How white passing hurt our family

[@mrscreoledavis205]

Your story is very much like my Southwest Louisiana Family’s Story. My Mother's Cousins moved to California and never came back to Lafayette. We never visited them but got phone calls, letters, and pictures. We knew all about them but the kids knew nothing about us. They were passing their whole lives not knowing because of their parent’s secrets. We understood it was their way of survival and making a life during those times. We finally met a few years ago and have bonded as a family.

[@nytn]

I am so glad you met that side of the family. Family in Louisiana has welcomed me in with no questions, it is more than I ever expected. On behalf of the "other side" of the family, thank you for welcoming the reconnection.

[@bobbyschannel349]

I think that a lot of black people who have family members that passed understood why they did it. I read somewhere that Ina Ray Hutton who passed as white... Came From a very large black community in Southside Chicago. Black people from her old neighborhood knew she was passing as white even when she became famous. It's a well-known secret, it happened so much back then...

[@davisholman8149]

I had my DNA done & have a tiny bit of African in me! I am so white, I glow! I also have French in me I did not know about. I am thinking maybe some Creole?? Ms. Davis - my maiden name is Davis! I need to do some more research - my blonde, blue eyed, part Swede children were thrilled about it. I would be so welcoming to any black family members. My favorite part of my body has always been my full lips - thank you great great grandparent!

[@steven0837]

Broussard, Boutte, Melancon, Prader, Thibeaux and all those that married them.

[@mrscreoledavis205]

@@steven0837 they are probably my cousins with those Surnames 🤣

[@gaylemcgregor4353]

Not from Louisiana but have a similar story. So much of your videos resonate for me. My mother was mixed race with light skin. She passed her entire life and lied to everyone about her lineage. It wasn’t until she died and I took a dna test that I found out her great grandparents were African American descendants of slaves. I feel like colonization deprived me of something precious: my family and family history. I can’t imagine how my mom experienced life carrying a secret about her identity. Thanks for making these videos.

[@nytn]

This was so special to read. There are a lot of "us". I can only imagine how your mother was raised to speak (or not speak) about your heritage. I have so many questions that I dont know what to do with. Im so glad you are here Gayle.

[@oc5939]

Similar story here also. When I first figured it out, I replayed my whole life as if it were a film to find the clues and new meaning to everything that I observed and experienced. I resonate with your feeling of being deprived and how racism destroyed the family.

[@tinkthestrange]

All descendants of slaves have been robbed of our family history and culture. White passing is just the evolution of that.

[@gaylemcgregor4353]

@@tinkthestrange I agree. White passing has an added element of gaslighting everyone around you, even your children.

[@Emperess]

African American are not from Africa. The are the true Native Americans. To mess up the History, after they were taken over. There people from India and Mongolia brought in to mix. So the true Native American people eventually forget who they truely are. Many are waking up to their truth. There are so many videos on KZbin. Everything has been a lie.

[@ivyd5485]

My grandfather was born in 1891. No one knew he was black from looking at him. He had a brother who also didn't look black. Growing up we were told that my grandfather's brother left South Carolina for Texas and passed as white. No one, not even my grandfather, ever heard from him again. I guess it was a very common occurrence back then. My grandfather died around 1956 so I never knew him, but I met some older black ppl and when I was introduced to them they'd say oh you're Nicholas's granddaughter and would go on to tell me how "white" he was and how he could pass for a white man. My grandfather decided not to pass and instead married a very dark black woman, my grandmother....well, I was told that his mother was also a very dark-skinned black woman. I can understand both men: one deciding to leave while the other stayed. I can definitely understand someone wanting a better existence and I applaud my grandfather who stayed and without question endured many hardships living as a biracial man in a very segregated south.

[@nytn]

I am always amazed and jealous of people who were raised with the full knowledge of their heritage. What a wonderful story about your grandfather!

[@ivyd5485]

@@nytn I’m watching your journey becuz I get it. I wish I knew more. I don’t know who Nicholas’s father was other than he was obviously a white man who had 2 children with my great-grandmother. It was forbidden to be discussed. I can remember my dad searching so hard for that little tidbit of information but old ppl back then kept many many secrets and they took them to their graves. I can remember as a little girl, my dad would take me to visit my grand-aunt, who was Nicholas’s younger sister. During the visits the conversation always turned to “who was related to who” and my dad would ask her who is my real grandfather (bcuz her father was not Nicholas’s bio dad). All she would say is “boy, leave that alone, there’s no use in you knowing that. 😔😔😔 she was already super old and blind when I was little. She died without ever telling my dad. How heartbreaking for him because he really wanted to know. I’ve discussed with my siblings if we should take a DNA journey of our own but they also want to leave it alone 😭. Who knows what those skeletons in our closet would say?

[@estherstephens1858]

It’s unfortunate secrets were kept so long ago and still do. This day and age secrets are still kept for similar reasons. I guess not much has changed.

[@tooka81]

@Ivy D You should take the test so you can know, you don't have to share it with your siblings. Get closure for your father.

[@beaujac311]

@@tooka81 I second that emotion.

[@akikiwithki4091]

I think a lot of black people claim to be able to tell our own because many of us had family who can/did pass for white. People in my family did. I’ve thought about looking into it but I’m not sure if I want that responsibility. But also, they say that cross racial identification isn’t typically reliable. So I think if you’re white/raised white it’s easy to not see any black in yourself. Where as black people sometimes have more experience seeing people who are different versions of us. At least in America I’ve found that a lot of white Americans really can’t distinguish between other races. I really think it’s because you don’t have to. When white is the standard why would you even be that observant?

[@nytn]

This is really poignant. I will say, the area you live in matters, too. We were all in a mostly Irish/Italian area. When I moved to a more diverse area, I immediately was no longer considered white. It was like a switch had been flipped.

[@akikiwithki4091]

@@nytn that makes a lot of sense. I can imagine that feeling strange too. To suddenly have people being like you’re such and such. My mom is very fair skinned and when we go further south like to Florida and surrounding areas people mostly think she’s Cuban or Dominican. They come up to her and speak Spanish. Where you are definitely matters in how/who people perceive you to be.

[@Catherine-gx7ez]

It's quite easy to tell. We know our own features&it's pretty easy to tell. If You remember the movie"Queen".the story of Alex haley's grandmother. Halle berry played the part of Queen. Anyways,she wouldnt have fooled me,i could instantly tell.

[@osiruskat]

@A kiki with ki, I couldn't have said it better. I immediately saw the mix of Creole ancestry and obviously indigenous ancestry.. I've seen so many and have family members that could pass but identified as "black" because that was how they were raised but let people think they were " White. "

[@michelebradley7813]

I've never been wrong yet at seeing when someone "has Black in them." My grandfather was 1 of 13 siblings. He had a sister who left MS in 1913 ( she was 17 y.o., he was 11 y. o.). He said they never saw her again until 1939 when their Mother passed away. She'd apparently built a whole other life for herself "passing" in WI of all places. We assumed she passed as White, but it was later discovered that she actually changed her name & passed as mixed (White/Native American). She married a white man but they never had any children. IDK how she came to know of their Mother's passing, but my grandfather & a few other siblings believed she kept in touch w/ someone in Pontotoc - but not her family. My grandfather rarely spoke of her, but when he did it was always laced w/a type of sadness: "She did what she had to" or "she wasn't built for the hard life we had to put up with." It makes me a little sad (& angry) to think about her & the family, cut off from each other. Not having those ties, sharing the joy & pain, being a soft place to fall; such a high price to pay all because of racism/ white supremacy.

[@panamasrose]

In terms of being able to tell, or not being able to tell, ask any black person what they think. "We" have always said that white people can't tell, but we can always spot one of our own.

[@nytn]

That has been a beautiful surprise on this journey

[@ucity88]

I've said for decades, "We know us."

[@tinamurray5610]

I can tell I'm African, American I can tell in her mother!-

[@kwikky22]

Her nose looks a lot like an African nose

[@shawnee1895]

@@kwikky22 I thought the same thing of her cousin also. However, her skin is very pale. Thank you.

[@slarvadain188]

Hello Creole family. I’m from New Orleans with grandparents from New Orleans and other parts of south Louisiana. My mother refers to it as passé blanc. My grandmother is very fair and look like an old white woman but she chose not to pass but I have heard all the stories of family in California, Las Vegas and New Jersey that we barely seen. We would get a visit once in a blue moon or the card during a funeral. It took me until adulthood to put the pieces together in my mind. There’s so many stories in my family.

[@nytn]

I love hearing the stories from the "other side" of the family. It is helping put the experiences into context for me...and our lack of experiences that I didnt understand before. I hope you will continue to chime in!

[@ECole-le7we]

I grew up in the South. My parents were both African American; and so I am, too - proudly. My parents both fought against discrimination during Jim Crow. However I remember a photograph on our wall at home of what definitely looked like a white woman. I recall wondering who that white woman was and why was she hanging in a beautiful frame in our house. I learned much later that the woman was my grandmother. I never had the privilege of meeting her as she died before I was born; but I learned that she married a man - my grandfather who I also never met - and who was born into slavery. He and his family escaped their enslavement near the end of the Civil War. My grandmother and grandfather met and married after that. But I also learned that my grandmother had 3 brothers each of whom passed into the white world never to be seen again as far as I know. I remember that when I heard about them, I judged them. "Why would you want to turn your backs on this great African heritage?", I wondered. With time, I have come to judge them less and less, because I was not in their shoes and could not possibly imagine how hard it was for them. I do, however, think of my grandmother in the highest regard. She could have done the same thing, but she chose the truth and the beauty of who she was.

[@kathleens.laroche754]

Not to say, that women never got lynched, but I don't think it was the norm, whereas it was the norm for black men in the South. The stakes were higher for them. It's always good isn't it, when we gain understanding of people instead of judging them?

[@nytn]

I started this journey with frustrations at my family, and now after learning some more...a deep sadness for the world that created circumstances where Lola felt she had no other choice. Thank you for sharing this story about your family and experience. To have family never seen again....because of skin color. It still makes my stomach drop.

[@janedoe1229]

@@kathleens.laroche754 Black men, women, and children were often lynched. It was pretty normal

[@kathleens.laroche754]

@@janedoe1229 Horrific. I'd be interested in your sources of information on this. I will say that the violence against Black people in the south both before, and after emancipation approach being genocidal.

[@mrs.wilson2275]

The south still has sundown towns… it’s 2023.. imagine that smh

[@japeri171]

Your aunt is a very nice person.I was happy when she talked about the work she did for homeless people. Greetings from Brazil!

[@nytn]

She’s wonderful! So glad you got to sit in with us:)

[@mageorge7068]

Thank you for sharing your families story of their heritage. I am not African-American, but Canadian born of Caribbean descent. Colourism, “passing” and many other consequences of colonialism are not primarily an American issue. It is worldwide. Wherever the European’s chose to “discover”, enslave and commit genocide share in familial repercussions such as your family. Maternally, my great-grandparents were French Creole, Indigenous of the Carib people and African. Many hues reside within our clan, and we all deem ourselves as “Black people”. But this is our experience. Again, thank you for this series about your lived experience. I appreciate your cousin, Kathleen, stating that it is important in these times to be careful regarding appropriation of people groups, cultures, etc. I respect the intrigue, vulnerability and honesty each of your family members has expressed. God bless you all.

[@nytn]

Thank you for watching and the kind words, this is the very beginning of the journey I think for us, and it is starting with finding out that this is not just about my family, but it is a larger cultural EXPERIENCE. Shocked me.

[@Louisianamomma13]

Your aunt is so right, it’s about having that respect for others and knowing that our experiences are different. Some people can be very hostile about this topic, but in reality we all must learn from the past a respect others and the culture that they grew up with. I have really enjoyed your videos and hearing different perspectives of the family history. You have done a great job in researching for the generations to come. Like you said, not all are interested in this information, but for those that are, they will have this information that you have worked so hard to discover.🥰

[@nytn]

A fear of not having "the answer" to the questions I was asking kept me from starting this journey publicly before, but I wish I had. Im so glad you are here on this with me

[@cassandraharper969]

L

[@cassandraharper969]

P

[@kathleenking47]

There's also colorism in black communities as well, which could be worse than racism

[@pierrerochon7271]

@@kathleenking47exist now- all over the NBA and entertainment industry - I live in LA and I have experienced some famous black men approach me with ridicule - I remind them just keep your hands to yourself and that I am an ATTY and will get PAID- so if u want to take a shot- go ahead - and I will fall like a feather AND LAUGH AT THE BANK!!

[@ksto1427]

"She moved away" is a very pregnant statement. It means so much more than physically moving to another place.

[@kathleens.laroche754]

Very poignant too, and not necessarily easy. With either decision, to stay or leave, there was a price to pay.

[@nytn]

Yes, wow

[@Saoirse-xt7mi]

My family didn't lose but 2 members to "passing", as far as I know. The family never heard from them again after they left S.C. Two of my great Uncles, my fraternal grandmothers' brothers, could have both passed, but didn't. I think the town they came from was so filled with people who looked like them, that they felt comfortable there. I never thought my father looked white, but just the past 10 yrs I've found out that other people see him very differently. His high school classmates would often laugh about the time a group of blk teenage boys went to Atlantic Beach, S.C. My father was part of the group. After the day on the beach, they were hungry, but all the restaurants that served Blacks were closed. So, on the trip home, they saw an open restaurant. The group asked my dad to go in and see if he could buy some food. He went in, bought the food, and returned to the car. From then on, which was 1953, one of his nicknames was "White Folks". I always felt a little uncomfortable whenever someone told that story, even though everybody laughed about it, including my Dad. Now, I wonder how did that experience really make him feel. I never asked, as more of these kinds of videos surface, I've started to think deeper about it all, and I wish I had asked him. Several yrs before he died, there were two occasions where someone didn't ask his race when filling out forms. They just filled in that he was white. His hospital records never were corrected to reflect that he was a Black man. I really hope this country collectively works harder to heal our deep racial division. Too many people have been wounded with its toxicity.

[@nytn]

Oh my gosh, this broke my heart. Too familiar. We do need a deep healing in this country, maybe it can start with these open conversations that we have never really all had together…

[@pierrerochon7271]

Yeah- I BET THAT NICKNAME WAS OFTEN USED TO BULLY HIM- I HAVE BLOND HAIR AND BLUE EYES-I HAD MANY FIGHTS TO DEFEND MYSELF. I WAS SUCKERED PUNCHED - in high school and had 3 surgeries on my eye over the years- My dad took me out of school 3 weeks before my graduation. Small sample size but -I was at the top of my class - sang ,danced and designed my own clothes- played sports and sometimes was not allowed on the teams- they would say - don't want him on the team- and then try to date my sisters and cousins. NO ONE talks about the dark side of that rejection - it is a gauntlet - from both sides- MY SURVIVAL- FEMALES THAT UNDERSTAND- HELP ME TO THRIVE- I AM IRON- CREOLE FOREVER!

[@Saoirse-xt7mi]

@@nytn I hope so too! You have started the conversation, which I know too courage many ppl can not imagine. Thank you!

[@Saoirse-xt7mi]

@@pierrerochon7271 I'm so sorry you had to go through this. I can't imagine how painful that must have been. I knew there were other kids who faced more torment and rejection than I did, but the level you faced is heartbreaking. I left public school too, but in 4th grade. I was sent to a local parochial school because the nuns didn't allow that kind of behavior, so I was safer. I later returned to public school overseas where there were so many different nationalities of kids in each school, that there was far less of this kind of harassment. I returned to SC in my senior yr, and well, nothing had changed at all! Now, I couldn't care less what anybody thinks! This family has offered their story as a springboard for others to share their experiences, even the dark side of the harassment. Let's hope the conversations continue because we can't heal what we don't acknowledge, and discuss.

[@84tahlia]

Thanks for sharing this.

[@auntieshugah9330]

There was a lot of shame. I feel terrible that they lived that way. It’s ok to embrace yourself. Whole and complete.❤

[@moneybags999]

@Jwill Business Class Online I agree. Right now I'm kind of curious about why this matters at this point. Their line has been diluted & if anything they're at most 1/8 or 1/16 black or less. I don't see any black in them. I would assume they were Hispanic or Southern European if I saw them around town.

[@niecylanae33]

I appreciate your Aunt sharing her opinion. Something she said resonates with a lot that is going on in the world today when it comes to multi-cultural people. Because of the genetic roulette, not everyone’s experience is the same. In my opinion, we as humans need to be okay with not trying to put everyone into a box. Majority of us come from mixed heritage or ancestry but grew up detached or unaware of the traditions of this cultures and that is okay. Once that is discovered there shouldn’t be this pressure to identify as that. Simply acknowledging and appreciating your heritage is fine too.

[@OreliaLatrice]

Great video, Danielle. 😊❤ Ms. Kathleen have a great perspective. She is absolutely right… learning about all of this has to be approached with respect, especially with different life experiences… I respect that. It makes us all unique. No one is exactly the same.

[@simshill295]

We know our own. Thankful for my ancestors that came back after passing that stood proud to be who they really were even in frustrating times to live… for those who could have, thank you for loving us enough to stay and tell the story and still feel good about the family you were born in.

[@nytn]

Well said!

[@davisholman8149]

@Jwill Business Class Online The Queen - do you mean Elizabeth, who recently passed? Where did you see that she has some black roots?

[@corinneskitchen]

I'm curious what you and others think looking at me...

[@jayregal6478]

AFRICAN DNA always finds a way to manifest it's self. Sometimes subtle, sometimes not so subtle. One has to KNOW what to look for!

[@rockyrobleedo3008]

Same with Italian dna!

[@SoulWhisperer]

Just one of the ways that the social construction of 'race' has hurt us all. I have a cousin that passed for white back in the day and married a white man. I was a child and confused by that information. I didn't understand how she could do that because she was cutting herself off from her family. I knew white colleagues when I was a graduate student who had native American heritage but didn't know much about it because it was a 'secret.' Amazing to me. I'm glad you are uncovering the knowledge and know you will integrate it all in a good way for you (and maybe your family, too).

[@nytn]

You are so right, it hurts everyone- we are so much better when we can be enriched by each other's beautiful heritages. Sound so corny, but I do believe it :)

[@carlcunningham294]

I could tell. I can look at you all and tell you were of color. Black people in the South know this because of many of us have family members who have similar stories. My great great grandmother was bi-racial. My great great aunt would go to New Orleans to pass for white on the weekends.

[@nytn]

Carl, I dont know why but that last line "to pass for white on the weekends" made me gasp. Finding that my family is a part of a "community experience" has been THE most shocking part of this journey.

[@nicholaslandry6367]

I realized at like 25ish that I hung out with my "racially ambiguous" peers my entire life It's definitely a thing that happens Also gasped btw

[@Michelle-pn9xt]

She looks white.

[@nicholaslandry6367]

@@Michelle-pn9xt depends on who's lookin'

[@kimmy8218]

@Michelle-pn9xt she looks like a light skin black woman. Many black people have family members who look like them I wonder how they would even pass. The daughter definitely looks black. Black people know their own

[@maegirl78]

DNA is a crazy thing. I am also from Louisiana and I discovered that my great great grandfather was Filipino. He married a woman that I suspect was of creole origin (French and possibly black) but it isn't significant enough to show on my DNA. It showed up several years ago, but as more info entered the databases, the percentages waned. However, one does need to ask who would be eligible to marry a Filipino man in 1850 New Orleans? One of their daughters married a white man, and that daughter passed as white. However, some of his other children were marked as "colored" on birth certificates and some census documents. In fact, he's buried separately from his wife in a "colored" cemetery. What's interesting is that my family line completely lost the Filipino heritage. However, some of his daughters married Filipinos and all of their children did as well. So there are several lines of cousins who are 11/12 Filipino and I'm 1/12 Filipino. It's sad because we missed out on so many cultural elements. We were told we had Spanish blood. As a child, I was often asked if I was Asian despite being very fair. My eyes were very almond shaped. Some of my first cousins were very dark-skinned and could have passed as biracial (black/white) or even Hispanic. My brother looks quite Hispanic. Louisiana was much more of a cultural melting pot than most people can imagine, and it was very common for people of different races and ethnicities to marry. It may have even been as common as it is today, though we don't realize it. The French were known for having mixed race children and even sending them to France to be educated. It's really quite mind blowing to look back into the past and see all of these interesting histories emerge.

[@nytn]

This was such an interesting experience I’m so glad you shared it, to me it had shown me the importance of not making assumptions about how people look, because even in the same family some of these mixed cultures show some beautiful variances in features…but it’s the same family and same ancestors.

[@pierrerochon7271]

my GREAT GREAT GRANDMOTHER WAS THE FIRST WOMAN OF COLOR TO OWN LAND IN NEW ORLEANS- SHE WAS 6 DIFFERENT ETHICITIES- IN 1804 HER PROPERTY - was taken away from her after the LOUISIANA PURCHASE. - WAS ROSETTE ROCHON. I WILL NOT renounce my cultural heritage-GOD UNDERSTANDS- I LOVE EVERYONE

[@JustFluffyQuiltingYarnCrafts]

Danielle, your family - near and distant - are such great interviewees. I could listen to her talk all day. I enjoy speaking to people who express themselves in a clear and matter-of-fact manner like she did in this interview. Thank you, Danelle. ❤Every time a new puzzle piece is revealed there are a dozen more that also turn face up with more surprising bits of information. 👍👍

[@nytn]

I’m so happy to have family agreeing to talk with me on camera for the world to see! 🥰

[@SpiritandTruth72]

Kathleen is a very thoughtful person. I appreciate your empathy, and opened mindedness with the unravelling of these untruths.

[@cgirls.3676]

I love this interview with your Aunt. Such honesty and sincerity. Yes skin color still plays a role today. Lighter in society is better. The key is knowing who you are and being ok with it I am a dark skin black women family from Natchitoches louisiana. Always told I was not pretty or Smart. Overlooked by society. Thank goodness my family never played the color game. I remember a family that lived across from my grandmother. Some of the family could pass and some could not. The world at a very young age made me understand passing and skin color. I have people in my family all shades . Dark, light . Can pass for white, native American and Mexican. Which are all in my blood line. Greatful I know and was rasised that family is family. I currently am not aware of any family that passed . The funny thing is I get people from other cultures ask me what are you mixed with. You can't be all black. 😂😅

[@nytn]

Im so sorry about what you were told, people can be so ignorant and cruel. You sound like a lovely person.

[@PsychicMedium4747]

Not just skin tone, but hair texture, facial features are equally measured with skin tone

[@AncestryAimee]

Thanks Danielle for sharing the discovery of your ancestry with us all! It’s an amazing and compelling story. There are so many people who have similar stories in their family trees! Hope this entices them to discover their family. ❤

[@nytn]

I totally agree!

[@paulacribb56]

I love all your videos Danielle. So much in them resonates with me. This journey is hard sometimes but its one we must take to find our true identities. Stay strong!

[@cheechee7408]

Very encouraging words Paula❤

[@nytn]

Always thankful for you, Paula. So much

[@crystaledwards7146]

Excellent content, I applaud you for having this dialogue with your aunt. I have been researching my family on Ancestry for some time now and I tell my children all the time you have to talk to the older people in the family to understand where we have been and we we are going.💕💕💕💕

[@nytn]

Crystal, 100%!

[@donnascottallport9193]

My mother is half Native American and she doesn't talk about it but she was very dark when I was younger and in the 70's it was really hard on her so I can understand and empathize 💔

[@shawnahall7246]

My papa was the same he told us they built a Indian owned casino on the actual land he lived on as child and it’s a territory and he went to school with Indians and a few blacks and he still denied it

[@jayjohnson9959]

I honestly have always seen black people accepting with open arms to other races. I think being honest telling people look I didn’t experience what you experience but I want to know about my culture and history. I think people will respect that more than anything. Having open honest communication. I wonder if your Aunt would ask her POC friends if they thought she look mix what would they say ? That would be an interesting video.

[@nytn]

That would be! I will say we have been more than welcomed by the communities. Blew me away!

[@marcuscole1994]

Black ppl are too accepting lol

[@khutchinsoncpa1]

This happened in my family from Castor, Louisiana. My brother got mad and denied it. My mother was hurt about it, but it solved some mysteries for her.

[@Iprsmrk]

With passing comes the acceptance that you'll be closed off from part of your family. There is a longing there, but also a price that comes from basically removing your family from a life that's not full of all the dangers and hardships that come with being a person of color. I'm a picture person, so I get sharing those moments but to put the brown family on the mantle would change their lives forever - from the simplest things like walking in a drug store without being followed (that's still an issue in 2023). I'm so glad you guys are having the conversation and connecting now. My heart hurts for what you've lost.

[@nytn]

This comment really touched my heart. I think we are slowly mending this gap between the family. It has certainly opened up my eyes to the very real world of white privilege. If it wasn't real, why would this have happened in our family??

[@spotted_salamander]

Your aunt Kathleen stated it perfectly at 9:07 when she said "My experience is not their experience." It's not that people under a "non-white" classification in the U.S. don't want people of a "white" classification to not "appropriate their culture." It's more like they don't want a person of a "white" experience to appropriate their social experience in the U.S. that they feel is attached to their culture or heritage. For example, your aunt can't appropriate lineage and heritage that is hers that originates in Louisiana and Texas/Mexico. All of that came with her from the time she was born. Again, what certain people would take some issue with is her identifying and living her life, from this point forward, as her ancestors who came from the American South. If Kathleen took up a social cause in her ancestors' name, etc then that would be the thing some people would take issue with. I see it like this: if anyone had a negative critique of your aunt because she chose to do the aforementioned, then that is a person that's still bound to a caste system mentality. And it's this type of mentality that would view your aunt as "appropriating" her own ancestors' experience since she is viewed as "white passing" and lived her life under a "white" classification. My remarks go both ways, by the way. Whatever heritage, culture, or lineage a person chooses to honor and hold in reverence, that they are connected to in some way, then that is their choice. Culture, heritage, lineage, and values are actually the meaningful things that bring people together anyways; it's not skin deep.

[@sproutedcoconut]

My dads white, my mom's Marshallese. We grew up in southern alabama. Bayou la batre. The racism i experienced growing up was scary real. When the white kids in the neighborhood saw my mom with her thick long curly hair that fell past her very big butt, her brown skin and the way her facial features were and starting taunting me that i was a half n***** bc my mama was too. I told her but she told me to just ignore them, I couldnt think of any comeback either since i was half white too so i got upset and whenever i visited my father, i told him about it. He brought me to a photo of a very dark skinned man and told me, "thats your great-grandfather from your nanny's (gma) side. He was half Cherokee and half african american/white." The thing is he went around as passing too. Completely blew me away. Its a bit disappointing to realize many of us dont even know about family history, not too much of it anyway.

[@ofc.s.t.smith-jones9772]

I grew up in South Florida and was surrounded by a similar history. I always suffered silently because I would go into my mother's parents home see these photo's and think similar things to what you're discuss. My grandmother (a black mixed Irish & Afro-Bahamian & African-American heritage) and her husband. My grandfather (a mulatto mixed Italian/Sicilian & Afro-Cuban & African-American heritage). My family has many different Caribbean Islanders of different European admixtures within my greater family. When I was a child my mother wanted me to be Mr. Pro blacky-black Blackman. I was a Caribbean Islander of mixed-race heritage. Am I black, "of course" but I always wanted to respect my different respective ethnicities respectfully. I see myself as a phenotypic black man of mixed racial heritage including Afro-Cuban Irish Italian and other ethnic descents known and still unknown.🤫

[@johnhagans2190]

My grandfather’s sister left GA & moved to the west coast with her army husband & became Hispanic.

[@machellegraves9889]

Both my parents are from the 1940s.Both look white and have the mentality don’t poke the bear. My mom is from Lafayette and my dad from Lake Charles. My mom side always said they were black creole , but my father, who is born out of Louisiana birth certificate, said white. I was always told if anyone asked me what I was say French and Spanish. Until I was 16. I lived in confusion because we lived in the black neighborhood. In Fort Lauderdale, Florida .I knew we were more but I just couldn’t get it out-of them I remember asking my aunt one time and she told me if my parents didn’t tell me what color I was she couldn’t say. I took a DNA test, 30% England 25% French 5% Wales, the rest black from different parts of Africa. Finally, knowing I was so excited to tell my mom she could’ve cared less. She actually didn’t want to even know more . So much pain and secrets makes you wonder how growing up in Louisiana in the 1900s really was.

[@nytn]

machalle, one of our DNA communities was super specific, it was AA and Louisiana Creoles: Lake Charles and Lafayette! Hey cousin :)

[@donhogan6887]

First, I want to say that you are doing great and important work, keep it going; I have watched just about all of your short docuseries with great interest; I am my family's genealogist and historian. As you, I have uncovered a trove of information regarding my entire family history that is bemoaning to some of my elderly relatives. Now for the hard and sad truth: Over 90% of African Americans are of mixed ancestry and possibly not by choice. My great grandfather's paternal lineage goes back to Sussex, England in the U.K where several of my relatives were Knighted by the Royal family. Can you imagine if your Great Gran and others like her fought on the side of justice and equality? maybe our fair country would have such a different history if we were to fight injustice by eradicating bigotry and hatred versus passing while ignoring the harsh treatment that others had to experience. I am a Christian male who is of mixed heritage, but certainly could not pass. Although I am a conservative, I continuously hear the many arguments regarding "white privilege" and does it actually exist. Unfortunately, I have seen far too many documentaries and stories of those who left their relatives for compromise and a piece of comfort. If a "skin color" allows one to pass, then the results are "white privilege." If race didn't matter and "white privilege" does not exist, then why do we conveniently forget about our non-passing relatives? We are Creole, Mulatto, mixed, bi-racial, Dominican and so forth and so on, BUT OH, DON'T CALL ME BLACK! We can be a bi-racial, Chinese/White mixed and proudly claim to be white. Skin bleaching cream washes away the beautiful brown complexions of those who are South Asian and the unique skin tones of the East Asians, why? WHY DOES THE WORLD FEEL THE NEED TO TRY TO GAIN AS CLOSE PROXIMITY TO WHITENESS? Maybe, there is some sort of privilege?

[@nytn]

I think about this very thought, and I appreciate you taking the time to write it out. That's why I still identify as white for the most part, but I don't like how that denies a lot of my heritage either.

[@denisehenry3427]

Your comment is so true, and the answer is yes. I experienced this with my last name. Without seeing me people assumed that I was white. My husband's family were free people of color. A few of his ancestors fought in the Battle of New Orleans and received a pension. They didn't pass for white and they achieved alot. What I would like to know is how did this family feel about Civil Rights doing the 60's.,and now. ♥

[@nytn]

@@denisehenry3427 I dont know if you have seen some of the other videos, I have traced a great grandfather to African and found out about some of my enslaved grandfathers in Louisiana! kzbin.info/www/bejne/q3Lbqq1mppV0atU

[@denisehenry3427]

@@nytn I guess because you are trying to learn about black heritage. You can identify with any color, culture or race that you choose. You have that privilege. Maybe because you don't know the working of black culture or the community, some of the comments may seem harsh.

[@nytn]

@@denisehenry3427 I wish I had grown up knowing about this side of our family very much

[@DeVron83]

Very interesting! I can see the Black heritage in both of you. The culture is so used to Black in every shade that I don’t think it would be a big deal. Also the lady in blue reminds me of my grandmother who had similar features. To the young lady, I think it’s admirable what you’re doing to find your roots.

[@nytn]

Thank you so much, it has become a project bigger than I expected. But I am on this path wherever it leads. Thank you for the kind words:)

[@moneybags999]

I'm black but I am not seeing any features that would "give away" their black ancestry. To me they look like they are of Southern European stock. Maybe I'm not seeing it because I'm not from New Orleans. Lol

[@marcuscole1994]

@@moneybags999Louisiana got a lot of blacks that look like her frfr

[@afromolukker]

Interesting, my Black family has roots in mainly Texas with offshoots to California. But my family are brown to light skin with similar features as the folks in the video. Only difference is that are family was slightly more brown and grew up culturally as Black American. I immediately see my Black American family in them. My ancestors census records all showcase mullatoe @moneybags999

[@cheechee7408]

The past was definitely not for discussion which prompted me to do my research. I feel as though the facts should not be as offensive as it helps to better understand. I love how you unearthed everything. Buried memories.

[@JillASim]

Wonderful interview/s. Thanks so much for sharing your moving family history and for such thoughtful discourse.

[@nytn]

Jillian, thank you!

[@GoddessFlame]

Such a great conversation. Thank you Ms(Mrs) Kathleen.

[@nytn]

Glad you enjoyed it!☺

[@nytn]

@Jwill Business Class Online I think everyone should know their grandparent's ancestry and where they came from. Im so glad I was able to help my aunt and my mom find out about who Lola was in Louisiana!

[@ticiao]

I find this very interesting my mom is from Louisiana. We live in Buffalo NY And moved here as a child. Very light skin could pass if she wanted to, but my mom and grandma leaned more into there black heritage and Native American heritage.

[@tamarpaoli8742]

My mom's dad is biracial and my grandmother was dark skin. My mom is very light, I'm talking being made fun of for how pale white her legs are with African facial features and red hair. With that being my experience growing up with very light skin Black people was a norm so from young I recognize race as a social identity then later socio-political because I noticed the behavior, culture and hair of my white teacher and friends starting in kindergarten was different than what I was accustomed to even though people were the complexion as my mother and other family members . It wasn't until I was a teen and an adult where I realized that people looked at things in the black and white. I had a caramel/brown skin college roommate who told me she considered herself light skin because her family called her that cause she was the lightest in her family and to me having a light skin mother I honestly thought light skin Black meant people with my mother's, yours and your aunts complexion that happened to be Black.

[@nytn]

I am amazed to find how people have been perceiving my family and the issues it caused before, when I didn’t see it or understand. Thank you for sharing your experience with that as well

[@jiladawilliams2503]

Your aunt looks Creole, regardless of complexion. Yes, I am Creole but my white looking mother never hid her race. I’m very proud of that. But I did hear I had family that tragically passed.

[@Joyful_Smiles]

A famous white passing person who didn't want to be claimed by their Black family was J. Edgar Hoover, head of the FBI. But we Black Americans knew he's Black no matter how he tried to deny it or did the awful things he did to us.

[@vixtex]

Also look up President Dwight D. Eisenhower.

[@joannemcmillan9201]

I think also that African Americans are better able to spot white appearing Black people is because we are accustomed to seeing our people in all shades. It’s not uncommon for a family to have 2 children of medium skin tone and one very light skinned child. Because so many slave owners sexually abused their slaves most African American families have Caucasian DNA floating around in their background. Since genetics is a roulette spin sometimes those genes pop up. Thus we have grown better able to see what White people often can’t. You will sometimes hear us say, “ he/she has got some black in them.”

[@ak5659]

I think part of it is that white people don't have a reason to think about it. And there're no consequence for not having that awareness. In northern Europe people insist I'm a native and in southern Europe if I go into a restaurant I'm automatically handed a menu in German. Those are hardly problems.

[@nytn]

⚪ Help me edit videos: buy me a coffee!:ko-fi.com/nytn13 Support more storytelling and get behind the scenes videos: www.patreon.com/NYTN/about Watch the Episode 1 that started the whole journey: kzbin.info/www/bejne/iYLTaJ2bg9WSr8k Watch Episode 2 here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/p4HdgX6Jf8uem9E Watch Episode 3 here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/mH3bkod4naiolbs Watch Episode 4 here: kzbin.info/www/bejne/jXXdZ3mdp5ikors Connect with me on Facebook! facebook.com/findinglolafilm/ Want to know more? www.findinglolafilm.com

[@BlackMagickMike]

I'm from SC. My paternal lineage is also VERY light. They could have easily passed but most did not. In fact, my grandfather was a local Civil Rights leader and my father was a Black Panther. There is one family member who, as was told to me, "lost his mind, passed and moved to London," presumably never to be heard from again. I have a friend of mixed racial heritage in the UK. He has about 10 or 12 siblings. Some of them have claimed the status of whiteness. My friend looks ethinc, though not what I as an American would identify as mixed Black/White.

[@nytn]

"Never heard from again".... I always wonder, are there grandchildren now trying to figure out their roots? I know it cant just be me doing this.

[@BlackMagickMike]

I wish I could share images of that side of my family.

[@sallyintucson]

The skin tone politics are alive and well. A woman I knew was a foster mother. A couple came over to see the baby. Their response shocked her. “Oh no we can’t adopt THAT baby!” “Why not?” “He’s too black.” The couple was African American.

[@nytn]

oh my goodness no😮😫 that makes me want to throw up. I'll take him! 💔☺

[@ucity88]

The name for "skin tone politics" is colorism.

[@Lily_of_the_Forest]

Oh that is sad. I’m so sorry.

[@theninjacat7200]

That is sad...we must love our own

[@julesmum9781]

I love these videos where your aunts and uncles and even a great uncle weigh in on your work. I was stunned to recognize your aunt's last name here. Took a minute till i recalled the radio commercials . . . It's a small world. I love your videos and work. I'm so grateful to have found you. Incidentally, having lived in NE LA in the past, i recognize some of the places you mention. Delta Airlines was started in Monroe. Your great grandpa had quite the opportunity to work down there, professionally as well as meeting Lola!

[@nytn]

That’s amazing! I need to look into the delta thing. Wow

[@julesmum9781]

@@nytn yes that would be good. There may be some controversy regarding where Delta started. I do know the name is after the Mississippi Delta which is widely considered the area from Memphis south on both sides of the river

[@justicesmith1934]

See how your family beginnings has inspired others to share. Don't stop keep going you might even find out you have relatives who are subscribed

[@nytn]

That would be so beautiful! Thank you :)

[@LilliLamour]

These stories (White passing) aren't solely belonging to Blacks in Louisiana. This was common to Blacks across the south. It amazes how my family here in Texas looks so much like this family. Records show my family wasn't even recorded as Black until my mother's birth.

[@lindabeck3412]

You are making my sister & me pick back up the genealogy works again. I have shared a couple "stories" with you already, & hers another short one. So, one day maybe 4 years ago I was flipping TV channels& Ohio State Football game was on( I am from Ohio) well OSU had just won the game & the player who scored the winning touchdown - was- and the announcers gave his name & a pic of him on screen. Well, he is Black & from SC I believe. The guy had our last name! And, our last name is very uncommon where I grew up & believe me I had to spell it every my time no one knew how to spell it! But what I found is that unique name while uncommon in North is very common in the south both of white & black families. Recently we found that the ancestors came from Scotland to SC & then a chunk of them disapproved about owning slaves & they left settling in rural Ohio. The rest stayed here in the south. My sister & I are still searching through things.

[@bihsaidwhatnow2392]

Linda, 2023 has pushed me to "speak up and correct the tribe and/or village when necessary." Today it is necessary. Please review your comment and know that the FBA / ADOEP are no longer accepting the word/term "slaves." Instead, in taking back the dignity that was stolen from human beings, please introduce yourself to and become familiar with the wording, "enslavement." To illustrate, I will help you with your sentence revised for the dignity of another's experience . . . . *[ & then a chunk of them disapproved about enslaving African people]* Be Well! 👌

[@Catlily5]

I have ancestors who were in SC and moved to Ohio because they didn't like slavery. They were Quakers. But our name is common.

[@nytn]

Im so glad you are doing it with your sister! That sounds so fun. Keep me posted

[@lindabeck3412]

@@Catlily5 My sister found some information about the ones that left SC & moved up to Ohio moved up with Quakers.. Thanks , for the comment this is so interesting

[@clementmckenzie7041]

In my Jamaican immigrant family passing was the most controversial and unacceptable thing a family member could do. It was common knowledge if you chose to do it, you would not be welcomed back. Don't send letters, don't come to funerals don't send wedding gifts, or even a birthday card, they would be returned. My grandmother's sister was turned away from their mother's funeral at the church door. Her brother and his wife day passed. Which means they were white at work and black at home. That was the most common form of passing in New York, but to live as white all the time was just not accepted as respectable to middle class black families back then. They saw it as a thing the poor who didn't know better did. Colorism passing as classism. We from time to time get a white family member who will contact us looking for answers. However we have found that being part black in the abstract is normally as much blackness as they can really deal with on a day to day basis. Whiteness in reality is too valuable for them to really want to adjust their racial identity from white to mixed race. Never met one willing to consider themselves black. Not even the ones where all of their grandparents were passing. It's just too much for them to give up much less take on. I can't really say I blame them. We just don't live in that world yet.

[@pamallen6372]

@clem. Very interesting read.

[@davisholman8149]

There are opportunities where being mixed race would be an advantage. Some places are hungry to give opportunities to people of color. Getting into Harvard or Yale for instance. I know in my industry (Pharma/med device) they are definitely going to hire someone racially diverse vs white if both candidate have similar resumes.

[@clementmckenzie7041]

@@davisholman8149 if this were true, Harvard would have a higher African American student body than 15% and you wouldn't find so many black people with college degrees working with coworkers white coworkers who make.more money than they do without a college degree. The , rather offensive scenario you laid out, is a tall tale told by fox news anchors. It's far from the reality lived on the ground by black people. In reality black ivy league students tend to be better qualified than their white counterparts and the same is true for black new hires. This is how it really works, I worked at the number one hospital in America, it had a rule against hiring people with a criminal record however whenever the candidate was a young white man HR sent me a story about him having trouble in his youth but he had turned his life around. In ten years I never got that story regarding a black applicant. I was the only black department head and the only department head with a masters, I wasn't even considered for the post until I had completed my masters. I know there is a segment of the population who have convinced themselves that what you wrote is a thing but in reality it's not, your qualifications have to be better not similar in order to be considered as a diversity hire. The so called advantage is just a bigoted right wing talking point.

[@ak5659]

"Not even if the grandparents were passing" ... Interesting. My dad's father and his family insisted they were all Irish and German .... And let's just say available data does not support that. But now their lack of both knowledge and interest in family history makes some sense. I still want to research it on my own now that everybody potentially involved has passed.

[@bihsaidwhatnow2392]

My dear NYTN: Beautiful interview/conversation with your aunt, Kathleen. I still think Lola-the-Ancestor is the one who has gifted you with this treasure chest that at times, may feel like Pandora's box. . . .who is saying, "Stay the course, you represent so many people not just in your bloodline, features, and culture-blending, but in this new light that is coming forth." Go ahead, Go forth, and as you uncover the hidden, may you always SHINE🕯NYTN! Encouragingly, your sister in this tribe called "New Quest"

[@nytn]

What a beautiful gift to read, I feel so encouraged by this!

[@kb5fhk]

As much as a lot of people try to avoid it, colorism and white privilege is real.

[@leotajackson5602]

This situation has popped up in a lot of our ancestry journey. I applaud you for being honest

[@jynnefer]

Oh my, I love your channel. I appreciate you being so open about your experience! It creates more authenticity in the world. I am culturally “black”. My DNA says I am a bunch of different things, from my lived experience; it seems like nothing else matters , only that I am considered “black”…it’s the one drop thing. I see how I and others like me have been stripped of true cultural roots because of the labeling based on the black /white line. And then I remind myself that I am so much more than a color or a culture… I am a soul and spirit inside flesh and bones. 🙏🏽

[@chestchirecateyes]

What an interesting conversation!

[@toyatee1077]

Born and raised in New Orleans, Louisiana. I swear I see so many people that look like there could definitely be some “black” in their family. Being that my own family complexion range from my complexion to even lighter. It’s just easy to spot. Nola is considered a melting pot. At the end of the day most likely we are all related in some kind of way. ⚜️

[@juniorgemini8076]

This is very very good information am glad you guys are not ashamed of yourself or your roots.

[@lindasmith9834]

It seems the family is still in denial of their biological identity. My family goes from blond and blue to the deepest, richest, most beautiful chocolate. We love, embrace, and acknowledge one another. We are family. ❤❤❤️

[@marygoround1292]

I live in Buffalo and I'm not going to lie, it's kind of wild that you are William Mattar's niece. That being said, this journey you're on is amazing, painful, but amazing. Keep up the amazing work!

[@nytn]

That's awesome~ yep we have a million pens floating around that say "hurt in a car? call bill mattar"

[@sr2291]

My best friend growing up had light blonde hair and literally pink skin that burned in the sun. She had Irish in her too. Her mom had black hair and her dad was swarthy. I found out her dad's father reported he was "Indian" on his military record.

[@annstephens3698]

My granddaughter is fair skinned (with freckles), has blue eyes and blond hair and is 10% African heritage.

[@nytn]

Thats a very similar breakdown to ours, which means Kathleens gram Lola was about 40% African (and about 40% Native Mexican).

[@albertaatieno]

She sounds beautiful and white.

[@cherylcarter6426]

I remember hearing about Clarke Gable being very defending of Africans because his ancestry had African in it. He could pass as well.

[@cocopucks]

I want to first say this is a great series - thank you for sharing. You cannot appropriate a culture that belongs to you..I do find it interesting that people of african ancestry are worried about appropriating a "culture" they didnt experience but they don't seem to have the same concern when it deals with indigenous, European or even Asian cultures. It feels very anti-black to me. It also feels anti-black when discussing lived experiences- black people are not a monolith and there are all types of experiences that exist not just poor, uneducated, etc. There is still a highly valued social currency associated with being "white" and associating with "blackness" doesn't have any or much value. There is a lot of comments regarding phenotypes but no discussion around where that came from "looking black or white" is not a scientific thing...is a social categorization meant to put one group on top and ascribe less human/intellectual attributes to the rest.

[@rejectionisprotection4448]

Preach. The only time being associated with Blackness is helpful is in certain areas of the music industry.

[@nytn]

Oh this is good, thank you...I think it's probably hard for my mom and my aunts (in their 60s now) to suddenly understand this whole new identity that I uncovered. we are still so disconnected, although I am working on that. For me, I am teaching my kids who we are. Here are a few videos on our enslaved ancestors that I was able to find: kzbin.info/aero/PLvzaW1c7S5hQxDnyRTah5wYRX9b4FSrqR

[@mybit7470]

Those who preceded us lived in an era that had its own challenges. They made what they thought were the best decisions at the time. It might have hurt or denied us important family information. We can learn several things from the stance they took.

[@phyllisjohnson8456]

Being black back the was SO hard and limiting, you can kind of understand people passing, it must’ve been hard because you have to leave your family behind. All light people didn’t pass though.

[@theninjacat7200]

Very true. All light people didn't pass

[@TheAdrian7826]

Your Family is similar to my family here in Oklahoma.We have The Native American,Dutch,European and Black ancestry.A lot of our family history is still a mystery.I enjoy your vids keep it up !

[@nytn]

Thank you , Adrian! :)

[@isabellaburnett]

Just so you know - Black people see it all the time while Caucasian often do not.

[@dinkster1729]

Maybe, whites don't care to analyse every nose, eye colour, skin colour, etc. especially in the multi-cultural North where everybody has a few oddities about their bodies. If you looked at my family of origin, my sister, brother and I would be taken to be French-Canadian whereas my other sister was blonde and blue-eyed and displayed more our German and Norwegian characteristics. A French-Canadian friend of my sister's brought her home one Christmas and noticed the French-Candian name on my mother's mailbox and said, "Oh, I didn't realize you were French-Canadian." She would have known looking at my father, or my brother, or my sister or, even me, but not her friend whom she had known for many years. I wouldn't say that my sister was "passing". She just used her first husband's name in Toronto--Dawe and, after she remarried, her 2nd husband's name "Giovenazzo". I use both my maiden name and my husband's name. People have asked me if we are Scandinavian when they look at my daughter who is fair, with fair hair, but hazel eyes. Actually, they know I'm French Canadian from my appearance and assume my husband is Scandinavian. The family name Inkster is from the Orkney Islands and, many Orcadians have Scandinavian DNA. I also have German and Scandinavian roots.

[@isabellaburnett]

@@dinkster1729 it's not analytics - just conscious of the 1 drop rule that a nameless group applied to us. It wasn't our invention

[@v4756nb1rs]

I love being Creole, and I'm glad to have found your channel! Being white passing certainly is a mire.

[@nytn]

Welcome!

[@ak5659]

My ex's dad was from Barbados. He was the oldest of 13. The 13 ranged from extremely dark to passing. IIRC, nobody was surprised because all shades were present in earlier generations.

[@silentnight9655]

Yet there was no marriage between Afro and Euro Bajans even now in the 21st century. There is still segregation.

[@iworkharvey4103]

This is a great (but not unique) American story that needs to be told for a variety of important reasons. Recognizing the real undeniable truths of our multicultural and divisive past is the path toward healing us and moving us toward a more vibrant collective multicultural future. Thank you and God bless🙏🏾

[@elanajenkins476]

Thank you for sharing your story. I have some similar stories in my family... The maternal side of my family originates from North Louisiana the Shrevport and Monroe areas. There are stories from my maternal grandfather's side of about the "White" side of our family who never actually claimed the black side even when presented with undeniable evidence of our relatedness. There is also the story of my maternal great grandmother who was jailed and then run out of town by the Klu Klux Klan because she liked (loved) to date white men. She was a very dark-skinned woman who lived life on her own terms. My grandmother, who was a young girl at the time, said that the Klan showed up at their house one night and told my great great grandmother that her daughter would end up dead soon if she didn't get out of town before sunrise. That's how my grandmother ended up moving to Detroit where I was born.

[@nytn]

Oh my word, this left me speechless. The more I am able to find out about what actually was happening the more I understand the choice my family made to leave and never look back. Lots of family is still in Monroe right now, but our side is up in NY and never went back 😌 thank you so much for sharing this, I appreciate it

[@zemry]

Monroe is my home town also.

[@bobbyschannel349]

I have a couple of answers for your aunt.. As a person who also had family member who have passed.. And coming from a predominantly Black American family. Black Family members understood what they were doing. when a family member passes. They understand that it's always for survival. And as a result they kind of give them freedom and space. in most cases.. They understand the risk, they understand the danger.. Outing someone .. getting in contact with a family member who are passing could be risky For the family member who is passing.. In the case of Ina Ray Hutton. Who came from a predominantly black community in South Chicago. When she was passing as white. (By the way, Ina Ray Hutton was a famous band leader in the 1930s and 40s who passed as a white women her and her sister June Hutton) Black people from Ina Ray Hutton's childhood community knew her family, and they knew she was passing for white, but they said nothing. typically, family members will get out of the way in most cases.. Louisiana, has a huge mixed-race heritage and identity. I think I told you this before... That almost everyone in Louisiana has mix heritage. whether they know it or not. In the late 1800's and early 1900s in Louisiana, there would be aristocratic white men who would have two families. A black one and a white one.. The black family knew about the white family, but the white family did not know about the black family. And the reason why is because the black family knew their lack of opportunity choices and in a white supremacist America at the time... It was apartheid Back then...That was typical and it happened a lot in new Orleans.. So family members allow their family members to pass in peace. They do not do risky things that could get their families members caught.. and that includes getting in contact with them. Because it could be quite dangerous. Especially coming from the south.

[@nytn]

This history is heartbreaking, but I am finding it to be very very much the story for this side of the family.

[@bobbyschannel349]

@@nytn A lot of people are learning, because a lot of people passed as white. Did you hear the story of Gail lukasik. I was looking at KZbin videos of her on Megyn Kelly show she was telling her story that was very similar to your story.. Her mother came from Louisiana and moved up north to pass as a white woman.. Her mother was also a creole woman.. The actress Rebecca Hall, her grandfather passed for white. She just discovered the background of her family story too LOL. And she did a Netflix movie about passing based on Nella Larsen's novel quicksand and passing. so it's all a part of American culture everyone is finding out that they had white passing family LOL

[@nytn]

@@bobbyschannel349 I love finding out this side of the family story. I did hear about both of those women. This whole experience has taught me not to judge a book by its cover

[@denise3422]

I don't think the family accepted that it's was shamefully to talk about the rape that resulted in the mixed race children. Think of how many racist don't know their true heritage

[@ladylioness9808]

You are absolutely correct. It was very dangerous to be caught passing. Many people passed in my family. They couldn't be seen together in the day. They would visit at nights and stay in hotels. My great grandpa got his mail at the post office, my great grandmother couldn't hers came to the house. (They used separate mailing addresses.) He went in the front door of establishments she never could. He had to meet her around back. People passed for better opportunity as my grandma would say "times was hard". Her dad passed which brought more money in the household but unfortunately it created a colorism problem in the family. Her siblings split down the middle by the color line.

[@Joyful_Smiles]

Black Americans can tell because of our lightskinned family members and historically we know what the different variations of us look like because of the laws. Biracials, quadroons, octoroons, and etc. were still part of the Black family and identity. Even though they had light skin or could pass they suffered terribly from racism and had no real opportunities. For example my great-great grandmother was white passing and appeared white to whites. Until she was hospitalized in her elderly age. They gave her good treatment and she was recovering until her Black children came to visit her. That's when they removed her and refused her anymore treatment and let her die. Our family is still hurt over her cruel unnecessary death even though that was generations ago. Also going to the octaroon ball was not a privilege or being light enough to be a prostitute to a white man wasn't ideal. The whorehouses would be labeled based on your mixedness. Octaroons and quadroons were separate whorehouses back then and those houses got the "better" clientele and money. Those who wanted a better life went away and we never heard from them again.

[@kic.7679]

Um Auntie, they definitely look at you and know. Trust that.💙

[@nytn]

I loved this. Thank you :)

[@mgriffith32]

I'm just saying... They know!

[@gaylefrederick]

Auntie looks like a light skinned black woman. She obviously sees herself differently.

[@KC-ke7kq]

I went to highschool in Monroe, LA. Great content

[@tbyas4406]

To live a life passing was a financial matter.

[@julieennis6929]

As Black people, many of us having family like yours, can tell. In Md where I am from we have a large community of tri-racial people. Lola and those like her strategically married White and pushed her family to do the same to erase her past. I found my White passing family in Penn. I talked to one and they went so far out to not be Black and erase it that some are racist.

[@cherylwade264]

Some people think it is only racism. It is not the people who chose to leave the South because of racism and segregation did that to live a better life. There are many people who choose to leave their former countries For opportunities they could achieve in the United States of America. Imitation of Life was a good movie.

[@Joyful_Smiles]

A famous person who thought they were white but whites labeled her differently was Johnny Cash's ex wife Vivian Liberto. She was Italian and Italians thought their pale skin was enough to identify as white. But she had Black or ethnic or mixed features and so therefore could not pass as white and they ruined her marriage to Johnny Cash. Based on her features she looked biracial or quadroon.

[@janedoe1229]

Very good work. Thank you

[@nytn]

So nice of you

[@katjones5187]

At my Grandmothers funeral, I remember seeing a group of "white people" sitting in the rows reserved for family members. My grandmother never really talked about her family members at all but she was a light-skinned (not passing) Black woman. I later found out that her father was the son of a plantation owner who left land/property to his son which we still own today. Many of her family members moved North and continued to live as White. I've never seen those individuals again (since her funeral) but I've heard many stories about them. I suppose they choose to separate themselves to continue living a comfortable life.

[@nytn]

Kat, I have heard this so often once I began talking opening about our family story. I had no idea it was a "community" experience. It still shocks me. I hope it is not too late for us to reconnect to our family, we are working on it!

[@IAMABUNDANT888]

I have cousins that look like your aunt. We come in so many shades.

[@pandoraroy117]

My lighter skined sister had nothing to do with me her whole life.

[@nytn]

this absolutely devastates me to hear., I am so so sorry. I had a relationship with a very close immediate family member blow up because they didnt like me doing this family research. Literally blew up the relationship. Was not prepared for that.

[@TaShawnaMoore-l1y]

This COLORISM thing is strong, alive and well. I've been sitting here watching these videos and TRIED EVERYTHING WITHIN ME NOT TO COMMENT, BUT YOUR COMMENT DID IT FOR ME because it is TOO SIMILAR TO THE STORY THAT MY 89 year old Nana, who just passed this September, told me about her and her siblings. Nana told me that her lighter sibling, Helen, lived with THEIR aunts in Baraud Park who were teachers and/or nurses. I can't quite remember their professions, but because they had money and could pass she was with them. She told me that our family owned a store on Brambleton Avenue and that whenever she would see Helen, they were on OPPOSITE sides of the street. And, that she and/or their other siblings couldn't directly speak to Helen because she was lighter. If they did speak, it was done SNEAKILY. Like Helen would pretend to drop something or pick up something from the ground to detach the hand from the aunt's hand to PREVENT HER FROM FEELING OR SENSING THE SNEAKY WAVE OR LOOK. My grandmother would pucker her lips with a semi-kiss really quick, as this was their secret communication to each other that SHE and HELEN had to come up with one of the times that they did see each other for the times that they wouldn't be allowed to acknowledge each other. Her lighter skin made her so much of GIFT that I was told of a story where Helen ate peanuts that nobody was supposed to touch, but blamed my grandmother for it and it WAS AUTOMATICALLY BELIEVED AS TRUTH !!! MY heart aches knowing that they endured this !! I cried when she told me this because I've always been taught to LOVE MYSELF AND TO BE TRUE TO MYSELF, IF NO ONE ELSE. My Nana also married a mixed man (black and white). His mother, which is my great grandmother, was white and black with "that look". "That look" is the look that reveals you've got black in you no matter who long your hair is, how fine your hair texture is, how light you are, how poised you are in regards to certain characteristics and mannerisms that most attribute to a particular race. Some of my family members discriminate based on our hair length, hair texture, and size of our nose by thinking that these phenotypic traits somehow makes them superior to others who don't possess the same. My hair is long and has MIXED TEXTURES. Like literally white folks hair in the front that I try hard not to process, is wavy towards the middle like Puerto Ricans, TIGHT CURLY PATCHES IN TWO SPOTS ON THE SIDES AND WOOLY TEXTURE TOWARD THE BACK MIDWAY IN WHICH I THANK THE HEAVENS FOR ITS BEAUTIFUL, EQUALIZING RESPONSE TO CHEMICALS. And, this ALLOWS for EASIER MAINTENANCE FOR ME. Smooth, comb through hair is easier to work with, especially when TIME IS AN ISSUE. However, I diverged to bring me to the next point of realizing just how real miscegenation is. It's not by happenstance that my hair has all of these textures !! It's because of the GENE MIXTURE and that gives true insight into who I really am. Knowing this is important because it allows me to be the purest form of my truth to myself. After all, this is what I was taught and believe. This brings on the EMOTIONAL TRAUMA that these people had to endure. THE TRUTH IS ALWAYS BEST and NECESSARY. So, I have empathy for those who had to choose denying who they were in order to survive, as their very breath and life depended upon it. I don't blame them for making the choice to LIVE WITHOUT HELL IN A SOCIETY WHO BOLDLY HATED PEOPLE FOR THEIR COLOR AND THEIR DECISION TO NOT WANT TO BE DEHUMAMIZED AND NOT WORK FOR FREE. Stress can kill you. So, I don't blame them, but the war with their conscience, morals, values, principles, and integrity was major. Disliking people for factors that have no control over gives off MENTAL ISSUES. Stories like these reveal how sick the ones in control really were and still are. To expect someone to turn a blind eye to pain is horrific. Especially, when they love to push the narrative that they don't see color and race, say we're pulling or using the race card, and try to pretend that the obvious are figment of our imagination.... THIS "GREAT" LAND IS SOMETHING ELSE.

[@mightymulatto3000]

Sad that she had to make that decision to leave. Never thought about bringing kids into that paradigm. I recall hearing once of a receptionist at the Dr's office in Arnaudville, LA who would call white people ahead of blacks even if the blacks had been waiting long before. The Dr. came out saw that people were still waiting and asked why they hadn't been seen yet. He then yelled "You don't do this to people!". From that day forward everyone was treated fairly. Interestingly before he opened that office he actually took care of us at our home for decades. Our family varies from light skin to very dark. We were told about the Spanish moss hanging from the cypress trees being the result of blacks being hanged and that we shouldn't be fooled into believing we were different. In terms of your aunt she should go on that journey. She has a birth right and might I even say an obligation to make sure her ancestors aren't forgotten given future generations will eventually find themselves longing; it is a very fulfilling experience.

[@johnhagans2190]

Read Langston Hughes short story “Passing”.

[@nytn]

I have a few of his books around, I dont remember that story but I also didnt know what passing was when I bought those books. I'll go look today

[@2dimitropolis370]

When I look at you I see Aztecs. I, a European, would never think, first time seeing you, that you are white of any black. I see Aztec. Native American. And that's so beautiful. Also your mom. Pure Aztec. Your auntie in the other hand, white. All the way

[@chastitybaylor3585]

MUCH LOVE FROM NJ. I CAN RELATE TO THIS SUBJECT MATTER AND YES ITS VERY PAINFUL BUT PASSING WAS USED TO SURVIVE AND TODAY PEOPLE STILL PASS FOR ACCEPTANCE THIS IS A HARD TOPIC TO DISCUSS MUCH LOVE FROM NJ TAKE CARE GOD BLESS

[@khayeel634]

I had two great uncles that passed. One moved to Montreal in the 1920’s. The other one we never heard from again!

[@neiloliphant1177]

Could the word mullungeon be derived from melange the French to mix?

[@rupenupe1]

Both my Grand mother and great grandmother moved from NC to St Louis then Chicago. They could pass as white to work for the postal service. Both married black veterans from ww1 and ww2.

[@astrobreaux]

pale doesn't matter. my mom pretty much glows in the dark and her dna says she is 1% caucasion.

[@nytn]

LOL. I love this.

[@lelelum4103]

😂😂 this made me laugh bc my family has called me a glow worm

[@travelingva]

I think it's fair to say that the "whiter" ancestors that have for one reason or other ended up on the "white" side is a fringe part of the african american experience and culture can be embraced at anytime. There are people finding out they are 10% Italians and are enthusiastic about learning about their culture it should be no different just because of your experience or lack of prior knowledge

[@jirensentry7609]

Here is what I am hearing and thinking: Coming from any country that has you or your ancestors dark in skin tone and getting to go to the United States and over a quick time, compelled by the racial caste to *pass as white*, having the view that in order to get the best possible changes, chances and opportunities afforded to those who can pass, you deliberately choose to do so for your children because you fully can see what can/may/will happen if you don't and therefore steer every family member directly or indirectly to do the same... As Black people... we hear this... see this... hear about a face chart that has black faces on the side of "pass as white" or whatever it said... see and hear that Indian Asians are doing everything to pass and see themselves as white... and listen to this story... and I look at my skintone... the faces of my family - we are African, White and Blackfoot to say the least - my eldest brother in the sun on a cruise in Barcelona... man I tell you he seemed like a man from Italy or Spain or something... anyway, I come away thinking how none of us could ever pass for white... and so many are forced to go Republican, deny ourselves, deny the culture or identify the worse about us as the culture... and do everything possible to be accepted by White people... And it pisses me off! Why do I have to sell my soul to get a fair shot in the United States regardless of my skin color? And in this political climate... everybody's wondering why Black people focus so much on racial climate!!! We here this and are reminded that we can't walk away from our heritage, skin color and the like. We are forced to live day by day to accept who we are! However, there are millions - poor, blue collar and famous trying to whiten their skin as best as they can! Lil'Kim? Tiny of Excape singing group. Man, even Indi'Arie lightened her skin. So did Dawn Richards of Danity Kane! There are millions more! The United States has done a very cruel number on us all...

[@ns-wg4vz]

I come from a country that compares to the USA very poor but what we rich in no matter what we look like we just citizens from that country not have this black white can't tell problem hope one day you all see your self Americans

[@donhogan6887]

Unfortunately, Darwin's theory of evolution helped foster in the skin-color hierarchy.

[@bmiles4131]

@@donhogan6887 no, it was slavery and greed. Originally based on religion ( we can break the Commandments on these people as they aren’t Christian…), then people taught Christianity to enslaved people in the Caribbean and the white folks realized that freed POC could run for office and maybe get rid of slavery. So they decided to make it about skin color. Obsession with skin tone happened because race was used for slavery and in order to justify that, they had to try to say black skin tone was bad. Generations of propaganda equating skin tone with inferiority to keep justifying slavery based on skin tone caused colorism. In the 20’s, they tried to twist around some science to justify, but it was when the kkk was going all out to keep the status quo. It all goes back to old fashion greed and years of propaganda to justify it.

[@cirellaw]

If you are passing, that means if your parents or close siblings die, you couldn't even go to the funeral. You don't want anyone to know you are related to these black people. Sad.

[@nytn]

Yep, we had zero contact, and no idea

[@henriettaabeyta1457]

💜 A bit like my granddaughter before the recent pandemic of Covid feeling pain suddenly when being laughed at in public while helping an African American because his fake friend couldn't tell she's actually a light skinned Hispanic not actually white.

[@valeriegrey8795]

Well we do know our own and the fairer complextioned cousin your hair texture is a give away. We would be excepting of you in our culture. Because of the former enslaved 5th grandfather's daughter you exist today and all on the family tree for generations!😊 Bless the Creator!

[@suzanneyoung8011]

I don't believe that Lola moved to New York so that she could pass as white. It's because that's where her husband was from as well as where he had the opportunity to work after the worst of the Depression. He met Lola while he was working in Louisiana but probably never intended to settle there permanently. My mother was a child during those times living in Texas. She had an aunt who moved to California who had one child before dying at a young age. My mother never met her cousin because he lived so far away. It was very common for families to not visit each other if they moved away because it was so costly to travel for a family, and the roads were not that good back then. So, like Lola they would write letters and send pictures. The difference is that Lola didn't share the information with her own family. My belief is that is possibly because it was her way of protecting them, and it could have been very difficult for her to discuss. She was also a widow for many years, so she didn't have the emotional support from her husband to lean on.

[@nytn]

I wondered this myself! Did they always mean to move to NY? I wish I knew. Lola couldnt even drive, and was a widow with 8 kids. She made it back once to Louisiana in the 1950s as far as I know, and that is it.

[@lindyashford7744]

@@nytn as a widow with eight children and no family around her getting back to where she came from would have been a major task. I do not know if she owned her own home, if she didn’t then there would have been rent to pay, travel costs to find, new outfits for the kids, and gifts for the people she had been unable to see for so long. And then the costs of returning too. Would her job have been held open? Or her home still be secure. Journeys such as this are still hard for migrant people in the here and now. It took 37 years for me to go back home, I still felt I went inadequately prepared, so much I did not know. Things like this are still happening in many parts of the world. I think Lola did what she could do in the best way she could, and having passed from quite an early age found it too difficult to un-pass, so she left well alone. It must have been incredibly difficult for her, and very lonely too. She was a courageous woman living in very harsh times. In the early days she must have been protecting her husband too.