Ilyas ibn Qabisa: Muhammad of 7th c., an 'Elijah complex'?

Mel introduces the Muhammad of the 7th century, commonly known as Ilyas ibn Qabisa, yet, whose name 'Ilyas' is the equivalent to that of the Biblical 'Elijah'.
He traces this Muhammad using a number of Christian and Jewish sources from the 7th century, but suggests that this 'Ilyas' had to be discarded by the later Abbasids and replaced with their 8th-9th century Muhammad because the earlier Muhammad not only had an official name which in Arabic meant "My God is Yahweh", the God of the Jews and Christians, but because he didn't have the same character as their later prophet.
Watch as Mel unpacks yet another aspect of this 7th century Muhammad, better known as Ilyas ibn Qabisa.
© Pfander Centre for Apologetics - US, 2020
(43,460) “inspiring”, by Rafael Krux (from-filmmusic-io - License CC BY)

[@amirthamalex1021]

Mel has a chiesled a permanent wedge in the holly narrative and smith is hammering it home in our mind and hearts. Great. Please take care. Our prayers are with you.

[@gilbertjones9157]

Interesting, names Chiesler, Chiesling, Chiesl; Wedging, Wedgeler, Wedgy; Smithy, Smither ..... LOL .... Sorry I could not resist. Good Job Mel, you have shook the Palm tree and it is raining sweet dates.

[@saotome6502]

Nice Analogy 👍

[@vivian4949]

One of my uncle's had very bad epilepsy which killed him at 47, when Jay Smith described how Mohammed would all of a sudden froth at the mouth etc it very much reminded me of my uncle.

[@gilbertjones9157]

Classic antiquity thinking equated epilepsy seizures with being touched by the gods. Julius C and Alexander were afflicted. If IIya was we don't know but this may have be borrowed to fill the story. Of note, is that IIya story has him being the son of parents of a mixed ethnic marriage within groups that practiced consanguineous marriage which do bring out genetic defects. Cousin marriages were also practiced by Roman elites while Alexander's parents were also a mixed ethnic marriage but were from 'high born' families that would also marry in the family. It also known that mental disturbance is associated with close family linge.

[@steviedfromtheflyovercount4739]

Sorry for your loss. God Bless.

[@vivian4949]

@@steviedfromtheflyovercount4739 ......Thank you so much Steve.

[@stephengilchrist3606]

Mel is fantastic. Very good to hear that Muhammad is a false prophet. And that the real "Muhammad was a Christian, who's name was Ilyas (Elijah), which has the name of the true God YHWH. God bless you Mel. Excellent work as always 😂👌🏾

[@kevinexmuslim1396]

I always had my feelings about Islam that something fishy and hidden going on , on this cult because Muslim scholars don’t want you know and their slogan is don’t ask and obey blindly.

[@alanmcnaughton3628]

I have no idea why Jay doesn't pull this file out of the draw, it's been known about for over half a century. archive.org/stream/HowTheVaticanCreatedIslam/How-the-Vatican-Created-Islam_djvu.txt

[@rizikiriyani7414]

Said a guy having jesus as profile pic

[@kevinexmuslim1396]

@@rizikiriyani7414 you are sad but I’m pride , you better go and worship your god BAAL abdull

[@rizikiriyani7414]

@@kevinexmuslim1396 you talk about the things you don't know, you believe in things that you can't know.

[@kevinexmuslim1396]

@@rizikiriyani7414 I talk about your cult I know very well because I was one of you for 45 years and Jesus saved me with love that you as Muslim don’t understand what love is bcz Mohamad never thought you about love but killing and lie

[@michaelnwachukwu]

The moment they said "don't ask questions" For any discerning and intelligent mind, that alone crumbles the whole pack of cards they stacked, to protect the falsehood.

[@terezin199]

there is a channel called Inquisitive Mind, witch explores 6e century sources about Mohammad. but he doesn't talk to not give away his identity, as he is from an islamic country.

[@andrewtham8093]

Thanks Jay and Mel. Your discussions about the historicity of early Islam have strengthened my faith in Jesus Christ, Lord and Son of God.

[@commentfreely5443]

he who has ears to hear, let him see.

[@marleyfan1000]

@@commentfreely5443 bruh *hear

[@turackaraca4354]

buddy ure asian... believing in a middle eastern and western religion. 😅

[@harrymuurling2742]

I was waiting for this again. Great video again, again and again, break down this beast system.

[@pharsight8928]

Magnificent work , thank you for you time and effort.

[@Matthew-pw3ng]

After finally getting to watch this and being able to hear, there are many hadiths in sunnah that mohammad said he had been given the keys to the treasures of the world, so this first thing is true. Thank you for finding it.

[@MultiMark2]

Again, the man from tayayye still giving us trouble

[@Scorpionking_2024]

Excellent Thank you soooooo much for such a insight May God bless you both more and more That’s the end of fake Islam and it’s fake prophet

[@salamfouad249]

LeoIII Message to the The Umayyad Caliph 'Omar Ibn Abd-Al Aziz' : ((It was Abū Turāb and Salmān the Persian who composed that book (“your Furqan”), even though the rumour has got around among you that God sent it down from the heavens.…As for your [Book], you have already given us examples of such falsifications and one knows among others of a certain Hajjāj, named by you as governor of Persia, who had men gather your ancient books, which he replaced by others composed by himself according to his taste and which he disseminated everywhere in your nation, because it was easier by far to undertake such a task among a people speaking a single language. From this destruction, nevertheless, there escaped a few of the works of Abū Turāb, for Hajjāj could not make them disappear completely)). The question that arises is: Who is 'Abu Turab' whom Emperor Leo accuses of composing the Qur’an? Is Abu Turab a second name for Iyas Ibn Qabisa, or is he the person of Imam Ali bin Abi Talib - Muhammad’s cousin according to the standard narrative? Or all those three are one person : Iyas ibn Qabisa?

[@MrDhinkson1]

Iirc in a previous video Mel said it was Ali.

[@FourApramanas]

Well done to Mel for investigating and bringing the matter forward as yet another source for “Muhammad”. Regarding the Mishnaic passage Edduyot 8:7, from Rabbi Joshua concerning Elijah, in Jewish understanding, it refers to reversing the situation of those who were forcibly brought near and/or forcibly put away, thus reversing a previously forced or coerced situation.

[@scp3178]

Nice intro music. Hi Jay, nice to see you again.

[@houseofsaudisthebeast]

this is amazing

[@mhorram]

Boy, talk about getting a Christmas present early! Who says history is boring? This discovery of Mel's is definitely worth further serious research and I hope it gets it. Mel I don't know whether the following has any bearing on how you view your overall analysis but I thought I would bring it up. Regarding changing the name to hide the origin and 'nomen est omen' as it relates to this new monotheism that was arising; I immediately thought of the first bringer of monotheism, Amenhotep IV, (Peace of Amon IV) who changed his name to Akhenaten (Effective for Aten). There is pretty good evidence from what I remember that Akhenaten not only worshipped a single god but he was trying, bit by bit, to remove the power of the priests of the old pantheon thereby supplanting the old pantheon with only one god, Aten (Jay, you might find this interesting, linguists claim that the proper pronunciation of this god's name is Yah-Ten. I have to wonder if Yahweh is a linguistic variant of this name. Moses, as a prince of Egypt may be more revelatory to the story of Exodus than we know.) Anyway, it is obvious the name Akhnaten is an example of 'nomen est omen' as this Pharaoh was quite effective in bringing about his new religion AND it seems likely that he was up to the same activity as Ilyas would be; meaning, if he got rid of all the old deities, there would still be the problem of his birth name, Amenhotep. That had to be hidden or there would be questions in future generations. The Ilyas 'deception' seems to be of the same ilk. In any case, Akhnaten may have been effective in starting his religion; but he totally failed to secure its future. Even Akhnaten's son Tutankhaten (Living Image of Aten) changed his name to Tutankhamun (Living Image of Amun) when he ascended the throne. Tutankhamun started the road back to the old religion and his successor, Ai, who was a priest in Akhnaten's religion carried on that endeavour. It seems that Islam did a much better job of hiding its origins and covering up the name changes that would show the narrative of its early history had holes.

[@Speakers154]

Very cool observation there. Thanks for that!

[@thetruthisbetter1339]

1There was a woman named Amna bint Wahab she married Abdullah ibn Abd al-Muttalibtheu, they had a son called Qathem but there's a twist in this marriage. Abdullah ibn Abd al-Muttalib died and Qathem was born 4 years after his father's death. Aminah was accused of adultery and the family never excepted Qathem. The family say there was a man called waraqa he was having affair with Aminah because everywhere Qathem went waraqa was with him. One day Qathem went missing everyone thought Qathem had been kidnapped they looked for him, they found him he was playing with waraqa...when waraqa died Muhammad tried to commit suicide. They say waraqa got his sister to sleep with Abdullah so he wouldn't have time to sleep with Aminah. Sadly Qathem mother died and he was shifted around by his family At 24 he met and married khadija. One day Qathem went into a cave he saw a man, the man squeezes Qathems hand 3 times and says read, 3 times Qathem said I cant read. Qathem runs out of the cave crying shaking keeps running until he gets home and tells his wife khadija that he's seen the devil up in the cave, Qathem was hiding under a blanket shaking with fear, khadija asks what as happened? Qathem couldn't stop crying and shaking shouting IT WAS THE DEVIL, i have seen the devil in the the cave! khadija took Qathem to a relative called waraqa and it was he who said it was gabriel not the devil...khadija and waraqa persuaded Qathem that its was gabriel and he is a prophet. Was Qathem right? was it the devil? After all satan did put words in Muhammads mouth! Muhammad recited Surat-an-Najm from satan, chapter 53 of the qur'an.

[@quentinschmierer9171]

Loved the riff on "interesting names". I had an experience at the Mayo Clinic once with names. I was in for an office visit and while waiting for my appointment I noticed a chart on the wall that listed the doctors who were "in" and those who were doing surgery that day. Listed under the surgeons for the day were Dr's Harm, Payne and Slaughter. Needless to say, I was thankful not to be having surgery that day. Fortunately Dr. Croak (yes) was available in his office - if you survived the surgery.

[@pa21thebeast]

Christian Prince has said many times the Islamic sources are very clear that Muhammad cannot be his real name, but I don’t know if there’s any hint to the name being Iyas (which in itself is telling as it means something given in place of something else). Along with ibn (son) of Qab-isa, a conjunction of the Qaba and Isa. Iyas being Ilyas in the 6th century is kind of unsupported. I was watching a video by Christian Prince about the Sabeans and how their Sidra Rba is likely the foundation for the Quran, including how early Islam source have Muhammad being called a Sabean. It makes sense that the early islamic army’s that defeated the Sassanians tried to unify (tawheed) the religions to fight under one banner, but due to internal conflict the Arabs took over because they had the strength and became more hostile towards the Jews and christians. Then as Islam matured it took on more pagan and sabbean practices to distance itself from the Byzantine. Even the Islamic sources are clear that the sabbeans and pagans were more open to Islam, and eventually they would be the ones that form the early Muslim communities. It would make sense that they made up the foot soldiers that latter revolted against the Jews and Persians in the battle of Hira, which was likely a coup involving Iyas ibn Qabisah. The islamic practices formed within the trenches as soldiers of different faiths were interacting. Ironically, the battle of Hira, where Iyas Ibn Qabisah fell, happened around the time profit Muhammad died like you guys mentioned, which could be a symbolic death. Also around the same time of the Islamic conquest of Petra (conquest of Mecca), which might be symbolic of the unification under a banner before Iyas is overthrown. Petra would have been very important to the Arabs because it was so diverse, so even if Iyas wasn’t from there he would be adopted as a native son due to his conquests. Iyas then becomes a folk legend because he was the one that brought Islam together (regardless of if he was eventually the antagonist), and the latter leaders attach theirselves to that legacy. The Quran could easily be the sayings of Iyas who was trying to unify his troops by using religious texts of his soldiers and after he dies those soldiers, most of whom were pagan and Sabeans, compiled those moral speeches together to form the written Quran, which would explain the lack of tact in its text and the traditions about how they were rushing to compile the Quran together. All of that becomes the backbone for the seerah, which was largely influenced by his soldiers trying to make him lower and more relatable to theirselves, but later scholars both later trying to dignify him, and have potentially real stories that were embarrassing. They also added the concept that it was Allah speaking and Muhammad reciting. The Quran does not read like that or say that of itself. It reads like it was meant to be second person retelling accounts of a sermon or pep speech to a group .

[@Chociewitka]

RE: "battle of Hira, where Iyas Ibn Qabisah fell" Are you sure he did fall there? Is it certain he has not taken captive and forced to give legitimation (provided with drugs and women to placate him and oversee him, but beyond that doing Umar and Abu Bakrs biding) to the nascent Umayyads?

[@pa21thebeast]

@@Chociewitka possibly but I’m not sure of what your reference for that would be. If he was upheld as this heroic figure, then was taken captive and coerced, that would likely be seen as falling to his supports (symbolic of defeat or death). I found it interesting that the Islamic traditions suggest he was not respected much in his death, which seems to me he didn’t actually die at that time but was disgraced. It seems there’s a lot of intentional confusion about his death that would suggest a conflict between earlier sources that wanted him to be truthful and later sources that wanted to glorify him. His death has always seemed like a coverup.

[@pa21thebeast]

I also suggest that the fact that Islam adopted so many pagan and sabbean practices suggests that when the Quran refers to polytheists it’s not talking about pagans in general, it’s talking about those that refused to unify and join under the banner of Islam (submission).

[@Chociewitka]

@@pa21thebeast And the narrative when he is being showed as a curiosity while in his trance. And the instances when Umar forces him to have a revelation to his dictation. And the way he is being dragged along when sick. Or when he is denied pen and parchment at his deathbed. And completely ignored several decades after his death by his succesors....

[@pa21thebeast]

@@Chociewitka yeah those are all good examples. Along with your theory it seems beyond just being disgraced, his death might be symbolic to his successors taking over while using his legacy and support to form the caliphate. Maybe the Hadith about him feeling like his aorta was cut (which would mean he lied in the name of Allah in the Quran) was a remnant to his failed prophecy about taking over the world. As pointed out in the debate with David wood the later scholars seemed to find particular issue with that.

[@nihilonisicruce6843]

And God said "let there be light" and there was light.

[@rebeccasamuel1987]

Amazing discoveries Mel. Keep up the great work. 👍 Yes it's high time truth be uncovered and holes in the standard narrative be exposed ..! Thanks Jay too for years of ministry

[@courag1]

One of the things which I had heard that the Byzantines did to thwart the attack on their city was they themselves became iconoclasts. Now whereas this seemed to appease the Muslims, it was not supported by the church who in turn brought them back, or the popularity of them, caused them to come back. When they were abated, the battle was something the Byzantines could repulse. I find it also interesting that when Protestantism took hold in Europe, that one of the things which the Protestants did was that in comparison to Roman Catholic cathedrals, their churches were not adorned with images inside or out. The Muslim leaders, as Jay has taught, wanted a religion to be able to give them credibility and it has preserved their movement. However it was Christianity in the West which preserved the West. Due to the rise of atheists/evolution, this is no longer true, and we are not the “single-minded man” but the man who does not know what to think “unstable in all his ways”. We surely need revival. We need someone doing for Christianity what you are doing towards Islam, whereas to tear it down, but we need men who will build up the rotting corpse of Christianity. With Christ, He can resurrect His body and we most assuredly need this to stand in the days ahead, which look to be days of trial.

[@nihilonisicruce6843]

So Jay admits that isn't his real name (baby J) because there was another baby born there in India on that day with the same name - wasn't Mohammed was it Dr Smith ? (spoiler: this is English sarcasm lol).

[@dsm5d723]

Excellent work. The Malachi prophecy hangs heavy in my head. Indeed. Fathers and Sons, souls being withheld. I have made only a computation, and it takes the form of a decree in a man. I am trying to avert utter destruction, and it is from US and to the Land which will be our undoing. We have thought about the world for so long without God that I don't see a way. Not today anyhow. Azazel is innovation in the Wilderness. It takes the first form of a weapon when tolls are denied to make better tools. He is out there with the Leviathan and the other Chaos Creatures now.

[@pincheguey1325]

Great job, god bless you. Merry Christmas!

[@robertb7110]

Mr. Dragamot is correct. The reported auditory, visual and muscle reactions very much sound like a type of epilepsy, which can (but not always) also be associated with cognitive and emotional deficits. No need to ascribe a negative supernatural influence as a source of "Muhammad's" erratic behavior and teachings -- an organic brain disorder explains it in a straight-forward manner.

[@philos521]

It comes to mind that when Al Fadi first became Christian he went by this very name ELIJAH. Later he dropped it and took on Abd Al Fadi. And Mel, i was also wondering was this a reason they dropped the name Yasu?

[@Speakers154]

Do you mean using Isa instead? I think the Isa usage has got to do with the form of Mandaic Aramaic that was being used prior to the quran's reading into Arabic.

[@TheDidacticMind]

Thomas Crapper DID NOT invent the modern flush toilet. But he did make quite a few very significant contributions to modern plumbing. He founded Crapper & Co. and, among other things, invented a number of new types of "water closets" - or, in modern parlance, toilets. It's easy to see how his name was conflated with the flush toilet, but that wasn't his doing. Still and all, his name has amusing connotations.

[@Speakers154]

That's news to me. It goes to show how a common idea gets around. Thanks for that. Apart from that, the example of his name turned out to be false, as it was his name that led to the later meaning, not the other way round. I would have dropped this as an example had I known. There was plenty of other valid examples, so I suppose it doesn't matter.

[@barry7608]

Great revelations Mel thank you both so much. What about the claims Muhammad was an orphan? Can this fit in anywhere as he was orphaned several times which I believe can cause massive psychological issues in a young boy.

[@kuntul_burung]

I think this Elijah complex more likely happen to someone who have judaism as their background

[@Louis.R]

What about Red Judaism/Bei Abeidan's theory that, rather than Ilyas, it was Hani ibn Qabisah (Kabsha), who became hereditary leader (Imam/Ayatollah) by marriage, and who appointed his uncle Hanzalah ibn Abi Qabisah (abi Kabsha) as "Rosh Ma'amad" (first councillor/Caliph), and thus it was Hanzalah ibn abi Qabisah, "rosh ma'amad" who was later conflated with/transformed into "Muhammad the Prophet & first Caliph" by the Abbasids?

[@2paacalipse]

11:20 thats how the man possessed by legion of demons acted before the demons were cast out into the lake

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

26:00 Mel says anything (no offence...) Ishoyahb just say that the Arabs love Christianity : "As for the Arabs, to whom God has at this time given rule (shultana) over the world, you know well how they act towards us. Not only do they not oppose Christianity, but they praise our faith, honour the priests and saints of our Lord, and give aid to the churches and monasteries. " that does not fit with Mel says... It's a real craft Mel (again no offence...)

[@Chociewitka]

Yeah, you just have to pay them half of what you own to be allowed to stay a Christian.

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

@@Chociewitka This is much later.

[@Chociewitka]

@@user-yz1dl3eu8l? In the same source you were citing Mel citing...

[@isaiah53apologetics56]

I read in Christian Prince book that mohammed's original name was Qasem Ibn Kilab. What do you think about this?

[@ferrywibowo339]

CP's book was written according to the already existed tradition brother. What Jay propose here was more of like searching the untold, so we would expect more contradiction with the already existed tradition. Have you watch Jay's newest video with Al Fadi? Its really devastating to Islam if all of it were true.

[@Chociewitka]

There could have been several persons incorporated into one mythical M.

[@interqward1]

@@Chociewitka There's 100% several different persons incorporated into one mythical M. Agreed.

[@isaiah53apologetics56]

I see.. thanks for sharing your thoughts

[@interqward1]

@Jason El Bourno Watch it, buddy - I still have the shovel from where we buried the body... LOL

[@hendrasaptadi1759]

Iyas Ibn Abi Qabisa / Hanzalah Ibn Abi Qabisa is the son of Iyas Ibn Qabisa / Hani Ibn Qabisa Hani Ibn Qabisa took Hanzalah Ibn Abi Qabisa to become a prophet called Rosh Al-Ma'amad and this guy is the inspiration for the muslim for their prophet named muhammad

[@joecarbone2316]

Here is something to add. David Koresh was an American cult leader who played a central role in the Waco siege of 1993. As the head of the Branch Davidians sect, an offshoot of the Davidian Seventh-Day Adventist Church, Koresh claimed to be its final prophet. Koresh is close name to the claim of Mohammad’s last name or clan - Qouresh. Both David and Mohammad claim to be final profits. Is this a coincidence?

[@Frst2nxt]

I dont think the Aishah component could have been an invention. Not one person didn't think his "marrying" her was a sure fact. Such a man could not have been immersed in Christian upbringing.

[@silusmkhwananzi3121]

Back then, there were no age restrictions, even among Christians.

[@Yeshua027]

I wonder if EGW of the SDA had her prophecies like Mohammad?

[@rajdialnandram5676]

It would be great if Mel and Jay would do the needful. They have already debunked Islam so they could refocus their sight. This would cause a great awakening in Christianity since it would entail a deep dive into the Bible that is sorely missing. Christianity needs to find out whicj is the authentic of the countless denominations, and each claiming to be the truth and causing confusion / babel / Babylon.

[@Phil_210]

Makes so much sense

[@samspade225]

As there were many Arab tribes that made raids against the weak borders of the empires there can have been more than leader/king whit a mission. Especially since monotheism was well established on the arabian peninsula.

[@Kuudere-Kun]

Your quote of Ishoyahb III is well known to be referring to a Shismatic known as Shem'on. It's all right on his wikipedia page yet you act like you've some something mysterious and cryptic most scholars have ignored. I'd like to know where exactly Iyas is mentioend in Sebeos?

[@silusmkhwananzi3121]

Well, how do you expect them to do if things like Britannica are censoring Islamic criticism.

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

20:00 Like in the Doctrina Jacobi, the "One" has no name, no identification here with Ishoyahb.

[@noelmaguire4074]

There was a union shopstewart in the workplace where i worked, his name was John Argue. 😳.

[@ALLHEART_]

Interesting stuff. However, how is it Mel concluded that Ilyas and Iyas were the same name?

[@noelshabo9497]

Brother if you were an arabic native you would be able to do that easily as I am one it's obvious you speak only english brother

[@ALLHEART_]

@@noelshabo9497 Do explain. Are they simply variations of the same name in Arabic?

[@AgustianesUmbaraSuwardi]

@Jason El Bourno so what is the difference between Iyas and Ilyas?

[@Yeshua027]

Well Mohammad was no John the Baptist

[@RR-xt7ew]

Iyas اياس isn’t Elijah Ilyas الياس is Elijah I believe.

[@philothegreatful]

Middle eastern revisionists thins Iyas ibn quabissa to be Ali ibn abi Talib on 2 accounts. One that the battle of siffin is said to have been reported by non Islamic sources as to have been fought between Mouawiah and Iyas as opposed to Islamic narrative that puts Ali in the battle against Moawiah. The other reason is that the names Iyas and Ali could be both spinoffs of Elijah. This confirms your theory of having 2 leaders leading the Arab alliance. Iyas ( Ali) and another leader the one later referred to as Muhammad.

[@Speakers154]

The time frame wouldn't allow it though, unless you imagine Ali being in his 90s. It looks tantalising close though. There might be a link: perhaps Ali is the grandson of Iyas?

[@philothegreatful]

@@Speakers154 Are you talking about the time frame between historical Iyas and Muhammad? Or the time frame between Historical Iyas and Historical Muawiah? Because if it’s the first I think you really need to rethink your paradigm of Muhammad appearing later than the Islamic account. If it’s the latter then may be you have a point but your point is only valid if Iyas being old led his armies himself, which might be hard for a man in his 90s to do but if it wasn’t then it’s plausible, and like you said may be it was lead by his son or grandson called Ali. The question here is there a historic reference To put Iyas in the battle of Siffin or not?! The closeness doesn’t stop at the name or the battle there is much more evidence for it. For example we now know Islam started in the Ghassanid kingdom. We also know the Arabs were united to fight the Persians and Byzantines ( according to islamic tradition and historical documents but most importantly according to logic). Now to consolidate such alliances royal weddings had to happen. Between the kings of the powerful Arab tribes. Such as the Ghassanides and the Lakhminides. You see traces of such stories in Islamic history ( where all the rightly guided caliphs gave their daughters in marriage or were married to the daughters of Muhammad - except for Uthman who eventually got killed 😉😉😉) Now such an alliance marriage between the king of the Ghassanids, Muhammad, and the king of the Lakhminids, Ali, must have existed. An alliance that later on was ruptured creating the Sunni -Shiite division.

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

14:55 Paul Casanova, not Cassanova.

[@houseofsaudisthebeast]

20:36 jay says he doesnt hide who he is, and then at 42:50 he says that jay isn't really his name and wont tell us what it is? but you said at 20:36 that you do not hide?

[@amemabastet9055]

Well, he does say that Jay is not his real name in the sense that he was christened to something else, by which name it would be possible to find his address etc. But that he has been called Jay since his birth because there was another child with the exact same name in the hospital. The difference lies in him using the name Jay Smith on and off internet as his official name, while others use a pseudonym on the internet and never refer to themselves by that name in any other venue. You go by the name "Private Name" here, but I presume that is not your actual name that you use outside of YT or internet. If you do, you are open about your identity as you identify as Private Name and thus create a link between your physical being and the name, regardless if it is your legally official name.

[@interqward1]

Wallahi! He is FINISHED!

[@amemabastet9055]

@Jason El Bourno And I have seen your name tag in several places before. I have yet to read anything you write that adds anything of interest to the conversation. Thing is, dear, anybody criticising islam have better hide, because there are harsh penalties for those who speak truth about this ideology.

[@amemabastet9055]

@Jason El Bourno Ehhh...? Full of presumptions, aren't we? I'm no christian, sweetie.

[@houseofsaudisthebeast]

I was just pointing out he contradicted himself in the same video.

[@francism3805]

Perspicacious

[@shiningirisheyes]

iilas ibn qubisa mahammad of the 7th centary an ilajah complex

[@ok0lets0go]

Iyas ibn Qabisah al-Ta'i

[@nightweels]

I can't get over the idea that these guys are enjoying ridiculing the religion despite the fact that the foundation they are talking about is scientific, I don't think that in the long run this will help the study in any way

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

23:00 If Ishoyahb speaks about Radan in Persia it is very far from its own place.

[@salancy3279]

💐💐🙏✝️💖

[@abanoubmikhail9632]

Mrwanya probably form Marawan

[@enkidugilgamesh]

While You always attack Prophet Mohammad and also claim that he never existed, be aware that Jesus and Christianity is pure fiction, designed by Flavius Josephus and other social engineers according the orders of the emperors Flavius Vespasian and Flavius Titus? What is meant with "God Father" is Vespasian and "Son of God" which himself is a God is Titus and the wholly ghost is mainly Josephus and and his helpers. Even Constantine the one, who made Christianity an official religion was a Flavian! He deemed himself as a Living God and considered the Christians prayers as his own people!

[@silusmkhwananzi3121]

Why would a Jews invent a false Messiah? You do know Joseph's is Jewish right? Did you get this from Hislop? Whaaaa? Where do you get all this. Also wow, a Muslim rejecting Jesus's existence, this is new for me.

[@savior2899]

👍👍👍

[@jamesmadden5058]

Yes they changed a lot of things threw hadeeth.but thereare muslims that wsbt to give the church back the 1 in turkey .look 2 imran hussan one in 2 billion muslims look what he says

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

54:00 Well... not really convincing. Two years of work is not enough. Each details matter. And all have to fit. Iyas b. Qabisah who is Christian is not the replacement of "Muhammad" and has not written an anti Christian book.

[@Chociewitka]

The book was compliled 200 years later and parts of it seem to be gnostic prayers.

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

@@Chociewitka Sorry nope ; all radiocarbon exams attests end of 7th c . manuscripts.

[@Oxygen11115]

@@Chociewitka 'The Book was compiled 200 years later', are you serious?

[@Chociewitka]

@@Oxygen11115 Yes, it took long untill the first of the today existing and considered valid versions appeared. We have reports about previous versions, but those are historicallu unproven and were abrogated anyways...

[@Matthew-pw3ng]

This is a reasonable theory if you ask me.

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

1:00 "Iyas b. Qabisah, ( *and not "Ilyas" as Mel says* ) the appointee of the Persians to the governorship of al-Hirah after the deposition and death of al-Nu 'man V b. al- Mundhir II (see al-Tabari, I, 1029-30, P. 359 below) . His life was much bound up with political and military events along the desert frontiers of Iraq ." This Christian guy has written down the Quran, an anti Christian book? (No offence, be serious Mel...)

[@Speakers154]

You are a nasty liar. It is Jay, not I, that uses Ilyas. I have always called him Iyas. I have pointed out that Ilyas and Iyas are the same name. You are a deceitful Islamic apologist, who has been hiding under a fake Greek name, statue, but you are not fooling me.

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

@@Speakers154 Muhammad has never existed, am I a deceitful Islamic apologist? Really?

[@elederiruzkin8835]

@@Speakers154 A sharp reviewer is always a blessing for any researcher. You should thank Aγαλμα for bothering enough to review your presentations with such sharpness.

[@Speakers154]

@@elederiruzkin8835 If he did so with some air of humility, I'd be inclined to agree but he takes great joy at being condescending and relentlessly negative. His latest swipe is to claim I have no degree which is a baseless lie. He is an academic snob, with an axe to grind. His is the sort of critique driven by self aggrandisement and not a love for truth.

[@midimusicforever]

Scambusting is good content. Bust the scam called islam! Well done!

[@stevendirik1545]

His argument is not clear, the way he talk and use ppt

[@hoopbloop1157]

I saw pfander jay smith you have lost to mansur at speakers corner I am sorry to say that

[@hoopbloop1157]

That debate on sc dawah channel

[@jmo5604]

We must find all truth even if Allah say Oh Noooooo

[@mrbrowntvdefendingislam3435]

The truth watch it kzbin.info/www/bejne/oqDEaZ6NaJqBi5I

[@nicktronson2977]

@@mrbrowntvdefendingislam3435 Yup the name and image jesus is caesar borgia, but mohamad was a Roman also. Which is why Rome and UK have always colonised and drew borders for muslim countries and why muslim countries are run by private banks. Which is why Pakistan and Saudi arabia are in so much debt to rothchilds and IMF and minority of wealthy jews and gog magog. Islam is as much a religious hustle as modern christianiy. Islam never stood a chance against rome or the rothchilds cuz they control islam like they control the rest of the world. islam is worthless. Gaddafi tried to start his own bank and look what happened to him. He didnt fall in line with his private bank masters and now he is gone.

[@nicktronson2977]

@@mrbrowntvdefendingislam3435 You can delete my comment on your youtube video, but you cant here. Remember, private bankers own islam and use it to colonize and draw borders and collect taxes. No muslim nation is independent from the private banking beast. Which is why Rome created islam along with gog magog/uk. You live in Gog Magog country which is UK. So refugees dont escape their masters, they run to their masters for "freedom." Islam doesnt teach about the beast and the mark of the beast cuz islam is a product of the Beast.

[@jaronimo1976]

Allah would be happy with the truth, wouldn't he?

[@mrbrowntvdefendingislam3435]

@@jaronimo1976 Watch this video about Jesus kzbin.info/www/bejne/oqDEaZ6NaJqBi5I

[@Phil_210]

Earth shattering, I think this will change the "holes" into "canyons"

[@musasuleimanchiroma2382]

This is the greatest deception of all times . Let YHWH Bless Mel and Jay in Jesus name

[@Chociewitka]

Could the one in Radan be Salman the Persian? This is straight way down from when he has started out from, below the Capsian Sea? If Salman was the Jibril figure he could have met M. later in the West from there?

[@ok0lets0go]

I didn't think you could prove Muhammad's true history. And you did. Wonderful work, keep it coming. You are changing the.world

[@erkinalp]

I recommend you strip the UTM tracking identifiers while sharing the links.

[@midnightwatchman1]

you should clarify what UTM trackers are

[@henktmmr]

Thank you both! Keep up the good work! GBU!

[@MrSatiiiii]

Ummaid dynasty adopted persian script for thier language.Early days they used Greek script at Syrian side and Persian scripts on Sassanian side.Later they completely adopted persian script...why this sudden shift in the behaviour of ummaids?. It might be popular in major portion of society the regions under thier control and also the regions beyond thier like Egypt, Entire Arabia and Persia... Thier main focus on dismantle both Christian and Zorastrianism... Whatever Christianity,Zorastrianism,Pagan,Judaism and various other practices existed already.... But ummaid chose one slogan eliminating all other identities like we saw on the coins... Abdul Malik and Abdul ibn Zubair both meaning slaves of Alla... People in dry lands get populated to other regions also... Nabetians may be high class priests of Arabs...they might be dominant in business in entire Arabia and Egypt... They also became kings middle region Thier entire travel for business mostly through persian dominated regions ....So years of contact with persians makes them to adopt thier script...

[@Rodemacher]

Great job Mel!!! I used the argument "What kind of prophet comes with a sword " many years ago. God Bless you both!!!

[@lalchand9621]

Again Mel has proved that Islam is false borrowing names from other sources. Well done Jay Smith and Mel for doing this great job. GBU

[@chrisazure1624]

Mel is taking a "deep dive" into the lies in the narrative. #LiesInthenarrative

[@lkae4]

Jay's name is not Jay?? I feel so betrayed. So betrayed.

[@morghe321]

He didn't say that his name isn't Jay, did he?

[@lkae4]

@@morghe321 He did. His name is not Jay.

[@morghe321]

Ok, heard it now. I wrote my comment before i heard that part, lol

[@islamdefenderyahya4621]

Prophet Muhammad was prophesied in Isa 29 :11-12 Isa29:11 And the vision of all this is become unto you as the words of a writing that is sealed, which men deliver to one that is learned, saying: 'Read this, I pray thee'; and he saith: 'I cannot, for it is sealed'; Isa29:12 and the writing is delivered to him that is not learned, saying: 'Read this, I pray thee'; and he saith: 'I am not learned. who is the vision of all became unto you ? >>>> Angel Gabriel what is the book the words of a writing that is sealed,? >>>>> Holy Quran. the writing is delivered to him that is not learned, saying: 'Read this, he saith: 'I am not learned. who is HIM the book delivered to and asked him to READ he reply I AM NOT LEARNED ? >>>>> Prophet Muhammad .

[@silusmkhwananzi3121]

Why don't you read Jewish & Christian books explaining these verses instead of pretending you know what you're talking about.

[@islamdefenderyahya4621]

@@silusmkhwananzi3121 I already did and that is why i am giving Ref of the Bible . wake up ...pls 😌

[@shdwbnndbyyt]

Actually the act was named after Crapper's company patented the toilet. So in his case his name did not dictate what he did, but his patented device (actually developed by a workman of his) changed what his name meant.

[@Speakers154]

Yes, you are right. That example I used was a bad one.

[@parrishquick2265]

Nice work! Keep digging!

[@FRED-gx2qk]

Mel and choly baby

[@dragondaeneris7300]

GOD BLESS YOU BROTHER JAY SMITH AND MEL 🙏

[@tembelkarnca9247]

I live in Turkey. I came across the video while doing research and unfortunately I don't speak very good English. Could you please add Turkish subtitles to the video?

[@c-tap5356]

Wahy وحي actually means revelation (direct) and ilhâm الهام is inspiration (indirect).

[@nazeemsultan123]

Wow. God who created this vast universe was a Jew from Nazareth. Amazing

[@Chociewitka]

What about use of hallucinogens to get those trances? The parts of M. becoming suicidal whenever his "supply broke down" (e.g. Warracka died) and the poisoning story make me suspect that maybe at the end of his live he died of an overuse of different unsufe substances?

[@ConservativeArabNet]

Elias is not uncommon in the Levant Muslims

[@Sam-bc6sr]

36:00 The Jews also dismissed Jesus...

[@admin8784]

Most probably ILYAS

[@humsterstories9736]

Sultanate?

[@jamesmadden5058]

Look into imran hussain

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

18:00 Ishoyahb tries to make sense of what is happening (the taking over of the land by the Iraqi Arabs) in listening what they says about their stuff about which he has no clues : "The heretics are deceiving you [when they say] there happens what happens by order of the Arabs, which is certainly not the case. For the (Muhajir Arabs) do not aid those who say that God, Lord of all, suffered and died. And if by chance they do help them for whatever reason, you can inform the (Mujahirs) and persuade them of this matter as it should be, if you care about it at all. So perform all things wisely, my brothers; give unto Caesar what is Caesar's, and to God what is God's"

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

24:00 Indeed "Mrwnayé" is a curious word. But no importance in our topic. Ishoyahb is a Nestorian he can speak about the Chalcedonians (catholics) to whom St Maroun was important and to which allegiance to Constantinople therefore Caesar is politically important whereas the Nestorians are used to deal with the Persians and now the Arabs.

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

2:00 References of IYAS b. Qabisah al-Tai : 11:134; V:341- 42, 35~60, 363,366, 371-72; XI:28, 30, 35 in THE HISTORY OF AL-TABARI VOLUME XL Index, p.247.

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

30:00 Elijah stuff...

[@asifbrettishmaelmakki9]

Hi brother's Mel and Jay. This was very very damming on prophet Muhammad , the is uprooting churches. I don't accept he done that! He says in quran, about glorifying of God going on in churches, synogoges,temples,he up held the prayer house's and holy books. Muslims have to understand from a bible point of view ( ie English language), the quote ' the is no God except allah = jesus is allah (but that is wrong, jesus is not God the Father) yet the Father is in him and he (jesus) is in the Father.. Did Muhammad think the anointed one was due? So a failed prophesy. Were the Jewish expecting an anointed one. Why would mo, not be waiting for Jesus return. And Mel time will tell if Muhammad was a false prophet. The bible will, indicate that quran is anti-jesus(so correct in what you say). But I follow that Muhammad(ie he is the quran) is with Christ.

[@asifbrettishmaelmakki9]

Muhammad is The Quran. The Quran belongs to him. Do u think mo did not exist?🤔. I am sure Jordans leader are of Muhammad's family. Wat about them agha khan lot. I even heard yrs back on tv that even Queen Elizabeth of UK is a family member to prophet Muhammad! Just in case it is true, then it should be considered that She is head servant of Christ Jesus (within CE). And Philip is equally with her, coz Jesus said, two flesh become one at Union of man and women ( ie marriage). 👍

[@asifbrettishmaelmakki9]

@Jon Doe. Hi bad language is ok if you write it better. You see mate I seen the Queen of England close up in flesh (as a kid on a town visit), yes, I can agree that is one of prophet muhammads daughter's🤔. Its called judgement 😐.

[@asifbrettishmaelmakki9]

I fully respect you brother Mel, you answered my question (I am like in debt to you 😊). And also to the Chief Dr Jay Smith 🤣. God Bless

[@asifbrettishmaelmakki9]

And Mel on that idris map. The N and S poles being in opposite position, with todays poles on maps. The idris map shows the genuine positions of the poles🗺️ then they changed. (that how I understand it).

[@asifbrettishmaelmakki9]

@Jon Doe. No bro. Its ok. U just ensure u do not turn to meds, unless you really need too. And support urself in pondering ' The Author of Life' and what the heck does that actually mean! referring too the author of life who is Jesus Christ=author of life amen. 🤫

[@demonhunter8533]

Elijah.... Means *My god is Yahweh*,... not Allah.

[@user-yz1dl3eu8l]

6:00 The DC speaker of this passage is a Jew : the Jews wait for a Redeemer to free them from the Romans. Nothing to see with "Muhammad" nor IYAS b. Qabisah al-Tai.There was no Jewish "hearers" of Muhammad, there is no sources of this.

[@asifbrettishmaelmakki9]

Well if there was jewish hearers, they must have understood Quranic Arabic.

[@abrahamnewsalem]

Praise be to Jesus Christ