I Ching: Philosophy or Fortune-Telling?

This video lecture is part of a companion course series leading up to the release of my third book, I Ching, The Oracle: benebellwen.com/i-ching-the-o...
Learn more about I Ching, The Oracle: benebellwen.com/i-ching-the-o...
A previous video in this companion course series might be a helpful guide on how to interpret an I Ching hexagram: • Interpretation of I Ch...
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Timestamps:
00:18 The historical origins of the I Ching and the Mandate of Heaven
01:23 The Zhou dynasty births Confucianism, Taoism, and Legalism
02:08 The Five Classics, rooting the I Ching in philosophical discourse
02:48 Studying selected lines of the Zhouyi together
04:22 Book of Change as a book on first principles
04:39 Case study of Hexagram 32 (The Eternal) on how the philosopher and the fortune-teller might assess a hexagram
06:48 Book of Change as a book on moral values; the jun zi (the sage)
07:31 Citing passages on moral values found in the I Ching
09:08 Topics of Chinese philosophy found in the I Ching
09:35 Shamanistic divinatory origins of the I Ching: to unite Heaven and Earth
10:21 Historically, consulting the Yi (I Ching) must be steeped in spiritual preparatory work, rites and ritual; philosophical study of the I Ching is the spiritual cultivation necessary for divinatory work with the I Ching
11:01 Why do we characterize philosophy and fortune-telling as mutually exclusive
12:47 Occult uses of the I Ching throughout East Asian history
14:22 Revisiting the Five Classics and 14:54 the thesis of the Book of Change
15:13 Exercise 1: As a Philosopher
15:25 Examples of philosophical questions to present to the Oracle for consideration; also 16:05 for a second list of philosophical questions
16:36 Spiritual cultivation comes from the challenging process of interpreting, assessing, and considering the Yi’s message
17:10 How to interpret your I Ching hexagram casting result; also 17:34 for more tips on how to approach interpreting your reading
18:25 Exercise 2: As a Fortune-Teller
19:18 Exercise 3: Personifying the Oracle
20:58 Leaning in to what you perceive as the tone that the Oracle is taking with you in this instances; what are your feelings and emotions in response to the reading; interpret the visuals you’re receiving as symbolic
21:22 Concluding thoughts on philosophy vs. divination/fortune-telling
***
I Ching, The Oracle (North Atlantic Books, 2023), benebellwen.com/i-ching-the-o...
- Amazon (US): a.co/d/cmm0qLP
- North Atlantic Books, a California-based non-profit publisher: www.northatlanticbooks.com/sh...
- Penguin Random House: www.penguinrandomhouse.com/bo...

[@BrianSullivanopus125]

I just came across a quote and immediately thought of this video. “When I throw I Ching, the answers I like the less are the answers [from which] I learn the most.” - John Cage

[@Frithogar]

This video exemplifies why practitioners will excel in an AI world. They are not bound by materialist preconceptions and are open to new ways of thinking.

[@ETALAL]

I've been stuck with Wilhelm for so long its become stale. I'm looking forward to this reinvigorating my interest and use of the classics. Currently my main source is Wengu 🎑

[@nemesisurvivorleon]

The i ching was always the most difficult esoteric classic to understand. But so satisfying.

[@dr.gaosclassroom]

Thank you for introducing your book. I am also interested that you mentioned that I Ching was one of the five classics to be tested in the civil service examination. I assume the commentary made by Confucius provided many test topics for the scholars during the thirteen hundred years of civil service examinations. I made a video about the test poems from the Tang Dynasty. Now I am going to look up to see if there is any test poem topics from I Ching. By the way, I would have to check out your book, it sounds so interesting!

[@zaharacelestial8940]

I am awestruck this is phenomenal work which you make accessible while being profound.

[@dr.gaosclassroom]

I just got your book on I Ching and looking forwards to reading it!!

[@BenebellWen]

Oh wow! I'm so honored! Thank you so much for supporting my work. It means a lot to me!

[@jamesnammack7535]

When you consult the I Ching, you can ask philosophical questions, or you can ask personal questions. Either way, you are using the I Ching as an oracle. Either way, you are fortune telling.

[@hinkwok]

The philosophers may digest the entire I Ching and implement it to their living. They may not "consult" the I Ching and expect to get one answer. More like the believers studying a religious text. They live it as one big universal truth. When a certain daily issue arose, they can recall from what they've learn and deal with it. So should it be called fortune-telling?

[@jamesnammack7535]

It is generally agreed in the English language that using an oracle to reveal information is "fortune telling." Instead, if you are using the text as a guide and you are not using the I Ching as an oracle, then accuracy is no longer guaranteed. When you use the I Ching as an oracle, accuracy is guaranteed. However, when you are using the explanatory text as your guide, accuracy is no longer guaranteed. @@hinkwok

[@chrisredfield6404]

Very interesting, I can’t wait for my pre-order to arrive

[@Stardust23558]

Thanks so much! Fascinating!

[@khileshjairamdas8410]

13:00 thanks for addressing this issue explicitly as I find it so often is danced around. Some of the sharpest minds I know regularly engage in what looks to outsiders like fluffy occultism.

[@Bjorn_Algiz]

Oh very interesting and informative 😊 I'm new to your channel but I love your work.

[@EarthWaterAirFire]

Finally got my copy today. My sister is a photographer so I asked her to take some nice photos for me so that I can share the outer content with some FB groups. Im sure they will fine this fascinating. Thank you B for all your work.

[@Adrians_WorldTV]

Added to the list of reads, Getting through your second book ATM. Would love to see more videos on the mythology of the Chinese pantheon and figures like Xiwangmu

[@alchemygal3285]

Thank you.

[@swan6290]

Thank you for this and all your work! I'm certain to more than just enjoy this important work on the I Ching! I've pre-ordered and next Tuesday can't get here fast enough. I've consulted all my oracles, and they all asured me there is no way to make Sept. 26th arrive any quicker than the usual day-to-day way. One mentioned something about "patience" (I'll google that word later.) ^.^ Thank you for peeks into your work, it did help me to decide that I absolutely want this enormous work of yours - big shout out to Foolish Fish who has also helped along these lines with his review!

[@juliemcdonald1245]

One mentioned something about "patience" (I'll google that word later.) ^.^ This got me so tickled.... I feel the same way about anticipating the release. Thanks for the chuckle. Enjoy the book! Cheers!

[@BenebellWen]

Yes! Big shout-out to Foolish Fish!

[@TheHoodCommentator]

Was on discount in Barnes and Nobel now im intrigued, i found myself looking into it way more than i thought i would lol

[@katherineniemiec9078]

You’re a tiger teacher.

[@simont.b.2660]

I thank you for this. (And wishes to boost the algorythms).

[@nestor.valentino]

I'm a "Rationalist" / "left brain heavy" etc. What's the "logical" reason to use the I Ching? I'm open minded and would really like to know.

[@martinlakeuk]

I wanted a lecture on the I Ching, but got a free neo-Marxist lecture too!

[@mr.sessle8444]

There's been a calling sense birth and in America at this time the only thing that helped was the book of change; through decades of cognitive dissonance and the burning and accumulation of karmic energy, I still believe we are in something. Once the hemispheres are separated and the physical can live with the consciousness of the physical of the planet then things seem to become more aligned with chi, Riding the wave- I am but the reflection of the society I am forced to be in. there is no where for us to go, so get comfortable

[@denisemannino]

Thank you for this profound content. I’m looking forward to the deep dive into your book, and asking similar questions you posed in this video, just to reflect on the answers from the experiences my life has provided thus far! Coming from a somewhat non dual position, I appreciate divination beyond ‘yes’ or ‘no’ answers. Thanks again!🙏🏼🥰👏

[@freedda1]

My sense is that the Yijing - at least at its core and its beginnings - did not start as a Taoist nor a Confucian text, but was later adopted by followers of both of these philosophies / religions. The core of the Yi, the Zhouyi, doesn't include any sort of yin/yang language or describe either Taoist or Confucian philosophies. It was (and still is) an oracle, a means of getting advice and information from 'the Ancestors', at least as it was originally used and consulted. I'm wondering what your sense of this is?

[@SnakeAndTurtleQigong]

🙏

[@mr.sessle8444]

change and time are separate but from our likeness it seems to be one and virtual reality is just the vacuum of a collected physical stuff as a whole with a group. there is will but it has the freedom to as its willed= rocks are as conscious as the matter of fact that they are an interpretation of physical matter projected from ones self onto the light of onto which its projecting. atheism is a political statement.

[@macavelli8905]

Very good conversation

[@4everseekingwisdom690]

Haven't been able to put the book down since it arrived the other day.. just a personal thought in regards to the many correspondences found in the I ching that I haven't yet come across in your book l book but was the first thing that resonated with me.. Duality is in all things, the whole will always contain both masculine and feminine (yin and yang) aspects.. this is evident in even the smallest piece of matter the atom. The atom as we know itself contains this duality by having both the electron (yin feminine) and the proton (yang masculine) along with a third component the neutron.. the balance of the three is what determines what the atom "is" .. I find this beautifully expressed in the I ching with the 2 trigrams expressing duality and each containing internally the Trinity, reflecting the natural world. As above, so below ..

[@meowymeow123]

Hi Benebell, I notice that the « book a reading » banner on your website doesn’t work. Does that mean you won’t do reading anymore ?

[@augusthavince8909]

Kind of an aside, but do practitioners of the I Ching observe heaven as a life after death or a superimposed dimension, or something else entirely? Maybe connecting heaven and earth is making them superimposed?

[@BenebellWen]

I think there will certainly be differing perspectives. :-) Sure would be fun to see what the Oracle says to you about the answer to that question, haha!

[@raycar1165]

🌎🌏🌍☯️⚡️ Much ❤ Love

[@Billyboy571]

Hi, should you read the changing line in the second hexagram?

[@BenebellWen]

Haha opening up a can of worms for heated debate before my book is even out? ;-D Which is just to say some people insist yes, you have to, and you read the changing line of both the primary and the second hexagrams together as one cohesive message. Others say no, you don't. All I can say is figure out which method feels right for you, and then stick to it. Consistency trains and hones the relationship between you and the I Ching, and it'll slowly program and adjust itself to your reading method. Just my two cents. :-D

[@jamesnammack7535]

No. You should not read the changing line in the second hexagram. It makes no difference if it feels right or wrong for you to do this. In an I Ching divination, only the first hexagram has changing lines. Your feelings about it are irrelevant. In the same way, 2+2=4 regardless of your feelings about it. In life, some things are really true and some things are really wrong. It is really wrong to use changing lines in the second hexagram. @@BenebellWen

[@jamesnammack7535]

If you do an I Ching divination about it, you will find that you should only use changing lines in the first hexagram.

[@Billyboy571]

@@BenebellWen Thank you for the reply Benebell, this sounds like an interesting angle to deepen your interpretation of the message the I Ching is giving you, especially as I’ve only ever read the changing lines on the first hexagram. Very much looking forward to reading your new book and best wishes🙏

[@BenebellWen]

​@@Billyboy571 The majority exoteric view is read the changing line of the primary hexagram only. The minority esoteric view is to continue the binary. Everything is always outer plus inner, a yin aspect plus a yang aspect. It aligns with the concept of stacking two trigrams, and how the primary hexagram is built from the earlier heaven ba gua while the secondary hexagram is built from the later heaven. So aligning with that principle, one would opt to read the changing line in both as a single cohesive synthesized message. It becomes a form of philosophical mathematics to synthesize the two changing line messages.

[@leonleoksart]

why 'LI" is the cover of your i ching version?

[@alchemygal3285]

Something I've been thinking about is compatibility between Taoism and the western way of life. Specifically, I'm a business owner that has to always use profits to live. How do I be a business owner that follows Taoist philosophy? This is for a friend in a multi faith server. I thought this was the perfect question to ask you. Your help would be greatly appreciated 🙏 ❤️

[@BenebellWen]

A distinctive Taoist approach to business would be to focus on how your work product or service can truly and significantly enrich people's lives. Compare that to focusing on earning yourself money. When the focus is on creating something that will enrich people's lives, you're more likely to achieve that. If you can achieve that, it will be something everybody wants. The end result is earning profit. When the focus was on earning profit for yourself, your vision might be too narrow and limited that you don't see how you can optimize demand for your supply. I would say another Taoist approach to business success is cultivating an experience for people. I believe the balance that we strive for under a Taoist philosophy brings our business greater longevity and sustainability. Taoist philosophy is very much about harmonizing with change, and it teaches us to be progressive and innovative, rather than resistant to change. That's going to get you very far ahead your professional peers just with that attitude.

[@alchemygal3285]

@@BenebellWen thank you ❤️

[@CheriRosePlans]

Yin and Yang energy🙏. I am so looking forward to your book. I purchased your I Ching Course and printed your I Ching Oracle that was included. I look,forward to comparing and reading the updates. I consulted the I Ching for the last New Moon Spread and Mabon spread and received the most profound and deep readings I have had in a very long time. I look forward to reviewing my readings at the Full Moon and Samhain to see if I interpreted accurately. I love the exercises that you included in this video and will be completing them. Thank you Benebell!

[@davegarciaofficial]

Why is Benebell developing more and more of an accent? 🤔

[@hagbardc623]

I love these suggestions of different questions to ask the oracle, I need to do more inquiries like this and I appreciate the suggestions and would love to hear more in the future. I've been so fascinated by the concept of what I've come to see as the 8 forces and 5 elements as a very good representation and model of nature and how it is still very much relevant for the modern age and not some arcane artifact. For instance we still make electricity(Thunder) by making a big Fire and pouring Water on it to make steam (chapter 63) which then makes powerful upward flowing Wind that turns turbines.

[@mr.sessle8444]

your mind body is a triplet, a magnitude of forces at work and that is where we are confused as a whole in humanity. I could answer all these silly questions but unfortunately we have already uncovered it all and thats what has been left over for us. Time and justice with accordance of society and the needs of a position of time. blah blah cheers till next time

[@dog_biter]

Deng Ming Dao's I Ching has been a go to for me,,it's confusing to me and often dark! I am looking for something more aligned with the peasants and hermits rather than a chronic focus on the aristocracy,,I suppose the preeminent shamanic realm informed by mushrooms, cannabis and sitting

[@davidstrevens9170]

So then... what is the Heavenly mandate for the human condition? Oh! I just presented my question to the Book of Changes. Hexagram #16. Enthusiasm. With the 6th line moving... deluded enthusiasm. Amazing! My interpretation is that Heaven's mandate for the human condition is to correct deluded enthusiasm. Enthusiasm is heavenly power. The human condition is deluded by abusing this power. Heaven is modifying our attitude towards power. Training us to use power for the benefit of humanity. Thank you. Oh! I've just pulled the transformed hexagram. #35 Progress. The real nature of man is originally good but becomes clouded by contact with Earthly things [objectification] and therefore needs purification before it can shine forth in it's native clarity. Yay! The mandate of Heaven!

[@jonghoonpark5497]

Those are astute and accurate interpretations. Well done

[@davidstrevens9170]

@@jonghoonpark5497 Thank you. The same answer from the Book of Changes also addresses my personal human condition. My desire to know the mandate of Heaven is a form of deluded enthusiasm. My desire to be satiated (in general), is also a form of deluded enthusiasm. How to use my power to cherish altruism? My native clarity is obscured by my assumption that I currently operate beyond my own being.

[@jonghoonpark5497]

@@davidstrevens9170 How would you define the Mandate of Heaven?

[@davidstrevens9170]

@@jonghoonpark5497 To be still within movement and to move within stillness.

[@CheriRosePlans]

Yin and Yang energy🙏. I am so looking forward to your book. I purchased your I Ching Course and printed your I Ching Oracle that was included. I look,forward to comparing and reading the updates. I consulted the I Ching for the last New Moon Spread and Mabon spread and received the most profound and deep readings I have had in a very long time. I look forward to reviewing my readings at the Full Moon and Samhain to see if I interpreted accurately. I love the exercises that you included in this video and will be completing them. Thank you Benebell!