How To Do Precision Center Punching To Toolmaker & Instrument Makers Standards As Taught In 1960

[@CandidZulu]

Thanks for sharing this. I've figured out most of this myself over the years the hard way. These basics are very important!

[@daveticehurst4191]

Glad it was helpful Robert. Thanks for watching it. Regards.

[@MrCrispinEnterprises]

Very similar to how we were shown at RR in the training school on the fitting and filing section. Good job!

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi Crispin, Glad you liked it and approved that it met your RR Training standards. Regards.

[@andrewdolinskiatcarpathian]

Knowing how to “layout” properly should be a prerequisite. Excellent explanations. Thank you Dave 👏👏👍😀 Andrew

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi Andrew Glad it was helpful. Thanks for the view. Regards.

[@tonywilson4713]

Just so you know I am here because Andrew Whale pointed out your channel. I love the old school techniques. I am an engineer and work in control systems and automation. Despite what I do for a living I honestly believe that we are over emphasising and over relying on technology. There's a channel NYC CNC and among their vids are factory/workshop tours. A while back they visited Hermle (in Germany) who make some of the most glorious 5-axis machining centers available. Part of that tour included Hermle's training center where they teach their own apprentices. On one side of the room there's old school with zero modern technology and on the other side of the room is the most advanced CNC on the planet. They all start on old school machines and as they learn they are taught to transfer those skills onto the CNC. You see the Germans know that no matter how much computer power you have the basics of machining still apply.

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi Tony, Thanks for the view and your excellent comment. You are quite right, should every computer chip in the World fail, you could still get by with the Old Knowledge and manual machines and if need be hand work. Regards.

[@tonywilson4713]

@@daveticehurst4191 That's exactly the point I keep trying to tell people - basics matter. I'm actually an aerospace engineer. I have spent most of the last 20 years working in the mining sector because at one stage we really looked like going to the moon to mine it for a very rare form of Helium to use in power stations. The main reason we haven't been back to the moon for helium or just build a base is that its just too expensive to fly everything there. We have to be able to extract raw materials up there and make stuff from it. So basic smelting, casting and machining is ESSENTIAL. The problem is the only people left who talk about the basics of smelting, casting and machining are people like you (from professional backgrounds) and the hobbyist community. And yes, anytime I try and raise this with other aerospace people their brains melt.

[@pgs8597]

G'day Dave. Your tip brought back memories from 50 years ago as an apprentice motor mechanic. Stay well cheers. Peter

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi Peter, Happy Memories I hope. Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@mathshopeful]

Thanks Mate I was apprenticed to my Toolmaker father in the 70's and thats how we marked out out die work. He was a apprentice in the late 1930's

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hello and thank you for watching and your comment, much appreciated. Regards.

[@DudleyToolwright]

Another video well explained. Thanks.

[@daveticehurst4191]

Glad you liked it! Thanks for watching. Best Wishes.

[@michaelmurray9154]

You really covered the subtleties of precision center punching. I've often thought this would make a good video. Occasionally, though rarely I still need to produce holes that line up on two different details and transfer or machine locating is not practical. I fall back to my early training which you so aptly demonstrated. I'm certain many of your viewers will benefit from your video. Good job Dave. Stay well my friend, Mike

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi Mike, sorry I beat you to making this video LOL Don't put off until tomorrow what you should be doing today. I mainly made it as I see such bad center punching shown on YT, no accuracy or finesse at times. It's a wonder that some of the parts ever fit together. Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@joevostoch8768]

That was the best explanation for precision center punching I have seen! Great job!

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hello Joe, thanks for watching and your excellent comment. Glad to be of help to you. Regards.

[@dermotkelly2971]

Great videos. That form of marking out was all I ever did really. No DROs,s in our maintenance shop lol

[@daveticehurst4191]

Right on Dermot, you really can not fault the "Old Ways " of doing things. Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@brucewilliams6292]

These tips and tricks are important to pass on. Sometimes you are in the "field" and need to accurately place a hole and knowing how they did it before DROs is very useful. Thank you for spending the time to pass this knowledge on! :)

[@daveticehurst4191]

Very true Bruce, old technology is still needed. Thanks for watching and your comment. Regards.

[@practicemakesbetter7132]

Thanks for the demonstration and sharing your knowledge.😀

[@daveticehurst4191]

My pleasure I hope you found it useful. Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@ianbertenshaw4350]

Great video Dave ! The main thing I see a lot is when someone goes to the trouble to mark out correctly then thump a giant divot with a big punch and a lump hammer. I have a little Starrett auto punch ( about 3 inches long) that I can actuate with nothing much more than reasonable finger pressure , I then use a small Starrett manual punch to finish it off. I do have a bigger auto punch ( from Hare and Forbes ) but this thing needs a lot of force to actuate it . It is great for doing witness marks ( idiot marks ) that I use for oxy cutting as it has a big rubber mushroom head that I can thump with my hand to actuate it so no need for a hammer ! Another technique that you could show is how to break an edge on a part without butchering it with a file , Sometimes you want that crisp but not razor sharp edge . I have seen precision ground stones used for this ( nice if you have them) but was wondering how it was done in the past .

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi Ian, thanks for the view and your comment. I will shortly upload a video about machining a 6 sided block and how to get the 5 th side square without using any tools or gauges. To achieve this I need a machined edge but with no edge radius, so I will be showing how I do this. The best way to get no burr on an edge is to always run the cutter so that it cuts INTO the part, thus not throwing outwards a nasty burr. Stay tuned. Regards.

[@davidjames1007]

Thanks for reminding me the importance of doing things properly

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hello David. Thanks for watching, hope you found it useful. Regards.

[@mchiodox69]

Awesome technique....I learned something useful that I will now use all the time.

[@daveticehurst4191]

Great to hear. Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@pauln1557]

Hi Dave thanks for sharing. I didn't know the tip about filing off the unequal raised rim around the punched hole, it makes good sense if you want good accuracy. I need to check out your other videos to see other gems about setting out of work. Regards Paul in NZ

[@daveticehurst4191]

Glad to help Paul. The accurate scribing video may be of help to you. Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@duckslayer11000]

Outstanding. I would have loved to work next to you.

[@daveticehurst4191]

Thanks for watching. There are a few other videos that may be of a practical use to you. Regards.

[@Ujeb08]

Good stuff Dave. The filing of the displaced material after "walking the punch" (moving the indentation) is good to know. I would add that if you need fairly close tolerance of the hole positions, I like to use a Magnavisor during the whole process. It's a set of magnifiers worn on both eyes at about 7x power. That way you don't risk losing your position while fiddling for a loupe or magnifying glass or even the hammer. Thanks for sharing

[@daveticehurst4191]

Thanks for watching and your comment. Yes you can use magnification for checking it has not moved. I have changed over to a different style of head magnifier. Head fitted but it has the lens hanging down in front, and you can lookover the top for normal vision when selecting tools. Super tool. Here is the link. visionaidmagnifier.com/products/visionaid%E2%84%A2-magnifying-glasses-with-led-light?currency=AUD Also look alikes sold on Amazon and Ebay. Regards.

[@EitriBrokkr]

I always learn something from your videos

[@daveticehurst4191]

Glad to hear it. Appreciate your time watching and commenting. Thank You. Regards.

[@teoperez6930]

Very useful. Thanks for sharing your knowledge.

[@daveticehurst4191]

My pleasure. Glad you enjoyed it. Hope it will help you out. Regards.

[@TheKnacklersWorkshop]

Excellent video Dave... it should help many viewers...

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi Paul, thanks for watching. I made it as I had seen such terrible center punching on other channels, thought it was about time they were shown the correct way. Regards.

[@JohnsOrganWorks]

Thanks for that. I've never thought of filing off the burr, but it makes a lot of sense.

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hello John, thanks for watching and I now hope that your center punching will turn out much better. Regards.

[@robstirling3173]

👍Masterclass!

[@daveticehurst4191]

Thanks Rob, so glad you liked it. Regards.

[@stephenbrown1143]

Your videos are great Dave, basic knowledge but with all the fine detail covered. Thank you.

[@daveticehurst4191]

You are very welcome Stephen, so glad you are enjoying them so much. More in the pipeline. Stay tuned. Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@timmartin8987]

Very helpful! Thank you

[@daveticehurst4191]

Glad it was helpful Tim. Thanks for watching. Merry Xmas.

[@malachilandis9542]

Great video! I like that you mention DROs not being invented yet in the 1960s. I will be starting at Northwestern's mechanical engineering PhD program studying metal 3D printing. It's amazing to think about the pace of progress in this field of machining metal parts, from hammer and cold chisel to CNC machining centers. Good to see videos from experienced machinists like yourself to preserve not just the knowledge of your day, but the perspective that came with it.

[@daveticehurst4191]

Good luck Malachi in your studies. Thanks for watching and this comment, very much appreciated. Regards.

[@johnwilleford7715]

Good information!

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hello John, Thanks for watching, so glad you found it useful. Regards.

[@russelldold4827]

Great! All the finer points (pun intended) taught in a good apprenticeship. Keep going, Dave.

[@daveticehurst4191]

Thanks, will do Russell, more to come. Regards

[@philhermetic]

Brilliant video on the foundations of accuracy! Thank you Dave! Phil Whitley

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hello Phil, Glad it was helpful and you can now put it into practice. Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@stringmanipulator]

very good tip thank you very much

[@daveticehurst4191]

You are welcome. Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@imysteryman]

Thanks for sharing

[@daveticehurst4191]

My pleasure, glad you found it interesting. Regards.

[@pweimer47]

Great tutorial. I never seen that technique. I have quite a lot missed the mark. Thanks again for sharing!

[@daveticehurst4191]

Glad it was helpful. Thanks for watching. Regards

[@tano1747]

Great info. Thanks for sharing from your experience

[@daveticehurst4191]

My pleasure. Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@philiprogers5772]

Will you do a video showing how to get your scribing block to exactly the right height?

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi Philip, thanks for the view and question. Yes will do, just need to clear bench space again to get my surface plate useable. Regards.

[@MrFactotum]

eyup Dave old school is the best👍👍 kev uk

[@daveticehurst4191]

You are dead right there Kev. Regards.

[@Randysshop]

Hi Dave Very good explanation of marking a part. I have had the problem before when marking a part that the lay out dye has come off. Cheers

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi Randy, glad that I could help you. Others on KZbin have complained that you Dyechem falls off easily at times. Now probably made in China. LOL thanks for watching. Regards.

[@ronkellis769]

Thank you very much. Passing on the lessons. The uneven raised metal made perfect sense as soon as you pointed it out. "Blinding flash of the obvious." in my former profession. In retrospect I'm sure that has bit me several times. Any disadvantages to using a stone?

[@daveticehurst4191]

Glad it was helpful Ron, by all means use an oilstone, but I tend to use them on hard materials. If you use a stone on brass or aluminium the pores in the stone will easily clog up. Better option if you don't have a fine file, is a bit of 400 or 600 wet and dry on a parallel or similar flat stock. Thanks for watching and your question. Regards.

[@robertwalker7457]

Very useful thanks mate.

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi Robert, Glad it helped. Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@robertwalker7457]

@@daveticehurst4191 Mate, do you make the copper sulphate solution, if so how please?

[@daveticehurst4191]

@@robertwalker7457 Hello Robert, I have not made any. Have a look at this video, he shows how it is done. You can buy the powder at any decent hardware store or garden center as it is used for certain plants. Regards. kzbin.info/www/bejne/kHfZgZpuorCNiJo

[@rectadyne]

Thanks for that. Nice to hear an English voice for a change!

[@daveticehurst4191]

Glad you liked it. Hope you found it useful. Thanks for watching. Best Wishes.

[@learningturningmetal]

Very interesting Dave. I must try marking up without layout fluid. I think I need to put a really sharp edge on my height gauge first. Cheers Andrew

[@daveticehurst4191]

Go for it Andrew, you can always use a sharpie on the area you want to mark first, as I find that does not wash off like the stuff you use. Get a rough rule measurement with a pencil, then say do a 1/2 inch square of sharpie to make your lines more visible. When you do it on aluminium, after scribing, rub your dirty hands into the scribe marks to make them stand out. That's free unlike buying Dyechem. LOL. Regards.

[@learningturningmetal]

@@daveticehurst4191 yeah ironically I've just marked up my v-twin crankcase using dykem. I'll give your method a try on my next component. All the best. Andrew

[@bodgit1964]

Thanks boss, that was brilliant, but how do you grind punches? I am never happy with mine! Also given that you seem to use the bent end on your scribing block how do sharpen that? I hone mine with a slip stone but im never very happy with the results. Thanks again!

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi there, thanks for the view and your questions. Firstly with regards to sharpeneing the center punches, generally they are only about 55 Rockwell hardness and are therefore easily turned on a lathe with a carbide tool. Failing that get yourself a diamond file or hone and use that. Should you want to grind using a bench grinder, hold the punch in the upright position and grind using the center of the wheel. It is easier to hold and rotate rather than trying it horizontally. By doing it vertically the grinding marks go down the length of the point, rather that the other way giving grinding rings, and it will come out much rounder. You are also able to rest the punch onto the tool rest and get better control. Finally with regards to the bent scriber, yes a real pain to sharpen, However it dose not need to actually be a point. You can put a flat on the bottom and also grind the top flat so that it looks like a height gauge beak or same shape as a wood chisel. As long as you have a sharp defined edge to scribe the line, the shape is not important. Hope this helps, any more information needed drop me an email and I can detail more with pictures. Regards.

[@cncshrops]

In Aus, we make our sketches on the Front of envelopes. Not on the back like the Poms. Thanks for the tutorial.

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi there thanks for the comment. 😊. Thanks for watching, hope you learned something. Regards.

[@johnhankin8918]

Hi Dave Did you work at PRL. john Hankin

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hello John, YES I did, well spotted. Trained in this art by Ron Fenner and Geoff Couchman. If you do have some spare time, the multi threads video shows Ernie Garlands Hardinge that I bought for 50 GBP when we downsized. If you watch the shop tour one I show all my machinery and tell stories of how I got them. The DoALL bandsaw chats tell how I became to be in Australia. Glad to hear that you are still around, I expect you must be in your 80's now, as I was 72 in April. Drop me an email if you want a chat or more information or photos. Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@stevecallachor]

Somewhere there is a cabinet maker looking for his Warrington hammer, and it’s at your place!!! Stavros

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hello Steve, had to look up Warrington. It was my Dad's and I have always know it as a tacking hammer for driving in panel pins and brads. See even I have learnt something. 😊 Thanks for watching. Regards.

[@paulburns2400]

That center punch would only be big enough for a .010" drill Dave..

[@daveticehurst4191]

Hi Paul, it's bigger than that, it's a good 1/16" and a B S 1 center drill fits a treat. Thanks for watching.