How should you handle COLLUSION at the Poker Table?

[@mecheckraise]

Bart, the problem is that MANY time dealers and floor are friendly to regulars and they often rule with them at the table. Some places are worse than others but these sloppy games I often just get up and avoid but It is hard when you would like to play but just want the game clean. I do not think it is very uncommon.

[@patrickhenry4675]

I quit playing non tournament poker at my local casino for similar reasons. It was obvious the regulars were betting the casuals out of the pot and then slow playing each other afterwards.

[@jasonhounsell3297]

I would also add to this comment although dated. In most small stakes tournaments the players are terrible, they think they are good though. In cash the regulars are technically better on average I find. So as a cash player, it’s not unusual to see the tournament fish being heavily targeted and isolated, and then in pots between regs it’s a lot more balanced and protecting ranges. So for example - HJ opens A10off and BTN calls. Flop A95 - against a fish I’m betting here almost always even OOP - say a 7 hits turn, I’m betting again for value, the fish is probably calling the button too wide, continues too often, and won’t raise me nearly enough. Against a pro, I check this flop a ton, the button flat range is condensed whereas my opening range has a lot of air and I expect the button to realise and exploit that as a professional. So what appears to be a slow play, is me protecting my ranges vs better players who I think could exploit me. This isn’t collusion but a lot of fish could mistake it as such.

[@patrickhenry4675]

@@jasonhounsell3297 I am not a poker pro like you but I understand a decent bit of the modern GTO thinking; have an EE degree and a lot of post grad Statistical coursework so my math abilities are solid. I see what solvers have done for the game in recent years and how the pros memorize a lot more hand charts to assist them in not being exploitable. I think I have a good change of differentiating if players are playing GTO to quantify opponents range as opposed to betting tourists/casuals people out of the pots then soft playing after only the crew is left. I had other players tell me they have seen the guys chop up the take afterwards. It only takes 5-6 such pots in low to medium stakes to destroy any EV someone not in the "crew" has.

[@runhorse]

Never play in a game with all regulars only. They are looking to chop up the new players money.

[@burkhartlaw1]

Yeah, you're right. But it's also an opportunity because they all want their shot at your money. I have found that playing very tight for the first several sessions and only showing up with the goods helps immensely. I definitely saw the that the regulars thought there was blood in the water when I sat down the first few times. A few weeks, and a few wins, later, they weren't so eager to call my raises.

[@exeggcutebenedict]

​@@burkhartlaw1 so you are a nit, no collusion is the answer, not playing nitty

[@stevezag4145]

I witnessed some much more serious collusion last time I was in Vegas at a $1/$3 table. (Sorry, I don't remember which room.) There were two guys sitting next to each other, one who was very quiet and fairly nitty and a boisterous, aggressive, fairly wild player on the nit's left. The wild player was very splashy preflop, always straddling when he could and frequently opening large, like $20 if he was first in and higher if not. It was obviously making the tourists at the table (including me) uncomfortable, because it meant they were playing above their comfort zone, but people were getting used to it, and started playing their normal range in spite of the overbets. After a while of this, on one hand the nit limps (unusual) and the LAG raises to $25, getting a couple of callers. Then the nit makes a near minimum 3-bet to $50 and LAG reraises to $190, getting one caller who is all in. The nit folds. At the time, I was just thinking he was an idiot for opening up the betting if he didn't want to play a big pot. LAG had KK, the all-in caller had TT. Fortunately, the tourist spiked a T on the turn and won. About a dozen hands later, the exact same scenario happened: nit limped, LAG raised, nit min 3-bet, LAG 4 -bet big, nit folded. This time, LAG had AA and got another tourist all in on the flop. In an amusing bit of karma, this tourist also hit a set with his 8's and won. These two events were the only times the two had this betting pattern, only when LAG had AA/KK. I realized that it was collusion and said so, rather pointedly, to the dealer. The dealer tried to shrug it off (it was not the same dealer as for the first time it happened.) but I was having none of it. I told him to call the floor, making it clear that I would if he didn't. However, before he did so, the LAG muttered something about having a bad day, anyway, and he took his (few) remaining chips and left. The nit left soon after. My wife pointed out to me later that my action is the sort of thing that gets one beaten up in the parking lot. I had never thought of that.

[@cj7139]

Fishy, yes. But there's nothing to "prove" collusion here. No dealer would have sided with you in this situation.

[@ashliski]

Happens all the time in $1/2 games. I used to play a lot with my friend and if it got to heads up we would just check it down. Didn't feel like we were cheating because it was just when it was heads up we didn't want to bet at each other and also pay more rake. Didn't do it to gain anything. We had a rule between us that if it's hu we check, if not we play as normal. I do remember one hand where someone got a bit upset (and looking back I realise it was wrong but at the time didn't think I was) because it was 3 handed post flop. I think my friend had aces or something and I had some kind of combo draw. Anyway he bet, I raised and the other guy folded, and then we checked down. I would definitely have raised this hand if playing normally and that was my thinking at the time. However, this was definitely wrong. If you have someone at the table you are checking down with, you should not be allowed to raise them. Because (I wasn't thinking this at the time) the only thing you're actually achieving by raising is to fold the other guy out. I don't want to put more money in the pot against my friend, and I'm also not trying to blow him off his hand. I think you should be allowed to openly nominate players that you don't want to bet with heads up, but if doing so you would also not be allowed to raise them either (not allowed to raise them post flop, not allowed to re-raise them preflop, if they were the initial bettor/raiser)

[@aloha270999]

There is a famous poker vlogger who goes to the poker room to play PLO with two other friends and they all bloat the pot and end up winning thousands and they put it out on KZbin proudly.

[@DominationRotation]

I must admit I have been a participant of soft play against good friends at the poker table, not wanting to stack them for all their chips (in heads-up situations of course). Yet raising anyone out of the pot was never a thing.

[@monsweko]

I don’t have any problem with that and I think most others wouldn’t, either. I’ve done it myself. E.g. you sit down with your buddy at a 1/2 game late night and he’s on his last $100 and you decide not to stack him heads up when you flop a set... but it’s when your actions affect others, especially repeatedly, that you cross a line.

[@tonyflow6244]

If my friend sits at the same table as me I’m gonna gun for them, I should know more about their play plus bragging rights plus I’m an asshole 🤣

[@randomperson-gp8ph]

@@tonyflow6244 👍

[@patrickhenry4675]

That is because you are an honest guy. Some women at the table commonly dress up and flirt to try to get guys to soft play them. You naturally do not want to stack your friend, even though you should by the rules. That is why the rule exists that if you are last to act and have the Nuts you MUST bet or it is a rules violation. It is to uncover team play. If you are not team playing I am not worried about you slow playing an actual friend once in a blue moon.

[@evadecaptcha]

I play in a few home games with a ton of recreational players that check it down heads up. There was only one or two times it really bothered me, which was similar in both cases. Player 1 & 2 usually check it down heads up. Player 3 jams allin on flop or turn, then Player 2 raises, not realizing it's into a dry side pot, then Player 1 saying like "wtf, there's nobody else in the hand - he's allin" (with the understanding that they always check it down heads up). Player 2 didn't realize that he was betting only against the person who he checks it down with, and tries to take his raise back; luckily Player 1 (the house man as well) doesn't let him do that to keep some integrity for the game. Player 1 ends up folding and would've won the hand on the river. Had they only checked it down, Player 3 would've lost the pot because of it. Generally, I don't make a fuss about these situations because I win a ton off of these players, in spite of soft collusion, so I keep my mouth shut and keep playing.

[@rickydona919]

I'll say this from experience that I've played with complete strangers for a few hours and this goes both ways where I'll get heads up or someone will get heads up with me and because we both view the other as being dangerous to each other's stacks we've sometimes agreed to just split the pot and not put ourselves at risk. I have seen brothers at the same tables and I've tried to stay away from tables that I know have collusion going on but unfortunately there's not much that can be done about it because yes it's against the rules but it's almost impossible to prove

[@cookypuss8603]

You can't just agree to split the pot at a casino. That doesn't happen.

[@rickydona919]

@@cookypuss8603 I understand that rules are different at some casinos but at Best Bet Orange Park you can agree to split the pot, I've done it and I've seen it done with my own eyes

[@arthurbekkerman]

What exactly does the caller want the dealer or the floor to do about it? Tell them they can't check it down when there is another player? Guess what, they can't actually force them to bet, so even if they say they can't agree verbally to check it down, they can still have a prearranged agreement to do so. The only thing the player can do here is get his chips and leave, that's it.

[@ItsEverythingElse]

I would expect the dealers and management to start keeping eyes on the guys, that's what.

[@kevinscott1390]

Stand up an yell floor Immediately as pissed as you can be when you see that. Seen it vegas in small stakes back in the day an floor did nothing. Never returned and room was shut down within few months.

[@gkprivate433]

One of my friends keep telling me he wants to agree before we play if we are at the same table that if we get heads up to check it down. I disagree so I make sure I never play in the game if he is at the same table. He does not mean to collude, and in general it is OK to no bet against a friend, it still is a bit iffy. He is not trying to raise and squeeze others out

[@djsparkyy]

Both Boston Billards in Nashua and chasers in Salem NH have great PLO games. Chasers runs 2-3 tables of 2-2 everyday and Billards does 5/10 on Wednesdays and other days as requested. Just this Thursday I saw a guy buy into a 2-2 table for $300 and run it up to almost $11,000 before cashing out for $9,900. NH poker is the best!

[@matthewmiller2550]

In this instance, it may very well be collusion. The main point is this was session 20. He should be aware, that they may do this 80 percent of time in situation. He never told us what his hand strength actually was because it was such a long story. I may have glazed over it. But sounds like he potentially had trips and was just short on chips. If they are actively colluding, dont you think they would just have made it an unspoken rule with each other?

[@tonyfisher7571]

the worst is when the dealer just lets 2 people speak in a foreign language and just carry on a whole conversation. even mid hand.

[@georgewbushcenterforintell147]

The Germans at Aria do this .dealer says English only they say okay then in German Es ist mein Spiel, ich werde meine eigene Sprache sprechen

[@dmed312]

So, how do you tell someone who doesn't speak english to only speak english? There are a lot of non-poker players who don't speak english that you want at your table. This happens all the time in Vegas, at like every poker room. You just tolerate it.

[@bryansmith7238]

@@dmed312 English is the dominant language in the US. If you can't speak it don't speak at all at the table. It's the same in every other country. Dealing with it is a good way to lose money to cheaters.

[@timdavis7398]

@@bryansmith7238 I've actually said when I was sitting at a table and there were 4 foreign players at the table and my cousin and I were getting PO'd because of that cross talk... my cousin was in a big hand and I folded A-low.. I actually asked the dealer... Am I allowed to say I had an ACE? Of course the dealer said no...and then the 4 foreign speaking shouted HEY!!!. My point was made. If they continue to allow the foreign cross talk... Somehow my 5 different language speaking wife will start going with me.

[@bryansmith7238]

@@timdavis7398 I was always under the impression there's little to no chatter at the poker table unless it's in the language of the dealer and house. The integrity of the houses game is at risk and the casinos reputation is on the line

[@ryanfeltedman6533]

This is very very common in home games. I play in some big games that do this a lot. If it's obvious like teamwork, we handle it. We have a few Armenians in our weekly group too haha

[@burkhartlaw1]

Your name is funny

[@phreddphlintstone297]

This is wide spread in live poker. Just as the caller laid out, two "friends" raise and re-raise the hand until the "victim" folds and then just check it down and one of them shows and takes the pot. Usually no words or conversation takes place. If they are dumb enough to speak, call the floor, demand that the winner be moved to another table or sat out until a seat opens elsewhere and insist the floor make a note of the names of both players and if another complaint arises they should be banned from the casino. None of that will actually happen, instead the dealer will just shrug and do nothing. There are several teams of "friends" on the Strip that do this all day long in almost every casino there. I suspect it is everywhere.

[@burkhartlaw1]

I sat down with a father and son at a 1/3 table. 7 handed. I don't know if they played this way before I sat down but as soon as I did they started raising and re-raising everyone out of the pot. If someone opened they'd be raised and called by both. Then they raise and re raise the flop scaring most out. About the fifth hand they stupidly got to showdown after they raised a 3rd guy out of the pot on the river and exposed K6 off and J5 off on a board of A Q 9 6 3 and the father won a huge pot with a pair of 6s. The 3rd player in the pot rightfully threw a fit. It was obvious what was happening. Apparently it was time for them to go to work anyway. 🙄🙄🙄 Very frustrating.

[@moneymikz]

If they didn’t say let’s check, what rule can you make and enforce to stop it??

[@stefc1768]

I’m very concerned about this, and I play PLO too. I think collusion is a real thing in PLO because even if only two poeple colludes, with the not so great advantage in multiway pots, it can be very problematic and almost unprovable. If the hero wouldn’t have been all in, it’s very easy for 2 villains to raise and reraise to make you fold also…. Here, the villains are stupid because I wouldn’t need to verbalise to understand with an accomplice to know what to do when your target is all in…. So I think it’s a very useful video

[@Fred-rg5vw]

If you suspect this is happening ; is there a way you could use it to your advantage? Eg slow play more knowing theyll try to bet you out of a pot ?

[@lightonstillwaters6789]

To any shitty poker room supervisor or dealer, please wipe your asses and wash your hands after you shit on players seeking fair play 😡😠😒!

[@tiltlss]

I've encountered this many times over the years, in public and private games, and always raised holy hell, best result I ever got in a public room was the husband and wife were separated. I think a valid idea would be (if they verbally declared) to call the floor, make them turn their hands up, a penalty, and hope embarrassment makes them stop.

[@edb7742]

As a recreational player, what are the rules at most Las Vegas card rooms for requesting to see hands at a showdown?

[@shadowsmessage]

Last aggressor should show the hand first. If u are on the button & its 3-way, they check it to you. U should show your hand first & not ask them to show their hand. Like u have AK & board is K4KA7. There is a wild player on the table & he bet wild like 75 on flop, 250 on turn & 1000$ on river & u just call his bet on river because u are in content with money & just wanna see his cards to know what range or garbage he is playing, as u are the last aggressor, u should show the hand first on river if there is no bet from the guy , if u call , he should show

[@gkprivate433]

In general, the rules state "At best it is considered rude, and if consistently done will not be allowed". So you can ask for it now and then but if you do it too much, a player or the floor may call for it to be stopped

[@percyblok6014]

Sloppy floors and overall piss poor poker room management seems to be more common these days. Lots of rooms are struggling a bit and the regulars are the ones putting steady cash flow into the tables. It all starts with the players list and table availability. Once you see player preference occurring and table stacking as a result, you spider senses should be tingling.

[@papercitygamerjeff1437]

At MGM in Springfield there was 2 guys taking turns betting $25 at a 1/2 table, taking turns I was about to call them out because they never did it against each other but than they moved to another table.

[@DoubleBassX2]

This was a particularly important episode.

[@emdiar6588]

I've never outright colluded, but once I tanked for a very long time in an MTT getting near the bubble with 83o, just to give a sweet girl on my table with the short stack a chance to cash. Now technically, whoever it was on another table who bubbled could argue that I had colluded against him by excessively tanking with a snap-fold type hand. I broke no rules as such, but I did play in a way that was designed to help another player (who I did not know personally) with no advantage to myself (I was deep). My point is, collusion comes in all shapes. Sometimes a subconscious bias will have you attack certain players more than others. Teaming up to muscle someone out of a 3 way pot, then openly discussing checking to the river though??? That's fucked up.

[@youngdoodle]

this isn’t collusion because all players have the ability and the right to take a reasonable amount of time to play their hand on each street. not only this, but each player has the opportunity and ability ON THEIR OWN with no outside help from other players.

[@emdiar6588]

@@youngdoodle Yes, however I was only tanking to help another player cash. I didn't need to tank. I was super deep and in no danger of bubbling. There was no need for me to tank down to the bubble other than to help other players on my table to last longer than players on other tables. Some might say that is a type of collusion even if it wasn't pre-arranged. Let's imagine a scenario where you (short stack #3) are third from the bottom in chips and we're two players off the money, so hand-for-hand play has not yet begun. The very next hand will see you all in, because you are in the sb and you have less than 1 bb left. Another player (short stack #1, The shortest stack left in the game) is also all in next hand. Now imagine yet another player (short stack #2) on a table next to you is also all in next hand for the same reason, but someone who has a massive stack on that table is tanking forever for no reason of their own, and no one calls the clock. Before you know it your hand is over and you are out. Now we're in hand to hand, but short stack #2 only has one other player with even less chips, to worry about. Even if they both bust, short stack #2 cashes, even though he had less chips than you at the beginning of your last hand. The only reason you didn't cash is that the large stack needlessly tanked to help short stack #2 until you blinded out and hand-for-hand came into play. Now, the big stack did nothing illegal at all, but he is still the reason you bubbled, and he did it deliberately to help someone else cash. How do you feel about that? Unless you can prove that short stack #2 said to him "please tank until I make it past the bubble and I'll cut you in", no foul play has officially taken place, but if he was thinking "I like that hot chick. I'm going to help her cash and who knows....", is that any less collusion?

[@leojoseph6385]

This happened to me, The dealer immediately told both players they are not allowed to do that, but they checked down the turn and river anyway. I lost. It sucked, I was pissed and asked the dealer afterwards why he didn't back me up. His reply was that he warned them...not an acceptable answer. I no longer tip that dealer, and also tip the other dealers less. I told the floor people about it afterwards and the awful reply was that I should have gotten the floor immediately. In a later session One dealer I have a rapport with, noticed I was tipping less, and I explained what happened. I haven't seen the two players again, but I will target them to lose or crush them at a future table.

[@alexleach4002]

Get over it. What is the dealer to do? You can't check?

[@leojoseph6385]

@@alexleach4002 Will never forget the BS, I doubt others would. Dealer should've asked me if I wanted to get the Floor Manager. You can check, but They already Spoiled the Integrity of the hand and soft-played the turn and River. One flopped Set on a flushy-connected board, the other a Straight and back door Flush draw.

[@jamesfancher7508]

actually, when i've noticed this sort of thing in holdem, i've used it against the colluders, which is fairly easy to do.

[@salidproducts]

Example?

[@jamesfancher7508]

@@salidproducts the easiest one, when they're especially clueless is to let them do the betting for you when you got it and go for the triple up, passive style.

[@FefeLeVrai]

What about the option of just observing how they operate and outplay them? The strategy of playing into each other to raise you out of the pot is actually very exploitable by just playing tight and trappy. When you have a nut hand, just call the initial bet, bait them into raising and reraising, then you backjam everything and easy chips. For example in PLO it's often be pretty hard to get it in preflop with aces, but against colluders it can become a cakewalk. Sure it's nice and all to call the floor and get them kicked out of the casino, but it's not as satisfying as stacking their ass.

[@gkprivate433]

I once heard two guys speaking French and just quietly muttering neuf or Dix etc. I let it go on for a few rounds to see if it was cheating or just a one off. I heard it a second time, I folded my 99 to his TT then called the floor and told the table what I was hearing. They stopped talkling. No warning was given

[@enemyfleet7139]

Record on your phone, then report players and manager to state gaming commission. That'll change the floor manager's attitude real quick.

[@no1ghostrider]

yes that's what I said - if the floor people don't want to listen to you maybe they will listen the gaming board

[@goweena209]

some card rooms have 3 house players on every table they signal each other they take extra money out of the pots and they switch cards like its nothing and play dumb . they also look at everyone playing is a sucker with money to lose.

[@jamiebousquet]

I'm also a Jamie from western Mass, but not the caller. If the caller didn't want to play in a collusion ridden PLO game, he could have just played PLO at MGM Springfield since that went most weekends and was probably way more fair. A lot closer, too.

[@fastfunpokerjamie124]

That’s funny I too am Jamie.. I had a similar thing happen to me at mgm Springfield when I folded and they asked to check it down.

[@jamiebousquet]

@@fastfunpokerjamie124 To be fair, I've never played PLO at MGM Springfield, I've just never heard and rumblings about collusion, and I'm pretty friendly with most of the staff.

[@PatrickA1]

We're going to see a lot of cheating at the tables the economy is shit. My friend already asked me if I wanted to collude. He's no longer my friend 🤣

[@lightonstillwaters6789]

Sorry you lost a friend. Kudos for your integrity! 👍

[@gourdiesel]

you could've just said no lmao. didn't have to ruin a friendship over it.

[@donniedoesdishes]

when i first saw qhat you wrote i thought it said your friend wanted to cuddle

[@lightonstillwaters6789]

@@donniedoesdishes if she is hot, why not? 😜

[@fastfunpokerjamie124]

@@gourdiesel when someone asks you to collude it ruins the friendship

[@lightonstillwaters6789]

Some floor supervisors seem to favor regs, possibly because they think regs are their main source of rake. What they forget is without rec players the games will dwindle and eventually die AND rec players will avoid unfair games in the long run.

[@marct7905]

They know each person is $10 an hour profit recreational or not and they definitely don't want to break a table up at 100 an hour profit.

[@lightonstillwaters6789]

@@marct7905 revenue, not profit 🙂, but good point. I still think rec players are the long run lifeblood of poker games, live or online. If they have fun and feel they are playing in a fair game, they will play more often, win or lose.

[@TheEknaian]

There is 5/10 plo at Boston billiards in Nashua almost every weekend! Trust me, I'm there!

[@brandonmcgillis]

One time I was playing 2/5 at Aria , and I was involved in a 5.5k pot with pocket eights and the flop came A K 8 rainbow 🌈. I was under the gun against a guy I knew would call his stack off if he had something Like AK or AQ. Nonetheless I get it all in with him on the flop and he sucked out with an ace on the river. The dealer glances at both of our chips and says , he’s got you covered . Without even allowing me to get a count on his chips the locals on the table who played with my opponent frequently and were saying “yeah he’s got you covered”. I’m from Canada, and they could tell I wasn’t from Las Vegas. It felt like half the table was colluding that day lol.

[@youngdoodle]

this isn’t collusion at all...

[@kaitlynblount7683]

I have the same thing happen to me at the poker table every time but it's not collusion, sorry bud but this is just you and I not being very good at at quick math lol

[@lightonstillwaters6789]

Hey Bart, how do handle playing at a live cash table vs live MTT with obvious couples (married, dating, bffs)?

[@aloha270999]

In Vegas with so many Asians dealers that don't speak English well and even guys who speak English well just don't want to be involved in controversial hands, if a player doesn't complain most likely nothing will happen.

[@EZBISME]

What happens is they stop checking it down, but still pool earnings-same result.

[@daveopie1234]

Sit at the table with a friend. Verbally tell him that collusion is OK in this game and once you and I bet someone else out of the pot, we are allowed to check it down. See if that changes their minds. The other option I see is to threaten the floor that you will report this collusion to the state gaming commission.

[@donniedoesdishes]

you might not want to say that out loud in the gambling world

[@daveopie1234]

@@donniedoesdishes Yes, that's my point. The dealer or floor had better say that is not allowed. Force the issue.

[@kylefrost2119]

Of course making the Armenian observation isn't racist.It's sad that he even feels the need to have to say that, but that's the world in which we live. It's not racism to point out observations or even stereotypes or whatever that one has noticed.

[@no1ghostrider]

I would tell them to do something about it, or you are going report them to the state gaming board. Then they might do something about it.

[@bobbybeef69]

Encore BH is the worst run poker room in New England. I hope it never reopens.

[@omarfromthewire603]

I messaged them yesterday on IG, asking when will Poker return ? They said they dont know, as it is the massachussetts gaming board's decison... All Political GARBAGE agendas

[@barryjb]

If you're not trying to absolutely win as much as you can from EVERY player at the table, you are not playing in the spirit of the game and you should not sit down. Doesn't matter if it's your best mate, wife or your mother.

[@bobross3781]

This guy is definitely Canadian ( with his accent) ..probably traveling from Casino Niagara ...now living illegally in US ...that being said , with the proliferation of poker rooms in the country ,avoiding regs when you're the outsider is difficult.

[@javelinzamot9907]

All home games should have a rule: must show hands on raise and then check down with three or more players in the pot. So that all player may decide to say in the home game ,or leave the home game .And all player must keep there opinion to himself or herself . cheating can be like a crime with no evidence)

[@kellyplumb3561]

Well let's talk K. Bricknal and her boyfriend being two of the three players left at the final table. They both colluded against the third player

[@teamgrahamie01]

Did they not offer that guy a deal and he refused .

[@mikelong2756]

If we wanted to take each others rolls we could of stayed home - Rounders

[@bryanroy111]

413 represent in Springfield Massachusetts baby all day everyday

[@TheEpicReach]

Had this happen at my table a while back when a shortstack was all in. Dealer was distracted making main/side pot and the 2 on the side said they knew each other and admitted to collusion/soft play in front of 10 people/dealer and no one said anything except me when I called over the floor. They were showing one another their hands and agreeing to check it down before the chips were even in the middle...

[@TheTheagent07]

ha this guys going to experience this a ton in so cal between the persians and armenians

[@clemfandango5908]

This is why I only play tournaments now.

[@godly04]

Discord Brazilians on Pokerstars are really bad for this - how are they not banned?

[@monsweko]

And it should be said that the dealers at the Encore Boston Harbor, overall, are the most novice and poorest quality dealers I have ever encountered in my life. Of course there are some good, experienced dealers but they are the exception not the norm.

[@georgewbushcenterforintell147]

I played in Mr Os game it was u vs the host Mr O And his henchman.

[@CrushlivePoker]

Who are you talking to?

[@slugerama]

He said all 3 players were all in. How can any further betting take place if all their money is in the middle?

[@willygene829]

The other two still had money behind

[@slugerama]

@@willygene829 Around 9:10 onwards he says we end up 3 way all in. Unless he changed the story at the end and I missed, that means there is no other option but to check it down. Edit: Listened again and the caller has no idea what happened. He says the other players are all in as well and that they have money behind.Which is it dude? Are they all in as well or do they have money behind

[@Stylish_Nihilist]

Brian McGovern from my understanding, the other 2 had him covered and had a fair amount of money behind. Hero was pissed because V1 (two pair) could have (and probably should have) bet flop and turn to drive V2 (who was drawing to a straight or flush) out of the hand instead of verbally agreeing to giving him 2 free cards. Hero’s top set would have beat V1’s 2 pair and he wins the pot. Could have been a scary board and I don’t know hero’s effective stack, but it seems really sketchy to agree to a check down, especially in PLO.

[@TheHardRockG6]

Are There Outdoor Tables In LA?

[@6stringsgood]

The Encore took care of this problem and shut down poker all together

[@robert2375]

I would tell the poker manager, what he has here is basically, a private game with these individuals and I would like a separate public game open on a different table.

[@libs-Suk-Balz]

Nyc plo player here. Many times we see guys check it down when it’s heads up and they say we don’t bet against one another. It’s bs but it’s not collusion if we see real action when there are multiple players. Another thing that’s done is one guy bets pot, the next guy repots and everyone folds but the original pot guy. The original says csll and then one of them says, want to pull back some money, ie the repot bet. Anyone at the table can object but mostly people say ok unless someone folded because of the repot. No, I folded because of that repot, the money stays in. There’s a fine line between collusion and not going after a friend when it’s HU. Looks shitty but it’s not exactly collusion

[@marct7905]

I've seen easily 10-20 grand on the Omaha tables at BBC nashua.

[@therealjackwhite1523]

lol 1k max buy in too

[@ep3578]

Boston Billiards is a great place to play

[@dandattola]

That's why I quit playing in private games. Too much BS allowed.

[@karlinchina]

Well, the caller got in top set vs 2pair and a draw, so he has over 60% 3 ways. If they don't agree to check it down, will one of them really try to bluff the other off a dry side pot? Just saying, show me an example of a hand where someone is really harmed. Anyway, verbalizing "check it down" should be some sort of automatic penalty. No idea why the floor would defer back to the dealers on that one.

[@deiterprussing]

PLO is a drawing game. Guy with top set is obviously harmed because naturally guy with top 2 would bet for value to drive out straight draws. The straight draw got there on the river which allowed the two pair to draw to nut full house and straight draw to continue without a price - openly checking down when others are in the pot all-in definitely harms them, especially if its a constant occurrence. playing against two hands is harder than playing against one

[@nuenen75ehv76]

Call yourself with drawing hand ...odds are ok against multiple people

[@stlbigbad23]

Jeez Bart, let people talk! You're terrible at interrupting.

[@yeeluvspizza]

No Bart is not. Stop exaggerating.

[@brucejsanchez]

Oh like tourney style

[@ItsEverythingElse]

These "professional" dealers aren't going to do squat without asking them. They don't want to jeopardize their tips.

[@gbwiz]

if you cant find the inner-self to win your friends money, then you dont deserve to be at a poker table.

[@joshkinard2843]

I play some large no limit Omaha games where a lot of the men have been playing cards together for 30 plus years. The game is skewed because the buy-in is only 50 bucks but there'll be several 10K plus stacks on the table and they straddle 50 sometimes a hundred. They run a lot of the shorter stacks into the pot and then they basically check it down with each other. The games is a honey hole and I would never tell anybody where it was at but at the same time that's a little bit of bullshit don't you think

[@ChrisM-wv4gs]

Sure sounds like colussion to me.

[@jdub643]

STOP PLAYING IN THE GAME! Lol

[@mikekutzler]

Your hair gets me every time 😂 joking love your vids and advise

[@tchrist141]

Jamie sounds like Johnny Vibes.....

[@stevevenn1]

Ha I thought that too a little. He wouldn't be as passive tho heh.

[@eugenesis8188]

I think a lot of people don't understand poker, so somebody constantly betting seems overly aggressive and ends up costing them a ton of money, so they'll just defend themselves by blindly attacking you. I was playing on one of those fake chips apps because I wanted to practice a lag style without losing money, and people would either spam emotes or start calling me names in the chat if I was betting on every street. A ton of people treat poker like it's the game, war, only with multiple cards, and you win a prize at the end. They actually don't comprehend that they should fold their 2 7 off, and they get mad at you for making them, because they remember that one time they hit runner runner trips, bet 10% of the pot, and won.

[@rn1731]

Rule breakers should be hit hard will total ban for a year

[@jamesmcginn6291]

If they do this and you have the best hand then you win a big hand. So, what's the big deal?

[@percyblok6014]

Obvious you don't play PLO.

[@Carlito1980]

Lemme guess the small group of players were Chinese... those guys never bet each other

[@alexleach4002]

I don't think this is or should be against the rules. You are not in a tournament, this is a cash game. As the house especially in PLO you want rules and policies in place to protect the money at the table. Don't make rules in polices that encourage people to buy in short and play a short stack. It is bad for the game. Protect the money the table by letting the money on the table realize its equity vs a short stack. You don't like them checking it down behind when you are in the hand? Then buy in like a man and cover em. The no check it down rule is to meant to protect short stacks in tournaments. This should not apply.

[@bluerushing8563]

Dude sounds like a losing player

[@brettblaster]

This guy sounds like a losing player. People check it down in PLO literally all the time. If the game isn’t good in your eyes don’t play it.

[@brucejsanchez]

This dude probably gets on everyone when they check it down

[@alexleach4002]

Seriously to everyone thinking this is cheating; I challenge you to find a buddy and go "take advantage" of a table by doing this. What edge are you getting? You get to realize your equity the same way the short stack does? There is no benefit to this that gives you an edge over the short stack. The only thing this does is takes away some of the edge short stack players get by playing short. If you don't like it or think it is an unfair advantage then buy in with a big stack and stop complaining.

[@deiterprussing]

Huh? There was no talk of "short stack" play or how this has anything to do with taking away the "edge" that a short stack has. That wasn't part of the discussion whatsoever. I've seen tables get taken advantage of in this exact manner. Deep stacked or not. Doesn't matter. When they can price you out of a draw, they price you out.

[@alexleach4002]

@@deiterprussing Who is getting taken advantage of? It is a side pot between 2 people. If they decide to check it down it is between them. They don't have to but sometimes it is in both their best interest to check down and if they both do that is their business. In my opinion.

[@deiterprussing]

@@alexleach4002 I definitely agree that they have the right to check it down, but when they verbalize it and do this all the time, it gets into a gray area. I’ve played a 1/2 game where boyfriend/girlfriend eventually sat right next to each other. We go to a draw heavy flop 4 ways with $80 in the middle. Boyfriend cbets tiny (like $15) and girlfriend tanks and raises to $120. I had some good back door draws but had to fold. It folds back around to boyfriend and he called. Second pair won at show down. No one knew they were dating, and they played super tight so the other players figured they had nutted hands in this instance. That was the only hand they played and they left the game 20 minutes later.

[@johntaylor2318]

damn dude. u losing hair over the years!

[@hossel1079]

moronic comment. It happens to almost every man, nothing special here, his hair looks fine to me.

[@lancebrown8398]

shouldve pulled your money back out of the pot and left, you got cheated

[@bearatts]

Bart should refer to the caller as Karen