HUGE Plotting Mistakes I Made as a Beginning Writer!

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

What has been the hardest Plot lesson for you to learn? For some writing exercises that get your novel moving again, grab the WCF Workbook! www.amazon.com/Writing-Compelling-Fiction-Workbook-Authority/dp/B0D65RWQL4

[@BruceWayne15325]

I've been an intuitive pantser for decades because plotting took too long and by the time I finished I had lost interest. Pantsing was great... until the novel was finished and it came time to edit. Then I'd look at the novel and toss it in the trash rather than face the monumentally difficult challenge of refining it. With the advent of AI, I've found that I actually do more plotting (though still not as much as others.) AI allows me to brainstorm ideas, so I can plan faster and get to what I really enjoy, writing. I'd say the hardest (and most important) plot lesson I had to learn was incorporating both the internal and external plots. For a long time I didn't even realize that there was an internal plot, which is sad because that's arguably the most important of the two. I'm still working on developing this skill.

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

@@BruceWayne15325 I agree, that is tough! That's why I always start with Character and develop a Plot based on who that person is and what will make them grow the most.

[@TempeBrennanBooth]

This video has been the most helpful yet. Honestly, I feel like I've got about 80% covered, but I will definitely be rereading my whole book now to tweak certain things with these new tips in mind!

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

That's great to hear! Thank you for watching too!

[@RonaldLeeBunch]

Great plotting tips. Thank you.

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

You're so welcome! Thank you for watching!

[@kenshoemaker1882]

Thanks, Shirley. Slowly catching up with your videos. My first chapter starts with my Firefighter MC starting his day at home and going to the fire station for his tour of duty. He reports to a new station where he has served before spending time with the arson squad. By the end of the chapter, he and a probationary FF are fighting for their lives when the roof of a new car dealership collapses claiming six of their teammates. He struggles with the emotions not on his but his wife as well who lost her dad in the fire.

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

Sounds like a great plot!

[@kenshoemaker1882]

@@WritingCompellingFiction 🤎Thanks. Emotions and descriptions are areas we have struggled with. MC is promoted to Lieutenant and is invited to come back to OFI(Office of Fire Investigations after the Captain is suspended. They are searching for a serial arsonist who is setting fires in the city and the county. The dealership fire is based on two real fires. 5 FF died in a new car dealership in 1988 in Hackensack New Jersey. Our city had the same type of fire 10 years later but no deaths or injuries. Our investigation concluded it started in the same area as the Hackensack fire. We slowly reveal MC's back story of losing his wife and injuring his daughter in a fire.

[@virginiaweir-hj1rt]

Tbh, starting at the novel with the start of your MC's day sounds a bit cliche. Rather than end the chapter with the fire, why not start with it?

[@rickkearn7100]

Hey this was awesome, Shirley! Now I know I've been on the right track all along. I heartily agree with your 7 points. I've read Stephen King's "On Writing" a few times and it helped my prose. Now, I get to explore your archive and see what I've been doing wrong! I subscribed. Cheers.

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

I LOVED that book and listened to the audio several times (because he reads it). I'll have to share the story of almost getting to meet him sometime. Thank you for subscribing! I'm so glad it helped!

[@rickkearn7100]

@@WritingCompellingFiction Will enjoy your "almost meeting SK" story when you post. :)

[@anthonywheeler2082]

Ok, I have a question. Does all of your character's backstory need to be in the book or short story? In one video you said that you need to know six secrets about your character. Are those the same as backstory? Like if you can't fit everything in? I might be confusing two different things. I'm just trying to be certain. I already started the 6 secrets thing for a short story character of mine. Great video btw.

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

No, definitely not. I actually said that in this video but cut it for time. You need to know it because it tells you how they will react or feel about things. For instance, a Character whose parents had a nasty divorce will probably steer clear of marriage. Or a Character who was bullied in fifth grade will probably stick up for the underdog. A kid who grows up in a small town might be uncomfortable at fancy events. So you use that information to create a Character who has some fears/insecurities/anxieties that you don't necessarily have to explain, but that the reader will get and thus, build more connection with them.

[@anthonywheeler2082]

@@WritingCompellingFiction Ok, now I got it! Thanks for answering my question.

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

@@anthonywheeler2082 Of course! You're so welcome!

[@lovelightshine2329]

Shirley, I have watched several more of your videos and have come across a couple of nugget's on "scene" - "Every time your MC faces one of these conflicts - that is a scene". You said it depends on ones writing style as to how many scenes per chapter. To my way of thinking/writing style - a scene is a chapter with a beginning-middle-end that moves the plot along to the next "scene". The scene changes literally when the "scene" changes or it is another day or even a reaction to the last scene, another POV. To me, too many scenes in one chapter slows down the pace. What am I missing here? I was thinking, in order to get my MC's on the same page sooner that perhaps I should put more scenes in a chapter but fear it will slow the pace. The problem (I guess) is that one of my characters do not want to be on the same page any time soon - is avoiding it at all cost. Help? BTW, I so loved the example of your MC attempting to fix the fan as "conflict" (I so want to read the entire book!) you managed to get them on the same page with the stray dog - my characters live an ocean apart in the opening chapters.

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

So I think your biggest problem is that the MC are oceans apart. It's almost impossible (not totally, but close) to create a romance when they aren't together. I suspect you are starting too early, rather than with the Catalyst that brings them together. They don't have to want to be together or even like each other, but there has to be some crossover with their plots to get them in the same space. As for scenes/chapters--a lot of scenes can happen if the book is fast-paced, like Robert Parker's books. Yes, you're correct that a scene change is generally a change in location, POV, or action. There are some that break that rule, but generally, that's how it works. For me, with romances, I generally did 2 scenes per chapter, one in each POV. The key is to have things get worse at the end of the scene, forcing the POV character for that scene to have to create a new action for their next scene. That escalates the stakes and tension and keeps the reader hooked. When you don't have the MCs on the same page, it's super tough to build that romantic tension.

[@lovelightshine2329]

@@WritingCompellingFiction But wait, there may be hope yet. I noted in the example of your book that you said the "meet cute" was in chapter 4 - although they had met briefly or something prior to that (you didn't really go into their being on same page prior to ch 4) my character's have met before the meet cute - just not on the same page - unless you count the prologue There is tension/conflict all the way up to the meet cute (reasons why he avoids claiming his bride - it is a historical romance) but I am going to spend the week thinking of how/where to cut so that I can get them on the same page sooner - but I struggle to do so without taking a few chapters to IDK - set the stage for the inevitable. Thank you Shirley for taking the time to help me focus and see where/how to keep it moving w/o abandoning the plot altogether. (Some ideas are already starting to form)

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

I’m not actually sure what book that would be, unless it was an unsold book and even then, I don’t think I’ve ever had the hero and heroine meet that late. When you’re writing romance, the reader expects the h/h together early and often because that’s what makes it a romance 😊. Are you sure it was me? Because I seriously don’t remember saying chapter 4.

[@lovelightshine2329]

@@WritingCompellingFiction Now I know I'm from Nashville and you're a MA fast talker, LOL But unless I misunderstood your point (highly possible) in the video, Breaking Down the Successful Scene Formula for Writers!, timestamp 4:44-48, where you were describing the scene - I thought you said they do meet early on in the book but it was a very small short scene (I did say you didn't go into that very small (previous) short scene - I only know what I thought you meant I guess - AYK I have to slow the video down to keep up. (From Here to Back Again?) Maybe it wasn't one of your books, or published - it was late but I did take notes - at 3:28 I thought you began talking about the meet cute - maybe this wasn't your meet cute. The reason for having the timestamps in my notes was so I could get back to it while I was looking at my chapter structure and breaking down scenes. Remember my question was about scenes. But I fully get the point to get them on the page together sooner - I'm just trying to figure out what to scratch, move, condense...

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

@@lovelightshine2329 That is my book and they do meet in the first chapter. He lives next door her so she sees him every single chapter 😊 The scene that I pulled happened to be from chapter 4. It’s just a little bit further along in the development of the romance.

[@felicityporter8375]

Do you have any tips on finding an idea that I actually like? I’m normally uninterested by the time I’m ready to start the draft.

[@felicityporter8375]

I’m starting to look into the elements of my favorite stories, but haven’t struck anything yet.

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

Are you writing what you think the market wants or writing what you love to read/watch? Writing to market can kill that love for story and character. Look at what you are drawn to in books and on TV. Not just genre but kind of story-sacrifice, family, danger, etc-and hopefully that gives you ideas you are excited about.

[@felicityporter8375]

Maybe I should spend more time diving into this than forcing myself to think of ideas. I've tried to force myself into so many boxes, I don't even know what I truly want or like to write anymore.

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

Or maybe just write without any expectation of it becoming a novel? Sometimes when I take all that pressure off, I have fun with the words and the work. It’s so easy to get wrapped up in the “rules” of writing and that can take all the fun out of it. 😊

[@WRLO56]

What sort of books do you like to READ? And are those the type of books you are trying to WRITE? No point trying to write a rom-com if you can't stand reading rom-coms. If you DO like the type of book that you're trying to write, then compare your plotline to some of your favourite stories. See if you can figure out what's missing.

[@moviemelody2210]

How long do you have to make the set up? For example my MC has been raising his little brother since he was 13 and the inciting incident happens when my MC wakes up to find his brother heading towards a pirate ship and after convincing him to turn around doesn’t work he decides to follow him. Unfortunately I don’t know what to do with my character till then (the only thing I have is starting the book with my MC going to a court house after his brother got caught stealing a coat and then going to back to where they live, The Bethnal slums) I hope this makes sense

[@WritingCompellingFiction]

If you look at the plot chart in the video, you'll see that the "Ordinary World," which is the setup, is generally very short (or not there at all). If you start with the setup, there needs to be something interesting happening in that scene. I love your plot! And maybe you start literally with the MC dashing through the streets, frantically looking, and the reader doesn't know why yet?

[@moviemelody2210]

@@WritingCompellingFictionthanks! It’s funny that you said I should start with my MC running through the streets because the first chapter starts with him going up the steps of a court house