HOW GOOD IS MAX? by Peter Windsor

[@hanstubben]

There is a very important factor that´s missing! The relative speed differences between cars, the last years we had most of the qualifying sessions with the firs ten in one second. This used to be two to three seconds in the Mercedes dominant era, In the McLaren Senna era there was about a second between pole and third on the grid. In the Ascari era there was about 6 seconds between the first ten on the grid. And when the weather "equalizes" the car performance, Max pulls out a from 17th to first in the rain and finished 16 seconds ahead of anyone. If you factor this in then Max´s statistics are even more impressive, in my opinion he´s on top of all. I´m following F1 for about 50 years now.

[@elecovanrenss1352]

most impressive stat to me is that he beats ascari race win % record in a season, while driving almost 3 times as many races, completely unreal stat.

[@kj48tiger]

quali pace is close but race pace isnt... RedBull is still seconds faster than a Williams on race day. Plus there is no dirty air these days…

[@trance9158]

@@hanstubben no... You just proved how dominant the car is .. or was.

[@Switll71]

Very good point and I bet that stat will easy to calculate since all data is available.

[@paskowitz]

Quality pace is far less relevant now though. Not sure this is a great metric.

[@RobinBooze468]

After watching Brazil 2016 I spent two whole weeks telling my friends that dutch 18 year old was going to be one of the best in history. We will miss drivers like him when he retires

[@southerncomfort1339]

Apparently you didn't see SLH FUJI 2007!

[@bassax7045]

@@southerncomfort1339 they both can be one of the best , its not either or

[@quigglyz]

@@southerncomfort1339 cringe

[@Voldnarok]

My grandfather is 84 years old he watches F1 since young age and he works in motorsports for long time in Portugal. He always said to me "the best F1 drivers ever are Jim Clark, Senna and Verstappen" and he was talking about Max since 2014, Max was not even in F1 and he was telling me this boy is going to be one of the best ever in F1!

[@TotalBuffoon]

Made up story 😂

[@Enzoblueblood]

@@TotalBuffoon😂😂

[@richy69ify]

Niki Lauda called Max "best talent this century" . Coming from Niki who had that rare killer instinct, that's a great endorsement.

[@Stantube1000]

Well, your grandfather knew his stuff.

[@bartbarelds8454]

Lauda and Marko also acknowledged Max very soon

[@shaunonig1979]

When you watch Brazil 2024, when power is not an advantage and you see all the other great drivers from young talents to Alonso not be able to keep in on the track and Max is hitting fastest lap after fastest lap, it's clear he is operating a step above in terms of talent, journalist are scared to offend, they don't give their opinions on who is the best anymore, they always accept excuses blah blah. Reality is that Max is the best driver of this generation by a long shot

[@trance9158]

Tell us you're a biased crashstappen clanboy without telling us you're a crashstappen clanboy.

[@trance9158]

Full of shit... Compare his first 3 years in F1... Total disaster and a cluster fuck. Without help from masi and the fia and a car that was illegal he's nothing but backfield material...

[@lIlIlIllIlIlIlIIl]

@@trance9158 tell me you‘re a biased brit without telling me you‘re a biased brit 😁 Watching Max win is even better, when you remind yourself of how many british people are losing their love for the sport for this exact reason lmfao

[@trance9158]

Speaking of excuses.... Sounds like you're self projecting there Bubba J. Maybe you should stick to DTS.

[@Games_and_Music]

@@trance9158 What about Brazil 2024 (or even Brazil 2016) was not great? The RB20 was no longer the fastest car, rain has been Max's strong point as well, on top of his recovery, also set a record of most amount of fastest laps in a row, while others had trouble keeping it on track. (EDIT: actually, i couldn't verify that specific record claim, but there's a lot of other interesting records to his name though, you might want to check them out.) I mean, where's the faults? Sure, i'm a Dutch Max "fanboy", but this is like trying to mock Michael Jordan for having a flawless match, the guy is just at the top of his game and of the sport. Why not engage with the argument, instead of resorting to ad nauseam.

[@Lanse1984]

Eddie Jordan had both Senna and Michael and says Max is better than both of them. I trust Eddie's opinion

[@FEARYOYOYO]

I would believe him if he had had those two while being someone else than Eddie Jordan. Haha

[@B-kl8vj]

Eddie is a clown.

[@MisFakapek]

@@B-kl8vj but a competent clown

[@paskowitz]

Lol. That is something Eddie would say. Max is not as good Senna. Senna could make almost any car fast. Max has had a top tier car almost his entire career (same as many 'top" drivers). Then there is Senna's grit. Could max do what Senna did in Brazil, driving an F1 car with 1.5 arms practically willed on by God? No.

[@964cuplove]

@@paskowitz though Brazil this year was a bit like Donington with Senna in the rain…

[@diederikjournee5580]

Dear Peter, it is quite brave that you dare to post this as a Brittish F1-expert in these divisive times. That makes you stand out for a lot of F1-loving people that watch the sport for over 40 years (like me). Keep up the good work!

[@StormcastMarine]

Maybe try to get out of your bubble of hate and just enjoy the sport. Nobody cares about how the bad men at Sky hurt your feefies.

[@idasteigenga-pq8uj]

What a nice thing to say 🙄​@@StormcastMarine

[@canismajoris6733]

youre living with your head in the clouds

[@wplegend]

It's very interesting to look at it more neutrally through statistics. However I still think looking at the great equaliser eg rain shows who the best drivers are and in my mind Senna and Verstappen are absolutely a cut above everyone else... Imagine both of them on the same track in the wet...

[@deerfootnz]

Clarke was just as dominant in the wet. Schumacher also

[@Stantube1000]

@@deerfootnz Schumacher wasn't looking nearly as good let alone dominant duing his first years, when Senna was still there. He only looked dominant next to such ""champions" as Hill, Villeneuve and Hakkinnen, of which even such poor driver as Hill was arguably the best in wet. Not saying Michael wasn;t great in wet, but I personally think Senna and Max were better.

[@deerfootnz]

@Stantube1000 not sure I agree with that. I watched Senna race against Brundle in F3 when I was at uni. I watched Schumi in the Benneton and later on. Both were dominant. Both had an unfortunate tendency to invite collisions when competing for corners which I am sure Schumacher got from Senna. Verstappen possibly does this due to his father's influence. The rules are not clear enough, not enforced in any consistent manner and in the end I have just given up watching. It's clear Verstappen is extremely talented. I will never bother watching him because he bahaves so appallingly badly, and now the FIA is returning to the ethos of Jean Marie Balestre. They can all go and f*** themselves, I am going sailing.

[@whitecobranldaniel958]

Before Max step in the formula 1, wolff and horner want him because they saw his talent. Max is the only driver on the grid that stop the lewis / Mercedes dominance. Without a Mercedes. Max is faster then lewis.

[@bobkeul7682]

Max is faster by far.. and Lewis knows that as well, so does the bias British Sky...

[@Milkywayboy]

I 100% agree max is faster But it’s also not fair Because max hasn’t raced Lewis in the era of cars that suited Lewis! This era suits max’s driving style Lewis seems to really struggle with this era as well! Anywho I agree max is faster by far

[@virgilma6153]

@@Milkywayboynot really, Max did pretty well in the merc era, his engine wasnt just as powerful and reliable as the mercedes engine. He fought everyone during that era, fought with Nico/Seb/Kimi multiple time where he didnt belong. He was just a lil handicapped because the other had a slightly better car

[@Stantube1000]

@@MilkywayboyMax doesnt have a driving style, he adapts. He would be successful in any era. There cannot be any doubts about that.

[@POVRR3]

​@@Milkywayboy2021 is still Lewis's era, 2021 is not a ground effect car.

[@floodo1]

Max will drive other categories (prototypes) later in his career and then the real comparisons can begin. Anyone that watches the man drive in iRacing will see the level of his skill is beyond belief. He is a true racer through and through and is only gaining experience as time goes by

[@nicolalosa7580]

What a quality video, the host, the guest, the content, the music...everything is lit

[@PeterPost-w8m]

I’m watching F1 since the early eighties. As a race fan, not as a fanboy. For me Verstappen is the best pure racer I have ever seen.

[@endthisnonsense7202]

Same here, following since 1984.

[@rick1901]

08:55 small correction needed, if Max's tyre doesn't blow, Lewis finishes 3rd behind Perez who had better pace and had the on track position

[@ftc-nl1041]

These statistics are Simply Lovely!!!

[@russwright]

I'd love to see stats for races under heavy rain where the car doesn't matter much, it's the driver's ability that shines.

[@MM-qm9ld]

True but it's a very specific kind of driving ability. Fans tend to rate ace wet drivers really highly but driving tops in the wet doesnt necessarily mean you're tops overall. Most races are dry races, so you probably need to consider that first, though your point is well taken. Id say that it does tend to be the case that the best drivers drive wrll in the wet bc they drive well in ALL conditions. Its not this causal relationship where driving well in the wet makes you good. Youre good, ergo you drive well in all conditions. But I agree that isolating wet races is a solid metric for sure. Definitely a fun latitude to place drivers on.

[@Stantube1000]

@@MM-qm9ld all the very best were simultaneously the very best in the rain. fangio, clark, senna, schumacher....wet weather driver takes the most out of every driver and show deficit in technique, confidence and ultimately skill. so, imaginary drivers that would be the very best at their timing driving in wet but would be nothing special in dry never existed. the overall best were always simultaneously the best in wet. no driver that wasn't capable to outshine the rest at his time in the wet could be considered amongst the best of all times.

[@atanasio13ltv]

The numbers from the 2021 champions shows the truth: Max was the Champion by distance

[@trance9158]

@@atanasio13ltv no he was handed the WDC by masi.. a fact you'll never change and there will be an asterisk by that as well

[@nodekapunk]

@@trance9158buddy, you’re commenting on every pro max comment. Get a life.

[@trance9158]

@nodekapunk go play in the road if it hurts your delicate feelings there precious.

[@johnnyreid1518]

He was the driver of the season ​@trance9158 in an inferior car riddled with bad luck and poor reliability while lewis got the opposite and still held on. The baby jesus made sure he got that title and the next 9. Now try different glu mate she's not working for ye. Buhhhhhhhhhh

[@user-yt7jb7kk1i]

In a slower car and those of us who watched the season saw Lewis gain advantage without giving position back 3 races, pit maneuver Max at Silverstone for a 10 second penalty, rear end Max because he didn't want to cross the drs line with Max being penalized (for Lewis running into him), Bottas taking out the field behind Lewis. The season should have been decided in Max's favour prior to Abudabi.

[@mikeewhite]

🤧 Here's a tissue for the Max haters. Merry Xmas everyone 🎄 Let 25 be as good as 24.

[@trance9158]

@@mikeewhite you're going to be crying next season and trying to make excuses for your reckless petulant child.

[@Taylor___]

@@mikeewhite Ha. I started out disliking Max like many did with Seb but I love him now. But I think he may won his last championship now.

[@foshizzlemb]

There you have it, what I thought all along. Lewis is very good but not outstanding. You never got this wowing feeling like with max in Brazil '24 for instance. I mean, Rosberg has beaten him and this year Russel. Lewis is a great driver for sure, but never mention him as probably the goat again. Stats only don't count, the fans have to be unanimous and they're just not, maybe only in Britain ....

[@tarikviaer-mcclymont5762]

Max has driven againt anyone good since Ricciardo

[@niklasschneider4022]

It’s good to see there are also other people who see that

[@trance9158]

@@foshizzlemb you're ignorant.

[@kj48tiger]

Bro talk about yourself. Hamilton has more wowing moments than Verstappen has races. Max lost to ricciardo twice btw since we are gonna talk about teammates. (the only decent teammate he ever had)

[@TGfoever]

@@kj48tiger😂😂

[@redporschekilla]

Peter, I’m first and foremost a F1 fan, since May 1979… I’m a LH44, stood in front of Michael, you name it. You know when I knew Max is the next Senna? 21 in Barcelona, turn 2 in the opening lap, and he passes LH on the outside, a move which is almost impossible…. Max is a true champion, because he’s a fighter. LH is and always will be my champion, because he’s shown it time and again, much like Prost did, win, when everybody had counted him out? Keep rocking

[@Daris_13]

It was turn 1 that max dived into Lewis. It was his classic yield or we crash type move. Lewis stop letting that fly. Senna is still way above max atm.

[@W0o0dy]

​@@Daris_13lol even after the statistics you keep it up? Man your stubbornness deserves a statue of its own!

[@ctopczewski]

So true regarding 2021. All the British DTS watchers love crying about 2021 but the stats don’t lie. Max dominated Lewis

[@trance9158]

@@ctopczewski but would have lost if it wasn't for masi cheating

[@NoxioLukas]

@@trance9158 So I assume you are also complaining constantly about the illegal tire testing Merc did before they went on their dominant streak, no even talking about them starting engine development earlier and strongarming the FIA into hybrids (thank them for no V10s). Am I right? You complain about that too, right? Or do you just act like an 8 year old whose favourite driver lost because he wasnt good enough?

[@MrZewustyle]

​​@@trance9158 You'r level of Verstappen hate is seriously toxic, why don't you accept reality, may be a shrink could help ?

[@cruxio02]

@@trance9158 Human error was the ruling; spouting unfounded nonsense won't change things. You will never convince yourself of this.

[@kj48tiger]

He dominated so much that he needed to drive like a kamikazi and benefit from the greatest robbery in history to win it. lol

[@odieostrich7718]

Max vs Senna for finesse. Max vs Schumacher for mental toughness. Max vs Prost for turn-in take-outs and he still beats them all.

[@Dante-w8f]

We don't know how good Max is because he never has to worry about internal competition. The whole team is built around him and the 2nd RB driver is there merely to support him. Liam Lawson has been told to not challenge Max. Why can't Max test himself against a top tier teammate? All his teammates since Ricciardo have been rookies or mid-tier

[@johnhill7058]

Max is exceptional, Schumacher and Prost are very good, and excel at the politics of the sport, but the very best pure driver will always be the Gentleman from Balcarce, Juan Manuel Fangio.

[@Wuppie62]

​​@@Dante-w8f Max beat the 'internal competition' in the eyes of the RB management a long time before he became the #1 driver. They - Horner and Marko - knew what they got under contract: a future race- and championship-winner. And so did Toto, but RB got him first. Then came Barcelona 2016, where youngest F1 driver - Max - won his debut race in the RedBull; even Niki Lauda told the world Max was the talent of the century. Naturally the team try to give their future champion a fast as possible car, to maximize his chances... It's clever to have a #2 driver in the team, who actually is and behaves like a #2. Two equal rivaling drivers in one team is asking for internal problems: i.e. Senna/Prost, Rosberg/Hamilton, Leclerc/Sainz, Norris/Piastri..

[@1997maup]

@@Dante-w8f ”why can’t max test himself against a top tier teammate” Well because that’s not up to him is it? He’s always said that he doesn’t care who his teammate is, and at the end of the day it’s the Red Bull management that makes that call. Ive never understood why people take issue with drivers over factors they have little to no control over, like driver pairings. That being said, I hope to see the day where we do see a proper contender to max in the red bull. Should make for a good show, and hopefully it will finally put all criticism to rest if/when max beats them

[@W0o0dy]

​@@Dante-w8fMax has been pushing for RedBull to sign Norris. Why? Because he thinks highly of Norris as a person and racer. He is not scared of anyone but with some the chemistry would be much too volatile to win, it would only be mutual destruction. And he doesn't want that, rightly so tbf

[@bigbaderek1978]

and max is only 27...........hopefully much more to come

[@johnhill7058]

Fangio never started a grand prix until he was almost 37 years old.

[@kristoffer3000]

@@johnhill7058 In a completely different era.

[@SOrme_C135]

Defining actual GOAT settings based on "facts". Love it Peter! There is always the nuance and decisions/opportunities with an "on any given Sunday" situation. However, comparing Max and his fellow world champs (notably Lewis) through the data illustrates the importance of reality checks. Cheers!

[@Gmima01]

Real comparisons remain impossible. Not even putting them all in the same car on the same track at the same time and in their prime would give a totally correct outcome. But it still is an interresting discussion. Thanks!

[@timocoh020]

Data does not lie... But the biased fans will always find excuses. For me Max is the greatest and his prime still has to begin... In time he will be the undisputed goat. The numbers will tell...

[@Lanse1984]

If he races long enough and Redbull gives him a competetive car then yes it'll be a wash I think. Hes only 27

[@silversub]

Finally! Thank you so much for this video. I hope this will finally help put an end to the discussion about Max's abilities. Instead of criticizing, let's enjoy his talent. What we're witnessing right now is truly unique. The data speaks for itself. Once again, let's enjoy it!

[@Dante-w8f]

How do we know how good Max is when his teammates are so subpar/inexperienced & hired to support rather than challenge him?

[@silversub]

@@Dante-w8f Well, if you want to call Perez, Sainz, Ricciardo, and Albon bad drivers, you have a point. I don''t think they are. But he outperformed them all. And then again, look at the data

[@lIlIlIllIlIlIlIIl]

@@Dante-w8fyou can‘t see Max‘ greatness, because you‘re looking for arguments against it brother. If Max had driven against a Sainz and beaten him in comparable fashion to how he outperformed every other teammate, you‘d probably be in denial and claim that RB is simply a one man team, sabotaging Sainz. Just enjoy witnessing greatness live, I am literally thankful for getting to watch this dude drive live, and not having to just hear about it like with Clark or Senna, because I wasn‘t even born back then.

[@Dante-w8f]

@@silversub - Sainz & Ricciardo outqualified and beat Max. While Albon was a rookie when he was partnered with Max.

[@silversub]

But this video isn’t about that time. Pay attention to the years as well @Dante-w8f

[@JM_daDoc]

Clark was for me the best, being a 50 year old F1 fan, having watched all the races where there is some images available. You can't compare generations but in these times consistency is king and Max is the most consistent one ever, being able to eek out a lead being 0,2 secs faster every lap...

[@PMMeiners]

Wow 🤩 I love this. What a great inside into F1. Data doesn’t lie, Max is so far ahead of everyone nowadays. Let’s hope he will have a competitive car next season than it’s going to be fun.

[@johnhill7058]

There are lies, damn lies, and statistics. Competent analysts can make any stats sing whatever tune they conduct.

[@bigbaderek1978]

I love these kind of stats...the raw number just leave so much unsaid

[@CPez]

Exactly. That’s what motivates me to do these. Thanks!

[@spudman2000]

Let me save you 24 minutes. Max is the greatest of all time, hands down.

[@majdsarhan1990]

Forgot to add a 'got beaten by their teammate' category (correction)*misinformation

[@CPez]

It’s in there. Lewis has been beat 4 of 18 times.

[@majdsarhan1990]

@CPez didn't catch it I guess

[@shro8605]

@@CPez -Max has been beaten 2 out 10 times but won't ever be beaten again because his teammates are hired to support Max

[@CPez]

@@majdsarhan1990In just watching it for the first time so maybe it didn’t make the edit haha. I could send the picture though.

[@bobkeul7682]

@@shro8605 He hasnt been beaten on speed, perhaps on points yes, but that is a comparison for donkeys and fanboys.. Its actually Sainz who was his main competitor not Daniel... Sainz was the closest to Max 0.06 slower than max. Faster Qualify Sainz vs verstappen 0.06% Ricciardo vs verstappen 0.11% Gasly vs verstappen 0.45% Albon vs verstappen 0.62% Perez vs verstappen 0.46% Faster Race wins Sainz vs verstappen 54.5% Ricciardo vs verstappen 60.6% Gasly vs verstappen 90% Albon vs verstappen 88.9%

[@Frazec_Atsjenkov]

Wow, this man has some serious F1 knowledge!

[@joeshap2003]

You can manipulate statistics do prove anything you want, in sports or any other subject. It's why the eye test and stats have fueled 24/7 sports talk TV and radio. But your videos are undeniably the best on F1...no stats needed :)

[@vincentansemsdevries8165]

I checked Cory's accordion music and I was not disappointed, I never knew I loved accordion. Hanging around Helmut Marko's house with Max playing accordion while Jos and Christian Horner are polka dancing is an image a can not get out of my head. What a fascinating character.

[@MichaelCuthbertson-zl6in]

Wow! As a long term F.1 fan, this all makes sense. Thankyou for this different perspective, gentlemen!

[@Camilo2099]

Great content! Bring Cory more.

[@jgonzalesm6]

Interlagos 2016 and Interlagos 2024 in the wet. No one comes close to Max in an inferior car in the wet. He is a rain God.

[@deanlawrence871]

Agree 2024 class of his own. But in 2016 he was quicker than everyone except Lewis. (From memory)

[@jgonzalesm6]

@deanlawrence871 - 2016 was the 3rd year of the turbo-hybrid formula and Mercedes dominance. Rosberg won the WDC title in 2016 by 5pts over Hamilton whom had the only DNF from Mercedes in Malaysia. Ricciardo came in 3rd...then Vettel in 4th. Max came in 5th place in seasonal points for 2016.

[@Stantube1000]

Tough to compare him with Senna, because Senna was head and shoulders above the rest in the wet as well, arguably by even bigger extent, but average level of drivers was far lower at Sennas time than it is now on the modern F1 grid. the most talented and best prepared ever.

[@Stantube1000]

@@deanlawrence871 he was potentially quicker than Lewis but not quick enough to overtake on track, or at least he was matching his pace.

[@deanlawrence871]

@ yeah I think he was matching him. Who knows if both were 100% pushing all these years later. I feel like maybe Lewis did start to pull away at one stage

[@elecovanrenss1352]

very interesting stats. thanks for the info! but it is just unreal that max is doing now, that it is even comparable to fangio and clark, ascari, while it is now so much more difficult. there is so much more competition. it is just nuts. also can we just get max into clark his car and let him drive around zandvoort. i just like to know what laptime he would set

[@trance9158]

@@elecovanrenss1352 it's the car and all the aiding and abetting from the FIA

[@elecovanrenss1352]

@@trance9158 hahaha that made me laugh! thanks! great joke upvote to you!

[@ramarkble101]

Not possible Zandvoort in Clarks time was a different track.

[@BlueJazzBoyNZ]

The movie Moneyball looks at the difference between perception and statistics in Baseball

[@BeeTB1]

Incredible insightful video. Love it!!

[@mediascapes2011]

How good is Lawson and Tsunoda should be the conversation, don't you know by now why and how good Max is Peter!

[@endthisnonsense7202]

An totally moot discussion. Red Bull was never going to repeat the mistake of putting a non-Junior driver in the top team, they have heard the anger of the drivers in their jr. program for not getting the chances to promote. And also Red Bull was never knowingly going for a driver staying for 1 year at most knowing Honda will transfer him to Aston Martin in 2026 as it is a Honda driver not a Red Bull driver.

[@LouSasshall]

max is sehr good 🍺

[@DustySides]

I love how invested people are in these debates. Writing multiple paragraphs defending someone who doesn’t know they exist like their life depends on it… Truly hilarious.

[@Felgenfahrt]

Imagine talking down to people while having „he/him“ in your bio, don‘t you have bigger problems to worry about than people being passionate about a sport they follow?

[@DustySides]

Me thinks thou dost protest too much. I follow the sport, have watched nearly every quali and race every week available to watch in my locality for going on 15 years. I just don’t have a parasocial relationship with the drivers such that my own self worth is wrapped up in how others perceive a car driver.

[@Felgenfahrt]

@@DustySideswho said that anyone has their self worth tied to a driver? Do people just disagree or argue when something their self worth is tied to is involved?

[@DustySides]

You can tell by the level of personal attacks, hyperbole, and desperation of people’s posts that it is indeed personal. Like, going to someone’s profile and trying to level completely unrelated culture war attacks says someone is taking it very personally.

[@Felgenfahrt]

@@DustySides you come in here and your first comment ever on the channel is talking down to people - you didn‘t expect being talked down to yourself, did you?

[@realitycheck908]

Max is the goat 2 wdc without the fastest car

[@Dante-w8f]

You could argue 2008 & 2018 for Lewi....Ferrari arguably had the quickest car in both those years

[@bobkeul7682]

@@Dante-w8f 2008 was a good / nice year but the advantage differences of Ferrari vs McLaren wasn't overwhelming at ALL. Massa suffered an engine failure in Hungary while leading, costing him a sure win. Massa's spin in Malaysia and pit lane mistakes, the infamous "fuel hose incident" in Singapore, cost valuable points. Räikkönen's form dropped in the second half of the season, limiting Ferrari's ability to score consistently. McLaren generally made fewer strategic mistakes and had a more reliable car, allowing Hamilton to capitalize when Ferrari made dumb errors. In the last race Lewis Hamilton's team's strategy was crucial, the timing of the rain and Timo Glock's who had gambled on staying out on dry tyres that tipped the scales in Hamilton's favor with HUGE luck... McLaren's decisions, especially the tyre changes were critical in keeping him in contention. So..Lewis had huge luck due to others misfortune in 2008 not because his faster than all others in a less car, like Max, Senna, Schumi did. Partly true, although 2018 the Mercedes W09 was one of the fastest cars on the grid, but not always fastest across all tracks, that is true. But not as near what is believed if you look at stats. Ferrari's car development seemed to stagnate after the mid-season break, allowing Mercedes to regain their dominance again. Over the course of the season, the Mercedes W09 was the most consistent and had the upper hand on a majority of circuits, particularly after the summer break. RedBull did outpace them occasionally. But Merc was still the most dominant car that season

[@johnhill7058]

What a lovely video for the off-season. Cory, its the assumptions you make, to be fair, you acknowledge this, and you are clever enough to troll Windsor with Jim Clark. Verstappen is incredible, but Fangio is and remains the Maestro, never forget that JMF did not get to F1 until he was 36 years old, has the highest all-time win percentage, and, drove for four different manufacturers; wish to say Fangio jumped to the best car, yes, of course, and why, because Fangio was the undisputed best driver and every team wanted him. Eye test? 1957 German GP at Nurburgring- from many minutes down to victory lap record after lap record. Max may be that good, Jim Clark was close, Nigel and Ayrton especially on their day were amazing, but Juan Manual Fangio the humble gentleman from Balcarce is still the best anyone has ever seen.

[@CPez]

Thanks John, and yes, 1957 Germany I talk about (might make the 2nd video). Just astounding stuff by Fangio, And yes! He was old when F1 started and he Still has those stats!

[@MrSpencerTreas]

Loved this.

[@Michel-r6m]

He was hired to TR to let him adapt to F1. He was promoted to F1 and by a bit of luck (Rosberg Hamilton collision) was to drive for P1 Barcelona 2016. Now he had the people behind him to show what he with a quality team can achieve. A driver like Verstappen gets everybody in focus and make achievements like this possible. In the early days it was more (not only) luck to have a car that performed with a driver that could handle it. These days it is so close it in my opinion is even more impressive to have a streek of four titles than ever before.

[@trance9158]

@Michel-r6m lmao a driver that's a reckless petulant child? You seem to have forgotten all the toxicity that's come from RB, Max, Marko, and Horner... FFS

[@adrianventer1447]

​@trance9158 get out of here , every comment you're hating on verstappen like a petulant child, you're the one bringing all the toxicity you hypocrite 😮

[@RhomasTotevenaar]

@@trance9158 He is talking about race results, if you want to talk about personalities go somewhere else.

[@brouwah]

Yeah, Max is the best ever 🙌🏻

[@familyreurts4978]

Fascinating theoty, amazing statistics and probably the best way to determine the GOAT. Would love to see the stats if the drivers entire F1 career was considered cause anyone whose chosen GOAT isnt the winner here, will raise that as an objection. But I love this. Thanks Peter for putting this on.

[@CPez]

We go over that in the next video haha

[@SafakYokolma]

Woww, what a great video…this is the best way to compare the drivers from different eras!

[@floodo1]

Peter once told me he doesn’t have an outro, so let’s call it his “signature musical ending” haha Whatever we call it though, I enjoy it (-8

[@Calbac-Senbreak]

The very best of all times. I was saying it even before the first title, because of the overall difference from his teammates.

[@atanasio13ltv]

Max is right on top with Fangio, Clark and Senna, but he is stilll active

[@danieljoseph255]

Should somehow be required viewing for F1 fans

[@Nkkdxn45j]

I do not really see the point in comparisons between eras, nor for that matter treating the driver as separate from the car. The driver/car are a unit, it's how well the combination performs that matters. There is really no comparison between eras. Verstappen and Red Bull have been the best recently, ten years ago it was Hamilton and Mercedes. In the sixties it was Clark and Lotus. These comparisons are just talking points.

[@endthisnonsense7202]

It the combination Driver/Car/Team that counts though, not just driver/car and the Verstappen/Red Bull/Verstappen team has been the best for 4 years. The best car was the Mercedes in 2021, the Ferrari for half of 2022 and the McLaren in 2024. With that it's easy who to figure out who was the best driver in these four years.

[@ollydorman2213]

This is true. Let’s see max in another (good) car / team combo. And see how Lewis goes at Ferrari.

[@mark4motion68]

Would have love to Hear you conclude this video at the end Peter

[@W0o0dy]

One thing we will never know is of course how any of the all time greats would have faired in todays highly developed f1. Everyone now has great race simulation software, each car is pretty good, few teams are a mess... That might make for a easier life comoared to the troubles and challenges from the past but... The competition is no joke these days.. i think you need to more versatile and more perfect to be outstanding these days... I think a few weekends of brilliance used to be enough.. these days it's about performing in 23 weekends, about understanding what is happening, understanding the daya, adepting the car or the race craft... Maybe i am wrong but i think a championship now is actually more difficult than it was back then.

[@OldmanNix]

The comment section is going to be marvellous.

[@cruxio02]

😁

[@CPez]

Actually it’s just about ALL positive 🎉👍🏻. Glad people enjoy the countries hours I’ve put into this over the years.

[@koenvanduffel2084]

I am only 3 min into the thing and already love is. My research heart is coming to life.

[@antonhuman8446]

Thank you. As an individual. I'm not mad about him. At all. Although. For what he does. Is masterly perfection. A gut feeling automoten. On auto pilot. Presently. In his stride. Whipping the smoke out of most. Will be interesting to how SLH is going to perform in an un-sabotaged Ferrari!

[@truth4reel]

Have only listened to tidbits of this podcast. That out of the way I wanna ask if the stats took into account what teammates all the greats drove against. Some had strong teammates that took stats away from them while others didn't.

[@ukps9632]

Best there ever was, best there ever will be. It's the eye test.

[@andrewmelton2686]

I always saw hamilton as the goat but verstappens ability to beat the mighty perez albon and gasly in equal machinery changed my mind

[@aaronb4936]

@@andrewmelton2686and beat Hamilton while in pretty much equal quality cars.

[@kj48tiger]

@@aaronb4936 Newey himself said the Redbull was faster on average which is absolutely true if you look at the whole season

[@lIlIlIllIlIlIlIIl]

@@kj48tigerthe W12 was actually 0.053s per lap faster on average over the season. Newey wants to take some credit for the WDC win that year, and rightfully so. But Max did win in inferior machinery (albeit not inferior by much).

[@kj48tiger]

@@andrewmelton2686 did you just say 'the mighty' ?

[@mitchdaytonam3]

You missed the 2012 MP4/27 as a car that was capable of winning races and a title.

[@Stantube1000]

2010 Mclaren was capable of winning the championship as well. Lewis was leading the championship but then made two mistakes crashing out in Singapore and Monza. Button was winning races as well.

[@mitchdaytonam3]

@ indeed the MP4/25 and 27 were both capable of winning the title.

[@superkoosable]

interesting and in general the precentages do confirm the picture that had in my mind. I only would say that we now live in an age that a dominating car for a whole season has become an exception. It is depebnding to strong of the type of grand prrix. Also we live in the age of tire-management. Qualifications doesn't need tire-management but races do. In my opinion that is why Charles won so many poles but no races in 2022. Also, and that is my biggest complain is that how much is a dominating car the result of having the dominating car or the result of an incredible driver who fastly outperforms his car, including including risk taking and racing style like oversteer and short corner drtviing. IMO you should really analyse each GP on its onw merit to say if the car was dominate or not. Especially in this time and age.

[@samhadden382]

What a fascinating breakdown love it

[@Reznor_Meeks]

What a fascinating fella, I really enjoyed 👍🏻

[@ottoranking]

Statistics are like a bikini, what they reveal is significant are they conceal is vital.

[@johnhill7058]

Oh, I like that, Otto

[@blakebarone1809]

I was an athlete. My mother was incredible in instilling goal setting and visions. I guarantee you that when he told Max “your ceiling is Senna.” Max would be telling this guy off and thinking “no, my ceiling is Max Verstappen.” Some people think differently.

[@CPez]

No actually. He thought about it and shook his head up and down and said “Man thank you so much. I’m going to try that for sure.”

[@johnhill7058]

@@CPez Inciteful; may we press you for how you came to be with Max at Helmut Marko's home?

[@blakebarone1809]

@@CPez Thank you for the reply. Cheers.

[@Slowpoke7329]

The difficulty in domparong eras is also related to the gaps between the cars. We could have second first to last right now. 40 years ago there would be 2 seconds between first and 2nd.

[@miquel440]

I.m watching Senna on Netflix. He was my favorite driver back then.. My first race was with my Dad at the Nurburgring in 1976 as a five year old when Lauda crashed. Not old enough to understand what happened. My Dad was in tears,he was a big Lauda fan. In 1994 we were at Imola together when Senna crashed.I was devistated. Back then Senna was the villain,he was victim of the relentlous actions from Balestre,at that time the Sulayem from the FIA. I see so much similarities with Max now. Max has the same qualities Senna had. Straight forward,no nonsense. Max is the villain now and i love it. He is in another league,his own league,like Senna was. And they share the same brilliance,devotion and honesty. Pure racers and for me Max is the GOAT. As long as Max is driving in F1 nobody will beat him.Never.

[@shro8605]

If Max is so great and unbeatable, why Horner having to warn Lawson not to challenge him? Why does Max need so much help to beat his teammates?

[@miquel440]

​@@shro8605 Really? Your comment is non relevant. Another fake F1 not knowing anything about F1. You are the laughing stock on this channel.

[@shro8605]

@@miquel440 -Go read Horner's comments. He has actually said that Lawson is there to support Max.

[@VjRj84]

we wont know until he drives against a good driver on the same car. He has had the easiest roster of all world champions on the grid, by a thousand miles.

[@johnhill7058]

you are speaking of Lewis Hamilton, yes?

[@VjRj84]

@@johnhill7058 hahahaha, Ham having one of the best rookie seasons of all time against the best driver on that grid must hurt you so much even after 20 years. Meanwhile max has had a bunch of rookies to assist him so he doesnt have a breakdown like in hungary. Dont believe me? Read what horner said about what role Lawson is supposed to take and good luck arguing anything after that. Kisses.

[@heideroosje12]

Are you kidding me? He drove against 3 team on his OWN the last years! Idiots always finding something to pin on Max. It's ridicilous

[@VjRj84]

@@heideroosje12 because his car was that good, yes. Again, if checo were merely closer to p7 they´d won the constructors months ago. You cant have latifi in the car and cry wolf saying its slow. If a good driver was alongside him your little narrative about red bull not being fast crumbles reeeally quickly. And we wouldve watched actual racing instead of his usual cruising around with no teammate, which in F1 is the biggest threat to a driver. Remember how you criticized Ham because of bottas? While forgetting alonso, rosberg, button, let alone the other world champions he had to fight. Same for alonso or vettel who btw was judge to hell and back for having the best car and "no teammate" in webber, who comparatively to perez was much better. Max´s roster of teammate is absolutely ridiculous and you know it, you just want him to win easily on the best car, we get it.

[@musamnguni510]

11:15 Yes but we’re not catering for the fact Max has never had a WDC teammate or a competitive teammate in that Period of time. Lewis has multiple times over. Even now he had an opportunity to have Carlos in the Second seat which would’ve guaranteed a constructors title win

[@elChirrinChirriondelDiablo]

I guess you can qualify 2 as multiple but that’s not wrong, max never had a WDC as a teammate.

[@mariobgrant]

Agreed. In my opinion, it's the final hurdle to GOAT. That's why redbulls choice for drivers has been disappointing. I think Max is faster than Carlos, yet RB still didn't want him in the car, just shows you how coddled Max is. Easy to look like a genius in the fastest car and a weak teamate.

[@ariebroek2404]

Very nice topic😊🙏

[@talbotbid011]

In-coming meltdown from Team LH...

[@williampalfreyman3037]

You haven’t mentioned team mates and team strategies concerning team mates.

[@JS-ll8nk]

He’s the best ever. Put every top 10 driver in the same car over a season and Max comes out on top.

[@simongilliat2205]

Fantastic piece! Cory could power an F1 engine on his own! Never seen so much energy. Thank you Peter

[@ACMEpowersports]

No surprise here for anyone who really knows the sport. I've never NOT included Clark in any top 5 list.

[@joriux]

Watching f1 since 1998. Schumacher one of the best, but was in the team which outspent the rest of the grid. Testing was unlimited and he basically built that car for his own. Hamilton one the best, but got very lucky in choosing teams throughout his career. Verstappen as of now is on the same level as other two for sure. Never changed teams, nor it was outspending Mercedes.

[@davidelghammer6449]

Seat cushion from the Indy 500 in the background! Love it! I had one exactly like it. Indy 500 rules. 🏆 Great show Peter! Fascinating F1 talk.

[@Chris-xl6pd]

Someone that talks more than peter!

[@CPez]

When it’s a topic I love, Yes haha

[@craigmacmillan2528]

How does Moss stack up?

[@DrEMichaelJones]

That was awesome

[@morgandude2]

I bet Peter was shaking his head after that.

[@NicotineRosberg]

Very good. Short answer

[@tonymcflattie2450]

Da best!

[@gaganreen]

I think Cory did an excellent job here . But he needs to somehow reconsider Michael Schumacher who I believe is probably better than Max . If things went his way then Michael would have won the WDC in 97, 98 , 99 and 2006 . Remember we only had 17 races back then and no DRS . And Michael only had dominant cars in 2004 , 2002 , possibly 1995 . The FIA changed the rules in 2003 specifically to slow down Michael . This has never happened before or will happen again in F1 . Max was also incredible by winning 19 out 23 races last year when he had the dominant car . So he probably does better than Michael in that category . But overall I think he is a close second to Michael .

[@craigm1954]

Consider throwing out the race domination, and similar, intangibles. This is a component conservation and budet cap era. The very best current races are all tyre management, and the power unit is raced ove six or seven GPs.

[@dancri4694]

Think there's an issue with what you call a 'perfect lap'....winning by two (2) minutes or a lap over the entire field is almost impossible in the past 2 decades....

[@CPez]

Yes, but I needed Another data point for people’s like Clark and Ascari to prove hour good they were which young fans don’t know.

[@NoxioLukas]

TLDR; Greats are in that order Clark > Verstappen > Ascari > Fangio > Schumacher > Vettel > Senna > Hamilton. When it comes to winning with having dominant car or just a decent car Max is the best. Vettel and Lewis are at the opposite end.

[@KingHoborg]

He's pretty good.

[@matthewkane7524]

Gilles Villeneuve stats would be very telling

[@964cuplove]

Well, Lewis does have 7 championships but Schumi was there first, so at least regarding that one, Schumi is in the lead till Lewis has eight…

[@bobkeul7682]

for sky maybe... for experts they all know Lewis has had huge amount of luck in switching teams, with that he never really dominated his teammate entirely except Koviannen...

[@adrianmeade6049]

totally agree regarding Max

[@formula2tom225]

strength of field needs to be considered

[@goodguy2627]

The Max's domination in the recent years was only possible due to two facts: 1. RedBull had most of the time superior car on the track (except from the last season's car). 2. Mercedes failed to provide Hamilton with a winning car for 3 years in a row. Mercedes's disaster became the RedBull's fortune. If it wasn't for that, Hamilton would have been F1 champion at least two times more solidifying his position as the all times best F1 driver. Lewis Hamilton is still the driver with most wins in the entire F1 history and the only one equalizing the M.S. achievement in terms of numbers of championships. The next season will be the beginning of a new era in F1 where Lewis will achieve unmatchable success that will stand untouchable for decades to come.

[@andriesrinsma8470]

Haha all the facts show this Max is the best everrrrrr. already and he has still 10 years to go at least.

[@StormcastMarine]

best at what? crashing and DNF? yeah, he's far ahead of Lewis there, because he doesn't know how to race within the rules.

[@Dante-w8f]

Also the 2022 RB car was totally dominant on race pace. It was very much like the 2019 Merc. Another team was often quicker on Saturday, but on Sunday, both the RB (2022) & Merc (2019) were in a league of their own.

[@PeterPost-w8m]

No, it wasn’t. The Ferrari was the dominant car in the first half year of 2022, but Ferrari and Charles f**ked up many races. Did you even watch?

[@shro8605]

@@PeterPost-w8m -Ferrari were quick for about the first 6 or so races....after that, RB became a ro cketship

[@williampalfreyman3037]

Fernando, Valteri and Nico compared to Chekko?

[@Nebula_Ultra]

GOAT

[@511dydy]

Verstappem might just be the best in raw talent and consistency. He is just lacking in the ethics department. Im saying this as a hamiltons fan.