How to Compose 4:1 Counterpoint || Tonal Voice Leading 4

[@jen3800]

for the first time in my 45 years of playing instruments by ear, i now finally believe i can actually read and write music thanks to these lessons. for the first time someone is speaking to me in a way i understand because i live harmony so much and this lays it all out so well! Thank you for this posting !!! I'm so excited ! I'm going to finally compose for real !

[@tactlacker]

Same here. This has been the perfect bridge-together of the written and the conceptual/performative ideas to finally afford my progress. If that makes any sense. I identified with your articulation big time

[@rogerramjet6615]

I think one the reasons that Fux and Mozart used their respective endings at the 17:30 mark, is because they wanted to outline the Dominant chord on the penultimate beat for a V- I cadence. With the other suggestion, it outlines the Supertonic which has a predominant effect.

[@sohamshah3128]

Really would like to thank you for this amazing series lessons on counterpoint, cleared a lot of doubts for me and improved my counterpoint line in my exercises a huge way!

[@JacobGran]

You are very welcome, I always enjoy hearing this.

[@chaoshead77]

The best explanation of species counterpoint I've ever seen

[@stell4rt]

My god... It's ... I'm speechless... Thank you

[@Ave_Musica]

This content is amazing! Thank you!!

[@JacobGran]

Glad you like it!

[@GLa-iacona]

Thank you SO MUCH for sharing this!

[@JacobGran]

My pleasure! Thanks for watching.

[@uomodibassamorale]

Whoah difficult for me. Subscribed!

[@ΚΩΝΣΤΑΝΤΙΝΟΣΡΟΔΙΤΗΣ-σ7υ]

At 3:52, could the B in beat 3 be viewed as a dissonant anticipation of the next B with the C as a neighbouring tone?

[@JacobGran]

Good question; in freer forms of counterpoint that could be a valid interpretation, but in strict counterpoint we would prefer the most straightforward interpretation, like Ockham's razor. If a configuration makes sense in terms of the simplest dissonances such as passing tones and suspensions, then that's what you should go with unless there are other stylistic or motivic factors that make you think an anticipation is a preferred interpretation.

[@ΚΩΝΣΤΑΝΤΙΝΟΣΡΟΔΙΤΗΣ-σ7υ]

@@JacobGran Thanks for the reply.

[@LoveRonnelid]

Good to see that Mozard managed to improve Fux this time. ;) Jacob! Incredible content. Thanks!

[@JacobGran]

Glad you liked it!

[@keyxmusic]

At 5:57, can double neighbor tones happen on beat 3 and 4, to lead in to a consonance in the next downbeat? For example, we have a cantus that goes C | F, and a counterpoint above that goes G E G B | A etc. Thank you!

[@JacobGran]

Good question. Double neighbors in 4:1 counterpoint always take up an entire measure of 4/4 time, so the dissonances will have to happen on beats 2 and 3. In your example, the first three notes G E G are consonant with CF note C, and the note B is a dissonance approached by leap, which would not form a neighbor note since they have to be stepwise. A possible situation with a double neighbor pattern shifted onto beats 3 and 4 would be something like this: Ctpt: G C B D | C 5 8 7 9 6 CF: C | E Here the notes B and D are dissonant upper and lower neighbors to the consonant note C, which appears on beat two of the first measure and returns on the next downbeat. I would say that this type of thing is possible in free composition, but the voice leading is a little too complicated for a strict species exercise. The reason this example sounds fluent, at least to my ears, is because we hear the C on beat two prolonged as a consonance into the next measure. Consonances prolonged like this across bar lines are called consonant suspensions, and they are the topic of the next species.

[@Tabu11211]

Thank you very much for you content!

[@JacobGran]

Glad you enjoy it!

[@nicolasrioscardona]

Hi Dr. Jacob. What if in the example of 6:10 the second beat D, third beat B and fourth beat C? Is posible?

[@JacobGran]

Yes, that would also count as a double neighbor pattern.

[@minyin988]

Btw In the Counterpoint at the very beginning of video.Is the connection forbiddened from "bar 5 downbeat note 'B' " to "bar 6 downbeat note 'F' "? Because of some "acrossing tritone" principle?

[@christopherheckman7957]

(1) This video looks like it's useful in other contexts, e.g., you start with a few pitches where the melody has to be at certain times, and then "fill in" the gaps. (Although you might need a "scratch" CF in order to make it work.) (2) Mozart's counterpoint reminds me of Sisyphus, who had to push a rock up a steep hill, then it rolls all the way down, he pushes it up again, it comes crashing down again, etc. (3) Evidently, there is no 5:1 counterpoint, either because 4 is the maximum number of notes (in the CP) that can be played against a remembered note (in the CF), or because things get too complicated to list all of the possibilities. Do you know of anything that would make the counterpoint idea break down at 5:1?

[@ogorangeduck]

A lot of it has to do with the simple fact that the musical tradition which species counterpoint developed from sticks to duple and triple meters; quintuple meters aren't a part of this tradition.

[@yoavshati]

5:1 just wasn't a commonly used rhythm at that time, but 6:1 could be done

[@kazpfster]

After studying this 4:1, which video should we move for next step?

[@phillipbrandel7932]

Really good video. One question: does the double neighbor figure have to appear with the lower neighbor preceding the upper neighbor as in the example, or is [consonance -> upper neighbor -> lower neighbor -> consonance] also permissible?

[@JacobGran]

Great question. Definitely also permissible.

[@phillipbrandel7932]

@@JacobGran Got it. Thanks for the quick response!

[@AngeloDiLeonforte]

Thank you sir

[@TheyBenefit]

Concerning the double neighbor figure, I thought the effect of parallel octaves/5ths are not mitigated by the addition of 2 notes. Does this apply to neighbor tones?

[@armansrsa]

I don't get what the big deal is about the Nota Cambiata. The note B is a step away from the C and then it leaps to a G which is a 6th away from the CF. This leap is consonant so what is the problem with doing this? It is not like you are leaping to the B note or anything. Isn't it supposed that you are allowed to leap to a consonant interval in 3rd species?

[@JacobGran]

Right the issue is about dissonance resolution, not so much the leap or the way it’s introduced. The cambiata is the only dissonance type that Fux allows in gradus that does not resolve by step. One of the ways that our “strict” exercises maintain maximum predictability and voice leading smoothness is by resolving dissonances in controlled, predictable ways, and the stepwise resolution of passing tones, suspensions, and later neighbor notes is a big part of that.

[@armansrsa]

​@@JacobGran Ok Thank you for that information, very helpful :) I have another question for you please. When aiming for a "climax" or melodic peak in the counterpoint, are all notes in the scale contenders or do some scale degrees make better melodic peaks than others? For example, would the 5th of the scale be the best scale degree for a melodic peak?

[@JacobGran]

@@armansrsa the only scale degree that would make a poor melodic peak is ^7. Looking at the examples by Fux and others, the best high points tend to be (in no particular order) ^1, ^3, ^5, and ^6, probably because they are consonant with ^1.

[@armansrsa]

@@JacobGran Thank you

[@7James77]

In Fux's book, through 1:1-3:1 the use of having a consonance more than a unison in the first measure, when the C.F. is on top was not allowed. Yet, in the very first exercise in D, when the C.F. is in top, it shows a perfect consonance of an octave in the first measure for the first note. I have searched through the chapters to see where this has changed and have not seen any evidence of such except allowing a rest in the first measure when the C.F. is on the bottom. Am I just reading the exercise incorrectly and not finding the paragraph where he announces this rule change for 4:1? I notice you showing it this way as well in your video. 3:1 doesnt have a dedicated chapter, perhaps this is when the rule change takes place?

[@JacobGran]

Good question. When the C.F. is above, Fux allows the lower countermelody to begin either on a perfect unison or on a perfect octave, but not on a perfect fifth, since the fifth below ^1 is ^4, which would suggest a non-tonic harmony to begin the exercise. He explains this a little bit with Fig. 6 (pg. 31) of Alfred Mann's English translation. So the beginning on the lower octave here is not at all unusual.

[@7James77]

@@JacobGran I feel stupid for over reading that. Thank you for the prompt reply.

[@Tabu11211]

I really want to study outside of youtube ang google (school).. but should I? This is really good content but mentorship seems valuable.

[@Tabu11211]

@@shamanbeartwo3819 damn alright good to know, now I just have to get rich so I can go to school.

[@cooperlacey9990]

Who else clicked on this just because they saw Mozart

[@organman52]

Why do you use the term 'passing TONE' but not 'neighborING TONE?'

[@jeronimoandresaguirrecardo3985]

I may be wrong: passing is a verb, neighbor is not.

[@nicop8452]

do 5:1

[@hugoclarke3284]

No audio?