I Can't Stop Thinking About Programming After Work!

[@HealthyDev]

What healthy ways have you found to stop thinking about programming when you get home? Leave me your tips and feedback below!

[@Pythonista24x7]

I think going for walks and swim has helped me personally. Listening to music and just catching up with movies and KZbin has helped me.

[@HealthyDev]

Those sound like great ideas. Thanks!

[@simpletongeek]

Why would you want to stop thinking about programming? Your best ideas come when you're relaxing either sleeping, showering, or just overall zoning out. Driving around in a car also works. Best if you embrace it. Do spend time with your friends and families, but carry a notebook with you to jot down these good ideas as they come to you. Computer programming is part of creative endeavor and you need to accept that good ideas come at all times.

[@PaulSebastianM]

Doing something else with my mind or hands. A separate hobby. Cooking? Wood working? Making music? Biking? Reading fiction? (Not really). Just do something else.

[@HealthyDev]

That’s good advice. Someone once told me “If you work with your hands, relax with your mind. If you work with your mind, relax with your hands.” Seems to make sense.

[@MikeChilson]

I have a hobby that has nothing to do with programming or being on-line. After dinner, I go down into the workshop and work with wood and other materials using my hands and it winds me down from the day in ways I could have never imagined.

[@HealthyDev]

Awesome! I’ve thought about learning to build acoustic guitars, but I probably don’t have the time right now. Woodworking sounds cool.

[@impdev9828]

What you said about coming home from work and not being able to take your mind off of things really resonated with me, I'm going through the exact same thing and it's starting to burn me out a bit. I still love my job, but I can't ever seem to just stop. I think a lot of people in the software industry experience this because our work is also what we're passionate about (most of the time), we can't switch off because subconsciously we really don't want to, at least that's how it feels for me. Great video regardless.

[@HealthyDev]

Thanks for sharing, it sure can be a struggle. I’m getting better at it for sure, but it’s definitely difficult. I think for me problem solving, or technology in general, can be addictive. I have to be ever more vigilant that I do a good job at work, but don’t let it take over my life. I hope you find some peace.

[@DarrenSemotiuk]

Yikes it only got worse when COVID19 shutdown made so many of us work from home months on end >_

[@androidgameplays4every13]

I feel dirty until I find the solution, I wish I could take it less seriously, but I can't.

[@Gigasimo456]

I have the same problem, but honestly all i do is, whenever a thought about work comes up while i'm not working, i just literally tell it to f. off (literally, not exagerating). No matter how interested i am in the topic and how much i would like to think about the problem, i realize i already spend 8 hours a day immersed in that. Because of a poor choice of university degree i already experienced a burnout that costed me a year of my life and i don't want to have another.

[@seesharper8913]

I have had trouble sleeping because I'm trying to think through a problem at work. I also notice sometimes I'll carry work in to my personal life, and slowly start to resent work for things I am doing to myself. No one asks me to work off the clock, but mentally I still do. Sometimes I'll even start up a side project that relates to a problem at work that way I can work on the problem, while also doing something for myself. Then I get back to work and I wasted my energy and motivation over the weekend hammering something in my head during the least efficient times.

[@TravisHi_YT]

Generally anything where I get to hold something physically that doesn't have a screen. So Warhammers, physical sports, reading books/magazines, going for walks etc seems to work for me. Btw seems like your channel is blowing up lately, one of the mystery youtube algorithms at work. Thanks for the videos, they feel really important as I move toward the intermediate dev range.

[@HealthyDev]

Thanks Travis, that's a great point! I once heard (I don't remember from who) "If you work with your mind, rest with your hands. If you work with your hands, rest with your mind". I think that's a pretty good thing to consider. When I've tried to rest from work with more mental work (even watching TV or playing a video game or something) it doesn't actually recharge me.

[@scabbage]

Definitely relatable. I had same issues of dreaming about work and not able to fall asleep cuz my brain was so actively thinking about all the problems I had to solve. And I'm sure it's a common problem for most engineers. For me, I considered it a somewhat unhealthy lifestyle especially considering the bigger picture of what it takes to be a healthy human being. In fact, taking our minds off of work is beneficial for us to get more productive at work. So maybe developing some ritual after work to wind down the day would help. Like go play sports or join a book club. You'll get a better sleep at night as well.

[@HealthyDev]

Thanks for the tips, most appreciated!

[@dsinghr]

Man you are making one awesome video after another !! Kudos

[@jagadeeshakanihal]

"Dreaming about programming" - this has happened me.

[@HealthyDev]

Isn’t it so weird??? Lol 😂

[@electron8262]

Yeah. The problem is that all the coding happens in my head, and I just use my hands to make the changes on the computer. So when I go to sleep, the part of my brain that does the coding sometimes keeps on thinking about and making new changes, but they just don't actually happen because I'm not at a PC. It's irritating to have my brain go on by itself like this.

[@herp_derpingson]

@@electron8262 Sometimes I have deja vu moments like didnt I already code this? ...or was it a dream?

[@electron8262]

@@herp_derpingson Man I can completely imagine that happening. It must suck. I've started going a couple of days in a row without coding to stop feeding my brain.

[@nuvotion-live]

For me it's the norm rather than the exception. Part of the danger of coding before bed

[@samqwerty]

You're doing an amazing job. Your videos are almost like a therapy for me!

[@HealthyDev]

Hey thanks for the kind words! Glad to have you here. 👍

[@jorabart]

I had a set of keys that were for various “work” areas that I had access to - the office back door, the server closet, the NOC, the cage inside the NOC, etc. I got a key ring that split into two parts. When I was not on-call, at the end of each day I would separate my work keys and throw them in the center console of my car, I wouldn’t even bring them in the house. I also had an on=call phone, I would leave in my desk when I was not on-call. Finally, first thing through the door was to empty my pockets and change out of “work” clothes and into something more comfortable. Depending on if the day was stressful, I would even take a shower with some soap or shower gel that was a relaxing fragrance, rather than the “invigorating” fragrance I would use in the mornings before work.

[@HealthyDev]

Interesting, I like the use of different fragrances. Thanks for sharing!

[@programthis3805]

I can totally relate to this! Great video!

[@Павел-т3х9в]

This is very complicated topic for me as well, though I'm still a student, there are a lot of projects in our university, which we need to accomplish, and it's to stop thinking about them even when you are trying to sleep. In my personal experience, what helps to get rid of such thoughts is gym, when you are totally concentrated on how to accomplish some exercise in a right way. You just cannot think about programming, when you need to lift 100 kgs or something like that :) Another thing, which helps, is talking with people, who are not from IT area. It's impossible to speak with them about "our" themes, and so you are slowly switching and turning your mind into another direction.

[@HealthyDev]

Great tips. That’s fantastic that you’re developing healthy habits to deal with this while a student! Thanks for your feedback.

[@RandomNullpointer]

Funny thing, I go to the gym for the exact opposite. Over there while I'm exercising I'd go deep into the program, it's like meditation; I would look for points which are potential problems in the design, or I would slowly study and find *the solution* for a lingering problem. The gym really helps me get things done :)

[@BonesCollector]

I just found your channel and there are many things, that you talk about, that I can relate to. Like in this video, I had the similar situation where I had a day job and my startup on evenings and weekends, while having 2 kids. I did that for 2 and a half years and I just burnt myself out, realizing that I lost time with my kids, wife and friends. Now I have set my startup to the side, not knowing what to do with it... and I have changed to a job closer to home with less responsibility. My last day job was not just coding, but I had many other roles within the company and was traveling to customers to fix, teach and do installations/upgrades of the new releases of the software. Hopefully people will see early on that work is just work and that you can change, but you will only have one life, so spend it correctly so you do not have to look back and regret that you have just wasted away memories that you could have had with those that are closest to you.

[@HealthyDev]

Thanks for sharing this if you watch the videos in the playlist about my career journey, and the “My Recovery from Programmer Anger” video - you’ll find we’ve both had some very similar experiences (regrets over failed startups, impact on family etc.).

[@drp_bear]

Thanks for the incredibly great content. As for "coping mechanisms", nothing can "flush" my mind better than thinking "hey buddy, you arent getting paid for thinking about it right now", lol. Cheers.

[@HealthyDev]

Ha! That should be all it takes. Somehow that never worked for me when I was younger. But yes a good question to ask!

[@CodeSwag]

I have the exact same problem. I get so engrossed by work that I end up doing exactly like what you are saying. Awesome channel by the way, I love the whole Healthy Software Developer concept, keep it up!

[@FilipLindqvist]

Very genuine video, I feel you! Just in the process of learning how to pull this off.

[@yobeenocreative6984]

I code in my spare time, between shift work. I get frustrated if I cannot solve a problem when it's time to wrap up. I think it's because that expected buzz I look forward to when I solve a problem, just didn't come. If I am trying to get my head clear of a problem, I try to do something else different to coding..try to learn something new on the guitar, watch a movie maybe, family time, chat with a friend. It's hard to detach because I am drawn to the problem solving. The upside is that I do find thinking about it after a break from it can provide solutions, often at the darnedest times. 😉

[@NewNerdInTown]

I completely understand figuring this out, but I do not think there is a one-solution-fits-all to this problem. Especially in the software industry. I am quitting a job this week that has completely ran my mental state into the ground the past 2.5 years. I was doing exactly what you mentioned: Bringing my work home with me, working into the early morning hours of a day (2am, 3am), giving the company more and more without thought to my own health. Then I broke, started smoking weed daily, drinking excessively, sometimes even taking my laptop to a bar during lunch hour. It got very unhealthy, very quickly. It was just escapism, like you mention. Then I discovered that isn't the person I have always been, so I had to identify what changed in my life to lead me into these new habits. That's when I figured out that being a hard worker does not define me, my habits define me. If my habits are just working my ass off every day, then I'm not human. I'm a freakin robot and everything I do outside of being a freakin robot are just mitigation tactics to keep my mind from breaking. I was being reactive, rather than proactive. I had to have that thought drilled into my head to make a change. So lately I have been taking steps to carve out those 16 hours of the day I'm awake into work habits, play habits, and emotional habits. Play is still that escapism - where it be having a drink, playing video games, or smoking a bit. But it doesn't consume me anymore. Balance at the daily scope, rather than the weekly, monthly, or yearly scope truly matters in the long run. It just took a company to run my mind into the ground first for me to figure that out. Cheers Jayme. Just discovering your videos. Great topics to reflect on.

[@HealthyDev]

Thanks for sharing your struggle and solution. You have no idea how I relate...

[@bendego2800]

why would any one do that much for a job? an abundant one

[@silentwater79]

Thank you 🙏! Just thank you for your Channel!

[@Jacob-mo7yw]

Thanks for the vid, it resonates a lot. However I don't necessarily feel burnt out, as much as I do frustrated when it comes to not being able to "switch off" from work. This is due to not being able to connect and engage with what's going on around me at the time.

[@HealthyDev]

Interesting what you say about not being able to connect and engage with what’s going on around you. That’s a good description.

[@Patrick_Iradukunda]

This is killing me. As long as I have a computer within reach I can't stop. The only thing that works for me is hanging out with people outside. The problem is my friends are programmers, so when we hangout we are talking about programming...which makes me bring up what I am currently working on ughhhh

[@HealthyDev]

Lol totally! We coders can be an obsessive bunch. I’ve had to be more militant about stopping as I’ve gotten older. It’s still tough! I feel ya on having programmer friends - that’s especially hard! Hang in there Patrick. Thanks for sharing your experience. 👍

[@jonbikaku6133]

Definitely woken up at 3am realising I figured out the proper way to solve my problem, and if it does work, then id rather tackle the next problem. If it doesn't, it makes me want to just be up and get that sorted either ways lol. For helping me get out of this zone at times, its chemical related but an acid trip once a month really helps me get a break tbh.

[@niclash]

I am now at 35 years of full-time programmer, and the easiest way to push it into right-side of brain (where it gets solved) is to engage with people, talking is enough, doing something together is even easier. And if there is no people in your life, then why does it matter if you disconnect or not.

[@krfloll]

I create mind maps as a way to journal the day/problem. If something comes to mind while I'm off work I add it to the map as something to try on the clock. I don't mind thinking/dreaming in code but I'll save the thought for when I'm in the clock. Getting it on paper, so to speak, removes the urgency and also give me the mental bandwidth to think about the efficacy of the solution

[@RyanKienstra]

Great video, Jayme! Active hobbies help me recuperate from work. Like you mentioned Yoga, I like to play music. Otherwise, I have a hard time 'turning off' after work.

[@XenogearsPS]

Happens to me when I get stuck. Then the wheels start turning and I can't stop thinking until it's resolved. Nowadays, I won't touch code until I solve it in my head. I get stuck at the computer screen and can't seem to think properly until I step away.

[@heatherlawler7]

Struggling with these exact problems. Especially thinking about “solutions” while trying to sleep. Difficult to get around it.

[@pawel89pawel]

It might seem stupid but going to work helps. What I mean is during the pandemic especially when I go to work and than have to get back home I feel like this time between one place and another when I walk or move from one place to another is this time that I can cut off. However when I do my side project which is on my computer I couldn’t get any sleep and I was constantly thinking about it as you said. What I think helped me at that time was sports and some time completely off-line

[@jasonhoman6525]

I go to the gym, swim, walk or do some yard work/gardening. All kinda help turn off my head and focus on the moment. I think the problem is programmers are always in their head thinking. It’s really hard to get out of that after work. It can be anxiety enducing because I’ll try to stop thinking then I start thinking about not thinking and go down this feedback loop that I can’t get out of. Physical things that require concentration without executive function seem to work well to get out of that loop for me.

[@deidran2116]

Love your videos. I suggest changing your profile photo to a more upbeat look, you’ll get more subscribers!

[@dukhlovi6284]

I went to a 4 day work week. It helps. But some times i cant lay work down,i know i have to put it down but i will go stubbornly go on with it to solve that freaking problem. It is wasted time. Mostly you will solve your problem the next morning in 10-30 minutes. Still learning being aware of how my mind works. if its tired i cant produce shit . Like you said its not flipping burgers. I play guitar or walk in nature with my dog to recharge. Did some yoga too for a year.I like it when i am coming back but i have realy to push myself over and over again to go ,so i quit. maybe i will pick it up again sometimes. The law of diminishing returns is strong in programming (talking working hours here),at least for me it is.

[@animanaut]

Having started JiuJitsu helped me „unhook“ from work. It is also about problem solving, but the scope is much more immediate. During class you pay attention to the lesson and drills. During free rolling afterwards you guaranteed don‘t think about work, since you are singlemindedly trying to survive the next six minutes. Being physically exhausted afterwards helps with sleeping. At work what I found helpful is, to cut my subtasks smaller. I also don‘t start new tasks near the end of „business-hours“, I rather reach out to colleagues to support them to finish their tasks.

[@afhostie]

I've done weight lifting which has been helpful but only so much. Especially with everyone working from home nowadays, it's become a little more challenging to completely unplug. Keeping pen and pad next to bed seems to help with waking up and having a solution.

[@geriatricprogrammer4364]

It's worse if you're working from home. Can't switch off.

[@claridiva2000]

I'm a new dev and learning a totally new language and framework for work. I definitely am doing code related things all day and night while in this learning curve.

[@HealthyDev]

While I applaud your enthusiasm, you’re also setting the expectation with other people you’ll work day and night to learn. Do what you gotta do just please be careful with your health. 👍❤️

[@Stratbass]

Man, a lot of things you say really resonate with me. I've had the same issues for "letting go" after work and also used to have what I call "code nightmares" quite often. What would you recommend regarding starting a startup and not feeling this way? I'm currently trying to work on my side hustle during mornings before work but I don't know if my strategy is the right one. Anyways, I really think I need something else apart from my daily job so I can have more "eggs in the basket". What do you think? Thanks for this video.

[@HealthyDev]

Hey thanks for the kind words. I think you’re right on target, making sure you don’t compromise the other “eggs”. They’re different for everyone, but walking with my wife or kids, sitting in our patio butterfly garden, praying, and singing/playing songs are some of the things I do.

[@rokyericksonroks]

Thank goodness for kan ban and the workflow visibility it provides. Otherwise, all the invisible, offsite round-the-clock mental torment experienced by the programmers would require a new way to make it more visible! We would be remiss if our client was unable to witness the anguish and disconnect being caused by the development issues of the assigned project. Likewise, consultants who know the vapid dystopian wasteland of projecting deadlines and estimates as new problems make their way to the surface would be better prepared fortify the pretenses they have already laid out for the client. See? It’s all really a healthy cycle. (sarcasm)

[@henriqueS9653]

Yep , I'm felling that I've been pass trought the same situation , although I've a newly history on programming, only 2 years. Started when I get into the university , and recently I start an internship , specifically on web development , since the begin I've been studying studying abruptly every day , and now that I work with it , I just can't stop to think about it , often I need to force myself to stop and sleep, not to mention when like you'd say woke up in middle night with some kind of 'solution' . I got reproved on all my course disciplines (computer science), because I've spent all my time programming , seems that i'm kidding but I don't :'( .

[@HealthyDev]

Hang in there Brendon. It’s like drinking from a fire hose starting out. But you WILL find more calm once you’ve been doing this a bit longer.

[@rafacancode]

I have the same problem, so far the best solution for me is 1. Have something you are doing which excites you, like a hobby, but like you said, it can't be short-term stimulation, so like a sport or something you do with your hands. 2. I have a wrap-up 1 hour before work where I document everything I did, I was doing and will do next shift, this way I can completely forget about everything because I know tomorrow I can read the notes I left and load the information back to my Brain RAM. If I don't do this then I usually can't disconnect because is like i left something unsolved and didn't clearly conclude it.

[@AHennigCR]

It's "a pain that i got used to". Singing helps me a lot. Unfortunately the quire i used to sing with is now more into social distancing than singing. The news about the calamity spreading with loud singing is horrible. In the yoga course, that i engaged before the calamity, i felt like the deterring exmple, but it is at least distracting and it is burning som stress hormones away. Uncluttering my mind with maintaining a journal is an ongoing experiment. When taking notes with pen and paper, something has letting go after only three iterations. i wish us both best of success with getting the work out of the head in the evening.

[@vidyadharUppaluru]

yoga, pranayam and meditation are a great way to survive a programming job, short of regular sabbaticals around the world and wilderness.

[@Donnirononon]

As i have started developing as a teenager i have always tought about "work" as home as i simply replaced time i spent on my hobby with working. Since ever i have this problem that when i am finally home at like 8, i have 2 hours until i go to bed and at least one hour i cant stop about thinking about work, in every silent minute. Just like now i am thinking about a problem on work and it drives me crazy, tomorrow i will remember that i want to play skyrim that evening, but i am going to think about work...

[@HealthyDev]

Hey try not to get too down on yourself! It’s hard to cut loose of this type of work. Hang in there. You’ve got a career to figure it out - you can do it!! My younger son was a HUGE Skyrim fan. He wrote some alternate lore even at one point! Great game.

[@TCTFounder]

You know when someone knocks on your door in that common way/pattern most of us know, but they don't finish it? ______knock.......knock, knock ....knock....knock ____most people feel compelled to finish it.____knock, knock! And then there're times when we get part of a song stuck in our head and it drives us crazy cause it won't stop. Some people swear that by singing out the remainder of the song that it helps get the song to stop playing on repeat within their mind. Perhaps that's the problem you're having when you can't let work go. I've heard that the human mind likes to finish things started or to complete patterns in general. Maybe you could try creating shorter-term goals on the job and attempt to feel satisfied having reached them by the end of the day. If that isn't possible or ineffective, then maybe you can trick your brain into letting go of the unfinished work by starting and finishing a word puzzle, logic puzzle, word-find, ect.. after you get off of work. That way you start a new "brain itch" and then satisfy that itch by completing the puzzle thereby forgetting about its previous itch. Good luck!

[@HealthyDev]

Makes a lot of sense!

[@blackmage-89]

Solved more than one problem during dreams :)

[@DoomedSpaceMarine123]

As a person who wants to be truly independent, I don't need to stop thinking about programming after work. I only need to stop thinking about work-related programming. Coding my own projects after work, on the other hand, is desirable. Software projects I do at work are so horrible (mostly because of technical debt) that working on my own ideas at home is not tiring but rather refreshing. Hell, it doesn't even matter if I work as a software developer or a cashier, because programming I have to do at work is so horrible I refuse to seriously call it "programming" since it defies the very purpose of programming, which is delegating the thinking tasks to computers to make our own lives easier. I don't get burned out because I don't do any REAL programming during the work.

[@HealthyDev]

Hey cool to hear you’ve got a situation where your day job is pretty easy so you can do stuff on the side. I’ve had phases of that over my career and it definitely can be nice!

[@DoomedSpaceMarine123]

@@HealthyDev "Easy" isn't the accurate word to describe it. To the contrary, it's inefficient and that makes it harder. We have a crappy architecture which results in lots of bugs, and rewriting some stuff would be the most efficient way to fix the problem, but the customers don't want that. They can't see the forest for the trees and just want us to take out the symptoms one by one. That's boring most of the time, and sometimes it's just exhausting. But I'm not exhausted to code my own stuff at home, because it doesn't have the exhausting properties that projects at my work have. I just don't see programming at home and programming at work as the same kind of activity, because, as I already said, the latter defies the purpose why I started programming to begin with.

[@HealthyDev]

Ok thanks I think I understand you better now. Yeah I’ve been on gigs where the culture is too messed up to improve much, and others where I’ve helped Product Management work better with engineers and their customers. Knowing when it’s worth trying is hard for me. At least it sounds like you’ve made the best of what you can’t change. That’s better than being frustrated and not doing anything about it! Cheers, Jayme

[@DarrenSemotiuk]

It has been 7 months, most of which were COVID19 shutdown ... how are you doing now? Still not feeling BurnOut?

[@salvatoreshiggerino6810]

I had this problem, so I quit and got another job where I didn't care about the product so I didn't have to lose sleep over it. So I went from loving work and hating time off to hating work and loving time off.

[@MPXVM]

making music or creative content helps to disconnect from "after work"

[@Snoopod]

For me, it really has just pot that gets my mind off it... But I need to learn better ways

[@brentknickerbocker6023]

video games or climbing

[@HealthyDev]

Climbing, nice. Never done that before.

[@chees720]

That's crazy, but have you tried DMT?

[@HealthyDev]

Nah. My days of experimenting with hallucinogens are far behind me. In the 90s DMT wasn’t as popular as it is today.

[@chees720]

@@HealthyDev mashrooms will do the trick, CBD helps too

[@igboman2860]

The gym

[@blackmage-89]

Also i've dreamt of being still at work! XD

[@HealthyDev]

Ha! Me too. Whiteboarding in dreams is weird 🤷‍♂️

[@gustavosalmeron2013]

Solution: Doritos, a Gentle Giant album and a giant bag of weed.

[@wBacz]

I have no solution for dat. Just like your work, work is your life.

[@bendego2800]

life is more than just work

[@hexchad765]

Furious masturbation. I find it really distract me

[@austecon6818]

My take on it is... What's the problem!? Let your mind go where it wants to go! This is why working from home works best... I often sit bolt upright at 3am and start writing down ideas / notes etc... The problem here is not having access to your work station to bang out the solution when your mind wants to be working on it. Then if you've been putting in huge days... you can add up the hours and have an easier day on one of the other days... As long as you get the work done what do they care!? Strike while the iron's hot I say.

[@HealthyDev]

Depending on your life circumstances I can see that. It affected my relationship with my wife and kids in negative ways. That’s not to say you can’t have this “problem” and not have it interfere with relationships! We’re all different for sure.

[@austecon6818]

​@@HealthyDev Fair. And tbh... When you're not single it just doesn't fly... and it's actually disrespectful and selfish to be consumed by your work when you're in a relationship... Currently single so I guess I'm "getting the coding out of my system" while I can so to speak. lol

[@austecon6818]

I never thought I'd become a workaholic... But here I am... The thought of dating feels like it will just get in the way of my "addiction"... how messed up is that... I know it's not healthy... maybe next year I'll decide to change...