPAA, maybe not SPG/late TDs as their bigger guns have a huge reliability penalty.

[@FeedbackIRL]

YES! Last I checked they only worked on light tanks

[@alessandromsk3195]

Thank you Dave. Very cool

[@WalrusJones185]

Reliability is not the same actually for higher tier tanks. So this is a really minor quirk: - Outside of interwar tanks, tanks are over 100% reliability and the equipment viewer is capping this to 100%, but the chassis go up to 160% base reliability. This gets insane because advanced light tanks can hit 12km/s, have 3 units of extra ammo stowage, and a still be at around 83-90% reliability depending on your gun choice. (This being a reliability score that people are happy with with on aircraft/firearms....) This gives around 60 breakthrough/30 defense. (You can tick the armor button 4 times to without adding any extra steel, but add 5 extra breakthrough mind you....) This is likely going to have a more lasting meta impact then the armor, just because of how efficient tank destroyers are likely to be. (A light turreted tank destroyer with a production cost of around 11 for example hits 119 piercing, which is enough to foil 159 armor tanks. This is because the tank destroyer designation automatically applies national anti-tank gun modifiers to the TD!)

[@gildedphoenix]

I think non-Boogie suspension - Welded Armor - non-electric engines are gonna be the basis of the template then the high velocity guns will be multiplayer pick and howitzer or standart gun for SP. Radio 3 will be rushed, and best special equipments are currently Dozers, stabilizers and reliability upgrades. So to my ideal tank: With 80% reliability limit: Heavy: Torsion bar - Welded (difference with Cast is probably not the worth the cost) - G Engine - best Heavy Cannon available - three man turret - Radio 3 - Stabilizer - Armor skirt - Reliability equipment then drop the excess reliability to 80 with armor/engine upgrades. Ideal speed of tbe tank must not be higher than 8km/h. Light: Christie - welded - G or GT engine - Best autocannon with three man turret - radio 3 - stabilizer ×2 reliability equipment thank buff speed up to 16km/h if reliability allows, otherwise to 12km/h. And if there are still excess reliability add armor. Medium: Panther suspension (the interblabla one) welded - non electric engine - best medium cannon 3man turret and radio again - stabilizer - slope or skirt then reliability. Speed should not be higher than 12, and not lower than 8. Then adjust armor level accordingly again.

[@gildedphoenix]

Also, super heavies can be fun idea to play around now it seems, if anyone ever gonna waste time researching them. But modern turret seems awesome. 24 flat breakthrough stat is awesome.

[@lasagnakob9908]

You forgot the Stabilizer in Engineering lol

[@zacharytaylor2423]

The meta is going to be highly armored AA vehicles. I'm not even joking. 30% of your division's armor is the armor of the most well-armored line battalion. Different battalions use a different number of vehicles. Regular tanks use the most and AA the least, with the exact number depending on the vehicle size. Thus if you make one really well armored battalion you can entirely ignore armor on all of your SPGs, TDs and tanks, making them much cheaper to produce. SPGs in particular because if you compromise on the turret you can put a medium howitzer on a light hull. On the defense, stacking the entrenchment from dozer blades is going to be a thing. They fit on any type of vehicle and each gives you +2, equivalent to an engineering tech tier, even if used in support companies.

[@bryanrussell8190]

I believe people may end up using amphibious heavy tanks. Heavy tanks can get the highest soft attack, and amphibious tanks can get a bonus from the commando high command.

[@gamingtastisch]

Thanks for the nice tutorial

[@lucajohnen6719]

Watch Specialised Tank-Destroyer Brigades becoming a thing now with their high velocity canons. Also, without speed you wont be able to really exploit the holes these "mega tanks" punch into the line. Or maybe AT becomes standart in defensive oriented divisions? It will be fun to see what happens

[@samueljames0908]

Something I've noticed with tanks: reliability is everything. It allows more armor and more engine. Also, GT is better for reliability at higher speeds because you need less engine points for the same max speed. Also, components that give percentage bonuses are best. Angled armor is an automatic pickup.

[@1Maklak]

Up to 1942, basic infantry plus artillery get 5 Piercing, so any template with Armour above 5 will be good against most AI templates. Early game, Light Tanks costing about 10 production are good enough. I like speed on my tanks. It's needed for encirclements. Plus Mechanized can be upgraded with XP now (speed, reliability, armour, cost reduction), but Amtracks can't. So you can get 15 km/h Mechanized 3 and 10 km/h Amtracks. You can't make Modern Armour Flame or Amphibious Tanks, but can make Heavy Flame and Amphibious Tanks. So my target Speed is 15 km/h for Modern and Heavy Flame Tanks, and 10 km/h for Heavy Amphibious Tanks and both are doable. Welded Armour with no upgrades seems good enough for the most part.

[@TheKlink]

0:54 and to think i was laughing at Ork vehicle designs

[@FlowerGuy32]

More! Please Give Us More No Step Back Content! Thank you!

[@ausnorman8050]

Another good video on the new DLC... I probably should buy it lol

[@GenericAmerican1]

There are more upgrades hidden in the electronics research page. One of the fire controls should also give you gyrostsbilizers for tanks

[@crowbarviking3890]

No no, you got that wrong. The Tech tree is bugged in appearance. Light 3 goes to modern. Not to Medium 3

[@crowbarviking3890]

Also, for me the meta changed from medium to light tank all the way. Thanks to the modifications you can do, you just do not need medium tanks anymore. At least against the AI. Also you can make a light heavy tank. I.e. make a light tank focused on defense by going diesel, adding tons of reliability and armor add ons and in the last step add armor points till it drops to 4kmh speed. Then add it to infantry. "Space Marines" reborn. I call it "the self propelled wall".

[@gildedphoenix]

Or speedy speed boy heavy tonks...

[@TheMelnTeam]

Speed on tanks died a bit with fuel and trashed supply. To win with speed, you need to be able to actually break through the line, prevent getting hosed by pinning attacks, and create/hold the pocket w/o dying to supply issues. Relatively large encirclements on no supply aren't a thing though, tanks and mot will become slower than infantry. If you can't utilize speed behind enemy lines for more than a few seconds, your fallback is to make the pockets you attempt to create smaller, and instead force their creation with raw power rather than maneuverability micro. The dev's indefensible change to make the UI strictly worse (wrt planning bonus change) is a factor in this change in tank preference as well. Less moving before pocket + less complex pockets = less time with accelerated planning bonus decay.

[@vicentea.3692]

A wheel tank is like Venezuela "Tortuga" tank, a Ford wheeled-truck with chains coupled with naval-grade whelded steel with a one man 7mm Mauser British MG copula, and 4 7mm MGs in 360°, Venezuela not have the tortuga tanks in the Stockpille

[@signoguns8501]

Every tank is going to be like late-WW2 British tanks. Just get as much in as possible lol

[@technoimperialist9509]

I hope next time is division template

[@RobinMeineke]

So far I’ve actually seen more points in favor of riveted armor as you can get similar levels of armor a lot cheaper. Only of you want 200 Armor on your tank you would want cast armor. But it’s super expensive and can still get pierced easily by tank destroyers.

[@maxomat4319]

If you research super heavies you get a super heavy gun you can put on a heavy chassis with fixed mount. With this gun you can pen anything it doesn´t matter if you max out the armour you will still be penned.

[@FeedbackIRL]

I mean sure but what's the point in a expensive defensive tank?

[@Gwebb74]

I think the best tank you can make is a tank modern tank destroyer with a super heavy cannon i had 260 pen and 250 armor still had 100% reliable

[@Sahtoovi]

Making a 120 armor medium tank in 1941 as the USSR to create a literal wall of steel is nice

[@ruukinen]

Light tank 3 doesn't go into medium 3 even though it looks like it. It goes straight into modern tanks. So all the tank paths lead to modern tanks. You can test this out by just unlocking the light tanks, you'll see that the medium is not researchable but modern tanks are. I also disagree with people putting everything possible into the tank. I agree that the tanks are gonna be soft attack based but you'll want to keep the production cost down since it is already a lot higher than before this new patch. In fact in some ways I feel like tanks might not even be worth it anymore in some parts where the terrain is garbage. CAS just does so much more damage.

[@martinnimcevic565]

step 1: take every module that increases reliability step 2: add beefiest gun possible step 3: hit engine and armor until reliability gets down to 85

[@leiaorgana5098]

Step 4: add maintenance support company to division. Step 5: profit.

[@Luredreier]

The whole reliability is the same between basic and advanced chassies thing isn't actually true. Yes, they're both "100%" but there's some kind of hidden stats at play from what I understand.

[@FeedbackIRL]

Watch the updated video

[@CARL_093]

I made effective thanks on my planned atk very nc hehe

[@Destragond]

Do you still get pre-made designs for when you want to keep it simple or do you have to turn off the DLC for that?

[@jeremielarin1979]

I think that a twin turrets devising with max anti tank in one and max howiser on a super heavy chassis

[@markusreed5447]

The Anti-Tank meta is gonna be Light Tanks with a High Pierce Cannon, because cheap 135 Pierce base with a Anti Tank Cannon Version 2

[@rafiakbar803]

that gas turbine joke caught me off guard

[@sulc4092]

Heavy tank with riveted armour, flamethrower and 4 mg turrets

[@EgnachHelton]

No, I think speed is even more important than before because you want your tank to penetrate as deeply as possible before they run out of supply grace period.

[@gorkarullan]

I have not had problems with supplies, it is true that now in the Russian campaign progress is slower. but in general in Poland, France and Norway it is even faster. I think the problem is the REPAIR of the train lines and the infrastructures. The REPAIR of the train tracks and infrastructures is too slow and I have also noticed that the wear in terms of manpower is greater. It also gives me the feeling that using divisions with a width greater than 20 is a mistake; they consume more resources and it is not possible to make such deep “penetrations”, the units run out of resources, because the infrastructures are of a lower level. It is much more profitable to use 22/24 width divisions. But worst of all are the repairs to the supply pounds, in Russia it is impossible, you are all the campaign trying to fix the train lines.

[@arankoka]

Theres is no more meta, now there are different ones. howitzer tanks > light stuff, but hard attack tanks (which cant break inf easily) > howitzer tanks. I also think using different tanks in your template might be very good. start with soft attack, and change more and more into heavy+hard. As it happened in WW2. The ultimate hard tank has no more punch vs soft targets, so u still need these vulnerable artillery tanks. important change: antitank tanks now have 3 width, it was 2. This is a major nerf. Maybe it is to nerf their lower equipment need. first u r right, this mass soft attack thing will of course rule (poland, france); but after a while; 1941-1942 maybe; antitank designs will destroy these. just how it was. maybe soft attack+breakthough tanks + motorised AT +mot/mech will be interesting to have for an allrounder.

[@ViktorVildras]

What I have done is make medium tanks my general soft attack ones, and made my light tanks the tank killers.

[@boxcarz]

Why light tanks for tank killers rather than heavies?

[@MrNicoJac]

@@boxcarz Because you don't need armor, just piercing and hard attack. Also, light tanks are useful research for other uses, but heavy tanks are not and are very expensive. This is sorta why WW2 USA tank destroyers were mostly fast-response units, not indestructible behemoths :)

[@ViktorVildras]

@@boxcarz low production costs. If i were to use heavies i would make them the main battle tank and use mediums for tank killers.

[@Daggoth65]

i love fast tanks, for encirclements

[@Trifler500]

There's a massive difference in Reliability between IW Medium and Basic Medium though.

[@derpiestderp325]

inf equipment 1 actually unlocks mgs and stuff lmao

[@suidkorea]

This is so fun

[@TheyCalledMeT]

hmmmmm... i am missing the "guide" part, but it was entertaining anyways

[@andrewgreenwood9068]

As long as Australia is able to make a tank with 3 car engines I will be happy

[@dannymerov]

im confused when i compare designed tank stats to actual templates using them ( i made like a 40w tank/mech/spg template). to me it seems like the values on the tank dont rly match to what i see in the actual template. im probably a noob, but if someone gets it. i wouldnt mind hearing about it

[@rexmopser7152]

You missed the mainfail in the update if you juggle with research bonus and focus bonus and the t3 light tanks and the fact that every road leads to rome äh modern tank with the new country tech trees you can pump modern tanks in february 1939 with soviet russia

[@VonPlanter]

MEMEMAUS

[@sakeburyojo4218]

I'm probably the only player to try to go for 'historical' degins in this game.

[@aquaarlest5821]

how do i get main armament pls i need tanks

[@tijmenwillard2337]

I don't really get the obsession with breakthrough though. Sure, it needs to be high enough, but at some point there is little bonus from it

[@masterawesome1]

I'm not 100% sure how it all works with production cost. So if the production cost is higher then it's just more resources? They should change a lot of the modifications increase the time it takes to build the tanks. The reason America welded tanks was because it saved them time in making them. If you can just slap the whole frame together for a increased cost America wouldn't have made a Sherman and made their own tiger. Idk a little way to change the way people build tanks. Instead of expense it should be how many you want.

[@MarkMuhammad190]

Are you new to Hoi4? I played for a couple years now but still consider myself a newbie. I'll try to explain though! In the game you have military and civilian factory, each of them produce a "production" which for example 5 but could be increased with bonuses. So 30 production tank will take 6 factories in this case to make a single tank in a day which is expensive. Correct me if I'm wrong!

[@gildedphoenix]

If IC is high, it means that it takes longer to build one. Resources needed is decided through piece of equipment you pick.

[@llhammer3075]

yeah Ludi gifted subs lmao

[@kingoftheskies34]

Me preparing to make suicide light tanks for snaking

[@gildedphoenix]

I think the new railway supply system kills the snaking.

[@kingoftheskies34]

@@gildedphoenix hence the term, suicide light tank. Snaking also could work for cutting supply off

[@gildedphoenix]

@@kingoftheskies34 i think you fail to see the issue. Snaking is now undoable due to lack of supply drops speed too fast that you won't be able to have enough time to send them behind that far

[@kingoftheskies34]

@@gildedphoenix I mean they will attempt to snake AND die. I never said they would work well. However they could attempt to take railroad points Edit: I also saw I made an error in my response

[@gildedphoenix]

@@kingoftheskies34 the problem is you think they can even snake away from supply range. The answer is they won't. I made a test game with Turkey against French Syria, the supply issue completely halts any advance even if you make 12+km/h modern tank divisions wreaking havoc with no fuel shortage at all. You'll have to wait 10 or so days so occupied supply hubs and rails start operating.

[@firmitas68]

This kid might be anti-American but God dam it he is a genius.

[@FeedbackIRL]

How so?

[@nathanvanherck8578]

could supply problems not be solved with suplly planes?

[@gildedphoenix]

Iirc, cost of running them was too much on cp that it wasn't worth it. I think the real problem with the current supply system is the "you conquered this land but you won't get to use their rail system for 10 days" it breaks speed advantage of motorized/mechanized divs. In fact, slow mechs and HTs will probably fill the new meta due to this.

[@jonaslechat9472]

@@gildedphoenix well, welcome to the logistical nightmare the germans faced in USSR. Logistic is one of the most important and impactful thing, and that cost them a war because they couldn't bear it lacking fuel for the trucs. That is why for fast breakthrough you need (as IRL) loads of trucs to extend the logiscal network beyond the railways networks and speed will still dominate if you know how to tame your logistic

[@gildedphoenix]

@@jonaslechat9472 even if you have shit ton of trucks to give you the supplies, the railway system being locked down still inhibits.

[@jonaslechat9472]

@@gildedphoenix the thing is that for the 10 days it is locked up, the nearest raliways will supply you (and normaly it should be at the frontline) so you can still go a few 5 tiles (or more I didn't checked properly) I belive with trucs, and the time for you to take those tiles the ennemy railways will get converted and even if a unit isn't supplied for a few days they will still have their own supplies. Now if you wanna go mighty far in no time, first there is a reason why you don't do that IRL in most cases, but if you still want to do that at a certain place get maintenance companies, logistical experts, etc (everything that can improve your units supplies management) even airlifts can in this case help if it is just for one place and you wanna do something insane like rush to moscow for some reasons

[@gildedphoenix]

@@jonaslechat9472 that's what I'm saying. The new system completely negates the speed rush templates that LTs are completely turned obsolete from the very start.

[@kk7324]

beta heavy tanks vs sigma medium tanks

[@aliheydarpour454]

Hi does anyone know the new cheats for tanks?

[@ninj2798]

The research for tank designer parts looks far too bloated and overcomplicated. Rip any country that has limited research slots.

[@calciumboy406]

HOW TF DO I GET MAIN ARMAMENT

[@tech6985]

so the meta is basicly as how americans made tanks, ok

[@arcticwulf5796]

Based on the true story

[@tijldenotter8246]

It's interesting to see how tanks now can be "defined" as roles within the designer. I found it weird that only the finial howitzer forces a tank to be an self propelled gun. Since they still cost 3 combat width and have lower hardness, you probably will never use them. It's better to take the heaviest soft attack gun and just make the cheapest medium. This way you can just have all your divisions impervious to basic AT while having insane soft attack.

[@ParanoidMaster]

Actualy what early Panzer IV was. They had short guns meant to bust bunkers etc. They started to fit AT guns on them to face T34

[@matthiuskoenig3378]

The British and Americans also produced howitzer armed turreted medium tanks (the Cromwell had a varient armed with a 95mm howitzer and the sherman had a 105mm howitzer varient) 1/9 medium tanks were equipped like this.

[@netz_nuklear-energie-techn4226]

Is anybody able to convert captured tanks?

[@clau.mm7]

i have wasted my money on this game,it is way too complicated for no reason and confusing as fuck

[@alexmannen1991]

dude ur production cost is 40. if u just dropped some meme stuff u could make 2 tanks for the same cost. its so dumb tanks have 0 defense like some generic infantry can overrun you. tigers sitting in ambush was an absolute shermankiller

[@brutalexis486]

git gut

[@tisFrancesfault]

At 1:43 theres a dude saying in chat that Vickers armstrong "doesnt really work" as a design company... like wut?

[@Not_Evil_]

For me personally this patch killed the fun I had in this game