I Quit Amazon After 2 Months

[@NeetCode]

Part of the reason I uploaded this was because I saw your video about your struggles before you started working at Netflix. Appreciate what you do Prime!

[@bhavyachadha]

Thanks Man

[@awesomegamer31]

NeetCode is my GOAT.

[@nealrutgerskid]

I viewed your video and i can understand your position. I totally don't agree with him saying you made a mistake by not toughing it out. You don't tough it out at the expense of your health.

[@Nick-qy7lk]

two goats 🐐🐐

[@nullptr-0x256]

You definitely missed an opportunity. Yes Amazon sucks but that feeling you had wasn't the feeling of fire or stuckness or inadequacy. It was fear. You were scared of making mistakes. You were scared to be yourself. You weren't setup for success by your manager. This was an opportunity for you to say "Hey, I know I'm really good at XYZ but I'm struggling to make progress, can I pair with someone or is there somewhere I can go for help?" Anyone reading this: If you manager calls you after you turn in your resignation and asks you to reconsider, this is your opportunity to explain how you feel, what is preventing you from succeeding, and ask for options. Don't quit unless you manager refuses to help you or tells you it's up to you. There is no weakness in asking questions, asking for help, or asking for documentation. - A manager.

[@billybumpers]

I used to be a pretty sensitive guy and as a new dev my mentor assigned was a guy that no one got along with and they thought he was an asshole. Turns out he was just majorly autistic and would say exactly what he meant. No tact at all BUT he also genuinely never said anything intending to be rude, it was all just people that wanted nice over truth and he could only do raw truth. It was the best thing that ever happened to my career and i worked with him for 10 years. After getting past my sensitivity and realizing it wasnt personal, I just took his advice no matter how it was delivered. Love truth over smiles

[@jazzochannel]

it takes a certain amount of character to swallow your pride and or hurt feelings and listen to advice. good on you, man.

[@jarretthorton7439]

Tom didn’t quit JDSL after 2 months

[@Rockodona]

Tom is a genius!!!!

[@annoorange123]

Why would he, JDSL is great, Tom is a genius. Just don't write comments and you'll be fine

[@abujessica]

Tom who?

[@tzuriteshuba2704]

​​​@@abujessica Tom is our forefather in programming. He is a genius. Watch "most amazing software ever created" by this channel... best vid out

[@lastmanstanding5423]

@@abujessica Tom The Genius

[@nontoxic9960]

Pushing through shitty places is what allows companies to stay shitty

[@elcapitan6126]

agree. have quit one or two jobs and glad I did. there's no reward for putting up with a really shitty situation. ended up in waaaay better jobs thanks to pulling that trigger sooner rather than later.

[@alexanderhorner]

"10 sick days" This is so weird to me how in the US the employer can literally just limit how many days you can be sick like it's in your control or something.

[@yoko312]

Yes yes, thank you, lol nothing on you, but we get it. WE GET IT. Our vacation time sucks unwashed ass. Thanks. We get it, but at least the pay is pretty great, I suppose.

[@alexanderhorner]

@@yoko312 that is true, pay in the US it’s pretty great

[@AE_AnarchistAlexcianEmpire69Bi]

@@yoko312bro had a seizure

[@Ehxx]

@@yoko312 Wages stagnate below inflation each year, companies all keep forming monopolies and homes/col is skyrocketing lol. Shits bad.

[@empyrionin]

well...@@yoko312 , maybe. Depends on your state. If you gotta pay 50K in rent per year (or more in mortgage!), your 150K per year is equivalent to 30-50K per year in Eastern Europe or somewhere mid in Asia. So your observation might have been correct 30 years ago, but it's now only partially correct. California for example would suck all dollars from you. Arizona or another state, yeah, definitely better. Just saying. What with all the inflation, wokeness, police not doing their job, it's starting to look a bit less inviting than people generally expect. Immigrants, especially from poor countries, get over stuff like that, generally. But some states makes it VERY hard to do so lately.

[@InfernalLegion84]

Daamn.. and I thought I've hit the bottom at some point. Got back to programming at 35, wasted more than a decade... But I'm telling myself 'better late than never'. Gotta stay positive

[@ThePrimeTimeagen]

Trust me, you got this

[@Baby4Ghost]

Programming is not an age thing, its a mental fortitude thing. You like puzzles and making your brain work? Then its the perfect place regardless of age. You can do it bro!

[@PixelThorn]

Same here bro, but just keep at it and you're up to speed in no time!

[@Shadow_B4nned]

Same. I quit programming 20 years ago. I wanted to see what AI was like and decided to learn python and deploy a gaming website with a database for users. While I was successful, I couldn't be any more discouraged now. The amount of work it takes to be a solo full stack developer is almost impossible to accomplish alone and there's no guarantee you'll make any profit. So you have to be part of a team. And having tried AI and looking at Google laying off 30,000 people to be replaced with AI. I've given up again. In a few years there will be nothing AI can't do in coding that a human can.

[@johnbell1810]

@@Baby4Ghost hmm, well it takes a toll on your eyes, wrist and fingers, not to mention increased chance of heart attack or stroke due to sitting in chair all day every day an night. Oh and there is bad posture leading to curved hunchback syndrome. Otherwise, age is just a number.

[@JRAS_]

I cannot say how much i appreciate people talking about personal struggles like this in the industry. I myself am struggling with some addictions right now and a lot of anxiety. There are a lot of days in the grind where I am just crawling to be better and it often feels useless and futile but it gives me a lot of hope to see people who I look up to beat their struggles and come out on top. More than any other of your contents I think these would be the ones that I will take with me going forward, the other being influenced to start using vim lmao.

[@boggledeggnoggler5472]

Hope you get on top of those addictions. I myself am a little addicted to weed. The grind can be a grind, but once you’ve grinded for a long time you’ll be grounded and grateful

[@ToddMagnussonWasHere]

I have a banner in my garage that I stare at every day, “Comfort is a slow death. Prefer pain.” When I was about to become a father I was broke, not broke broke, but credit cards cruising me into the 500s. I remember studying code in Northern Midwestern cold from text books in a wonky garage on a cheap ass couch, with cheap cigars or Jane and low sleep. 😂, so maybe I’m one of those guys who paired his vices and his learning… but it paid off. And I understand this dudes feeling, I occasionally still get the third-person effect where I’m able to zoom out like I’m playing Sims and be like, “they’re paying me this much to design UI’s for prospectively millions of customers…” Speaking of which, instead of very hard drugs some of us fell into the MMO gaming hole of the 2000’s, it was like crawling out of a 1950s nuclear bunker and not recognizing the reality you returned to. Having the dark spot in your life gives you a bit of resilience for sure.

[@Xe054]

I hope you pick up a coding routine. Do 100 days of code. It literally changed my life and it could change yours. Never underestimate the power of habits.

[@thebluriam]

You do realize that you are describing literally everyone who has ever existed right? Some people are better at showing the mask than others. Not only are you not alone, the way you feel isn't even remotely unique. Just find how other people are suffering and connect with them on that. You'll realize very quickly how all that feeling of anxiety never mattered because you were never alone to begin with.

[@ToddMagnussonWasHere]

@@Xe054 self-discipline leads to habits. 👍🏼

[@kasper_573]

Please do not intepret what Prime is saying as you should tolerate and push through any and all hardships. That is a one way ticket to serious burnout which may have lifelong impact on your quality of life. Choose your battles carefully. You don’t go to the gym for the first time in your life and suffer through breaking your back trying to squat 200kg expecting to come out stronger. Definitely strive to become resilient, and push through some tough situations. But be mindful of your capacity and if your struggle is far outside your weight class and should be left to be fought another day.

[@Mr.x.187]

well said

[@NihongoWakannai]

Exactly this. The attitude of "never quit, struggle makes you stronger" is provably wrong and toxic. You need progressive overload to improve, if something is too hard for you then quit.

[@mmc239]

this

[@FushigiMigi]

Good stuff

[@bok4822]

@@NihongoWakannai Yeah, at some point you need to realize when something is simply too much. Giving up after barely attempting is something that is not good, but never giving up is just as bad. Only real experience will allow you to start telling when something is actually worth giving up on though, and it is not easy getting that experience when you are not used to challenges to begin with.

[@Kodlak15]

I have the utmost respect for you and your willingness to use your platform to share your personal struggles. It takes a lot of courage. I am glad you are doing better now, and am thankful that you are in a position to help others going through similar situations.

[@Hayze42]

This video is legit - both OP and Prime spit a lot of wisdom here. Only thing I *kind of* disagree with is around 10:00-14:00 when Prime says you should "break through shitty, difficult situations instead of quitting" (paraphrased). Yeah, you might grow. Alternatively, you might get gaslit, abused and wrung out till there's nothing left. Arguably worse, you might get molded into a shitty manipulative Amazon-robot for the rest of your life. I spent 11 months at Amazon after college and quit for similar reasons as the OP and, similarly, my manager tried to tell me "oh don't do that you don't need to quit we can make this better." Bullshit. Trust yourself. If something feels wrong, it likely is. Amazon taught me how to work in a pressure cooker but fuck sticking it out once you know something is fundamentally wrong. There's a reason long-time Amazon alumni have similar reputations to the company as a whole. Stay too long and you might see yourself become one of them.

[@maciejglinski6564]

There is a big difference between technically hard were you can grow and overcome it and destructive hard, where you can at the most endure and hope it won't fuck you up long term. I too would prefer if it was pointed out, but you can't have everything.

[@fluxter7629]

I think he is saying that he doesn't hear a good reason to quit. Was there too much work pressure? Were the managers unhelpful and rude? Was work environment toxic? If you have any of these reasons, please quit. Else push through.

[@maciejglinski6564]

@@fluxter7629 if there are 6 noobs on 5 engineers who are so burned out that newcomers shouldn't ask them anything, it surely doesn't sound as a healthy envirnoment

[@fluxter7629]

@@maciejglinski6564 but he didn't say that was the reason. He said that he was having anxiety about work, not that he was burned out by work.

[@enzito_sdf6978]

this. there's no reason you should keep up with terrible work environments. if it's draining you and making you unhappy constantly, i really dont see a reason to continue. i've had very very rough moments in my current job , but at least my managers did their job to make it less stressful, and i got paid accordingly. what i mean is: dont let yourself get used and abused by corporations. it's never worth it

[@handlechar568]

Yeah if your manager says "don't ask questions" then probably your only sensible options are talk to them and drill down into wtf is going on, and ideally get that problem solved, or, if they're an a-hole, go over their head to get them deleted, or quit. If you're young and inexperienced at dealing with people, quit is probably the only option.

[@MadaraUchihaSecondRikudo]

Sure, but as an intern you're already scared shirtless about your performance and how the big scawwy seniors look at you, it takes experience to do these steps, both knowing to do them and having the courage to do them.

[@NoahSteckley]

Yeah generally my experience with lunatic superiors is being honest gets you fired, because… if they’re ridiculous people to that extent, they also aren’t interested in dialogue and improvement and honesty Peterson has a phrase “It’s not worth it to simply say ‘I’m going out in a blaze of glory’ if all that means is you burn yourself to a crisp, and someone carelessly comes by and sweeps up your ashes.” (You gotta have a smart pushback if you’re gonna push back otherwise you’re just playing a silly martyr game that doesn’t help you OR the company)

[@dandogamer]

@@NoahSteckley agree with this, talking to them just paints a target on your back best bet is just to go over the top of them. Unfortunately you have to play the politics sometimes

[@ericmclean4291]

Just ask questions anyway. You'll find a couple of people who aren't complete d*cks or people who are d*cks but will answer you questions. Also, some people that are burnt out are looking for any reason to put their focus elsewhere for a little while. Or you should take your questions directly to the manager.

[@Spoonbringer]

It's hard to know how that was phrased. When you're the senior person trying to hit a deadline it can be frustrating having a bunch of new people taking up all of your time asking a million questions. Maybe management wanted to head that off and encourage them to spend some time on the problem themselves before running to one of the senior people for help right away. Knowing when to ask for help (and how frequently) is something a lot of young people are often not good at. On the other hand, when they are more than doubling the team in that short of time that means they are either screwed or half the team just quit and management is trying to replace them.

[@patricksquires77]

For a year - I was getting extreme anxiety on things I could/should do better. It was gripping me - I was successful but had this feeling - so painful feeling failure - and my performance started getting called out and I was spiraling. My wife had me see a therapist for months. Some more Months later I was going blind… turns out I had a brain tumor. Had the tumor removed… that extreme anxiety was gone! Had a golf ball in my head on my pituitary. I feel I understand more what people go through. I also learned things about myself. Was wild/scary hard but that was a experience I had.

[@patricksquires77]

Just saw the 36 thumbs up - appreciated! People really do read comments!

[@enzito_sdf6978]

wow that's scary man, hope you're doing better now!

[@theideaofevil]

Holy shit bro, that's wild. Glad you made it through!

[@mjsagxy]

When I was at amazon I was coached not to ask or disturb others - solve it for myself. And then they bragged about working in small teams! No teamwork just individuals clustered around services. That was my experience for a year before I knew I had to walk.

[@kagame6524]

bro, this is my experience too. It's so soul sucking, esp when "teammates" eat lunch at their desks. Literally something that could be solved by working together in a few min, someone ends up spending all their time researching it to find out the same thing that someone else already knows. S/O to people who answer sage questions.

[@rontanamobay2154]

I found myself in this kind of situation right now. I never struggled through school, but my parents always had a rough time. During my senior year, me my parents ended up getting a divorce, and me and my dad had to move out. I wasn’t even aware that they were both addicted to drugs at the time. Now, i’ve basically failed out of my freshmen year of college. I’ve lost all of my scholarships and i have to get two jobs to support myself. I can’t stop smoking weed. I want to get better and change my situation. I just feel stuck. My dad doesn’t have a job and probably won’t get one and i’m stuck taking care of him. I appreciate the op for telling his story. i know no one will see this but i hope everything is well with you if you do!

[@jonnyjoker01]

I see you. Sorry to read that, I really hope life becomes better for you. Stay strong, things will change, they always do especially if you're aware of the problems.

[@vinylSummer]

Hey man, you'll make it! Stay strong 💪💪💪

[@CandyCaneChris]

Hey, I just saw this now. I hope you're doing alright. The biggest thing that helps me focus on dealing with the stuff is when someone told me "focus on what you can control." You can't control other peoples addiction, but you can keep yourself from following in their footsteps. Take care of him, but don't let that become your life. I don't know where you are in the world but in the USA there are groups like al-anon and they will know how you feel. You're not alone, and things will get better.

[@DavidHanks90]

You bring up Salesforce plugins... a buddy of mine left a 6 figure job that he had in downtown Chicago, moved back to UT where he is from, started a Salesforce plugin shop with a buddy of his and is making more than double than he was before. Going deep on a topic is not just real advice, or good advice, it's really good advice.

[@poprockssuck87]

My first six months as a developer, I was often tempted to quit, worrying that I might get fired. However, it didn't take long to see that the company had just as many shortcomings, and I had the excuse of inexperience for mine. This led me to change my attitude to "I'm not going to give up. If they want me gone, they'll have to fire me." This got me through it. The Dunning-Kruger effect also applies towards one's ability to accurately judge negative situations.

[@jl_117]

same same. I really thought I was the most incompetent guy on the team but my coworker eventually complimented how fast I was improving which had me confused

[@sarethdarva]

I like how you put that, that we can have Dunning-Krueger for judging our situations just as much as a skill. I’ll remember that next time I feel imposter syndrome (which is often)!

[@marektengler6033]

damn so accurate, 1 year in my junior position and i have feeling “they will fire me in any month” i am constantly afraid end of month

[@joaoph9391]

​@@marektengler6033just completed 1 year and got a raise, still think I'm getting fired at any moment

[@NoiseCommander3DS]

I was never able to shake off this feeling of being incompetent at work.

[@vsolyomi]

"OMG, I can eat!" - sooo relatable. Remember having no coins for the coffee machine because no cash at all. And no money for public transport to get back home. From work.

[@kokoinmars]

I am in a situation like this myself right now. I have just quit. I was working for an offshore team. I was frustrated by little things that would keep going wrong with staging or whatever. It sounds trivial now. I was angry at dealing with the bullshit and learning nothing in the process. Worse, I even self sabotaged a different job opportunity that would have let me leave this job, over some lunatic thoughts I developed towards the end. I thought that with this job behind me I will get back in touch with programming etc. I've spent the last 3 months doing nothing. Over the last 2 weeks I started learning rust. I really like it, but it's quite hard. And just the other day I had a nice interview with a startup looking for a JS dev. I feel a bit lucky that I stumbled across this video. It puts my recent experiences in perspective and I just do not want to repeat this experience again.

[@MagnumCarta]

Please take Prime's advice and go to bed (emphasis on go to bed) on a consistent schedule and at a reasonable hour. Try to also by extension get up each day at the same time. A lot of what you've experienced and described can be caused or at least greatly magnified by poor sleep health. I hope you have a good day and good luck in getting your next job!

[@PieterWigboldus]

It is good to have somebody near you, so you can manage it with others. Like at Amazon, if you have a Senior developer sitting near you, to mentor you, and your life will be a lot of easier.

[@anclaudys]

At Amazon, I had a senior developer who was intentionally giving me the wrong instructions and then calling me out in front of the whole group for doing things wrong (what he told me to do). I'm not saying it's an Amazon thing btw. But yeah. This is a new trend in this industry apparently.

[@PieterWigboldus]

@@anclaudys sad to hear

[@vsouza5000]

I'm glad he overcame all that. Prime and him definitely had it more difficult than most of us. The beginning is always the hardest. Everyone feels imposter syndrome. I also felt it, but fortunately for me, I knew impostor syndrome was a thing, so I just kept at it and studied more. I knew I wasn't great, but it was just a phase and it would come to an end. Also, thanks for the inspiration PrimeAgen.

[@slimjimjimslim5923]

I also think the key is between learning/doing enough to keep your job and stay relevant in the industry but not so much you forgot there's a life outside of company. That balance is hard to strike when management pressure you or you give yourself pressure or you don't actually know how much to work. Though I believe if you force yourself to get a hobby, have a partner, develop interest, then you will eventually know how much do you want to work vs how much do you want to develop socially. FYI I know really experienced engineers, expert reaching senior PE, 25+ year experience. But they seem to like working 12+hrs a day, 6 days a week, meeting at 11pm, 6am. Every project lead wants the person's opinion just to get confirmation the design is good. This isn't what most people want but for some it is their life.

[@anclaudys]

At Amazon, I had a senior developer who was intentionally giving me the wrong instructions and then calling me out in front of the whole group for doing things wrong (what he told me to do). I'm not saying it's an Amazon thing btw. But yeah. This is a new trend in this industry apparently.

[@keylanoslokj1806]

They are trying to eliminate what they feel is their competition

[@anclaudys]

@@keylanoslokj1806 it’s pathetic to be threatened by a noob wtf

[@goneator]

I had the same thing happen to me in a company a couple of years ago. Amazing how some people uses titles and positions to kill other people's motivation and spirit... Luckily now I could see just how bad of a programmer he was and how pathetic he was, I've worked with great people this couple of years and learned a lot, realy lucky and greateful.

[@MindfulTatiana]

This was one of your best streams. Thank you for this. It really helped me look back at some things I've been through and look at them a different way. And this was the advice I needed going forward.

[@itsmeben604]

Nailed it in so many ways on this one. Imagine what the world would be like if every engineer still had Prime's mindset.

[@tc2241]

You can be intense and passionate and not be an absolute a hole. It’s even worse when it’s an a hole on a power trip

[@faridguzman91]

cant have all three people are too confident in their bs

[@dvdonadelli]

Man, a lot happened in this video. There's a lot of advices and and emotions going on here Great video primeagen, as always.

[@youcefmoukeut6818]

I rarely comment, but I had to for this one. This video brought out so many emotions. It really calmed me to realize that most of our struggles are alike. Seeing the comments and discovering how many people face the same challenges, and how they’ve dealt with them, is such a great help. Thanks, man-great video, great KZbinr. ❤ P.S.: I will start using Vim. Eat shit VS Code!

[@MuhsinFatih]

wow. I've had the forgetfulness for a while after hitting huge rockbottoms in life and I genuinely thought I actually hurt my brain, minus I never did any drugs. It's really good to hear this kind of stuff and see that people do come back. I feel like I'm mostly back and in fact better in some aspects

[@tahamanna3600]

I just finished out the first 10 minutes of the video and want to say that primes video encouraged me so much to continue learning and developing my skill set, i really appreciate what the prime does to influence us and lighten the spark RESPECT

[@cprn.]

Move to any Eastern EU country (it's in some of the central EU countries culture as well). Everyone's an honest asshole and we still like and respect each other. Also, there was a study showing incrementing pay isn't what motivates employees the most - after you get a certain level of living where food, roof over your head, some savings and a decent vacation once a year stop being an issue, you need more than just a raise or free fruits in the office kitchen. You need regular challenges and the freedom to solve them however you want (it has to go in pair), you need your r&d time, and the last but not least, you need to see the results of your work positively impacting your workplace (or your business if you're your own boss).

[@bezimienny5149]

Where are you from?

[@cprn.]

@@bezimienny5149 Hehe, Spain. Ale zgadnij, gdzie teraz mieszkam. 😆

[@bezimienny5149]

@@cprn. już chyba wiem :) Jak długo?

[@cprn.]

@@bezimienny5149 18 lat minie w lutym, ja już miejscowy, Kraków, obwarzanki, maczanka, kumpir 😆

[@fasolplanetarium]

Sounds like this guy wasn't in a very healthy place to begin with. Amazon is indeed a very stressful environment. If you're not mentally and emotionally healthy, it will certainly break you. Hope he's doing better now.

[@AizakkuZ]

100%

[@NihongoWakannai]

Most people straight out of college are not in a good place mentally. They've been in school their whole life and everything has just been about studying for the next exam. They have no idea how to suddenly adapt to the working world. School sets people up for failure when it comes to attitude even if they have the knowledge.

[@Abdullah-vx3qv]

He's got 500k subscriber on KZbin

[@slimjimjimslim5923]

To be honest, toxic place will even wear out the healthiest person. That's how toxicity work and why careers like lawyer and doctor have the highest percentage of alcohol/drug addiction as well as depression/anxiety, right next to EMT and big city Police officiers.

[@fasolplanetarium]

@@Abdullah-vx3qv Great so even more stress 😆

[@Felice_Enellen]

Sounds like he had DPDR - de-personalization/de-realization. It's something that can happen when you spend too much time alone and in your own head. The real advice is to keep yourself from doing that. If you're going through a hard time, make sure you're making contact with the outside world every day. Literally go outside and touch grass, even if it's just with your feet. Getting grounded is the main way you keep yourself out of DPDR, and you don't want to get into it, because it's harder to get out of it than it is to avoid it.

[@Celastrous]

Really appreciate these real-talk videos, as someone who can relate quite a bit to what both you and the gentleman in the video went through.

[@kagame6524]

Had some issue with a lead engineer last year and I also almost started forgetting how to code simple stuff.. might be due to lack of sleep agonizing about the issues. A few breaks here and there helped stabilize myself again, but oof, this is some scary thing to go through. I feel NeetCode!

[@jacobleslie8056]

Love when you get real on vids. Something incredibly sincere and powerful when you talk about getting out of a shitty situation. Or maybe it just resonates cause I get it.

[@marna_li]

What makes software development hard is the human factor. Getting people together to find a common goal. And if you are looking for collaboration in software development, you might find that a lot of developer are very self-centered and do the minimal stuff needed. Not everyone is really motivated or interested in the field. A lot of devs just want to pick something from Jira, rather than communicating with people. And in some places you understand why. You want to do what you are best at, at the people around deciding what to develop are a distraction. Socialization is very much a distraction to many - especially in these times if remote work,

[@FirstName-hd7ss]

You right. It’s the First time I agree with a woman about development.

[@Ian-sm9uv]

Thanks for this one, primeagen. I burnt out hard early last year and have been slowly figuring my shit out since. It really helps to hear stories like these to know that I am definitely not alone in my experience.

[@pierreollivier1]

The LSD part really hits hard before getting into SWE after the army I felt empty, I once had a really horrible bad trip with LSD, alone in my room, and since then I can't really tell if I'm not dead, like I've no certainty, I'm now comfortable with the idea that I might be, because whether I'm dead or not, doesn't change the subjective experience I have to being alive, but early on it was hard to pull myself through the days not knowing,

[@ChristianWagner888]

You’re alive as you can’t post from the grave. Jesus said: “I am the Way, the Truth and the Life”. He is the source of life. If you feel dead on the inside, it’s because you do not know Him yet. I have been made alive by getting to know Him. Start to get to know Him by reading the Gospel of John and you will find life-affirming and life-changing words. I would not be alive anymore if I had not taken His words to heart.

[@aybmab2]

God damn it Prime, the honesty and transparency you put out there is insane and so appreciated. Thanks for the content man - can't stress how much it helps me in my day to day.

[@progpogs]

"Go through emotionally difficult things and not crack" - for how long? Is cracking quitting? I left AWS after 7 years, and my mental was definitely fucked up, it took a lot from my life and changed me. I actually wish I "cracked" sooner and moved onto new opportunities with my experience. Also when you are saying the manager is like "you don't have to do that" etc- at Amazon they might say that so you stay, and they can use you for unregretted attrition.

[@rewazilol]

This video had me crying. Thank you so much to both of you guys for sharing.

[@LordOfElm]

Damn, Amazon's agile retro's are hardcore. On a serious note, this entire video was incredibly relatable. Spend years and thousands of dollars to get educated, and then fail, especially in your first job, it's a hugely stressful issue. It's not just being poor, it's being poor **and** in debt. Combined with a complete loss of confidence in what you just spent all that money and time earning. This dude managed to work through his issues and that is impressive on every level. There are a lot of great life lessons here. College sucks. Pushing through challenges will always make you a better person, but not necessarily a happier one. Just because you loose your path does not mean you can never find your way back. Don't do (too many) drugs. Have a routine. Just to name a few.

[@lancemusashi6368]

Loved this comment

[@TheMagnus156]

I can relate to the room layout take so much as a single guy. I invested in a very decent apartment and money isn't an issue at all but getting the furniture and decorating stuff is just such an hassle and unnecessary thing to do for me. I'd rather do something else even in my free time than shop for stuff. This guys chair and cupboard are way better than mine. Id should get a decent chair instead of random ikea kitchen chair. It does it's job tho.

[@SirSomnolent]

When I got my first corporate job I bought a house (back when people could do that) that was way too big for me. There was my motorcycle, mountain bike in the living room and a chin up bar and a couch I slept on. TV in one room on floor with an xbox. Didn't use any of the other rooms. House got cleaned every month or so when my sister visited and was like, "what the hell is this". I miss those days

[@Rohinthas]

Honestly, you do you and all. I noticed that life started to feel better for me, when the space I was inhabiting felt like it was an extension of the better aspects of myself. I know its not like that for everyone, but I strongly project myself on my space and if the room looks and feels soulless or dirty I start to feel that way too, so I gotta put up paintings I like, plants, even build my own furniture (it looks crappier than if I bought something nice, but it looks exactly how I envisioned it). To each their own though

[@Slavolko]

If you're at the computer at all, definitely invest in a good chair. I got an Aeron for myself, but you can get other ones, like the Steelcase Think.

[@sdstorm]

The wise way to look at these behemoths is not to say "I'm sure Amazon is horrible." In fact, it's basically impossible to talk about these huge organizations in such simplistic terms. In my experience, the only thing that matters is the team, not the company.

[@CardinalHijack]

0:49 its very easy to say "better to work for people who will speak directly to your face" till you work with someone, or for someone, who speaks directly to your face. It can make your life hell, and if the "directness" is about something subjective, you will quickly lose interest and deteriorate. It can also be jaring to work with someone who lacks social skills and speaks directly because of it. The correct, realistic answer is a balance. You want someone who is nice and understands social interactions but will be honest to you (nicely) when needed.

[@Someonedoingnothing]

I always hate hearing things like "we all have to do." No we don't. We don't have to be fake dishonest people. We choose to out of convenience and social pressure. Nothing irks me more than this notion that we just "have" to do these fake things. Personally I've stopped, and never felt better. Sure, I burned a flimsy fake friendship or two, but atleast now I know that when I make a friend, or develop any type of relationship with someone whether it be business or personal, it is a result of who I actually am, not the phony person I used to pretend to be.

[@JayDee-b5u]

Hear hear.

[@dave4148]

Meanwhile I'm more offended by the assumption we all constantly think negative about our peers. I for sure don't. This says more about your issues than you think

[@AizakkuZ]

@@dave4148Yep exactly.

[@NihongoWakannai]

​@@dave4148 exactly this. If you think everyone being nice is just fake, you're the issue. Corporate talk and toxic politeness ARE issues, but we can still be respectful and nice to others. Lots of people like to think they're "just being honest" when really they're being too lazy to consider the feelings of others in how they phrase things.

[@sahil9146]

Agreed with the comfort stuff you mentioned. Every time in my career I've worked on shitty projects or worked with shitty orgs. But I make sure I always push through the project to completion. I think there is something about your mental resilience when you quit after you've had a good win rather than quitting through difficulty. It builds character and makes you a stronger person

[@JackDespero]

Depression is such a hard thing, especially because people do not understand you. How would they understand when you do not understand it yourself? You know rationally what is happening, that your brain is low on neurotransmitors, that making that phone call, or going to that appointment or literally writting that line of code or that comment on your thesis is a 1 minute task. And somehow, you would rather get shot in the leg than do any of those things. And anxiety is a similar case: I have a good life, I have finantial stability, I am relatively smart, I have a phd. I have so many things going on for me. Why do I have this constant feeling of impending doom? I once thought that something bad (but not terribly bad, just bad) had happened. In 10 seconds at most, I went from something bad had happened, this will lead to this, to that, then I will have to do this, and it all end up with me being expelled from the country and destituted, considering doing something to myself. In ten seconds I went from reality to delulu land in which I was about to do something terrible to myself in the near future because I ruined my life. Why? Because I thought I had missed a healthcare related payment of $15. It turned out that I had paid it, but I forgot to mark it as paid. So literally nothing happened, but in 10 seconds I ruined my week and cried so much. These are things that cannot be just "pushed throught" many times. Something is physiologically broken in your brain and you need time and therapy to recover, even prescription drugs, just like you would need help to recover from a broken leg.

[@KingBobXVI]

8:30 - To be honest, if I'm in the senior engineer's position here, a better thing for the manager to do would be to take me off tickets for a few sprints to help ramp up the newbies. Going back to basics, not being on a mega time crunch, and teaching would be a great palette cleanser after a string of burnout sprints. Of course, we all know what would actually happen - you'd get the training responsibilities, but also still get tickets to do in the meantime.

[@Charlie-pt1ks]

You're wrong about everyone being the same on the inside and nice people being fake. You have a very corporate perspective.

[@samuelodan2376]

Wasn’t that a hypothetical situation or did I miss something?

[@Charlie-pt1ks]

@@samuelodan2376 he posited that everyone 'nice' puts up a facade, then presented the choice between people being nice & fake or genuine & mean with the presumption that what he posited is true. it isn't, it's stupid, and it's very corporate. also not what a hypothetical is because he presented this as fact and not a theory. the hypothetical he presented was about the office setting, and that was still based on his flawed logic.

[@razzle8140]

Yeah, that's pretty dark

[@hansfrans761]

The video and your response to it are probably some of the best early career advice for people whore are not morally bankrupt. Highly recommend this and at some points of the video I felt flashbacks to my own situation some years back

[@Chris-qb6lb]

1:00 very neutral framing of the question lol. Personally, while douchebags always exist, I think the polite lie is useful in reigning in the prevalence and opportunities of such douches. There are people who are genuinely more sensitive. Douchebags will always reside in any population because they genuinely don't care, but if a population is more douchey, more sensitive people will self-select out of that group. So, if you want your company to have less talent, definitely encourage your douches. (Of course there are times to have tough conversations, and it's totally possible to have heated debate that is impersonal, but if your culture is "Don't be too sensitive," then that's obviously not the bulk of what you'll reap.)

[@anariesjourney]

I will listen to you along the way I'm coding, not because of the tips and the sayings you have in your content, because you exactly know what it feels like when you're down and what drugs do to the brain and body :) , wish that I had a pal like you that could talk about life more and more and also learn from each other . so thanks for standing up once again for yourself and for the ones who follow you 🤟🏻

[@mohamedaityoussef9965]

27:01 i love you prime, you push me to be a better dev and a better person

[@ThatOneRightThere]

Great motivation for us devs going through the ruck of life. Glad communities like these are here to keep us focused on the right track. Thank you, keep up the good work!

[@Dan-codes]

My mentor has a killer resume, including 1 year at Amazon. He said it was miserable and that after 1 year, he was in the top 50% of seniority, which is when he quit.

[@qoup22]

thank you for posting this content and doing what you do. I hardly ever post, your content is helping me with the rut I'm in and can relate to a lot of things you touch on.

[@sharkysharkerson]

I don't think people worry as much about working with intense people as they are about working with combative people. Intensity can be contagious. Different perspectives can help us get around our own internal biases. It's the combative side that makes work shit. I'm not going to fight with people who are adamant about the wrong path. There's too many idiots who believe they understand more than they do, it'll just mean fighting all the time and promoting the bullies. If people really want to fight me because they want to do something stupid, natural consequences will do a better job teaching them than I ever would.

[@synterlu]

Honestly you two are such an inspiration to me, I've struggled my whole life but I'm not giving up. If something, I'm stronger than ever. Thank you both for your honesty.

[@kinuthiasteve4505]

Thanks for this Primeagen. My first job was an internship as a data analyst, first 1 month i had not delivered anything. I felt sick with anxiety every standup. Coming from SQL the db was NoSQL, i wanted to quit soo bad, but I knew if i push through because working in construction was terrible i needed to change my life. TLDR: i managed to make live dashboards for marketing and c-lev executives. Currently am developing software (python and bootstrap)for my church after hearing the rev say he was going to use a spreadsheet to store records. All thanks to finding Jesus it's not a real tech job but it's a start.

[@zacharypoorman1067]

I appreciate the transparency and honesty. Been watching you for a while and this video confirmed some things I had come to conclusions of. Thank you for being honest, giving good advice, and following God. Appreciate you a ton.

[@TJackson736]

Moving on in the software field is just so different from my original field.

[@AWildLukeAppeared]

Thank you prime for doing the real work out here.... making us all feel better about our shitty rooms and the fact we have mattresses on our floor. Real fckin talk!

[@quadmasterXLII]

Before you say "It's not that bad, he should have been stronger, he's weak, he's never experienced hardship life's an RPG" consider that amazon might be different from other stressful situations. People unpredictably come out of there with severe mental illness, even if they've survived hardship before, even if they're tough.

[@quadmasterXLII]

Some things that were less stressful than working at amazon: taking care of a newborn gradschool taking care of a newborn and gradschool at the same time fleeing from an active shooter in a foreign country Travelling for hours over gravel roads with a dislocated kneecap It's not any specific thing, I can't nail it down. The culture there just rips apart the psyche and leaves you feeling like you're the problem. I'd still believe I was the problem if I didn't have stories from others who went through the same thing there. People who work there but can't feel it will agressively shit on you for being affected by it, even after you leave. I think that's part of it.

[@AizakkuZ]

Yeah Primeagon for some reason has the belief that it’s more about the individual than the individual’s circumstances

[@noornasri5753]

I completely disagree with "stick with it so you can become resilience" - if that is the ONLY reason you're doing it, you're just suffering. Some people push through horrible situations and end up with a survivor bias - it's completely unreasonable. My gf tried to "push through" an extremely toxic company where the boss yelled at everyone daily, and even after a year it still affects her. While she was there, I would tell her to quit while older adults had that mentality. "You are just starting out, it is normal to get yelled at. It's okay, you'll get more resilient this way. This way you can learn." Yes, sometimes in life you MUST push through. I once had a horrible semester - 4 days before a statistics exam with a 0% of the marks or knowledge, 85% final exam. Of course I should have avoided this situation, but I ended up here while pushing through a super heavy project course where you have a partner (except mine would go MIA, so I pretty much lived at Uni for one course). I needed to pass, so I ended up watching 40 hours of lecture in one sitting then going to the exam and getting 70%. However, I did this because failing the course would have cost me a year and an internship. There was reason to push through, and I did indeed become more resilient from this. Now that I'm working, if my employer was unreasonable - I would just switch jobs. I have NO problem pushing myself. However, every time you push yourself you put a strong mental strain - an employer that doesn't value you is not worth it. Sometimes you put it behind you, and sometimes it affects you. Don't run away from a challenge, but don't push yourself for a company that makes you question your worth.

[@Dev-fo8zt]

As a single software engineer my bedroom is a bed on the floor with a close basket, my home office on the other hand.....

[@Funpreet333]

Recently subscribed to you @ThePrimeTime. I am going through some physical & mental stressors currently while preparing for a job change and had been procrastinating for a few days. I am not very good with Algo/DS and resume has average companies so have been getting quite a few rejections just based on the resume which added to the stress. Just an hour before , I was with a psychiatrist and she validated my strategy of taking things slow and I was planning to continue the same. But this video and your general vibe hit me so I am going to go back leetcode today and hopefully can keep this up. Thank you.

[@AaronBrooks0321]

Ill NEVER understand quitting a job because you think you're going to get fired, and maybe its just a survival thing. Even if you are going to get fired collect as many checks as possible and stay eligible for unemployment while looking for a new job. Jobs can suck, but NO tech job sucks more than being broke

[@joaoph9391]

That was my mentality,if they made a mistake by hiring me, at least give me my severance package, not fired yet

[@randomuserame]

As someone who once ended up broke and homeless after quitting a shitty job. I very much disagree. They're rare, but there _are_ jobs that are worse than being homeless.

[@croissantwrenchn]

This right here is why I absolutely love your video and find so much inspiration and motivation through the stuff you preach about. Your story is something that is relatable to mine, being able to give me hope in myself. My first couple decades of life I believed I was meant to be a nobody and just be a loser ass bum all my life with no purpose but you are helping me redefine my purpose and give me a lot of hope. I appreciate you and your content. Keep it up man, you’re killing it

[@tusharsharma590]

Came for programming, stayed for life advice!

[@ChrisSkene]

Counterpoint: do not burn yourself out in an unpleasant software engineering environment. Recovering from burnout comes at your own cost, takes time, and can leave you with maladaptive coping mechanisms. Managers know this, so they try to suck as much value out of you until you break or leave. This guy made a good decision by getting out early.

[@BrazenNL]

Dutch Directness. Yes, we're proud of it, too.

[@Titere05]

"The experienced devs are a little burnt out, so don't ask questions. That way they have to fix your shit in addition to doing their job. That'll probably help them"

[@Scizzzor]

I am not from America, but how come from "We are poor, I want to help family so we can eat". Into "I am just sitting in my home chewing LSD like tictac"? Are housing and drugs so affordable?

[@Cowboydjrobot]

It’s a very “tech bro” hustle culture, Ayn Rand kind of mindset to even consider whether it is better to be productive or nice as of there is ever a reason that you can’t be both. The only reason people choose to interact without kindness is if they lack the intelligence or skills to communicate with kindness.

[@daltonyon]

I can't imagine enter in a team and not asking questions, in my team there's a new guy, we pass the code, how to debug and dev should try to understand how things work! Sometimes pain moments build us more strong, so I like ppl struggles to understand how things work and the result is that many people grow up a lot!!

[@JaredHatesGames]

Thank you for sharing this man, a lot of people out there who are going through similar situations.

[@NihongoWakannai]

11:00 i completely disagree and think this is a dangerous take. Especially when you say "I feel bad for those who crack" but actively encourage people to go into situations that are likely to crack them. That's a horribly irresponsible thing to encourage. If you want to be physically strong, you need to do progressive overload where you slowly increase the weights you lift. If you take on too much weight at once, you just destroy your body and get long term if not permanent injuries. The same goes for life, you can't just tell people "oh you're in a bad situation? Just learn to deal with it!" If a situation is too extreme, people are just going to come away with mental health issues and trauma. You SHOULD quit things if they are too extreme for you, otherwise you will become a broken person. Go find a challenge in life that is suited for your current level of progress. I had to spend YEARS overcoming the mental health issues caused by extreme workload and stress. That did NOT make me a better person, it was just a waste of my limited lifespan. What did make me a better person was slow and steady progress. You're spreading a dangerous "sink or swim" mindset as if jumping in the deep end is the ONLY way to improve your life when it's not.

[@matthamende6359]

20 years doing IT, still haven't found a shop that isn't some degree of actively burning, for years I thought I was going to eventually find a company that just had it's shit together, at best I found a fairly stable company that I've been able to stay at for the last 5 years with still enough challenge to keep me interested, but feeling like I can logoff at 5pm when things aren't on fire.

[@lhcunha1]

3:00 I'm laughing my ** off😂😂

[@policyprogrammer]

Intel, in its heyday, used to make everyone take training in "constructive confrontation," which was all about being direct and a bit combative, but also being able to resolve conflicts and move on. It was kind of an intense place to work, but you can't argue that it was ineffective. I don't know if they still do that.

[@briankgarland]

Focus in on what you are hating about the job then laser focus in on that until you conquer it. Then quit, if you must. But defeat your challenges, don't run from them.

[@davidlwatsonjr]

The fact that you analyzed this guy's life based on the background literally RIGHT after I'd just done the same thing (including the, oh, his bed's off the ground, must have his shit together kinda, but it's still a twin...) made me laugh unreasonably hard.

[@briandawley7808]

The whole, "Being put in a hard situation," thing... yes, 100000%. Some people are just very gifted and are never pushed beyond what they feel they're capable of. So when they encounter that situation where they're suddenly challenged, they fold. I'd rather take the person who's overcome challenge after challenge after challenge, struggled and endured, and live to fight another day, than the one who just floats through life. At some point, everyone will encounter something that is above them, that is hard, that is more challenging than they've ever encountered, and you need to know whether the person you have working for you is one who will persist and fight and gnash and just tackle that challenge, or one who's going to crumble. I want the fighter. I don't care how gifted you are. If you're scrappy, I know you're going to make it.

[@wadecodez]

Mental health is no joke. I went through psychosis around the same time. I blame it on working with AI while working in quarantine. The fact that my brain turned on me without me knowing is the scariest thing that I’ve ever experienced. If your job sucks you should communicate that to someone otherwise you keep internalizing your emotions to the point where the brain won’t know which world to operate in. Know what existential questions are. If you are questioning reality you’re probably experiencing mild psychosis.

[@superitgel1]

Was afraid of getting fired, so to prevent that quit..? Brilliant! They can't fire if you quit 😆

[@Slashx92]

It's more like "because of the reasons I think they will fire me, it means I should not be here"

[@dontbreaktheshadowofmylove]

most people are missing that the bedding, his shirt and the mic are all predominantly shades of blue and the side table can be considered a complementary color of wood, against floor and walls that look like they're a neutral grey. this dude has infinites amounts of swag more than most of us

[@brightsausage4851]

"Stick with it" is true until it isn't. Sometimes you need thicker skin, sometimes your company genuinely isn't respecting your time and expertise and you would be better someplace else. Telling the difference is genuienly difficult but you have to move on from that if you're feeling guilty. Learn from your mistakes and move forward.

[@brightsausage4851]

Also send those applications while you still have a job lmao

[@somenameidk5278]

agree, you can't fix the people around you by just working harder. i feel like prime kinda conflated personal problems like addiction and social problems like a toxic work culture.

[@sadboijesse]

as an individual stuggling right now through a lot of shit that life is throwing atm, thank you! makes me feel less alone

[@hld3738]

15:21 My new ringtone

[@joshuasansom_software]

This has to be one of the most relatable and enjoyable streams you have ever done. Love it.

[@lessmoneylessproblems5145]

My respect for neetcode has gone up,even more

[@SvetlinNikolovPhx]

I never saw a person become really good when their goal was making money. In our industry when everyone is in danger of being replaceable, a person without any passion and only motivated by climbing the ladder, either becomes the best example of a replaceable colleague, or worse - the person who replaces colleagues. Programming is a tool for a purpose, not the purpose, and money is a side effect. If you invest enough effort into getting better at solving problems and building your dream project, you would never worry about money, you would be very much needed.

[@PiyushSharma12479]

I took a wife to lift the bed🤣🤣

[@CottidaeSEA]

I don't want nice, warmhearted people around me. I want people who know how to solve problems. If I have a problem and I go to someone else, I don't need compassion, I need to have the problem fixed and I can't do it myself. I'll deal with the emotional stuff nicely on my own.

[@liquidmetal718]

Solving problems and having a good attitude are mutually exclusive. It's probably not the first time a problem is being solved, someone else might have already solved it before. So, would you want to work with a jerk , to ask for help or explain some design or trade arguments about a decision ? If you are already stressed out work or some oncall thing or etc, do you want burden yourself with other people's toxicity ? Most probably not.

[@CottidaeSEA]

@@liquidmetal718 Just because you're not acting nice and compassionate doesn't mean you act like an asshole.

[@kooraiber]

Solving problems and not being an insufferable cunt are not mutually exclusive.

[@robertluong3024]

lol I want nice people around me because they're reliable and trusting. I've been around jerk problem solvers and they suck. It makes coming to work tougher and they never take feedback well. They don't want to write tests. They're a pain and after you work with them a while, I truly don't believe they're THAT much better. Software is a collaborative effort nowadays. It's weird to say otherwise.

[@CottidaeSEA]

@@robertluong3024 Sounds more like those jerk problem solvers weren't good enough at solving problems. I've instead had too much niceties where the whole world is promised to me, then nothing happens or gets worse. I'd rather have someone fix the problem.

[@steveneastman3349]

This was powerful, powerful stuff. I appreciate this on so many levels. Thanks Prime for sharing

[@BrunoPassos1999]

It seems like the guy shot himself on the food due to personal flaws. I think it's more of him being mentally unwell and not using his opportunities.

[@asdqwe4427]

Having 50% new grads and 50% seniors is just the dumbest idea. They can often not even understand each other. You need some intermediate people there

[@Chag69420]

The only reason he has a matching sheet and pillowcase is because they came in the same package off the shelf.

[@randyriegel8553]

I've been a software engineer for over 20 years. I think sometimes substances help 😁 I've solved some of my biggest problems in code in the evenings when I was high on pot or half drunk. I thought outside the box and it worked. I haven't touched acid in many years.

[@Rohinthas]

Dawg, this was surprisingly raw, never went to the place he went, but this shit is still relatable and humbling...