High DPS is the Most Important Thing in SWTOR PVP

[@quantomsquirrelleap]

My problem with number farmers is when they wipe the enemy team, and still ignore the easy objective right in front of them

[@ivano1337]

Why is that a problem? Just take the easy objective yourself

[@THISISLolesh]

@@ivano1337doesn’t always work like that does it? It’s objective based, capture what you need to capture, simple.

[@ianmc6063]

It's not all about DPS. It's about survivability. It's about being able to DPS while your taking damage. Example: someone does 800k in damage but takes 100k in damage is NOT the same as the guy doing 800k in damage while also taking 600k in damage. There's a lot of variables.

[@ivano1337]

Surviving is one of the things that goes into doing high dps. Surviving is important, but not as important as putting pressure on the enemy team even if you die for it. Getting the balance right is the tricky part. I have a video coming out on that soon.

[@CeaseFaith]

My win rate directly reflects this on my pretty much solo queue only characters. It does sadly become a double edged sword as the higher you go, the longer the queues. The more likely you'll be backfilled & those are likely into rage quits more than disconnects. While also having to carry harder the higher it remains. Then if the opposite is your case, you have low win rate and low damage, you're likely going against groups who refuse to play objective, giving the players who should be more often pitted against groups with groups on their team a sort of safety net from matching against each other. That is unless it's a backfill. This helps nobody and just really makes matchmaking fail in nearly every single way it could. So what I am saying here is that it's a never ending cycle, pugs will face TDM groups because their win rate is low and they'll sit in queue for a longer time due to support roles / group size. While players with medium to low win-rate will often times be matched against them quite quickly - much faster than another group with a similar low win-rate. Unless they change the way match making works it'll be a never ending cycle of objers playing against a premade and the occasional good player dealing with ALL of the combat in that said game while their team collects their free uncontested win. Meanwhile the premade faces 1-2 people with likeminded interest and give up on the match waiting for the next. Neither side gets to have fun and the "objers" are just getting a free win. A lot of them confuse it with actually beating the other team when it is in fact only one side actually interacting with the objectives. Which is definitely not helping... Winning isn't a metric for anything and if winning meant something like it did in ranked you'd see players willingly sacrifice themselves and or damage to secure that objective.

[@thebaronlouis8619]

Wait, if winning doesn't matter than why are you playing? Rewards are tied more to winning than they are to damage. If fast weeklies doesn't matter to you, what does? Why does "number go up" apply to dps and eliminations but not to tech frags, conquest points, and seasons objectives?

[@ivano1337]

@CeaseFaith exactly!

[@CeaseFaith]

@thebaronlouis8619 once you've unlocked everything & you've always played just for PvP, it's a completely different point of view. The reward is pvp itself. To get casuals in, they'll care about what they'll get out of it, but as they progress if they like pvp. The reward slowly becomes just fighting.

[@LingWujue]

Majority of the matches are backfills into groups that already afk on a node without lifting a finger and even if it's not, the matches are most of the times quite identical. One, two, sometimes three people face all the pressure while the rest asks what they ate for lunch, either way, it's not fun. Not for the people that backfill, not for the people already in the match afking on the node and especially not for the "winning" team sitting on mid playing cards while waiting for slight resistance.While I do appreciate a good objective game with teams that are quite.. well matched, in today's pvp, those matches are rare.. And what's worse, usually players unknowingly undermine the match for enemy's profit simply due to the lack of their experience which makes it all the more annoying. Damage does matter, as does healing and taunting or guarding a player, even picking targets. One thing alone, one player alone, won't turn the outcome around. Like Cease and others have said already, the most important aspect of any pvp arena or warzone isn't the W or L, but whether you, as a player had fun during the match. More than anything, PvP is a conversation without a single word.

[@charlesbrown1570]

Good point and true playing every class also has help but true doing most dps does keep the other team off balance and they usually break down good video

[@ivano1337]

Yeah you can win most warzones in the first two minutes if you have superior dps

[@theerichba]

I’m bad in English but I’m learn it cause I like the game and KZbin content about this game. Ivano, you are my new English teacher

[@ivano1337]

Hahaha as long as you don't pick up my accent, you'll be fine

[@thebaronlouis8619]

You make it sound like people who focus on objectives aren't also shooting for high damage. A smart player accepts that while working towards the objective, not every single GDC will be optimized for maximum damage but does the best they can on the move. If they spot an opening to steal the objective, they lose 6 or more seconds of damage on a gamble that may not even pay off... because wins count x3. Sure, if you can clear the enemies and then click the button while their respawns are still miles away, then you'll still win, but that won't always happen. Sometimes you'll face other people who also have good dps, or good healing, or they always have just enough people around to make sure the button area is never fully cleared. At that point, you have to at least attempt a Hail Mary when their back is turned. I'm no pvp God but I've seen plenty of "number go up" types waste a ton of time on me while half my teams ran straight to the end of voidstar. I trolled a Jugg and PT on Huttball into pounding me into the ground in the corner of the map while my team dominated mid and ran the ball past them 3 times in under a minute. There's a reason the description for every mission says "Wins Count x3" and it's not because High DPS is the Most Important Thing in PVP.

[@ivano1337]

The reason you won these matches is because the other team decided that pounding you into the ground was more fun than winning the match. It's a valid strategy to distract the damage farmers if your team is inferior, but my point still stands.

[@thebaronlouis8619]

​@@ivano1337they chose to lose. That's the point. We agree they decided number go up was worth losing. And while I may not have gotten the elimination, did I say I was just standing there not also farming damage while keeping 2 characters away from the person with the wall or planting the bombs?

[@ivano1337]

@@thebaronlouis8619 if you can do both at the same time - that's great! But that means you need to pay attention to your own character, cooldowns etc. as well as what all the opponents are doing. That's too much for most players, esp. beginners. Most people should focus on improving their dps first esp. if they can't break 10k dps yet and then worry about everything else. Clicking turrets does not make you a better player

[@faltun]

high dps mostly comes from free casting, high up time, spreading dots and aoe stuff, or so much support from tank and healers you dont have to care about anything just brainlessly chasing unning after randoms and pushing 4 buttons in a specific order, this can be done by a monkey if you give them 10 minutes to learn it. Basiclly this is the most boring activity in SWTOR for quite many players. Performing under pressure, make enemy players busy, landing slows, roots, stuns on the right target in the right time, surviving, kiting, LOS enemies, out think your opponents, positioning, moving around the map a lot not chasing high uptime is more challenging to the brain, therefore more fun\important to some players, these activities tho make you waste GCDs to non dmg abilities, forces single target focus, forces spending time on running away and reduce uptime, these often result in lower dps yet a more fun, skill based gameplay. Its important to be able to deal dmg effectively in situations and for that it has some requirements as you said and it makes you a better player, but there is a difference between effectively dealing dmg and chasing high numbers.... having tunnel vision and chasing high numbers dont care about anything else and setting up everything for it(pocket healer, personal guard, stacking enemies, dont even try to escape\dying, etc), so only have to use the 4 button rotation and have close to 100% uptime, AOE stuff, spreading dots.... to just send a pic or a video about the "numbers" for some approval is very childish and silly and skill cannot be measured only by that, and clearly not the most important thing. We all know players that can reach super high numbers if everything is set, yet they re bad payers when face real challenges and cant kite, survive, cc, positioning, play solo.... Well, its a bit sad to see what SWTOR became over the years, as a veteran old school player who experienced the peak of SWTOR in 1.0 and 2.0 era when "important thing" was defined as a more sophisticated thing and meant much more than high dps :D but this is what it is, this is the current SWTOR community and this is today's SWTOR.

[@faltun]

Dont missunderstand me, i also think the quality of dmg dealing is important, but be honest, in SWTOR its not about effective dmg dealing but pure number farming sacrificing everything else in the game. so ppl who dont have enough stuff in their pants can flex with numbers. end game stats should be removed, or should be about deaths and kills not dps hps stuff....

[@ivano1337]

Think you misunderstand me. I didn't say: "mindlessly farming dps records is the most important thing". I said: "high dps". As in: if you cannot break 10k dps yet, focus on improving that before you worry about anything else. Because sure, it's nice if you can perfectly chain your cc or perform to 99% of your best under pressure. But 99% of what? 3k dps baseline :D Also: If even a monkey can learn it, why can't my teammates? :(

[@ivano1337]

But good to see that you're back on the game!

[@grimkupid8478]

But if the point is to do max dps, what's the point of having the objectives?

[@flottzhd5727]

what’s the point of having a bunch of damage abilities and not using them?

[@ivano1337]

The point of max dps is to make the objectives easier. Much easier to grab the huttball if the enemies are stuck in spawn

[@RippednBuff]

People treat swtor like its the first MMO, Its always been like this, rated BGs in wow is ALL about overwhelming with damage. Simple tactic, if your opponents are all dead then you dont have to do the objective.

[@ivano1337]

Offense is the best defense

[@yuzo9760]

yo wollte fragen ob es sich lohnt die Zeit zu investieren und pt in pvp zu spielen warzone/arena allgemein oder eher auf andere klassen gehen

[@ivano1337]

Ja lohnt sich absolut

[@qwertiepie]

Nah, I disagree. I don't do arena so can't talk much to that, but I'm a solo player in mostly/only warzone pugs. I'm convinced that high DPS is not the be all and end all of it. I've seen some scary disorganized hard hitters come through with absolutely nonsense and give away the match cause ... yeah DPS, look at me kill you! the organised ones are yeah a bit more difficult :)

[@ivano1337]

Sure, you can get easy wins vs damage farmers because they don't care about winning. They just want to farm numbers. But if they decide they want to win, they will win almost every time unless you can actually fight back. Case in point: kzbin.info/www/bejne/b6Gsm3p8l8-YjdU So while dps isn't the end all be all, it's the #1 thing you should focus on if you want to get better at the game 👍🏻

[@randomhero3419]

The biggest flex in swtor pvp (16 player maps) and you want to win is when you are able to count to 8 😜

[@ivano1337]

sorry, I can only count to 4 :p

[@Ares_Hord]

The statement is certainly interesting. But I think it only works in cases where you have a good team, or at least randoms roughly equal in strength to the opposing team. If you go solo, and get into an absolutely weak team, against a very strong one, then you still will not realize your average dps, even if you are a genius of swtor pvp. In this case, it probably makes sense to try to do objectives, because this has at least some chance of success. Otherwise, I agree.🤔

[@douglasdoyle5746]

I mean this guy plays in premades. it's a different game solo

[@ivano1337]

It's even more important when you don't have a team to carry you. I did not say you can get top dps or win every game even if you play perfectly

[@chancellorpalpatine123]

I know a guy that plays objectives, peels for his below average skilled healer and does most dmg in almost every game while doing that. Does that make the rest of the pvp players trash or? #l2p

[@ivano1337]

Yeah. Getting geared and using the right build will get you to 10k dps. Getting actually good at the game will get you to 20k. Spamming aoe into teams of noobs will get you to 30k 🤣

[@kiddo7073]

Actually his heal is really good and carrying games.

[@modesty834]

@@ivano1337 how long does it take to get good?

[@ivano1337]

Hard to say. Depends it you have previous MMO experience. Between a month and a year, maybe longer

[@Vixerus]

At the end of the day, we all play the game how we want period. I cannot explain how many times I see people legit rage in chat with name calling over objectives. It's like dude go do it then, we have the other team under the thumb.

[@ivano1337]

Yeah the most toxic messages I have seen in pvp were mostly from obj'ers 😅

[@Vixerus]

@@ivano1337 dude right? Hahaha