How to Safely Stop Antidepressants | Interview with Adele Framer (Altostrata)

[@lisaodendaal629]

I am going through these things at the moment. Its just insane! My heart just breaks that people are going through this. The akathisia is hell! I already have fibromylgia which probably occurred because of previous withdraws. I pray for everyone who is suffering! May the Lords grace cover you, strengthen and keep you.

[@EC-yd9yv]

🌹💖🙏✨✨✨

[@Vancouver_1986]

Your ME/CFS is 1000000000000000000000000% long-term/protracted withdrawal syndrome. (& maybe declining hormones in Perimenopause/Menopause.) Your nervous system is fucked. I've had this happen to my body, too, as have many many many others around the world. I'm still having ME/CFS symptoms many years later. And I have more Pharmaceuticals to get off of right now. Things got worse for me in the last few years (ie: more Pharmaceuticals I don't require to be well). I'm on fucking disability from my Province because of it, as are a lot of us. These Pharmaceuticals are extremely extremely extremely dangerous. It's unethical, and it's a liability. We can't even sue for these iatrogenic injuries. There are too many of us; hundreds of thousands upon thousands around the world.

[@YoAuntyMihkoh]

I cannot explain how difficult coming off of Effexor is. I feel like I’m dying and I have been slowly tapering for a long time. I’m so sad. I’m praying I survive it.

[@estelled389]

I understand I'm on these hideous pills also . If I miss more than 2 days I feel like I'm being electrified. I'm coming to a conclusion that whoever made these drugs wanted humans to suffer 🤔. 😈

[@mickrozycki451]

I'm also tapering of Venafaxline (generic Effexor). Even went as far as opening the capsules and counting pellets to gradually reduce the dosage. Have gone down from 150 mg to 37.5 mg over the course of a year. Each major dosage change I wait a month or two to stabilize. If you need someone to chat with about reducing your dosage let me know.

[@YoAuntyMihkoh]

@@mickrozycki451 hey! Thanks! I actually ended up reducing my 37.5 mg slowly by 10 “pellets” until I reached half. When I wrote this a month ago I had just switched from 10 to 20 minus pellets. I had been slowly coming off for almost eight months. It took a long time and was awful but Im six days fully off!! 🎉 I still am experiencing a bit of withdrawal. Emotional, irritated, a little wobbly - but nowhere as bad as the first time I tried. I feel hopeful that I will recover. Sure as heck put me off antidepressants for a while tho 🥲

[@Mike_Iz_]

@@mickrozycki451 great job! please go slowly once you go past 37.5mg. I had smooth sailing until I hit that point and everything came unraveled and I had to go back to a full dose. Haven’t been the same since.

[@debbie.doodle_]

@@estelled389or they want you on them forever! Cha Ching, cha Ching

[@NuNugirl]

Thank you. I was taking Lamotrigine and Seroqule for over fifteen years. It took two years to slowly taper off. I’m reaching my one year anniversary late January 2024, completely free and living in my beautiful State 🌴. I carefully planned both endeavors. Everyone be healthy and happy.

[@AlbaLynxQueen]

Thanks for this interview. Altostrata has done a lot for the community.

[@claireh.7605]

Stopped Lexapro around December. In April, was fired from one job, sent to HR for politeness retraining and reassigned in my other job, yelled at my family and showed them the middle finger, and was told in both jobs that I am erratic and there is something psychologically wrong with me. There were other factors too like bad diet, coffee and night shift work though and stress, but I’ve done that for years and was everyone’s favorite at work until Lexapro starting and stopping. Still drinking coffee and can’t stand being around family due to unbearable boredom and anxiety.

[@robertcolman2598]

I totally understand this

[@claireh.7605]

@@robertcolman2598 thanks to these videos, I came up with a coffee taper idea: I buy one brand cold brew in a bottle at the store that has four cups of coffee in it, I drink from it from midnight to midnight and gradually decrease the amount by a mL. I don’t drink coffee elsewhere. This way I have consistent caffeine intake in 24 hours since it’s one brand and one container brewed industrially and consistently. Also I’m assuming it doesn’t have mold in it like cafe coffee makers. The roller coaster of buying coffee is too destabilising for my brain and hormones.

[@adrianfeeger]

wow... this has really helped me understand a lot of my experiences. I have been on meds for 30 years and had a few moments of trying not to be on them with extreme side effects after tapering including mania, which now I realise was really Akathisia. I just didn't get support from my gp as he seemed to not understand it. Now I'm on paxil and manged to drop from 40mg to 20mg but feel stuck at that level. I'm now inspired to look into a slower tapering.

[@estelled389]

Dr Josef you are a God send. Doing good for humanity 🙏 thank you so very much. God bless you. Love from Australia 🇦🇺 ❤

[@ajax700]

A summary of this talk is that depression drugs cause severe damage to persons, many end disabled for many many years, needing a decade to heal, if they heal somewhat at all. Nobody knows what to do to improve, medics or damaged communities, tapering faster or slower, what to do if even tapering slow you have symptoms that seriously ruin your life, like akathisia, or not being able to sleep a bit. I think most can't afford not working many years or decades, and being disabled, not being a healthy partner (good luck keeping a partner in this condition). It's almost impossible to find a medic that knows the few fuzzy principles that maybe will help finding at least some relief for symptoms and stopping further damage. Like extremely avoiding drugs as probably the organism is over sensitive to any substances now, like some antibiotics, antihistamines, tramadol, isotretinoin, finasteride, etc. etc. Also: antipsychotics name is pharma marketing, the old name was true: major tranquilizers. They just heavily sedate, luckily masking symptoms. There are no psychosis biological markers known. antidepressants is marketing, they are very ineffective to reduce depression (worse than placebo) and can cause depression, PSSD, the neurological damage mentioned on this video, etc. Big pharma orwellian doublethink must be abandoned now! Speaking like that we are not going to solve the (drug selling) health system acute problems. I write this with tears on my eyes, this power "war" seems so hard to win against so many millions and billions of dollars of power and influence. Hearing all this makes me cry. Most don't even believe us, they think it's one in 10 million, or we are crazy, or "medicine / doctors can't be so wrong / so ignorant". Josef, you appear smiling on all the photos. We are not, we are crying, every day. For how supposed health professionals not only did not help with our traumas, but have destroyed what was good and healthy in our lives. Best wishes.

[@katherinelalli776]

Thank you for speaking out, and doing so very eloquently! Everything you describe is a perfect reflection of my own long and painful experience. Some of us (I am 57) were prescribed these drugs when there was no counter narrative: no warning of the risks posed by being on these drugs. I was called both non compliant and treatment resistant, my original traumas were never addressed and I was sent for ECT after 'failing to respond ' to multiple SSRI and SNRI trials. After ECT, I was labeled borderline and anti-psychotics were added to the mix. I've been prescribed drugs from every category in terms of psychiatric drugs. My brain never had a chance to heal, the side effects were attributed to my "severe mental illness". Family and friends abandoned me and I eventually wound up on SSDI. Now I avoid all doctors and "social services" because not only am I not believed but these interactions make me vulnerable to being funneled back to "mental health care" which I finally escaped. Everything you say is the truth. Thank you for speaking out. You give much needed validation to other survivors.

[@aliciameeks]

@@katherinelalli776your story sounds exactly like mine except that I am now totally dependent on my husband with no SSDI or recourse for damages. I am painted as crazy and damaged. I don’t disagree but that is not who I was before I went to a single psychiatrist to deal with “depression” without understanding that I was really struggling with grief.

[@catherinemazzie4632]

I have been on them for 21 years. I didn’t know anything about them. I would stop abruptly, and end up in the psych unit. By 2005 I knew there was something else wrong with me. I never had psychiatric problems, but I was a nervous kid, no matter what medication they gave me. It made me very hyper, anxious, and because of what they saw after they gave him the medicine in the hospital I was diagnosed with bipolar. I thought them at first because I knew I wasn’t bipolar. I was 42 years old and never felt like this before in my life I was put on me is by my doctors cover and doctor because she said I was menopausal. My response was yeah I get that, but I felt weird sensation in my head and immediately started crying uncontrollably for three hours straight to the point where I’m hyperventilating , she kept insisting it was depression. I said I wasn’t depressed a half an hour ago and then I’m getting agitated because she’s not listening and she said the agitation was due to the depression, so I thought what harm could going on antidepressants do? I had no knowledge of psychiatric drugs, except that my grandmother needed Valium , but she had Parkinson’s. They kept saying it was serotonin that I was lacking, but when I asked, how do they know that they said we just now. I remember thinking it’s stupid mean that’s my problem, but I have no idea why and years later I was diagnosed with dementia with Lewy bodies and early onset vascular . I was never asked about head injuries, or anything else except those mental illness running your family? I have a couple cousins who are depressed, but that was due to their childhood and it was situational. Finally, I refused to take some of the meds, and they didn’t like that, but unfortunately, I couldn’t do that, and I was switched to mirtazapine by my primary , I was also on Abilify which totally changed the person I was I’m so embarrassed at the way I behaved when I was on that medication and unfortunately lost a lot of friends because of my behavior. I was also in pain management so they assumed my behavior was due to that now I’m terrified to leave my house, because now the people who said I didn’t have bipolar do not believe I have dementia , I read in multiple places that antidepressants can cause depression. Within a month that’s what happened. Unfortunately around that time my marriage was falling apart, I eventually lost my job, and had to go bankrupt and move into my parents apartment upstairs from them. Would that have made me depressed? Yes, but it would’ve been situational and I would’ve gotten over it. I’m angry at myself for not researching these medications. I just took my doctors word for it, all the doctors, because they were the professionals even now. When I bring it up, they’re dismissive years later I found out that I was missed diagnosed with bipolar I was told by the doctor, who diagnosed me that the anti-depressants were the cause of my depression, and I could never stop them because I would have a psychotic break, I am been telling them for years that I am having small strokes and possibly seizures. My friend reminded me if she should I had in my 20s that I totally forgot about. Now I’m on mirtazapine but we cut it back from 30 mg to 22 ish. That was over a year ago and the doctor misdiagnosed me told me it would help the hyperactivity I’m feeling from the anti-depressant and it did but as my dementia gets worse, I feel like I have to cut back again at home terrified to do it, but it’s been over a year and I handled it well so God willing I could do it again. I am so sorry for everything you’ve gone through it angers me that there’s so many of us out there, and still, we are not believed in addition to all of that I kept getting infections and over the years I got worse, and I was in the hospital multiple times a year , they didn’t believe me and kept sending me home even when I vomited blood I thought after my spleen ruptured a week later, they would finally believe me when I told him I was sick, but it actually got worse. I made the mistake of pissing off a psychiatrist when I witnessed what I thought was malpractice , I was very polite and said something to him and he didn’t like it and that’s when he submitted a diagnosis of three different types of schizophrenia and that is still in my records, and since then I haven’t been believed or treated properly I went to and a half years dealing with an active H. pylori infection, and my doctor told me to go to hospital and they will call and he was sa.y send her home and have her follow up with me, but it was during Covid and I was running fevers on and off. Finally, my gastroenterologist had me admitted. The doctors that treated me couldn’t hide their anger out the way I was treated. Friends and family avoid me like the plague in the more they do that the more compulsive I get in reaching out to them and I know it’s the medication more than it is dementia, but even adventure community, they don’t understand, what I’m going through because they don’t have the same side effects, but they were put on a very low-dose, but I was so we started off on a high dose, but didn’t know it had the time. Every day is a struggle I’ve been asking for years how to wean off of these and I finally got an answer. After I filed a complaint with the board of medical examiners surprisingly, they called me back, but I was too afraid to return the call because I know the consequences of telling on a doctor. I think I will call them back because I believe it’s still on my records because they just can’t remove it, usually they put resolved when I see that I think they mean by medication, it’s been a trip from hell work 21 years. Are used to think that psychiatrists just don’t look at psychiatric disorders, but other disorders that have a psychiatric component, I learned the hard way that wasn’t true , they also gave me medication. I wasn’t supposed to take and lied to me about what it was the last time they did that they put in my records that I had poor insight and I was uneducated. There’s more objective views in my medical records and there are actual facts .

[@catherinemazzie4632]

There’s one more thing. It says it doesn’t cause suicidal ideations in anyone, but the younger population, but that’s not true because I got them within a couple of years of being on these, and they say that it could be dangerous for older dementia patients, but not many younger people were being diagnosed with dementia when this came out, so how do they know it’s safe for that community? It’s also frustrating and when you speak up, there’s consequences to be paid.

[@Vic-Meow]

@@catherinemazzie4632please go back and edit your comment with paragraph beaks so people can read it. It's really hard to read because it's so long. I'm sorry for all the damage done to you by the medical and pharmacy system

[@syourke3]

They put me on Effexor years ago, and quitting was absolute Hell. It took me several months to taper off.

[@mamas3cubs]

I'm tapering Effexor currently... very slow much less than 10%, we'll see how it goes..

[@mickrozycki451]

@@mamas3cubs I'm also tapering of Venafaxline (generic Effexor). Even went as far as opening the capsules and counting pellets to gradually reduce the dosage. Have gone down from 150 mg to 37.5 mg over the course of a year. Each major dosage change I wait a month or two to stabilize.

[@ljsc1265]

It's harder for me because I am on a benzo and an antidepressant.. I'm holding at my bezo dose because it helps stabilize me somewhat through my duloxetine taper. I'm at 16 beads. AT this point I drop one bead ever 28 days. I'm not at my best, but not nearly as bad as some experiences I have had in the past. I've come from 120mg cym***/duloxetine from 2018. It's harder now with the small drops. Once I dropped from 18 beads to 15. I had to go back to 18. This is maddening. I had a severe reaction to a Z-pac (azithromycin) I could not move my limbs for about 5 minutes. Words cannot describe this horrid journey. Thank you for this video.

[@mickrozycki451]

Counting beads is the way to go. :)

[@Snowflake1374]

Thanks for talking about this. Doctors should take note.

[@icfda]

Fibromyalgia is a condition of elevated serotonin & a very common side effect/after effect of taking antidepressants.

[@nmeyerho]

As far as why there is a delayed onset of symptoms for SSRI Withdrawal, there is a theory out there that it may take a few months for the autoreceptors to recover and that’s why there are a few months delay before real symptoms show up.

[@ogh63waynorth]

Finding this conversation has given me such hope for the future. The first step for me was dietary changes I've made since discovering the Zoe Science and Nutrition Program which has made an enormous improvement to my mental and physical health just one month in. The next stage will be common off Sertraline safely by following these methods of very gradual withdrawal. Thankyou so very sincerely.

[@brendansmyth5053]

In Australia the worst place to go is your doctor or GP. After my investigation I’ve found it’s the most dangerous place to go. I’m a survivor of PAWS.

[@shan4145]

What does the acronym stand for?

[@brendansmyth5053]

@@shan4145 Protracted acute withdrawal syndrome.

[@shan4145]

@@brendansmyth5053 thank you very much

[@joycewoodard1706]

I have come to realize this about going to a psychiatrist or your GP here in the US.

[@KatJ3st]

​@@jellybeanjedi2372physicians don't have a clue how to treat mental health issues. They just reach for the prescription pad. There's not enough mental health support to refer to. Most people want instant relief.

[@danasarokon887]

wow have i learned alot about myself from this channel!!!! THANK YOU SO MUCH!!!!!

[@estelled389]

Thank you and god bless you 🙏 may we have the strength to see this through ❤

[@celestepiccolo6586]

I have learned so much from this conversation ❤ Thank you!

[@agilli5388]

Allostrata's site Surviving antidepressants saved me when coming off after trying to come off on my own.

[@craftygirl17]

I don’t think there is a safe way to come off antidepressants, even slowly you still go through awful withdrawals when you get to the last dose it’s even hard.

[@shan4145]

Wonderful questions doc. I wish I could talk to Adele 💖

[@catherinemazzie4632]

I tried that multiple times and felt great until the thee to 4 week period. I think it should be done over a longer period of time.

[@Uma921]

Dr. Shipko suggested I reinstate the full dose and get on a benzodiazepine after being hit with akathesia withdrawal after stopping my antidepressant 3 months prior. It was unbearable akathesia and I lost 15-20lbs in a matter of 2-3 weeks. I agree with Adele in that I had withdrawal symptoms prior to the full blown akathesia, but kept chalking it up to something else. The full dose reinstatement went terribly. I’m currently tapering the benzo.

[@adamwiseman6117]

What did you take and for how long? Did you taper fast?

[@Uma921]

@@adamwiseman6117 Prozac 7 years, brief switch to lex, Sertraline 2 years (9 years continuous SSRI use in total). Fast tapered over 1-2 months.

[@AkathisiaWarrior]

Yeah. No one seems to know how to handle Akathisia from withdrawal. They throw more meds at it.

[@AkathisiaWarrior]

And there is no “E” in Akathisia… please help us spread awareness.

[@mamas3cubs]

You can beat Benzo's I finally did after 42 years. I did a water taper the second attempt. VERY SMALL REDUCTION WELL BELOW 10%... 1 year 8 months later. No protracted withdrawal. HOWEVER, first attempt too fast... death would have been a relief, thankfully I tried again. Doctors haven't a clue... do your thorough research... slow and steady... you can win. Benzo's should be illegal IMO. The best to you.

[@DavidCumner]

Thank you for the information you are making available. For people new to this like me, the discussion can be hard to follow, as things like washout and brain zaps are not explained. Can anyone shed light, please?

[@madelenewhite1576]

I've been tapering a 7.5 MG tablet in half of mirtazepine and oh boy I have symptoms. I took this drug for a few months. I was on seroquel for years at 25 mgs and my doctor said stop the seroquel which I did. I had 2 weeks of the worst insomnia but didn't connect the dots. I was awake for 24 hours and ended up at the ER

[@joaquinjosue]

Estou a 6 anos me recuperando da crise de abstinencia provocada após interromper 7 anos de uso da Paroxetina. Nos 3 primeiros anos após a interrupção, eu tive mais de 30 sintomas que variavam de choques na cabeça, crises de panico intensas, tonturas, dejavus, insonia, dores pelo corpo, doença do movimento (cinetose) e etc. Metade desses sintomas melhoraram após 6 anos, mas ainda sinto tonturas e ocasionais crises de ansiedade. Altostrata diz que precisou de 11 anos para melhorar, então eu me apego nisso. Apenas espero que essa mulher não esteja nos enganando, pois eu acreditei nela e estou esperando tudo melhorar, sem tomar nenhum remédio. Faltam 5 anos pra completar 11.

[@terrasini1]

She is definitely not deceiving us. Just remember everybody is different so please do not stress yourself about 11 years timeline which is really an extreme in tne world of PAWS as most people recover in 2-3 years. I am really sorry you still face some of the symptoms and I wish you that they resolve very very soon…and if they don’t please have relevant checkups done to exclude any other possible issues…

[@joaquinjosue]

@terrasini1 minha parte mental melhorou 90% após 4 anos. Mas, ficaram sequelas dos Brain Zaps, tonturas graves, choques na cabeça dormindo e etc. Eu já tinha esses problemas de tonturas e sensibilidade a luzes, movimentos e cheiros antes da medicação pois sofro de enxaqueca desde criança. Porém após o uso da Paroxetina, tudo ficou 1000x pior, os Brain Zaps parecem ter destruído o restante do meu cérebro. Estou fazendo exames muito específicos pra ver se existe algo errado, mas até agora, só a abstinência de Paroxetina explica tudo isso. Aliás minha libido, meu sono e minhas fezes são todos péssimos ainda, mesmo eu levando uma vida bem saudavel com dieta bem equilibrada .

[@angelagrosso2162]

Thanks Dr Josef for all your doing on this subject. It's so very difficult to get off of Venlafaxine 😢 also the med.has beads.....how do you withdraw from that😢😢😢😢 again Thank You

[@jj-nh8lz]

I have been taking venlafaxine for several years. What do you mean by “beads?”

[@Crazydoglady.]

THANKYOU 😊 I also had delayed symptoms 5 months after going off prozac, I couldn't stop crying, I wanted to die, symptoms went away as soon as I started taking it again, so bizarre 😢 my therapist told me it had nothing to do with prozac 🤬

[@MlleJulliette]

I’m just thinking about how crazy it is that brain zaps while on antidepressants have been normalized.

[@krbaran3]

Thank you

[@kimballscharff5913]

Thanks so much for this interview. I got a little lost in jargon though. Can you please tell me what washout phase is? Many thanks.

[@taperclinic]

Its a phase in a study where people are taken off their medications usually its about 2 weeks. The idea is that after the washout period the effects of the last drug aren't in play anymore.

[@johnson00nat]

Dr. Josef if you can do a video on tapering off of Amitripyline Tcas in general I would appreciate that greatly

[@pauljohnston7004]

Any positive store's would be appreciated.

[@DG1234-h4k]

Thank you!

[@cm23307]

Can you please do a video on safe antipsychotic withdrawl?

[@madelenewhite1576]

Thank you so much for this conversation. I want to go very slow.

[@jamesrob8552]

I think about people coming off high doses of long term tramadol must be utter hell because tramadol is kind of like a opioid mixed with effexor. It's got some antidepressant pharmacology mixed with a decently strong opioid(not tramadol Itself but it's main metabolite is a full agonist opioid receptor agonist) so the withdrawal can't be stopped with opioids alone... I can only imagine it being the worst hell ever.

[@catherinemazzie4632]

What about people who have been on them for twenty years?

[@Mike_Iz_]

@@Viper-jk2pfI’m sorry, how did you come off?

[@TheIgnacio777]

Does neuroplasticity from psilocybin help the withdrawal or recovery process?

[@Dylan-pp5fg]

DO NOT consume psilocybin while withdrawing from any psychiatric medications. You will significantly increase the chance you have a catastrophically bad trip.

[@bbqchezit]

I've had a good experience with Fluoxetine, the half-life is very forgiving for missed doses, and it does its job great and in the background. This is great information if I ever change my mind :)

[@helenaquin1797]

Prescribes that for post partum depression. At first, my brain felt so 'on fire', could be introduced to 8 new people at once - remembering all of their names. Then came a point months later (there was no plan from the GP at the time for when to stop), where someone told me what a three letter acronym stood for. As soon as they told me, my brain just could not absorb it. Embarrassingly I had to ask two more times before it sunk in. Decades later, another gp described that reaction as a pseudo dementia. It sure felt like that. A horrible time(!)

[@annt7384]

That was my first anti-depressant. It worked super well managing pms but not so much on my depression. It took a while to figure that out, but what a godsend for pms.

[@laurenschultz9781]

Having anxiety show up after tapering down to .5 Lexapro, I was told it was just my “baseline anxiety disorder“that was returning. How do you know whether it is actually the underlying condition coming back or whether it’s a withdrawal symptom?

[@kadambarichowdhary7337]

How to come to terms when it was your own family who prescribed and does not agree with the withdrawal, they help you with food or moving around but support otherwise missing... And over years have become indifferent holding you responsible for your plight

[@Brenda-l8j6f]

I tried quitting Effexor cold turkey and ended up in the ER and sent to the hospital psych ward.

[@annt7384]

I think it took 1-2 month months going off Wellbutrin with my doctor. It basically stopped working.

[@susanmorgan4151]

Thank you!!!!

[@Ajesais]

Dr. Josef, would you recommend a slow taper off an AD even if, in my case, I've been on it for 6 months?

[@bryanhord9259]

So how do we get in touch with you all?

[@danasarokon887]

I have tried to come off this Cymbalta severeal times now and always have to go back to the dose i was on 120mg smh how do i get off of these meds???

[@Mike_Iz_]

One has to wonder if it’s even worth going off the drugs if you risk permanent neurological damage from doing so. Unfortunately this was not addressed in your interview; neither were the odds of complete recovery after coming off. But otherwise it was a great interview.

[@celestepiccolo6586]

1:020:14 she gave you a HUGE compliment, Dr Josef ❤

[@EC-yd9yv]

Ppl are lucky if they feel well ever again, after any lengthy experience with these poisons..No doubt a zombie apocalypse effect. A complete nightmare to the billions effected by this horror!! And it's legal.

[@Snowflake1374]

Sad.

[@fidesedquivide3486]

Dr. Josef, do you know you look like a movie star 😂🎉❤

[@craftygirl17]

How long were you on Proxitine?

[@bryanhord9259]

How can I get in touch with you or Adele Framer?

[@Tempo50]

Adele works for Outro. Dr Josef charges about $1000 for a consultation. I would google Dr Mark Horowitz who is the founder of Outro. He charges $400 an hour, worth every penny. Google him.

[@dianeensminger38]

How depressing! Just looked at the site. Would have to be quite rich to ever consider it. A program is needed for normal people who can pay a reasonable amount.

[@nouchthom9546]

survivingantidepressants is a free website

[@Mike_Iz_]

What are you talking about?

[@dianeensminger38]

Sorry, I don''t remember now, but I may have been replying to something heard elsewhere on KZbin, but then made a mistake and put it in wrong place. I don't know why put that there because it doesn't fit here. I have listened to most of this talk now and it is very good advice. I've learned somethings I needed to know about this subject. The problem for the patient is finding a doctor that go along with tapering slowly.

[@Mike_Iz_]

@@dianeensminger38 oh ok, I thought maybe you were commenting on his private clinic which is expensive indeed. Yes it’s very challenging to find a doctor but I’m not sure one is even necessary, unless for support/reassurance, prescribing liquid or compounded medication. Most people in the lay withdrawal community I know do it on their own by titrating their dose. Sure it’s kitchen pharmacology but it’s all we have until the medical field catches up.

[@Snowflake1374]

Learned too late. Tapered off too fast. Severe WD 3 and now 6 months off. Dont know if I survive this. Life ruined, cant Work.

[@mandyvasseybryant4618]

I am on 2 mg of Clonazapam and 150 mg Wellbutrin and Cymbalta 30 mg. Can I taper off all? I am 69, so may not have years to taper.

[@mariloudelosreyes2583]

Taper one at a time.

[@Mike_Iz_]

Taper Wellbutrin first, then Cymbalta, and finally the clonazapam. But if your quality of life is ok, I wouldn’t.

[@catherinemazzie4632]

Withdrawal didn’t start for me until 3 to 4 weeks later

[@Snowflake1374]

Same.

[@Heartbrokenforever1978]

The way Adele runs her group and behaves like a god is the reason multiple people have given up. Bluebalou rip.

[@agilli5388]

I didn''''t know about w/d, I cut by 50% I was horribly sick for 2 years bad idea!

[@estelled389]

So sorry its extremely painful I feel you ❤

[@Mike_Iz_]

Then what happened. Did you return to normal?

[@agilli5388]

@@Mike_Iz_ No. I had to stop at 75mg of effexor and still not physically well.

[@Mike_Iz_]

@@agilli5388 I’m sorry to hear that. Something similar happened to me. I got lower though, to 25mg and then back up to 75mg after withdrawal complications and hospitalization. It’s been 2 years and I didn’t get back to normal. Now I have to decide whether to start tapering again. Hbu? Do you have a plan?

[@craftygirl17]

How do you do reductions when they are capsules.

[@ajax700]

Some buy these drugs in liquid form, to do a much slower and precise tapering. Some cut or even crush the pills, and only take a portion of the powder. Don't doubt to go to any damaged by drugs communities to ask if you have any question, like Surviving antidepressants or Benzo buddies, etc. Best wishes.

[@allisonburd6935]

I simply opened my capsule and split the tiny balls. Tapered down very very slowly .

[@angelagrosso2162]

Thanks Allison how did you that with capsules...😮

[@MC-ds5ox]

Open the capsules and sometimes count beads

[@MC-ds5ox]

This lady experienced this problem

[@AkathisiaWarrior]

I thought she was younger. She has blocked me from several platforms. She thinks she understands Akathisia but she doesn’t. I would love to have her on my side but these authority figures hate me 🤷🏻‍♀️ “Akathisia goes away…”

[@sarahpearsall2248]

Who blocked you ?

[@uk8349]

Really

[@shan4145]

THIS reminds me methadone.

[@mamas3cubs]

Devil Effexor ! 30+ years

[@Mike_Iz_]

Damn, you ever tried to come off?

[@mamas3cubs]

@@Mike_Iz_ I am currently... been going well since last week of November until this week now hitting a withdrawal.. not good. Thanks.

[@dorothywillms115]

Hmmmmm a lot of medical speak here. Difficult to understand.

[@michaelcagney2871]

They need to get up to speed in their so called specialty. They cover very little of the subject and they miss all sorts of alternatives to ssri. Why are they even having this useless chat? Many of her answers are appealing and she babbles about nothing.

[@agentblue52]

I'm one month on Vortioxetine. Too many side effects. I would like to stop/taper :(

[@Mike_Iz_]

It’s a tough call whether to slow taper or just come off. My take is after one month tolerance is just beginning so don’t taper years but rather a month or two.

[@agentblue52]

@@Mike_Iz_ Done in 3 months. I am glad I'm over with it.

[@Mike_Iz_]

@@agentblue52 Your off? That’s great! Another case of anecdotal evidence that short term use of these drugs does not warrant drawn exponential tapers. Any protracted withdrawal or are you back to normal?

[@agentblue52]

@@Mike_Iz_ none. Im almost 90% back to normal. Cancer in family caused my depression.

[@mysticmardi]

So you admit you come from the fda and were perhaps quite aware that these drugs were poison. Noble of you to finally let us know. And now that we’re completely freaked out and don’t even know what permanent damage we incurred and who is really responsible but you are profiting from helping people get off them. Sounds very hegelian dialectic; create the problem, (high cost) induce reaction (distress) and provide the solution (for thousands of dollars). Is this ethical? Is it right?

[@NuNugirl]

Explore the meaning of redemption. It’s Biblical and very much real. I might have just helped you find peace ☮️

[@mysticmardi]

Explore the meaning of right and wrong. I may have just helped you find the point

[@ajax700]

Why you keep deleting then reposting videos? You don't like damaged by drugs communities comments? Guess what, we don't like having PSSD and drug damage. Best wishes.

[@Kalley_Kavia]

How about you stop bashing one of the few people who are actually trying to help and raise awareness about the dangers of these poisons? He reposted it to edit it obviously. Best wishes.

[@mariekejansen7658]

Thank you so much 🙏

[@ajax700]

​@@mariekejansen7658 _How about you stop bashing one of the few people who are actually trying to help and raise awareness about the dangers of these poisons? He reposted it to edit it obviously._ The video was perfect, it did not need editing. Many times Joseph has agreed with me. Many times not. I never insulted him. I describe facts and have different opinions. I don't agree these very damaging drugs should be used, as one pill can ruin your life. I don't like he never mentions any non drug therapies. I don't agree with psychiatry jargon and pharma marketing: antidepressants drugs don't exist they are serotonin system disrupting drugs, antipsychotic drugs don't exist they are major tranquilizers (their previous and still valid name). I don't agree PSSD and drug damage is rare, "1 in 100.000" like he said in a video a couple months ago. 6 of 10 drug takers according to Rxisk 4 of 100 drug takers according to pssd network faq Am I not allowed to express myself? In a way I know more than him, as I experienced these drugs on my own body and I'm still paying a very high price for that. Read that in the less arrogant way please, it's a disgrace that damaged by drugs communities know much more than prescribing medics. And I don't have any conflict of interest, as I don't get a cent from what I write or say. For Joseph these videos are promotion of his business. After what some of us have suffered we have to keep vigilant for errors and malice. It seems that healthy critic and different POV are not welcome by some in the damaged by drugs communities. I think damaged by drugs communities are not getting a cure from begging pharma. We are begging to all the health system since 1960s or even much earlier. Obscene obscene profits are more important to them than real patient health. After years of no improvement at all, I have no hope of recover, and if I recover somewhat, it is too late already. I had profound life and relationship problems caused by the damage, there is no way to recover those lost years, those nightmarish moments that should be beautiful memories or to heal those extremely traumatic experiences. No medic has apologized or heard what happened to me. Best wishes, and hope the best for you if you are damaged.

[@Auntie909]

Why are you a troll?

[@ajax700]

@@Auntie909 I'm not a troll. I'm a real person with PSSD. I disagree with Josef on some issues. Best wishes.

[@Vivita257]

This doesn't inspire much confidence as Dr Josef doesn't put his surname. And what's the lady's name ?

[@MlleJulliette]

His name is Josef Witt-Doering (if you go to his profile or look at his logo, you’ll see it) and her name is Adele Framer (on the bottom left of the video).

[@FolaTheMaverick]

Too technical to understand the nitty gritty of what to do!

[@MlleJulliette]

If you need more help, Dr. Josef has a whole playlist on how to taper off his medication.

[@makemoneynow8690]

My daughter (23) protracted after 6 months withdrawing. She wasn't completely off the drugs (Ativan, Olazapam, Lithium). I think she tapered too quickly the Ativan). My daughter stopped eating and got down to 89 lbs. so we had to take her to emergency. Of course, she was put back in the psyche ward and put back on heavy dozes. The doctor wouldn't accept any withdraw or codependency, but just said "Schizoaffective."

[@sarahpearsall2248]

So sorry