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0:00 intro
1:00 my stance on hookless wheels
1:22 what is ETRTO
3:00 29mm is the new standard
4:00 why is this important to end users
4:50 zipps response
7:08 enve response
8:34 WHAT SHOULD CONSUMERS DO?
10:30 my experience with consumers hookless

[@GCPerformance18]

I need to know your thoughts on this, you know my stance on the hookless, I just find it odd after them studying a years worth of riding they went ahead and changed the tire size again for a better safety standard. Maybe they did not like what they saw in the past year with issues

[@JayLato]

Go hookless 25mm internal and 28mm tire for best aero properties they say, now go 29mm+ and go back to a less aero lightbulb shape they say….

[@laiphe]

I agree the Zipp's response was emphatical. They don't back their statement with any technical details. How they performed the tests and what they tested. I find it trully disrespectful. Saying there are many riders in the past several years riding such combination is like saying there are so many smokers who didn't die from lung cancer, therefore we consider it safe. This is what's happening when the marketing and finance departments lead the technical innovations.

[@VFTactical15]

I always hook my shoes onto my tires so I can't fall off as easy

[@waynosfotos]

I will do a vid on this 😮

[@shirtlessGraveler305]

The only set up Hook Less wheels I have our fast forward brand gravel wheels . Oh, and I’m using the stock specialized pathfinder pro size 30 eights that came with the original wheel set tubeless of course I’m running it and I don’t ride that bike much no issues my road bike is a trek with a zipp 404 rim brakes and 25 mm continental GP 5000s so basically, I’m just observing all of this going on not planning any bike upgrades or wheels that is for Road so appreciate you keeping us in the loop here. I’ll keep that in mind in the future. Thank You Grant

[@JayLato]

It’s almost as though they should add a little hook to hookless for a tire to clinch onto. They should call it a clincher.

[@bozidar753]

🤣

[@denethorpalantir2815]

I don't think the dentists and plastic surgeons endorse this line of thought.

[@GCPerformance18]

lmaoooo

[@chm2]

You sir, are a forward thinker!

[@kristofferguerra569]

that's genius, why didn't they think of that earlier...oh wait

[@eto2352]

Zipp/Enve: No one will read a CN article on ETRTO.... weekend is almost here baby! GCP: Well lookie here! Zipp/Enve: *tear runs down cheek*

[@crypto_que]

The media always bury the bad news late in the week especially on late Friday. That’s how propaganda works.

[@cup_and_cone]

We have to remember that a 28c tire today is not the same as a 28c tire from just several years ago. Some tire manufacturers have narrowed their sizes (*cough*Continental*cough*) - as rims got wider their old sizing was causing tires that measured much wider than advertised, in addition to accommodating newer 30/32c options and correcting their market range. The new ETRTO standards feel more like a correction this this phenomenon of tire manufacturers downsizing. What the industry actually needs is a better standardization of the way road bike tires are measured so that a 28c from manufacturer XYZ is the same width as a 28c from manufacturer ABC on the same rim.

[@GCPerformance18]

yea this is true I can agree with this

[@jds7438]

I do beleive that this standards will be followed by premium brands, conti, Pirelli, goodyear, mich for example. All of these brands will adhere to ETRTO , TRA standards across there product portfolio, consumer, commercial, otr etc so see no reason why they wouldn't with bike tyres. I think the main issue could be with the "other brands"

[@tccycling]

A standard is definitely what is needed. I've used Conti 28c STR's on 25mm internal wheels and they always measure over 30mm when inflated. Been using 28c Pirelli Race TLR's lately on the same wheels and they are almost bang-on 28mm wide.

[@TheMancVillian]

105kg rider here with Enve 4.5 SES on 28mm (2 years) and Zipp 353 on 28mm for 6 months running at 65 psi and haven’t had any issues and love the comfort over tubes. This is on UK roads which can be frankly shocking.

[@joshhaibike1365]

👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼 couldn’t agree more

[@saynotothegreatreset]

You don't ride fast enough for pushing those round corners . Your weight + low pressure + a fast corner it would end very bad 😊

[@TheMancVillian]

@@saynotothegreatreset what’s fast round a corner? can hit 30-40mph on club runs regularly on twisty country lanes, never had any issues. Had the Enve’s up to 50mph on some descents in Europe and ridden flanders and Amstel on them. Have used Swalbe, Challenge and Conti tyres all worked perfectly.

[@DaveCM]

I like new technology, but the hookless rims just make me nervous. People will bring up the fact that car wheels are hookless. That isn't a valid comparison. Car tires have a way stiffer and stronger tire bead and the fit is very tight to the point that the tires have to be put on with machines or tools that apply a lot of leverage. Bike tires cannot be like that.

[@thehobbs7849]

Cars are also 1000's of lbs traveling at high speeds compared to the hundreds of me and my bike going slow af

[@flipooh]

I like your common sense. Sold my Zipp 404 a year ago when it burst after going over a pot hole.

[@rostuchicken]

I ride 28(s). I like 28(s). This situation is nuts. Thanks for keeping us consumers informed. I’m gonna stay away from hookless.

[@darktimus]

Have been using 303s on 28mm tires for almost 2 years. Have been doing long rides such as LRM 1600km at thailand and Audax under heavy rain and hot sun. Have no iaaue on the wheel and tire. Below 70psi

[@nationsnumber1chump]

So they make rim fur cheaper but we pay same as hooked rim 😂

[@TheGroupRide]

We're actually paying more.

[@nationsnumber1chump]

@@TheGroupRide

[@FriedrichK97]

I don't get why people keep saying that. Zipp 404 for example: the retail price for the old model was 2600€, new model 1800€, currently available for 1300€ in Germany.

[@user-nu5fx6en9h]

@@FriedrichK97 agree!

[@GCPerformance18]

hahhaha I mean right here.... zipp 353 cost $4000 in clincher version next year zipp 353 goes hookless only model price:$4000 hookless is cheaper to make?!?!?!?!?

[@taylorbrasher4252]

I have been running the new Enve 4.5 Hookless for over 18 months (12,000 miles) with no issues. Only 1 puncture that I had to stop and repair. Love the performance, and comfortability. I have been running them on 28 mm GP5k TR's

[@anthonylozano3645]

1000 miles on my new Enve Ses 3.4 and no issues. Running 30 mm GP 5000STR

[@bennymozzarella1605]

Been running the hookless 303s w/ 28mm pirelli zeros two years on my roadbike now. Ive done crits, road race rides, everything. Ive never felt unsafe. Punctured twice where I actually had to pull over and let it seal and continued my ride. I guess it makes good content for the youtube community

[@wsbygt]

Same here. 303 Firecrest and Light Bicycle 45deep wheelset owner from Pirelli SL, TLR and Cinturato to GP5000S TR now. I´m moving to buy the ENVE 4.5 as soon as they get available again.

[@melcin]

Same here. 303 Firecrest with Schwalbe Pro One's 28mm. I'm on my 3rd set of Schwalbe's. No issues. I had a few punctures, didn't know I had one until I got home. Fly Navy.

[@nokia6800]

303s are 23mm internal width so a 28mm tire is probably still in the recommended zone

[@tombola4046]

Same here, 303 and 404 FC two years with both 28mm Pirelli tires with zero issues

[@slowcyclist4324]

You never feel unsafe, until your first crash. So. I’d suggest that you keep praying that you never do crash. I’ve always felt that one of the drops I used to take was a safe walk in the park, till my first crash there knocked home just how dangerous it really could be.

[@bebopman5]

I’ve been using ENVE 4.5 ARs (identical dimensions as their current flagship 4.5 SES wheels) for a few weeks now with tubes. I’m not racing, but on group rides, I’ve had no real problems. Got a puncture and was able to fix it with little issues. It was difficult to get the bead to seat, but after riding about 2mi, it seated itself (on 40 PSI). It might help that I was using ENVE’s own 29mm tire. I never plan use it with a smaller tire anyway. I understand the concern because hookless is in its infancy, so those of us who use them are somewhat beta testers.

[@nochancecw]

Hookless systems are way too sketchy for me. I work with CSA and NFPA standards. They are always recommendations, because they don't want to assume liability. However, if a company chooses to go against technical standards, they need another defensible standard or technical testing to prove safety. Otherwise they assume way too much liability. I would like brands to release their data and how they came to the conclusion they have. What is more likely is you will see a new 29mm tire soon...

[@richcole3931]

Just another reason to avoid hookless for now. Tire pressure is another red flag. Zipp states hookless wheels should not exceed 72psi. Sure, you might not *need* to go higher than that. But clearly hookless technology is still in its infancy. Avoid for now.

[@ragethomas]

You do know cars, motorcycles airplanes all use hookless?

[@Freestyler913]

@@ragethomas also MTB ...

[@cup_and_cone]

​@@ragethomas Apples/oranges. Passenger vehicles use steel beads that require machines to mount and are high volume.... Airplane tires are a completely different discussion.

[@kovyrshinv]

​@@cup_and_cone never had to deal with airplane tires, are those hooked?

[@cup_and_cone]

@@kovyrshinv Airplanes actually use multipiece wheels to fit the tire onto the wheel because the steel beads on airplanes are so tight and high lipped they cannot even be machine mounted.

[@bennop.2553]

It's not just a matter of not being educated about wheels and tires. In my opinion, 90% of customers who buy a new bike, don't know anything about bikes at all. That's why the bike industry is doing so well.

[@yonglingng5640]

Many of them don't know how to work on their bikes at all too, some of them don't even know how to remove their rear wheels, be it thru-axle or even a quick-release!

[@JFomo]

I've used 28mm Pirellis and Continentals on my hookless 404s and it has been fine. 55psi at the front and 60psi at the back. Don't even sweat it.

[@ChinCycling]

I’ve been running Conti STR 25mm on my Enve 6.7s, and I just rode 200 miles across Florida

[@chrisrivera448]

I been using hookless rims Corima Essentia almost a year with vittoria n.e.x.t tlr tires & it works me great no pucture problem & make the ride most comfortable .

[@rivnuts7398]

Always appreciate your industry information.

[@orlandostuart5805]

I've been tubeless for 6 years. Hookless Zipps for 4 years. I've only had one tire blow off. It was on a hooked rim with a Pirelli tire. BOOM!💣 Otherwise tubeless and hookless has been great!

[@dbk81]

I’ll stick to my hooked clinchers with latex tubes thanks. When I grow up and turn pro I’ll worry about the marginal gains of tubeless (I’m 42 and will never be a pro fyi 😂)

[@tbone-ip5fi]

Oh for sure, it's such an easy decision. I spend no time thinking about hookless rims or tubeless tires. A pair of fast hooked tires with latex inners is a tried and tested great combo. Easy to install, low rolling resistance, and no liquid running around inside the tire.

[@tbone-ip5fi]

And I can't remember the last time I punctured, either. Must be years ago. Not saying other systems puncture often, but neither does this latex/tire system. At least not for me.

[@dbk81]

@@tbone-ip5fi Agreed, hundreds of KM’s a week, it’s been years since I’ve had a puncture.

[@bradleyleeper9517]

I come for the intros and are never disappointed 🤣

[@savagepro9060]

GC Performance: Experts say 28mm Hookless is unsafe! Hookless Victims: Uh, GC, we knew that already.

[@grantsearles511]

Also, have to factor in companies claiming 28mm tyres but in fact are way smaller than stated. I have used Pirelli 28mm on my 404 but they deflated after 2 initial rides, I put the correct amount of sealant and tyre pressure of 72 psi. the original tyres on my 404 were continental st r 5000 never deflated unless punctured.

[@GCPerformance18]

yea this is true

[@rayF4rio]

So if 28mm tires measure 30mm on a 25mm internal Zipp hookless rim, is that within the ETRTO recommendations? My 30mm 5000 STR's measure 32mm on 303FC. I think the critical variable is pressure vs tire size(volume) and hoop stress. There are multiple combinations which will be safe, and some which will appear safe, but will not be due to rider weight driving up inflation pressures.

[@johnkasza2315]

I run shimano wheels with 21mm internal..conti 5000 28 installed measures out at a perfect 29mm..thats a clincher .... my buddy on an older zipp wheel, which probably was 17 or 18 internal, same conti 5000 28 measured only 23!!!! internal width is important..

[@GCPerformance18]

yes this is very true

[@petermerrill9803]

Thanks for pointing out the new recommendations. Does the new recomentation of 29mm refer to the measured tire width when inflated or the width indicated on the sidewall? I ask because I have an ENVE 3.4 with 28mm wheels and when I measure the width they are 31mm. Thanks.

[@caerffili_callin]

Interesting video. I had tires blow off hookless rims in the 1970's like a shotgun going off and when hooked rims came in they were a revelation and I see no reason to go back to hookless on the road bike, mountain bike maybe, but road bike no chance. I value my face too much just to save a few grams that an inner tube weighs.

[@bikeman123]

Hookless and tubeless are different things.

[@jonpoon3896]

I will always use hooked rims. If I’m traveling for a road event, I can always put in a non-tubeless tire in a pinch

[@Po.2013]

hookless 28 mm or higher. If you want to use 25 26 or less go with classic wheel set. I am using 30 on my zipp 303 second year. Never any problem

[@chasepalpatine170]

Running specialized turbo 30mm on Roval Alpinist wheels with tubes at 55-60 psi for years. Going up and down Mt Lemmon and other climbs in the Tucson area. Butter.

[@chasepalpatine170]

These are the tubes only Alpinist wheels…

zero issues, like my hookless wheels

[@GCPerformance18]

nope

[@DannysMyNanny]

​@@GCPerformance18 🤓

[@ashacklouis]

“My tire blew out while just sitting in my living room” is just preposterous and literally unbelievable

[@GCPerformance18]

it is not, happens a lot, I work in a store for over 12 years and I have customers who literal have that exact thing happen.. people on my iknstagram send me pics of there exploded tire from hookless wheels in there living room

[@Alejandro_BoniIIa]

The editor needs a raise!

[@Spartan_-du9wi]

Rolling Zipp 303's on Schwalbe 25's. I weigh 225 run 72 psi and use a digital inflator. I maintain pressure few rides. Never have a problem.

[@richcole3931]

72 is the max PSI rating. Seems sketchy to me.

[@onigm2]

Wait the 303 or 303s wheels? Asking as the internal width of the 303 is 25mm and the 303s is 23mm

[@jamesbianchi]

Editor, roll that intro🤣

[@waynosfotos]

ETRTO, is not a company, it is a working group that agrees on an industry guideline. It is NOT a standard. They don't test, it is just a group with experts that agrees on a code or guidelines.

[@GCPerformance18]

that companies base there tables and tires off of, they are huge guideline to follow, I was told this by my zipp rep directly

[@mysho6317]

WHY are Hookless Wheel cos making / selling 25mm internal for the Road? Makes sense for gravel & mountain wheels where riders use much wider tires & often with lower pressures. 21 Internal rim width for Road with a 28 tires would seem to give a much bigger safety margin on hookless. I'll stick with Hooked rims as Hookless never seemed to make any sense to me as a rider

[@MarcraM82]

Good video! Thank you.

[@andrewfehrsen]

That camera switch bro.... So smooth

[@justsomedude7556]

I few years back, I was looking at some zipp's, but I bailed on them due to the hookless. There is just no reason at these pressures to use hookless.

[@donwinston]

I don't think 25mm internal rim widths are appropriate for a road bike. Rims that wide are for off road use. Road bike internal rim widths are 19-23mm.

[@user-ug4qy7ch9f]

You were right, that shrimp is all over the internet.Now you can see it anywhere good job

[@Stringy1313]

What would interest me is how they derived that recommendation, what is the data? And this would apply to Both the Regulatory body as well as Zipp/Enve … What tests were done and where did the failure or kind of failure that makes a 29mm tire the min for 25mm wide hookless wheels.

[@kovyrshinv]

And enve was making 29mm tire for quite some time. What a coincidence😂. On a serious note, that doesn't affect most of the riders, but heavier (higher pressure), or people who go fast through corners or mountain descends (those guys usually know what they're doing). I have no issues sticking with bit more cofmy 30c tires TBH.

[@cyclingjeremy7201]

I think you need to save that chair spin and have it has your permanent intro

[@echtogammut]

A factor not discussed in this guideline is how the tire measures. I have 28 tires that, on the rim, measure the same as 26, I also have some gravel 28's that measure closer to a 30. How much sidewall and other variables like what the carcass is made up of will effect how a tire seats on the rim. I've never felt comfortable with hookless, but I'll admit to being enough of an Enve fanboi that if they said it was alright, I would go along.

[@blinzi69]

I am running 28mm continental tt on zipp 404 tubeless with 60 psi no problem

[@skogling]

Thank you.

[@chrisdestefano7273]

I have the enve foundation 65 wheelset and was rolling with 29c SES tires (tubular) with no problems. Now im tubeless with Vittoria Rubino Pro graphene 2.0, again, no problems. To each their own 🤷🏻‍♂️

[@GCPerformance18]

exactly

[@ryjayhar20]

I've been running enve 4.5 ARs for years and put over 15,000 miles on them. I've ran 27-30mm tires, never an issue. Are hook less rims occasionally going to fail for someone? Of course. But everyone acting like clinchers never fail and never have issues is just cherry picking data or anecdotes.

[@sylwesterziewiec]

Also, that whole hookless situation is about profit increase for producers, it is not about a better product to end consumer.

[@GCPerformance18]

Yes I couldn’t agree more

[@sccxvelo]

Why I avoid hookless wheels for cycling. Useable pressure and tire size are not the best combination or risky.

[@ragethomas]

I run tubeless hookless, tubeless hooked and clincher. The only blowout ive had was my clincher with tube in my living room going boom at 80psi. I bet most blowouts are user error.

[@Nyarlathoth]

But how likely is the user error to occur? When the compatible rim/tire chart is a jungle, the setup is hard and complicated, the pressure tolerance is very narrow, the maintenance is a pain... At this point a user doing an error can only be blamed for having chosen a specific technology in the first place

[@LarsRR]

ENVE tests all the tires they officially list as compatible, to meet their internal safety standards. ETRTO is very important as not every rim and wheel manufacturer can cross test every tire and wheel combination, and therefore, if both wheel and tire meet the ETRTO standards, they‘ll work.

[@bike314]

What's the tolerance on a 28mm tire and a 29mm tire? +- .1mm? +- 1mm ? +- 3mm?

[@GCPerformance18]

1mm

[@bonn1771]

i agree with you on this one

[@edsinofsky]

29 on a 25 inner may measure 31 which is no longer in the 105% aero rule. My 28s on a hooked 25 internal measures 30 on a 33 wide and follow the rule and fly.

[@GCPerformance18]

that rule goes out the window with a roval rapide clx wheel front

[@edsinofsky]

@@GCPerformance18 why? that rim is 35 wide so a 29 tire measuring 31 would follow that rule. My buddies ride 26s on those.

[@nickshiland608]

just gimme some clincher 25/28’s on a hooked rim and i’ll be ok. the extra tiny speed savings doesn’t cancel out my lower perception of safety

[@awesomexistence]

This Hookless resistance reminds me of the DISC BRAKE resistance of past. Discs were going to slice and dice body parts! I’ve been Running zipp 303s (23mm internal width) with 26’sspecialized 1st and continental 25’s (both measured 28+ inflated to recommendations for my weight and style riding. Absolutely love it. I’ve had rocks and potholes that i know (decades of fast group ride experience)would have flated a tubed tire.

[@kellrockets101]

But what if people arent flatting with tubes. I ride hooked rims with latex tubes and i flat maybe once a year at 10k miles a year. So should I still change my wheel standard?

[@dickieblench5001]

But not a tubular. Which is still the gold standard in safety

[@awesomexistence]

@@dickieblench5001, I’ve yet to see or hear of anyone rolling a tubeless off the rim in my area. When tubulars were king in the crit scene of the 90’s I saw a few roll off the rim. Tubular was an accepted standard then and internet was young so word didn’t spread much on that. It’s instant news if someone complains now. Tubular’s are rarely ridden in my area now. They are sweet to ride but IMO tubeless have dethroned tubulars due to ride quality and price.

[@dickieblench5001]

@@awesomexistence yes but now we have hookless🙏

[@awesomexistence]

@@dickieblench5001, I’ve been running hookless for 3 yrs., Zipp 303 S and they are quite popular in my area. No problems occurring! Tubulars=the original “hookless”.

[@jds7438]

ETRTO set the standards which european manufacturers should adhere to. When it comes to dimensions they say 29mm however in the manual there will be a +/- tolerance. Brand abc maybe recomending there 28mm which has been manufactured to the top end of the tolerance and actualy when mounted is infact 29mm. Regardless i would never run a hookless tyre / rim, in my eyes is dangerous!!

[@theantichrome9842]

Weird. I run 303 Firecrests w/ Schwalbe Pro tle 28mm. No issues at all. Interestingly, at 69psi, they measure (with calipers) 31mm.

[@GCPerformance18]

this comes into play with tire tolerences, some tires are made right and maybe people dont have issues, but here with the heat, if a tire says it can run at 73 psi buyt with heat and riding that will expand

[@guineapig13]

I’ve said it before, hookless doesn’t belong on the road!

[@jeffreytaipei7907]

99% of the comments are about hookless...but part of the issue is how the past few years the internal width has widened on road wheels to 25mm for some brands. If we are going to do a 'Public Service Announcement' you should also note that GP5000 S TR 25c size "cannot" be used on rim inner width over 21mm even for HOOKED RIMS (according to Conti themselves). So internal width plays some kind of role even for hooked rims. And an argument has to be made as to whether we really need 25mm internal width?

[@GCPerformance18]

why not just run hooked rims that are super light weight, have no tire restrictions and you can run whatever psi you like?

[@yavuzuzay]

For road i think we dont need 25mm internal width rims. And even if you use it on an all road bike (hooked 25mm internal Roval Terra for example) i would not use it with tyres narrower than 32mm

[@the.communist]

On my mtb 25 mm internal rims i use 2.30 tire.

[@seanwise7464]

I’ve been using zipp 303s and firecrest with 40mm gravel tires, no issues after 2 years of abuse so I really don’t care anymore (as far as using wider tires anyway.) I will say the 177 and zr1 hub design seem to suck pretty bad and stock wheel and driver bearings are crap, but that’s a whole different topic

[@josh33172]

You should really state this as a caveat for ROAD hookless......not even gravel. MTB has been on hookless for 8-10yrs now, and the reason there isn't a compatibility stipulation is because they operate in completely different environments when it comes to PSI. Gravel and MTB tires run at such lower pressures the design works. I've personally been on Atomik carbon hookless rims for 5 or 6 yrs now....no issues. Been using Zipp 303S with a variety of different gravel tires, no issues. I believe the Zipps are compatible with the Conti 5000 TLs, never tried it. I have faster wheels on my road bike and run tubeless (currently on the 5000S TR in 30mm, no issue. The rest, 100% agree.

[@elviracatherinetalaoc2070]

I have 353 NSW hookless and I never had any issues with it.

[@luisjordan2324]

I purchased a pair of NSW 353, and have been delaying my new build because I keep reading these hookless horror stories. I’m debating on buying a new pair of hooked wheels instead.

[@the.communist]

Enve n zipp wanna use the same rims fir both road n gravel, why would you need 25mm rim for road?

[@mochno1]

Just go 28mm. It is brutal cool, good for ride. 4BAR and you roll easy.

[@marks4471]

Clinchers, rim brakes, mechanical shifting!

[@MarcraM82]

Light

[@M3GRSD]

I literally, like today, just set up my Foundation 65 wheels tubeless with 28mm Pirelli Cinturato Velo tires because I am sick of pinch flats. Fuck.

[@GCPerformance18]

hey, it should work with you, give it a shot

[@TheGroupRide]

As a fellow big guy, Hookless is a non-starter for me on road.

[@user-nu5fx6en9h]

i am 100kg with hookless rim, i got no problem riding for years. i would say go for it

[@TheGroupRide]

​@@user-nu5fx6en9h On 28mm tires the Silca calculator, which I consider to be the most accurate recommends, 81psi Rear and 79psi front. This is beyond the safety threshold of hookless. I race and I love to rail the downhills. I will not be on hookless any time soon.

[@melcin]

@@TheGroupRide Nothing you just said applies to tubeless\hookless. Maximum PSI is 73 for tubeless\hookless. If you want to know the correct inflation numbers check with the wheel and tire manufacturers. I ride Zipp 303 Firecrest 65psi rear and 60 psi front for years now Schawlbe Pro Ones. I weigh 100 kilos. No problems.

[@TheGroupRide]

@@melcin what size tire?

[@TheGroupRide]

@@melcin Not sure In understand. I've tried tubeless/hookless 28mm tires at the max allowed of 72psi on the GP5000 setup and it was to vague when railing turns. Completely changed the bike handling in abad way.

[@jmac9205]

Only blowoff I’ve had is on a hooked rim. Been racing on Enve hookless for the past 6 months with zero issues (80kg cat 2). The best rider/team in the world are currently on hookless, and not because of sponsorship money (Pogacar- UAE). The reason you’re hearing more about hookless blowoffs is because firstly, people aren’t running them at the right pressure (if someone pumped a clincher up to 200psi and it blew off, you wouldn’t think it’s the fault of the system) Secondly, because hookless is such a talking point right now, you’re hearing more about the stories of hookless wheels blowing off and people attributing the blowoffs to hookless. There’s tons of cases of hooked rims blowing off, pinched tubes exploding, etc. But most people aren’t going to report that back to you because they have a normal wheel set and will just attribute it to a pinched tube or sudden flat.

[@user-nu5fx6en9h]

The main reason I moved to hookless to avoid blowing off for no reason and more comfortable in riding. I have been using it for many years (hookless) got no issues till now.

[@GCPerformance18]

yea I mean we have too assume that every blow off is only user error, and these idiots are pumping up past 73 psi.... there is no way in hel they are running there tire at 73 psi, then riding on hot tarmac in south florida for 3 hours on a 90 degree day, and there is no way that pressure isnt going to expand past that.... right? thats no possible, no way

[@YtseHWSW]

what makes you think UAE uses hookless / tubeless?

[@jmac9205]

@@GCPerformance18 I agree, heat is definitely a factor. I raced Tulsa tough last year and saw multiple tires blow during the race both hookless and hooked, that’s something riders need to take into account before the ride same as wet conditions or cobbles, you adjust pressure accordingly. I’m not saying hookless rims never fail, I bet that all rim manufacturers have a percentage of wheel failures. Say that the percentage of failures is the same across all manufacturers (1% for example) Enve, Giant and Zipp combined make up such a large percentage of the wheel market, 1% failures for them is probably 4x the number of any other brand and therefore you’re going to hear more about it. You obviously see and hear more about this then most of us, being in the bicycle industry so perhaps I’m wrong on this, I just find it hard to believe Giant, Zipp and Enve, some of the biggest companies in the bike industry, are willing to destroy their companies with potential safety related law suits and complete loss of credibility over saving a few bucks not putting a hook in. It’s not even like they’re thinking “oh, this might not be a good idea after all, let’s quietly switch back to hooks”, nope, they’re doubling down and adding hookless to their top end wheel sets!

[@koreydeese6899]

I didn’t think Continental made a hookless compatible tire? Or is that new?

[@joshualancekemp]

Just curious if anyone out there has tried the hookless setup with TPU tubes and are they comparable to using tubeless sealant

[@GCPerformance18]

you can, I have ran tubeless setup with tubes for consumers and works

[@BiigiieCheeese]

Roadies always amaze me how they’ll blindly follow any manufacturer “recommendations”.

[@timothyreeves1585]

Your editor deserves a raise. Keep up the good work!

[@GCPerformance18]

hahahha I fired him after this video for trolling me, found a new one lets see hoiw long he lasts

[@Hard_Work_Is_Rewarding]

In cycling community to be accepted you need to hate hookless passionately. Any other opinion is frowned upon. I think hookless is a valid option with some limitations. Too many people have used too narrow non hookless compatible tyres and then complained about hookless in general. I think this is illogical and unfair.

[@GCPerformance18]

I have my feelsing on it from seeing 100s of in person wheel and tire combinations from people coming into my store to get worfk done

[@sevontiy]

@@GCPerformance18 Of course, as a mechanic you would be frustrated and it is fair. How many times of these 100s it was not a rider's fault? I do not think individual experience is worth much, but I have hookless wheels. I set them up with non hookless Conti tyres. They have blown off (or I should say were just losing air intermittently). Did I blame hookless wheels and went on the forums to winge? No, I went and bought hookless tyres and have been happily riding for years since. Not a single tiny issue since.

[@solanogu]

Bike stores should be well trained on this matter or matters related to their business to recommend the consumer what is good and safe to purchase. You know lots of people go and buy things that probably aren't appropriate to their needs. You should guide them to not pump 120 psi on a hookless or even before that inquiry if the customer has hookless rims for example. In that way customers will be educated, safe and grateful. BTW I don't have hookless and don't plan on getting any besides I'm heavy so I need more than 70 something PSI in my tires. I even went back from tubeless to tubes both in MTB and Road bikes, I just ride mostly on the weekends.- Nothing rides like tubulars but they are now scarce (wheels, tires and mastik) in Costa Rica and expensive.

[@GCPerformance18]

Yes of course They should especially the store that sell that brand which is hookless like giant or whatever. But in this market where there is more Buying online. People buy Zipp and enve all the time without knowing what it is. And are so use to there old ways with psi and tire they don’t even realize there is a difference

[@dominicbritt]

So basically Zipp have screwed up. How can they remain within ETRTO if they don’t agree with the body’s recommendations? That’s basically Zipp saying “screw you” to consumers. What are they playing at? No one in the car industry behaves like this!! I don’t think people should buy Zipp until they come up with a sensible position on this…

[@rochtofenoldgen2494]

Hi. I have a question and I hope you can help me. I bought a giant propel advanced 2, comes with a giant SLR 2 hookless rims. All the hookless rims have the maximum tyre pressure on 73psi, but my wheels have a sticker Wich say "don't over inflate over 125psi". Wich indication must be follow?

[@jdmcdorce876]

Giant's online guidance is "Never inflate over the maximum tire pressure indicated on the rim, the tire and /or the rim tape" (noting I have never seen pressure printed on rim tape). You may want to Giant is there is nothing indicated on the rim, as well as for additional guidance regarding the minimum pressure printed on the tire.

[@bikeman123]

Its a maximum not a minimum. 73psi is maximum for hookless regardless of tyre.

[@sylwesterziewiec]

My guidelines are - no hookless on my bike. The only guidelines that matters.

[@ZioComposite]

Wow, editor popping off though

[@GCPerformance18]

editor goes dumb

[@simonwarmer8777]

What happens if you put a latex inner tube in a 28c tire. And how much psi can they take?

[@GCPerformance18]

if it is a hookless wheel the psi pressure is all the same, the max psi is 73psi

[@simonwarmer8777]

@@GCPerformance18 Thanks! Yes,they are SES 4.5 2022. Rides like a dream with Schwalbe’s. It’s a shame that they are hookless, but no choice.

[@mrwezbo]

I'm completely fine with hookless if the main thing is it's cheaper/easier for the manufacture to make the wheels. Because those savings will be passed onto us consumers, right? ...right guys? guys?

[@user-nu5fx6en9h]

That’s right, due to that the new hookless rims are cheaper than the previous one 😁😁😁

[@GCPerformance18]

hahahhahah still have not seen a 1000 dollar wheelset from the hookless people. meanwhile specialized has a hooked c38 wheel for 1100 but kudos to them for that

[@ohgodmacpac]

08:06 my mans saying schwable

[@GCPerformance18]

hahahhah he is evolving

[@ashacklouis]

You’re also conflating 28c with 28mm which are not the same thing at all

[@GCPerformance18]

sorry

[@nigelmcclean4166]

I had a chance to get a GREAT deal on a set of ENVEs...but let it go coz of "that hookless" thing. Just doesnt seem safe!!!!

[@millermiller75]

Do they explain why they recommend this? Maybe it’s cuz people tend to overinflated their tires.

[@GCPerformance18]

no reason or explanation from them, just changed there end result from 2022 to this in 2023.. maybe just from what they had seen

[@edwingosens8798]

I think the minimum reccomendation of a 29c tire on a 25mm hookless rim is not specific enough. With wider rims nowadays, a 25c tire blows up to 27-28mm wide. And not all tires with the same size label are the same size. Vittoria has charged their sizing of tires, so that a 28c tire would actually be 28mm when mounted onto a wheel. And tires like the GP 5000 S TR are developed and tested with Zipp and Enve hookless rims… So it would be a little weird for them to not be safe anymore. They should have made more effort to list all tire sizes from all different brands onto different rims with the safe range of tire pressures. To me it seems like the ETRTO is just trying to save their own ass by tarring all tires with the same brush: “If you are not using 29c tires on a 25mm hookless rim, and something goes wrong, Its not our fault.”

[@brasso9393]

Hookless with Pro One 28mm for 2 years ++ no issue at all. Generally, hookless users go on with their business without fuss and drama.

[@richcole3931]

shrinkflation = the hook is gone. pay the same.

[@johndef5075]

What was hookless supposed to solve? Preventing tires staying on rim?

[@hmcps89]

It created a lighter and stronger rim. It is also cheaper to manufacture.

[@GCPerformance18]

yea lighter and stronger, meanwhile there are lighter wheels then the hookless wheels at same price points, stronger for no reason

[@user-nu5fx6en9h]

I have been riding with hookless rims for many years, 100-150km per week I got zero issues. However, I had more issues on the hooked rims before like blowing up without any puctrure.

[@melcin]

Your bias is so strong against tubeless you disqualify yourself from speaking on it. You have no objectivity. Example - How many people do you know that have had correctly inflated tubeless/hookless tires just blow off rim sitting in their living room? Probably none despite what you say. If tubeless and hookless were so dangerous you wouldn't see pros dropping down mountains at breakneck speeds with no issues. Tubeless is not for everybody, but don't be hater. You don't want to be the next Durianrider. Do better. Love U!😃

[@GCPerformance18]

why is my argument biased..... This is my literal work, I benefit from this I sell this. it would make me more money to push tubeless setups to riders charge for labor and new tubes and have them replace tires once they get a slice in it instead of a new tube....... I have experience this I have headaches with this... I see no good coming from this, I dont mind tubeless, but have a hooked rim, there is no benefit from consumer to ride a hookless road wheel at high psi, whne the only advantage manufacturers say is its stronger rim for impact and cheaper to make even though the consumer does not see those discounts, you can achieve any setup you want with a hooked rim with no specific tire and no tire limit..... that is why Princeton wheels is dominating enve and zipps in sales

[@GCPerformance18]

also I have literal videos sent to me of this of people walking into there living room with there zip 353 wheel and pirerlli tlr race tire 28c pumped to right psi.... also customers calling me on the road asking for pickups or help saying there at the turn around point they got off there bike and tire is off rim. believe what you want. I try to give you guys REAL, IN LIFE DATA for you to take in and do what you want with it...

[@MarcraM82]

Cheaper made and less safe. 🤔 No thanks.

[@robertwhyte3435]

When they do the test they put them on perfectly... When people put tires on they may or may not. Standards can't account for all poor implementation.

[@laurenz323]

Never understood hookless. Imo its just something new they can promote and sell. Who needs it? Or do i forgot something

[@pabloc106]

honestly i dont trust a guy who put a 60psi on a 700x47 tyre and was shocked because the tyre blew off

[@DomH1994]

If someone has a front blow out (while riding a zipp/enve with a 28mm tyre) resulting in a crash occasioning severe injury or death a lawyer will have a field day. The judge could only view their ambivalence to ETRTOs recommendations as criminally negligent.