I FIXED

[@raydans]

Thankyou again to Glorious for sponsoring today's video. If you want to get your hands on a GMMK3 keyboard as well, make sure to follow this link! bit.ly/RaydansGlorious Also it makes me look good when you use my link 👉 👈

[@bossSHREDDER210]

if i needed a keyboard i would use it but unfortunately i think my keyboard has another year in its life give or take :P

[@rndThursday]

both lists are wrong. antler is s tier

[@raydans]

Elusive Antlers absolutely S tier 🙌

[@kanseidorifto2430]

Elusive Antlers is highkey in the C tier at best, I love the Antler Shield and it belongs in the B tier at it's lowest

[@bakerdarcy6001]

@@kanseidorifto2430 it's okay that you don't have any understanding of the game!

[@kanseidorifto2430]

@@bakerdarcy6001 It's funny that you sound like a bot, since you talk exactly like the person you're subscribed to. The Antler Shield is actually a pretty viable option to allow for more damage potential with Engineer, allowing the damage to scale with the difficulty modifiers and provide them more usage per turret. It's okay that you don't have any understanding of the game ;>

[@Chippy-J7]

​@kanseidorifto2430 okay... but we are talking as if it was to all characters of RoR2. Antler shield is almost useless to most characters. For example if you were playing on Monsoon as void fiend or someone who isnt engineer, it's basically empty space after the 3rd or so stage and you are better off scrapping it as it would prove more use to get a better common or something.

[@MeloniestNeon]

RND on his Antler Shield arc and its still a D tier item, that's just how bad it is lol

[@Izmooh]

@@MeloniestNeon Well, his main point was that the item shouldn’t be changed because it’s “bad” as it gives players more ways to experiment with different item combos (correct me if I’m wrong, please). Don’t get anyone wrong, it’s definitely not a very practical item anyways.

[@rndThursday]

shhh

[@sunny3545]

@@rndThursday 🫎 🛡️

[@LeToplache007]

@@Izmooh there is maybe a 1% playerbase that actively goes for specific item combos, and that is because in Risk of Rain 2 without artifacts you CAN'T CHOOSE your items, you play with what you get. We already have Razorwire and it is one of the worst and most useless greens on every character except Rex where it would also be scrapped and traded in for Ukulele, ATG, bands - you get the point. So we already have a green with the same effect which has the worst condition for activation - to actively take damage for it to work. Imagine post second loop - are you trying to get hit? No. Why is that? Because every enemy has potential to melt you in a milisecond if you let them hit you. So we got Antler Shield, an item saturating the lootpool even more and implemented so badly that even raising the numbers wouldn't make it work - because it would make Mithrix unbeatable. He would instantly kill you if you damaged him with anything when he takes your Antler Shield in the last phase. Nobody asked for an item like Antler Shield, however the community has been asking for more common movement items for quite some time now because there are only 2 dedicated common movement speed items - Hoof and Energy drink - while the green tier has no consistent movement items. Elusive Antlers, while also not very consistent will probably help in not bringing any run you have with Captain to a certain death because you couldn't move out of Dunestrider's rolling balls because you didn't see any common movement items for 3 runs straight.

[@aggapuffin]

Sonorous Whispers not being S is crazy to me. In a world where Sale Star is S, Sonorous Whispers is S. Because, like, if you get Sale Star on the soup in the moon, it's useless. If you get it on stage 5 that's, what, one extra item? Wooooow. Such a good item. I'm not saying that Sale Star _shouldn't_ be S, it 100% should be, but in a world where it's S, so should Sonorous Whispers. And the reasoning of "in a normal run you wouldn't go and farm Gilded Coast or Void Fields with Sonorous" is a pretty bad reason. If an item gives me an instant win if I farm a stage for infinite items but I don't do it because it's boring, then that doesn't mean the item isn't broken, it just means it's broken in a really boring way. Like, if this was a fun tier list, I would agree, Sonorous is kinda boring, but it is a power tier list.

[@mcoolgamer12]

Sale star gives an extra item based on the itempool of the chest, sonorous whispers mostly gives white items. The white items introduced in the dlc dilute the pool making sonorous worse. Sale star is better because you can get extra greens or reds if you plan well enough. Sonoreus fails due to bad whites from dlc, sale star wins because it is more controlled and you're able to strategise.

[@aggapuffin]

@@mcoolgamer12 This would be a valid reason if not for two reasons. One, scrappers exist, so you can turn those bad white items into better white and green items thanks to printers and soup. Second, the quantity of items that Sonorous Whispers gives is easily greater than Sale Star in practically every scenario. And, while quantity over quality is a factor, when you can use scrappers to turn all the garbage white items you get into fantastic white and green items, that is much less of a factor. To clarify, Sale Star is the better designed item and the item that I personally enjoy using more. More strategy is more engaging, after all. But Sonorous is still better in 99% of scenarios, or, at the _very_ least, on the same level as Sale Star.

[@thiccum2668]

I just tested this with debug toolkit and I am 99.99% positive that the second instance of damage from warped echo DOES inherit the armor from the opal consumed by the first instance of damage. The baseline damage without the opals in my experiment was 5 damage on the first instance and 5 on the second. Theoretically, if the second instance didn't inherit the opal's armor, we would see the second instance be 5 damage no matter what. However when I gave myself 999 opals and took the same exact hit, BOTH instances of damage were reduced to 1. My only items in this experiment were the opals and warped echo. In conclusion, there's probably no anti synergy between warped echo and oddly shaped opal. If someone has an experiment with different findings please correct me.

[@sleeve.3995]

no youre right, the code is much simpler than people are thinking. opal gives you armor which directly divides variable "damage taken." warped echo splits damage taken after its calculated, which opal has already reduced. theres no antisynergy

[@samgraffen9212]

@@sleeve.3995 The delayed damage from Warped Echo WILL reset the cooldown of Slug and Opal though, effectively nerfing them from a 7 to 10 second downtime. Could be the difference between life and death in a tense scenario.

[@rndThursday]

ye because the echo does all the reductions and OSP calculation before it halves the damage (which is why opal doesn't remove OSP). for example, if you use a jade elephant to reduce the second hits damage, it won't work (99% sure) also repulsion armor and planula don't get double value either, since they only proc off the first hit also u cant dodge with i-frames which is stinky 💩

[@sleeve.3995]

@@rndThursday yea the part about the jade elephant is correct. the only thing you can do about the second hit of damage is block it with a spaces

[@thiccum2668]

@@samgraffen9212 i don’t think that’s how opal’s cooldown works. You’re definitely right about the slug though

[@sleeve.3995]

i think unstable transmitter actually has some really good potential. imagine if the teleporting was like a 2 second animation of you dissappearing and reappearing with i-frames when its used so youd know when and where youre being teleported to, and if it always teleported you to the node furthest away from enemies.

[@sleeve.3995]

i think luminous shot is a pretty sick idea too, it just needs to be way better. like instead of 150% + 25% and a 0 proc co, it should straight up be like 300% + 100% with a 1.0

[@lobertironston2412]

@@sleeve.3995luminous Shot’s problem is that when it says base damage it means BASE damage, it will never increase, not watches, not crowbars, not even Shaped glass will increase the damage

[@sleeve.3995]

@lobertironston2412 i wasnt aware of that problem but it does also just suck and stack horribly and have no proc coefficient

[@forlackofawetterbird]

make it like how nova drift does warp shield

[@khemically6124]

​@@lobertironston2412it also anti synergizes with Shuriken since afaik it doesnt boost the actual damage of the Shuriken but will eat the Shot buff anyways lol

[@Keyce0013]

The actual problem with the Chronic Expansion is that all of the listed enemies don't count as "in combat" if you're actively shooting/damaging them. Killing them still counts towards increasing the stacks, but you have to actively ignore the listed monsters and go shoot at something else if you want to maintain your stacks. Hopefully that gets fixed.

[@Termulus]

I would like to see Tier Lists change from the S-F tier format to like, explaining what each tier is. Like for example for ROR2: Always helpful, Generally useful, Has it's uses, Very situational, Scrap Immediately. That sort of thing.

[@thiccum2668]

that kind of tiering cant apply to ROR2 because of how dynamic it is.

[@youngun8950]

Noxious thorns has a weird thing with its proc coeff so it applies bleed for like a quarter of a second each time. Growth nectar just needs to work on safer spaces and bands and it would be fantastic. 5 buffs isn't insane for most runs especially on bandit, seeker, veind I wish the descriptions were actually accurate for the dlc items.

[@mcawesome9705]

noxious thorns' proc coeff is apparently based on the enemy attack. so if you get hit by a lesser wisp, the bleed is gonna last 1 second. if you get hit by a clay templar or wisp chimera, it only lasts 0.15 seconds.

[@youngun8950]

@mcawesome9705 ticks from fire elites normally are great for razorwire but do almost nothing with this item

[@mcawesome9705]

@@youngun8950 yeah, the burn's proc coeff is 0. idk what the fire trails' is but it's also low.

[@youngun8950]

@@mcawesome9705 definitely think duration should be tied to stacks instead

[@KodaWPLSH]

I entered Sky Meadow, started clearing the stage as normal, and found Longstanding Solitude. Avoiding an obviously dumb decision, I decided to loot the stage before picking it up. I cleared all the chests, found all the doodads, fought the enemies, and I even cleared the teleporter. I did remember to grab it on the way to Commencement, hovering around Level 32-34, pretty standard. I was Level cap before the third pillar.

[@daanaerts_]

Personally I still think sonorous is S just for the guaranteed item from all boss enemies. I don’t see the value of solitude unless you get it very late, all chance shrines become nearly unobtainable if you want to keep up pace

[@bossSHREDDER210]

with solitude chance shrines are irrelevant if you grab every crown you see (which you just should if you do a solitude run) not only is there no downside because all gold is converted instantly if the crowns proc then you get massive blobs of exp and you level up like crazy and with how op leveling up is you can just start deleting every enemy on stage 3 as if you were on a 40 stage run

[@daanaerts_]

@ in that case so many items could be S tier, having forgive me please w soulbound catalyst makes chronic expansion OP. It’s a pretty specific combo you have to be fishing for and reliability should be taken into account for rankings imo

[@thiccum2668]

@@daanaerts_ except that's not applicable to lunars, and by extension brittle crown whatsoever because you can nigh guarantee them from the bazaar. Also keep in mind that roll of pennies and RAPs are literally white items. This is not comparable to soulbound+fmp at all.

[@daanaerts_]

@@thiccum2668 not guarantee, you’d be rerolling a lot just for a chance

[@vertonimal]

Fun fact about my experience with longstanding solitude. I usually play with command but to test it out I played without it so I could cleanse it after I hit max level. Brittle crowns also helped so I had a couple of lunar items to cleanse. The second lunar I cleansed gave me an irradiant pearl. Playing command I never get to use cleansing pools, so I got an irradiant pearl first try knowing how those pools work.

[@Nnyco_]

We all know RND lied when he made that tierlist, theres no way he would put antlers on D.

[@druidofnosleep1513]

Growth nectar is very character dependent. I.e its easily S tier on bandit with 3 buffs for free. Add in one opal and one shuriken and its at basically 100% uptime.

[@Lucyfers]

Actually, unstable transmitter creates an interesting and very powerful dynamic, where you can pick up an actively detrimental item, but have the great potential to get a green scrap in return! /j

[@hooparainbowbraceypkmonand7862]

Long standing solitude is on its redemption arc, the item is really cool especially with ghors tomb and brittle crown

[@glitchedpersonality]

F should be insta-scrap instead. Like disputed always says, everything always has a use, even if that use is becoming scrap

[@ninja666gaming]

the explosion dmg of gas does the same dmg as luminous shot

[@Ippotsuko]

Knockback fin (in current state) is a straight detriment, i don't even pick them up if i don't have a scrapper on that stage. i believe a "F" tier should just be items that you will outright avoid picking up unless there is a scrapper on stage. the longstanding solitude while is insane, i think they need to fix the ability to softlock yourself (even if it is a mistake you have to knowingly make).

[@cadenmyers1982]

I've been playing as captain and I've knocked the enemies OUT of my air drops with Knockback Fin way too many times.

[@cadenmyers1982]

Quick things- Bolstering Lantern: I don't think this item synergizes at all with engi. Either the turrets are already dead because a blazing beetle killed it, or it is forever at max health due to The Shrooms. It will rarely, if ever, actually be able to utilize the lantern. Antler Shield: This item does not synergize with REX at all because the damage is dealt only to the ATTACKER, unlike razorwire and Noxious Thorn. I don't know what antlers do in this situation, but I'm 90% sure that they wouldn't do anything. Longstanding Solitude: If you plan to loop, DO NOT GET THIS ITEM! You will hit max level, and you will be unable to open any more chests. All that's left to do is hope and pray that you find a cleansing pool or pick up an Ego to MAYBE lose it that way. Now if this item popped out of a lunar pod with a cleansing pool on the same stage, you've just found your ticket to level 94 for free.

[@hooparainbowbraceypkmonand7862]

By the time you reach max level you want stats more than items at that point because you already have all the items you need and likely have a pretty good build by then. So its still good in the case of looping.

[@cadenmyers1982]

@@hooparainbowbraceypkmonand7862 But the item doesn't give any more stats past level 94. Once you hit that level you are done. You can't level up anymore and by extension can't open any chests anymore. Longstanding Solitude hard caps how strong you can get in the late game unless you can get rid of it.

[@Pengolord]

Considering that you can solo the first two stages with just chronic expansion, I’d say it’s S tier

[@nuzzlevee]

What does this mean, genuinely? You can do the first two stages with any items, 0 items included, easily in e8, so what does it mean? I think chransion is fine, needs a nerf for fmp, but by itself its just ok, often just scrap

[@Pengolord]

@@nuzzlevee You cannot do that first two stages with no items easily? Maybe with diablo or acrid, but 90% of kits are not able to beat the first two stages with zero items easily

[@ThatOneAuthorGuy]

as long as they dont ruin the Solitude, Brittle Crown combo I'm happy

[@aaronw4262]

I have never had runic lens proc on me once in the 12 hrs I've played with it. Stacked it to 17 and slowly increased my damage to see when it would finally proc. It never did. Even after verifying game files nothing.

[@fungalPS]

It probably did proc, it's very difficult to see. Try the better runic lens mod, it makes the effects more visible.

[@mcawesome9705]

you should get someone to make a mod that counts how much damage razorwire and antler shield do, then do a run where you start with razorwire and every dropped item is an antler shield. ...although maybe also give yourself like 1 bungus and rap every stage lol

[@LDSG_A_Team]

Congrats on the sponsor bro!

[@footur3179]

OK but why is Stone Flux Pauldren not in S tier?

[@LDSG_A_Team]

Okay but what Tier does rnd fall into? You should do a ror2 youtuber tierlist. Cmon, it'll be funny ;)

[@brianbrian121-j9k]

doing god's work dan

[@Balagnugnes]

i think 100% warbonds is F tier imagine you spend all that time killing alloy and instead of getting something worth all the time you spent trying to kill it you just get warbonds

[@wildnick365]

I disagree on the Sonorous placement on the basis of putting Sale Star at S tier. Use the same reasoning for Sale Star that you do for Sonorous. Get it on Stage 5 or the Moon? Maybe one extra item on the moon if you have a lockbox. One extra item on stage 5 (unless you’ve looted everything already, then it’s just a lost item). But grab Sonorous Whispers on Stage 5? If elites are spawning, you can get items. If you’ve got grandparents or solus or xi constructs, you can get items. Even on the moon, if perfected elites spawn, you can get items. Sure, the chance is low, but that’s more items than you can get on the moon with a Sale Star. In the end, Sonorous is definitely S tier. It’s just free items, same as Sale Star. Both pop off best at the same pace (though Sale Star is significantly better for legendary chest). The earlier you get either item, the better, which is why Sonorous should 100% be in S Tier with Sale Star.

[@Crazykidthree33]

I would like to note there are a few huge things you're ignoring here 1. Sale Star is Green tier. Sonorous is Red tier. You're way more likely to get Sale Star earlier, making it way less likely to be a dud item. Getting Sale Star stage 1-3 is very, very common. Can't say the same for Sonorous. You're more likely to get it by stage 4 onwards due to guaranteed red drop methods, meaning its usefulness is already more limited by the time you generally start expecting to seeing it. 2. Sale Star with Rusted key is a guaranteed additional green or red item. An item with a much bigger power level than what Sonorous Whispers will generally give as it gives mostly white items. If you're on the moon, it's likely you're set on your whites and would rather see something higher tier than what Sonorous will feed you. Thus, Sale Star's items will generally make you more powerful than Sonorous's items will because you have control over what you get. Since Rusted Key is white, it's not unreasonable to look for it specifically so that you can benefit from its interaction with Sale Star. In fact, a personal strategy of mine when having Sale Star is to find a Rusted Key and then not use it until I either find another Rusted Key on the stage or I don't find a large chest on the stage. That way I can always guarantee Sale Star's reward will be green or red tier. 3. Time moves on the moon and the chance for Sonorous to drop from an elite is actually 3%+1% per stack rather than what it says in the logbook. Thus, you're hoping for a 3% chance to scale you against time or else you're just making Mithrix stronger for little benefit. Infinite items, at the cost of a lot of time. Meanwhile, the moment you find the Rusty Lockbox Sale Star is done. You've gotten its benefit and are more likely to be much stronger for the amount of time you spend on it.

[@thqwibble]

sonorous used to be s tier before it got nerfed, felt like a "you insta win the run" item like drone parts with how many items you get. post nerf it feels like it doesn't really do much besides with bosses. also its probably gonna get nerfed again since the only item gearbox isnt gonna fix is sale star so personally id put sonorous z tier

[@aggapuffin]

@@Crazykidthree33 The first point doesn't really feel like an actual point to the power of the item. Yeah, you see more Sale Stars, but that doesn't make either more or less powerful. And the final point is instantly invalidated by Void Fields and Gilded Coast. Unless your argument is not in-game time, but actual real life time. But even then, if an item gives you the option to instantly win by going to a specific stage and spending a good bit of time there, it's an S-Tier item, it's just a Z-Tier on the fun and interesting item metric.

[@Crazykidthree33]

@@aggapuffin What? Are you ignoring the OP's post when responding in relation to mine? My entire post is responding just to the OP's points and only addresses what they brought up because that's how a debate works. I don't need to address things they didn't mention. They argued that Sale Star can be just as much as a dud in late-game scenarios just as Sonorous Whispers can be. So, my point was to say that Sonorous Whispers is more likely to show up late, while Sale Star is more likely to show up earlier. Thus, the scenario where Sale Star is a dud is much less likely than Sonorous Whisper's. I wasn't making the point that Sale Star was more powerful, I was just proving that these scenarios aren't as comparable as they seem at face value. Yes, Sonorous is literally infinitely better in places that don't have time pass, but the OP didn't talk about that so I didn't have any need to bring it up since it's not what was being talked about. All the OP mentioned were scenarios past stage 5 where time passed normally. So, I countered with my own scenarios past stage 5 where time passed normally. Now, to fully address your arguments since you're the first to bring these up. An item being more common means it stacks faster and is more reliable to find. Reliability is powerful by itself in a game riddled with RNG mechanics. It's unlikely for Sonorous to save a dead run because the chance it pays off often enough to do so would be equivalent to winning the lottery to get the right item type and rarity you needed at that moment. It's just more RNG to fight the RNG, so it's unreliable to give you what you need. Sale Star, however, can be expected to save a run with decent consistency due to the amount of control you have with its payout so it's just all about knowing what you're lacking and choosing the right interactable that can save you. Sale Star also stacks decently well while Sonorous stacks terribly. That 1% isn't doing anything compared to getting more and more items out of an intractable of your choosing. I don't know how Sale Star stacks off the top of my head, but I do remember being shocked at how good it is when I looked further into its mechanics. So, Sale star can be found more reliably, is more likely to help you get your exact needs, and stacks better than Sonorous. Sounds stronger to me. I already said earlier that Sonorous kicks Sale Stars ass when time is paused, but I would like to mention something. Void Fields is actually terrible for Sonorous unless you're able to last a significantly long time in the Void Fog's infinitely ramping damage or get a boss as one of your few selected enemies. Otherwise, Void Fields does technically have a another timer to your stay there in the sense how long you can actually hold off charging the Void Cells. Enemies don't spawn unless a Void Cell is active so you NEED to activate them to get things going. I believe Void Fields only feels powerful for Sonorous because the stage is just powerful in general with how many items you get there to begin with. And if you don't get a boss enemy, you're solely betting on that 3% chance. Not great. Technically free items if it does proc, but all items are free in Void Fields anyway. You're already more likely to win a run if you visit Void Fields with or without Sonorous. That means Gilded Coast is the only place that Sonorous is technically infinitely powerful in as there is no limiting factor to your stay or enemy spawns. You'll have to be there for a long while to feel any significant amount of power gain, but I'm not going to say my idea of fun is any better than yours. I personally wouldn't want to stick around for Sonorous Whispers to go off a lot, but I'm not going to be someone's fun police and I'd believe anyone if they said they would and enjoy it.

[@digs-]

Why does he keep saying “they”to refer to RND?

[@raydans]

English?

[@papasprinkles]

PRONOUN. Did I scare you? Yeah, I bet I did. You coward, you make me sick. Your weakness is pathetic.

[@digs-]

In English you usually refer to guys as “he”. Is he non binary?

[@raydans]

They is universal. All he's are they but not all theys are he's

[@digs-]

@@raydans I guess, it just sounded weird using “they” for someone who goes by he/him pronouns (at least I assume he does). I appreciate you explaining

[@mcawesome9705]

6:21 using the wrong wiki smh my head (/j) also, what the heck is a trongle

[@TheBirder24]

Dan! I am withing the top 0.5% of your viewers! I like upside down man!

[@Hlebuw3k]

I hate tier lists

[@kirbysuperstardeluxe9889]

Rnd is ALWAYS wrong.