How Much It Costs To Maintain An Airplane | Detailed Annual Costs | Mooney M20C Vlog #9

[@gordonfeliciano4315]

Nice job. The secret to your first annual not costing a lot depends on how well the previous owner took care of your aircraft. For the 77 Grumman Tiger that I own, the first annual ran us just over $1,600. I did not assist during that first annual, which I found out later, was a mistake. Had I done so, (I found out later), I would have saved some serious money. The typical "stuff" had to be replaced... vacuum filters, airbox filters, fuel filters, oil change and filter... then came the AD compliance stuff for the FAA, followed by avionics tests, ELT tests, airframe, landing gear, brake system and engine inspections. Finally, the prop was serviced and dressed. Then next few annuals saw an increase in price. Mainly because I had some things added and other things needed to be repaired, such as my Garmin 430 WAAS, which had a worn out com button that made it next to impossible to switch frequencies. That alone ran me $890 in 2017. My highest cost, so far, has been $2,100 for an annual. This year I have great news... my annual ran me just over $860. I found a new shop whose owner allowed me to perform "owner assisted maintenance". I spent that time doing the things that owners are allowed to do under his supervision, which included removing inspection panels, removing and servicing the spark plugs, cleaning the engine compartment, etc. We did not need an oil change this time around since we only had flown less than 10 hours on the previous oil change, so that saved me about $250 right there. We also no longer needed a vacuum filter as I had replaced my vacuum instruments with G5's the previous month, along with a panel replacement, and had the vacuum pump and plumbing removed, so that saved me even more money. I even took the time to paint my piston covers on my engine, touch up some worn paint around the entire airframe and cleaned the oil streaks from the under belly. I cleaned the interior upholstery and added some placards to the new panel. Unlike your Mooney, I have fixed gear, so the servicing on my Tiger is minimal as compared to yours. It's important to find a shop that is honest and willing to work with you on your aircraft, not just during annual time, but throughout the ownership of your aircraft. I think you may have found that. Fly safe and fly often!

[@MyTimeToFly]

I happy you have found that, as I believe I have as well. Time will tell. Thank you for sharing, I and many others will take learnings and direction from your experiences. Safe flying!

[@Stepclimb]

First of all, this is a great video for folks wondering about the real costs of aircraft ownership. Thanks for sharing the details of this Annual inspection. Regarding the ELT AD (line 3 on your work order), please check your logbook entry. There might be a typo. The AD for AK-450 and 451 ELTs is AD 2017-16-01. The W/O you show @ 5:45 has it written as AD17-18-01. Attention to detail is a very important quality to look for in an IA and A&P. Please make sure the entry for this AD compliance is correct. 14 CFR 91.417 (2) (v) places the burden of accurate record keeping of AD compliance on the OWNER, not the IA. Another reason this attention to detail is important: As crazy at it may sound, if you are involved in a mishap and there is a error in a logbook entry where AD compliance is in doubt (rendering the aircraft unairworthy), the FAA may take certificate action against you! In addition, your insurance policy would not cover you since the terms of the policy require the aircraft to be in an airworthy condition. Please remember, insurance agencies exist to make profits. They will scour your logbooks looking for any excuse to deny a claim. At the conclusion of the annual, it is important to go line by line in the logbook entries with the IA and DOUBLE CHECK his paperwork entries. Ask them how they do AD searches for your airframe, engine, propeller and appliances. Look up each of these ADs for yourself to ensure the entries make sense. An honest mistake on the IA’s part could lead to big trouble for you later down the road. Good luck with your aircraft ownership!

[@MyTimeToFly]

Wow...thanks so much for the detail, and the kind words. I most definitely didn’t go in this much depth, but will go back and do this work! Thanks again!

[@ShuRugal]

Once you get a good relationship with your A&P/IA, the annuals will also get cheaper. Strongly advise that you also participate in the annual inspection: you can save your IA some labor by helping to remove inspection panels (and all 400 screws that out Mooneys have) while learning a few things about the plane yourself. Also, if it wasn't already checked, go through your logbooks and see if M20-217 has been complied with. The Hydraulically actuated flaps on the early models need a reinforcement applied to the rear spar web where the flap torque tube support adjacent to the pushrod from the actuator passes through the web. The spar web under this mount point will tend to develop a fatigue crack along the top edge of the mount. If it needs to be done, and you don't have an experienced Mooney shop nearby to do it, have a shop you trust get in touch with Maxwell Aviation for the parts kit and instructions on how to install it. If you already know all this, then kudos for doing the research!

[@MyTimeToFly]

That’s a new SB to me, I will have to look into it more! Thanks so much!

[@ShuRugal]

@@MyTimeToFly that one ate all of my summer "me budget" last year - should have been a 20 hour repair, the shop that did it for me took 40 hours.... If you have an aviation sheet metal specialist near you who will let you swing a wrench to help with the labor, i recommend doing so - it will save you money and get you better acquainted with your bird. there's a full list of Mooney SBs here - www.aviation.govt.nz/assets/aircraft/airworthiness-directives/aeroplanes/my.pdf A lot of those are not applicable to the C, but it's worth a read through. A lot of the inspections you can also perform yourself, as they do not require removing anything other than an access plate to view. Obviously, you cannot sign them off yourself, but you can get yourself familiar with the guts of your bird, and use them as a starting point for a discussion with your A&P/IA about what your plane needs or does not need to remain airworthy.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thanks for the resources. You’re so right that performing some inspections on your own is a GREAT thing!

[@ShuRugal]

@@MyTimeToFly yep, there's a lot you can be proactive about as an owner to get more familiar with your aircraft, which will make you safer and save you money. If you haven't already found them, EAA and Savvy Aviation have a series of hour-long webinars on KZbin covering a wide range of subjects, including things that an owner can do, and what your legal responsibilities as an aircraft owner are WRT to maintaining the airworthiness of your bird.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thanks again! Great stuff!

[@jofido]

Appreciate learning about your annual. Thank you for your in-depth review.

[@MyTimeToFly]

My pleasure man. It’s my goal for people to see the real world of airplane ownership. The good, bad, and expensive! HA!

[@williamtitus8467]

Well, just had to put my two cents in here. Latest Mooney service instruction on jacking the plane states that wing jacks and a hoist on the engine is the approved way to get the plane off the ground. Holding the tail down or using a prop hoist are potential problems. I think if your A&P was a "Mooney Guy" he'd not have jacked the plane up using a tail hold down device. Many engines have a hoist eyelet to fasten an overhead gantry to or an engine hoist. My A&P uses straps on the engine. As the theory goes, holding the tail down can cause structural issues with the aircraft and putting a jack under the prop introduces unusual forces on the main engine bearings. I'd look up Service Instruction M20-114, on jacking the plane and share it with your A&P for future jacking. Paperwork that came with my plane had all the AD's and applicable Service Instructions and Bulletins--this was one of them. ('63 M20C owner as well) That being said, thanks for sharing... My last annual was $1875 for the inspection, and I had about $4,500 in repairs and parts. Nose gear repairs and cracked spinner that had to go out for repair.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thanks so much for the detail, I will most definitely ask that my Mooney be handled in this manner in the future! It appears I managed to dodge damage in this case!

[@williamtitus8467]

@@MyTimeToFly -- I think they've jacked up many Mooney's using a tail tie-down over the years. Don't know why they've issued the new service instruction on using a hoist on the engine, but there must have been some problems discovered over the years. I'm sure my plane has been handled that way too, over the years, and she still solid and a good bird. It's nice to learn from the misfortunes of others, however, and since a service instructions says this is the way to do it, I can only assume some unfortunate soul(s) found out the hard way. I'll always make sure any A&P that jacks my plane does it according to the latest Service Instruction. Another thing I learned the hard way about Mooney M20's is that the nose gear is its glass jaw. Previous owner used a gas tug on the plane regularly for 15 years. My first annual required $2000 worth of parts and labor to take all the slop and play out of the system. Retract connecting link on these things are made out of aluminum and too much stress on that nose gear causes the holes to elongate. Also plays havoc with the pivot point. My son and I made a power tug for the aircraft and it looks good, but now it sits unused, and its never touched the plane! Never putting a power tug on the plane again. Push the plane with the prop and steer with a manual tow bar. It's a pain, but our aircraft just weren't engineered for power tugs--or so it seems.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thanks William! I appreciate the follow up here. I agree it is best to learn from the bad fortunes of others, and follow best practices! Thanks again for your great insight!

[@howtimflies204]

Ya, I was going to say something about not closing those cowl flaps but the Johnson bar comment was the key focus. I heard another new C owner say that if you leave the flaps down they will go back up on their own with some speed...UGH! Could be why his brake calipers were leaking...same system. That price was really fair for the work you had done. Good job. Mine should be done in the next couple days too. Just putting it back together.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thanks Tim, I do appreciate the thoughtful comments! I’m always learning, that’s for sure.

[@howtimflies204]

My Time To Fly you got it man. I was in the same spot a few years ago. My instrument examiner became a good friend and he does some flights with me and has a 65 E like mine.

[@Devyn6Seven]

Great video. Very informative. I bought a 67C this year. Spent a good amount of money on the pre-buy and on subsequent repairs which the PBI uncovered. My first annual I'm expecting to be very reasonable.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Very awesome. Have you hit that first annual yet? We've found ours to cost between $2,500 - $4,000.

[@Devyn6Seven]

@@MyTimeToFly Mine’s in annual right now. No idea what the bill is yet.

[@MyTimeToFly]

I just got the quote for mine, $4k if we did it all. Some painting can be deferred, that will save a bunch.

[@Devyn6Seven]

@@MyTimeToFly Mine has been stripped, interior just done, fuel tanks just resealed. New paint is imminent.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Sounds like you’re going to have a beautiful bird!

[@MrSixstring2k]

Wow, plane seems to have being well taking care of. Enjoy it.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thank you, we do feel very fortunate to have found this bird. Thanks for watching!

[@thesearcherman6652]

I think that your mechanic may just be a “keeper”. Hard to find honesty around here in any service related trade. Thanks for the movie.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thanks man, I’m very impressed with him. You are unfortunately correct regarding dishonesty in all industries!

[@brandonmurray9448]

That's great news! The first annual with our 182 was $5K...Atlanta area so I'm sure the prices are much higher here. Our average annuals were closer to $3k. If I get an M20C it might be worth making the cross country run to T&J! This video makes me want one even more!

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thanks Brandon. The C certainly is a pleasure to fly, but I do envy the useful load of the 182! Thanks for stopping by!

[@brandonmurray9448]

@@MyTimeToFly The 182 was great when I had to fly 4 adult men out of South Florida in the summer months. Still got off the ground and had good climb performance. But 130 kts was top speed and that came at 13.5 GPH. It was a great plane but I was ready to go faster by the time we sold it.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Very understandable, we looked at a 182 when shopping around and ended up not being able to justify the cost of entry, or fuel burn. It’s all a game of trade offs I guess.

[@brandonmurray9448]

@@MyTimeToFly Very true! Our mission currently is 150kt 4 cyl for 2 adults within 300nm from our home base.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Sounds like a Mooney is in your future!

[@steveb7310]

$2466 is pretty darn reasonable for an annual. I’m glad glad things went well. Owner assisted inspections are the way to go. Be the Owner in Command.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thanks Steve. You’re correct, owner in command is a great mindset to have!

[@svp2587]

congrats on your purchase. never look back just fly the wings off it. welcome to the Sky

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thank you, it certainly is a feeling of freedom owning a plane!

[@StefBelgium]

Interesting. I d guessed a way higher cost. What the cost for an overhaul on this plane?

[@MyTimeToFly]

Overhaul costs are extremely high currently. If I just went the traditional route, it would be $35K or more.

[@davidhofman4341]

Why did you take all of the plates off of the wing underside. Only a few have any thing to be inspected. They were only put there to assemble the wing.

[@MyTimeToFly]

It was our first annual, so I was really interested to inspect everywhere. It was certainly overkill!

[@N182NS]

I think the cost was very good as an IA I have seen some get out of control especially when things that should have been taken care of do not get done I recently had a J model that the elevator bell crank was coming apart You could move the elevator up and down and see the side ways motion of it the part was over a thousand and labor over a thousand so it can get out of control

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thanks Nick, that is reassuring!

[@gmonnig]

Better than my $5600 annual, although I did replace all the rubber on my -540 to stop an annoying oil leak....airplanes are awesome and suck at the same time.

[@MyTimeToFly]

This is so true. There are worse things to spend money on!

[@3SM20Pilot]

I actually just dropped my '67 M20F off for annual yesterday in Troy Mi. The guy came recommended by a guy at my home airport that has a J model who is very meticulous about his plane. I was quoted just under a grand for inspection so I'm interested to see how much it's going to end up being. There are a couple things I'm having fixed at the same time such as my step that isn't retracting. It's my first annual with it after buying it in September of last year sight unseen. Hope to meet you at a Mooney-Meet some time!

[@MyTimeToFly]

I wish you good luck in your annual! I’d love to hear how it ends up! Perhaps we should start organizing a Michigan Mooney meet up, unless one already exists? I will certainly be hitting dawn patrols as well!

[@3SM20Pilot]

@@MyTimeToFly Well, I did not have a good time. I dropped it off on the 16th of May, though I didn't expect him to start work on it until the 18th. I just picked it up this morning on June 26th. So he had it for almost 6 weeks! I wish I could say he was working on it the whole time, but he really only touched it the first and last week (Charged me for 18.5 hours) after I got on to him for taking so long. I even took a day off work to go put the panels back together under the wings. Next week I'm taking it to a Mooney service center to have it looked over as I don't feel comfortable with the quality of work that was done. For instance, After the first week I went to go check on the progress. He had it on jacks so I jumped in to swing the gear. They went up fine but they wouldn't come down. The front wheel was getting caught on the left gear door. I didn't have any problems before so I'm not sure why it started doing that. I also inspected the plugs myself and found a cracked ceramic. Somehow he missed both of these things. The engine also sat without plugs or oil in it for over a month. He said I would need brake lines soon, I was going to have him replace both of them but after it being down for 5 weeks already I decided to have the MSC do that. There were also a few other things that I wanted done but will have to have MSC take care of. Lesson learned. Onward and upward!

[@MyTimeToFly]

I’m so sorry to hear this! It’s funny how expectations as an owner never quite line up with professionals in the business! Better luck with the next service provider!

[@AV8OR51]

$2500 is not bad. We have been paying around at least $2500 for the past 4 plus years on our Grumman Tiger!

[@MyTimeToFly]

That’s great to hear! I’m certainly pleased, especially knowing some of the cost was elective!

[@tjflynn1014]

I am curious, did you do a pre-buy inspection from a someone that was really familiar with your type of Mooney?

[@MyTimeToFly]

TJ, we did do a pre-buy with a mechanic familiar with the Mooney, how he did not claim to be an expert. We were happy with his inspection.

[@davisandotube]

Nice, I got a pa28-181 last November and due for anual on September, I am a little in the wonders of how much it will end up costing. I really hope is somewhere in that neighborhood. Thanks for the video, by the way are you still planing for aviation career?

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thanks David, I wish you the best with your annual! If you’re in Michigan I’d recommend T&J in Hastings! Regarding flying for a career, I will someday fly for money...I don’t quite know what that looks like just yet. Thanks for following along!

[@davisandotube]

My Time To Fly I’m based in Florida, but thanks. Just as a cheer up, I learned to fly at 30 yrs old, I am now 38. I always wanted to be an airline pilot but things in live kind of stepped in front. As I went down the licenses, PPL, IR, CPL, Wife and two kids, and specially after I bought the plane, I too find myself in the situation where I still want aviation as a career but not sure how... guess it will come with time.... congrats on the plane, the channel and your aviation journey!

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thanks so much David, our journeys are definitely similar. I wish you the best in your continued journey!

[@brandonachi]

Glad it was such a reasonable price. Any luck on the autopilot?

[@MyTimeToFly]

Unfortunately we haven’t made any progress in the AP, I will likely have to run it up to a local avionics shop to make headway there.

[@anthonycastellani7470]

Are you from michigan?

[@MyTimeToFly]

I sure am, and yourself?

[@anthonycastellani7470]

@@MyTimeToFly yes sir I live about a quarter mile from kyip

[@MyTimeToFly]

Nice, I’ve been to Willow Run once I think. I’m sure I’ll be back some day!

[@sljs1010]

Great airplane!

[@MyTimeToFly]

Thanks man!

[@sactu1]

That's a very reasonable price for a Mooney annual.

[@MyTimeToFly]

We were pleased overall, we even proud for a little paint work that wasn’t completely necessary.

[@N1377J]

Not bad at all $2400.00 to $2500.00 I just got my plane back 3 weeks ago and paid $ 3700.00 and I'm flying a Piper Cherokee 140 last year I paid $3400.00 and almost had a hart attack.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Yikes! Did you have anything major pop up to push the price tag so high?

[@N1377J]

I had to replace the rear tail cone and do some work on the brakes new fuel lines in both tanks which required removing the tanks and so other minor stuff.

[@MyTimeToFly]

It sure adds up quick, but it’s hard to put a price on safety! Enjoy that Cherokee!

[@Ramblequist]

Airport I use to base at, the freshest annual on the field was > 10 years old, lol

[@MyTimeToFly]

That’s crazy man!

[@carlpease4230]

Great price, could have been a lot more!

[@MyTimeToFly]

No doubt about it, I don’t even have to ask my parents for a loan 😜!

[@williamfahey4092]

That’s a bargain. I have a 45 year old 172 and the annual this year is over $6k and she’s been down for 30 days.

[@MyTimeToFly]

Ouch, you must have had something major pop up?

[@williamfahey4092]

My Time To Fly the biggie was a cracked exhaust collector. Most everything else was minor but this happened to be the year that all the little things added up. Hopefully next year’s annual will be light.

[@MyTimeToFly]

They sure do add up quick! Thanks for the follow up, I’m hoping for a smooth annual for you as well!

[@tjonessc]

+ parking/hanger + 100LL + Insurance + eventual overhaul +++ there is a lot of costs to owning a plane better have the passion. It's not like my Harley that I can keep in my garage and ignore till I am in the spirit...

[@MyTimeToFly]

This is very true! Passion is truly what keeps these planes flying!