How to align a tape machine for reproduction using an MRL

  Рет қаралды 81,676

Scott Oliphant

Scott Oliphant

Күн бұрын

Part 1 in our "How to" series about recording with tape. If you've committed to recording to tape, you absolutely owe it to yourself to learn how to correctly align the tape deck to get the most out of the medium. Properly aligned and setup, it's unbeatable (at least we think so). Not doing routine alignment on the machine is like running a 3 band EQ set at who knows what into and out of the machine. This is the simplest of the alignments and requires a proper MRL test tone tape, not some tape your buddy made. Read more about the MRL tape at www.mrltapes.com/. It's not hard, and with a little practice you'll be able to do a 24 track alignment in probably 10-15 minutes. Long live analog recording.
with Scott Oliphant and Chico Jones
www.ohmrecordingfacility.com/

Пікірлер: 68
@dhampex
@dhampex 15 жыл бұрын
Your a life saver. I needed this info. I just got my MCI jh24 and a mrl so now I can do this myself. Thanx a mill!!
@richpaul8132
@richpaul8132 4 жыл бұрын
I deleted my statements & questions because I realized what I was missing when I re-read the manuals. Thanks, Rich
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 15 жыл бұрын
One other thing, I had a the mx70 for a couple of years. It's a great machine, but will limit you a bit when it comes to projects coming in and going out. I was the only one in my peer group running 1" tape. Another thing that I did not like was the plastic pots on the audio cards, they'd strip easily. If you can swing it and are serious about tape recording, do what you can to spring for the 2", you won't regret it (assuming you find one in good shape!) good luck!
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 14 жыл бұрын
@conordoyle85 both. there are separate controls (at least on most pro decks) for adjusting these independently (I don't think our otari has a low freq control for sel rep, just gain and hi freq). The repro alignment is the most critical as it's the head you'll use for mixing or transferring to the computer, the sel rep alignment will come into play during tracking when you are monitoring and recording overdubs.
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 14 жыл бұрын
I didn't take it as a critique, we welcome all knowledge here to help folks out. We may actually be using a 320 nW/m tape since we operate at +6 over 185 (at 0 vu), you'll have to forgive me as I have a newborn at the house and haven't been in for a session in a couple of months! You could also get a 500 nW/m tape for +9 over 185 operation (say, for gp9 or the like). Thanks for the info Paul! Scott
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 15 жыл бұрын
record and input coming soon need to find some time to edit them together! Hopefully people may find these useful and we'll keep analog recording alive for a little longer, i need to be able to buy tape =)
@dhampex
@dhampex 15 жыл бұрын
Once again thnx for this.now I will hook my 2 inch mci to the new endless analog clasp processor to let protools capture the repro head, arming the tracks through protools and control the transport. This will eliminate me from buying Gang of reels, work linear or non linear, less wear and tear on the deck and tape, switch different tape speeds on the fly and retain the 2 inch sound ( a super hi brid all at once).
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 15 жыл бұрын
When you buy an MRL tape, they come with different eq curves. NAB and IEC are 2 different versions of these. NAB, traditionally was used extensively here in the states, while IEC tended to be used overseas (from what i can gather). We use (sometimes) the IEC MRL with the 24 track headstack because it gives us a a slightly lower noise floor at 15 ips. Since the track width is wider on the 16 track headstack (already giving us a lower noise floor) this is not as much an issue
@RailManSD
@RailManSD 13 жыл бұрын
Analog is awesome! :D
@michaefrasinelli9191
@michaefrasinelli9191 8 жыл бұрын
I know this is an old video, but I'm going to be calibrating an Otari MTR-12 stereo machine. Do you use the low speed pot for 15ips and the high speed pot for 30ips at 10KHz? Or always low speed for 10KHz?
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 15 жыл бұрын
the last 2 tape machines I purchased I got from either craigslist or friends, good luck!
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 15 жыл бұрын
Hey there, I'll bias with one of the master bias pots if I've recently set the bias on all the cards individually. If the individual cards are not biased correctly in the first place, just using the master won't get you there. I like to know for sure my bias is correct so I'll usually spend the extra 15 minutes setting it up! been real busy, will get the other videos up at some point, check back!
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 14 жыл бұрын
250 nWb/m. We've done probably 100+ sessions now with this tape deck / MRL and quantegy 456, rmgi 900, etc. We don't mind a little noise (and neither do the bands we've recorded). If a session has to be "noise free", like a dynamic jazz ensemble or if someone does not want to record to tape, we can always record to the computer through the apogee converters which sound great. Rock and roll and pop bands have never once complained our recordings are too "noisy" for whatever that's worth.
@BRINGYOURSONG
@BRINGYOURSONG 4 жыл бұрын
Scott.... thanks so much for this. Do you know if the audio cards for the MKII and MKIII are the same? They look like it.
@999kgb
@999kgb 10 жыл бұрын
Nice video, thanks for posting. I'd like to comment on the importance of setting azimuth. Regardless of how many tracks you're working with, from full-track mono to 2" 24, understanding how to set the record and reproduce azimuth should be mandatory. The slightest misalignment can be detrimental to what might otherwise be an excellent recording. Some might say you can "set it and forget it", but that's like saying your piano was tuned when you bought it, therefore it never needs tuning. For those new to analog tape machines, grab an xy scope and familiarize yourself with setting azimuth. Regarding bouncy tones, there can be a few reasons related to the transport to cause bouncing, but a slightly misaligned azimuth can also cause alignment tones to bounce.
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 10 жыл бұрын
we didn't get to azimuth, but you are correct! should be part of your overall maintenance. Not to get into too many details here, but the basic idea is to feed channel 1 and channel 16/24 (depending on headstack) to a scope and adjust the course / fine azimuth screws while playing back the appropriate tones (included on MRL tape but essentially the 1 and 10/12/16k tones or whatever.) Adjust until the tracks at either end of the head are in phase (or as close as you can get it) Record head azimuth would be a similar process but you'd be feeding tones instead of using the MRL
@325iaddict
@325iaddict 10 жыл бұрын
That's exactly the very first point I always start with. The lower the tape speed, the more the high frequencies will suffer with just the slightest misalignment of either the record or playback head... No matter how large or small the recorder is (I painstakingly adjusted my Uher Report Monitor 4200 5" reel-to-reel machine in this respect, now it even has a usable frequency responce at 1 7/8 IPS).
@brentfisher902
@brentfisher902 6 жыл бұрын
And if you are using an ordinary $25 shoebox compact cassette recorder, the wrong azimuth can make a okay cheapo deck sound ear-bleedingly as bad as my Asus 10 inch IPS LCD tablet PC.
@andyk9685
@andyk9685 11 жыл бұрын
WOW ! Good job ! Thanx
@shadowshop1
@shadowshop1 6 жыл бұрын
hi to all out there i picked up a otari mx80 of the ebay i had to do this. i can tell you it takes some time . rew the tape all the time i put the start of the tone at zero helps big time. i have a 16 track heads what a pain it is to change it over all the time . otari mx80 mx70 i have they are ace recorders and great to work on
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 15 жыл бұрын
sure! that looks interesting, how does it handle the monitoring delay (in repro) for overdubs i wonder? have fun
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 15 жыл бұрын
good digital is expensive as well, 24 channels of high end conversion would run you more than a good condition 2" machine these days. As much as we love analog recording, there are places for digital as well (which we also use), and most studios that still record to tape have both or use some sort of hybrid combination of the 2.
@StudioSasha
@StudioSasha 7 жыл бұрын
Help Please !! Otari MTR 90 , Problem : after Transport from germany to USA , Evrethink work but no power on Capstan motor , but reels motor good. But all buttons iluminate good
@bryannelson72
@bryannelson72 15 жыл бұрын
very nice.
@HoboCabbage
@HoboCabbage 13 жыл бұрын
@nhuwar what happens is over time the flux in the tape can print through the tape that has wrapped around it.. the print through is unavoidable... but by setting forwarding the tape all the way will make the print through occur after the original point on the tape... instead of before... A good example of print through that happens BEFORE the original sound is in Led Zepplin whole lotta love. when its accapella and the instruments arent masking the print through, you hear it sort of pre echo.
@nationaldebonaires
@nationaldebonaires 9 жыл бұрын
Scott - nice videos. . . helpful. I have an MX 70 and need some basic get started info on how to use the Auto Locator. Do you have any information you could share? Thank you. Steve
@nintendoor1
@nintendoor1 3 жыл бұрын
thank you for this helpful video! does this translate to most tape machines? I recently picked up a Teac 80-8 R2R and some of the tracks aren’t erasing / recording properly, so I am planning on buying a calibration tape in an attempt to remedy that issue, but I’ve never done anything of the sort, so obviously, I’m a little nervous poking around
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 3 жыл бұрын
it does! though that sounds like a physical issue vs electronic alignment (like an azimuth thing maybe) you can do a dirty check for physical alignment by running a tone to the first and last track, flip phase on one of them and see how much gain reduction you get on your stereo bus (and you'd adjust your physical heads ever so gently to maximize the phase cancellation) you can also do this the "right" way with some scopes etc. but, bounds like maybe beyond an MRL issue. Good luck!
@bobbyhosweden
@bobbyhosweden 9 жыл бұрын
Hi there, are these reliable machines ? I am looking to buy an Otari MTR90 but have heard that the Mk ll or lll are prefered?
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 15 жыл бұрын
The record and I/O setup are on their way in the next week or so!
@NeneExists
@NeneExists 8 жыл бұрын
Wouldn't variation on the outer tracks indicate your MRL tape is starting to stretch?
@zosolespaul1
@zosolespaul1 11 жыл бұрын
HI Scott Sorry I don't why my post didn't all appear but what I asked was how did you get the test tone to sound out when adjusting the bias..did you use the MRL or a test tone generator again thank you jimi
@UnchainTheNight1
@UnchainTheNight1 15 жыл бұрын
well to be honest i know nothing about recording period. but i find recording fascinating and i think i may learn about it in college or something
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 15 жыл бұрын
yep! mtr-90 mk III
@zosolespaul1
@zosolespaul1 11 жыл бұрын
HI Scott, Hey it wasn't clear to me how you obtained the test tone audible when you moved the bias switch. Are you running tht got an Otari MTR90mk2 still looking for a CB 113 to control arming of tracks. If you know of one available please contact me again much thanks! jimi
@daveagne3308
@daveagne3308 4 жыл бұрын
How often does the tape alignment need to be performed?
@SeanKerns
@SeanKerns 6 жыл бұрын
Hi Scott, thanks for doing this, Is there an official name for the "tweaker" too, and where can I find one? Trying to keep a jeweler's screwdriver while adjusting is a real hassle. Thanks!
@cameronos
@cameronos Жыл бұрын
eBay “reel to reel adjustment tool”, other name is insulated screwdriver
@EmilianoCaballeroFraccaroli
@EmilianoCaballeroFraccaroli 11 жыл бұрын
BTW, you could calibrate your tapes recording a 1khz tone from your oscillator right?
@Jarraknz
@Jarraknz 15 жыл бұрын
Any idea how these decks compare to the MTR-100s?
@RemyRAD
@RemyRAD 10 жыл бұрын
Wow! What a fabulous video you have made to show people how to destroy their very costly, MRL calibration tapes. There is this little thing called a "head de-magnetizer". You can't use the little skinny crappy ones from Radio Shaft. No. You need something that has a very strong degaussing abilities such as a "Handy-Mag". YOU MUST FIRST ALWAYS de-MAGNETIZE THE HEADS FIRST, BEFORE YOU EVER LOAD THE MRL, CALIBRATION, ALIGNMENT TAPE! DON'T EVER FORGET TO DO THAT! Now that cleaning procedure with the Q-tip and 91% isopropyl alcohol also gave me a good laugh. Not! Why? You indicated to clean the head in the direction of the tape travel, back and forth across the gap. NO, NO & NO. You clean the head with a Q-tip, dampened with alcohol, not soaking from alcohol. And you clean the head vertically, up and down the multitrack gaps. Not side to side, where you can deposit and clog the head gap with magnetic tape articles. It's the blind leading the blind! OMG! And does everybody know about MRL calibration tapes that are compensated or uncompensated, for multi-track reproduction? Of course not. So if the tape is not " Compensated for Multi-Track reproduction? What does that mean? That means, you're not going to adjust any of the low-frequency Playback equalizers, while playing the reference calibration, alignment tape. No. You adjust the playback low frequency response equalizers, while you are recording low-frequency tones. Not playing them back from a tape that is not compensated for multi-track reproduction. What you don't know about these 2 inch tapes, kids, is that they are actually recorded on 2 inch, FULL TRACK HEADS, that are specially made. This made this so you can use that tape on 16 track, 24 track and the John Stephens, 2 inch, 40 track machines, all. Now that's going to be a calibration tape that's not calibrated for multitrack reproduction because you are using different track format machines. And the different track widths actually affect low-frequency response, from what is known as " FRINGING EFFECT ". Meaning that the tracks of the heads, will see, more low-frequency response, which will be displayed on the meters, erroneously. That's why you cannot use the low-frequency playback equalizers, with the calibration tape, in playback. I know that sounds whacked but that's the way it is with analog tape recorders of a multi-track variety. And you didn't get to azimuth? What? That's not a repro alignment. There's always been a lot of discussion how to check and adjust azimuth on large-format, 16/24 track machines. Some folks think, you take tracks 1 & 24 (16 if that's all you got.). Unfortunately, that method does not guarantee that you will have proper azimuth alignment. No. It's actually best to take tracks 1 through 12. Combine them all together to the left channel output of your console. Then take tracks 13 through 24, combine them all together and place those in the right channel mix output of your console. From there, you can watch your meters on your console, and tweak azimuth for highest output. However, the best way to do that is with an oscilloscope. Left channel goes into the horizontal input. Right channel goes to the vertical input. This will display a 45° diagonal line from lower left, to the upper right corner of the scope display. And the idea here, when tweaking the azimuth, is to try and obtain the skinniest and most accurate 45° , lower left to upper right, bushy line you can. That yields the best overall azimuth alignments since, not all of the gaps all line up perfectly with each other, vertically. This is referred to as " GAP SCATTER ". That's why you can't just use 2 or 4 tracks. It'll be close just not as close. I'll leave the different methods of biasing and other alignment procedures, until another day. I figure going to be sick? Scotty, ya really should repost this the right way. Start with the de-magnetizing, please. Pretty please. And clean the heads top to bottom not side to side. No! DON'T PLAY WITH THE MASTER BIAS OSCILLATOR LEVEL ! Only a hack would do that as a quick way to align record to a different tape formulation. No. NO! You may actually be risking blowing out your machine doing that. I've seen it happen too many times. So many bias oscillators are already running balls to the wall. Most weren't designed for these last generations of hot mastering tapes. Though Studer A-800's & later machines and Ampex ATR-100/124's, got plenty of current to spare. That's why it's indicated as a onetime critical adjustment, with test equipment like AC volt meters and oscilloscopes, distortion analyzers. That is just not smart. That's supremely incompetent and lazy. It doesn't take but 10 minutes to tweak record on a 24 track machine. If you don't have that time to do that? You're in the wrong business. I'm sorry if this seems rather terse. But when you're trying to show the whole world how to do it the wrong way...? You're doing more harm than good. You're not part of the tea bagger party are ya? I hope not? Those folks are as accurate as the Bible. Not. I actually had to inform J. McKnight, the owner of MRL Labs, that he had made a mistake, making the alignment tapes one month, for Scully. He called me every name in the book. Then he called me back the next day at the factory to apologize. I had been correct, that he had made a change, in the making of the calibration tapes, that was inaccurate. It caused all the machines to not meet playback specifications with brand-new test tapes. The thing that specifications with the old worn-out test tapes. What's that tell ya? I know what I'm talking about. That's what. Mx. Remy Ann David Former Quality Control Manager Scully/Ampro Recording Instruments www.crowmobile.com info@crowmobile.com 202-239-7412 (answering service)
@RemyRAD
@RemyRAD 10 жыл бұрын
That's practically a How To book, I wrote ! Sheesh... If you want to know how to align the machine properly? I'm going to have to charge ya LOL. No... I won't. But I would like to share accurate information. Come on guys, you've got to get this right.
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 10 жыл бұрын
wow, as I said below "we welcome all knowledge here to help folks out". We're not claiming to be the ultimate masters of tape recording and alignment procedures like you seem to be, just trying to be helpful and when we made this video we could find almost no information online about the process. As someone nearing 40 I do appreciate being called "kid" though :) Your comment here in it's entirety for people to reference and take from it what they will. thanks
@RemyRAD
@RemyRAD 10 жыл бұрын
Well Scott, you should be commended for your efforts. But not de-Demagnetizing your heads first, it is like not zipping up your fly. But everyone forgets to do that once in a while LOL. Here is some trivial and useless technical information regarding analog recorders. Many of us, before the digital days, would schlep out big, heavy, Ampex & Scully's. And I'm going to describe why demagnetizing your heads are so important.Scott Oliphant When we went out to do on location recordings, if your machine is transported east or west? You'll have no problems. But... if you're heading up and down I-95, going north or south, it has a tendency to magnetize the playback head. It might be ever so slight but... the damage will still be done. You can't get it back when it's gone. Certainly not like file recovery software LOL. Which is another reason why cassette players in cars always added noise to your tapes. The engine and ignition system is a substantial source of electromagnetism. So that didn't help, either. 40? Ya I guess ya wouldn't know? I'm over 58. When I was seven, I got to go to the big Studios, Radio & TV stations, in Detroit. I've never been the same since. I always had an incredible fascination over magnetic tape recording. So I not only ended up working for Scully, I was factory trained for all the others except for TEAC, OTARI & Studer. But when you've seen one, you've seen them all. There is also a biasing procedure, few people know about or have used. And it doesn't require a voltmeter. Only a sine wave oscillator. Though, to do this right, you need an oscillator that will go down to 10 Hz, that's ten. Not a misprint. Here's what ya do: After doing your de-magnetizing and playback alignment, you load up a fresh roll of your favorite Mastering Tape. Set your oscillator to 500 Hz at 0 VU. Roll record and monitor Repro. Making sure the level is still at 0 VU. Now you need to turn off your speakers, completely. And get a pair of headphones out. Your best headphones. You're going to monitor playback, while recording, 10 Hz. Now the recorder can't record 10 Hz, no. As much as it tries, it won't go that low. What you need to do is listen to that. Of course you can't hear 10 Hz, either. What you can hear, while trying to record 10 Hz, you'll frequently hear something we call " Bias Rocks ". You'd think with an expression like that, it would be good? It's not. You're hearing the intermodulation distortion. And the idea is to trim your bias so as to get the lowest bias rocks and " whoosh whoosh whoosh ", to a minimum. Beware, it's easy to go too high with the bias that will cause self erasure. You lose level and all your high-end. But when you get it right... you'll have the cleanest sounding tracks you've ever recorded. And especially of bass guitars. Now if ya forgot to turn down your speakers? Chances are? Your woofers, wouldn't survive it. So this is only done with headphones. I did not create this procedure. I was turned on to it by the now late John Stephens, maker of the Stephens Multi-Track Machines. Though it takes a keen ear and some getting used to. But when you do it right and reference it against 10 kHz set up, you'll generally find it matches, only better. Unfortunately, it seems to be a somewhat goofy imprecise way of seriously tweaking anything, without a volt meter and distortion analyzer. What can I say? It works. Try it. If you can't get it right? Go ahead and do your adjustment at 10 kHz. Then put your headphones on and turn down the speakers and swing that oscillator down to 10 Hz. Take a listen. And lightly rock the bias adjustment, back and forth, listening carefully, to the intermodulation distortion and bias rocks of 10 Hz. No voltmeter needed.
@llary
@llary 8 жыл бұрын
+RemyRAD someone get grandpa his pills, quick.
@Vladislaw81
@Vladislaw81 6 жыл бұрын
Why do we need to set oscillator to 500 Hz, when we need 10 Hz? Do we have to set the "0" dB level first using the 500 Hz test frequency, and then set the oscillator to 10 Hz with the same level?
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 14 жыл бұрын
calibration will not fix that problem, i don't know what that might be =) is it a 8track headstack? It almost sounds like maybe you were playing back something recorded on 1" 8 track and playing back on 1" 16track. Good luck with this one. If you feed the machine signal on track 3 and record while in repro (not sel-rep) is it on 2 and 4?
@38911bytefree
@38911bytefree 10 жыл бұрын
WOW, that is for serious ... ITS A MONSTER R2R.
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 15 жыл бұрын
no problem!
@fredrik.larsen
@fredrik.larsen 14 жыл бұрын
@nhuwar Storing tape tails out reduces signal print through. You should google it for more information, if you'd like.
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 15 жыл бұрын
hey thanks man, I play with Joel in the deaf ears and engineer at the studio, drop me a line if you have any questions and i'll do my best to help out! take care scott
@Dzoni73
@Dzoni73 15 жыл бұрын
can somebody write dimensions of this beautiful machine ? thanks.
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording 15 жыл бұрын
good point, the less water on the heads the better
@wado1942
@wado1942 14 жыл бұрын
You shouldn't fast forward through the tape, just let it play till the end for the most consistent pack.
@joaxTV
@joaxTV 15 жыл бұрын
MX-70???
@joaxTV
@joaxTV 15 жыл бұрын
MTR-90!
@RaychSeldon33
@RaychSeldon33 14 жыл бұрын
Ok, you guys are like an oasis in the desert. I have this beautiful 1" studer A80 and i was desperately looking on how it should be aligned... Thank you VERY much. I live in a small town, and i'm afraid there is not a single person able to help me on this. I payed almost 3 000 for this machine and i think i was close to the nervous breakdown when i became aware that what i recorded on track 3 was played on tracks 2 AND 4... Do you think calibration will fix that problem? However THANK YOU again
@musicnetwork2834
@musicnetwork2834 2 жыл бұрын
yea bruh tells you why this video should be deleted hustlaz - 355
Жыл бұрын
Hey, man! You forgot to demagnetize the tape heads and all the tape path. A calibration test may be totally ruined with just one pass with magnetized heads or path. Very important issue!
@ohmrecording
@ohmrecording Жыл бұрын
We (and other folks I know) don't demag every session, but if that works for you then go for it! Happy recording
Жыл бұрын
@@ohmrecording check your calibration tape. May be, it's already no more "calibrated". Happy recording, too.
@UnchainTheNight1
@UnchainTheNight1 15 жыл бұрын
wow i know absolutely nothing about analog recording but it seems really expensive and tedious. i bet its worth it though, down with digital.
@inkwell1981
@inkwell1981 14 жыл бұрын
That tool is actually called a tweaker tool.
@MattsterFelix
@MattsterFelix 11 жыл бұрын
havent you herd? the dirt keeps the funk lol
@musicisitall
@musicisitall 12 жыл бұрын
I can align by hearing. yés I can. They controlled it by analysing it....... and I can....
@Eyliusevil
@Eyliusevil 15 жыл бұрын
should be 97-99% alcohol.
How to align a tape machine for recording (Bias setup included)
9:45
Scott Oliphant
Рет қаралды 101 М.
Steve Albini cutting and splicing tape
11:53
Vintage Drummer
Рет қаралды 93 М.
DEFINITELY NOT HAPPENING ON MY WATCH! 😒
00:12
Laro Benz
Рет қаралды 18 МЛН
Sending drums through tape - Shawn Everett
4:36
Mix with the Masters
Рет қаралды 129 М.
Electrical Audio How-To: Editing a Multitrack Tape
10:28
Electrical Audio
Рет қаралды 33 М.
Mixing Analog Off Tape, No Computer @RiotHomeRecording
23:55
Riot Home Recording
Рет қаралды 56 М.
Technology That Changed Recording History (Part 2)
12:51
Audio University
Рет қаралды 67 М.
How Reel-to-Reel Tape Works
19:28
RobScallon2
Рет қаралды 65 М.
THIS IS HOW A 24 TRACK TAPE MACHINE WORKS!
22:21
White Sea Studio
Рет қаралды 84 М.
Debunking the Digital Audio Myth: The Truth About the 'Stair-Step' Effect
13:17
The Studer Legend - the history of our tape machines
10:34
Studer
Рет қаралды 217 М.
Electrical Audio How-To: Studer A820 Multitrack Alignment and Calibration
15:47
1958 FACOM 128B Japanese Relay Computer, still working!
24:05
CuriousMarc
Рет қаралды 1,4 МЛН