Hydraulic powered snow blowers, not all they're cracked up to be.

[@stephenmichnick6079]

I converted a 5ft rear 3pt pto snowblower to hydraulic driven loader mount way back in 1990. My machine was an L245DT and the rear setup just didn't work so good with no live pto and too tall of a reverse gear. So I built a 15 gallon tank that I mounted to the back of the blower, did the calculations for a pump and motor setup that would transfer all the engine horsepower. Ordered those parts and an open center valve from Burdens surplus center and mounted the pump to drive direct off the engine spline shaft at the front so it turned at engine speed. I even set it up so I could use one of the bucket curl rams to rotate the chute. It worked great and would just about stall the engine when the pressure relief kicked in. I could chew away at the big 8ft snow piles that slid off our steel roof shop with the loader raised up and work my way down. The only issue is that after an hour of heavy use the oil would get a bit hot and some loss of drive efficiency would occur but by then I was usually done or ready for a break anyway. I would have added an oil cooler if I was running commercially.

[@davidbalvin8112]

Good, honest explanation of power loss in hydraulic driven implements. Driving front mounted implements from rear or mid PTO usually also result in loss of ground clearance and lift height.

[@jimmcknight3021]

I think it would be interesting videos to show how the trailblazer power pack could be used for hydraulic powered implements like an auger in the front so you could put downward pressure on the hole that you're drilling. You are absolutely right after studying this topic for over the last year. It's more about the hydraulic flow than it is the horsepower. That's why even a small frame skid steer will outperform a large tractor on a similar implement, because even a low flow skid steer will typically give you a more powerful hydraulic flow than a large horsepower tractor. At first I couldn't believe it, but when you look at the numbers and see videos it's obvious what is going to work better.

[@timpierce110]

It would be nice if Kubota would add a mid-pto to the M4, M5, or M6. Being limited to the GrandL60 and M7 leaves a huge divide in between.

[@northwoodslife5964]

Thank you Sir! Previously a Kubota B7100 owner circa the late 1970's. We are tractor, FEL and snowblower shopping as we just bought a forested northern property with a 1/2 mile driveway. Great info in this video. I really thought that we could save some money by buying a tractor without mid PTO. Now I know.

[@platinumlawnservice]

I came here after watching a brand new 100k dollar ASV with a 14k dollar blower struggle with 8 inches of packed snow. Ive never even thought about how hydro works vs PTO. Our garden tractor with blower can power through most anything without much fuss. I think when we upgrade we will go the compact tractor route

[@miken8336]

A hydraulic snowblower on a skid steer that has high flow capabilities is unstoppable. The one I use at work will send snow an easy 30 to 40 feet, this is in MN where we get real snow fall totals.

[@ThomassEvo]

Would you recommend a tractor or skid steer on 25 degree slopes in MN?

[@Jeremy-fy1sz]

Thanks for the hydraulic horsepower formula. I always wondered how to calculate it.

[@brianhillis3701]

An angled blade up front and an offsettable blower in the rear.

[@chiefmik9108]

Good topic Neil, w the backlog on equipment now is the perfect time to set up your snow equipment…God Bless…Chief…{NYS/ADK}

[@rcclassiccrawlers4368]

What tractor manufacturers need to do is come out with a high flow hydraulic system like on select model skidloaders where you flip a switch to get that extra boost of hydraulic volume/pressure. Then you could run those snowblowers, brooms and whatever else.

[@paulmaxwell8851]

Thanks, Neil. Just when I was about ready to drop a lot of money on a hydraulically-driven snowblower you throw facts in my face. Seriously, thank you; I think I will look at a shaft-driven front blower now. Excellent video!

[@markkuhar1188]

Don’t forget to look at the rear mount blower it’s shaft driven the impeller is backwards so your not wrecking your necks and stretching your leg for your treble pedal. You drive over the snow the blower is kinda backwards guys forget about this model. Shaft driven blowers are half the cost and resale is fantastic as well when you wanna unload it

[@swampwhiteoak1]

Thank you for talking about SNOW today. Cooooooool. It is 90° and I just came in tremendously overheated. Honestly this afternoon I was thinking of ordering a new 8’ skid steer mount snow plow with third function left-right angle. The order must be in by September 1.

[@bradleymcwilliams6348]

Hmmm... Here in Arkansas we simply wait a couple of days till the snow melts. When I lived in south Texas, we just didn't do the snow thing...

[@JeremyTVOK]

Great video. I believe the better front-mounted blowers I’ve seen for the Kubota B2650 like I have are PTO-driven. Sounds like that’s the best way to go.

[@renimleinadyt]

ummm, not sure how you guys are sizing it, i would assume properly lol. But my blower is a front mount 8'6" on a Landini Blizzard 85. (80 horse) and even through 3 feet of snow it'll blow it 80 feet. Sure if its real wet maybe 40. Granted it is set up different, with a 50 gallon hydraulic tank on the back. It runs at about 1900 RPM of the motor. I can't remember the flow rate though sorry. They are 1 1/2 hydraulic lines. I mean yes, you are correct, much less power, horse Power, at the blower comparatively, tons of torque though, but at least I don't have to worry about braking shear pins 500 times a winter haha. i do have neighbors and friends with mid PTO blowers, and they have twisted shafts ( only once so far ) and break 2 -5 shear pins, every single winter. I think it really high stress areas Hydraulic shines because you can be VERRY rough on it, and not break any thing. 25 years of use, and the Hydraulic system has never failed. Not even once. (Edit) Ohh ok I see so your simply talking about the on board Hydraulic system. That makes a little more sense. I will leave up what I originally posted just for info sake. I think you should go into some benefits of have a large Hydraulic system though. Like I had said previously, I can really run it ragged and all it will do is bog down a bit, and even if I catch a butch of dirt and clog it. (actually I have just straight up, blow dirt with it because it will cut deep sometimes before I can stop it) It just stalls, just shut the PTO off. Unclog it, then your good to go. No mechanical pieces braking. No shear pins or shaft ripping to shreds and causing more damage as they spin around a speed. But yeah just a thought, not sure if you guys have experience with the larger system, I mean I would think so. But there are benefits.

[@wdglockandroll]

Just was having this conversation with my buddy. Forwarding the video to him. Thanks

[@brianpritt4154]

Interesting info. Thanks again Neil

[@1966cambo]

I have a rear mount PTO drive forward snow blower, it's quite old and as such doesn't have a feed auger so when snow is wet it just becomes a rear pull plow. I have tried lining the angled feed with old plastic roll up kids sled/toboggan but it did very little. The other downside to a rear mount is as you drive forward you can only get as close to things as the length of your tractor without having to turn back up reset and start over. It works great when snow is dry (most of the time here) but I think it would be really nice to have it on the front!

[@memyselfandifarmer]

love my mx 5000, three point lucknow 7 ft snow blower. now got a massey 5455 cab, lucknow on the back, 10 ft snow pusher on the front.

[@ritterjon]

💥 A front mount snowblower is the way to go for those who move snow often. Combine it with a rear blade for extra fun. Great video Neil! *Keep on tractoring!* #ARITTERBITWILLDO

[@wildbill23c]

It almost seems as though you do this every winter or something HAHA!!!. I enjoy watching your winter snow clearing videos, you have a great setup for your needs.

[@ritterjon]

@@wildbill23c As you are well aware I have a little experience. 😂😂

[@jimmcknight3021]

Yes, GP outdoor on his channel has that kind of set up on a little larger Kubota with hydraulics on his rear blade so he can stay in the cab and enjoy the heater. Lol

[@timberhitchllc]

Tractors are an incredibly useful and versatile form factor to get work done. The world would be a better place if manufacturers added accomodations for the option of MUCH higher hydraulic capacity when the design these machines, instead of marginal/incremental improvements on a 150 year old design. I'd love to see skid steer grade high-flow as a factory option.

[@blessed7fold]

Timberhitch LLC they will never do it because then it would cannibalize sales for skid loaders.

[@waiting4aliens]

The 4x4 tlb units have much higher capacity pumps, sometimes by a factor better than 5. It could be an option, if they thought they could sell enough units.

[@blessed7fold]

@@waiting4aliens 4X4 tlb? Please explain...

[@johanneslaxell6641]

One way is to ditch the tractor and go for a loader (JCB/VOLVO/CATERPILLAR/KUBOTA) or a "toolcarrier" (LÄNNEN/LUNDBERG/AVANT). On those the machine drives hydraulic pump(s) not a gearbox which then divides power to wheels, pto and sometimes the hydraulics. If you then have the guts and the money to check the "workpackage" box to get extra hydraulics (seen it being calld "sweepinghydraulics") you should be "good to go". But beware: it's tractor-money times two or three. If a Kubota M 4073 is 55 000$, a Avant 860i GT is 90 000$ and a Kramer 8055 is around 90 000$. The Kubota R070 loader is aroubd 65 000$ but i don't know if there is power enough. I am a bit out of my comfort-zone, but I would say that if you want something that can run a larger hydraulic blower than around 50 inches, the cost starts to rise quite dramatically. But if money (and size) isn't a problem, go for it 👍🏼! There are many good machines to choose from, but I would reserv +100 000$ if you shop new machines. The reason if you don't know all of the brands: I live in Finland and has never been to the USA or to Canada. But "anywho, anyhow", I do think that the power (~60-75 hp) could just be enough IF the machine is made for hydraulic "work-use" aka: a wheel loader 🤭😋.

[@mxadema]

that how they do it here in Eastern Canada. A L with front blower off the rear or mid pto, with a expandable snow box on the 3 point. we clean driveway like you wouldn't believe. for big yard we use snow box on the loader and a rear blower on a M series. or straight loader

[@djbme83]

The title of the video just broke my brain.

[@OG1160]

They're strikes again

[@Primerk5]

Relative of mine purchased around an 80 hp kubota (I can't remember the model number) through you guys a few years back and set it up like this with a front mount blower (which he got elsewhere) mounted on the loader. The trouble he had was that when he went into deeper snow it would pretty well kill the blower as there was some sort of hydraulic bypass valve for when the system got overloaded. The tractor had the power to run it but the hydraulic system wouldn't allow for the load. On top of that the blower hanging so far out in front made it very difficult to make turns while blowing. Pretty much could only run straight lines.

[@thetractorden6189]

Hope those rear wheels have rimguard (or equivalent) in them for some rear ballast weight. 😉 Great video!!! Love the facts and the math to back it up. Very Educational!!! Thank you for sharing the knowledge.

[@billvandorn5332]

I've often wondered why they can't put a transfer case with a PTO like shaft up to the front to power the blower? Of the few videos I've seen with the front facing rear mounted blower appear to work well also

[@jasone679]

I've thought about a rear mount front facing blower, but you wouldn't be able to get close to anything like you can with a rear facing blower. Might be better to just move south.

[@goaheadmakeourdayscooterpe9644]

Wish you would do a video on the best options in the garden tractor to subcompact size snowblower for bigger driveways.

[@MessicksEquip]

Garden tractors never make sense. I have a ton of video's on subcompact.

[@texnorthman]

Loving this channel, has tought me a tonne about tractors! Sadly the Kubota line-up is named entirely differently in Europe for some reason, trying to decide between an L1-382, L2-622 or M4073, but there is little info out there on how they match up to their US counterparts. Funny hearing you mention the forward facing rear mounted snowblowers being a newer thing, they seem to have been the standard setup here in Skandinavia for ages. My Kubota dealer instantly understood I'd been watching youtube videos when I asked for a front-mounted setup ;)

[@mjethier]

solid man, solid. I watch this channel religiously and I don't even own any Kubota or power equipment in general (I do want to buy an SVL97-2s and have been waiting for your explanation which you gave a couple months ago about how the svl95-2s suffered from the ridiculous DEF pig pee sensor issue.)

[@tractortyme]

Unless you deal with heavy drifting, an inverted snowblower like you mention towards the end is the way to go. I have a 68'' Meteor on my TYM T474 (48.3Hp) which is about 36-37 at PTO. And it runs just fine. I've made a video or two off of it.

[@fredhinck9685]

Agree wholeheartedly on the drifted snow. In my location when it drifts during a blizzard you can't drive through the drifts. Also unable to plow with a compact tractor. The only way is to use a blower.

[@tractortyme]

@@fredhinck9685 Yup, for high drift areas, you'd either need a front blower solution or an open rear end one.

[@tb8338]

@@fredhinck9685 Also rear-facing allows you to get right up to buildings and such.

[@wildbill23c]

I do have a snow blower for my lawn tractor but I have a gravel driveway...see where this is going LOL. Anyhow, a rear mounted PTO powered snow blower that you can hookup and drive forward seems like a much better idea than having to drive in reverse all the time, always seemed like a stupid setup, hurt my neck just thinking about that type of blower....For my case a blade makes more sense, someday I'll get one, but haven't had enough snow the past few years to really mess with it...I have a modification plan I am going to try on my blower to keep it from scraping up rocks just need the time to do it. The BX front mount snow blower would be great...if I didn't have a gravel driveway....and if it didn't cost a fortune.

[@paullambert2668]

A guy on one of the forums has a really big mirror on his tractor, for running a rear mount snow blower. Kinda clever, but once you hear it, also kinda obvious.

[@nicholasbrown7068]

I've been running pull blowers for years, nothing new about them. Been around 40 years. I only buy Normand blowers, 92" blowers except for 1 being a Normand N100-310HYB. My tractors are 100 pto hp & up.

[@joelsanford]

Inverted (pull type) pto powered snow blower is the way to go, keep the bucket on or snow push/plow for pushing banks.

[@erikgullickson3590]

Super good dude! Appreciate his honesty.

[@NatesRandomVideo]

Morning Neal. Thanks for making my inner engineering nerd happy on a Monday. Ha. I have a day of fiscal auditing ahead of me today. Haha.

[@teamdrummond6915]

This was very intelligently explained thank you!!

[@johnparkhurst1141]

last 2 videos have been great Neil(sp)

[@ozzieman4392]

Great video. I finally understand how the system works.

[@robertkeeler6774]

I really enjoy your presentations. On the hydraulic driven front snow blower mounted on the front end loader I will politely suggest to check out the frontier loader mounted 72inch with 2134 hydraluic power pack combination as I have it on my jd 4720. I live in Wyoming and have since 2013 operated this combination after some pretty severe snow storms with brutal wind blown drifts. Mine has preformed with no issues. I just have to be very careful on where I aim the snow as it is discharged as it can do damage. I don't know if Kubota has a similar product but the above combination in my experience works great. Again I enjoy your presentations.

[@joesteen9742]

Neil your video are great info

[@nathanbrodeur]

Neal thanks for the formula to get the hydraulic hp

[@rodbagley1686]

I must admit it does look cool!

[@amywright2243]

Whew I thought you left off the intro and I was typing furiously! 😆

[@mattromain7177]

Would really like to see you test a standard pull behind vs hybrid and offer them for sale. Not a lot of distributors in the US.

[@MessicksEquip]

We have an order of pull behinds coming in for this exact reason.

[@brodegets]

Great information in this video, but I laughed a little at that new style pull behind blower. I had a 1930's Ford 9N with a pull behind V blower. It would have worked well if the tractor was geared lower.

[@jimwilloughby]

I've seen front mount snowblowers with dedicated gas or diesel engines for power on big ,(construction company sized ), front loaders. Are there any companies that make such equipment for smaller tractors, and can you do a video about those?

[@MessicksEquip]

MB attachments does. Not something we keep here for stock.

[@paullambert2668]

I'd wonder about how much HP they really have. If the engine isn't the size of your tractor engine, it won't do 60HP. If it is the size of your tractor engine, I suspect your loader won't lift it well. I agree with Neil on the PTO driven equipment, and really if you want a front mount blower I think a mid-PTO machine is the right choice.

[@jimwilloughby]

@@paullambert2668 You make a couple of very good points, Paul. I think I'll have to look into pto driven snow blowers. They'll have to be the type that takes power from the rear though. My B 2601 arrives in October, but I bought it without a mid mount pto. As a side note I have a hunch that I'm going to need the loader , at the very least, this winter. I think we're going to get belted this year, and at 73 I'm too old to wrestle with my snowblower anymore.

[@802vt3]

Appreciated this video. That would be a lot of money to waste on an under performer.

[@greghickox9508]

Great info, thanks.

[@jbooh88]

Fm25 flail mower? Why do they have such high hp requirement compared to the del moreno models seen in your videos. You implied these require less power than rotary mowers, yet my kubota dealer barely recommended the 48” for my b2601. I was hoping for 60”. Any knowledge to spill on the fm25 line? Would i be dissatisfied with the lighter Italian model when I have land pride expectations?

[@MessicksEquip]

'FM' is a beast of a flail. If you want to go wider, a lighter duty mower will draw less power.

[@Microphone73]

Very interesting. Thanks Neil.. Good to bust the myths.

[@waiting4aliens]

very good and informative video, thank you

[@bahabob1386]

Good video Neil, where do we suggest topics for videos?

[@MessicksEquip]

Here

[@bahabob1386]

@@MessicksEquip Using your differential lock.Some people seem to forget they have it or don't know how to use it.Using it with 4wd also.

[@stumpfarm3714]

Snow blower video in August, how about a snow cone implement review?

[@sstelmack]

Speaking of mid PTO front attachments. I saw a video of a Europe version of a Kubota with a front mount flail mower. Do you have any info on those?

[@RTrekker]

Usually dealer will ad an additional PTO and 3 point linkage on the front of the tractor. Europe got really big market for it. Some of the popular companies that make them are MX, Zuidberg or Folger. Just to name a few. And as for front flail mowers, Müthing is something worth looking at.

[@daveb1081]

Hey Neil! Big fan of the channel, had an idea for a video. Not sure if you are familiar with the Cub Cadet Lowboy 154, 185, and 184. Interesting tractors, not sure if you have access to one, but i was thinking the other day it would be cool to see you do a video on one, as they are sorta Niche machines!

[@MessicksEquip]

these used to be everywhere, seems like awhile since I've seen one now.

[@daveb1081]

@@MessicksEquip yeah, I think they are more common here in the Midwest. Just a video idea if you get a chance to be around one! Have a great day and keep up the awesome sales work!

[@bladerunner1458]

Thanks for the analysis. I’m looking forward for an electrically driven snowblower any thoughts anybody?

[@waiting4aliens]

a 1oo amp alternator at 12 volts only kicks out 12oo watts. 1.6 hp. A 6ooo watt generator. 8 hp. You have losses electrically as well.

[@robertrockwell7581]

will never have a snowblower on the back of a tractor.

[@jhomrich89]

Alternatively you can get a front facing rear mounted snowblower and for way less money then a hydraulic one will

[@onlygodknowswhat7595]

Adding a pump to the pto that can handle the blower really makes these things sing.

[@akbychoice]

Power head front mounted blower.

[@tsafa]

I think snow blowers stuck. Especially if you've got gravel and some rocks. The Snow Pusher can also become too much for a tractor if you've got more than a foot of snow. The best most versatile option is the standard bucket or a slightly oversized bucket.

[@markloomis1415]

I wish someone would offer a huy- flow

[@DensityMatrix1]

Rear-mounted snowblowers aren't worth it. Ask your neck if it's worth it. Have fun with cervical issues.

[@SK-dj9nd]

That snowblower design is flawed. Virnig does a lot well, snowblowers is not their strong suit. Erskine / Quick Attach manufactures the best hydraulic snowblowers. As they should, they've been manufacturing snowblowers for 75 years.

[@dmhipkins]

Thanks 🇺🇸

[@karatejoe5049]

I mean I don't really look at an open station tractor with a snowblower and think fun.

[@Ramdodge582]

here i am thinking that 1 HP is equal to 1 GPM at 1500 psi so 40 gpm would be more like 80 HP

[@_AndromedaGalaxy_]

in my experience plowing is always faster than blowing.

[@zfilmmaker]

PTO is the only way to drive a snowblower. Hydraulics can’t compensate for heavy loads... doesn’t matter what your flow is.

[@7ofmine258]

Hes to young to understand that guys over 60 need a FRONT PTO.

[@Ramdodge582]

your math did not include the efficiency of the motor.

[@ttss5726]

Who cares about the snow blower how about why a piece of the tractor was swinging in the wind on the right side near the inner well at 2:46

[@MessicksEquip]

It was one of the hoses from the snow blower, it wasn't actually hooked up.

[@goesintite]

It just sounds to me that you're too lazy to set it up to produce 42 gpm's. I think you need to learn how to set those kinds of setups up. Keep learning...

[@DKWalser]

But, you'll still sell it to me, right?

[@MessicksEquip]

As long as you know what your getting into :-)