HMC and ZMC: Secret Deadlock Advanced Movement Tech and Tutorial

[@quackbo1]

dude, watching you play Deadlock is like another game entirely. Good vids, thanks!

[@noctgaming8335]

Really appreciate it and glad you enjoyed!

[@rauggie9971]

I hope things like this don't get patched out of the game, since a lot of the appeal of Deadlock (for me, personally) comes from the more lenient and "casual" aspects of this game (by "casual" I mean games that allow more room for player agency as opposed to "optimizing" every little thing for the sake of pure balancing). I've played MOBAs before, but my first love was movement shooters (ala Team Fortress 2). In Team Fortress 2, one of the best things about that game was players being able to use intentional mechanics in unintentional ways (like crouching while rocket jumping to propel further and higher, or strafing off of sloped surfaces while Demoknight charging to start "trimping"). HMC and ZMC very much remind me of that kind of "player-to-game-mechanic-dynamic", and it makes this game really *"feel"* like a Valve game.

[@kamella2563]

yep as someone who came from overwatch, trying to make every ability fair for the sake of being fair killed the game. id much prefer frequent balance patches like deadlock does.

[@crumpledmint]

I just hope it doesn't become like apex's using unintentional mechanics in unintentional ways. I really like what valve did with movement in deadlock and I really like how accessible it is

[@rauggie9971]

@@kamella2563 I feel you. I got burnt out by competitive games due to the metacentric nature of being forced to constantly keep up to date with constant buffs, nerfs, and overhaul patches. Deadlock has been that weird middle ground for me where, even though it's very much built to be a competitive game, the item system has been streamlined to a point where its simplistic design allows more room for player expression and experimentation, rather than being solely forced into a single meta. I love it.

[@rauggie9971]

@@crumpledmint I'm not too familiar with Apex. I'm curious to hear some examples.

[@Ishsa]

​@@rauggie9971 They're probably referring to tap strafing and super glides

[@cyberjeeb]

I finally got the secret hidden advanced movement channel in my yt algo. I play deadlock for the shmovement subbed

[@troshinalex5250]

Top notch video. The movement tech is insane in this game, and I’m all in for it!

[@Goober70000]

paradox gon make a banger w this one 🗣

[@noctgaming8335]

BUILT-IN HMC HEROES RISE UP

[@dmitriytitov4116]

Great vid, Noct! Didnt know HMC was patched out and in, I am so glad the tech was acknowledged! Also thank you for showcasing Pocket tech, it looks simple yet effective.

[@collins_channel8643]

This give me BXR nostalgia. Great breakdown my man

[@kuz-33]

Exactly what I was looking for, great stuff.

[@DUCKVILLELOL]

Great vid Noct, thank you! Can I give a small recommendation on the production end - when you've got the text of the "what move to make" at the top of the screen overlayed on top of the actual movements happening in character - could you animate the text so that it shows "what movement is happening at this point"? This stuff is awesome and I'm trying to learn how to do it (slowly... very slowly... lol) but it'd just be cool to understand more directly for newbies like me what you're actually doing when you're flying across the entire map as Lash lol :D Thanks again!

[@noctgaming8335]

@@DUCKVILLELOL great suggestion. I'm learning too, so I'll give this a shot next time!

[@mordsven]

Movement is really fun in this game, it makes you look like a speedrunner in the process

[@KeroOW]

Thank God they re added hmc after last patch, it's so fun

[@bazzfromthebackground3696]

I only just recently learned corner kicks were a thing. Movement in this game is crazy, now I have to look up what sone of these other techs were.

[@Strellzic]

Been waiting for a vid like this

[@user-yo7ef2wv8q]

7:38 the fact that this happened makes me so hopefull about these devs and the game going forward not turning into some clunky mess

[@RealSnugh]

Yo I love this video. Please keep posting stuff!

[@RjVal-w5b]

Awesome video btw !

[@Yolipow]

So glad HMC got added back

[@yungebola5524]

the bg music is sick btw.

[@TVFrag]

definitely gonna check out the build + subbed

[@1millionRamen]

im a lash main. but damn bro i play like garbage after seeing ur gameplay. i subbed.

[@leonmarley776]

Amazing video man 👍

[@JarvidO]

It's kind of funny a lot of people had the impression that "melee is useless" at high levels because of the parry key, when the game first opened up. but all of the melee items are high value and versatile, and there's a million ways to bait parries, completely free opportunities for melee on stunned or channeling heroes, insane movement options, and you can basically condition players to reliably self stun themselves with the parry key.

[@mrawesomelivshere]

Hey man Im loving this tech. Wondering if u take melee charge to extend the HMC range? keep it up! Id love to see some paths to practise (streets to walkers, secret shop too walker/lane, how to get out of a deeep dive using vertical routes, etc)

[@noctgaming8335]

@@mrawesomelivshere yeah I take Melee Charge whenever I am running HMC. And good idea!

[@bellatorpopo430]

Source games always have amazing movement tech

[@Hope-lt3de]

Is that a bird? A plane? ...No, it's a flying life-stealing ground-slamming detective.

[@jamilyeung]

Should probably make something clear: HMC is not going to be patched out and it seems that Yoshi(the head dev) is keeping it as a feature as he said so himself. This means that other HMCs and other interesting movement tech such as corner boosts are likely to stay in the game.

[@JarvidO]

it feels like corner boosting has a unique sound when you trigger it, meaning it's not a bug, unless it's just two wall jump sounds stacked then that would make sense

[@theSato]

he did say that at the end of the video friend

[@throwawaydetective9080]

I feel like its nice that its not patched out, but ideally what should happen is that every hero should be updated to have at least one way to access HMC without items, or just have more items activate HMC.

[@theSato]

@@throwawaydetective9080 it does seem weird and awkward that some heroes can use such a basic fundamental advanced tech inherently, and some can't. that could be okay theoretically, but then the other heroes need their own fundamental tech like this which is somewhat equivalent in how widely applicable and useful it is.

[@billedwards9221]

how do i find the "noct's supperior movement lash" thread on the deadlock discord? im sorta new to discord and can't seem to find it anywhere there

[@linegrinder]

is it important to diagonal strafe dash or could you just imput a forward dash as well?

[@noctgaming8335]

It is. Theres a limit to how much speed you can gain from a forward dash. But the diagonal dash bypasses that limit

[@linegrinder]

@@noctgaming8335 thanks for explaining

[@cyriiix]

Could you make a whole video on strafe dashing? I can do it but don’t really get why it works

[@DanesCorner]

Can you cover diagonal strafe dashing?

[@noctgaming8335]

Not a bad idea!

[@lfishl22]

tbh this is breaking the game, even not with Lash

[@RjVal-w5b]

Does the HMC -> Diagonal Strafe Dash -> Slide still work in the new patch?

[@noctgaming8335]

It does. You might be canceling your melee too late if its not

[@RjVal-w5b]

@@noctgaming8335 btw, what are your keybinds for Heavy Melee and Fleetfoot ?

[@RjVal-w5b]

So for the Pardox HMC.. Are you saying that because she has her 3rd ability, she can heavy melee cancel with the 3rd ability then consecutively do another hmc with an item like fleetfoot? So: 1) paradox is on a rooftop 2) she jumps off, then does a heavy melee charge 3) she cancels it with her 3rd ability so she can get more horizontal movement 4) then does another heavy melee charge and cancels it again but with fleetfoot (to get even more horizontal movement) Are there other practical scenarios to use this combo?

[@noctgaming8335]

Yes, you are correct. She can essentially HMC to start the Carbine charge, and HMC a second time before shooting it. There are some Paradox players using this now to play a Close-Range/Melee style Paradox. Otherwise just using her one built-in HMC can be used to help her maneuver general escape, engage, moving into a better position to hit carbine, etc

[@garo7892]

i mdae a shiv movement discovery on my channel idk if thats good or not

[@tempest5343]

does having melee charge make it so you go further/faster with an hmc?

[@noctgaming8335]

Yes, using Melee Charge can help you go further or faster but its not required

[@vMoppyMedia]

When doing a diagonal strafe dash, is it not more beneficial to do it at a 45° angle with your camera sideways so you technically go straight farther, instead of looking straight and going at an angle?

[@noctgaming8335]

the DSD should give the same speed+distance as the 45° strafe dash due to the way its calculated on the back end

[@vMoppyMedia]

@@noctgaming8335 okay thank you for the clarification!

[@xxAlphaFoxxx]

I’ve been thinkin about playing abrams as a second to lash. Do you have a build up for him too? Not at the game to check rn, but I’ll prob end up answering this myself.

[@Magpie7]

yo what resolution or fov do you play on your camera looks soo good

[@Ninebreak999]

Reminds me of Gunz the Duel.

[@goredyn8150]

How do you hmc with mo&krill?

[@Mrmoocows99]

Scorn (1) is a hmc.

[@3MC3]

This is great and I hope it stays in the game. This is the kind of mechanic which needs practice and effort to become good at and ultimately separates top rank players from lower rank players. Other things like game sense and gunplay do come in play but these small things add another layer of skill and can, believe it or not win games. If I had a team that rotated as fast as this guy does, team fights and objective pushing becomes an entire different game.

[@SleightSoda]

Did Yoshi acknowledge the melee cancel tech only, or did Yoshi also acknowledge the zipline tech? I've been concerned the zipline tech might be patched for some time now, and I'm curious if both were acknowledged/removed/put back in. Thanks.

[@noctgaming8335]

@@SleightSoda as far as I know, he's only acknowledged HMC and it's the tech that was patched back in. ZMC has been pretty well documented for awhile now though. I'd be surprised to see it go but it's a powerful offensive tool, so who knows!

[@andresemidey9679]

Zipline drag reduction buff is specifically coded in for these kinds of movement interactions, unless the devs go through some ideological changes it should be safe to say it's staying.

[@SleightSoda]

@@andresemidey9679 There's no evidence to suggest that they removed the friction when canceling with crouch. Valve/source games actually have a long history of movement interactions involving crouch that are esoteric/unintended. My argument is that if they wanted people tp be frictionless when they disconnect from zipline, why isn't that standard when you use space rather than crouch? The only explanation that makes sense (to me) is that this is unintended. There is no useful gameplay purpose for the distinction.

[@scolit205]

I do feel like going for superior stamina this patch is better, even without the funky techs. It has to be so much better after enduring speed nerf

[@noctgaming8335]

I think Superior Stamina is being slept on in general because Majestic Leap is so easy to use and usually you dont want to spend too many Souls on "movement"

[@pushlock]

@@noctgaming8335i want. . .

[@scolit205]

@@noctgaming8335 also! There are not that many items that can slow your dashes I believe, and if you lock in those can save your life.

[@Dani-of2zu]

does dashing while in the air after double jump hmc still work? it says “You are busy” when I try to dash. Am i doing the timing wrong? edit: nvm just got it

[@Maelthorn1337]

I might have missed something, but does "diagonal strafe dash" just mean "air dash" or is there more to it than that?

[@Maelthorn1337]

Fantastic video though. I hope I'll be able to make use of even 25% of this.

[@noctgaming8335]

@@Maelthorn1337 It is different actually! Air dashing forward has a limit on how fast you can go. But if you air dash forward while holding W+A or W+D you can bypass the limiter, hence the diagonal dash!

[@Maelthorn1337]

@@noctgaming8335 Well gee dangit. I've watched like 3 movement videos and I either missed it or it wasn't covered. Or maybe you covered it in this video. I'm very tired lmao. Thanks for the explanation!

[@RjVal-w5b]

Looks like infernus, mcginnis, and mirage dont have HMC anymore?

[@AsefKhan-s8o]

Does corner boost still work?

[@minkblanket9632]

what is mirages cancel? i cant find it

[@noctgaming8335]

Mirage's built in HMC got patched out, my bad. I'll try to leave a note on the video

[@IAcePTI]

Lash came from Attack on Titan anime 😂

[@celexample]

People should note that these might not be intended.

[@misira8256]

Yoshi(valve dev) added it back with patch note acknowledging it.

[@TheVakin213]

HMC requierd 2 items meele charge and fleetfoot, too expensive

[@testwordz]

its not really fair to everyone else on this planet to have movement this good though

[@matthuckleberry5238]

Pretty cool but should this really be in the game?

[@rauggie9971]

Even though these two games aren't even in the same genre, I'm gonna use TF2 (Team Fortress 2) as a point of reference here. Valve has a history of making games where players are able too use intended mechanics in unintentional ways. For example, in TF2, rocket jumping was a mechanic specifically designed and implemented by Valve. But what Valve didn't predict was that players could crouch while rocket jumping in order to propel themselves much further and higher than if they were to do it the intended way. The cool thing about this is that, because of the way the intentional aspects of rocket jumping works, this unintentional way of rocket jumping isn't actually op (which is why Valve never patched it out of the game). In order to rocket jump in the first place, you need to fire a rocket down by your feet. This means that in exchange for mobility, you have to damage yourself in the process, spend ammo to do so, and take even more damage depending on how high you are off the ground before you land. In Deadlock, the HMC and ZMC movement tech have that same kind of "transaction", where in exchange for really good mobility, you still have to spend stamina bars; you still need to activate items which are set on a cooldown; you still need to activate abilities which are set on a cooldown; you still have to deal with damage falloff if you decide to shoot while airborne. All-in-all, so long as there is a "transaction" dynamic of some kind, where players need to sacrifice core resources in order to use intended mechanics in unintended ways, I think that having things like this in Deadlock is perfectly okay. Sure, some things may need to be tweaked here and there in terms of balancing. But, I don't think that these things should just straight up be removed in a game like this. There's already a lot of player agency in the form of item experimentation compared to other MOBAs. The more a game is designed to be competitive, the more it generally tends to focus on "optimizing the 'fun'" out of a game for the sake of balancing; (yes, 'fun' is a very ad hoc term, but I'm mostly referring to a player's freedom of expression in a game vs how much a game restricts that). I think that Deadlock is really unique in that it somehow managed to be a middle ground for "casual" games and competitive games in general.

[@mikkelh9757]

yeah, u dweeb git gud

[@Tamperkele]

Yeah, I mean is it really that op?

[@lordsithis937]

This game has already set itself apart from many others in that rather than nerfing everything and everyone to the ground everyone feels powerful and the skill ceiling no matter who you are and what game you’ve gotten good at is high why not one more that is also fun to mess with?

[@remingtonrojas]

I feel like tech in this game is kinda cool but there is just so much of it that it is starting to be overwhelming. Like to compete with these sweats it feels like you have to do homework instead of just playing the game and finding out organically.

[@noctgaming8335]

I know its a lot of information condensed into a short video. But if theres one thing to take away that you dont have to think too much about, just crouch off the zips from now one. You'll go a lot faster and can start organically feeling it out from there.

[@Nauct]

You're jumping off the zipline? Why do that when crouching off conserves all your momentum?

[@wavyboi]

imm cooming rn

[@mrawesomelivshere]

siiiiiq

[@thchris]

demoknight tf2

[@Xemen]

you're treeree of deadlock

[@celexample]

That widescreen really giving tons of extra vision. Hardware advantages always make me cringe. Still, useful video.

[@noctgaming8335]

I get it. Tbf its not doing a whole lot for me in Deadlock. But it does make it feel like you're going super fast lol

[@bendymexicano4232]

they done nerfed it 😮‍💨

[@eebbaa5560]

i can't even fucking walljump

[@cadders8205]

too bad last patch gut the heavy melee cancel

[@noctgaming8335]

No, HMC was hot fixed back into the game today. Its live right now

[@cringe1462]

​@@noctgaming8335WOOOOO

[@dudeguy3d]

@@noctgaming8335 holy shit i thought it was gone forever this is awesome

[@cadders8205]

@@noctgaming8335oh shit thank god, as an abrams main i can sleep easy

[@RandomUsernameAppearsInChat]

rip heavy melee canceling

[@Colesalad]

still works.

[@styrbo]

bro its fixed

[@Colesalad]

still works

[@lordvon_3490]

this is clearly an exploit that will be patched so I don't see any reason to use it

[@noctgaming8335]

it was acknowledged by the devs and patched back into the game, so its not an exploit