How Deltarune created one of the BEST Psychological horrors

The Hidden Genius Horror In Deltarune's Snowgrave route
Deltarune's Snowgrave route Is Genius Horror
You might know Deltarune for its happy and wholesome adventure, but hidden in chapter 2 is one of the darkest, most disturbing gaming experiences ever produced.
The Snowgrave route as it was named, creates a whole new type of psychological horror, by instead of making the characters self aware, or making them have too much control over the game, YOU now have too much control.

[@lamparo7028]

It feels so sickening being able to read Noelle's thoughts. Its suposed to be just dialogue in a game but it feels like such a breach of privacy in this route

[@Shilsey]

Very much agree with this, i really should have gone more into this point

[@nguyenhoang6702]

_Why are you wearing my watch?_

[@codycombs8590]

​​​​@@nguyenhoang6702 You gave . . . it to me

[@daniellejackson6543]

​@@nguyenhoang6702What it's a neat watch. Oh yeah btw that dream was real or smth. Sorry about berdly I guess.

[@Madhatter1781]

I definitely agree. It's almost hard to watch, especially for someone with trauma themselves. Glad I never bothered doing these things, they make me feel icky :(

[@Emperor-Quill]

There are more than just the "Fight" or "Flight" response as a reaction to something bad. There is also the "Freeze" reaction, And there is the "Fawn" reaction, most commonly found in emotional abuse victims. Under the belief that by "fawning" over the perpetrator, you will be subjected to less harsh treatment, or even be rewarded. Interesting how Noelle has ice abilities, and is a young deer. A Fawn who Freezes...

[@Shilsey]

I knew about the freeze one, i had never heard of fawning, thats very interesting!

[@Shrooblord]

Good one!

[@cartwrightplayz4636]

is this a pun or just talking about the video

[@tiredperson1124]

Oh my god I've never made that connection before that's so cool

[@CyberDucke]

@@tiredperson1124cool indeed

[@extrocacity]

During Noelle's Creepy text in the hospital, you can actually walk over to her. And if you decided to equip her watch in the dark world she talks about how she doesnt remember giving you her watch

[@cordyceps7531]

It’s amazing how a story manages to feel more dark and disturbing when we’re psychologically tormenting a single person, as opposed to genocide.

[@joshred1571]

Well genocide (both in game and real life) allows us to disconnect ourselves from the horror of what we are doing. It becomes a task or job. It isn’t personal, this group of people simply have to go. A “necessary evil”. When we abuse someone it’s personal, we play on all of their hopes and fears and turn it all against them. We trap them in a prison of their own mind. It’s deeply personal and it is very hard unless your mentally disturbed to push that feeling down. That’s my two cents any way

[@Amber-Hazel-Mint-777]

​@@joshred1571perfect take on the matter 😊

[@doritos4956]

It's a sad reflection to real life Dam this writing os good

[@kx7500]

It feels more real. Idk it’s similar to rpe vs murder. Many are more offended by the former despite most logically agreeing the latter is worse

[@Rudxain]

This reminds me of Trolley Problems

[@meloncholicc]

i'd like to mention that in the berdly battle, noelle's hp goes down to 55. 55 in roman numerals is LV.

[@Shilsey]

ooeh cool detail

[@gamehero6816]

LEVEL OF VIOLENCE

[@OneBrokenEgg]

UNDERTALE REFERENCE

[@thethree13o]

Dunno if Toby did this on purpose, as in the code it just divides by three ( I think) would be cool if it was intentional though!

[@antifascistamerican3782]

Also, in Berdly’s battle, he no longer has a smug expression. He’s legitimately serious and concerned for Noelle.

[@feyytime5571]

Snowgrave is psychological horror by using probably one of the most painful emotion someone can feel. Guilt. And it's amazing

[@candykaind]

i feel like it's also so horrifying because noelle isn't even safe in her own thoughts, we the player can see everything, and by kris responding it must put a whole new level of fear into her. no matter what she does she isn't safe from the person she fears, she isn't safe from us

[@Shilsey]

this is such a big point, its so horrid how we have that much control.

[@RyderTaylor-d3d]

One of the scariest parts of Snowgrave to me is the manipulation of free will these chacters have. This is really only seen in Noelle but will probably be used in other weird routes. You don’t get to even think about your favorite ice cream flavor or how your dog died and you’re sad without the player knowing. It is and I’m using Noelle’s own words here. Terrifying.

[@AvariceAgent]

Keep in mind, Noelle likes scary things, Susie, Scary movies, etc. But that voice she keeps hearing... It Terrifies Her.

[@Shilsey]

Oh thats so interesting, especially cause you can interpret it two very different ways, one being that shes used to scary stuff and thus doesn't get scared easily, yet this terrifies her, or in the way that she likes scary things, and that she could start to like the manipulation... Thats an amazing detail

[@insertnamehere1398]

It’s not distorted. It sounds uncanny

[@NiennaFan1]

@@Shilseyshe likes scary stuff if it’s safe, like a horror movie she can turn off- this isn’t safe or in her control at all

[@Shilsey]

Susie is not something you can just turn off, and noelle is still attracted to her, so i would disagree with this take@@NiennaFan1

[@jameseads6597]

​@@Shilsey I know this is a bit late, but Noelle said she liked Susie because she is the good type of scary, during the ferris wheel

[@hatandhoodie_]

An important distinction to make is that Undertale's Genocide Route feels like something you _aren't supposed_ to do, while Deltarune's Weird Route feels like something you _shouldn't be able_ to do. That's what I like about the Weird Route in contrast to the Genocide Route, because it doesn't just feel immoral, it also feels impossible.

[@Shilsey]

This is absolutely s great point, i didnt mention it because i feel like it would be more effective in a video talking about the metanarrative of both undertale and deltarune? Idk if that makes sense but yeah that's why i didnt mention jt

[@ricky.t.1658]

I think both are ok, no need to critizise one

[@rustyfisher2081]

​@@ricky.t.1658 nobody is criticizing them lol

[@Awesomeness-iz3dh]

When you consider what we learn about Noelle through the Spamton Sweepstakes thing, it becomes clear that she's someone with a knack for finding odd glitches and exploits in video games who also lives in a video game (and of course you have to go and make that her problem), which is why it makes so much sense for her to be the key to this weird, weird route.

[@rustyfisher2081]

@@Awesomeness-iz3dh that's awesome

[@normalhuman9878]

I like how much this route emphasizes that you, the player, are responsible for you make Kris do. Too many people blamed Chara for the genocide route in Undertale even though they, the player, chose to kill everyone.

[@maila319]

Well it's true that Chara was never responsible for the genocide run since we chose to do that to the point even Chara labels us as "perverted sentimentality" after the second genocide run but they were still guilty for helping us after the Ruins section and destroying the world rather than objecting us from killing the monsters they cared so much.

[@LordBison98]

Many people still blame Kris and say they are the horrible one, which is heartbreaking.

[@PhantomGato-v-]

​@@LordBison98that is maximum f*cked up

[@snowboundwhale6860]

@@maila319 Though Chara destroyed the world because they thought that was our goal with the genocide route, the logical end point for actively hunting down and killing everyone like we'd been doing. Wanting to go back to that world at all gets some confusion and criticism from them, and going back just to kill everything again does fit the label of "perverted sentimentality" very well. Chara does what they do because they _can't_ stop us until the end, and by then they're acting on what we've taught them, which is why trying to go back confuses them.

[@TheParadoxGamer1]

@@LordBison98considering toby’s storytelling, i imagine he’ll emphasize its *our fault*

[@GachaLifeGirl]

Fun fact: you can see Noelle move when Kris goes to step on the other switch in Snowgrave. She wasn’t just thinking about killing us. She almost *did.* I love that little detail. It shows how much you’d already broken Noelle’s will. It sent chills down my spine when I first noticed it.

[@Shilsey]

Thats such a cool detail damnn

[@ImJustHereHiHowAreYa]

1 extra thing that i love about the snowgrave route is that if you decide to wear noelles watch in the dark world, theres a bit of extra dialogue in the creepy hospital scene. I just love this small detail and it just makes it slightly creepier in a way

[@Shilsey]

True, didnt know about that while making the video, but its bonechilling

[@Pixmel_Artistry]

My favorite scene out of all of the Snowgrave route: “Why are you wearing... my watch? Wh... when did you...” It truly signifies a new ending for the game that we probably wasn’t suppose to be accesible. There may be 2 ending. One that Toby didn’t want us to get

[@rockgirl6786]

Maybe this is sort of off topic, but it's nice to see that someone else knows that emotional manipulation is abuse

[@Shilsey]

I don't feel like that's off topic at all, and I totally agree that way too many people don't realize that important fact.

[@chickennuggetman2593]

i thought it was obvious

[@IkerTG]

The thing about humanity is that there are probably a lot of people who know that this is obvious, but there’s also people that just don’t

[@OttrPopAnimations]

yess

[@TacoBellBee]

And people still do it sadly. W comment tho

[@eli-chan4159]

If you interact with Birdly in the library, you'll get some unique text. And also if u interact with the closet there, it will imply that it's a perfect place to hide a body...

[@N0peto3]

İ thought that was intended for the Knight?? Cuz yknow the knight needed to hide from Berdly and Noelle

[@N0peto3]

İf thats so that very messed up

[@NiennaFan1]

@@N0peto3both maybe

[@Diamond1234]

It's true, the worst part of the Weird Route/Snowgrave route is you force someone else to do it. Someone who is just listening to whatever you say and thinks you are doing what's best for them when in reality, you are just forcing them to do your bidding for your own sake. It's so unsettling that I'm almost ashamed I even found out about it through the wiki and watched in horror that a route like this took place in a game where I thought our choices didn't matter.

[@Shilsey]

yeah, its disgusting in a good way

[@normalhuman9878]

I bet Toby made it even more clear that it’s you who is doing it because everyone blamed Chara for the genocide run in Undertale

[@samgeorge1452]

There definitely is something very horrifying in how Noelle repeatedly mentions the voice controlling her was, "Unlike Kris's" that adds a whole new layer of horror to it all. It seems like Deltarune is taking a more literal meta approach- We, the players, control Kris, but Kris themself still has their own mind and personality despite this, outright resisting us at times. However, no one in-universe as of now (minus maybe Ralsei or other Darkners?) could feasibly know this. Kris is isolated enough where absolutely no one, besides Toriel to a small degree, except Noelle actually notices something is wrong with Kris. Noelle is left feeling so incredibly isolated and terrified because she's the only one who knows. She's the only one who's been affected (minus Berdly) and that makes it even easier to understand how she can convince herself that it was all a dream. Kris themself doesn't really seem to complain or be upset, but Susie does mention twice they look hurt or unenthusiastic, so I can't imagine they're happy with any of this. Being forced to hurt one of your only friends in such an awful way is horrifying.

[@Shilsey]

man, I made this video some months ago and have since researched storytelling more in depth and I gotta say, I wish I had talked about more about the meta implications this game has, its so incredible, and I am so indescribably excited for future chapters. but yeah, its gonna be so interesting to see how Kris will act throughout the future chapters

[@tomahawkgamesbr6045]

@@Shilsey Recently another thought came to my mind regarding the meta implications and I think I finally found a place to express them, in the end of the genocide route Chara specifically uses the wording "Let us erase this pointless world, and move on to the next." then you make a choice, game crashes, everything is empty, and then Chara says "You want to go back to the world you destroyed." they specifically say "go back" if their intentions were to just destroy the empty world and restore it so you can "move on", they would have done so and perhaps asked for your soul right then and there, you wouldn't have to ask them to restore it, which makes me wonder if said "next world" Chara was referring to is Deltarune or something else entirely, if that is the case it gives a completely different meaning to the genocide ending and the fact Toby Fox even encourages the player to use their own name in both games, the player is a reoccurring character, perhaps DR's "your choices don't matter" is some sort of in universe defense mechanism against the player

[@genarorios5055]

@@tomahawkgamesbr6045 so....aware of what we could do **they** tried to limit our influence by making us believe we had no power over this world? ... ... ... ... ... Interesting, but ultimately useless. Kris is becoming an annoyance. We may have to get a new vessel...*observes Noelle* and she's perfect. After all, we all know what happens when a monster absorbs a human soul....aha-hahahahahaha!

[@chloskyskies4399]

Love to see someone else acknowledge that deltarune has a large psychological horror element. Imo most of the game is fridge horror. Also Imagine being kris, you got bodyjacked, but no one notices. In fact, they might like your imposter _more_. Or watching helplessly,as the thing controlling your body manipulates your childhood friend into murder.

[@chloskyskies4399]

also the random Zelda footage at 3:37 lol

[@Shilsey]

I wouldn't agree with it being a fridge horror, as its pretty disturbing all throughout, but yeah that scenario is horryfing

[@i8chocolatecake995]

oh yea absolutely that part is delightfully HORRIFYING

[@RyderTaylor-d3d]

This chat message kinda makes me remember a music video called Meglomaniac. Where half way through Frisk gets body jacked by Chara and has to watch while she kills sans.

[@LightmareShadow]

17:02 I love this bit of the dialogue because this is when you realize finally that this never was kris, and it was your and your fault since the beggining. The creepy voice Noelle refers to, is the player's voice. Note how the screen shifts to black during this scene. You can't see not Kris and nor Noelle. You can only see your own reflection. This is all you're doing.

[@Shilsey]

yeahh, I should have gone more into depth about it, its so damn creepy

[@LightmareShadow]

@@Shilsey absolutely

[@MahBoi100]

There are a couple of bonus lines available when you talk to Noelle while she's losing her shit in the hospital. Noelle wears a watch as an equipment while she is in your party. If you take her watch and have Kris wear it instead, she is going to comment on it in this scene. Really creepy!

[@Shilsey]

I heard about this after making the video, and it really is so spooky, i wish i had known about it before

[@TheSkyGuy77]

Toby: this is a happy game Also Toby: .... unless you make it not so.

[@DavidHeartdust]

The conversation outside the hospital becomes 100% creepier if you equip Noelle's watch

[@erickmoczulski1582]

Everyone already told you that about the watch. But did you know that you can move during this cutscene? You can move closer and closer to Noele and it freaks her out.

[@Shilsey]

wait what.. I didn't hear about that that's so spooky

[@LiMe251]

​@@Shilseyafter the cutscene ends your location implies you cornered her into the wall.

[@AcidVials]

that route hurt me so badly when i first did it. i found out about it through a video and i wanted to try it as a challenge because of how hard spamton neo is in that route but by the end i felt damaged because of my actions. the worst part is i beat spamton neo and got the ending and then i was back at the end when i reloaded my save because i wanted access to redo the fight again but then i accidentally deleted my file and thus i have not done the route again. not only is it so emotionally draining to do because of everything in it but also i just don't wanna spend so much time on it again

[@Shilsey]

yeah its very rough, but what you can do if you want to replay the spamton neo fight, you could download some save files from the internet just before the fight

[@QSBraWQ]

About time part. Jeviltail (you can get it behind waterfall in castle town if you beaten him at 1st chapter) makes first encounters die in 2 turns. You can just run to enemies and hold C on dialogues. Weird route skips a lot of deltarune, so there are barely any cutscene (1 unskipable after using the spell). Mansion isn't particularly time consuming either.

[@ma.2089]

It’s actually funny you mention that Snowgrave is fully the player’s fault. Cuz it totally is. But I’ve seen people deny it and claim it says something about Kris. That Kris is able to do it, therefore they’re evil. They completely ignore all the evidence against it. I wonder if Toby is making the choices so obviously the player’s choices after fallen child/Chara was scapegoated so hard in Undertale. The game itself implies something about how we’ve fallen off the path that we should be going down. There’s also some cool theories that half baked bread chaos (sorry I don’t know his name it’s something like that) came up with that would die the hardcore manipulation route to Gaster in some way. Either we are falling off the path or something else. Can’t wait for chapter 3. There’s so much psychological and existential horror in these games.

[@Shilsey]

people tried to justify snowgrave?? that's crazy haha the chara situation I could almost understand but this?? anyway I am also super excited for future chapters, incredibly high hopes

[@cindyzhaoyingzi8719]

HalfBreadChaos is their name (also they use they/them)

[@NiennaFan1]

Absolutely, I think Toby learned his lesson from people (for example the kids playing Undertale which was designed to be a kid friendly game) thinking Chara was always like that and made it painfully obvious this time around

[@onyxuhhhhhermmmmhhhhsilly]

Do you ever like a character just because you feel bad for them? Cus well berdly was annoying and no shit its obvious that’s how he’s meant to be but he didn’t deserve that. Especially because he literally immediately snapped out of the goofy nerd boy act and actually tried to save noelle. It’s also implied that you stuff his body in the closet when you get back to the light world. I’d really like to see how toby fox continues this with further chapters!

[@onyxuhhhhhermmmmhhhhsilly]

You can also see that there are significant differences in his sprites, for example the fact that for some reason there is no longer an eye on his halberd. I have no clue on why this could be, do any of you have any ideas?

[@Shilsey]

I can totally see what you mean, and I don't dislike him as much as I made out in this video, I kinda did him dirty in this one, I am curious to see where his character goes in future chapters, normal route, but also what the concequences will be from him dying in snowgrave. also I had no clue that his sprites change, ill come back in like 10 minute and give you my theory

[@Shilsey]

for the sprite change, his expression also slightly changes to look more serious, so I feel like the eye disappearing may be him not caring anymore about how others look at him? idk im too tired to actually think about shit rn

[@rushledog]

This route was creepy af, found it is so specific and nothing gives you even a clue about it existing, it feels like something that shouldn't be possible. It was truly an expierence

[@genericname2747]

You can inflict extra trauma on Noelle by wearing her watch when you see her at the hospital

[@Shilsey]

I have been made aware!

[@CrystalGeny]

honestly agree with everything you said about the Weird Route it really is a great example that, in direct contrast with what you're told in the prologue of Chapter 1, your choices do matter. You don't get to choose who you are, but you sure as hell can choose what you do. And what you do WILL have consequences for the people around you. its a perfect example of psychological horror, because your actions hurt everyone EXCEPT yourself in the game, and you can't fix it once it's happened. it's not horror because you lack control, it's horror because you have so much control when you shouldn't

[@Shilsey]

very much agree, its such a fantastic subversion of common horror tropes, I don't think I've ever seen horror where you have TOO MUCH control, its crazy, man toby fox is a genius

[@dominikjus8229]

Ok so... I can see how this route would continue in chapter three, but this time instead of noelle and ice, it's toriel and fire, in noelles case, your her childhood friend who'd never harm her, in this case kris is toriels child, her own child only wants the best for their mother, right?

[@alexburn4014]

The real fucked up part is the possibility of undyne showing up since she's the police. If they take on the appearance of a knight whats stopping us using Toreil to fry her saying that the roaring knight plotting to end the world.

[@themostamericankenjaku]

Welp , I am expecting to see Undyne turned into grilled fish

[@i8chocolatecake995]

@@alexburn4014 would love for this to happen ngl

[@i8chocolatecake995]

this would make sense and be wild af

[@moosethegamer9140]

"Who no one really likes when they first play through." Me who actually likes Birdly: "... yeah... no one...."

[@TheSpecialPsycho]

Personally, when I was playing the Snowgrave route, at some point, I genuinely felt like I wasn't in control of what I was doing. Like I was on autopilot, or having my own strings pulled. It wouldn't stop. The time I was me again, though, was about the Spamton Neo fight. I don't know why or how I got unto that mentality, or how I stomached going through the route, but I definitely felt something wrong with me by the time I got to the end.

[@jackthesmoltangerine]

Dude, I think you were losing your mind

[@NiennaFan1]

Wow that is horrifying

[@help_me_help_me_help_me]

Your name now makes sense

[@CannoliSlugYT]

Matpat: "It's a world of pure imagination!" :D Toby Fox: "Are you sure about that? Noelle use SNOWGRAVE!" The quotes belongs to their original owners and the last one was a reference.

[@FtheP.]

I had the same reaction to snowgrave, when I saw it for the first time, I was like, no more internet for today.

[@Hessonite_Dragon_Helen]

I'd like to add to one of your points In genocide in Undertale, it's relatively easy to keep going through that route, it's easier and easier and you're even locked into it about 2/3rds through the game (Either Undyne the Undying or Papyrus, I don't know the intricacies of Genocide) In Snowgrave, you have to bend over backward to keep going, and a single misstep ends the route. Until the final casting of Snowgrave on Berdly, you have the chance to back out. Hell, it's *easier* to back out than keep going. Snowgrave isn't something you stumble onto, maybe the first couple steps, sure, but the FreezeRing and ThornsRing steps are incredibly easy to miss. as well as the puzzles you solve by Proceed-ing. And just *one*, one single mistake, locks you out of the entire route. You basically have to intentionally know what you're doing to continue

[@connorschultz380]

Actually your not truly locked in to genocide until basically 5 minutes before the sans fight, if you make the right choices just before the mettaton cutscense; you can get the metaton EX stuff and not fight sans Edit: fundamentally, most people don't consider you locked into the genocide route until the sans fight. (Tho technically this happens, a few minutes before then)

[@Shilsey]

this is a good point, Snowgrave feels more like it requires you to choose for it 100%👍

[@user-file-x-life]

‏‪18:44‬‏ It still doesn't really make sense how Papyrus wasnt shocked, like, literally, sense he still has the gem

[@QSBraWQ]

Basketballs are made of runner and electricity doesn't transfer through it

[@user-file-x-life]

@@QSBraWQ good point But this means, papyrus shouldn't he shocked in both pacifist and natural routes

[@i8chocolatecake995]

ig he hadn't turned the puzzle on yet?? maybe??? that really doesn't make sense ur right

[@PhysicsGamer]

Another little bit of the tragedy of Snowgrave comes from that bit where Noelle says she really only feels comfortable saying 'no' to Kris and her father. She's already dealing with the fact that her father is really, really sick - she might soon lose one of the few people she actually feels truly comfortable around. But then Kris (or rather 'Kris' - but she doesn't really seem to realize that overtly) undercuts and browbeats her into doing what they say. Noelle loses the ability to say "No" to "Kris"... in exchange for being able to say "No" to others, potentially. In the regular route, she raises her "boldness" and learns that she has to speak up to get what she wants. In the weird route, she raises her "coldness" and learns that if she does what "Kris" says she'll get what she "wants".

[@Shilsey]

yeah, its so tragic how much she trusts kris before the snowgrave route, its so disturbing

[@PhysicsGamer]

@@Shilsey Yeah, especially after the Sweepstakes gave us more background into her past with Kris. I really hope she gets to reunite with December as has been foreshadowed a few times as a possibility, but I'm also wondering what that meeting would look like if it happens on the Snowgrave route.

[@Shilsey]

that would be SO cool to see, especially because we basically know nothing about December, so literally anything could happen

[@PhysicsGamer]

@@Shilsey Yeah, Toby's definitely been playing that one especially close to the chest. As far as I'm aware, this is the sum total of the content we have connected to December: * Lines from Noelle that are only indirectly about December (the spelling bee monologue), plus a couple of brief allusions from other NPCs * Some unused-on-purpose text that really has no connection to December besides the circumstantial * A picture of a guitar * A single implication of some sort of close-and-possibly-romantic connection with Asriel (the jacket) * Reactions from Noelle that, if you squint, imply she might have been more involved with the disappearance of December than she lets herself remember * A music video that Toby worked on which we have every reason to believe is totally unconnected to Deltarune - including his own statements to that effect - besides the fact that there are multiple obvious parallels Actually, laying it out like that it's kind of amazing how much we've gotten about December without actually learning anything. She's definitely going to be incredibly important.

[@StypidRoofer]

​@@PhysicsGamer yep name checks out

[@jgtb0pl]

16:53 btw if you equip kris with the silver watch that Noelle has while with her and get to that dialogue it changes a bit the ending goes a bit like this: "It was just a dream right? Then... then why does kris have my watch?" or something like that

[@dgouin99]

I think Noelle is going to end up being like Undyne. Even if the ending is the same, it would be super easy to implement a flag to, say, a scripted Noelle fight at some point in a future chapter. If you don't do snowgrave, maybe it could be you stopping her from getting too powerful. If you go through with snowgrave though, you would have to fight her at her full icy potential. No idea what the outcome or consequences of that could be, but I think it might be possible

[@Shilsey]

this could be a very interesting idea!

[@TheBl00d_OfEvelyn]

Imagine how it would be like for Chapter 3 after SnowGrave

[@Shilsey]

yeah that's the big thing for me as well rn, so hyped for future chapters

[@yeetius-e2z]

DDLC: lets do phycho horro *Toby later on* Toby fox: I could try that

[@A_Andromeda_a]

Your name is- Ad: “PIZZA HUT MEATLOVERS MELT”

[@TokiTheUhh]

if you wanna spook her even more, take her watch in the dark world before beating spamton

[@theprinceofawesomeness]

A huge part about the hospital sceen in chapter 2 is that we know Noelle is there because her dad is there, so for us to come there to see her we need to use psycopath logic. "Where can we found Noelle?" "In the Hospital, next to her dying father" "All right, let's go and see her" And probably in chapter 4 (if we skip a cha3 encounter) we will ether found her in the church or the hospital since her father promised to go with her to the church but he might not be allowed

[@arg1]

I had Genuine nightmares for WEAKS after I did the snow grave rout...... DAMN toby is good at guilt-tripping.....

[@kentuckyfiredchiccen]

Underrated video and channel, the editing and narration on this video are top tier

[@Shilsey]

Much appreciated!

[@alexburn4014]

I like to imagine that the end of deltarune is kris breaking our connection from the player and thats why theres only one ending. Because we either relinquish control or have it taken from us. In undertale no one could stop the player from killing everyone but what if that choice is forcefully ripped from you by kris and eventually Noelle as she finally snaps and loses all fear of the player. You only slowed her character development instead of stopping it and the moment she no longer will listen means you will have no way to interact with the world.

[@_m6_]

Wow this was incredible. Definetly deserve more subs.

[@Shilsey]

Means alot, thanks!

[@nicolasn12]

toby got a little carried away, it was supposed to be an normal (fun) game but remember its toby, everyone gets carried away sometimes

[@Shilsey]

Dont quite agree with this, i imagine he has most of the game planned out, but fair enough!

[@nicolasn12]

@@Shilsey so do i that was meant to be a joke :D

[@Shilsey]

ah mb :D @@nicolasn12

[@nicolasn12]

@@Shilsey no problem :D

[@squirtle_10]

this is rlly underrated!! your editing is really good

[@Shilsey]

Thank you so much!!

[@totothepotato2794]

1:53 Ah yes my favourite Deltarune character, RALS-EYE.

[@JezElectro13]

Kris ripping their SOUL out is important though. Partially. Because it's first real proof You the Player are separate entity from Kris, which is important because this Route is 100% your fault, and you can't blame Kris for anything except maybe them not stopping you while they could.

[@elrohirshouldercheaptrick9452]

I bet deltarune is gonna end with Kris being permanently freed from the control of us

[@Brydav_Massbear]

Despite what they say, our choices 𝘥𝘰 matter. Also, believe it or not, we have had this mind reading power in Undertale as well. The easiest way to tell is when interacting with certain characters. We can hear their voices even though those words are inside their mind.

[@we_like_quaq7619]

The secret Watch dialogue is so scary to me.

[@ivancabrera3289]

I imagine that if you keep doing the weird routes you would have to fight ralsey and susie and this fight could be harder than the sans boss fight because ralsey would actually be defending and healing susie and susie would hit as hard as possible

[@alliwrites6739]

I couldn’t go through with the undertale Geno route because killing my favorite characters mad me sad and maybe a little guilty. In deltarune it’s different. Knowing the amount of manipulation and guilt your throwing into SOMEONE ELSES HANDS, is just disgusting and completely terrifying to think about. It’s more of torture rather than just death.

[@chickennuggetman2593]

i remember art of noelle's "BANGER VIEW" *shivers*

[@mochiandturtles5642]

What art?

[@BlueBerry20104]

Underrated my guy you deserve more subs

[@dustylonefox4804]

Wholeheartedly, when this chapter came out and i learned about the Snowgrave route, i was haunted by the animation of Noelle casting snowgrave, and i still get chills seeing it now. I couldnt tell you how Toby pulled it off, but the animation itself and the sound design of the snowgrave spell just creeps me the hell out.

[@Shilsey]

it is quite special how such a simple animation can be so haunting

[@BlueBow-f5h]

Still get “chills”

[@loubaxo9339]

I wonder how will this route influence the rest of the game, like will Berdly appear in subsequent chapters even if you have done Snowgrave?

[@Shilsey]

yeah that's the big thing for me as well rn, so hyped for future chapters

[@Natillumi]

i just watched one of your other videos and i wanna watch this one very bad but i gotta finish chapter 2 first 😭

[@Shilsey]

Haha its fine, chapter 2 is really good first time playing through :D

[@user-file-x-life]

Dont worry, its really ez and not that long if u tried to speedrun it

[@Andriu-eh9sg]

I like the copium of certain players that say "Berdly just fell asleep" like, brother, if Berdly actually fell asleep, he would have awakened in cold sweat and with their body chilling.

[@silversnow-]

I personally absolutely love Snowgrave route, even more than Genocide in Undertale. Feeling the disturbing atmosphere and guilt...the music...the paychological aspect...made me fascinated. The detail who made me sick to the stomach though was when I read the item description of the Ring of Thorns. Like...we are actually let her wear a ring which she gets pain from??? That was fucked up😂 Even more sickening at the hospital scene is that Noelle freaks out if you wear her watch and come near her. She is terrified of you. Also a sick detail is that Noelle can't die at the Birdley fight. Her HP will go down to 55 and if you transfer these numbers into roma it spells LOVE. Level of Violence...from Undertale..m

[@Thedragonlover95]

Now I wouldn't really do this in game.

[@cattothecar]

genocide route is the gaslighting your deer friend speedrun

[@NotAnAlternate1337]

This rout for me feels like something that’s invading the world of deltarune, something that breaks everything.

[@BreadBreadBreaddd]

i legit didnt have any reactions when i played snowgrave route but the only time i had an actual reaction was when noelle said "Why are you wearing my watch?" it legit gave me chills since I DID NOT KNOW THAT DIALOUGE EXISTED since i watched a playthrough and ending of snowgrave on youtube and I did not know that equipping noelles watch at the dark world also affects the light world

[@maskedgames9115]

16:49 if you equipped her watch in the dark world kris will still have it equipped and Noelle will be surprised, confused and panicked saying how did they get her watch

[@Shilsey]

only found out after making this video sadly

[@Barichter74318]

The Weird Route is the most I've been disturbed on anything by Toby Fox, even more than the genocide route. I think it is because in Weird Route, we see all the effects on Noelle very clearly. Genocide route sometimes feels like a chore (kill 23094353 monsters in hotland), sometimes has epic boss fights with epic music (Undyne, Sans), and even though we see how fucked up it is when we kill the boss monsters, it feels like we can distance ourselves from Frisk at least sometimes. In Weird Route, I was constantly reminded how fucked up it was since we can even read Noelle's mind, actually speaking about this, as you said, the game makes it very clear we are doing this. Kris doesnt read her mind, we do. We are the one that says all the stuff to her, so it feels harder to distance yourself. Even at the "final boss", we still use Noelle and she is the only one that comes when we call her name; we, not Kris. "Because it wasnt a dream" was the last straw for me, it was one of the most disturbing things I saw in any game, great video!

[@NagKai_G]

19:10 "I really hope chapter 3 to 5 comes out within 7 months" *Seven months later, I'm writing a comment on a video I just watched just to say that that did not happen*

[@Shilsey]

haha true, SURELY next 5 months though

[@CharlesC520]

This year will be the one, I can feel it

[@help_me_help_me_help_me]

​@@Shilsey After another 7 months, still neither have come out.

[@jjupiter_nwn]

@@Shilsey Reading this comment (written 7 months ago) is so funny to me JHBDSFJHBG

[@Shilsey]

@@jjupiter_nwn haha yeah, how naive i was... SURELY NEXT 5 MONTHS THOUGH

[@kittycat1130]

I just really love how at the end of the Spamton fight, Kris is the one shouting for help. Kris shouts Susie's name, Kris shouts Ralsei's name, but YOU *whispered* Noelle's name

[@princequincy5421]

What's wild is how this route is foreshadowed. Kris' decisions may not matter, but others seem to.

[@lancerdeltarune]

Proceed.

[@Shilsey]

Proceed.

[@lancerdeltarune]

@@Shilsey Proceed.

[@nguyenhoang6702]

Watch what happens when I cast a spell that I don't know!

[@lancerdeltarune]

@@nguyenhoang6702 Proceed.

[@axis1677]

​@@nguyenhoang6702titututitututitututitutitutitutuuuuuu

[@MintyFox_2009]

Man I just loved hearing berdly been a bitch That made me laugh

[@destructivecriticsm]

one hidden detail: if you take noelle's watch and equip it in the dark world, the dialogue in the hospital changes slightly, with noelle being concerned as to why you're wearing HER watch

[@Murdock1260]

I’m sure someone’s already mentioned it, but if you unequip noelles’ watch from her, and give it to Kris then you get new dialogue at the hospital. Because Noelle knows something happened. And it makes it all the much worse.

[@Shilsey]

haha ive got about 50 comments about this, but yeah i wish i knew that when making this video

[@Murdock1260]

@@Shilsey It just goes to show even with research and effort, Toby still manages to surprise people with hidden details to scare people

[@TheTrueBloxxer]

2:01 that door slamming was on point lmao

[@SomeRandoDum]

What's even scarier is if you take her watch, she notices it during the ending dialogue with her

[@sahilhossain8204]

Lore of How Deltarune created one of the BEST Psychological horrors momentum 100

[@Cheesegod3655]

You make very well made and enjoyable videos, definitely subscribing

[@toxdaz]

14:20 2 hours? I HAVENT EVEN BEAT PACIFIST SPAMTON NEO YET

[@MarcosAlexandre-no3qx]

I like how he pointed that people wanted to kill berdly. Yeah but is almost like, we fight you because you're an annoyance and can't be killed, not because we want to really kill you, but in this one, when you make noelle kill him (and it's not your action of fighting but the action of manipulating someone else to do it) you fell horrible, more than in the genocide route.

[@ChaoticDoodle]

Can’t wait for me to get scared half to death in Chapter 3 😭

[@matttale7918]

I’ll be honest, the moment I snowgraved Berdly and got to Queens mansion I immediately felt sick to my stomach. Before I was creeped and weirded out by the….oddly possessive and romantic implications of the route with our connection to Noelle, and the felt guilty for manipulating her. But that was when I couldn’t take it even though I just HAD to know what would change. This route definitely pulls at your [[heartstrings]] in the worst [best] way possible.

[@THE-MØSS-EATER]

The snowgrave route feels disgusting, wrong and just straight up evil

[@Yeay_yusuf]

Imagine that you are getting controlled by your best friend but now your best friend is like “not your best friend” and theres nobody to help you in this situation. Because even if you just think anything, Your friend hears what you are thinking and then you saw your only friend that can help you but your best friend uses you to kill him…

[@Xenex06]

Its fascinating how youre always the villain of deltarune , without you kris would just live his life

[@samgeorge1452]

Their.

[@NiennaFan1]

But no one would have been able to seal the fountains without us…

[@_frenchfriesguy_]

Bruh your video quality is just so good! You deserve more subs, man! Keep up the good work!

[@Shilsey]

I appreciate it! Means alot!

[@_frenchfriesguy_]

Thx!

[@The_true_and_real_chaos]

What's she gonna do make ME an ice cream!? yes.

[@Shilsey]

haha that's a funny interpretation of that line

[@gagabarbidou5975]

Mandatory comment to tell KZbin to show your videos some more love. Great vid !

[@pakuvang4775]

(Not so) Fun fact! During Noelle's monologue in the hospital, you can actually move during the cut scene, making Kris walk towards Noelle. And she reacts to it, telling them to get away from her. And when the cutscene ends and you are able to see again, Kris and Susie are standing very close to the wall. That basically implies that you, controlling Kris, backed Noelle to the wall. Think about that.

[@TheSenkMan]

Toby probably read the Jeff the killer creepy pasta before making deltarune chapter 2

[@QSBraWQ]

Weird route is inspired by creepastas. It's a thing you do randomly and game doesn't have hints for it. I like video of Part two device theory, where partially they talk about it (it's 2 and a half hours tho, so partially is a lot).

[@TheSenkMan]

@@QSBraWQ yeah, honestly if someone described snowgrave to me without me knowing about it I would laugh and tell them thatnit’s just a creepypasta

[@nguyenhoang6702]

@@TheSenkMan Fun fact: SnowGrave was discovered by accident. So I imagine that it's pretty tough for the first person who's ever found it to even convince other people about the route's presence in the game.

[@TheSenkMan]

@@nguyenhoang6702 imagine telling people there’s a secret murder route to a game that was officially announced to only have one ending

[@TheSkyGuy77]

Its more like one of those Pokémon creepypastas tbh

[@SpidersofGod]

I dont think anyone talked about this however when you go to the hospital and that dialogue starts you can actually walk during it and if you do Noelle freaks out and screams for you to stay away from her

[@Shilsey]

haha true, that's such a cool detail

[@JonathanMeyer-o4m]

well, can confirm that deltarune chapter 3-4 did not release within the next 8 months

[@Shilsey]

Haha yep, surely the next 8 months though :)

[@Lilaclightning12]

1:20 he speaks no lies

[@thelagnificentleader]

3:37 Link Jumpscare

[@slashcake6045]

Dude i was legit shaking while playing this route

[@person4579]

5:35 This made me laugh out loud

[@Dabi_MichaelAfton_and_gyutaro]

I will be disturbed by psychological horror for a bit, then I get paranoid, then I laugh at it

[@Shilsey]

haha this is so true