How to do the 4 cable method with the Line 6 Helix (the EASY way!)

[@Abellyisforjelly]

Finally! This is the first setup I’ve found for the helix that doesn’t sound like shit and give me a bunch of racket. Thank you! Subbed

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Nice! thanks dude!

[@BrianSGuitars]

Thank you God! Finally someone made this simple enough I can figure it out! Nicely done!

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Glad it helped!

[@kidlargo1]

Short, concise, and to the point. Excellent. Thank you!!

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

thanks, Joe C

[@georgedunham7311]

Dude!! Unreal video. I’ve only just got my helix and honestly I would’ve thought they would’ve made it so the send of the amps FX loop just goes to send and same for return and then you just assign your inputs and outputs as required on your second line. But, apparently not! 😂 Still pretty easy, so thanks heaps for the video man

[@djkolcun]

I just did a similar set up with two separate audio lines (one pre, one post) but stayed with the send & return (sort of standard) vice doubling up on the 1/4" and panning - cool idea though. Appreciate it!

[@ssi1121]

Thanks for the video would have loved to hear a demo after this 4CM set up😀

[@johnmac8084]

Brilliant, so clear, thanks

[@angrybuzzy]

That is a beautiful method, BH! Thanks for making the video and posting!

[@funkyblofeldsam]

Thank you Ben, your video is very useful !!!!

[@musicgearnetwork]

Just became your 300th Like. Great video!

[@lucassamsmusic]

you’re a god. thank you.

[@ward4251]

With this method, can I use the amps and cabs within the helix rather than the amp everything is plugged into? I’m using a Fender Champion 100.

[@craigjasper1274]

I’m waiting for a new amp to arrive and this is exactly how I’m planning on using the four cable method. Quick question - why do you use panned left and right jack outs instead of the effects send?

[@privacynomoreolny446]

5 stars two thumbs up watched this demo vid and there is no more confusion best regards!

[@texholliday]

Thankyou. U rock Sir

[@yuudee3132]

what i thought about 4CM is complex, is the naming "send, return" of both amp and multi-effect, if some brand to rename it to a simple new name, it could better for us.

[@stub390]

Superb stuff

[@ryanabitz]

Hey Ben. This was a great use of 4CM! Super straight forward and makes sense. Do you have any experience in using 4CM with two separate amps? I guess it's called 7CM.? I tried this with a traditional 4CM setup but for both amps using the send/returns on each amp and send/return 1/2 on the Helix if that makes sense. But it doesn't sound as good as just using an A/B/Y box straight into the front of both amps. That sounds killer. Any alternative suggestions on how to hook up two separate amps through the Helix? I'd love to control both amps with the Helix, like have all the effects go to both amps. I don't care about ping pong delay and shit like that. I just want a wall of sound using the Helix and both amps simultaneously. Does that make sense? Love to hear your thoughts. Thanks in advance!

[@crsantin]

My amp sounds great like this. Am I setting my inputs and outputs to line level or instrument level?

[@philthompson9403]

Did you ever find out? I'm surenit has to be instrumental level?

[@jaktje]

Amazing video, thanks.

[@timtaylor164]

Both ways are easy but yea this works too. Thanks.

[@burnedclutch]

Hi Ben, I have a petrucci majesty which has a stereo output one for the piezo and and one the magnetic pu 's the other end of trs cable are the two tr ends how can i connect to the helix LT and the out to either stereo amp or preferably two different amps from the helix? thanks in advance, cheers!

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

you could do a regular 4 cable method with the regular guitar output then use the AUX IN on the Helix for the piezo and have a whole separate line of audio in the patch just for that. That line can then go out to whatever, FoH, amp etc. I guess that you only use the piezo clean so a straight audio path in Helix would be fine.

[@MegaBrebis]

Great idea! The only problem is that the second path (what's in the loop) is noisy in my amp (Marshall) even with no pedals... Any idea?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

thats weird. what Marshall is it? Do you hear FX in the loop if you do put any pedals on that path of audio?

[@MegaBrebis]

@@BenHartwellGuitar It's a marshall Origin 20C. Yes I hear the FXs normally in the loop, it's just that it adds noise (even without FXs). Another problem is that I cannot record with my external looper (I can play what's on it but cannot record with it). I put the looper in the second path parallel to echo and reverb.

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

@@MegaBrebis strange. does it make noise with just the Helix or other pedals too?

[@MegaBrebis]

@@BenHartwellGuitar Only the Helix.

[@Knardsh]

This is exactly why I came back to this vid, to ask if anyone else was experiencing noise issues. How did you narrow it down to the 2nd path? Im getting a fairly bad buzz/hum at no volume when the gate is fully engaged and when I play it adds a fairly bad static/ crackling - sounds digital to me. The interesting thing is, I started out using this unconventional 4cm in the vid below and so then I tried the normal 4 cable method and the noise is worse. Using my old (non Helix ) setup I never had this problem. Ive checked everything over like 3 times, its all setup right as far as I can see. take out the 4cm and its totally normal.

[@leplussauvage]

And if I want also to control the channel of my amp, have you got any solution too? (my amp is a MEASA BOOGIE MARK V 25) and does your method still available if you have the solution to flip the channel and the eq of my amp?

[@denzciodiaz347]

how do u set up with helix is it line level or instrument

[@12Jsilva]

question... currently diving in to using the helix lt for 4 cable method with my evh 5153 50s then goes to my torpedo captor x and into my focusrite interface.... i've been having some "string noise" issues especially when doing palm mutes... does anyone else have this same problem?

[@richjohnson6817]

Great information Ben, thank you. Can you possibly do this set-up with a Mesa Boogie Triaxis? I have that and would love to see it done with that unit. Cheers.

[@paramediccpo]

This seems great for a person that wants to design their own sound what about a simple man like me that just once for one particular song that you to sound or that Oasis sound for example

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Yeah the helix is great for creating all those kind of tones. I did a U2 tone with it in one of my older videos

[@redkurn]

why didn't you use send 1 for the fx loop instead of the right out? i suppose because it merges send 1 and 2...

[@daylonsyler5599]

I'm trying to figure out the same thing. I think mine sounds worse this way compared to not using the out 2

[@lennylewismusic]

How would you go about using something like a g string Decimator in this setup, which traditionally goes in the fx loop Decimator in, Decimator out - send/return of amp while the guitar goes into the input of noise gate pedal then back out of pedal into amp input, I want to use my Decimator instead of built in gates. Any suggestions?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

yeah just had a look at that pedal, cool idea. So I think the way you would do it is: Guitar >> Decimator in, Decimator out >> Helix GTR in, Helix Left OUT >> Front of amp, SEND from amp >> Helix RETURN, Helix Right OUT >> Decimator in, Decimator out >> amp RETURN. That would put the Decimator last in the chain on the FX Loop of the amp, I think! L&R outs of the Helix might need swapping depending on how things are panned, but I think that would work.

[@DragonMoto777]

Great Tutorial!! I’ve been messing around with different methods and this one works best with My 5150 3 100w What is the the best Global settings for this method? 1/4 outs and send and return. Should I have both set to line or Instrument?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

According to Line 6 you should set them both to instrument as that would mimic using a more traditional 4cm pedal board.

[@DragonMoto777]

@@BenHartwellGuitar Thanks for the info👍

[@juanvaldez5422]

This is awesome! Thanks , subd

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Thanks dude

[@vofcr91]

Hi, I've got hx LT hooked up to my pc via USB and studio monitors to it via provided jacks. I've recently bought an amp (jvm210h) to my long not used 4x12 cab. How to connect it to helix so I can still use studio monitors for playback off KZbin etc. but guitar signal to come out of cab hooked to the amp ? Also so you can steer head channels via helix ? Do i need another interface? Or just 4 cable method and monitors via xlrs rather than jacks? Thanks

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

hi, love the JVM! You could connect that amp in 4 cable method with the Helix. You could also use a midi cable from the Helix to control channel switching on the JVM. As for the playback with the monitors, you would be best connecting them directly to you computer with a small interface. You could do it with the Helix if you needed to, you would just have the KZbin audio on a separate path in Helix and output it to wherever you have the monitors connected.

[@JackMasonLive]

I feel like cussing but, in a good way. And sorry for that, girls. Only fucking video online that actually solved my problem with the 4 cable method. And for that, THANK YOU!!!!

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Glad I could help, cuss away!

[@oziresteixeira1719]

Thanks! It works on the hx effects? Brasilian up here!

[@bmwr1100s]

Is there any reason why youre not using a send / return block in your signal chain? I use a Marshall JVM and i´m quite happy with this way. I don´t use the volume knob for the 1/4" outs and only use it for the XLRs, is there a must to use the volume knob? and which loop of the JVM do you use?! Like i say, i´m happy with my setup but sometimes there are some questions that dont get an answer from the manuals..Thanks for answering

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Cool. I just use the in and outs to save using a send/return block. I just find it easier to set up using one path for pre amp and one for post, and I use the serial/parallel fx loop set wet.

[@TheRohanwilson74]

Great vid man, just wondering if you use this method for changing channels on the jmv via midi? If so have you had any issues getting it to work?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Cheers dude. No not tried it yet. Really want to. Gonna dig out a midi cable and give it a go

[@TheRohanwilson74]

Please make a vid man!, I'm having all kinds of trouble! 😄

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

So I've plugged my JVM in to the Helix via Midi and got it set up so that the Helix changes the channels no problem. Heres how I did it: 1. connect Helix Midi out to JVM midi in 2. set up which ever channel you want first on the JVM 3. go to command center on the Helix and choose a switch 4. set it to Bank/Prog, MIDI Ch 1, Program 1 5. double tab the MIDI PROGRAM button on JVM so it flashes 6. press the switch on the Helix you just assigned That switch should now control the channel change to that channel on the JVM 7. Setup another channel on the JVM 8. repeat steps 3-6 but change the numbers to 1 higher i.e. 2 You should now have 2 different channels controllable by the Helix. The only downside to this is there is no visual feedback on the Helix as to what channel you are on

[@krzychu7531]

Great video, thanks for sharing Ben. Does it also goes with parallel fx loop? I own Marshall TSL and I wonder how it will work with helix which I am about to to buy. cheers.

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

thanks, yeah it should do. Its just like plugging just your time based fx in to the fx loop. might just need to adjust your levels a it is all

[@marvinduschek7338]

Great video! But my 6505 looses a ton of "power" when using this method.. do i need specific cables?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Just regular guitar cables. Is the helix set to unity gain?

[@marvinduschek7338]

@@BenHartwellGuitar i dont know :( how do i check that?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

@@marvinduschek7338 actually I'd try running 4CM with some 'regular' guitar pedals and see if you get the same effect. if so then at least you know its not the Helix

[@tattooeditalian2895]

Can you still control the amp itself?

[@rsvette123]

Ben some Gimour presets to buy would be great - thank you

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

That’s defo on my list

[@rsvette123]

​Excellent looking forward to it :) thank you

[@TerraDactyl-tw1nv]

So by running this setup do I use full amp models or can I get away w/ using preamp models?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

this is just to use the Helix as an FX board. But you could set it up to use the amp models if you wanted to and bypass the front of whatever "real" amp you use

[@SpaceBaloo]

This video is great! I tried this setup, but when I took the top path and panned the left 1/4" all the way left, my amp went silent. If I kept both the 1/4" in the center I get tone. Any idea why your directions wouldn't be working for me?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Thanks. Hmm...that’s odd I’m not sure why that would happen. You could try reversing them so top path panned right and bottom path panned left. See if that gives you any sound. What amp are you using?

[@SpaceBaloo]

Ben Hartwell I’m using a Dr Z Max 18 which has an fx loop.

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Awesome amp! The only thing I’d try is just run the top path, no fx loop, and try panning it left and right and make sure you get sound when it’s on one side or the other. Then add in the fx loop panned in the opposite direction and see what happens

[@Jimboishere11]

Are those speaker cables and guitar cables? Also do I have to that for every single patch? Or is there an easier option. Thanks.

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

The only speaker cable is the one from the amp head to the cabinet, all the other cables are regular guitar cables. You would have to setup each patch that you wanted to do 4 cable method with yeah unfortunately

[@Jimboishere11]

@@BenHartwellGuitar Thank you for the reply 👍🏻

[@TheJammed]

Can you tell me exactly which ones to plug on the jvm please

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Yeah you do it the exact same way. GUITAR>>HELIX>>HELIX 1/4 OUT L>>AMP IN. Then AMP FX SEND>>HELIX RETURN 1>>HELIX 1/4 OUT R>>AMP FX RETURN. Then just set the ins and outs on the Helix like in the video. Hope that helps

[@InnerSilence123]

I have a question, if you play live and the amp it's let's say 5 meters away from the pedalboard do you need three 5 meters long cables? Or even if it's further away? Wouldn't you loose signal or something? I mean, including the guitar cable, that would be a 20 meter long cables for the whole setup, does it work?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

yeah you do lose some signal with longer cables, but i just design my sounds around that. The problem I have is that my stages range from a couple of meters to huge stages where I need massive cable runs. The signal loss is not so great that I really notice it, but you're right you could use smaller cables if you are going to be closer to your amps, or use buffers to keep the signal nice and strong, which i think the Helix is anyway.

[@InnerSilence123]

@@BenHartwellGuitar thank you!

[@InnerSilence123]

@@BenHartwellGuitar the efect loop from the cabinet is unbalanced right? then using the balanced output in the pedal board wouldnt make any difference. anyway, I wouldnt try it I dont wanna fry my equipment...

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

@@InnerSilence123 yeah FX loops are usually unbalanced. The only balanced output in the Helix is the XLR outs, all the others are TS jack outs, as far as I know, I may be wrong.

[@InnerSilence123]

@@BenHartwellGuitar yeah, should be balanced in both ends to make any kind of make sense, my bad

[@justinTime077]

I find what is much less available is the methods of making a patch for 4cm rather than how to connect the shit.

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Good idea, maybe a future video

[@wfntube]

I tried this method but am faced with latency issue i.e. I play a riff then it comes on like milliseconds later. Is it normal?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

That’s weird. Not had an latency issue when I’ve done 4cm with various amps. What amp are you using?

[@wfntube]

@@BenHartwellGuitar I'm using a Blackstar Studio 10 EL84. I followed every single step but there is latency issue. I'm using short cables too.

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

@@wfntube great amp! yeah that is weird I've never had any problems like that with 4cm. is there Latency even with nothing turned on in the Helix?

[@wfntube]

@@BenHartwellGuitar hi Ben, I managed to resolve it when using on a fresh new patch. I think it might be an issue with my previous presets. Thanks.

[@kimiversen81]

Great video 🙂 if I want to use a preamp in the Helix how would I bypass the preamp from the real amp?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

thanks! yeah I do this all the time with my v30 and Helix. You just take the output from the Helix to the FX return on the amp, that's the only cable you need. That bypasses all the front end of the amp and only uses the power section. Then just choose whatever amp you want to use in the Helix. It works really well, just balance out your volume on the Helix and you're good to go

[@kimiversen81]

@@BenHartwellGuitar yes I know this 🙂 what I meen is that if I wish to use the 4cm the way you do. How can I use the preamps in Helix then? So I can switch from my amps preamp to Helix preamp. Without adding a fx block in the path 🙂

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

ahhh got ya. yeah I think you can do it would just need some clever routing. let me have a think

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

so the only way I can think to do it with this 4CM is to mute the top line in the Helix that's feeding the front of the amp. And then kick in whatever amp you want on the bottom line to feed the FX return. You can have both those actions on one foot switch, it just means that you would need two copies of anything you wanted in front of the amps cuz you're muting the ones on the top line.

[@kimiversen81]

@@BenHartwellGuitar that would work 🙂 thanks a lot 🙂

[@sweetmotash]

Nice :) And what if for example you wanna use additional physical pedals from your pedal board, like clean boost in front of the amp?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Yeah you can do that easy. Just plug them in before the Helix. So you would go Guitar>>Clean boost>>Helix>>Amp. Or you could put it after the Helix just before the amp so Guitar>>Helix>>Clean boost>>Amp. Or you could use the FX loops of the helix to keep them out of the chain when not in use. Hope that makes sense.

[@sweetmotash]

@@BenHartwellGuitar Thanks! that makes sense :), and what if I would like to go from the amp to reactive load IR (without the cab), and back to helix as audio interface, should I plug Out of Reactive load to Aux In of helix and set it to Line level ?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

@@sweetmotash thats an interesting one. I've not tried that myself, but yeah I guess if you did it that way onto a separate audio path in the helix that then output to usb only that should work. just be careful not to create a feedback loop where the audio is going HELIX>>AMP>>IR>>HELIX>>then back to the amp. Be interested to see if this works, let me know.

[@sweetmotash]

@@BenHartwellGuitar I will try that :) But I think now, better option will be to invest alittle bit more into apart audio interface like scarlett, and use helix, as a pedalboard only.

[@sweetmotash]

@@BenHartwellGuitar hehe well, ive tried only once, and when i went from standby to on, feedback loop almost took my ears off :) Just ordered audio interface :)

[@rdog6402]

So where would a looper go to catch both paths?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

depends if you want to loop pre or post all the fx. You could add it first (before helix input) in the chain to run in to all the fx, or, if you want to capture just preamp fx you could put it before the amp input, or, to capture all fx you could add it between the helix and the amp fx return. hope that makes sense

[@rdog6402]

@@BenHartwellGuitar thanks mate

[@tomulator]

Question...since you’re using your 1/4” outs, where do you set you master volume of the Helix (i.e., big volume knob on front of Helix) to get optimal signal/noise?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

So what i used to do was just dial in the volume control to get around unity gain, so that it was the same volume as plugging direct into the amp. But after doing some reading, and according to L6, if you set the 1/4" outputs in the global settings to 'instrument' instead of the default 'line', then turn the volume knob all the way up you get true unity gain and best signal to noise. So now i do it that way. Hope that helps

[@tomulator]

Ben Hartwell awesome. Just the answer I was looking for! Thx. 😎👍🏻

[@Vethuleion]

Hey, I would like to know how transparent HELIX is ? I used to play 4 cable method with a few multiefects in the past and every one of them just gives some "colour" to the sound.. I would say some kind of hissy-mid tone. Also, can you change channels in the amp via MIDI ?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Hey, its the most transparent I've used so far. No real 'tone suck'. I had a G System years ago that sucked a lot of top end but the Helix doesn't seem to. As for channel switching, it has an amp switching jack that you can use. I've not had much success with it tho. I can get it to change channels on my V30 but it introduces a lot of noise on the clean channel. Might be a different story with MIDI tho, I've not tried that.

[@Vethuleion]

@@BenHartwellGuitar thanks a bunch! I use nova system only in effects loop and it changes the tone a bit, just in that hissy way. I think about changing my gear now and I'm lookin for good floor for recording and to use it with my amp.

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Yeah I’ve not noticed any of that with the helix. If you don’t need the amp modelling side of things look at the HX effects to use with ur amp

[@scottpeters4401]

Is there any tone suck with the Helix like this??I hooked mine up the traditional 4cm,where you are putting your amps preamp into a loop on the Helix,and it seemed to really change the tone of my amp.....maybe I didn’t have the levels right or something,I don’t know.....The way you are doing it,your amp isn’t actually running into the Helix...

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

Can't say I've ever noticed any tone suck from the Helix. There was some volume difference until I sorted the output level but thats all really. The 4CM I do is GUITAR>>HELIX L OUT>>AMP IN>>AMP FXLOOP SEND>>HELIX RETURN 1>>HELIX R OUT>>AMP FXLOOP RETURN. That way I can use all the channels on the amp with any FX I want in front and can also put any FX after the preamp of the amp.

[@Knardsh]

Isn't this a 3cm?

[@BenHartwellGuitar]

don't forget the cable to the guitar