History of the Rock Island's Choctaw Rocket

[@osmanjeffrey]

Thanks, TH, for more Rock Island tales of woe! Always a pleasure to watch you on any topic, just to be clear. Okay, to illuminate your statement around 10:39: the dome car, "Big Ben" operated at the forward end on train 6 from Rock Island to Chicago in the morning and returned as the obs on train 5 departing La Salle Street at 5:35 PM. This was operated by the tour company DePorter Butterworth of Moline, Illinois. Butterworth later ran the parlor cars "The Reveler" and "Bonnie B" (which was an 11 bedroom Pullman from the IC, "Belleville") after the Rock took off its own parlors, "Golden Vista", "Golden Divan" (ex-Golden State lounges) and "Pacific Shore" (originally NYC). The equipment was not turned, as a rule, at either Peoria or Rock Island. Hey, save on labor where you can, right? The mail/baggage cars came off around 1972 or so. Other note is on the Choctaw Route. I have a summer 1966 timetable showing trains 21 and 22 from Memphis to Tucumcari and dear God what an endurance test that would have been to ride. The timetable does note three meal stops where box lunches were available. I'll bet the food was nearly as tasty as the box it came in. Looking forward to more, TH. Cheers!

[@tanned2go22]

Your commentary about the Choctaw Rocket and the Choctaw Route/Sunbelt route, while entertaining, might benefit from a little more historical detail. The Memphis-Californian, rather than being a secondary train, was the premier train on this route from the time it was inaugurated in 1924 until the Choctaw Rocket was inaugurated in 1940. The Choctaw Rocket was downgraded in 1952, converted to RDC cars (Budd cars in Rock Island terminology) in 1953, and those were then discontinued in 1964. The Memphis-Californian became the Cherokee when the train was dieselized in 1948, although it continued to carry through Memphis-Los Angeles Pullman cars and a coach into the mid-1950s. The unnamed successor of this train lasted until November 1967, a victim of postal service and REA switch from rail to highway transport. In early years, the Rock Island was a fierce competitor with Missouri Pacific for the lucrative passenger traffic from Chicago in to Hot Springs, Arkansas. Through Pullman cars ran on the Illinois Central Chicago-Memphis and then the Rock Island to Little Rock and Hot Springs, while MoPac through cars from Chicago to Hot Springs traveled over the Alton and the Wabash to St. Louis. Rock Island ended passenger train service to Hot Springs in 1951, conceding that market to Missouri Pacific, who continued service for another 13 years. Rock Island management in the 1970s recognized the Choctaw route as a potential revenue generator with bridge traffic, and the route was rebranded and publicized as the "Sunbelt" route. Extensive upgrading took place at many locations along the route, and while those projects were never completed, when segments of the line were scrapped, it was necessary to torch newly laid welded rail into 39 foot segments for salvage, not exactly a branchline that was lost. Both Santa Fe and MKT conducted studies indicating that the route was viable, but both were concerned about the cost of finishing the route rehab project started by the Rock Island. Missouri Pacific and Cotton Belt were both bitterly opposed to seeing the route reopened after Rock Island shutdown in 1980, and their heavy influence in opposition helped to assure that no state assistance would be forthcoming.

[@gmo1515]

I've read somewhere that the RI Choctaw line was one of those routes that looked good on a map but the actual railroad was filled with rolling hills and curves that didn't make it as attractive as you would initially think.

[@Joel-sy4ho]

I have a 1913 Rock Island Passenger Time Table with Arrival of and departure of passenger Trains along the Choctaw Route through Arkansas and to Hot Springs.

[@buckyc.9069]

BNSF would've saved a lot of money running stack trains to Memphis via Little Rock instead of Sringfield Mo.

[@johnsimms6184]

Yes, they built what we called the million dollar switch in Amarillo East Tower, it connected the Santa Fe to the Rock Island. Then the SP merger canceled that plan.

[@buckyc.9069]

The ATSF was interested in the Choctaw route, they had a lot of traffic going to Memphis and poi to beyond, but they were contractually obliged to feed that traffic to Frisco via Avard Ok. Nobody foresaw the future traffic explosion on that route. New traffic would've had no such obligation, but nobody saw it coming at the time. Another missed opportunity.

[@Joel-sy4ho]

Don’t forget about the Rock Island Hot Springs Limited.

[@Joel-sy4ho]

Their where 9 arrivals and 9 departures on the Hot Springs Limited in and out of Hot Springs.

[@NicholasMarion-pl9bm]

Request: History of the New York Central's 20th Limited Century, History of the Pennsylvania Railroad's Broadway Limited, History of the Illinois Central's Panama Limited, History of the Norfolk and Western's Powhatan Arrow, History of Baltimore and Ohio's Capitol Limited, and History of the Kansas City Southern's Southern Belle. Oh, and History of the New York Central's Empire State Express and History of the Southern Railroad's Crescent.

[@gregsells8549]

Sausage and mashed potatoes with brown gravy are what the Brits would call bangers and mash.

[@intercityrailpal]

One more link missing from the national system. A cross line linking today's Southwest Chief. Just Think if LA was linked to Memphis, Atlanta and dozens of other cities directly!! This train paralleled the busy I-40 corridor that has ten lanes in each direction in places! No direct service Little Rock to Memphis today~! For example. Think they just forgot? The last train was a RDC with mail and express section. When that express business was put on trucks that was the end. While walking around the CNJ yard in Elizabeth Port, NJ. I saw it! CNJ bought it for parts. I walked through it. It had bus seats in it. It's gone now too. So is the yard and the mainlines that crossed there. Under the Aldene plan. One more failure. We have a 1960- rail system today. Not planned for a 21st century world. 1960's were years of declining demand not growing demand. Airlines were not bailed out and bankrupt from year to year. Gas 20 cents a gallon. California shows us everyday what can be done with a commitment to rail!

[@buckyc.9069]

I-40 runs where it does for a good reason.

[@laddrickstafford2153]

Rock Island was designed to be bridge railroad to Southern pacific on New Mexico from there to Chicago st Louis Memphis ok when Southern pacific bought cotton belts lost bridge ok Memphis to New Mexico useless line to rock Island mean unprofitable to rock