I'm so tired of this... Handheld Reviews and Crowdfunding

[@JeffGeerling]

Handheld gaming PCs seem to be in a similar state as RISC-V SBCs or even still some Arm SBCs... keep spamming out new models every couple months (many on a preorder or crowdfunding basis), barely get support for basic features, abandon the device and move on to a newer model... rinse and repeat :(

[@CraftComputing]

That's exactly where we're at right now. Spam as many models as possible to market, but not leave any time to actually see what sticks.

[@mikearisbrocken8507]

Except for the Steam Deck, this thing might not be duper powerful, but as someone who also tested the Legion Go and ROG Ally, the experience, support and solutions are on par with a proper console or PC. I don't even miss Windows on it.

[@jothain]

@@mikearisbrocken8507 Well Valve is a big business and I agree it's very solid device with good support. But to original comment, I find it odd and somewhat alarming that markets are spammed with mini PC's that are in market for like less than 6 months and something very similar suddenly spawns into market. To me it feels quite odd and I'd be concerned if device is build from cheapest components that are expected to fail and even some good reviewers have pointed that driver/bios support can be in very bad level.

[@tirion7180]

Sd is good linux too..but windows is more freedom ..i can find games much cheaper if i dont buying just on steam..also power of ally and lenovo go is somwwhere else then steam deck ​@mikearisbrocken8507

[@drewnewby]

You guys know best what a wild west it is right now, given the demand. I opted to wait for the dust to settle. For home use a $50 tablet, $20 BSP-D8, and Moonlight / Sunshine do everything I need for now.

[@frankpatterson9682]

I have been successfully talked out of ordering the OneXPlayer X1 Series: 3-in-1 Console 10.95" AMD 8840U. Thank you for all your time and efforts.

[@chaosfenix]

I feel like Valve is doing this right. They are doing exactly what you are describing. They have 1 handheld. Yes they have a refresh but it is the same processor and the same form factor. They went with an 800p display because that is what makes sense for this screen size and cpu/gpu power. Yes their processor is a little weaker than others but they have built an amazing platform around it. When the steam deck originally launched there were only like 1000 games that ran well on it. Now there are 15,000 that are at least playable. Valve has made gaming on the steam deck the best linux experience out there.

[@frequentfrenzied]

I feel the same way. The key to the whole thing is to have fantastic software support, and Valve seems to understand that perfectly when it comes to the Steam Deck. The hardware really doesn't matter, and can actually become a hindrance if it is pointlessly over spec'd or comes in too many variations to effectively support from the software side.

[@arcadeportal32]

I love my Steam Deck, a great system especially when I am at the Airport

[@hornantuutti5157]

There is way more than 15k games working fine on deck. They have only tested small part of the steam games by now. I got like 250 games on steam and i have been testing alot. I got like 5 games that wont work and thats because game devs are too lazy to implement linux support for anticheat wich was made by valve. I best most games listed in steam works just fine.

[@chaosfenix]

@@hornantuutti5157 Yeah I was simply naming what was semi-official. At this point I think the last major software blocker is anti-cheat. The rest are either mostly or entirely addressed by proton. I do hope that Linux keeps getting more popular. 6% between Linux and ChromeOS is better but I think we will need double that before developers start taking Linux desktop more seriously. Maybe with Windows 10 going EOL we will get people moving over after deciding that they don't feel like throwing their older system in the trash.

[@JasonCrosen]

This is why I still end up going back to my steam deck. Hardware might not be as powerful as a 7840, but the software side is much better.

[@MaxKulik]

As someone looking for a handheld right now for my s/o I greatly appreciate this review. I don’t even consider crowdfunding devices an option as it makes me concerned for support later down the road.

[@CraftComputing]

The OneXFly, IMO, is the most balanced handheld on the market today: amzn.to/4br1jQh

[@Sleepy.Time.]

get the 64gb LCD steam deck while its on sale and add a 1tb SD card and you wont be disappointed

[@MaxKulik]

@@CraftComputing Thanks for the suggestion! I am going to be looking into it!

[@Backstage_Politician]

The whole point of crowdfunding is supposed to get a benefit, and there's nothing really extra, everything is still extravagantly priced. For example the a Ayaneo Kun. $1200+ when the legion go was 750

[@Respectmyskill07]

Hopefully, this device will be released in a good state i feel like 3in1 devices are the future having one device that does everything.

[@rudca37]

hello, I am interested in the one x player x1 mini. but I have a question to ask you, is it easy to play on a sofa with your arms outstretched without having the handles resting on a table or on your knees? In fact, I regularly play on my sofa with my arms outstretched and I don't know if it's compatible. Thanks in advance.

[@parrottm76262]

Jeff, kudos to you and your stance on these handheld products. We need more of this.

[@r2db]

The same reasons you stated are why I no longer will support crowdfunding. I have received a bunch of things from both new and well-established companies that I had purchased through crowdfunding. However, I have also had both new and well-established companies fail to deliver anything on crowdfunding campaigns, ghost the supporters, and in some cases put up new crowdfunding campaigns for something similar. The worst case was a well-established company "discontinuing" its existing product in a particular line, launch the "new" version of it on crowdfunding, and then stop communicating after a "successful" campaign. This cannot be tolerated any longer.

[@semihtor]

I want to know 2 things: 1. Why do the controllers on this device slide DOWN the sides? I’d imagine that having them slide UP would secure them more safely since the weight of the device is stopped by the slide’s ends. 2. Since I don’t have any knowledge of the other devices with removable controllers, I also wonder if all of them have controllers that slide down?

[@nosirrahx]

I'm a huge handheld gaming fan and I have 1 complaint about all others. Don't reinvent the D-pad, there are already fantastic ones. I literally don't care if 50 handhelds use the same D-pad if they all use a proven good one.

[@0xKruzr]

I don't have any interest in handheld gaming PCs, but I DO have a lot of interest in the kind of micro-laptops GPD and One-Netbook make -- I feel like we've been waiting forever for an update to the GPD Pocket 3 and GPD MicroPC!

[@aaronbrown9110]

This is the second video I've watched on your channel(close to following), but I've seen reviews from six months ago, and other youtubers had a better experience with this device. I like and hear your thoughts, but i understand review units are different from store products. Can't wait to see the next review...whats your fav gpc so far?

[@Psikeomega]

So I agree with alot of the points youre fielding (I say as if theres any I dont agree with) but if we focus on the crowd funding, it almost feels like companies are abusing it in place of actual market research. I really think that companies that big have no business crowd funding and if they really need market research, maybe they canbeither hire professionals or find a service that does that specifically. I really appreciate that going forward, you're only going to review production models. Because i got in on the DX1 oculus rift and i loved it. Every change along the way that they duct taped on after that development model on their march to production in my opinion just added problems with each new feature. I still have my DK1 but now i wont let a newer one in my house. So keep those reviews coming and ill keep listening to them on my headphones while im working.

[@joeschmoe5009]

This video was spot on, well made with constructive criticisms we all feel. This video just elevated my respect for you and i appreciate it. Excellent new rules on your part going forward, i will stay subscribed

[@moralreality7328]

Ayaneo kun was great. Runs a little hot but is 80% or more of what i want in a perfect handheld. Plus the heat isnt near where you hold the device. I just dont think the tech is there for a perfect machine yet. But its coming along.

[@gunstorm05]

I very much agree on confusion around crowdfunding for these companies. I have a launch-day Steam Deck and I'd honestly be happy jus sticking with it for my primary handheld, but there is a single itch it has never scratched for me: Pocketability. I got the original GPD Win and then the Win 2, and I stuck with the Win 2 until the Win Mini came out, because pocketable clamshell machines are the pinnacle of portability. I'm often out-and-about with my family and when we have a surprise few minutes of waiting for something, I can pull it out of my pocket and play something. With that excitement, the only reason I backed the Win 2 on IGG back in 2018 was because my impression of GPD was they were small and needed the support, and I wanted a successor to the initial Win to thrive... but then they've just kept going with it, year after year. I find it very confusing as to why they would go the crowdfunding route. Despite my excitement, I waited for regular ordering to open for the Win Mini in 2023, because I refuse to crowdfund any longer. I'm a customer, not an investor.

[@AlexRubio]

I funded the xplayer mini with 6800u still running great no issues, but now that the steam deck is out it's just a hard sell

[@Natsukashii1111]

Unpopular opinion I like the tablet form factor of onexplayer. I think it is fine for one company to be the tablet handheld line onexplayer x1 Another company to be the laptop with controller like gpd win max And another company to be the steamdeck competitor like Aya neo

[@mechanicalmonk2020]

This isn't really a crowdfunding issue. This is a Chinese manufacturing issue. These companies are not as big as you're assuming them to be. They build small batches and the redesigns do not take as many resources as you think

[@marksapollo]

This is why Lenovo Asus and Valve have been successful. You can walk into an actual shop and buy them or online from trusted websites, no paying money on the hope you may get something. You have consumer rights. Plus if your AyaNeo or One X breaks other have to send it back to China, or they'll send a part out you'll have to fit.

[@13JacksonMr]

Also Lenovo Asus and Valve are multi Billion dollar corporations with international presences. It makes it easier for them to do so than say AyaNeo, GPD or OneX

[@ericdeltoro8484]

I think the tablet form factor could work if they didn't try to force it to work as a "handheld". If they keep it as a tablet/convertable laptop, I think it could be a compelling buy for someone who wants a powerful but compact laptop.

[@drackar]

Crowd funding has been completely dead to me since the second or third year kickstarter existed. I don't back indie projects anymore, let alone anything from a major company. Frankly, a major company doing crowd funding makes me less likely to use that company, at all, for any product, anywhere.

[@jothain]

Thanks Jeff for doing such great video about these "things". As end consumer I would like to see one thing. No crowd funding. I'll never buy such hardware, period. Second thing. Make the frame/hardware GOOD. Not these half assed Switch clones. I want good hardware and controls. That's the key. Performance is long away down in my priority list. Now if you have made really f'n good frame for the device then make it so, that battery is removable and device itself repairable and if there's gimmicks like keyboards etc. make them so that they're compatible in future devices for at least few iterations. Then the last thing. If you've made before things good, how in the hell no one is capable of doing mobo of the device removable/modular. I have Steam Deck. I absolutely love that thing. It's really good device, but one thing I'd like to see is that in future it would be cool to remove mobo and replace it with upgrade part in future. Everyone is flashy on their desings etc. but I just don't understand why there isn't more effort to "Framework" way. That's what I'd like to see the future way. I'm sick of disposable devices. Heck I buy my computers mostly refurbished business models as run of the mill laptops always break or get issues no matter how delicately you handle them. Get your shit together hardware manufacturers.

[@TheLukemcdaniel]

I'm mixed on crowdfunding. I've got some gems. The Dresden Files rpg, a set of fate die to go with it, Yooka-Laylee. But then there's crap like the Translusense kb. Admittedly, it would only be a display piece, but this is only one of many examples of what is so bad about kickstarter, and it's the reason I won't touch kickstarter again. 10 years later, and I will forever remain salty on this. The "business" model of ks is screwed at the foundation. You're not investing, you're "backing". Once you hand over your money, it's no longer your money at all, and they have zero obligation to actually provide what they promised. At that point, ks has already gotten their percentage, and have zero obligation to issue any refunds, in fact they have every incentive NOT to. Fuck Kickstarter. Fuck early access. Fuck crowdfunding in general. It's lead to one of many instances of the enshitification of the wold as we know it.

[@jt3000o]

the thing is is that every handheld that has come out has had two small of a screen 7 and 8 inch screens are too small

[@T.Lspitz]

I might be the minority here but I actually rly like this design layout. I feel a handheld resembling an xbox controller with a big screen in the middle between both hands, would be perfect for mobile gaming.

[@CraftComputing]

It was definitely comfortable and well balanced. But it's not exactly the most portable device either.

[@T.Lspitz]

@@CraftComputing that's understandable. everyone has their own preferences and its pretty difficult to design a handheld that has all the best features without it becoming the size and weight of a small laptop so some compromises will probably have to be made either way. Personally speaking, I'd prefer a handheld with a decent size and quality screen that's comfortable to hold and I also feel joysticks and triggers are a must have feature. Touchscreen, online streaming and web browsing capabilities to top it all off. I might just settle with this handheld though depending on price and availability. Thanks for your review on it. Definitely has my interest peaked.

[@Hyde-Jahf]

Sitting here watching this on my Steam Deck in Desktop mode. 100% has been a laptop replacement for me. I'd love hardware options ... but. If other companies want my business, please just support SteamOS. My desktop is moving away from Windows anyway. I have absolutely 0 interest in a portable handheld with Windows. Valve is open to others using their stack ... just do it. As in from the factory, not as a community port. Provide and test hardware drivers, use the existing stack as the base.

[@itsdeonlol]

Thanks Jeff for this video!

[@mikebroom1866]

I don't want to see handheld reviews at all... But I'll watch yours!

[@joeschmoe5009]

I have never, and will never crowdfund, its no gauruntee. I will only order direct from reputable dealers. Quantity does not equal quality. I will never even buy 1 of these from a reputable dealer.

[@2kcheetah]

Thank god I didn't pre-order it. Ally X for me!!

[@buddybleeyes]

This is exactly why the steam deck was what i put my pre order down for, and although some are more powerful- the steam deck support is the absolute best. I am waiting on a steam deck 2 rather than buying one of these rushed out, monthly refreshed crowd sourced crap. I had the same complaint with aya even before the steam deck took off

[@ellusion1985]

No flex of controllers??? My X1 intel version controllers are flexing as hell...........

[@brialdridge]

Its not even as good as the steam deck. If you want to sell me something, make it at least AS good as the steam deck, not worse and also worse and have it be 3 years later. I bought a steam deck the first day because I have every steam product and I wanted that portable PC capabilities. The steam deck is the best hardware I've seen Valve ever make. Beter than my Index, Better than the two steam controllers, better than my steam machine, SO much better than my steam link. If you want to replace my steam deck, it has to be at least as good at everything and then better than that at anything. Does the OG 512 steam deck do EVERYTHING well? of course not. But it does everything good or well enough. I use my steam deck all the time. If someone wants my money, make something as good in every way and then do anything better, and definitely nothing worse than the product I already own. Not something better in one dimension but much worse in others. Every category. Display, storage, interface (both hardware and software), battery, thermal control, game software, every possible control surface and touch point. Why bother otherwise.

[@PhatBoyzClub]

You are new so you dont understand why crowdfunding is done from china. First these are very small companies that need to market their product outside of China which they obviously cant because 1st they don't have most of the certification needed to sell these in countries like the US, Japan, India, Korea etc. 2nd There are a lot of regulations that are needed to legally advertise most of these devices like ayaneo, onex, gpd, anmbernic etc which simply cant be done because most of the parts used in them do not go through normal product safety manufacturing guidelines. Basically you are buying a niche custom boutique product that can blow up anytime while ur on a plane or in a car or can have a stolen windows keys or have a bunch of roms in or can be using non certified Thunderbolt 4 protocols/google services. Without crowd funding there would be no easy way to buy or advertise these products. JD is Chinese crowd platform they use JD also to promote their products rather than traditional marketing which is very expensive and comes with risks. Its a double edged sword if you want something this niche/cool you have to take risks or wait till companies sell them legally in the US.

[@cheeeeezewizzz]

Sleep is broken on all windows devices.

[@tohur]

TBH unless these companies can go straight to market with these products they aint worth ya time.. stick with Valve, Asus and lenovo if you want a hand held til these companies can just go straight to market.. way I see it if these companies can't go straight to market with their own funding they have no business making handhelds.

[@TheKinoal]

Finally somebody who said the truth !! 😊

[@RetroGameCorps]

Great video, Jeff! To add context, I was also sent the X1 Mini for review, but it had some catastrophic hardware issues that prevented me from fully testing the product. So I returned it to the company and decided that I'll tackle another review once they're ready. I agree that I'd rather have these companies take their time and refine their lineup rather than focus on output.

[@SirSicCrusader]

I don't get the value of those really big ones... they are BARELY portable, is it just in case you need to kill a man while you're gaming on the go?

[@mycosys]

Make an epic DAW/virtual instrument for jamming an gigging tho

[@jothain]

Tbh you really can't make insanly small PC based portable. I get the console emulator ones, but PC. Nope. Steam Deck is already on verge that you can read stuff from display.

[@BrunodeSouzaLino]

@@mycosys That niche is already filled by the iPad and it does it really well.

[@mycosys]

@@BrunodeSouzaLino LMFAO clearly not something you do. Nor would it support literally any of my equipment or software.

[@BrunodeSouzaLino]

@@mycosys Explain the multitude of live equipment with iPad support then.

[@mjc0961]

I don't crowdfund anything anymore. I am a *_customer._* I am not an investor, I am not a bank giving interest free loans. It's not my responsibility or my desire to prop up all these projects. What do I even get for crowdfunding? At worst they take my money and run. At best, I preordered. No thanks. I'll wait until the product comes out (if it does) and check out some reviews to see if it's worth it before I part with my money. Crowdfunding can go pound sand as far as I'm concerned.

[@carlost856]

Crowdfunding isn't investing, you're not getting a return. You're a donator. Which is why crowdfunding was great when it was about small art projects that wouldn't otherwise be made. But tech came in an tricked people into thinking they were investing or pre-ordering.

[@zeendaniels5809]

Not to mention that being an early-adopter almost always sucks (especially this early, prototype quality level almost).

[@RobertPendell]

I went in on a few things. One item they never produced and promised refunds then never gave those refunds. Ended up doing a chargeback 2 years after the original "investment". Yes I won that chargeback even though it was well beyond the typical window. Honestly if I go in on one I don't care about if I get something or not as long as they are transparent about it. I had one production that took a bit over 2 years. Did get all the rewards promised in the end. Another one was a possible film that never happened but eh... They were up front about what it was for. I just didn't notice until later.

[@Fay7666]

Main problem I have is the lack of support. All if them have horror stories about units arriving with bad QC and being completely screwed by their support departments being useless. I've been holding on to getting an Ayaneo Slide since announcement because of this, I want a keyboard in a handheld like my childhood dream the Vaio UX. Thankfully, _Antec_ decided to take on some distribution so I'm finally gonna be buying one of those this weekend.

[@benny21293]

You could get a gpd win 4 or mini. GPD has become much better in quality and are at this point an established maker or handheld PCs. Never order directly from any of them go though a reputable seller and let them handle support for the devices.

[@bobbiesterling574]

big companies using crowdfunding is just kinda icky for me. it really feels like they are trying to dodge the higher responsibilities in taking actual pre-orders. with all the horror stories ive heard, i just dont think ill ever be up for backing a crowdfunding campaign also, im definitely not the target market for handhelds, but i find a lot of the reviews kinda same-y, because a lot of the products are kinda same-y. there's just only so much you can do beyond tiny adjustments and the only real questions are "does it suck to hold?" and "how is the battery life?"

[@CraftComputing]

Exactly. Hardware internals have reached stagnation because there really is only ONE option... the 7840U. So they try to cram as many 'unique' features as possible to woo potential buyers, but all of those features are basically pointless in a device like this. I don't need a fingerprint scanner, Windows Hello camera, 1600P display, 64GB of Ram, keyboard docks, removable controllers, etc.

[@jothain]

Yes. Especially when big company is crowdfunding stuff feels just very odd to me. There aren't any true reasons for them to make such things. Maybe it's to blame gamers as iirc this trend seemed to launch after Kickstarter projects where originally there were few good things like Wasteland 2 I got into and got happy in the end. But when big companies go into funding it's very sketcy. They're given instantly frame to do virtually anything with given funds, without any risks. Star Citizen is perfect example of this. I can't believe people are STILL pushing money to Roberts. Like what the hell?? Haven't people looked into how much money they've already wasted. It's absolutely insane. They're making game that would need several game engine remakes to accomplish everything they're trying to accomplish. I don't believe that game will ever have proper "done" date.

[@chaosfenix]

@@CraftComputing I think this is a big point. They try and put in features to differentiate their product but in most cases it just ends up making the product worse. A 1600p display at these screen sizes just kills your battery life and mean you have to crank up cooling to try and keep up. Most people will drop the resolution to fix that but then you are working with a non native resolution and paid more than you should have for the device. 64GB of RAM is also overkill and again uses more battery than 16 or 32GB would. They are chasing numbers on a spec sheet instead of focusing on building an actually good product. At this point there are only 2 handhelds I would recommend. The Steam Deck and the ROG Ally. I prefer the Deck but if someone really wants better game compatibility at the expense of some of the battery life and user experience I would recommend the Ally.

[@rawdiggitydog]

​@@chaosfenixThe Legion Go has better battery life than the ROG Ally and it doesn't come with hardware that is known to be broken (SD card slot). All why having a bigger display, faster RAM, and a more sturdy build. The only issue is really the speakers

[@chaosfenix]

@@rawdiggitydog Except that the fact that it has a bigger display is part of the problem. The thing is massive. Even with the Ally's problems I still think it is a better windows handheld than all the others. That being said I still think that the Steam Deck is preferable to both.

[@marcogenovesi8570]

Jeff talking to handheld designer companies: Stop it, seek some help

[@internziko]

The Companies: "And i took that personal"

[@chris_schenkel]

Way beyond help. Institutionalize.

[@cheeeeezewizzz]

These companies will all go completely bankrupt within 6 months if they don't keep up the current production method

[@Tappotuoppi]

And while this rant goes on im fully satisfied with the original steam deck and will be using it for a long time

[@CraftComputing]

The Steam Deck is the gold standard... but it's also barely half as powerful as these new devices. The 800P display can also be limiting in some games. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE the Steam Deck, but there are some gamers who do want more performance and a better display. My recommendation for that is the OneXFly.

[@chaosfenix]

@@CraftComputing But isn't it the only one out there really doing what you are asking for in your video? They have focused a ton on the user experience. They started with like 1000 games that were playable on steamos and that has ballooned to around 15k. The 800p display is a little limiting but it is what is appropriate for the processor they have and they prioritized battery life over raw power. A lot of other handhelds out there have better performance and so do great on the charts but the steam deck has always been top notch in battery life which is kinda important in a handheld. I also think they limited themselves in some ways due to the market segment really being new. They didn't know if people would accept a more powerful device that costs $1000 and so they picked a price point of $400. Those are very real constraints and the steam deck is still amazing even though it is competing with devices 50-100% more expensive than it. I do hope they launch a steam deck 2 with the HX 370 and maybe a 1200p screen. If they can slap the Ally X's battery into it that would be great. The market has been proven and has shown that there is a demand for a more expensive device. Personally I don't think they should go hog wild though. I would pick like $650-$700 for the entry model and then go up from there. If they go too much more expensive than that I am afraid that a lot of the good rapport they have will disappear.

[@aftdawn]

@@CraftComputing can you list some games that "can be limiting" on a steam deck's screen? cause as far as i have seen from my own deck, every game i've tried works basically perfectly with no resolution issues or oddities sure the performance is not the best, but it's not a potato by any stretch of the imagination

[@TrTai]

Yep, there's better, and I would like better, but there's a community around the steam deck that will most likely have any of the same issues I do, and it does enough for what I need. I keep tabs on the new stuff but it's never enough to justify more than just seeing what the current go-to chip is capable of.

[@CraftComputing]

Games with UI/UX that are fixed for 1080P. Stardew Valley for example, the UI takes up 25% of your screen, and you have very limited view distance because the render resolution doesn't scale.

[@mikearisbrocken8507]

Steam Deck delivered what I look for a handheld device: They went the Gameboy approach, not SUPER RAW POWER, but user experience. The customization of controls (that I actually use), enough power for most games, in a 7-8 inch screen I don't need 120Hz or 1080P, mature software (took a while but we got there) and yet they deviated from the Nintendo model by actualñy letting you tinker with it. Hardware and software wise. Slight itterations of the steam deck is what I need, also their pledge for repairability is amazing. All of these are reasons why I kept my Steam Deck infavour of the Ally or Go. They provided an adecuate bridge between PC and console experience. A bridge between custom and customizable software. A bridge between build quality adn repairability. I just need a Steam Deck 2.

[@Elkarlo77]

The 720p Screen on the Steamdeck is a Pro not a con, especially for games not optimized for Handhelds the larger Pixels are easier to read. The Oled with it's 90hz Display is perfection, putt it in 45hz mode and you have smoth frames and long battery life. I have both and tested an Ally. I stay with my Oled. Hopefully Valve will release a more Powerfull Steamdeck next year in two Variants: Steamdeck 2 with an 7" inch and Steamdeck 2 Plus with an 8" inch. Both with 720p, Oled and 90hz. One for Home Gaming mostly and one for mobile mostly. So two sizes. Even the battery can stay the same. Thats the only improvements Valve may do, when they then keep all the components (Joysticks Buttons etc) the same so they are interchangeable for repairs it would be perfection.

[@ToGrimmToWin]

800p screen ​@@Elkarlo77

[@draco2xx]

they took the nintendo switch approach

[@C20F]

​@@Elkarlo77Nonsense... You can adjust resolution, this isn't console...

[@trsskater]

Having an ROG Ally that has the same size screen as the steam deck I used to say the same thing that it's better off in 720p and so on. When I played a game that could handle 1080p in a game that was pixel art the difference was massive enough I would rather not play at a lower resolution. Colors pop way more and the color grading is wider. And honestly just play games the system can handle. There are tons of them. Save the bigger games for you PC at home. I'm not playing a game at low settings. But maybe I'm different because I don't play any games below max settings at 4k. If I can't do that at above 60 fps I wait until next gens graphics cards. To play that game since there again are so many games I can play and achieve that.

[@RubyRoks]

I always appreciate when creators and reviewers do what they can to keep companies in check. Shit like this is why i haven't bothered "upgrading" from my first run Steam Deck to a newer and more powerful handheld. It's a known quantity that is both getting continued support and isn't being replaced by a new model every 9 months.

[@gunstorm05]

As for your questions at the end: My personal preference is to get reviews of devices that focus on stuff people using these devices actually care about - It baffles me how many handheld "reviews" are more like "spec sheets and hype-building" than "What it's like to use it." I want to hear what it's like to actually use a device as intended. How many hours did you play on it? What did you actually find enjoyable to play? Where were you usually at when you played? (Sitting/laying on a couch? Sitting/laying in bed? At a table? In the car?) How long were you able to play on it comfortably? How loud is the cooling fan in an average game running at normal TDP ranges - Loud enough to bother those trying to watch a TV in the same room? Is the screen pleasant to look at? Is it top-heavy?

[@AMidgetWalrus]

I think a lot of it is that many reviewers A.) Want more views and B) Want to be sent more handhelds. If you constantly say "eh this is the same damn thing as the other 9 I've been sent this month" people won't care, and companies won't send you shiny $800 PCs. Now if only these companies would stop making ROG Ally clones, that'd be cool...

[@jbjb6000]

This is why I follow your channel. This is one of the most fair reviews I have watched in ages. You gave fair constructive criticisms with a path to solution. You pointed out the positives and at no point did it feel like an attack.

[@Pieteros21]

For me its hard to call this a handheld when it's so big and heavy ;[

[@ElNeroDiablo]

Honestly, having had my Steam Deck 512GB LCD (upgraded to 2TB) for about 10-11 months, pretty much the only thing that'll get me to migrate from it is a revision using a newer APU (say a 9840U?) with support for 2280 NVMe M.2 instead of the 2230 NVMe M.2... Preferably with Valve selling it directly in Aus/NZ with a partnership like EB Games or (as ASUS did with the ROG Ally) JB Hi-Fi. Otherwise the form factor, input layout, screen size (if not resolution)... it's practically perfect for me nowadays when away from my powerful gaming rig.

[@CraftComputing]

The new APU coming out from AMD is the HX 370... 12-Cores and a 16CU Radeon 890M. It's going to be expensive, but that's the next paradigm shift in handheld performance.

[@TheKazragore]

I wouldn't hold my breath on Valve doing anything like that for us, unfortunately. On the note of m.2 sizes, it's probably a matter of priority when it comes to the internals. A bigger m.2 slot probably ranks lower in priority than battery, cooling, SOC memory, screen, controllers, overall size, etc.

[@JessicaFEREM]

This reminds me of the Bringus studios Ayaneo 2S situation, where ayanei made a handheld that could actually burn you if you used the touch screen and they hand-waived it away as "it's just a prototype" personally I think when these companies say "it's just a prototype" it's a lie and it's actually the finished unit, and they're using the "prototype" excuse for reviewers to go lighter on it as "it's just a prototype the finished product will be better" but in many cases, no that's really not the case, as soon as these consoles are released they're onto the next handheld with no updates after launch.

[@crestofhonor2349]

I love handheld PCs. I have been paying attention to them since before the Steam Deck. My first one was the Steam Deck OLED and later on I got both the ROG Ally and Legion Go. Since then I’ve found myself loving the smaller handhelds. I pick up my Ally more than anything else as it’s not too big to transport. I do not like these handhelds getting bigger and bigger. It makes them less portable and more like a laptop in size. I’ve also agreed that these companies need to have fewer handhelds. Aya Neo is especially guilty as they’re shipping out new models practically every three months. Consumers are going to be very confused by that. They need to stick with 2 or three product lines that get updated every year or two. I do agree that battery life and software need to be high priorities. It seems like Asus and Valve are the only ones who understand and ship out good software. Lenovo is lacking and plenty of others are too. Software is very important for the user experience and a bad software environment can make even the best hardware feel frustrating and might even make them feel underpowered

[@mycosys]

Pl Pl Pl keep growing your hair - Wizard Jeff would be so epic, would suit you so well on so many levels (inc aesthetic).

[@TandyOne]

Better return his screwdriver sir! Otherwise you owe him a few beers.

[@CraftComputing]

Oh, beer will be had.

[@Montytheolaila]

the excitement around this industry is great. But everyone needs to take a beat. If you NEED to do refreshes and release new products, please just refine your current form factors. GPD win mini is great! work on the cooling! Ayaneo 2S is great! make the micro LED version you claimed was coming. OneX..all you should be doing is releasing a Oled fly. It's literally the best of these devices. Nurture it! Stop crowdfunding prototypes. Let's all wait for the next chips and value the customer for a second.

[@Dracossaint]

What i want out of handhelds is a uniform experience that isnt spotty. I prefer they slowdown on hardware release, but i get their a hardware company. That might not be an option. So i just want the software to be less fragmented and more reliable. I shouldn't need 4 different package to play games. Contribute to handheld companion and make that the core of your product. Not a varation of it. No the actual software and help them grow.

[@claucmgpcstuf5103]

Yea tias is avri nasti pls they only Lenovo ligeon go or Asus Aly extreme .. or samthing more sirios .ko Veri good information .plus tha price it is stil in tha 350$ to 450$ max .... Pls stop with a apelizem sindrom of tha 1000$ starter ... price. Up to wat ever . It is not gonna happen in tha non existen economi ... Not in this cencary gen . Tray next cencary 2100 gen ..if noting relei bad hapans more until then gen

[@ryansarkinian7196]

Interesting link between the sponsorship of the video by "cloud gaming" and the denigration of handheld PCs.

[@Krux3]

But doesn't steam already make the "one" handheld? If these guys wanna shoot themselves in the foot with product fragmentation let them.

[@JoshLloyd]

For me, I'm looking to see if a device fundamentally delivers on all it's promises and then how it compares to the Steam Deck. I 100% agree on the point that these companies should stop abandoning their devices to make totally new things so frequently. Look to how Nintendo and Valve treat their hardware platforms. Just do the one thing, as good as it can be, as supported as it can be, and then upgraded options over time within the same platform. I refuse to consider buying any of these devices from any of these brands specifically because of the constant new devices coming out.

[@rilufuzz]

I feel like these Chinese companies are just throwing shit at the wall at this point to see what sticks. Intstead, they should really be trying to refine what they already have.

[@eternalrest2859]

Theres all these crowd funded junk handhelds that are basically clones of each other with a minor variation. The market is currently flooded with these devices and they all have the same basic specs. They become obsolete in a matter of weeks and peoples addiction is making them easy targets to buy the next greatest device. This means your $700 device is going to be worth about $100 in a matter of months. Just look what Asus did to the Ally. Nobody wants to buy even a new one anymore. People cant give them away second hand. Only devices that hold their value are GPDs. The Original GPD Win 1 and 2 (both predate the SD) go for as much as the Steam Deck. Im seeing hundreds of people on social media with Multiple devices all released in the past year. Not just 2. I mean a lot of these guys will have 10 devices. "I used my SD for Steam games, I use my Rog Ally for Windows games, I use my Aya Neo for Emulation, My OneX Player when im taking a dump" is the BS excuses they use when its obvious gaming and electronics are an addiction.

[@JB-tp6uj]

Why does this bother you? Nobody needs any of these devices, but there are valid reasons to have multiple devices. Some people use them for reviewing purposes. Others use them because the form factor fits the style of play better. For example, my Ayaneo Kun is great for higher end PC games. My Odin 2 is better suited for emulation. Maybe a clamshell device for DS and 3DS emulation. I could totally understand having another device that fits in my pocket for quick traveling scenarios. And yes, some people just like to collect things. Once again, why is that a "BS" excuse?

[@AdmV0rl0n]

I think one aspect missed is that crowd funded kit allows a certain 'marketing' of something not yet made, or perhaps only in prototype form. If I am engineer at some company, and they won't pay for development, but they do allow you to fund some this way - I'm loathe to attack it. *I've not bought from these pre -purchese methods, but if I did, I'd be careful and accept some risk.

[@JohnWick-ym7dd]

I want them to stop pushing higher res and bigger screens, it's a handheld, I'm biased because i love the PSP but the resolution of the SteamDeck (1280×800), for example, is fine!

[@aaronbrenkus9126]

I want to see a review that shows what the new ones can do, especially functionality, be it hardware or software. I have wanted a good portable machine that functions as well as a desktop, I know that is still a bit of a way off, but I think we are getting there faster and faster. Your reviews, and others like you, show me how close we are getting. I am still happy with my SteamDeck purchase but I wish it had more power, like it missed the chip lottery by maybe 2 generations. Thing is though, it got almost everything else right for its size and cost. Hopefully someone else will soon as well.

[@claucmgpcstuf5103]

So pi is almost a scam deamm .mansti tha drivers ar not deffolr rem AMD ..tha is Veri nasti .. tha audio mith exist or not .. tna cotrost sak as qalati...and tha Apu control. Max 50w vs low 25w .. daz not wark .. this is a scam ! Deam Shem . Fin

[@LiamNajor]

Write proper english if you wish to be understood.

[@TesGon]

Nobody need your crowdfunding money. Wait for the reviews - buy or don't a product. All these brands like Ayaneo or Onexplayer can release products without this .

[@KomradeMikhail]

Can't wait for the SteamDeck2 to upset the whole scene...

[@Goalier95]

With Asus ROG Ally, Lenovo Legion Go being sold at my local Best Buy and Valve’s superior customer service if anything goes south, there’s no reason to do anymore Kickstarters or IGG for the latest new gaming handheld.

[@C20F]

Lol, this couldn't be more incorrect.

[@NexGen-3D]

I just picked up a Legion Go, kinda glad I did as I looked at these first.

[@leonkernan]

This is the standard Chinese flood the market routine.

[@mckelepic]

i like watching the amount of beer slowly lower throughout the video

[@exmodusgaming]

I agree with you mate, I'm dead tired of all the different handhelds coming out that don't differ much from each other aside from the completely newly introduced issues that seem to compound with each iteration, no matter the improvements. It's really exhausting from the consumer point of view and seems reckless and short sighted from the 'successful business' point of view. It's pretty scary to me overall because these companies are certainly stretching themselves past their own capabilities and the failure of this amazing form factor would simply lead to a lower quality life for me and those who value what I value.

[@cheeeeezewizzz]

It's the same as watching every single laptop than gets released and constantly trying to keep track of that. People in the handheld space are simply insane. These are COMPUTERS, stop thinking of them like toys.

[@shinythings7]

Right now, I think there are some nice outcomes to this, including a race to the bottom for pricing. If you can find an amazing deal on something used or a seller clearing out stock, you can get a 7840u for a really good deal. I also have found that I need to temper my expectations with these devices, both for performance and support. I have to treat it like something that will break and not have any real way to get it fixed in the short term if replacing something like a fan, battery, or drive doesn't do it. Not a great spot to be in, but if you minimize how much you spend on the device, it isn't as bad.

[@HandheldHardware]

I dont have all the hardware controls yet... but i do have some similar software to one x console and it does plenty of stuff one x console doesn't. If you are interested, i'd be happy to share! Development is more transparent then these companies software...

[@xXDarthBagginsXx]

I really want handhelds to do well after I bought my son a Switch OLED for Christmas when they released, I play it more than my son and have been looking into better performing units that I can play my library through but at the right price-point ($300-500). So far Valve is the main contender for that price-point, and love seeing the innovation and chances that competitors are taking. I too avoid crowdfunding due to my experience in the custom keyboard space. In the end we all want a good performing unit with amazing battery life that is comfortable to play on the go, 720p/1080p is more than enough at a 7" to 9" screen size as anything higher is wasted pixels at that density.

[@PsychoStreak]

What I want to see reviewed in handhelds? Controllers - if they're not Hall effect, don't bother reviewing them. If a company can't be bothered to use better tech than an Atari 2600 in their controls, I won't bother buying them. Driver compatibility - If they don't have all the drivers I need for a clean install on a well sorted download page, I'm not going to give them my money. Software - as little as possible please. Joystick mouse support. button remapping, and a simple interface for power/performance settings. Also give me the Pro version of Windows. at the prices you're charging that should be the minimum.

[@KnightRiderOfVoid]

Everything you said except windows, no way I'm buying anything to run that OS haha, I have enough of that torture on my work laptop, on my personal machine, heck nah.

[@arranmc182]

My main issue with 99% of devices like this they ship with windows rather than Linux as Bazzite OS & Holoiso would make far better operating systems and would allow this device to act just like a steam deck.

[@wenzlg3420]

I have been looking for a fairly priced easy on the budget windows tablet So far i have seen most windows tablets are overpriced for the performance you get like the surface go 3 and the surface pro 9 is over my budget Then i saw the legion go nicely priced good price to performance windows tablet for work This is just to say that I AM THE AUDIENCE FOR ONE INCH WINDOWS TABLET!S and i need more options other than the legion go

[@Nocturn3]

Honestly, seeing videos regarding both absolute maxxing performance and a separate one for maxxing battery life would be great if you wanted to change up your handheld review video format away from "yet another ryzen 7840u device"

[@stuartcastle2814]

While I normally think that companies releasing a lot of products is a good thing, because it means more choice, I can't help thinking that these manufacturers need to do is slow down on the amount of models they release, and devote their resources to improving one model. You may not be able to resolve the physical problems, but you can improve the software, and the physical problems may be solved in a future product revision. At the moment, it's actually quite confusing finding one to buy because there seems to be hundreds of handheld gaming PCs from several manufacturers. I'm an experienced PC gamer, and while I am not in the market for a handheld at the moment (I am happy with my OG Steam Deck), I still get confused with the shear number of handhelds available. It must be a nightmare for a newbie, or even a parent buying a handheld for their kids.

[@CraftComputing]

That's exactly my point. The OneXPlayer 2, the removable controllers were not ready, as the fit and finish weren't there. The X1 Mini controllers have a MUCH better connection to the main body, but the controllers themselves are junk (buttons and DPAD are up there with the worst I've ever used). Things like this should have been caught before going into production, not just thrown into the wild, and maybe in the 4th revision we'll iron it all out.

[@DigitalJedi]

Agreed. Look at how the big PC makers that have gone into the handheld market do it. Asus made one Ally for better or worse, and has just been updating it over time. They have a successor with buffed specs coming in the Ally X with more RAM and a bigger battery, but that makes model number 2. Valve has 2 Steam Decks, the regular one and the OLED, with the only differences within those being storage.

[@BrunodeSouzaLino]

The issue is they're not actually releasing anything. They're just throwing a bunch of prototypes out there just to see which ones will sell well, otherwise they just do that small run of pre-orders and discontinue it. Quite a shady way of making a profit off a product you never intended to manufacture in the first place.

[@cheeeeezewizzz]

What software? It's a windows pc. There is no software. No software is even necessary

[@cheeeeezewizzz]

​@BrunodeSouzaLino GPD doesn't do that. They have established product lines. The GPD win is on its 5th version, the wini mini is on its 3rd, the win max has been around for half a decade, etc. They have thoroughly established product lines.

[@Qrinity]

UI and UX consistently provide a long lasting satisfacrion than hardware. It has been proven time and time again. Compared to valve who owns the largest market share of having a storefront, the others dont have a way to sustain themselves other than releasing another handheld and see hype can sustain them till the next breakthrough in apu performance comes. But that is impossible when valve and other major brand players come in and there isnt a new apu for. 3 years at max Valve made themselves better because of their long time development with linux in making their own OS that makes everything accessible.

[@Crazyates11]

This looks IDENTICAL to my Lenovo Lefion GO. The screen is the exact same 2560x1600 16x10 144hz IPS, bezels and webcam are the same, same detachable controller sliding sockets, the kickstand, everything about the body looks the same. Internally, it looks like a slight upgrade from the Z1 extreme (7840u) to 8840u, 16GB to 32GB, and a 49wh battery to 65wh.

[@Zoyx]

I've given up for now. I use a cheap gaming laptop with my own controller and ignore this drama. I really do like the idea of a high-powered handheld, but none of them measure up to the versatility of a laptop. Maybe a handheld will come along and lure me back in.

[@cheeeeezewizzz]

S3 sleep doesn't function because AMD doesn't support it anymore. The 8840u is incapable of s3 sleep. It will never work no matter what you or anyone else does. S3 sleep is permanently gone from AMD powered windows devices. Further, these companies are Tiny. You are absurd to think they are huge rich companies. Ive seen GPDs office, its a hole in the wall. These companies only sell a few thousand units of each model. They arent moving tens of thousands, their sales goals are closer to 3-4000 units per model. You are completely and totally out of touch with reality.

[@pyroslev]

I like the idea of Crowdfunding. Pebble got it right. Znaps dropped the ball. I get why So many companies do it. They can spec out to see what people want but that was before the Steamdeck. If they have something in this hardware style that has something UNIQUE, perhaps crazy and not something with wide appeal, that's a crowdfundable one to me. But only for something that's 50/50 if it would sell enough even break even. Not for another *insert handheld type*. I know it gives them buffer for if the device flops. They need to stop hiding behind that and grow up as you said. 101% agreed.

[@CraftComputing]

RIP my Pebble Steel... still mad at Fitbit about that whole thing. But, Companies like Pebble (Or Ayaneo in 2021... or OneXPlayer in 2020) are working to both establish their retail presence, and also collect funding needed for manufacturing their products. This can be to finalize tooling, complete prototyping, etc. And that's perfectly fine. But in 2024, Ayaneo and OneXPlayer are MORE than established enough. They are delivering devices to reviewers that are functionally complete. Their manufacturing ability is already where it needs to be. They already have an established multi-national retail presence. They no longer need crowdfunding.

[@darkguitarist037]

Why on earth does an 8-9" screen need 1440p? I know a lot of phones these days have a similar or higher resolution on a smaller screen, but most if not all actually run them at a lower effective resolution. I get the pixel pitch argument and having look sharper, but I'd guess that a 1080p screen would be hard to distinguish from 1440p at 8.5", and be better for battery life.

[@vocalitypog2316]

Buyer's Guide would be best. I've avoided the handheld market because of the insane number of options, and all I want is a premium software experience. I'm reminded of the 3D printer space before Bambu Lab demolished the competition. How did they win? UX/Software

[@RedMageGaming]

Aside from the general problems attached with buying a product whos whole support system is overseas, the primary reason I never bought any Ayaneo, Onexplayer, or GPDwin devices over the years has been, the excessive costs, and the constant new releases, and in cases like Ayaneo, new releases before shipping the one people already ordered. I don't really care if they want to crowdfund their innitial orders, It's stupid, but at this point these brands have proved they can and will ship, so there's no real anxiety there, it's more that it's unnecessary now, their names are big enough, their company is big enough. If each of them poured their time into making ONE handheld each, and sure, several skus with different ssd and ram if they want fine whatever, but ONE form factor, and really go all in on it from a support aspect, abd kept at it for the whole year, and only made a new model when it made sense to, they would have much more loyal buyers, and more enthusiastic reviewers. Arguably the most important, they would be able to produce at scale and the price could come down to compete with contemporaries like the ROG Ally or Legion Go.

[@asunavk69]

I think it'd be interesting to showcase bazzite/chimeraOS on ROG ally or legion go, for users that need windows, but also would like a steam deck like experience, its advantages, limitations, etc. I'd wish companies would try eyeing a bit on linux gaming tho..

[@awetisimgaming7473]

I'm definately in agreeance, I never participated in the crowdfunding for my GPD WinMax 2 with the 6800u, I think investing in a maybe is stupid, and feels desperate. It feels like a host club or something where they want me fawning over their products like I'm in love at first sight. I do love my device, even without the oculink port which i would have shilled for a dock, but that is what it is. I used this thing so much I just killed my 4tb ssd 3 days ago installing linux and games over and over trying stuff (which I bought at the same time). I still think I'd like to see maybe having better software implemented like was stated ad nauseam, if maybe we were lucky, I'd love to see just plain old linux installed, it doesn't need to be steam's implementation. I would like to use some os level stuff to reconfigure my device, and not hack into the bios, or compile my own Amd tool from source.

[@bartz0rt928]

I'm honestly not seeing any of these guys do significantly better than the Steam Deck. More performance hardly matters given the games I run, at least not until they can do substantially better at the same power draw. Higher resolutions are also of limited value, just makes everything suck the battery dry faster and at a screen size I'm prepared to take with me you don't really see any benefit above maybe 1200x1920. The ergonomics are pretty much perfect for me. So what's even left? Can you make better software than Valve?

[@Jackpkmn]

I don't even want a handheld at all! I want a like 7 inch tablet form factor pc with a cpu like this. Just the 5-10 point multi touch screen and ability to put it in my pocket. The only windows tablets around are great hulking beasts at 12-14 inches way too big to pocket. And nearly universally use very low end intel chips. It's very VERY frustrating to see all of exactly what I want in handhelds just lop off the unnecessary controllers and controller mounts.

[@jttech44]

Honestly, you should only do handheld reviews if they're paying you. I'll watch them, I watch all your stuff, but, there's nothing really remarkable about handhelds, it's a tablet computer with joysticks, maybe a little faster than the last one or whatever. Really until someone does something that's actually remarkable, and I do trust your judgement as to what is remarkable, a review video of iteration 2.0.1.2.8 handheld X is going to be pretty meh.

[@dexterman6361]

I do not like hardware being released every quarter like cakes. ASUS does the same thing with their laptops, and each is riddled with firmware bugs and broken sleep and drivers. Never again. Thank you for bringing that up! Software support and long term support is * Important *. Great video!

[@jeremybarber2837]

Oh man… do I have thoughts about handhelds. I have a SteamDeck and love it most days. I would love it even more if XBOX made a remote play app for Linux as I am one of the weirdos that has an XBOX Series X essentially as a game stream server but I digress. And yes, I am trying to get Greenlight set up… no success yet. In my dream of dreams I would love to see a Frameworks laptops approach to handheld: modular and repairable as core tenants. I’ll admit that I have an abundance of computers (perhaps too many) to choose from for any given workload I want to work on. That being said I would love to see a handheld that could be both a portable gaming machine and the core of a reasonably powerful desktop experience. Great video by the way, keep up the good work.

[@NatesRandomVideo]

I’ve just stopped bothering with anything kickstarter. Finish your product and market it like we had to when I made things. They’re just annoying. If the product is good enough, it’ll sell and pay back development costs. If it sucks you won’t be able to finance the development.