How To Fix a Concealed Cistern WITHOUT Removing Tiles

[@danfinan]

Thank you so much for this video! Never touched any plumbing before but I was able to follow along and fix the toilet which was leaking a constant stream of water into the bowl. I took out the flush valve, cleaned up the rubber seal, put it all back together again and the problem was solved. Super grateful!

[@micdev42]

This may help someone as not all Geberit faceplates have the clip at the bottom. I watched loads of videos and the clip is always shown at the bottom. I spent a frustrating time trying to get mine off (by pushing upwards) and almost breaking it in the process. Mine (a 2017 model) has the metal spring clip on the LEFT side. Therefore to remove the faceplate you need to push it to the right then unclip the right-hand edge. HTH. Cheers from UK.

[@effervescence5664]

So this is true for the majority of floating pans as they're on metal frames. The bigger issue and what normally requires hacking the tiles off is if some twit mounts the pan on the tiles without the board behind the tiles being directly on the frame, so it flexes and then leaks. Or floor seated pans with concealed cisterns where there is no bracket stopping the flush pipe being pushed back when the pan is slid back so it never slots in properly. Extremely typical to find both issues in new builds unfortunately.

[@BigPopaRoth]

Absolutely amazingly useful! Thank you. I've had a dodgy flush, where it seems to get stuck flowing afterwards. You've given me the confidence and know how to go have a look myself!

[@AnneConnett]

Brilliant DIY video. Clear explanation and as Roger says it is all very straightforward. Follow what he says step by step and you will be able to solve the problem yourself, in minutes. Job done.

[@rush211251]

Rubber washers go hard on those types of flush valves after several years . I get called to these all the time when the water is letting by . Can be a pain in the arse if you can’t obtain the washers locally .

[@SkillBuilder]

Online next day, just replace the flush valve

[@london_roubenl]

Doing toilet cistern work, I don't like these at all, for me the ability to look at the whole cistern is always good, I prefer concealed designs where access from the top is achieved, you get to see the cistern any gunk in it, the seals, the flush pipe, the floor, concealed cisterns with large access panels are also more acceptable to me, obviously my first choice is always exposed cisterns !! Anyway great channel, always excellent and very informative !!

[@justaguydoingdiy7975]

Here in Poland everything we fit is concealed, all of it serviceable without taking the tiles off, very neat systems.

[@SkillBuilder]

I also favout that approach, hide it all away. It makes for a cleaner better bathroom

[@alexpinna7193]

Thanks, saved me a lot of stress/money... mine (Noken) had a flexible part which made it possible to take it out as you suggested. Cleaned and poured lots of lime scale remover down there. Reasembled and made a few manual adjustments and no more issues! 😮😊

[@sonyamc]

Very good video, it was very helpful when I had this problem on a single button cistern

[@miketomlinson7643]

Thanks!

[@SkillBuilder]

Thank You Mike.

[@laurencebushby713]

unfortunately not all builders use those type, a member of my family bought a brand new flat not only did it have just a circler knob like the top of an exposed cistern tiled in when you put the seat up it was behind it! also if there is a leak between the cistern and the pan on your type you probably simply unbolt the pan but not on the ones i have seen, these systems are good but i can understand why most plumbers think what you were saying at the beginning and i agree with them. hidden boxed in units just hide all the bad workmanship and leaks that could easily been seen in a normal exposed cistern .

[@garycunningham3490]

What a video what a clear concise explanation, well done 👏👏👏👏 just experiencing the very same issues and fixed successfully after watching this video.

[@SkillBuilder]

Great to hear! Too many plumbers still hacking tiles off

[@Mike35858]

You'r the man Roger. Thanks for the info.

[@sybaseguru]

Bottom rubber seal of flush unit is a common cause - it gets bubbles in it and doesn't seal

[@micdev42]

OK. So how do you fix? Clean the seal or replace it?

[@micdev42]

Just in case it helps someone: after inspecting mine, I replaced it. Cost about £3. Working fine now.

[@Stefan_Kawalec]

In fact it really matters what the make is. Geberit is the only worth installing system. You can really service all the parts through the faceplate opening. And they have 25 years spare parts availability.

[@SkillBuilder]

Abacus makes a cistern that is every bit as good as Geberit and comes with more plumbing options.

[@Stefan_Kawalec]

@@SkillBuilder Thank you for your answer. I've been installing various concealed cisterns since 1998. And yes, I tried different brands. Here in Poland we have Grohe, Sanit, TECE, Roca, some local brands like Koło (very low-end, recently acquired by Geberit) and of course some generic Chinese-made stuff. Throughout these years I was always trying to find best price/quality/serviceability ratio. I tried cheaper Geberit options like Duofix Basic. But in the end it turns out that Geberit Duofix UP320 with Sigma cistern is the paramount of quality, durability, comfort and maintenance. Of course it's a bit on the "expensive" side of things, but it's worth every penny.

[@FriendlyFireBrigade]

I always fit grohe rapid sl, all internal parts serviceable and replaceable through the flush plate opening, good quality, easy to install, not too expensive (£130-160 incl flush plate and all fitting parts)

[@Stefan_Kawalec]

@@FriendlyFireBrigade I had too many complaints from my clients about pneumatic face plate. Here in Poland Geberit UP320 DuoFix Sigma 12 is £182 with Sigma 30 face plate. Grohe is £134. And as I said, Geberit is worth every penny.

[@FriendlyFireBrigade]

@@Stefan_Kawalec I never had any issue with pneumatic grohe plates since I installed the first one 5-6y ago, but yes, geberit is better (also the inventor of concealed plastic cisterns) just the face plates are a bit too large for most of my clients. I didn't look since a while maybe there are smaller ones available now?

[@43bikeguy]

videos like are this are you tubes saving grace, brilliant.

[@vannezaserrano7834]

Hi, mine only has a small circle for flushing, how can I access to fix it? As I seem to have leak /dripping issue

[@0richbike]

No problems at present but my cisterns are fully enclosed with just the remote button flush. So there's no easy access unless the builder built an access panel

[@mikedavey2321]

Terrific video as I'm faced with a concealed unit (for the first time), similar to the video, that continues to flow after flushing. Plumber is talking about getting to the unit by tile removal etc mainly because he doesnt know the make of the unit for spares. Is there a common area for the makers name to appear on these units so that I can investigate?

[@SkillBuilder]

The best thing is to pull out the flush valve and clean it and reach down to clean the seating. It is rare that this doesn't cure the problem. Photograph the inner workings when you take them out and that will help you identify the part. You might find a label behind the front panel and there might be a number on it.

[@Orionrobots]

We have OLI ones - which are a bit different, and plumbers often look a bit confused and not happy with them. The part below the buttons is the same, but the button assembly is different. The number 1 problem is that the isolation valve on the problematic one is complete stuck - the blue tap broke off trying to move it. We are in a hard water area. We did manage to ervice one a bit turning off the mains water - but that is two floors down.

[@Alanoffer]

Excellent tips , well explained , I was thinking it was going to be major surgery on the wall to get the cistern out

[@frankief7111]

To fix the leak on mine I replaced the side fill valve part to the right which you don't show. This is because when the valve doesn't close the overflow is through the cistern into the toilet.

[@chriscarter2101]

Thank you. Great tip!

[@amaan-khan]

Best video ever. My problem was solved within first 3 mins of the video

[@rdahal2583]

Is it possible to create a water outlet for a bidet spray from the concealed cistern's pipeworks? Or is it most likely necessary to remove/drill a hole in the wall behind toilet to actually access to the main pipes in order to do this?

[@Mike_5]

This is such a good video to teach you how to teach the plumbers you call how to do it!

[@Trevor_Austin]

I’m not even slightly surprised that some plumbers think this. Believe it or not even the morons who fitted my bathroom even said I should keep a few tiles spare for when someone requires access to the cistern. Had these bellends read the instructions all would have been clear. The reality is in Britain not enough tradesmen, plumbers included, spend enough time learning about any of the products they install. Simple things like reading instructions and installation guides would help. Also many manufacturers have training sessions on their products where they can learn the correct installation and maintenance techniques. I’m also convinced the trade doesn’t spend enough time at trade shows to learn about new products and ideas. I see no solution all the time there is a shortage of crap tradesmen, let alone skilled and knowledgable ones aware of the latest market trends - even if some of these products have been on the market for 25 years!

[@SkillBuilder]

Trevor, I agree with every word.

[@samanthavarley2332]

Hi , thanks for the video , can i ask would a small drip in the bowl activate my pump, it keeps going off through the night , had this concealed unit installed 4 months ago and its been trouble ever since. I've had it checked 3 times and its still leaking .

[@rikscha2k]

Can you drop a product like Bloo into the cistern?

[@NotableTarun]

Keep doing excellent work like this and keep giving information, thanks for your information.

[@upperdeane]

Hi. I have a similar one with what looks to be the same same flexi hose to the one shown in the video. Do you have any idea where you can get the flexi hoses or what it is exactly as mine is perished?

[@geoffwoodgate7450]

Every single diy shop here in Belgium sells these. Dont they in UK?

[@chrishyde5995]

hi so how do you do this with a pan mounted on a wall panel and there is no access panel?

[@claudiojunior9618]

What if it leaks under where the syphon sits Roger ?

[@robertpowell7672]

I find that the diaphragm at the bottom of the flush valve, has to be replaced occasionally due to 'cupping' which allows water to leak through into the pan. I'm talking Ideal Standard here.

[@mariaescosura3972]

Great video, thanks. However, the push button in my in-wall tank is very small so I think the tiles will need to be broken?

[@SkillBuilder]

Send a picture of the wall and the toilet. Is it wall-hung or floor standing?

[@mariaescosura3972]

@@SkillBuilder I don’t know how to upload the pic here. I can email it to you if you let me have your email

[@mariaescosura3972]

It’s floor standing.

[@mariaescosura3972]

@@SkillBuilder here is the pic in the link- kzbin.info/www/bejne/rqbbmZZ6ad-UaaM

[@chrisridesbicycles]

Our house was built in 1984 and we have some of these causing trouble from time to time. The manufacturer does not exist any more and the plastic has become brittle. Can you get the internal parts for older models? What is your take on removing scale buildup inside the tank? When you have removed the valve any kind of acid runs out quickly and has little effect.

[@davehunter6920]

good work rog but what a ballix of a job

[@CourtneyWilding]

Roger what about an older type naye 12 years system that's built in. I can only access the system through the top buy it's constantly draining into the pan. How do I get the flushing system out and refit as I though I need to get under the water chamber to unscrew.? Thank you

[@SkillBuilder]

send us some pictures before you start pulling things apart www.skill-builder.uk/send

[@mugabiisaac4534]

Very helpful boss

[@robertbamford8266]

Interesting. Don’t see them much here (US). Have to consider waste pipe position for a retrofit. Thanks for the info.

[@oti21]

Thanks so much, i repaired my own one, it was only dirty

[@mimieliza2492]

Roger, could you please describe the exact part I could try to stop the constant slow drip flow of water into the pan? I am an senior citizen and won't call a plumber, as I get fleeced by service people! Thank you

[@mimieliza2492]

Any chance of a response please? Thank you

[@Nbomber]

The type of mind who doesnt think "i should try that panel first", probably shouldnt be doing this sort of work. Lol. I would imagine that this would be the first point of call for anybody with more than 2 braincells.

[@SkillBuilder]

Ah! I think you have the problem right there, brains

[@zfid]

Hey Roger however Ive seen completely tiled in cisterns in brand new 'luxury' flats. Porcelain tiles too

[@SkillBuilder]

Show me the pictures. There is usually access

[@zfid]

@SkillBuilder It's from last year and I'm not on that job anymore. Im guessing from your video that access was possibly from behind the wall mounted flush button plate. Also noted that the baths are also tiled in and access to drainage would also require some tile removal. Fortunately I was simply fitting shower & accessories (toilet roll hangers, shower soap holders and the like).

[@Star-8888]

hmmm. so my half flush button has suddenly started to push my full flush button then both won't return and water runs into bowl. But full flush works ok ........been watching video's... can't quite work out why. Is it just the flush valve long tube thing, that's it. not two separate floats?

[@SkillBuilder]

Is it a concealed cistern with a wall hung pan, or a floor mounted pan.

[@samanthajames-cooper5529]

A nice idea. However, I have fitted them with a removable shelf above - just like his example!!!!! Why no just do that if this is the bathroom design? My other version is to build a cupboard above - again with a removable lower shelf. A panel held in with magnets ans a little sealant works fine.. No need for an intricate system like this in most instances. Sure, it has it's place.

[@SkillBuilder]

You cannot access this kind of cistern from above. The shelf is useful to access the feed but it will do nothing to help with servicing.

[@samanthajames-cooper5529]

@@SkillBuilder I fairness to you, I don't know the exact model. I chose cisterns with a top access to give me access from above. Luckily I've only had to service 1 of them and the removable shelf above worked a treat. Of course, no shelf, then it's some sort of front access you are stuck with.

[@bobbydelcavallo7181]

Absolutely amazing 🥳🥳🥳

[@robhogenesch2233]

Mine isn’t leaking into the pan but in to the water reservoir it’s dripping continuously. Can that be fixed through the panel?

[@SkillBuilder]

Yes it is an easy fix.

[@robhogenesch2233]

@@SkillBuilder if you ever happen to make a video about how to fix it I’ll be interested.👍

[@pdashs5810]

Thanks Roger, We have a cistern that is concealed inside inside a furniture unit around a year old, it has a push button flush (1 small button inside a larger 2nd button) on the small front panel just under the top - we find we have to keep the button pressed in for around 5+ seconds to get a full flush, if you give it a quick press it stops flushing as soon as you let go - is it broken or just not set correctly?

[@grayhalf1854]

They look neat but I'm not sure I trust them. I like to have things more accessible tbh...

[@vinnysurti]

What Roger is saying is that they are accessible! Probably more tricky if you got hands like shovels.

[@grayhalf1854]

@@vinnysurti Not being able to see if there's a leak makes me uneasy, I can't help it.

[@vinnysurti]

I guess so, tricky to see leak, sometimes leaks for years before even noticed as all the rot is hidden behind the tilled box

[@quintdewit4870]

I had it leak with a renter of mine for about 3 years and it cost me around 3k in water bills just put a normal toilet it is not worth the extra space and i have had alot problems with the build in one at our own place because we have really hard water so every 2 years in needs a rebuild

[@darrenmackenzie1892]

What about flush pipe leaking how do you fix that?

[@SkillBuilder]

Remove the pan and access from there.

[@peterprice8393]

Roger , great video everything we need to know . A lovely collection of hammer rash on those the Thumbs. Ouch 😣

[@SkillBuilder]

Not hammers but a recip saw. I made a video on it a couple of months ago. I was lucky to keep my thumb.

[@samuelbeckett485]

Normally turn up to them rubbish black plastic cisterns that have been tiled behind and you can’t get to it.

[@SkillBuilder]

In the case you are talkign about some invasive surgery

[@bonganindlovu-hx8bt]

This is the best, i was about to go and break one out

[@SkillBuilder]

Thank Goodness you didn't do that. Imagine doing it and then finding out that the whole thing can be serviced through the front plate.

[@bonganindlovu-hx8bt]

@@SkillBuilder Funny enough i was supposed to have demolished the whole thing on Monday bt a lazy feeling kept delaying me and tmrw was the day i was going to break out the tiles, that feeling of having to break out was making me postpone the whole process, bt tmrw i am going there as early as possible, there is a good chunk of outstanding payment resting on that one toilet, i installed 9 of them, 8 working perfect bt that one got me out of sorts

[@Ade85]

Isn't there two level adjusters? One for half flush and the other near the top for full flush. I also find it's not just a clean up that is required but the large flat washer at the end of the plunger just starts leaking for no apparent reason.

[@SkillBuilder]

Yes you are right.

[@karl212]

Bottom.rubbers on geberit flush valve systems have a habit of bubbling or splitting...always handy to have a few spares on van ...👍

[@CubanRAT]

Thanks for this video. I was clueless before I started. Thanks to your video, I could confidently tackle the job and resolve. My toilet was just contionously running and would not refill. It turns out it was the the rubber stopped at the bottom would no longer sit flush as it had started to bubble. I cannot find any replacement parts in my country for the toilet (my toilet is exactly the same as the one in the video). I drove around and bought a geberit rubber stopper which is the closest match. However, before I fitted the new stopper, I flipped the current one over and it seems to be working a treat. You dont perhaps know the model of the toilet. I do know the manufacturer is WDI. But It would be helpful to know the model.

[@davidjeffreys9063]

What if the flush pipe is leaking?. How do you get to that, that would be more of a crock

[@SkillBuilder]

Take the pan off the wall and look from there.

[@davidjeffreys9063]

@@SkillBuilder Only trouble with that is when you take the toilet out to expose a possible leaking cone, when you put it back it's hard to see that joint to check it

[@MBAWarlord]

Thank you! Saved me having to call out a plumber (i.e., ££££!)

[@MrSbenn69]

Sure, assuming it was installed properly in the first place…😃

[@frenchgreguk]

Or the donut is perished.

[@kyam3331]

There isn't a donut on wall hung pans and if the pan connector is leaking you can remove the pan and fix any leak still without removing any tiles

[@frenchgreguk]

@@kyam3331 you wouldnt believe what people burry into walls. Ok, lets say the seal at the bottom of the cistern then...

[@lazylad8544]

I see rodger has been punishing his thumbs with the hammer again. 😳

[@DarkwingXRP]

Legend, you've just saved me £280❤

[@blackadder1966]

But I've seen many of these without that access panel.

[@SkillBuilder]

. I have never seen the ones you are describing so it would be interesting to know the make

[@blackadder1966]

@@SkillBuilder im in Australia

[@SkillBuilder]

@@blackadder1966 Ah! that is outside my experience, send us a picture next time you see one

[@SvenAERTS]

Buildings that have a lot of scaling, hard water, calcium, tartre whatever you want to call it, I guess it's a good thing to poor in a cup of vinegar every so many months? Maybe you can show how easy that is?

[@SkillBuilder]

Good idea

[@davidjeffreys9063]

You cant beat the normal style cisterns that sit above the toilet on show

[@london_roubenl]

You immediately see any problems and always easy to fix

[@davidjeffreys9063]

@@london_roubenl Depends if there are any access panels, especially if the flush pipe is leaking

[@london_roubenl]

Yes obviously these are the best especially for servicing !!! Very Practical.

[@scottmacpherson6787]

That looks like a quality setup, you aren't going to find that in a new build. Tiles will be off

[@nickhickson8738]

All that mechanism looks so flimsy. It'll become brittle and fail. Al looks and no substance and I don't know how long a suspended bog would last with people plonking themselves down on it day in, day out.

[@SkillBuilder]

If they are fixes properly they will take a lot of weight. You could sit two people on it if that is your thing

[@richardpaine5923]

Yes, but if you don't have this access system...............

[@SkillBuilder]

Then you are in trouble

[@elainejakob7936]

Nope can’t get past the very easy first bit ie removing the cover plate. This is just like the very easy replacing a tap washer malarkey

[@chrispugh2450]

with all due respect thats specific that that type of cistern. Some simply cannot be accessible after tiling !!! seen loads that leak but guys have boxed them in with with simple push buttons and cannot be serviced without removing tiles!!!!

[@chudchadanstud]

Morden day toilets are an absolute mess.

[@bebopalooblog2877]

Um, sorry, but you haven't shown how to access the fill valve. That's the flush valve, as you know, but you began the vid with what you said was a running overflow - which you then failed to address.

[@SkillBuilder]

It was the flush valve seating leaking and not the fill valve. The problem was solved. When you open up it is fairly obvious where the fill valve is.

[@240soundwave]

forget about it its a fugazzzii

[@Oli_Hudson]

We all like a full flush!

[@PhoneVidoes]

More plasitc junk to break, pound to a penny that wont last 5yrs let alone 25yrs before all the plastic bits go brittle and you just end up with a pile of junk thats fallen into the recess and you'll be still tearing the tiles off the wall :(

[@StephenWestrip]

Laughable comment.

[@SkillBuilder]

I have them in my house and they are well over 5 years old and have never caused a problem

[@Pete.Ty1]

👍👍👍

[@renstol658]

That kind ofsuspended toilets are ages in even Poland......no problem... Its standard terenie.....Herę you showing IT live you ale NASA enginere.....God.......pls.....

[@SkillBuilder]

We have a lot of emails from people who don't know how to service this kind of cistern. Some of them are Polish

[@renstol658]

Leverkusen of Flush Got nothing to deal with leak into toilet. Good plumber Got no problem Wit IT.....all video is for subs/live.....shame you. Dont put plumbers as idiots....

[@renstol658]

I really like that channel but what I notice it going down as hell...... Means......NO ONE CANT FIX TOTALLY NOTING( Unless provided/ connected with SkillBuilder) ....wtf?????

[@SteveAndAlexBuild]

Easy when you know how and you made it look east Rog 👌🏼🧱👋🏽