I Analyzed 180 Days of Data To See if New Recoil Made People Quit Rust...

The recoil change is likely the most debated update in Rust history. Some say it spelled doom, others survival. I took an objective look to try and answer what the impact looks like 6 months later.
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Sources:
Player counts pulled from steamcharts.com, reviews from lorenzostanco.com, YT search interest from google trends, Twitch peaks from steamdb.info, FP headcount change from linkedin.

[@miloodie2782]

Personally I miss the old AK sound more than the AK spray pattern.

[@Zero1030able]

Yeah it's supposed to be thunderously loud almost to the point you can't hear foot steps trading firepower for game sense

[@hexay4321]

I just the like the sound of a actual gun (old sounds), where as the new guns just sound like a fake pew pew at least to me

[@tilted9230]

fr the recoil is whatever i miss the sounds

[@Fishnet-c5k]

I miss the old sounds

[@thebiggestdummy6020]

Fr when I was new the guns sounded scary in a way like almost intimidating, but now they sound like pea shooters, especially the mp5 which I think is worse than the Thompson

[@christophermacdonald5011]

The main problem is that the new recoil has terrible aimcone unlike the old, the new recoil is easy to control by anybody who just picked up the game while the old was difficult. new recoil makes fights more rng based, bad aimcone can lose you a fight even if your aiming right at them the whole time, but the old fights were skill based, because of the smaller aimcone it was really just a battle of who had the better recoil control and aim. in the end i think old recoil was better as it rewarded skill, not rng

[@sigbog]

that mostly would be the holo nerf I think, taking away the huge accuracy buff on it, using a laser makes things way less rng

[@misspotatosman5901]

but then its just who has a laser wins@@sigbog

[@MasterTemp]

@@sigbog zerg will have full kits while a new player to server will have jack shit, that seems like a bigger disadvantage to new players, knowing theres nothing i can do skill wise to out play an opponent is litterally pray and spray garbage that doesnt keep people around for long the moment new game comes out they will leave the hype train because the gun skills of pray and spray easily transfer, compared to old rust unique gun control locks you in for longer since other games wont feel the same.

[@HansTomato]

there are thousands of servers, beginners dont have to and in the most cases wont play servers with zergs on. everyone I played rust with quit the game, we all give the new recoil update a chance but it is just not fun anymore. rust was special, it was hard but very rewarding. now gunfights are ass, you have to crouch so pvp is not as fast like before + recoils are random on thompson, mp5 + aimcone. I quit maybe 2 weeks after recoil update, after months a came back for couple of hours but it feels like a new game not the sweet old rust. wasted 800 hours just for rust to give a shit about all the time you practised recoil control. for me rust is dead, I will never play it again. what remains are good memories @@MasterTemp

[@tdiggitygaming4971]

I was so bad with the spray patterns of weapons like the AK that in the 3 years I played the game, every AK I had just either sat in a box in my home or went into a vending machine. I really have never had the time to learn spray patterns but now I actively find myself using every single gun I get and going to fight with it.

[@ChaseHub]

3 years without learning the AK bro WHAT???? I only started 2, maybe 2.5 years ago, and got AK down to 200m... I played like 4k hours but still 3 years were you casual or just not into pvp

[@daone_vac1002]

@@ChaseHub some people are just not that competitive, no need to write in CAPITAL LETTERS.

[@ArtistinDeadlight777]

@@daone_vac1002 Then they should stick to mmos wtf

[@orbbrust]

Honestly your just bad if you played rust for 3 years and couldn’t spray the ak. When I first started I went on a aim trainer for like a week and I could spray everything. And now if the recoil came back I bet I could still beam. Also sounds like you never gave the gun a chance to learn it either if you gust sold it like go roam that is how you learn, like your not going to get good if you just get rid of your aks

[@elliott8596]

@@ChaseHub 4k hours is a long time playing a video game.

[@FoxD-vy5ju]

I left official Rust for all time because of the Recoil change. Now everyone plays on a private server.

[@hydrosphereic8370]

I wish instead of changing all the gun sounds and patterns they just reduced recoil by like 25 - 50 percent

[@RanDom-if2ee]

Holy crap, this video quality is top tier! Keep up the good work!

[@tsunamio7750]

CS:GO style pattern recoil is artificial knowledge that forces you to choose between games. Learning Rust patterns fucked my CS:GO patterns. Learning patterns is busy work; only some people have time to invest in such foolery, and most of what the game offers becomes locked behind a skill check that is outside the premises which sold the game in the first place. We bought Rust to build bases, create shops and farms, raid people and have the sneaky-brekky grubby-grubby fun. Some come for the electricity, others for the zerg. There are plenty of combat skills to learn, some funnier and more impressive than "I spend 200 hours pattern training, you can't shoot me with an AK, but I blast you with a tommy from miles away". Patterns encouraged people that would not cheat otherwise to use hacked clients.

[@drothehero4784]

I dislike how you can’t challenge an ak unless you have an ak (or some other t3 gun) you still can if your five feet infront of the guy but, before you could spray a tommy at somewhat range and outgun an ak guy. now the bullets are going everywhere, mp5 needs to become a t2 and lasersight needs to be as common as mailboxs and wooden spikes

[@DirtyTrout]

I'm not a game developer, but I can't help but ask why so many things had to change all at once? Some things make sense like crouch meta to complement bloom, but to also change recoil, sounds, hit punch, crosshair, everything all at once--sure makes it hard to say which of these if any or all of them had which effect. I'm glad people like yourself are doing the research to add some perspective to what's mostly been a screaming diaper hurricane and, as you've shown, it's ultimately been a decent change (or at least, not an outright BAD change). Damn I miss the old fuckin sounds though lol.

[@valorantclips3481]

yeah the bloom and crouch shit needs to be reverted. it ruins 50% of fights

[@drolay2]

@@valorantclips3481 Im not familiar with what your talking about havent played in a bit was there a change to crouching and how does this effect bloom?

[@mr.coconut4234]

@@drolay2 I believe he is referring too 2 different things, the crouch to shoot, and the bloom. Not related.

[@Astrnauted]

2001: A Space Odyssey my friend

[@itistempest]

i think it had to be done all at once, rust has one of those hate every new change to the game community, so you change the fundementals of the game by slowly pushing it out and it will never get fully released

[@dustgg]

The new system feels entirely unrewarding for pvp/gun fights. I think there were other parts of the game that were much more difficult to get past than the recoil for new players, and honestly it didn't take much effort to learn the recoil on a few primary weapons. The aimcone is the worst part, it's SO frustrating to lock your cursor on somebody's head and miss every single shot and just watch the bullets go around them..

[@mates352]

I think that the worst part is the crouch to beam aspect. Nowadays who shoots first wins the fight almost every time

[@AndyRobertooie]

I wish rust wasn't trying to appeal to the 12 year olds. I swear, we went from rats to mice.

[@TheRysiu120]

The recoil WAS the worst part for beginers before update. Not everyone wants to treat game as a job and grind countles hours shooting bots on ukn

[@allThingsReimagined]

@@TheRysiu120 it doesn't have to be a job lol recoil on everything but ak could be learned in 30 mins ak was a little harder but wasn't even that hard

[@SemNic_]

@@TheRysiu120 you could practice recoil for 5 mins a day and it would for sure be enough to be better the alot of people on official servers. I used to only practice for 5 mins a day and i had an ak spray which good enough to play entire wipes and be succesfull with pvp.

[@wwheeler4946]

1 year later...this games is ruined by devs and cheaters. Devs dont really listen to player base and put the worst updates on this game....this is not RUST ANYMORE

[@Devakiinable]

They need to make berries more obtainable, and put mixing tables in safezones to encourage people to make more teas, with Teas you can REALLY offset some of the recent changes for the better. Max HP teas will give you that "extra shot" you're looking for in pvp so you don't just instantly die, but have atleast a chance to react. It also makes it where you don't get 1 tapped by C bow or P slug in some cases depending on the tea you drink and your armor. The tools to make the most of recoil update are there, it just need a little nudge in the right direction. As simple as making berries random 1-3 from bushes and more from planted ones, and making a mixing table available so people can make a tea on their first couple of lives or to help get the base set up etc.

[@spicysand5085]

more max hp is the most obvious, but starting out with wood/scrap teas could really boost early farming

[@Devakiinable]

@@spicysand5085 Exactly, and then theres more loot going around so pvpers can farm the farmers with more everyone wins

[@bushybu]

Good point!

[@hexay4321]

@@spicysand5085 Wood teas are still really decent for farming for walls, but the scrap and health (the regen one) are both completely useless but I'm not sure what could change them to

[@mentalist9690]

@@hexay4321 regen one is not useless, its spamable with just a global cd, and u can use it in open water. perfect around oil/cargo

[@B11AWAIS]

Thank you for letting me know about their job listings, had no idea they are based 30 mins from me!!

[@idiamondz1487]

i personally instantly quit as the game turned into cod and it was an obvious greedy decision and there was no gamemode that you could play that reverted it

[@demobnen2144]

In my opinion i think Facepunch should make it so that server hosts can change between old recoil and new recoil. this would bring back alot of the player base and still maintain the new.

[@Trenton-x5g]

They wouldn’t do that because they know most of the server owners would use old recoil instead of new. New recoil literally makes no sense at all, the more damage dealing guns are the easiest to control which makes 0 sense.

[@jaydos92]

Gunplay rework is borderline unplayable dogshit, facepunch are thieves.

[@KTM_Trooper]

From the zergs i sometimes play with none of the players have quit... the spray pattern thing was overblown... i still am mad about the ak sound change

[@CrowRust]

There are still a lot of glitches in building that need to be looked at that make it difficult/impossible to rebuild after a raid. Also, In my opinion they should also patch wallstacking so clans can't build such big bases with low main TC upkeep. Instead add another row of material space in TCs so a single TC base with 40k upkeep is actually manageable.

[@sk8c]

preach building changes we need them so much

[@tomczakpl3680]

@@sk8c no

[@scsMai]

i miss a non RNG recoil pattern where the aimcone wasnt that bad, i hate the standing recoil change and the ridiculous smg nerf

[@umid970]

yoo

[@scsMai]

@@umid970 yo wassup

[@umid970]

​ @scsMai I'm trying to be nice

[@scsMai]

@@umid970 and im saying was up like whats good

[@umid970]

@@scsMai i lost good vibes 1 year ago

[@chetkelly3099]

I played a few wipes with the new recoil and haven't touched the game since. Helped me out of my rust addiction

[@Midwestemoisme]

I have to say as someone with nearly 2k hours, the top tier guns were just unusable for me, I work 8 hours a day like any other working person so sitting down and dedicating time to learning the god awful spray pattern of the AK was just not gonna happen. Now I can actually play and use all the guns which is fun for me but I do understand why people are upset. Imo I think it makes it so people such as myself who can only play casually actually able to compete in pvp

[@smoke3560]

I started like 3 months before the recoil update, work 8 hour shifts, and was beaming pretty good before they changed it. At the end of the day you're unskilled because you didn't try, and to expect the game to bend to you instead of actually putting forth some effort to play the game is mind boggling to me. I don't even mind the new recoil that much but people like you are infuriating. Edit: 2k hours my ass

[@yeti_ily]

I play casually work 8 hours 5 days a week and go to college and it took me barely anytime to learn the patterns I will say ak was harder but not nearly as hard as people pretend it was, it took time yes but 5 min a day for a month and you were beaming was easy to learn patterns hard af to master, also never had issues being good at pvp as a casual players either so don't know where it'll let casuals pvp, but with that said if you were good before recoil change you still are if you weren't you more than likely still aren't

[@Midwestemoisme]

@@yeti_ily if that were the case I woulda learned it lol but maybe ur a better man than me idk, like csgo spray patterns? That's something you could easily learn casually and still feel rewarding at whatever level of play, for a lot of people, and even players like hjune have been quoted with "if you don't have 10k hours your basically a noob" in the context of yeah maybe the recoil pattern should be switched up

[@yeti_ily]

@@Midwestemoisme it wasn't hard to get decent with is what I'm saying, but it took a long time to get amazing with, I agree recoil needed change game got stale but I don't enjoy the new recoil feels way to easy I'd honestly welcome a CSGO style pattern as I thought we needed a middle ground between what we have now and what we had, I think they just made it far to easy

[@ankari5257]

It’s literally not even that hard to learn the old recoils it was so easy ak was the easiest just pull down then left then right then left then right again

[@hanfiball4136]

The lac of recoil patterns really doesn't hurt as much a I thought. That being said, current pvp absolutely sucks compared to old pvp. And it is all because of crouching. You have to crouch while shooting otherwise it is un controlabel. That in return makes the fights so much less movement based. A lot of cover option you where formerly able to peek over are now useless as shooting and standing is really hard and if you shoot and strave you can't hit shit. People are still in fear of loosing gear ad rather run around to grub. Expect for clans, they don't get demolished by good players anymore and now can rule simply by numbers. All in all I see a lack of skill gap and a massive buff for numbers that needs to be addressed. What the devs sould have done and could have done but actively decided against, was to offer two versions. Have servers with old recoil system and servers with the new and see which servers get played more. I personally think if they had done that from the start, people would gladly have stuck with the old system. The old system only had some balancing flaws while the new one has multiple in my opinion. Tommy is still meta sar is alright now, you can't hit over 100m with any gun and mp5, M9, LR just absolutely suck. AK is still the best, silencers are still op even after the nerf...pump slug was the biggest group infestation since the compound bow nerf...

[@stixinst5791]

Oy, facepunch could solve the numbers issue by changing codelocks....if standard one could remember only 2 people clans would be gone within a week. Maybe add tier 2 and 3 codelocks with 4 and unlimited number of players. Tier 3 would only have 3number combination and both would cost much more to craft/upkeep (like tech thrash hqm and scrap) Same for t1-t3 TCs Or atleast give us the setting, so we can force solo-duo-quad groups on servers

[@nawaudakie]

​@@stixinst5791 terrible idea would just grief small groups even more

[@stixinst5791]

@@nawaudakie u think clans would risk playing with 3number locks? It would make coreraiding them 10x easier.....or they have to build outer door for every 4people they have and payup for the number of them + they need to clear build privileges regularly to switch builders....just annoys the hack out of them with no effect on solo/duo/quad

[@antsila5825]

​@@stixinst5791bro all of these changes that a limit never work Tier 3 codelock with only 3 numbers? Just have different codes afterall you only need to enter the code once.

[@bChima]

bruh i hate how people rant about the need to spend hours on ukn to be good at old recoil, ive rarely played ukn and only practiced recoil from playing on normal servers i didnt see any problem with the old combat mechanics i did just fine, the people that complained about how hard it is never got to top tier weapons and i dont think that the new recoil and aimcone is going to help them

[@watermelonbleach]

For people who want to want to punish bigger groups i would love to hear of some ideas that you think would do so but not effect solo/duos. I think its hard to effect one style of group without effecting another

[@nagydani825]

A certain amount of turrets/tcs you can be authorized. Scrap helis cost more. Better terrain generation: less big empty flat spaces, red/blue keycard monuments further away. Increase base yield for not god clones since only big clan can have dedicated people and time to crossbreed. Never patch bunkers! Increase upkeep cost on bigger builds ( i know it is already a thing but still can be increased). Recycling smoke grenades will not give gp.

[@watermelonbleach]

@@nagydani825 im only gonna point out the cons of these not saying they wouldnt help. --Auth limit on TCs would mean you cant go into raids and auth on other peoples TCs. --red/blue keycard monuments further away mean it would be a lot harder for a solo/duo to get them because of the risk of the increased distance means they have to cross more bases. --crossbreeding plants isnt actually that hard it just takes a little knowhow. --Bunkers can be used by bigger clans and they can add more bunkers because they can make a bigger base so it would do the opposite i think. --I think recycling smoke nades is more helpful to a solo than a clan its easier to farm as a zerg than as a solo.

[@petrvojtasek7829]

Adding a recyler on oil rigs/cargo ships because for solo coming on boats is harder to get to outpost And recycler there compared to zergs with helis etc. Solo should be able to get as much loot as possible from it (zergs always do)

[@watermelonbleach]

​@@petrvojtasek7829 This would also be used by zergs meaning they still get a bunch of loot. The reason recyclers were removed from oil rigs originally is because the amount of loot you can get from them was incredibly strong and no other monument was used. If they were brought back then they would have to reduce how much loot is on all oil rigs and on cargo. As of now you have to debate with yourself on whats worth taking home and whats not.

[@nagydani825]

@@watermelonbleach man zergs dont need bunkers not a single zerg has been offlined and even if they had a bunker that would only add some to the raid cost if they take away bunkers the solo bases go from 30 to 15 rockets . I have seen a zerg industialise smoke grenades. They had a hemp farm the size of a main base and had 3 minions who where buying smoke grenades 10 plus hours staight . And droning everything.

[@scrubpar965]

I started playing like a week before the recoil update, so I can't really comment on the previous gunplay. That being said, the aim cone and the need for crouching rubs me the wrong way. Like, it definitely makes the game more accesible to new players and encourages the average person to take gunfights, but the minimal recoil combined with the restricting movement leaves little room to outplay worse players compared to before.

[@ptr0001]

couldn't agree more, I always believed even after 2k hours that the recoil was too difficult. even after I came to master them with 100's of hours on aim train servers. However the forced crouching to get the benefits of less recoil sucks. I used to be so much more confident running and gunning but now being forced to crouch and not be able to make myself a harder target to hit absolutely sucks. Attempting to solo now in my experience has been awful due to this new gun play. I would go as far to say outplaying isn't really achievable anymore under any circumstance as a solo. Restricting that movement ability along with adjusting for easy recoils has minimized the effectiveness of game sense as well. Maybe for a group this update hasn't been terrible and maybe you even like it. But as a solo, well It's only been made even harder and to more benefit of those larger groups who just hold W anyway and don't need that extra movement and game sense to compensate for lack of numbers.

[@jefmoesy]

I play for fun and not to learn spray patterns, so imo it is a good change.

[@LilDonutV2]

When I hopped on after the update on a basic 3x and found out the meta of cheap ass smgs over an expensive ass AK or LR I realized they made the game shitter friendly cause people don’t like putting in work to get better and u dont have to play aim train to get better btw, can’t fight roof campers unless u have a bolt or L9 8x so one of the biggest problems with the game still remains, pvp fights are more random due to recoil even if get the jump on someone if u have AK and they have custom they still have 50/50 chance to kill u, I’m rambling now but games now are becoming so shitter friendly and the excuse of “well this isn’t the only thing I play or I don’t play games all day” is overused cause even just 30mins a day playing a game over a year ur gonna get a good bit better

[@MosahWasTaken]

I’m really not a big fan of crouching to shoot EVERY gun. The pvp was fun because you had to control recoil with your strafing while keep crosshair on them while they are strafing.

[@the.wayne.b]

i miss the old spray patterns. it's very satisfying learning a skill. i'm old as shit and it didn't take much to learn a few guns. it's laughable that people couldn't lol.

[@grub-g1j]

I've spent the last 7 years playing rust and i think the recoil change was terrible. It was kind of the main machinic in the game. It would be like if fortnite completely takes away building for good, that just makes it another BR.

[@TarkanTV1]

Honestly new recoil update is decent but they have to change MP-5 man that gun was a king before the recoil update..

[@eKostiK]

IMO tier 2 and tier 3 weapons need to become much pricier. Lets take for example semi auto rifle: hit a single metal node for 600 metal (need 450) and open a few crates for components and you got a solid weapon. Weapons are so cheap that once its unlocked, you can mass produce them like a factory. Making T2 T3 weapons more expensive will make T1 PVP more common. Hazmat suit should also be less common drop. Most players never craft hazmat suit, because they can find it everywhere. Hazmat suits almost free to get solid armor which devalues road sign armor.

[@kacper98789]

The new recoil in my opinion is so bad. I miss the old recoil because when u learned it, it was so easy to kill almost everyone. The new recoil is mixed and now the spray is all about luck where bullet lands, these who say new recoil is good never tasted how 90% accuracy old ak feels

[@corbinlemon5936]

I still play but I feel like I wasted a long time training recoil, to be able to spray ak plus 150 and that was stripped away, I could fight big groups before I could take on teams bigger than 10 solo or duo now I lose two a duo when solo because they pushed the same time and its hard to miss shots before I could take them at range and out spray them. standing is the only skillful thing besides building but even then you cant force standing gun fights every time. I have had friends that joined (becuase of update) for a while but then quit due to the amount of time you need to devote to the game I now have had to run deeper and bigger groups still fun, but i miss the rewarding 1v5 2v8 etc fights i was able to win before. big fights aren't as rewarding seeing I am running deeper. just my thoughts also love your channel Sig.

[@dwaynejohnson4085]

loot doesn't even feel like loot anymore lol. It just feels like an "investment" of time for pixels. That's why I stopped playing rust. Guns aren't rare, materials are abundant, and everything is predictable. Too predictable. The past 3 "wipes" I played I felt like it was a waste of time because I knew exactly where I would be and what I would be doing. That isn't exactly fun to me. Returning to older devblogs like 116 & before let me remember why I played rust to begin with. Very little was predictable. Loot was rare. And that's all it was. the minimalism spoke volumes. It Made you have to feel like you were fighting for the ability to defend yourself, and to defend your -base- home. Now I log on a server and fish for 10 minutes to get a shotgun. There is little sentiment to rust anymore in my opinion.

[@dmytroliepin5664]

Hate new research system too, wish they will remove workbench research in Hardcore

[@ktms1188]

It was the GROSS amount of SCRIPTING that was the real reason this was so big for legit players. It causes faster deaths but actually makes the game fair for all those fights you lost to scripting.

[@hjaltestaun929]

bro not many people are scripting, they are just better than you, except maybe if u played on facepunch servers, but thats ur own fault then.

[@Beyondlimits_400]

Scripts are still definitely a thing, it’s just different scripts that help narrow the aim cone. They took something that wasn’t broken and utterly destroyed it, making only 2-3 guns in the game really viable for pvp.

[@robinkonig5828]

Scripts are a 10 times bigger problem now then before, and its almost impossible to tell now if someone is scripting or not, having a script makes you never whiff in your spray with any gun so its still a way bigger advantage then people may think Especially with guns like python or just using 8x scopes on guns

[@vans617]

i personally quit for several months after the update. imo the problem with all these updates is that they are changing the things that made rust rust. the tech tree, new recoil being the biggest. you used to have to go out and find what you wanted to blueprint and practice to be able to shoot higher tier guns. now zergs have t3 and aks 30 min into force wipe and players with 500 hours beam with ak

[@user-qf2pk4ip3z]

Lets see the new numbers. New recoil is still trash.

[@NinjapowerMS]

Turned PvP lamer. If you got caught in the back, you're dead most of the time. Old recoil gave you chances to react but now every casual can just burst you to death unless they have the aim of an old man. Also there's been a clear cut meta now. Barely anyone crafting other guns besides AK, SAR and Thompson. Sure there was meta before with MP5 and AK but the rest had its love. Wouldn't even touch LR now lol

[@ewiebs6969]

I think that the game would be so much better with no aim cone.

[@azmirahman6387]

The good thing about the recoil update is that I don't have to play long hours as compared to back then. Now, I am engaged in more PVPs & raids. One regular night is enough to fill up my dopamine level. Of course, I died more often now but that's part of RUST.

[@quez1937]

No rust was about a hardcore survivagame no one with 500 hours should be the same level as a guy with 2k hours

[@MasterTemp]

so basically you sucked and dont have time to practice so that means you should be given a red carpet to get your dopamine high getting lucky with some kills. thats like saying I cant ride motorcross but they should flatten everyones tires so i atleast stand a chance in competition.

[@bilghiru1992]

I said it since the recoil update and I stand by my point. The only people complaining about the recoil changes are the same people that no lifed 1000 hours on UKN to shit on everyone else. 2-3 guns were usable, which sucked. I couldn't even hold the AK in my hands, now we are on equal grounds and it all comes down to game sense and how you peek. Besides, now it incentivizes players to roam and fight more with higher tier weapons since they don't need a PHD in controlling them.

[@jameswilliams185]

The issue I see with the recoil update is related to just how different rust is compared to other games, what game has the spray patterns of csgo, survival and building mechanics of Minecraft, dayz, and 7 days to die, and fps gameplay like call of duty and battlefield. NONE. Rust is in an entirely different ballpark in terms of how it should cater to new and old players. It was all of these combined things that created a crescendo of amazing game elements that fit together well. Extremely hard recoil patterns and LIMITED BLOOM meant that getting better was rewarded, now there is call of duty-esc recoil with boring and infuriating Fortnite style bloom. I think this change was made to try and fit in with other fps titles, after all, facepunch is a corporation with sucessful ip’s. But playing it safe and conforming to other games will doom the game to mediocrity

[@Flame-dn2tb]

bro old recoil felt like u mastered the game yk, this new shit I can be spraying perfectly on someones head and random bloom will decide I'm not winning the fight yk. put the power back in the players hands.

[@wornoutwasd8567]

I fight way more people on the ground since the update. I was worried about how it would affect the game as a 7 year vet since I saw the last dive on the previous recoil change. The previous aim cone was not implemented well but this time it has been much better.

[@Pade-14kct5]

not at all you clearly arent a vet lmao

[@ArtistinDeadlight777]

@@Pade-14kct5 "I have frog boots and 1k hours, I used to play this game on my browser, here is my vet opinion, it's worth as much as yours, you may have game sense and be good for PVP, but I have history and I remember how it used to be, back to battle bits now" -Your average RPer

[@Pade-14kct5]

@@ArtistinDeadlight777 Ive been playing since 2013 im aware of how the game used to be too bud. It used to be 10x better than what it is now. I have 15k hrs you think i got it in 2 yrs? no the game was good and the devs dgaf

[@ArtistinDeadlight777]

@@Pade-14kct5 I was replying to you as a joke I also want old recoil back It's just goofy rpers who don't really play the game They're all on battlebits as we're speaking

[@Pade-14kct5]

@@ArtistinDeadlight777 ewwww wtf

[@statitica5662]

I'm a fan of the simplified recoil patterns, as I think that combat should be accessible to newcomers, but aim-cone is a bad addition and turns every gunfight into a mix of spray, and luck.

[@sigbender8849]

Most w take in this comment section honestly

[@sigbender8849]

Because then the good players can still be better than everyone

[@Erick726]

I can finally shoot w/o having to memorize complex patterns. I didn't start playing Rust to sit on aim train servers for hours a day before I start playing. The really old AK pattern from 2016 was perfect in my opinion. This is second best. Those who are crying hate that recoil has been balanced and they are no longer the top 1%.

[@silviarust]

guns aren't balanced even a little anymore ak is 10x better than literally every gun including m2

[@riverafps]

now everyone is good at rust bc theres no recoil

[@Kevin-xq2tv]

@@silviarust r/woooosh

[@orbbrust]

Bring back old sounds and recoil plz and ty

[@zaskadu8320]

Oh i quit and never looked back even once.. I have 3500 hours and wow what an experience it was to go from total noob not even knowing what is a TC and why i need to make a base.. to full on chad controlling servers. Old recoil Rust.. where hard work payed off... those were the good old days hey........

[@sk8c]

i think big burger does big hungry

[@thekorekoi]

Been waiting for this one :)

[@Saqux]

i still cant recognice what gun is shooting in the distance, im so used to old sounds

[@isthatotis]

im a competitive guy and it was such an easy transition from cs to rust for me not because it was easy but because it had such a competitive scene, a lot of people dont understand that. peoples egoes were huge not because of comparing to others, but self progress, then they went and threw it all away. Another thing is hdrp update, me and all my friends were getting 90-180 fps prehdrp with good graphics and after switch it was 40-50 with graphics on lowest, getting rid of that red biome n the basic geometry for something much more bland and open without increasing performance really turned us from competitive players to competitive whiners. There were a few very welcomed changes like labs and arctic but for the most part this game’s started to lose its glory

[@johnwick7900]

I dont like when floor triangle are getting splash damage or doors going through walls and the thing you can place unlimited tcs and sleeping bags

[@jeroen92]

The surge in cheaters hurt the game. Nothing else.

[@deadeye5639]

cheaters, wut, there were a lot of scripters but thats changed since they cant use laser aim, the new recoil/bloom update makes that almost impossible, but i dont think we had actual cheaters that use fly hacks, wall hacks, aim hacks or spawn loot, thats really rare, we also have admins that can check on ppl, cheaters arent that common imo, maybe im wrong but yeah

[@N3ON1993]

@@deadeye5639 6 cheaters in maybe 8 h of playing :D 2 of them blantant aimboting the shit out of everyone... There are more hackers then ever. And scripters were anoying but most of them sucked in terms of gamesense and aim so if you had some certain skill level you could even kill them also at further distance... good luck now with all those bloom...

[@speedy357]

@@deadeye5639 i used to never run into anyone i thought was cheating but now almost everytime i get on i have a little message in my inbox saying someone i reported was banned

[@jeroen92]

@@deadeye5639 do you even play? I get at least 4-5 ban messages from people I reported for cheating every week. I guess you just don't know quite how to recognise it, but there are cheats that let you see through walls and yes, also fly. There are also cheats that let you fire your weapon much faster for example. Last wipe there was a group that was flyhacking on eu facepunch 3 and raiding the whole server. They had walled in bandit camp with turrets and killed the entire server pop. Whenever they got banned they would log in a new account straight away and continue cheating.

[@reefbackleviathan3581]

i dont really care for the recoil update, and i think it helped in some parts of the game but what made me quit was the nerfs to all smgs, mp5 and tommy recoil were unique and enjoyable to learn due to not requiring such insane hours on ukn as the ak if they reverted mp5 recoil specifically and altered some of the sounds to be more recognizable then me and probably a lot of other players would return

[@cutwrist]

As someone who has played rust since 2015 and always enjoyed pvp the most, the combat update made me quit the game entirely. I wouldn't care about new recoil or gun sounds but making it so you can't shoot more than 10 bullets with any gun before spread is too much to hit anyone makes it less about skill and more about luck.

[@anomalyevolution40]

I love the change because you couldn't pay me to learn the old AK by spending 1k hours in ukn just so I can have a 200m spray.

[@Trenton-x5g]

Old recoil was just better in my opinion, i wasn’t even that good but I remember having a ton of fun because I knew I was working towards improving my skill now gameplay is a bit meh. Also people saying that they don’t have time to learn the old recoil was a bit of a dumb take, I mean it’s only an S.

[@BullseyeBill]

As a long time player (2.5 years) but part time player, I really like the update. Yes, I understand the frustrations of the hard core pvp’ers, but for me, especially as a solo/due player the update has made it move even. I want to jump on and enjoy rust. Get a few kills, make a few plays and still enjoy IRL off line life. There is no doubt that the pvp Warrior types will be upset, but you have to consider the longevity of a game. In my opinion it had become too skilled for new players to become established, to be able to learn and enjoy the game. Now, after 2.5 years and nearly 2k hours I am still shit at pvp, but at least I have a small chance in a fight, which does open different excitements and aspects to a game which can be played in almost too many ways. Anyway, I’m off to farm…

[@ptr0001]

If you truly do solo this update hasn't really benefited you. As a solo the one thing you can count on in pvp is that you can outplay a group, pick one off with good game sense. But restricting the ability to stand and spray, and being forced to fight crouched, in my experience has just made me a sitting duck. Without the ability to spray and jiggle back and forth crouch as well, pvp against groups has been horrible. The recoils I agree were fine, but the changes to movement imo hasn't benefited any solo's out there where success is only found by out playing groups.

[@shaqrater7827]

As a rust player i absolutely despise the recoil update

[@michaelfomenko1563]

I started after the recoil update and that had no impact on my starting... however as someone who's played games with spray patterns I'm glad to see they removed it before I had to suffer through that nightmare again. Spray patterns simply give an edge to people who have hours to blow training muscle memory to twitch in a specific pattern with a specific gun. I'd argue it has less to do with skill and far more to do with how much time you have to dedicate to aim servers. While this does present problems like the inevitable Bush grub getting the drop on you and mercing you before you even know you're in a fight, those problems can be solved with either buffs to armor or nerfs to gun damage to prolong fights allowing players with actual skill to overcome ambushes.

[@yuy389]

it wasnt hard to learn them and the people who put the time and effort into the game should be better then the 23 hour guy who just got it

[@michaelfomenko1563]

@@yuy389 being "good" is more than muscle memory on how to twitch with a weapon or how much time you spend on aim training servers. being good is about things like tactics and teamwork, about being able to strategize on the instance and out think your opponent. good players only got better with the update, bad players were merely given a chance if they were smart enough to ambush good players in the first place.

[@dred1685]

@@michaelfomenko1563 Shooters aren't for you. Civilization VI is the perfect game for you.

[@michaelfomenko1563]

@Dred lol if you need muscle memory patterns to play shooters then I'm afraid they arnt for you. Go back to console with your aim assist and leave the pc fps to those of us who don't need the lame advantage

[@yuy389]

@@michaelfomenko1563 sprays are mostly luck now it only helps the shit players aimcone is insane rn

[@dhugrace8861]

Me personally it’s somewhat understandable for the new recoil because so many complain about learning the recoils but the one thing that pissed me off the most was how they changed the sounds I had spent about 1000 hours so I was used to the gun sounds but then when I heard the new sounds I instantly uninstalled the game I have came back to playing the game but it is not the same it used to be

[@ewancook]

Sorry man but I have to say it, imagine uninstalling a game because they changed the sound of a gun LOL

[@BapRust]

Great video dude

[@fizzlebeef165]

I both like and hate it I love the AK recoil because a gun shouldn't be that difficult to control all the other recoils were fine idk why they changed them And I hate the crouch Meta and bloom

[@Soapy007]

I think that more people will come but they won’t stay as long because the game is not as rewarding anymore.

[@LazyBuddyBan]

More simplicity for casual players is great, but they still not adress main problem with the game. There is too much focus on competitive pvp: If i wanted to play ESPORT CSGO i would have played that instead of Rust. I want ACTUAL danger from environment other than damn roof camper. I DONT want another pve-disguised grind for the sake of pvp.

[@pianomirror4833]

Wont play the game again until they revert the change.

[@SSGoobert]

I think there are only a couple things rust needs to change and that is 1: THE WILDLIFE IN THIS GAME IS SO GODAMN OVERPOWERED PLEASE FIX IT NOW GOGOGOGOGO 2: make some way for newer players to figure out how to play the game, in my experience a bunch of people call rust trash and then I ask them how many hours they have and they say like around 10 and I say to them “did you even try to learn the game” and they don’t even know where to start so I’ve tried to teach a couple of my friends how to play but it’s just so confusing to newer players. 3: make locked crates not able to give you complete garbage That’s all

[@Liam-tw1dz]

I loved the oil recoil but new is just as good for different reasons, people complain about performance but considering there's servers with 700 players all from different places with their own bases I think it runs insanely well. I spend most of the time dead as I play solo or small group but that just makes winning more fun, im happy with it all.

[@chance5192]

If they literally left T3 guns the way that they were before the update the game would be perfect, as most players struggle to get to T3 weapons regardless it wouldn't matter how hard the weapons are to spray as it wouldn't be an issue for 90% of rust players. Veterans would still have difficult recoil and high skill pvp to enjoy whilst lower skill players would be able to easily shoot T2 and T1 weapons. not to mention the god awful sounds they added to the guns, we are literally shooting paintball guns and it breaks my heart to see such a phenomenal game turn to shit in such a short span of time.

[@gmclucy]

hey saw me in there :3 I dont play Rust much just because of time but one of the stand out things was always how annoying and unpredictable animals were

[@SuplyLV]

Damnnn I got in the vid :D

[@ThatFellaTymer]

I think that the recoil changes were overall a good thing, if for nothing else, I LOVE that I don't feel obligated to play ukn anymore just to stand a chance, feels more about getting the jump on people, which It should, rust is meant to be a ratty experience.

[@lilsnugo7171]

No, Rust is meant to be very skill based

[@AndyRobertooie]

Rust is a grind simulator, why shouldn't you have to also grind for good aim as well?

[@lilsnugo7171]

@@AndyRobertooie agreed

[@mr.coconut4234]

It was a good idea for change, but executed HORRIBLY. Gun fights don't feel rewarding, and guns in general aren't fun to shoot anymore.

[@IZbyxI]

@@AndyRobertooie It is a grind even now you just probably dont realize it. From my observation people who have mastered the current recoil (for example 200m ak spray almost perfect straight) are less than 5% of the total players so idk if it should be even less accessible.

[@boy9958]

i miss the old sounds but all i can ask from facpunch is to help performance and have the M2 buffed a bit

[@hotline1970]

i feel like the game only has one aspect that you can be better at and that is building and that you can just copy a youtube video to make a base that people whit 200 hours shouldnt be able to make. old recoil was the great equalizer, people couldnt just copy a youtube base and defended a online raid so easily. the game feels like it discourages online raids, bcs there is no longer a skill cap and you couldnt win a online just from beeing better at the game.

[@yeti_ily]

This right here, online's while rare on old recoil are basically gone unless they are using a fob as I can't just put a sleep bag and an extra kit or two and win raids consistently online anymore, and I personally hate fob raiding I'd much rather just ram thru the base but hey they gotta get the cod players somehow I guess hopefully these cod players leave after a year like they do with they own games 🤣 and they change it back to a decent recoil I'd take the lighting bolt pattern over this and I hated that pattern

[@MG_bard_sensei]

going through waves of playing rust (getting 40+ hours a week for a few weeks straight then putting it down for months) I can say I was really bad before recoil and am now pretty bad post recoil update. mostly monuments have become easier, while pvp is basically the same. any benefit I got from the recoil update the players who spent weeks shitting on me also received so I think the balance remains.

[@ShrUmzZ]

the amount of players looking at steam stats has dropped by about 30K excluding Christmas boom which happens every year. personally as someone with thousand of hours in this game who has played for 4 years i think that the recoil change was the worst update in this game so far and im not saying that changes to pvp weren't needed but i am a believer in the idea that games are better when it takes skill because it is fun to learn and improve. the huge weapon bloom especially on weapons that use 9mm is awful, you have to crouch to be accurate and to lower the recoil, all these changes made the pvp in this game feel slower and more luck based i understand the devs wanted to make newer players have a better chance but removing the skill gap isn't the right way to do that,

[@sloppyslopp2430]

i miss everything about the old guns also i havent liked any of the new updates after combatupdate exepct for the new one with drones i actually really like flying around with drones its pretty fun

[@Fl4ctioN]

personally I would prefer the old recoil, but I don't really mind the new one. Only thing I would change is the way they make players stay in there base instead of roaming.

[@nebulancer3533]

If you can't outplay new players without being able to beam them at unrealistic ranges while strafing, you never had much game sense to begin with. An arbitrary recoil pattern is not how automatic gunfire works IRL or should work in a game. Obviously, people who learned one style of gameplay and were favored with insane advantages are going to miss it. But others (like me) who refused to spend weeks learning spray patterns for a supposedly-fun video game have now returned because of the recoil update. Hate away, but this was the inevitable route Rust needed to take.

[@shaymic20]

I think that having team limits on some servers would help the community alot. I saw a comment on how that could affect raiding because you can't clear the tc, but honestly everybody Ive played with except total newbies code lock the tc so you have to destroy it anyways Whenever I play solo I go to to a modded solo duo trio quad server and have great time. Hell even when I gruop I do that cuz fuck zergs. But yeah if you wanna zerg or challenge yourself to beat them there should be an official server dedicated to that and all the small gruops can go to another official server.

[@GodHeld]

So your answer is we don't know? The title is "Did the recoil update hurt Rust?" According to Betteridge's law of headlines, is a saying that says, "Any headline that ends with a question mark will be answered with the word no."

[@a1534-d7k]

The new recoil and aimcone made pvp boring af..

[@orbbrust]

Sorry but 500 scrap for mp5 yeh it was ok with old recoil because it was a good gun but post update it should be a tier 2 gun not tier 3 worthy

[@Mephilic]

Personally all I care about is limiting the functionality of recoil scripts. If the changes make that harder to do that's all that matters to me. What I'd really like to see them balancing the gun play by either modifying the current guns or adding new guns that can allow one to play closer to their preference of gun style. Burst mode was a great addition in this direction.

[@capuchiin]

you can still script, the scripters are all legit cheating or full cheating

[@antsila5825]

The thing is burst is only on glock mp5 and lr and no-one uses the burst module Glock is pretty good from close range because the fire rate is insane Mp5 and lr are ok but honestly its better to just tap if you cant full spray or something

[@OrangeMan-ek1xu]

Honestly i haven't even really noticed. I had around 200 hours before the update and i have played about 700 since and the change didnt effect me much. Although im not combat wizard like some of the other people commenting.

[@skeletor3703]

My problem is fact that Facepunch has not addressed the cheater epidemic that is happening for a few years now. The game is fine as it is, maybe a bit of performance would be nice as well.

[@orbbrust]

Rather vs a cheater with old recoil than the new on atleast I had a chance now my crosshair is on their head and half of my bullets don’t hit because game bad

[@RB3_24cent]

if they didn't change the ak recoil and sound it wouldn't be this bad

[@OEsEben]

The AK recoil being scripted by 50% of the playerbase was the reason the changes came. Get outta here lmao.

[@RB3_24cent]

@@OEsEben well now u can't even know if some one is cheating or a total new to the game by the ak and cheaters are still here so what did they achieve?

[@OEsEben]

@RB 3 stop coping. The game is better than ever with way way less cheaters.

[@RB3_24cent]

@@OEsEben legit every one can spary ak now i tought my firned the game in his first 10min in aim traning to see recoils he started killing ppl with it from far so that's the thing uit's way too ez compared to the last recoil

[@OEsEben]

@RB 3 that is a good thing. Skill isn't how long you can practice a recoil pattern. Get your game sense up and outplay people.

[@hendytendy5972]

Great vid Sig

[@panampizzaman7011]

Old Recoil had years of tweaking before it was "good". Same goes with this New "PvP" update. Just needs some Time Love and Care.

[@metasamsara]

i don't care about gun play, but i don't like that they failed to improve building system. playing defensive solo is barely viable on unmodded, and they won't add new building stuff. There is so much that could be done, including half vertical walls, half vertical door frame, half floors and half foundations, square triangle floors and foundations, mirrored staircases, secret passage hiding mechanics (like hiding a trapdoor or window under a rug, quarter wall crouching doors, more traps, easier ways to setup electricity, harder raids outside of going through doors, lower upkeep cost, etc, etc. the reasons to dislike the building in rust as someone who actually wants to enjoy rust for the building are COUNTLESS. and the devs keep acting like rust is a pubg wannabe instead of capitalizing on the defensive building meta. let us build much more advanced and inconspicuous trap bases, and make it more seamless to not be able to tell the difference between a good raid target and an actual trap base. even shotgun traps are so limited in how you can effectively place them and not be dodged. and rocket launcher should have never made it into the game. as a result i stopped caring for building, and moved on to PUBG for a better pvp experience.

[@premade2466]

I think this update was a big fail... i mean YES the weapons where to hard.. and yes the new Player experence was shit, but why was there no compromise?? Why change all weapons in one update?.. all sounds the crouching... it was to mutch. Why dont say hey let them the mp5 or thommy... now everyone beams. The new player experence is even worse becouse everyone beams... And its all in all wayyyy to easy to get guns and use them. I also do not see the point of watching Rust Videos...becouse there is no skill gap. Now numbers are everything the pvp is no fun and getting beamed in 0.1 seconds is the new Meta. I still play it sometimes, but i played since 10 years and i know aaaaa looot of the playerbase and the most say the Same.... its ok... but it just feels not the same... And if an Update is still a thing After 6 month, its not a good sign..

[@samson_BNR32]

it’s the aimcone. it’s so demoralizing hitting your shots and not being rewarded for it. with holo and laser. it’s so dumb

[@center45studios38]

basically, all old players who were good at the game quit and don’t play rust anymore and the only people left are shitty kids who aren’t argued with

[@urus.T]

isnt a hardcore survival game anymore its just a battlefield where numbers rule. The updates have been so bad ever since the recoil change, they are adding tugboats, ATTACK HELICOPTERS that players control, and next they are probably just gonna add jets and fucking nukes because why not game is already fucked

[@syd4289]

honestly i dont mind spray pattern change itself (on the ak) i actually like it, my friends that dont put too much time in the game can actually play now. however, what i dont like is the standing recoil penalty, the pvp is already slow in game so why would they make it like this. + new bloom/aim cone is so bad it made the custom smg worthless, now most pistols are better than it. also the lmg was unnecessary. they should've added a new tier 1 weapon. we've had only rev, nailgun and db for so long

[@SockerConny80]

I only really have two grievances with the recoil update: (1) I don't like that having superior skill with a gun no longer matters much which only further benefits zergs that are made up of 99% trash players. (2) That the LR has become so bad it's only slightly better than a custom. They might as well have removed it. I feel like they are trying to push for larger group playing to eventually make it more viable as an E-Sport down the road. As a result though, I'm afraid it will alienate the players who are drawn to the game by how much more it is than the monotonous fps games like cs:go. I love Rust because of the absolute insane weirdness that happens in the interactions you have with all types of players doing their own thing (for example Welyn meets Porgie). Great Channel, can't wait to see what you give us in 2023!

[@Yodeed]

Launch Rust Classic. Old Recoil, Old Sounds. I'll buy it.