How To Do Modern Transformers Pretenders

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#Transformers #EntertainmentEarth

[@Ken-mj4rg]

I honestly think that they could do just fully articulated pretender shells in the RED line

[@Orniphus]

Hollow the back to slide a Prime Master in there.

[@jacliffh9221]

I think the problem with pretenders is that nowadays some of them are more iconic with their shells and others more with their inner robots. You’ve got fans of the g1 toys wanting to get a bomburst with a big gargoyle shell, fans of masterforce wanting to get a gold metalhawk jet with a tiny pretender shell, fans of the rotf toy, cyberverse and IDW wanting to get a bludgeon with no gimmicks at all, and the easiest way for hasbro to satisfy all is to do this fusion route, where they get to pick and choose elements to incorporate, so they get to release a stranglehold without scaring off kids.

[@adianolkonen8488]

The Siege/Kingdom Ultra Magnus design seems like a great start. I can see that as Thunderwing.

[@SwiftpawWolffox]

The style used for Iguanus and Bomb-Burst is almost perfect. Skullgrin is good too, in robot mode. But is also a good lesson how to not skimp on the alt mode details.

[@chriscarpenter3370]

nonnef and/or DNA design should make upgrades to make this better

[@CyberDragon10K]

I lost the inner G1 robot for my Skullgrin, so the big satanic goat headed monster is what I remember most. The new deluxe ticks that box nicely. Solid plastic weapons and stuff to fill out the alt. mode and robot mode gaps would be great though.

[@myroncaraway2313]

My mind immediately went to Siege/Earthrise/Kingdom Ultra Magnus, it's pretty much the exact same concept; a core figure with a shell made of several pieces of armor that you can attach, retaining the same articulation from the core figure.

[@cheesier5153]

Combiner wars magnus doesn’t have a core figure…

[@myroncaraway2313]

@@cheesier5153 My bad, I meant Siege

[@elrick44]

That's exactly what I was thinking,

[@cheesier5153]

@@MathewHaswell highly doubt that given their size, plus they don’t really work the same way, especially shockwave he just has some extra parts you slap on him, manus has several armor pieces, but the POTP leaders were basically massive suits that smaller figures would slot into

[@03kevinmatthew03]

There’s also POTP Optimus Prime. I’m surprised they didn’t capitalize on the engineering in that figure.

[@panelvixen]

I think the Power Master anime did the Prentender concept spot on. Robots that not only looked human, but were the same size as regular humans. When they left their shell they grew to giant robot size.

[@RedneckOgre9000]

You could say that several Arcce figures are Pretenders with a car as the Pretender shell and the robot folded up underneath.

[@brentsimard977]

zing! haha

[@TornaitSuperBird]

Honestly, Arcee shows one of the problems with Hasbro always trying to commit to G1 accuracy- her G1 model is difficult to translate to a figure without some level of parts forming due to her thin-ness. Simply put, they need to thiccen up Arcee nowadays.

[@thatonebritishidiot3037]

@@TornaitSuperBird or give her a different alt mode, a shelby cobra is my vote

[@TornaitSuperBird]

@@thatonebritishidiot3037 Same here.

[@tllgestalt1942]

@@TornaitSuperBird I mean, it's really a problem if you want G1 accuracy, but if you want a better transformers, yeah, she needs to change.

[@omegamaximus1727]

I got the Legacy Skullgrin recently and I love it .

[@KingofPotatoPeople]

I love pretenders. When I was a kid it was great to have them interact with my MOTU figures, which, especially when you look at the Pretender Beasts, it really looks like they were intended to do! I really want proper, updated, full on Pretenders. I use a prime armor with the Prime Master Liege Maximo on my Legacy Skullgrin to approximate the gimmick. It works quite well.

[@greggheist8762]

I think pretenders were transformers answer to motu.

[@dag1984]

Super Human Samurai Cyber Squad. Now that's a property I never thought I'd hear about again. Oddly enough that show got me into stuff like Ultraman and Gridman.

[@diegodankquixote-wry3242]

Legacy is the way to go. Also, fitting repaints work too like gen. Skullgrim. Still wish we would have gotten a stranglehold from Thrilling 30 Rhinox! Zardoz happens this year after all. Roadblock is awesome...

[@deltaknight2764]

I just want to see G1 Roadblock in action. I want to see just how much of an absolute demon he could be if the entire Decepticon army fears him.

[@wizofwonders]

I have an Idea story wise that somewhat makes sense pretender mini-cons. Mini-cons that have pretender shells that allow them to pass off as humans. The shells can either become weapons or armor for a normal sized transformer and then the mini-con links to the transformer giving them a boost of power or a unique ability. The mini-cons can also ride in the bigger transformer for transport and to serve as drivers so that most people don’t ask questions. Heck if really bold you could use this to replace the human characters of a cartoon show. The toys might be a bit harder to work in though a mini-con working with a power of the prime’s pretender shell that can plug into the transformer to activate certain features.

[@keilafleischbein59]

Just make pretenders be like more evolved maximals. Decepticon pretenders are humanoid flesh and metal monsters that turn into vehicles. For the autobots, flip it on it's head. Put a human microfigure in a mech suit like spike and Daniel's exo-suits

[@inazumanfrash]

I like inner robot Octopunch because crabs are cool and so are octopus diver monsters.

[@albertorodrigomolinasortiz471]

I have been thinking of the Prime evolution gimmick as a way to modernize pretenders since always. Probably because Thunderwing was an option for the fan vote that year.

[@chriswu772]

It's a shame that Thunderwing never won the vote! He would have made better use of the Prime Evolution gimmick than Optimal Optimus!

[@MonsterKidCory]

Honestly, I liked the Prime Masters or whatever they're called. Because the funnest thing about the Pretenders is that they have the little robot inside. Despite the Prime Masters being useless, they got the funnest part down! Plus, they were actually "human" sized finally!

[@wakeangel2001]

8:44 the weaponizers from RID 2015 had my favorite version of Strongarm (though I DID have to paint her to make her satisfying) though the energon armor wasn't all that satisfying, now my eyes lit up when I saw Drago/Phormo in this video, I still have my original Drago figure from when I was a kid on display right here on my main display shelf, I LOVE that thing.

[@XenotHedgehog]

I think the Beast Hunters line had some pretender-like concepts that could be further explored.

[@saimaidar9417]

My only complaint is what your describing is more armor than pretending to not be a Cybertronian.

[@shawnkarg3794]

I can see two ways to revisit this idea. Similar to what they are doing now, the shells are separate versions of the inner robot, which gets released as it's own unique toy that somehow got split from the shell. The other would be similar to the armor thing-the inner robot merges with the shell a la Ultra Magnus so it appears as a larger character. Think Omega Supreme if the tank was the inner Transformer, and then combined with the rest of the set to PRETEND TO BE a combiner or a guardian robot, or even a Titan.

[@TheCrabbyArchives]

I honestly liked the idea of the POTP Pretenders- it solves the scale nightmare the shells normally present. The titan masters could've turned into heads based on the inner robots or something, though.

[@Biodragon882]

I gotta say that i feel the Legacy/Bludgeon and Thunderwing way of doing it just feels better, mixing elements of the shells, as those are the most recognizable parts of the characters half the time, with the robot mode while they take to OG toys alt mode and adapt it. Granted some this might not work for all the human shells and a lot of the offshoot pretenders like the Megas and the Pretender Beasts, but those are bridges that can be based when or if every reached. Say like, make them just normal animal transformers like the Maximals and Predacons for the Beats, call em the 'battle beasts' or something since their animal modes are armed to the teeth. For those names that have been name shuffled around enough that they're not associated with the G1 characters anymore, i don't think they're in need of a new figure. Not many people think G1 Landmine, they think UT or Movie Landmine instead. I also feel some lend better to knewer alt modes like Octopunch, who has had a fair few designs based around that Hunt for the Decepticons Seaspray

[@pessie83]

1:31 The transformation gimmick of this figure is a nice reference to the Mega Pretenders.

[@omegamaximus1727]

Siege Ultra Magnus would be great inspiration for the Pretenders.

[@ORLY911]

Im glad Bludgeon is going to be a Voyager, at first i thought he'd just be a retool of skullgrin but looking at the listing leak it is indeed Voyager, someone suggested if hes not all new he'll be a retool of Tarn. Wonder how much of the ROTF toy will be homaged.

[@favorites8651]

I like this idea for a modernization, and I would like to expand upon the first idea you mentioned. Similar to your armor idea, I think the armor should work as a set of attachable pieces that work off of the interior robot. However, I think the armor should attach via siege ports the same way ultra magnus and shockwave did it. Using the siege ports as a method of adding armor makes the pretender armor much more modular. It would then have backwards comparability with the netflix trilogy figures and synergize with the play pattern of the weaponizer line they created. Additionally, this modular pretender armor could be marketed in as an evo fusion gimmick that is self-contained within a figure, and can be transferred to other figures currently coming out. That way, the pretenders can match what hasbro is currently doing with the evo fusion gimmick. Also, using the siege port system, the armor could have a second use taking on its own alt mode when not being used by its core robot. To keep costs down (cause hasbro always complains) I would be fine if the core robot was legends class and the armor increased the body size to a deluxe class.

[@christopherbravo1813]

your very first idea makes me think of Optimus Prime's Battle Mode in Robots in Disguise as well as both third-party versions of Nova Prime.

[@christopherbravo1813]

considering that size-aleration is confirmed to exist in Transformers-Soundwave being an *excellent* example of this-I think, in media at least, modern Pretenders could be super-realistic outer shells containing their VERY compressed true selves inside, which could themselves transform into full-sized robot and vehicle modes upon emerging from their shells.

[@dylancrossman8502]

Honestly, I think the way they’re doing it now is pretty great. The shells are what everybody remembers and the inner robots were pretty generic, so the current set up gets you the best of it. You lose the gimmick, but keep the design.

[@scottsummers5994]

I know it's not a pretender but I really like how they modeled RID (2001) Optimus Prime. The front of the fire truck was the base robot and the rest of the vehicle mode broke apart into armor for his super mode, just don't worry about the "base mode"

[@dragon1130]

Yeah. I loved that one. And RID (2001) Megatron was an amazing triple/quintple changer at the time even if some of his alts were ridiculous (one mode was a freaking hand)

[@scottsummers5994]

@@dragon1130 true Megatron was kinda odd but a solid build anyway. And even though ultra Magnus has an odd transformation, you can't deny the combined node was cool.

[@strikerevimus]

It had mixed results for Siege and Kingdom Ultra Magnus, and worked decently enough for Galaxy Upgrade Optimus Prime, but those were the figures I was thinking of when you mentioned the armor attaching idea. So they absolutely could do it with Pretenders and it'd work better. I do think Pretenders could be done for the Deluxe Class too, and make the vehicle for the inner robot actually look like something, getting back to the original idea of Classics a bit. Simplest way to do it is how the Botcon/Figure Subscription Service ape mold handled the Double Pretender Function more or less. But here you use Core Class figures for the inner robot, engineer them so their Pretender mode heads flip out for the shell but still transform into vehicle mode, and then put it in a fully functional shell. Like a kind of modernized Brainmaster if you will, but the shell has full articulation save for the waist. You could also make entirely new Pretender characters by integrating parts of the vehicle mode that can't be folded up reasonably, such as jet or bird wings and have them sticking out of the back of the shell. Still integrates and all of that jazz. Though given that the toy concept was to have action figures that disguised themselves as other toys, hence, Robots In Disguise, and while it was desperation, Pretenders were meant to look like the action figures of the day, hence why some could fit right into Masters of the Universe for example and only experts would know the difference. You kind of loose that charm by changing the Autobots to look like space marine robots... But, we could have a solution here... Face plates with a human face that can only be revealed while in shell mode if the owner so chooses. So you get the best of both worlds and gives you an option, and as Emgo loves to remind us, "Options are good." That would work across the entire line from Deluxe to Leader and a Titan or two, as for Core Class... Well, unless we're willing to have tiny versions of original style pretenders at that size, it'd be best to keep it mostly to the miscellaneous collection of desk sized Transformers it is today. Though in terms of lore, and I don't know if the original comics used it, but part of the lore was that the outer shell could still function without the inner robot in it, effectively giving the transformer a way to basically be in two places at once as an advantage. So while your idea would work, and fit into current lore, same with mine for Deluxe Class, we do lose the interesting lore that no fiction has ever tried to tackle. How does it work? What effects does having your consciousness divided between two bodies have? Does the inner robot feel the pain their outer shell feels? Does it work the other way? Anyways, that's my solution for the Deluxe class, and super cheap relatively speaking with minimal articulation loss to both the inner robot and outer shell. I'm willing to surrender elbows, ankles and wrists for the inner robot as long as it has ball jointed shoulders and to lose the waist for the outer shell and maybe its ankles too. The entire franchise got along pretty well with a lack of wrists, ankles and waists for a long time, it can do so again for just the years of having Pretenders at Deluxe Class if it has to.

[@ToaBastignika]

Another examples could be Siege Ultra Magnus and Galaxy Upgrade Optimus. Something cool they can do is mix the armor pieces between the toys. There's also the Zi-O Rider Armor toys, I like how the armor in these can stand and articulate by itself

[@flameflamedramonva]

Personally, I prefer what Hasbro has been doing, a combination between core robot and shell. My idea for his sort of concept would make it so not everyone would need this aspect: The Core Gundam from Gundam Build Divers: ReRise would be a way of looking at it from where I am coming from: You get the mainline release where its a combination between robot and shell and then an online retailer exclusive would be model kits with some assembled parts. You'd get a Robot head and then runners to which would form armor that would clip onto the existing figure a way to do it cheaply in a way that doesn't over extend the budget. The shell idea as a whole is something I am meh on, but it would work way better for autobot pretenders so you don't have the stupid human aspects muddy up the design

[@toysmostwanted]

My take would be a merger of the Pretender gimmick and Visionaries. Large 7 or 6 inch articulated action figures in the style of the Visionaries armor with hollow torsos that has enough space for a Core Class Transformer. The holo sticker on the action figures chest plate will be of the core figure's alt-mode and it opens up so you could eject the core figure mimicking how the Visionaries would transform into their animal forms in the show. Would also be a good explainer why these pretenders come out of their shell in alt-mode instead of robot mode and having a compact alt mode only occupying the torso means unhindered arm and leg articulation for the shell.

[@Patolagos]

For the human pretenders, I imagine they could make something similar to Mega Construx's micro action figures. Those are pretty much GI Joe ripoffs, but in minifigure scale, which is perfect for Transformers. Or they could just go the "They're giant humans from another planet" route, and make them armor for the robots.

[@cybersilver5816]

It is completely unreasonable, but I would love for pretenders to have synergy with Hasbro's other 6inch figure lines

[@juanpablogutierrezduenas5127]

these legacy pretenders should have had a beast wars-esque mutant masks

[@Evaunit98]

I do quite like the Rotf Bludgeon, I've never liked the head but think it's a solid figure

[@masterfarr8265]

If they were to do G1 Gunrunner (one of the pretender vehicles) I could see him being a repaint of the Siege Tetrajet.

[@williamwoxblom8417]

You're literally just describing Siege Ultra Magnus and yes, I agree that it would be the best way to go forwards with the concept.

[@jasonschneider7224]

Hasbro's current take on Pretenders would be fine if it weren't for the fact that they don't accomplish their aim particularly well (they need less cheaty vehicle modes, and a more distinct "transmetal" style differentiation between mechanical and organic parts between modes). Nonetheless I like a LOT of your ideas! I couldn't help but wonder: what if you flipped the script a bit and made the *inner* portion appear organic? Say have the Space Marine or Alien Monster be the core unit, and have the robotic head, joints, and critical connection points fold out of that, and have their vehicle transform into the rest of the Robot? Imagine something a bit like the Cyclone armor from Robotech. Then the "human" form (for example) could not only could scale and proportion better to an actual human but function as a part of the vehicles disguise by being the pilot/driver. Having a few concealed flip out weapons, rocket packs, or things of that sort could add a bit of play value to the inner figure too giving it both a fully organic and Cyborg like form before combining. Heh, Bludgeon could be this undead Samurai warrior with what looks like a steampunk mini-tank or cannon emplacement and have it combine into something that resembles the original inner robot with a bit more of the skull theme included. I think this kind of thing could be fun, take care of some of the mass shifting inconsistencies, and add a bit of a twist to the original concept.

[@walterlopez5054]

I've been workshopping a similar idea for a couple years now (pretty much since weaponizers were introduced in siege) All of our pretenders begin as core class figures with their nonsense alt modes. Each on also can be folded up into a cuboid torso for the shell. Like a Mugenbine. Deluxe class is standard pretenders like Longtooth and Bludgeon. Core body, with weaponizer limbs that can form little partner drones or battlestations. Voyager class is our Vehicle shell and Mega Pretenders. These guys are are still the core. The shells meanwhile are fully functional transformers, but simple and hollow, like a Cyber Battalion toy. Leaders are our Ultra Pretenders Pretty much the same as the voyagers, but with an additional vehicle shell with a partscount similar to er Optimus's trailer. (No idea what id do with actual core class here, or the commander/titans) Added bonus, some of the vehicle shells and weaponizer limbs could maybe be re-used for Action Master partners later on

[@michaelpapp5518]

I was thinking for modern pretenders, have a deluxe or Voyager sized outer shell, with good articulation. Then a smaller bot, legends scaled, maybe. One that functions as a perfectly good toy at that size, but also folds up enough to fit in the shell’s torso. Maybe make the inner bot modular like a weaponizer. Have the parts tuck into cavities in the shell’s limbs and torso. Like, the leg pieces get stored in the shell’s leg. The head, hips, and torso fold up and go into the shell’s torso. The arms would then slot into the outer arms. Maybe make it a leader sized outer shell. The robot could be voyager or deluxe.

[@JRJohnson1701]

Redo the robots with modern articulation. Then, transform them into little boxes/cubes that fit into a more articulated shell

[@Jazzer995]

The only problem with trying to make the Pretender Shell, core robot and Alt mode three seperate component is that you might end up with a compromise like other figures with three modes, take Ultra Magnus, Shockwave, Blitzwing and Astrotrain for example; Ultra Magnus - hands exposed; Shockwave - combine mode look ridiculous; Astrotrain - the shuttle mode aft section; Blitzwing - the jet mode. Springer is the only one of these with three modes with no compromise and that's because honestly there is not much difference between helicopter and car modes. And having the Pretender shells on their own just gives us the issue that I (and maybe others) have with the current Optimus and Rodimus; an empty hunk of plastic that preys on G1 nostalgia to double the price point. I was around when G1 started, I still have my original Optimus and Soundwave (both look like they have gone through the G2 comics) and my first proper introduction to Bludgeon was the Stormbringer comic and that ROTF figure you showed, I was really lucky to track one down and it started me on my paint fixing craze (those swords were horrendously coloured and I could not find the upgrade kit), had I not, even with my limited money, would have bought the 3rd Party Susanoo, because that just made Bludgeon look ****ing awesome, and I hope the upcoming Legacy figure is just as good (I also have all of the Legacy Pretenders so far and love all of them).

[@MikeD974]

I like the way they doing the new pretenders and don't mind them being different sizes but wished bombburst was bigger so he could hold his powermaster figure as a weapon . I never liked the orginal pretenders with the shells glad they not doing them like that

[@powerrangerkid16]

2 words: Mugen Bine Use the concept that worked from that for the shell and the core robot becomes the 'mugenroid' type of robot

[@blue18404]

The original inner robot Pretenders were excellent

[@jst082]

I was personally a big fan of the titan master shells.

[@myang12003]

What if they did the monster pretender combiner in legacy? Would the members just be a monster that transforms into another monster?

[@thatonebritishidiot3037]

personally I'd do the shells as deluxe at minimum, then do the inner robots as core class, give them the same alt modes as each other so you can preserve the colours of both the shell and the inner robot I think that'd be neat

[@TheZamaron]

I LOVE Pretenders, I think they're a cool gimmick for the time and though the gimmick is largely forgotten, some of the characters have stuck around and gone on to their own legacies, such as Bludgeon being redesighned still keeping the Samurai asthetic and tank mode to him. THe problem with Pretenders though is the engineering. The OG toys were pretty simple, an often skinny robot that transformed, and from their they crafted essentially a casing you could put the bot in, with articulation limited to the arms. Worked for the time, but not today. THis shows how hard it is as Botcon had a figure where a small redeco of a Swerve would simply be put into a htch on a larger figure. Or the Prime Masters, which simply reused the engineering of the G1 toys but on a smaller scale, the shell being able to become a weapon while the Prime Master inside could plug into certain parts of a figure or the shell it's self. Just the problem with these guys is trying to make a functional shell while not limiting the figures articulation back to the 80's. Maybe one thing they could do is make it so that the bot has a skinny bot mode, simple transformation, and the shell is desighned that it could be articulated on it's own, or you pull it apart and put it on the body of the bot like battle armor. THen there's the fiction side. The best use I can think of for Pretenders is this: The bots are weaker then most Transformers, they can fight generally in 2 ways. Either have the bot and shell be seperate where the shell is ai driven and not too smart, but can give you a little extra on numbers. More guns essentially, and the bot is versatile with their alt mode. But they can equip the shell like battle armor with the shell being very durable, and with the bot making use of it, it becomes more effective tactically, and now powered by the bot's own spark or power source, the weapons, speed and strength becomes greater then them seperate, but they sacrifice versatility for this, and maybe it's not very quick to equip the shell. Also some shells could have their own special capabilities or fighting styles and weapons. Essentially seperate you have more versailty, but you're weaker and have a dimwitted but decent partner watching your back, but equip the shell and you're stronger, faster, more firepower, but not as versatile in tactics like switching modes.

[@thenuclearsandwich]

It's too bad we don't get any retro releases of the pretenders. If they can rerelease shelf warmer Retrax then there is no reason that can't do any old pretenders.

[@tsunami1986]

The Pretenders I really like are the 6 Decepticons Bomb-Burst, Finback, Iguanus, Skullgrin, Bugly & Submarauder. I used to have them all. I don't like the new ones because of the size differences. I want those 6 in voyager scale. Voyager is about the same size as the original shells.

[@Nausicaafan-go6lq]

You basically got my idea spot on with your first one. We just got off of the WFC trilogy, and they forget the perfect opportunity that they had JUST USED that could've made it work. Hasbro was making high quality laziness with Legacy year 1, but at least they still listen to their fans. Perhaps they'll listen to you... Legacy Metalhawk is right around the corner, and they stated in the livestreams that fans wanted the shells back...

[@ShokoArc]

A weaponizer with a core class rider, that sounds pretty darn cool

[@labyrinth6549]

I have always wanted something like you mentioned for Pretenders, the way Legacy Motormaster works is a way I'd like to see it done. Also you said Animated came after ROTF but It's the other way around, since ROTF is what killed Animated early. The style of Bludgeon for example is I think more so meant to be able to fit in with the 2010 Generations figures as that's when they started that line off, same for characters like Lockdown. It's as though the designers were told to keep them movie like enough, but to simplify it down for Generations.

[@fishpop]

The idea of a dude you put armor onto reminds me of some Power Rangers toys that did the same.

[@mctankies]

Here's to hoping they make a Legacy Thunderwing.

[@VZMkII]

Look up a toy line from Takara in 1991 called Metal Jack.That’s exactly what you’re looking for as Neo Pretenders are concerned. I could only see them doing three price points though. $30, $50 and $100.

[@darianalexander5503]

We all know the original pretenders were produced to compete with other action figure lines of the time. Today, they seem odd because the concept was for another kind of market that doesn't exist anymore. I wouldn't complain if Hasbro completely ditched these kinds of figures.

[@zoltanperei4789]

There was a kickstarter 3rd party project to bring back the pretenders, but hasbro shuted it down before the start.

[@beardedmegatron5816]

So Siege Magnus? Or exso suits like the POTP leaders?

[@werlynakadera1944]

I prefer titans return on steroids. Targetmaster Prime-master pretender shells housing a headmaster for a inner-robot transector. I have a spare TR Blurr I intend to turn into a Submarauder and I might extend this idea to other figures. Hell, Hasbro already did it with Boxset Metalhawk!

[@damonselman636]

I favor having transformable shells myself. Also thought about how to do the tech specs, comic/cartoon character aspect, have the Transformers have different abilities. For example with Bludgeon, have his inner robot be a bruiser and an RPG "tank" while in "Samurai Skeleton outer shell" have him be a glass cannon with tremendous stealth capabilities (cloaking device?).

[@TFGourmet]

YES!!!!! YES!!!!! YES!!!!! YES!!!!! THATS A GOLD IDEA!!!!!, TAKE MY MONEY NOW!!!!

[@greggheist8762]

I would look at Soundwave/Blaster. Instead of cassettes tape robots the inner robot is triple change; robot, alt mode and predator mode. In predator mode they enter a larger transformer transtector shell (which has its only transforming abilities).

[@elpizo1789]

If they did went with armor pieces, then the system should be modular, so that we could swap armors between figures. Maybe a system similiar to Kamen Rider Gaim for the chest/helmet piece. I think the Clones could work as a basis for the core figures. Or heck, just go Mugenbine. As for the Autobot Pretenders, I would take inspiration from IDW and made the shells look like armored space suits, visors and all.

[@sda9650]

🤘🤖🤘 i agree

[@Saturnlock]

I personally really like the idea of fusing the pretender and its shell. My sort of head canon is that Shockwave made Iguanas and Bomb-Burst as experiments with the goal of creating the next evolution of the cybertronian race. He basically fused alien DNA with defective Cybertronian protoforms, turning them into the small, freaky core pretenders. And Jhiaxus perfected the experiment later on and made Skullgrin. With monumentally more success.

[@DragonxFlutter]

Ideas sound great! They sound too expensive for cheap-out Hasbruh, but they still sound great!

[@decepticonleadermegatron5239]

I always thought that the shell could have a hollow torso that the robot folds into so that the limbs could be pose-able

[@jlashombjr]

Thought that Deluxe Skullgrin was going to have room in its chest for a future core Skullgrin figure. I was hoping that each core pretender would get a deluxe or bigger sized figure that would act as its shell.

[@Loremastrful]

I'm half and half on this one. I appreciate Hasbro recreating the entire G1 line. But many toward the end like Pretenders, Action Masters and the like were just gimmick and no play. With Pretenders you had an outer shell with no articulation and not in scale with other transformers before. And the inner robot was mostly a skeleton that transformed into a shape and they'd call that shape a car, a plane, what have you. During Power of the Prime, I spun out this entire tale for the Pretenders. The Primes were being hunted down. To hide from their pursuers they split themselves up. Their knowledge and personality formed the Prime Master (that little robot), but their power stayed in a matrix called the Prime Core. They hide in a variety of worlds and sometimes the Core or the Master might cause problems and attract the attention of the Autobots, Decepticons or the Hunters. Since multiversal crossovers were in vogue, they often inhabited world of other Hasbro property. An example would be Vector Prime who controls time. His core and master land in Valoria, the world of the Dino-Riders. The Rulons use the core to open time windows to pull dinosaurs from their past to use as battle platforms in their war. Inhumanoids, Centurions, Visionaries, Jem even My Little Pony, everything was on the table. And the Prime Hunters were mostly the toys I picked up during the Hunt for the Decepticon line.

[@bobaphatt6977]

Unrelated but does anybody have any feedback.... I just ordered a Jinbao Hercules G1 Devestator KO, anybody have any knowledge of what I can expect as far as quality or anything else?

[@haydenreviewscustomcombos]

Also, Hasbro should be taking notes for a potential ZAP thunder megazord.

[@SonsOfLore]

How about taking the POTP Evolution Optimus, Optimal, Rodimus, scale it down to deluxe, or leader class, and use core class from the Earthrise/Kingdom lines?

[@chriscarpenter3370]

"pretending to be pretenders" this couldn't be more true lol

[@skybite]

I would have the Legacy “Pretenders” as Tarantulas’ experiments.

[@ZZtheDark]

9:30, I was thinking the same thing like Saint Seiya. 11:40, Phormo and Drago from Superhuman Samurai Syber-Squad. The only thing I can think of with robots wearing armor is Super Live Robo: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jYCQYntsgLWCgdk Having Pretenders do this reminded me of Saint Seiya since when Liveman was out, this anime was popular which was why Super Live Robo was a big deal. 12:10, parts-forming done right. 12:50, what they hey?!! 0.0 I imagine Double Pretenders would be a Commander Class.

[@DelrueMadden]

52Toys has a new line called Beast Drive that is similar to this concept but a little different. Haven't bought any of the figures myself yet.

[@mayoral_fabrication]

Do you know Saint seiya? Armors that assemble into shape of zodiac signs Yep That idea is not new But want to see it in transformers

[@kelynandrasko9888]

So like a beefed up spark armor concept from cyberverse?

[@SuperOmega53]

I’ve been enjoying the new pretender but that’s mainly because they are so different from the norm we’ve been having Got to admit that 2nd idea sounds cool but really expensive

[@windsweeper8002]

I'm not a fan of the Legacy Pretenders. I never liked the trend of basing the robot mode on the shell. I'd be happy with updates of the inner robots like Titans Return Metalhawk. A different Titanmaster on Nautica and she'd have been perfect as inner robot Submarauder. The Primemasters were a step back to me. I wish they kept them as Titanmasters that were based on the inner robot heads. At least you could find a suitable robot body then such as Quake for Skullgrin or Triggerhappy for Bombburst. My ideal Pretender update would be Titans Return Metalhawk with his Power of the Primes shell resculpted to accommodate the Titanmaster. No Primemaster with the useless glyph. Otherwise, something akin to the mutant heads from Beast Wars. I liked how Legacy Inferno’s ant head envelopes the robot head as a helmet and given the size of Skullgrin's beast head, I think they could easily have had his inner robot head inside. At least the Primemaster shells looked robotic. The Legacy Pretender heads are too jarringly organic looking.

[@ShadrackMeduson]

as long as they dont do what michael bay did with the pretenders in revenge of the fallen.

[@RialVestro]

The main issue I've always had with Pretenders is they never look or feel like Transformers. The shells always felt like they were intended for an entirely different toy line and they just got random Transforming figures that fit inside of them. It doesn't feel like they're intentionally designed to go together. Even when they're redesigned without the Pretender shells making the robots look like the shell rather than the robot has the same issue that they don't look like Transformers. The problem is that the shells are designed with organic elements and then they transform into vehicles. It's very off putting to see a human face randomly on a robot with vehicle kibble hanging off of them. The way I would fix this issue is if you're going to have them transform into vehicles then the robot needs to actually look like the robot not the shell. If you're going to make something that looks like the shell than have them transform into something that makes those organic parts on them make sense. With the Decepticons Bomb-Burst could actually transform into a bat, Submarrauder could transform into a shark. Having them like Beast Wars figures would make that make so much more sense. I could also see incorperating some of your ideas where you have an inner robot that transforms into a vehicle and can combine with the Pretender shell as either armor for the robot that looks like the original pretender shell or a second alternate mode making them both Pretenders and tripple changers. Of course this would mean that the Autobots would just transform into humans which actually leads to another issue I have with Pretenders. The idea that a full sized robot is suppose to hide inside of a human sized shell... that feels like it should be the other way around. Like why are they smaller with the shell than without? Japan actually took the pretender concept and reversed it for some characters so they are humans who become Transformers rather than Transformers who disguise themselves as humans. So maybe the Autobot pretenders could reverse things so that the robot is actually the shell and the shell is the inner human figure. The human figures could just wear armor that connects to the larger robots. I think that actually makes them make a lot more sense when you reverse it than when the giant alien robots are suppose to hide inside of tiny human shells.

[@RialVestro]

BTW, I always thought the point of Transformers in the first place was basically that they are 3 toys for the price of one. A vehicle or beast, an action figure robot, and a puzzle if you're like me and don't look at the instructions. So having a pretender shell as a second action figure doesn't really come across to me as a second toy, more so just left over parts I can't do anything with. Because of the way pretenders work they actually have less articulation than the inner robots do so they aren't even decent action figures. It's just a poorly tought out and executed gimmick that never really worked. I had a Pretender Bumblebee as a kid which was a K-Mart exclusive that came without the Pretender shell and I never even knew it was missing anything. I feel like order for Pretenders to work they need to actually be integrated as part of the Transformer and not just a random shell.

[@haydenreviewscustomcombos]

Well, this probably won’t affect me, since I’m already in “The Omegadome”

[@goemonbeatsnaruto]

only pretender I had is bumblebee he do transforms in the more show accurate bmw that his minibot toy, his shell might be reference to spike since they are bff

[@JoseFlores-xc7wu]

The best way to bring back Pretenders is easy they already got the inside robot part down i got two word for you Weaponizers Technology is perfect for the Pretender line all they need is to modernizes the Pretender shell give it some extra points of articulation and give it a better sculpture and you get a modern Pretender to me Hasbro gave up to early on the Weaponizer technology there is so much that you can do with that technology they even use it on SS 86 Kup so there is other things that you can do with that technology and to me putting together with the Pretender shell make perfect sense

[@KibbloMkII]

for the articulated shell, I was reminded of this three tiered robot called Baikanfu I think. Has one core robot that can go inside the larger shell robot, and then that can go inside an even larger shell robot, its a pretty cool gimmick and each robot is highly articulated

[@bakuraver5512]

I always loved the pretender concept unfortunately the only one I ever obtained, was the bear one.forgot his name,I thought it was a great figure despite the shell had no articulation.the in'er robot was simplistic, I thought they were awesome.and wish they Would go back and give us all the old molds I would buy em.And correct me if I'm wrong, but didn't they go back and forth with the basic idea. first they said the shell's had no mind of their own and where remote controlled. then they did have a mind of their own but could be stopped, if they went beyond the in'er robots commands this always had me confused.

[@IonStudios96]

I prefer the way Hasbro has been handling the pretenders they just need some more experience with it

[@whelpd]

Strange this was the same idea my brother and i came up with

[@tyjohnson7616]

I prefer the new concept were the robot is the shell and the altmode is the altmode

[@maskedriderweaver4122]

I actually like the direction of the Legacy Pretender characters, but I think they need a lot of work. I think your ideas have merit, but really would have to see more development. I have to disagree about the two for one gimmick not being cool. I always thought that was in interesting component and perhaps an integral part of the Pretenders concept.

[@nykomedes]

I like the idea of the primemasters, the only thing im not liking is the articulation of them

[@audiobrainiac]

Great concept TJ! I’d buy it.

[@KamisamanoOtaku]

How about we do what Pretenders should* have been the whole time? *Have a human **_inside_** the Transformer!* From both a toy and a storytelling standpoint, doesn't that seem like as good or a better idea? Humans _pretending_ to be Cybertronians via a transforming exo-suit. If you still want Cybertronians pretending to be humans *no worries!* You still have a human toy inside of your Transformer toy, it is just the in-story explanation is that the human figure is a remote control drone for the Transformer in question. *How would the toys actually work?* Remember ye olde G.I. Joe: A Real American Hero toys? Dunno about the modern ones, but the old ones had a big main screw in their back that left a hole Hasbro took advantage of for backpacks (and some vehicles) to plug into to hold the character. Now we just claim its a cybernetic socket built into the human's nervous center; the human plugs into their Cybertronian shell there... or, again, if we still want Cybertronians pretending to be humans, that's just where the human drone plugs into the Cybertronian. Basically, the Cybertronian bit would need to be big enough for such a toy to ride in, and (as a robot) enough room for the human toy to be inside the torso. Though if we're going for the original Transformer-pretending-to-be-human concept, then you can plug them in anywhere out-of-the-way in Robot Mode, like you would any other drone. If G.I. Joe: A Real American Hero humans are too big, scale them down to the desired size for the pilots. "Monster" characters may be more awkward, as they should probably be sized and shaped similar to the human characters, but I think that's doable for most of them (maybe all). Yeah, TJ's ideas are better, but I've been wondering about this for decades (not since the originals, but probably since the late 90s or early 00s) so I'm attached to it. _*Yes, this is just my opinion, but does it really make less sense than the reality?_

[@TornaitSuperBird]

This is basically modern Diaclone with extra steps, though.

[@twistedgaming9185]

@@TornaitSuperBird Diaclone exists because of G.I. Joe.

[@ironclaw3000user]

Simplified core class Star Saber in Voyager price as a Pretender

[@TMNTransformerz]

Leader class figures

[@TMNTransformerz]

I just think a leader class skullgrin would be awesome